I didn't know ALL of them were related.
I can't say I'm surprised either.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCCx9Oczqp8&feature=related
Regards...
Message to Stefan:
Hi Stefan,
Unfortunately I have to report a new member 'Asymatrix' (likely an old one) using personal attacks and intentionally derailing my threads, despite being asked to stop.
I would very much appreciate it if you would put a stop to him/her.
If there was a way of making each poster the moderator of their own threads, this type of behavior would be eliminated in short order.
Do the administrative controls allow you to do that ?
Regards... "
Before you laugh it off why don't you view the evidence...the odds quoted were pretty clear.
Regards...
Cap-Z
I think it is best when you only answer Hans because he is the only one so far to check facts, while the others just say no you are wrong with nothing to back it up.
I see the others as nothing else as agent provocateurs, just ignor them.
Tink, Do you honestly believe I'm an "agent provacateur"?
Quote from: newbie123 on June 05, 2009, 10:31:04 PM
Tink, Do you honestly believe I'm an "agent provacateur"?
Maybe not.
Please do as Hans and check the facts.
Thank you Tink...these posters are clearly trying to redefine fact as empty rhetoric...when that is what they are offering themselves.
They leave their self subject to speculation and suspicion by doing that.
As you said, all I ask is that people check out things for themselves.
Regards...
Quote from: Cap-Z-ro on June 06, 2009, 10:41:24 AM
Thank you Tink...these posters are clearly trying to redefine fact as empty rhetoric...when that is what they are offering themselves.
They leave their self subject to speculation and suspicion by doing that.
As you said, all I ask is that people check out things for themselves.
Regards...
Laura Bush and John McCain are sixth cousins! Oh noes!!! It's a conspiracy. Whatever shall we do!
Quote from: Cap-Z-ro on June 06, 2009, 10:41:24 AM
Thank you Tink...these posters are clearly trying to redefine fact as empty rhetoric...when that is what they are offering themselves.
They leave their self subject to speculation and suspicion by doing that.
As you said, all I ask is that people check out things for themselves.
Regards...
Cap-z-ro,
Checking into things, and deciding for yourself is fine.... But spamming out every sort of conspiracy YouTube video you can find is idiotic, especially on this FE forum.
Do you understand that this video is worse (bias) propaganda than you will ever seen on FOX News? It's clearly propaganda out to convince people there is some presidential bloodline conspiracy going on. And the FACT is... There is absolutely no real evidence of this in that whole video...
What I'm saying by you posting these extreme left-wing conspiracy videos; you are just as bad as the extreme right-wing lobbyists..
Also, do you understand that by posting videos that encourage MiB belief, etc, you are in fact suppressing FE development yourself? This does two things.. Creates baseless fear of MiBs, and your threads basically push the new more valuable research threads down the line of new posts. This sort of crap spamming is a tactic used by shady day-traders on stock market forums... You're doing the same thing whether you like it or not.
Lets gets something clear: They are NOT "Left-Wing"...
They are more "Libertarian / Independent/ Patriot / Ron Paul-ites" or whatever you would call people like "Alex Jones"... But "left wing" is definitely not accurate at all.
It's just that through careful labeling over many years; "Left Wing" has been taught to mean "radical" ;)
The fact is that the "right wing" is much more radical than the left these days.
There is nothing "radical" about working for "universal not-for-profit health care". Or for ending the wars of aggression. Or returning to The Rule of Law and prosecuting the bush regime for their many crimes. Or for stopping corporations like ADM or Monsanto from taking over our entire food supply; and other corps from destroying all our unions and manufacturing base, or taking over the Internet for their own greed and controlling interests.
These are the real issues the political Left works for... And the truth is that peeps who bring up NWO-related stuff get just about as much criticism from the Left these days as from anyone else, lol.
Democrats and Republicans.
If the US would offer an alternative flavor (Europeans can hardly tell the difference), this particular conspiracy theory might not exist. Doesn't democracy mean having a choice? When you make a bad choice, you correct that within 4 years. Yet, you re-elected Bush. Even his dad's work didn't offer enough hints to prevent his son getting a real chance.
Maybe the voter has become genetically programmed through recent evolution to vote for a certain family characteristic being showcased. If you elect Bush-Clinton-Clinton-Bush-Bush, that's not going to help the next generation in voting originally, now is it? What will your kids vote, or be able to choose from?
Seems the USA needs MORE fresh blood from overseas to get out of it's still white-dominated ways. What do white people do in a red man's land anyway? Why was this particular colonization allowed, as one of the few, to remain unturned?
