Sharing ideas on how to make a more efficent motor using Flyback (MODERATED)

[poynt99]

Would you mind reposting your circuit diagram?

Merry Christmas! 

[gotoluc]

This would be the closes to what I'm working with.

Thanks

Luc

[gotoluc]

Here are some interesting results using a test device I put together to observe the flyback and Pin of two bucking MOT's (opened) E cores.

Circuit is attached, believe it or not lol... and a picture of what the test device looks like, with E core to E core, scope shots of each test and a picture of the E cores with an I core added in between.

Both upper and lower MOT's and circuits are a mirror image. I used a 2 channel  signal generator to trigger each IRF840 (Q1) mosfet's
Each MOT has their own 5Ah 12v battery (C1) which are at 12.98vdc each.
Each CSR (R1) are 0.1 Ohm
Mot primary coils (L1) are 0.35 Ohm, about 13mH with a cardboard air gap of 0.023in. (0.6mm) in between to simulate a motor rotor to stator coil gap. MOT secondaries are not used.
The capacitors (C2) are 57uf (tested) each and have a load resistor of 4.7k to drain them before the next pulse
The flyback diodes (D1) are RHRG5060

What I find interesting and Gyula may also is, if I would of built the bucking reluctance motor without a I core rotor in between the two Bucking MOT E cores, the motor would of never worked and would be a power hog with next to no flyback recovery.
Look at the scope shot difference with E core to E core (with cardboard air gap) compared to adding the I core in between the two E cores with cardboard air gap on each side.

Yellow CH1 is CSR, Blue CH2 is not used, Purple CH3 is Voltage and Green CH4 is Cap charge voltage

So the big question is, where does the magnetic field go when it's E to E core?... it's not in the flyback that's for shure and notice the voltage flattens out!... why?
The other thing is, during the E to E test you would think they would push each other away (not stay in place) but nothing like that happens and and when I put my hand on the core I feel next to nothing and can barely hear a sound compared to when the I core is added in between.

Luc

[tinman]

Here are some interesting results using a test device I put together to observe the flyback and Pin of two bucking MOT's (opened) E cores.

Circuit is attached, believe it or not lol... and a picture of what the test device looks like, with E core to E core, scope shots of each test and a picture of the E cores with an I core added in between.

Both upper and lower MOT's and circuits are a mirror image. I used a 2 channel  signal generator to trigger each IRF840 (Q1) mosfet's
Each MOT has their own 5Ah 12v battery (C1) which are at 12.98vdc each.
Each CSR (R1) are 0.1 Ohm
Mot primary coils (L1) are 0.35 Ohm, about 13mH with a cardboard air gap of 0.023in. (0.6mm) in between to simulate a motor rotor to stator coil gap. MOT secondaries are not used.
The capacitors (C2) are 57uf (tested) each and have a load resistor of 4.7k to drain them before the next pulse
The flyback diodes (D1) are RHRG5060

What I find interesting and Gyula may also is, if I would of built the bucking reluctance motor without a I core rotor in between the two Bucking MOT E cores, the motor would of never worked and would be a power hog with next to no flyback recovery.
Look at the scope shot difference with E core to E core (with cardboard air gap) compared to adding the I core in between the two E cores with cardboard air gap on each side.

Yellow CH1 is CSR, Blue CH2 is not used, Purple CH3 is Voltage and Green CH4 is Cap charge voltage

So the big question is, where does the magnetic field go when it's E to E core?... it's not in the flyback that's for shure and notice the voltage flattens out!... why?
The other thing is, during the E to E test you would think they would push each other away (not stay in place) but nothing like that happens and and when I put my hand on the core I feel next to nothing and can barely hear a sound compared to when the I core is added in between.

Luc

Without the I core section,there is no flux path for the fields to follow,and so with the bucking field without the I core section,you have a net magnetic flux path of zero,and have made a nice induction heater. With the I core piece in place,you now have a path for the flux from each coil to follow,where the flux from each coil will share the I core piece that is now in place,but the path is complete for each coil.

Brad

[gotoluc]

Thanks for your brave reply Brad
That's about how I understood it as far as the I core being there in place or not but you would think these Large MOT E cores could store up a little flux of this short pulse, no?   and where does the flux go?   does it just leaks in space?
Did you notice the voltage pretty much fell flat instantly and how can the current instantly go to maximum on an inductor?
What part of a bucking field is Chris suggesting to be used?

Luc