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Overunity Machines Forum



Maximum current in less time than the "Time Constant" is the Orbo Effect!

Started by gravityblock, December 04, 2010, 06:43:04 PM

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lumen

It should be possible to calculate the values for this setup.
Suppose we charge coil "A" with inductance A, to produce a field that reduces the inductance of coils "B" and "C".
Then the fly back of coil "A" is used to charge coils "B" and "C". This transfers the entire charge of "A" into "B" and "C", while the inductance of "B" and "C" is increasing.

Then, recover the fly back of "B" and "C". If the calculations work, there should be a greater return than the initial energy provided.


Low-Q

Quote from: lumen on December 07, 2010, 08:14:19 AM
It should be possible to calculate the values for this setup.
Suppose we charge coil "A" with inductance A, to produce a field that reduces the inductance of coils "B" and "C".
Then the fly back of coil "A" is used to charge coils "B" and "C". This transfers the entire charge of "A" into "B" and "C", while the inductance of "B" and "C" is increasing.

Then, recover the fly back of "B" and "C". If the calculations work, there should be a greater return than the initial energy provided.
The inductance in a coil is constant unless you change the coil itself. Inductance is not the inverse of resistance. The inductance allows higher impedance as the frequency rise. I say impedance because it is an inductive load. An inductive load allows phaseshift which is going from 0 degrees (at DC) to 180 degrees (at infinite frequency), and 90 degrees in resonance with a capacitance (-90 degrees) which allows totally 180 degrees phase shift. The phaseshift is the reason why the inductive coil increases impedance as the frequency rises - and also the reason why many inventors believe they have more power out than in...

gyulasun

Low-Q,

I mostly agree, with an addition: the inductance in a coil is constant IF it has no ferromagnetic core.  A coil with ferromagnetic core is far from linear, it can become nonlinear very easily, depending on the quality of the core and the amount of excitation i.e coil current.

Gyula

gravityblock

Quote from: Low-Q on December 07, 2010, 04:27:45 PM
Inductance is not the inverse of resistance.

In my example, the inductance value of the coil is the inverse of the resistance value in order to have a fast rise time.  You can have the resistance to be even higher than this, but then you won't have enough current allowed by the resistance to saturate the core material.  I believe a metglas core can be saturated with as little as 12mA, which is the maximum current allowed by the resistance in my example.  I did not mean Inductance itself is the inverse of resistance, but only meant it as far as the inductance and resistance values were concerned within the context of my example.

GB
Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, and expecting a different result.

God will confuse the wise with the simplest things of this world.  He will catch the wise in their own craftiness.

Low-Q

Quote from: gyulasun on December 07, 2010, 06:05:34 PM
Low-Q,

I mostly agree, with an addition: the inductance in a coil is constant IF it has no ferromagnetic core.  A coil with ferromagnetic core is far from linear, it can become nonlinear very easily, depending on the quality of the core and the amount of excitation i.e coil current.

Gyula
You are right about coils with a ferromagnetic core. They are far from linear. I just didn't see where this unlinearity should matter at relatively small currents.
I work with DIY speakers every day, and we often use iron powder cores in the inductors for crossover filters. These cores are none conductive to electric current, and quite linear untill the core are starting to be saturated. The saturation will occour at several hundred watts on the speaker. Measurements of harmonic distortion due to non-linear coils are almost outside the measurement scale at "normal" listening levels. Some core materials are a disaster, and other materials are better. It varies quite much. Air core coils are also non-linear due to other things which happens with the wire itself at higher frequencies. So we often use foil coils with air core. These foil coils are most used in the tweeter area. Most common are 12 and 16 AWG foils.