Africa may come across criminal and corrupt (it does to white-me as well), but at least it's mostly being ruled by men and women who's ancestors evolved there. Like Asia. No white guys running the show there. Europe, mostly locally evolved rulers. Did we fight off the colored folks too well, or did they not try hard enough to take us out completely?
Don't get me started about jews killing off Pelestines just slowly enough to sustain a population, for dozens of centuries now. When did Arabs last steal and keep white land?
I'm as white as white gets, btw. Doesn't mean I think it's cool for Indians to be near extinct and
Palestines to be shot off their holy land.
Oops, did I slip off-topic? :-) Truth hurts. Feel free to delete, but let some US folks read it first, please.
You are correct in your basic facts clox...but there is never any 'choice', because all "party's" everywhere are controlled by banksters.
The people killing the Palestinians are no more jewish than those behind the invasion of Iraq are americans.
What they really are global inbred elites, who masquerade as whatever stereotype suits the "event".
There's a name for the real jews, americans, and muslims of the world...its taxpayer or wage slave.
Regards...
Quote from: Cap-Z-ro on June 06, 2009, 02:07:27 PM
You are correct in your basic facts clox...but there is never any 'choice', because all "party's" everywhere are controlled by banksters.
The people killing the Palestinians are no more jewish than those behind the invasion of Iraq are americans.
What they really are global inbred elites, who masquerade as whatever stereotype suits the "event".
There's a name for the real jews, americans, and muslims of the world...its taxpayer or wage slave.
Regards...
When a people (or selective members) supports its own army's actions, those are then responsible as well. I have seen footage of Palestines throwing rocks, wanting their land back, and jews shooting back with Uzi's. That is not new world order, that's people putting their own convenience (extremely fertile and holy ground) above another human's life. Bankers have little stake in this argument. One religion denying the natural inhabitants their rights.
Columbus went to explore the world, and ended up starting colonization. The people who killed the indians, and those taking advantage of land-theft are to be held responsible, not bankers.
Don't like banks? Just don't give your money to them, and don't allow them to give you their money. If we live less greedy, there will be no need for credit cards, car loans, mortgages, etc. House prices will drop even more when we get reluctant to decorage and maintain huge properties.
There are exception. In the Yugoslav war of the 90's, not all the ethnic groups joined in the polican hatred. I went to school with Croat and Serbian guys, and they chose to be friends during this, not to allow blind hate to get to them. Wise teens. Their families were being killed in the fatherland, mind you.
See this between muslims and jews ever? They're the only 2 world religions I know of that don't eat pork, dismissing it as an unclean animal. I regard it as a higher animal than a dog, as it certainly is more intelligent. We're even to some extent genetically competible to pigs, lesser so to dog. But before you get ideas, I prefer to eat pork over dog, as dogs are my friends. Never got to socialize with pigs, we hang in different places I suppose. Or they may righteously take offence of my diet.
If jews would finally agree that Palestina and it's region belong to the arabs who evolved there. Hey, the history is in all the religious books, they saw a better land, and set to destroy its inhabitants to have the land for themselves. Let the arabs in peace, and seek asylum in their buddies of the new sacret world, USA. Plenty of room there, they could even get a similar arrangement as the indians, less the killing and discrediting.
If you want choices, you need to vote outside the usual box, or not vote at all. In most of Western Europe as I know it, bankers don't run the elections, I'm telling you. Politicians don't get to live in huge houses, they get to work really hard to fight for their beliefs, against a rigid system. But they do.
If you are marking one box when your choice only is between "bad" and "worse", I have bad news for you : you are not living in a democracy. Whether you're electing a muppet or a dictator, you're contributing by voting. Sleep well :-)
I'm afraid it goes deeper than you know clox.
Only through comparing various independent sources will you find out that the game is keeping people in a perpetual state of war.
Genocide begets depopulation and is openly discussed and documented.
An elite ruling class served by a working class of people just smart enough to perform various tasks.
The bloodline of this inbred elite extends back to ancient Babylonia.
That is why most of the people in leadership world wide are blood relatives, or otherwise affiliated.
Regards...
The video evidence presented is just one of a number of sites making similar assertions.
Legitimate research web sites were provided as proof.
The evidence however, is offhandedly dismissed...did any of you provide proof to the contrary ?
None as offered.
Regards...
