Roll on the 20th June

[purepower]

Sorry Archer,
   Nothing like a tri-gate. more like a SMOT

I second that, the two systems are nothing alike. I think AQ was just a lil upset we stopped talking about him and more on Rusty in the last few pages. He probably said that to drop something that might work and divert our attention elsewhere, like his donation link and homemade trailer (oilman tactics!)...
Also on the trailer, I'm having trouble figuring out the layout. The windows dont seem to match up, especially on that last pic. Also on the last pic, it seems to indicate the trailer is incredibly wide. Is the donation money going to AQs trailer biz or the wheel? Is the wheel going to power the lighting in the trailer?

In my personal opinion, the trigate is the future of FE. I've fully analyzed Archer's system many times many pages ago, and at best it is a unity device, less losses. Adding a trigate to AQs system might get it to work, but is meerly a band-aid covering up the inherent problems.

Someone (I'm on my phone, can't go look up the name) posted a pic of a trigate wheel. I thought of the same idea, but I'd suggest turning the trigate and rollers 90degrees, perpendicular to the plane of the wheel. That way, the distance the edges of the rollers are always equal distances from their relative gate sides (hope that makes sense to  others). Also, the larger the radius of the wheel, the more linear the path the roller makes through the gate, the better the results.

-PurePowe

[exxcomm0n]

I second that, the two systems are nothing alike. I think AQ was just a lil upset we stopped talking about him and more on Rusty in the last few pages. He probably said that to drop something that might work and divert our attention elsewhere, like his donation link and homemade trailer (oilman tactics!)...

You're entitled to your opinion, just like everyone else is

Also on the trailer, I'm having trouble figuring out the layout. The windows dont seem to match up, especially on that last pic. Also on the last pic, it seems to indicate the trailer is incredibly wide. Is the donation money going to AQs trailer biz or the wheel? Is the wheel going to power the lighting in the trailer?

Yeah...the last pic got me too, until you REALLY look at it and see there's a window in the middle of the counter.
Like the ones (caravans) you buy corn dogs and slushies at when you're at the carnival.
I bet it's removable too since it'd be an easy design.

In my personal opinion, the trigate is the future of FE. I've fully analyzed Archer's system many times many pages ago, and at best it is a unity device, less losses. Adding a trigate to AQs system might get it to work, but is meerly a band-aid covering up the inherent problems.

Again, I have to agree/disagree. Again, this is MY opinion.
You like the trigate, cool. I do too.
It is a POSSIBLE way to OU, but you think there are no more???

Someone (I'm on my phone, can't go look up the name) posted a pic of a trigate wheel. I thought of the same idea, but I'd suggest turning the trigate and rollers 90degrees, perpendicular to the plane of the wheel. That way, the distance the edges of the rollers are always equal distances from their relative gate sides (hope that makes sense to  others). Also, the larger the radius of the wheel, the more linear the path the roller makes through the gate, the better the results.

That'd be me (combo wheel) or capthook.
Mine uses both systems, his uses trigate only.

Pure, if you think the trigate is the answer, then spend your time and energy to that end.
I think you'll be a lot happier if you do, since then you know your energy went into a system of which you have belief of concept.

You're still (and always) welcome back here though.
Your opinion and input is as valid as anyone elses.

EDIT

@ Archer

Man, get you some google ads on your page! Get paid by those supporting you, and those pointing and laughing, and have not 1 dime come from their pocket!

I'm sure Stephan get a bit of support from the ads here.

Then you can blow off the donation thing if you still wish to do that.

[sm0ky2]

Hi exx,
   I don't think this will work because you will need to get past the repulsion/attraction at the beginning and the end of the arrays. I would love to be wrong but thats how I see it. Take a look at the graph I posted. I think the Only way that a tri-gate array can be used in any working system is to have the roller mag moved into the array just after the begging and then taken out just before the end of the array. I have currently started to build a grav-mag device that will hopefully do this to some degree I have posted a pic some where in this thread that shows the basic principle. I also have a few other Ideas for builds using the tri-gate not using gravity. 

@ GWhy, how are you measuring this "force" on your graphs? 
a properly assembled Tri-Force Gate does NOT HAVE an attraction at the end of the gate, it has a REPULSION! that kicks the roller OUT. You dont lose anything leaving the gate - you  GET BACK almost what you put in, to enter the gate.

If your gate does ANYTHING other than this, then it's not correctly assembled. 

There IS a repulsion at the entrance, which from hundreds of repeated tests, in various configurations - is estimated to be equal to the repulsion at the gate exit + the losses within the gate-array. (though there are a few anamolous configurations, where the exit energy is enough to enter another identicle gate array.)
A single gate array, appears to be balanced both IN and Through + Out.

I'm curious as to what exactly your graph is showing.... is that force in the horizontal plane? In one direction?

How are you measuring this? do you have a way to determine the verticle force vector?   
The reason i ask, is because that doesnt look like many previous measurements of Graham's gates, that several people have done.

[sm0ky2]

Take a look at the diagram below, to see what im talking about here...


From A to B the rods are under magnetic incluence from the upper gate. By design this effect is countered (mostly) by gravity , such that a measured drop of the wheel with and without magnets appears to turn the same speed. [ exception being magnets overproportioned to the imbalanced mass]

From B to C, this is standard gravitational acceleration, the momentum of the wheel @ C can be calculated by standard procedure, using the mass of the wheel, the angular velocity, the imbalanced mass and the distance between the center of gravity and the center of rotation.   we'll call this= M2

M2 is enough (without the lower magnets) to bring the wheel from C up to point E. (note E is drawn slightly lower than B to account for losses). So if we call this momentum =M4, we know that M2 = M4 (+ losses)

We shall label M3 as the (negative) momentum from point C to D.

We know that the momentum possessed by the wheel @ point D is = M2 - M3, we'll call this Mwheel
Mwheel, by design, must be sufficient to break the magnetic wall.  [ if you dont follow this, stop now, study the operation of the wheel, then come back]

The Line in red represents the motion of the rod. The rod travels distance P - which is the hypotenuse of the red triangle drawn off to the side.

The energy required to move the rod is a simple calculation of the Rod-mass * Gravity * H (side H of the red triangle) - At the upper limits of the system, This is = to the energy required to break the magnetic wall @ D

Side L represents the linear translation of the rod - which affects momentum, but does not take away from the energy of the lifting rod  ( minus the friction of the chosen slide mechanism).

The potential energy of the lifted rod @ point A = Rod-mass * Gravity * Height(A to D)

Would anyone care to share why they don't believe the energy of the momentum Mwheel could be greater than the energy input at the magnetic wall  given the proper proportions 

I'm open to your opinions, but none of the CoE arguments thus far presented have shown me enough to discard this wheel.     




[ Update on my build::  i've mounted 4 of the 6 linear bearings on the wheel face, will mount the remaining 2 this evening.  Then re-balance the wheel with the mounted bearings on it, before installing the rods. I've decided to go with the Neo's, 1/4" circular N42.  I have a few hundred, so this will enable me to play around with different flux densities, and magnetic configurations to make the smoothest transition of the rods as possible.  Will post pics when i get to the next stage.]

Here's the diagram of what im talking about above::
[Note: ignore the blue triangle, i removed that part of the post to avoid confusion]

[CLaNZeR]

Sorry Archer,
   Nothing like a tri-gate. more like a SMOT

19 videos on the Tri-gate in linear fashion. Got to update the site with the wheel videos, they were posted on YouTube but no longer there

http://www.overunity.org.uk/triforcegate.html

Tri-Force is great and respect to Rusty.

The only thing it lacks in my opinion is Torque when needed.

Cheers

Sean.