Robert Alexander Motor/Generator

[oouthere]

  I decided to give this motor/generator a shot.  The test frame is a  Chinese built 12V DC motor.  The manufacturer is BCM and  the part number is 200602000F.   The original no load measurements were obtained from the powering device, a MASTECH variable power supply HY3005D (30V/5 amp).   My mini-o’scope would only lock for short periods but the sine wave looked normal for an a/c generator and did not have the dc pulses as shown in the patent so perhaps I did not wind the motor correctly.

No load original motor readings with factory 19AWG and 12 wraps:

Volts/Amps: 2.0/1.1; 3.0/1.24; 4.0/1.35; 5.0/1.44; 6.0/1.55; 7.0/1.7; 8.0/1.72; 9.0/1.83; 10.0/1.9; 11.0/1.94; 12.0/2.05; 13.0/2.1; 14.0/2.15; 15.1/2.07; 16.0/2.15; 17.0/2.18; 18.0/2.11; 19.0/2.11; 20.0/2.13; 21.0/2.0; 22.0/2.2; 23.0/2.3; 24/2.4

  I tried winding the motor for 1 primary turn to 3 ac generator turns (12:36 in this case) as called for in the patent but there was not enough room on the rotor core.  Since the amperage readings were so low and this is only a test unit I decided to strip the core and rewind using 24AWG which should be good for about 3.5 amps.  Using my finger on the shaft the amps would jump to a maximum of 4.0 amps during testing so this should suffice.  I wound the core but nearing the end I realized I had forgotten to reverse the winding direction at the middle set of turns and without doing so it would have a zero voltage output.  I had originally wrapped it using 12 primary drive windings to 36 ac windings and was running out of room toward the end so I switched to a 5:15 ratio instead, still following the 1:3 build listed in the patent.  Here are the new no load measurements at only up to 12V as I do not trust my work as much as the factory….lol

No load rewound with 24AWG and using 5:15 primary/generator:

Volts/Amps: 4.1/2.08; 5/2.13; 6/2.17; 7.1/2.22; 8/2.23; 9/2.27; 10/2.32; 11/2.35; 12/2.41
For loading purposes I used a 60 watt incandescent bulb to test the generator output:
(Motor input v/a; generator output v/a):  (4.1/2.88; 13.6/.04) (5.2/3.03; 18.1/.11) (6.1/3.1; 21.8/.16) (7.1/3.22; 26.4/.2) (8/3.26; 29.9/.22) (9.1/3.37; 34.6/2.5) (10.1/3.49; 38.9/.27) (11/3.57; 42.7/.28) (12/3.59; 46.3/.3)

The first reading is 12.67 watts input and .544 watts output, the last reading is 43.08 watts input and 13.89 watts output, nowhere close to over unity.

I tried using two 60 watt bulbs in parallel to place a heavier load but the efficiency never went above 30%.  I’ll post photos and winding patterns as time permits.  There is more than one way to wind the rotor so this is not the only build I'll try.

Rich 

[oouthere]

Here are pictures of the test platform....

[broli]

I don't like reviving old threads but I just come across Robert W. Alexander patent on rexresearch and was intrigued to see any experimentation on this due to its simplicity. And lo and behold there was.

I'm very interested in follow up experiments by @oouthere. I'm actually more curious on the winding pattern of your secondary coils. Because if you just wind the secondary along the primary motor windings wouldn't you end up with a polyphase system which is not good if you just hooked it up to just two slip rings?

[oouthere]

Just a quick update, I’ve made 8 different versions of this generator so far.   I’ve tried three different frames (the two pole listed above, a four pole, and also bought a 2.5lk Onan generator (http://www.ebay.com/itm/370614576856?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649) which seems to match the pictures and era of the patent).  The device will not work if wired according to the patent, also the field voltage is wrong as well….it’s 4.5 volts, not 45 volts.  The armature core segment picture has 25 segments, not 20 so it seems either information was intentionally distorted or there are bad typos.  In another article it states a 7/8hp motor kicks of the system, no idea where that enters into all this unless it is more deceit.  But anyway, just wanted people to know I’m still throwing money and time into this project.

For those interested I believe the magic is in a flicker circuit on this particular generator.  The field coils are double wound with one coil set being ran through the armature and the other set being ran to ground via a set of contact points located in the engine points housing.  When the motor would fire it would speed-up and cause the lights to go bright so in order to stop this the flicker points opened at the same time, which opened the field circuit direct ground and routed it through a 5 ohm/50 watt resistor which reduced exciter flux temporarily.  After 10 or 15 degrees of rotation the points would close and the full flux would resume until the next ignition fire.

The theory seems to be that when the reduced exciter field flux occurred on the armature current producing part of the stroke then the counter torque was not so great thus reducing the required input energy for the armature rotation.  I’ve ordered parts to try this next.

Rich

[norman6538]

Rich I am very interested in your replication. back about 6 years ago I took a Chevy Cavalier
ventilation DC fan motor with permanent magnetic stator and rewired the coils and made
an AC collector out of the drive end by extending the shaft to attach the collectors. It did
not perform well. I still have it and will examine it to see how I wired the segments.  They did have two coils wound in the same segment to get the transformer combined flux effect.

A problem
with these motors is brush overlap to multiple coils. That might need to be changed by removing every other segment to get isolation. What I thought would be better is a brush set
and DC out like the asymetrical motor discussion here http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/11885-my-asymmetric-electrodynamic-machines.html

The patent has an assignee which could be a surrogate for any of the big guys.
The concept sure is simple enough and surely could be assembled and tested.

Norman