Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy

[Void]

A good function generator behaves like an ideal voltage source behind a 50 Ohm resistor. 
If the impedance of your circuit is much greater than 50 Ohms then only a small portion of the phase shift will appear at the function generator output.

Hi MarkE. Thanks for the reply. I don't get what you mean however. Are you saying that phase shift measurements are only reliable when
the input impedance of any given circuit is a close match to the generator's output impedance?
All the best...

[MileHigh]

@MileHigh,

Everyone knows you're even worse then me. You caused me to retaliate against your abuse. You forced me to fight fire with fire.

I am not 'forcing' you to do anything.  Everyone is fully aware that you act like a mentally unstable person that states the most outrageous things about all sorts of subjects that are untrue and that includes your statements above about me.  Just stop your problem behaviour with respect to me and the problem goes away.

[TinselKoala]

TK,

Look at Conrad's post.  Vr is the voltage across the 100R resistor.  Vh is the voltage across the coil primary. 

Yes, I see that, and the Vt is the subtraction.
But if you had a true differential voltage probe and you connected its two leads across the 100R, would this not be a measurement of the voltage drop across that resistor? And is this use of the true diff. probe equivalent to the way Conrad has his two probes connected across that resistor?
This is where I'm confused.

Vr is only needed to calculate current through the 100R and the primary.  I do believe his voltages are RMS as he stated that his FG was outputting 10Vpp.  The voltage measured at the FG side of the 100R is in line with the RMS of that 10Vpp value (but then again, maybe the 10Vpp was open circuit...  hopefully Conrad will let us know if these are RMS measurements).

Anyway, I believe he made an error in his Pin calculations by using the Vdrop across the 100R (Vr) instead of using the voltage across the primary (Vh) in his Pin calculations (which would then make Pin around 7mw). 

So are you saying that Pin = Vh x (Vh/impedance of primary) x cos theta, where Vh is the RMS voltage and Vh/impedance equals the RMS current value to be used in the power equation?

What he appears to have calculated is the power dissipated by the 100R, not the Pin to the transformer.

Well, somehow I think I agree with this too, but see my objections re differential voltage measurement above. Hence my confusion.

See what you think...

PW

I think I have a headache.
What do you think of making an inline current reading with a DMM?

And how do we get a good measure of the actual phase shift between V and I, considering MarkE's remarks above?
It would  seem, though, that underestimating the phase shift is actually increasing the measured power, since cos 0 degrees =1, and the greater the phase shift the less real power to the load. But even with a phase shift of zero degrees, we still have an input power measurement that is well under the output power measurement.

[TinselKoala]

A good function generator behaves like an ideal voltage source behind a 50 Ohm resistor.  If the impedance of your circuit is much greater than 50 Ohms then only a small portion of the phase shift will appear at the function generator output.

MarkE and picowatt, I am using the push-pull driver circuit shown below to drive my primary coil in my testbed. It works well with the resistive load on the secondary.

How would you suggest I measure the power input to the primary coil, considering this circuit?

(The coil is obviously connected where the "M" is in the circuit. I also have inserted a 0.1 uF monolithic capacitor across the + and - supply rails.) 

The Vin input to the op-amp is where the Red lead of my FG connects, with the Black lead connected to the 0 volt midline supply rail of the bipolar power supply. I am testing at -7.5 -0- +7.5 volts input to the rails from the bench supply. The output voltage to the coil tracks the input from the FG exactly, until the FG's voltage nears the value of the supply rails. And of course this system can supply much more current than the FG can on its own.

Presently I am using a 4.7 ohm precision non-inductive CVR in series with the common Emitter lead to the coil, or on the other side of the coil in series with the return to the 0 level rail, in an arrangement like Conrad's except with the push-pull driver in place of his FG.

(With bidirectional LED load, things are different, the circuit is  not so well behaved,  but I'll address that issue later.)

I would appreciate any comments that MarkE and picowatt might make concerning this driver arrangement.

[picowatt]

TK,

Here are Conrad's Pin calculations:

Vh = 3.04 V
Vt = 3.28 V
Vr = 3.28 - 3.04 = 0.24 V
I = 0.24 / 100 = 0.0024
Ɵ = 17°
Watt through the primary H1 (input) = 0.0024 * 0.24 * cos(17°) = 0.55 mW

Vt is the FG output.
Vh is the voltage at the top of the primary.
Vr is the voltage across the resistor (which is equal to Vt-Vh).

I (input current) is Vt divided by the 100R of the series CSR.

Phase angle not withstanding, Pin to the primary is simply Pin=(Vh*I).

Conrad used Vr instead of Vh.

However, that is (Vr*I), which is the power dissipated in the series resistor, not the primary.

So, if Pin=Vh*I*cos() =3.04*0.0024*cos(17) =6.98mw

PW