New Rosemary Ainslie Demonstration Scheduled for Sunday, 4 August 2013

[poynt99]

TK,

Rose is arguing the validity of using AVG(Vcsr) x AVG(Vbat) to sanity-check the AVG(v*i d/dt) measurement from the scope.

I've proven it is valid, and Steve has said that it is valid. Rose however refuses to listen (as usual) and is stuck on her belief that making this simple calculation somehow causes the "benefits" to be lost.

She has no proof, only a belief that her assertion is true. But everyone is entitled to their beliefs I suppose.

I have again challenged her to prove her belief in exchange for the OUR Award prize.

[markdansie]

Rosemary has indicated this is her last test etc. I am personally disappointing she is not listening to good advice, but lets hope that Mr Weir can get us through a reasonable test and demo. I might add I have been rather diplomatic to date, but that condition is only temporary. Rather than look at what the data is telling her she is seeking to be a martyr now on some energy conspiracy.
I provided a platform for to exit gracefully accepting that measurement techniques and assumptions were wrong. That opportunity is still there but it depends on her actions and how she acts (hopefully in a professional way)



Rosemary mentioned moving into magnetic monopoles. She will be up with some of the leading and awarded scientists in the world. It will be interesting how she copes with true scientific methodology well explained in the following video.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zgios9zEuJ4


Kind Regards
Mark

[MileHigh]

Just for fun some show and tell.  In the attached graphic you can clearly see that during the oscillations the battery discharging current spikes form a bright solid band and the battery charging current spikes form a dimmer solid band.

I ask the question, "How wispy is this peach fuzz?"

The reason I ask the question is because the real question is, "Can I use the relative brightness of the two bands on the DSO display to make an estimate about the relative average current in each direction?"

The answer is no because you are looking at processed data, data that has been washed through a display algorithm to try to make it "make sense" on the display.  The display resolution is much lower than the equivalent sampling rate resolution so a software algorithm has to deal with this issue.  There is a very good chance that the wispy peach fuzz is in fact much fainter than it appears to be, indicating much less recharging is going on.  There still might be some wire inductance effects at play also, and we know they can appear to indicate battery recharging when it's not actually taking place.

No matter how you look at it, including from the attached DSO capture, the net battery current is showing very clearly that the batteries are discharging.  And the battery voltage is near constant DC.  The measurements, if properly done by Donny and Rosie, will also show this.  Both the DSO based measurements and the multimeter-based measurements will show this.  And we are expecting that Donny and Rosemary will do proper thermal profiling of the load resistor.  The battery output power measured with both methods and the load power measured with the thermal profiling will all be approximately the same

[MileHigh]

Just a little addendum:

I am going to assume that the sampling rate by the DSO is fast enough to resolve the individual spikes in the oscillation.  So that means you can export the data and then analyze it with a spreadsheet.  This of course eliminates the sub-sampling and software algorithm issues related to massaging the data for the display.  With the exported data you work with the pure full-resolution of the DSO capture.

All that you have to do is cut out a time slice that corresponds to the pure oscillation phase.  Calculate the area above zero and calculate the area below zero to compare your discharging to the charging.  To do this, all that you have to do is sort your column of current sampling data points by value.  Split the data into above zero and below zero by inserting a blank row.  Then add up the positive values and add up the negative values and compare with the column summation function, the "sigma."  Then just compare the two values to see the average discharging current relative to the average charging current.

Once you figure out the start and end times for your time slice corresponding to the pure oscillation phase, you could do the calculation in less than five minutes.

[MileHigh]

The more I look at those upper and lower peach fuzz bands, the less comfortable I get that they are telling the true story.

The waveform is too symmetrical about the ground.  If you assume that the MOSFET switch on and switch off times are about the same, then the inductive effects would superimpose a symmetrical peach fuzz waveform above and below the ground just like we see in the scope trace.  What I don't know is if this makes sense considering that Poynt has his scope leads clipped as close as possible to the current sensing resistor.  However, the excitation voltage is much higher then one normally works with and that might explain it.

So it looks like the oscillation is composed of two components:  1) the symmetrical bidirectional wispy waveform from the wire inductive effects, and 2) a train of unidirectional current pulses corresponding to the battery discharging.  (Note the distinctive extra bright solid band in the battery discharging half of the waveform.)

A laying on of wet fingers on the current sensing resistor might show that.  (Yuck!)  Alternatively, a very very tiny capacitor soldered across the CSR might do the trick.  It has to be a "Goldilocks" capacitor that is large enough to soak up the wispy-ness waveform, yet small enough to not affect the train of current pulses corresponding to the battery discharging.  If the wispy pulses are truly tiny relative to the discharging current pulses that may be possible.

You can imagine when you put something like a 10 pF capacitor across the CSR, that the wispy positive and negative pulses nearly disappear and all you see is the train of regular current pulses corresponding to the battery discharging when the MOSFET switches on.