Roll on the 20th June

[hartiberlin]

So again this is the main principle, you have missed the basic, the 45 is actually longer as well yet still makes it, as for the distance for your firing mechanism, the first is to ensure the ball only just makes it, then you must use the same distance, this gives you identical impact PPSI.

No,
not if you turn the firing device around and hit the rubber ball at 90 degrees, so your iron weight, hitting the
rubber ball still has to travel higher to hit the rubber ball at 90 degrees, so it has a lower impact kick energy.

If the iron weight hits the ball already at 45 degrees it has also only traveled a lower height different and thus
still has more impact PSI kick energy.

Another mistake you make,
if you pull out all the energy from the 1 oclock to 6 oclock movement of the fan,
then you just got the Epot= m x g x h
But as you let it go, you only have low friction and the wheel
might be turning up to around 10 oclock and then rocks back and
forth, but only, cause you have no load and low friction.

All you end up is, that you have converted Epot= m x g x h
into friction heating, after the back and forth rocking has stopped.
If you make the friction this big, that your fan will only turn from
1 to 6 oclock you have loaded the machine and converted all:
Epot= m x g x h
to heat already,but you never will get more out than
Epot= m x g x h
all in all.

And as far as astronauts probing the zero gravity in a parabel flight on  an airplane,
they only become weightless once top dead center has been reached and the plane is going downwards.
They don?t become weightless before top dead center as far as I understand this.


Regards, Stefan.

[hartiberlin]

Hmm,
regarding the parabolic flight path I was wrong.
The persons in the plane are already weightless
before top dead center, but is seems to be related to
almost zero thrust at this time but as the plane still have kinetic speed it still
converts this speed into height.

See this graphics:

[hartiberlin]

From:
http://www.dlr.de/rd/Portaldata/28/Resources/dokumente/fuw/Parabelflug_Broschuere.pdf

where I got this above graphics from, it is said:

After
about 20 seconds, the angle of ascent
reaches 47 degrees, a steep angle com-
pared to a normal takeoff, where it
never exceeds 18 degrees. At this point,
the pilot throttles the engines down to
very low thrust.

Within a few seconds, the A300 goes into
free fall. The momentum it has gathered before,
keeps it falling upwards for another 2,000 metres or so.

At the apex of the curve, at an altitude of about
8,500 metres, the speed of the aircraft is
down to 390 km/h. From here, it continues
to falls down in an open parabola.

[exxcomm0n]

Hi all,

Back again to bounce some ideas.

It's good to see that Archer (The Eskimo Quinn) is monitoring this thread as I'd say he has the ultimate rights to this idea.
I can sympathize with his delivery method since it harkens to "Give a man a fish and feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and feed him for a lifetime". I've seen Erfinder and Grumpy adopt the same stance in some threads.
It may be a little difficult to deal with now, but in 8 weeks I'm sure it will seem like not such a big deal. I don't quite get it yet, but I think I can see were this is going.......

Anyway......... @ goat @ MB @ TEQ

Q: What is the world's biggest flea market? 
A: Ebay

Setup an account and give it away (the building plan or http link to) by advertising it as a carbon emission reduction device, it seems like it's the buzzword du jour these days...LOL

Maybe describe it as a handy man only type project or build to suit for people that are able to offer the service of building the machine.

@ Goat

E-bay probably would be a great idea, though I would bet the day it is released someone will start trying to make money off the plans.  It will be posted as "free" on e-bay +$15.00 shipping and handling or a pdf file with a password that can only be had by signing up for something. 

An excellent idea! The problem is that you don't want to see those that had nothing to do with the idea making money from it. That part is going to be tough to keep from happening since it seems any new idea worth it's salt gets pirated in record time. The issue with pirates is that they already have manufacturing facilities, they already have the money for fast re-tooling, and they use unscrupulous, but effective methods to get their product sold. If the concept was well known and easily discovered, wouldn't this be a WONDERFUL thing to be farmed out to China and Mexico and Sri Lanka for manufacture as long as the resulting builds WORKED? I can't think of a better wayto get this technology into the hands of those that need it the most than that.

So.....you give it away for free to combat that.

The hard part about this is that people don't often go for what is free because throughtout their lives there has always been a catch to a proposal like that. How often do you click on the banner ad saying "Click HERE for a free PC!"?

