Gravity Mill - any comments to this idea?

[ooandioo]

tbird, you are right, that is the way I'm thinking about.

hartiberlin, the inverted "U" is also a good idea.
I have calculated something: Never mind if we fill a baloon under water or a inverted "U" the pressure we need to do that depends on the water pressure+airpressure. Air pressure is 1 bar and waterpressure is 1 bar for every 10 m. Filling a baloon at 10 m under water we will need pressure more than 2 bar (29psi).
p=F/A (pressure=force/area)
F=m x a (force=mass x acceleration)

We now should see, if the amount of water thats beeing pressed upward is enough to fith these formulas, thats the crux.

Andi.

[tbird]

hi stefan,

i'm not sure why you keep asking

But how many centimeters or inches must then the swimmer
unit be compressed at what size dimension ?

And how much energy does this use up ?

without knowing what size unit you are talking about, no answer can be given.  it's like asking how much gas does it take to drive across country without saying what transport will be used and how far across you want to go.  those answers can be figured out if we know what the size of the unit is.  this in itself needs to be determined by the user/builder.  how much work do you want to do?

Maybe someone can post a step by step calculation
of an example with all mathematical steps to calculate that,
so it it getting more clear ?

i have already done this in reply 15.  except for figuring out how much work the water we moved aboved could do.  i also said in that reply

if i made any math mistakes, please rap me on the knuckles and let me know.

why haven't i had a knuckle rapping?  are you not reading the post?  are you not following my explanations?  if not, why not ask me to re-explain where you got lost?  i can't lay the blame on you.  if you don't understand, it's only because i didn't do a good job.  for that i apologize.

the mistake i made was "now when we release the piston at 11.33 ft, it will expand to not only the orignal 1 cubic ft, but to a plus .1psi."  if you read on, you will see the figure to gain equal work was less than the pressure we increased to after figuring out the shuttle piston wouldn't expand at depth.  when i suggested the pressure to compensate for the depth (11.33ft.) should be 5psi, this was wrong.  all that was needed was 4.9psi.  then adding the amount of pressure to do the work (move water) .449psi we would end up with a 5.39psi (that was right).

the figures i used in this example were based on a size i created in the example.  this unit, for it's size would hardly produce any work.  it was a starting point.  work is not cheap.  the more work we want, the more we have to pay. to get more work from the example;  we could compress the shuttle piston farther (more work in, higher psi).  with 21.66 cubic ft of water available per cycle and/or extending the leverage of the compressing unit, we have the resource available to do extra work.

hope this clears up things a bit.  forgive me if i was too tuff on you.  btw, did you check out the link in my last (ps at the end)?

tbird

[ooandioo]

Here some more calulations in this:
Lets assume you have pipe, 10m under water and 1m over water. Its diameter is 1m.

Our shuttle has to only lift the amount of water thats in 1m above the water, thats:
V=A*h, A=r?*Pi=2500cm*Pi, V=785.398cm? this weights 785,4kg, its force is F=m*g=7.704 N
That means, the lifting power has to be greater then 7.704 N.

If this is the fact, the shuttle will push the water thats in the pipe under water 1m above the water.
This will be V=7854cm?*1000cm=785.398.000cm? this weights 785.398kg, its force is F=7.704.754 N.
Looks very good, as we need quite less lifting power.

One more, the pumped water has its energy:
E=m*g*Dh/3.600.000J/kWh
E=785.398kg*9,81*0,5m/3.600.000J/kWh=1,07kWh
The maximum energy we could take out of the water 1m above sealevel is 1,07kWh (if we alow 0,5m fall down).

Andi

[tbird]

hi stefan,

a light just came on.  are you trying to get me to WRITE a formula that you could stick in whatever variables you want and come up with answers for the unit you have in mind?  if so, you give me way too much credit.  i make too many mistakes.  they maybe simple mistakes, but the formula you seek can't have any.  it has to work for all samples.  maybe there is somebody out there watching that can.  please step up if you are willing to help.

tbird

[tbird]

hi  FreeEnergy,

not sure what you are saying.  are you suggesting the shuttle piston be 6ft long or the tube the shuttle piston rides in?  also don't understand the function (purpose) of the one way valve.  can you try again?

tbird