Double Pendulum Power

[nybtorque]

No.. we don't agree on the theory. Your assertion that you can remove energy from the system and have it continue without stopping is unfounded. The analysis you are using to support your theory is wrong.

You do not model the forces at the pivot between the two pendulums correctly. You ignore a damping force proportional to the power extracted. You cannot extract that power without affecting the transfer of momentum between the two pendulums. For your theory to hold the momentum transfer between the two would be unaffected by the counter torque at the pivot caused by attempting to extract that power.

Also if there is an excess of energy available to be tapped it would already have been manifested. The energy of the combined pendulums would increase spontaneously, but that doesn't happen.

As of your suggestion I have updated my model with damping forces (ie. torques) like friction and loads. All kind of loads can be simulated at both pivots and have been done so. The results are interesting and show overunity. I've used both a 50Hz model (huge COP) and a Milkovic type pump (COP =7) for my analysis. Please read my report and comment.


http://www.scribd.com/doc/146232946/Double-Pendulum-Power-AC-Power-from-a-Mechanical-Oscillator


NT

[dieter]

If the brothers wrigth would have tried to convince everybody with theory,  we would still think Aircraft is nonsense. Just go for it! In the worst case it won't work, that wouldn't be a catastrophe.

[vince]

I finally got around to building the double pendulum drive with 2 offset weights. This is a large heavy duty version in which I can try any motor type I want. The motor mount slides from one side to the other so that I can drive the mechanism from any side depending on motor rotation.
This design incorporates all of the details in nybtorques version and the ones that are brought up in the "Motor Generator An Explanation"thread where Woopy did a demonstration.  The offset weights are adjustable for radius and mass. I will be able to change the rotational speed by changing sheaves and/or motor speed.

I am currently building the power take off in which I will be using a one way bearing to harvest ocsilations in the arm and convert them to rotary motion.

I have tested the build with no power take off and find that it is surprisinly smooth during operation. The arm ocsilates violently but is offset by the opposite side so the base does not vibrate and remains very stable. oscilations are fairly small in amplitude but very strong. with my full weight on one arm I can not stop the movement. I have placed a wattmeter on the motor and it does NOT pull more power when fully loaded.

There are several methods that I see of harvesting power from the ocsilations. One possible method is to attach a magnets or an electro magnets to the ends of the arms and fix a coil and core to the base so the magnet vibrates in front of the core and coil.

I will make a video to show the movement. I made a crappy video with my phone camera but it is too grainy and does not show ocsilations of the arm like they actually are.

Vince

[telecom]

Looks great - please make a video.
Great craftsmanship!
Have you tried measuring the wattage?

[vince]

Thanks.  No, I have not taken any measurements other than a wattmeter to see if power increased under load.  Going to concentrate on power recovery as all the motors I will try will try will have different values.