Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy

[itsu]

Woopy, 

good to see you found the problem, allthough i would have liked it to be not so.

Carroll is right, those clamp meters are not accurate, i tried mine on my setup, but could not get any reading, probably because of the low (9mA rms) current that was flowing.



Chris,

it does look like the toroid (steel) was saturated, but it puzzles me how as i only had a 6V/2W bulb as load (its a 15VA steel toroid transformer).
I still think it is some kind of impedance mismatch between the 2 (steel) toroid transformers, but i am not sure now.

I will check out your referenced page to see if i can check my toroid for saturation.



Itsu

[hyiq]

Woopy, 

good to see you found the problem, allthough i would have liked it to be not so.

Carroll is right, those clamp meters are not accurate, i tried mine on my setup, but could not get any reading, probably because of the low (9mA rms) current that was flowing.



Chris,

it does look like the toroid (steel) was saturated, but it puzzles me how as i only had a 6V/2W bulb as load (its a 15VA steel toroid transformer).
I still think it is some kind of impedance mismatch between the 2 (steel) toroid transformers, but i am not sure now.

I will check out your referenced page to see if i can check my toroid for saturation.



Itsu

Hey Itsu - Good to know. I can only make assumptions on my end, I try to help where I can. I don't know everything and am wrong sometimes.

   Chris Sykes
       hyiq.org

[partzman]

It can be demonstrated by simulation and bench tests that a normally operating transformer constructed of a primary 'A' and connected bucking secondaries 'C' and 'D' will exhibit no output across the bucking secondaries with input to the primary under the following conditions:  The secondaries are identical in all their parameters ie turns, dcr, wire size, height and width, and have identical coupling factors and capacitances to the primary.

If output is obtained from two bucking secondaries on a transformer with the primary driven, then one or more of the above parameters is no longer equal and balanced.  The higher the unbalance between parameters, the higher the output. 

Scramble winding secondaries over already somewhat scramble wound primaries on a toroid will produce unbalanced parameters in the bucking secondaries and therefore output.  Winding a pair of bifilar secondaries over a layer wound bobbin style core or precisely placed windings on a toroid will result in reasonably well balanced buck windings that will produce little to no output.

pm

     

[hyiq]

I used clamp meters for many years in industry.  They are not good for accuracy because of the loose coupling between the wire and the clamp.  They are only good for a close approximation which is good enough if you want to know if a motor is being seriously overloaded or a circuit is not drawing any current when it should be.  For the most accurate use of a clamp meter the wire needs to be right in the center of the  clamp and the clamp needs to be very close to perpendicular to the wire.  Laying the clamp meter down so the wire is close to parallel to the clamp will throw off the accuracy.  They certainly have their place in industry but are not good for accurate circuit analysis.

Carroll

Carroll is right, Clamp Meters have a lot of problems. Stray Magnetic Fields and so on... Measuring low power they are not accurate. Not as accurate as we need, but this is all some have and is as you say, a good approximation.

EDIT-i forgot to mention--to achieve these results,i had to use a square wave,and a frequency of 12.2KHz.

Still looking for the error,but here are the results so far-measured with both DMMs and scope using a CVR.
The scope and DMMs had only a 2% difference with value's,so an average was taken from the both results.All DMMs were swapped around,and came within +/- 1%
Tried using the clamp on meter,but currents are to small to register.

P/in-6.8vRMS @ 19mA=129.2mW
P/out 1-1.8vRMS @ 41mA=73.8mW
P/out 2-1.83vRMS @ 42mA=76.8mW

So seems to be running at 116% efficiency.

Brad's measurements were made on the scope, as others have and we are still getting good results! So a Clamp meter, although they have higher inaccuracys, are still showing us some degree of direction.


   Chris Sykes
       hyiq.org

[hyiq]

It can be demonstrated by simulation and bench tests that a normally operating transformer constructed of a primary 'A' and connected bucking secondaries 'C' and 'D' will exhibit no output across the bucking secondaries with input to the primary under the following conditions:  The secondaries are identical in all their parameters ie turns, dcr, wire size, height and width, and have identical coupling factors and capacitances to the primary.

If output is obtained from two bucking secondaries on a transformer with the primary driven, then one or more of the above parameters is no longer equal and balanced.  The higher the unbalance between parameters, the higher the output. 

Scramble winding secondaries over already somewhat scramble wound primaries on a toroid will produce unbalanced parameters in the bucking secondaries and therefore output.  Winding a pair of bifilar secondaries over a layer wound bobbin style core or precisely placed windings on a toroid will result in reasonably well balanced buck windings that will produce little to no output.

pm

   

Partzman - There are two types of Bucking!

   1: Non-Inductive - No Output - Conventional
   2: Inductive - Output - MrPreva Experiment Style - Which is an Auto Transformer, of sorts, with an additional Winding.

I have tried to explain this for nearly two years now, seems this is very hard to grasp?

Simply Put, One needs an Output Voltage, The current in the Partnered Output Coils must Oppose, this is the Bucking, Current and Magnetic Fields Buck... Both types of Bucking can produce Excess Power, but Type 1 is very much harder than Type 2.


So I only partly agree with your post.

   Chris Sykes
       hyiq.org