The only solution I can see to this quandry is for as many people here (OU) as can, start an Ebay acct. to sell these things as "energy reclaimation devices" (AT NO TIME should we use the term "free energy", or we have lost a significant portion of our "sales" public immediately).
Just say that it's able to glean the energy lost from the small, but vampiric energy costs of appliances that are always on standby, or some such other nonsense so as not to "insult the intellect" of the public
A portion of the money made from the endeavor can be given to Archer, and/or a charitable concern of his choice. In this way we are able to overcome the stigmata of "free" AND we are able to disseminate the idea, make some cash to fund other undiscovered energy source projects, and make sure inferior copies of the idea that don't work don't flood the market and kill the idea by reports of customer dissatisfaction.

The individual can make money too! Manufacturing space costs money. Building stock costs money. Construction costs money. Management of a business costs money. Employees cost money.
You WANT employees. Lots of employees!
They sometimes freelance on the side, or give business ideas and methods away to their family and friends.

If I have to take money from each individual I talk about this idea to accomplish spreading the word, I will.

now do you see what you are missing??? (god i hope so) Newton?s calcs were never designed for the Wright brothers or this device

I like the idea of the young minds, toys or puzzles that build the machine, once you know it works, you can't unknow it, like being told planes can't fly according to Newton and his gravity calculations.

These are 2 good approaches, and they might be able to be married.

In fact, it would probably be the best way to "market" the idea if a new childrens "toy" was modeled out of the idea and sold as "The Magic Wonder Wheel", or some such nonsense.
An adult will discount the possibility of something based on what they have been taught or what they believe. A child will "discover" and not question possibility because they "see" it, their hands built it, and the result of failure doesn't mean impossibility; It means to try again.
I read Mimsy Were the Borogoves, a science fiction short story by Lewis Padgett (a pseudonym of Henry Kuttner and C. L. Moore) that was originally published in the February 1943 issue of Astounding Science Fiction Magazine (read it here: http://www.scribd.com/doc/43321/Mimsy-were-the-borogoves-Lewis-Padgett- )  when I was young and it changed the way I thought about thinking.

Doesn't it gall you just a bit when a child shows you how they did something you would have thought impossible for them, and the way they show you is so simple, elegant, and something you'd deem as so naturally intuitive that you can't understand how you didn't already know about it?
Lately I find myself trying to be like a child again because of that. I think it might be the best way to experiment with the ideas I see here.

I look forward to being "galled" by Archer in 7 weeks if I can't figure it out from the clues he's giving out before then.

If this proves out sir, I thank you from the bottom of my heart and I will employ it as you wish if you'll tell us.

@ Goat

<snip>  Trust the larger media and it will become the joke of the hour and not heard of again.  </snip>

<snip>  My gut still says whomever has a working prototype will open a flood gate of publicity every time it is announced in the local media (I don't think the small time local papers are terribly corrupt, brainwashed somewhat, but not totally corrupt).  Anyone that creates a prototype and wants to help their community could easily do one of the business opportunity like seminars that seem to get people out and motivated.  A short downloadable video on youutube or a torrent etc may go a long way if someone takes the time to video tape the entire process.  Getting the information out will not be as difficult as deflecting the naysayers with the big textbook brains that have squashed so many interesting ideas with a just a few words in the press.  </snip>

The YouTube idea has even more merit, but there are still some people that pick and choose what to see dependant on what they're told they see.
I mean, we all "saw" planes hitting buildings (on TV, well....except the Pentagon). We all "heard" frantic cell phone calls (on TV). We all "know" the the destruction of a building into it's own footprint is possible if it's hit by a plane, or even a chunk of falling building (from "experts" on TV).

Now that, my friends, was a masterful sales job and woefully it's working to this day.

An idea like this has to move with the intensity of civil disobedience or religious decree to not be quashed by popular opinion.

In fact, there might be an angle to the religious aspect.
The offerings you give to the religion of your choice or the non-profit orginization you belong to is to pay for the maintenance of the place you meet, to pay salaries to the people that dedicate their time to it's health, and use any extra to spread among the community and further good works or orginizational aims and education?

I can't think of a better offering or contribution than self generated power, can you? That's about as grass roots dissemination as you can get and you still can feel good about giving "the gift that keeps on giving". It frees up a major cost for them that they can now use for the above aims. They might even see the dissemination of the idea as the most paramount of good works or education.

Then the only weapon that can take out an idea like this is fear.
It's a major weapon and has been noted to work.

Upon the release of the idea it HAS to be reconstructed by individuals the world over and heavily scrutinized not only for proof of concept, BUT FOR SAFETY!!!!

The moment that a device is able to be used to destroy a busload of school children it'll be socially abhorred and legislated into non-existance.

My $0.04 now.

P.S. You're allowed to make money from helping your fellow man if they won't allow it any other way.

[ramset]

I suppose the flea trying to steer the elephant is not even a good analogy  its gonna be a wild ride  hold on   @Helmut looks good im still gathering parts   Chet