If you'd substitute top athletes for world leaders, you'd get similar results. Many will be related. Olympians get married all the time. No-one else understands them better. Their kids break records, on a young age. Genetics and culture combined for the same goal : performance. World leaders do the same for another goal : power, and money, interlinked.
Athletes cross over to politics (Arnold is just one example and a new breed of athletes is preparing themselves (Armstrong, and Joey Cheek I believe). The other way around is less practical, as respect comes as hairs turn grey, and respect is required for votes.
Nothing to disprove, but you can wonder whether it's a preferred situation, one breed of people to always rule the world. They thrive on power, and have their way with it. Their desire to rule others, many others, may not necessarily make them leaders for the benifit of all mankind. This is not their inherited goal. So, people with other goals may need to be supported in polical endeavours. In my country, sometimes the green party is quite substatial, but just too small to reach a critical power where they can be part of a government they can idealogically support.
Clox...you seem to be hung up on the 'party game'...this discussion is going circular.
As I said...your own due diligence is required...nothing I say is going to sufficient.
Newbie...the video provided its soures...you cannot declare anything lame until YOU not me source out contrary information.
And you are continually dismissing things outright, and coming off as suspicious as mentioned earlier, because of this.
This will be my last comment on groundless assertions.
Any further posts with nothing concrete to offer will just be removed in the future.
Regards...
I went to the "New England Historic Genealogical Society" website and not only did I not see this so called study but looking at the web site I really doubt they would ever conduct a study like this.
Here is their site http://www.newenglandancestors.org/
But who knows? I mean it must be true It was on YouTube after all.
Well I tried to search that link, but not being familiar with the site, I couldn't get any results for 'us presidents'.
But on the other hand, was I using the right 'key words' ?
What search criteria did you use ?
I know that a lot of work went into producing the video, and I know how prone society is to corruption and nepotism.
With that said...I not prepared to declare the video to be inaccurate, just because 2 people were unable to navigate the sourced site.
Its going to take more than that.
Regards...
QuoteThe bloodline of this inbred elite extends back to ancient Babylonia.
Christ said that nearing the end of the current reality, the 'beast' would turn on the harlot, 'mystery babylon the great' and devastate her, taking her wealth. He also revealed that such ones are spiritually as sodom and egypt.
And we all know what happened to sodom & Egypt:
http://www.arkdiscovery.com/sodom_&_gomorrah.htm
http://history.howstuffworks.com/ancient-egypt/plagues-of-egypt.htm
Here is a link from a clone thread, showing the familial connections referred to in the above linked video.
To me the connections are too close for coincidence given the population of the US.
Would it be safe to guess that 90% of americans are not connected to that exclusive group ?
That link was originally posted here, but got deleted because of its counterproductive presentation.
As I stated earlier, all opinions respectfully expressed will be received in kind...even those of past transgressors.
Every day is a new start.
Regards...
Quote from: Cap-Z-ro on June 09, 2009, 07:00:34 PM
Here is a link from a clone thread, showing the familial connections referred to in the above linked video.
To me the connections are too close for coincidence given the population of the US.
Would it be safe to guess that 90% of americans are not connected to that exclusive group ?
That link was originally posted here, but got deleted because of its counterproductive presentation.
As I stated earlier, all opinions respectfully expressed will be received in kind...even those of past transgressors.
Every day is a new start.
Regards...
This thread is a question - "what does this tell you?". The answer - many presidents are related. Some are direct descendants. Some are distant relatives. Some are very distant relatives.
Here is a more complete chart, without the doomsday music:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Presidents_by_genealogical_relationship (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Presidents_by_genealogical_relationship)
The most common relationships are fifth, sixth, seventh cousins - not very close relatives. Do you even know any of your sixth cousins? Seventh? Eight? Would you be inclined to promote your seventh cousin to a powerful post on basis that you shared a great-great-great-greatfather?
So, alone, this tells us nothing special. I would be curious to pluck out 42 random Americans, from 1776 until today, and see how many of them are related. That would be a good control.
USA population was only about 4 million in 1790, so you have to figure there are a lot of common ancestors involved, and when you are dealing with the upper class (a minority group), who tend to marry other members of the upper class, you get more closer relationships.
What the video infers is that there is some kind of nepotist conspiracy to select presidents who are related to past presidents. However, that is all it is, an inference. It is begging us to connect some dots, but it is a propaganda piece.
One thing I will add is that I find your position interesting, that you are not ready to regard this piece as inaccurate. You appear to have already committed to the message in the piece, and now declare that you will not be swayed by insufficient evidence to discard that commitment. What does this tell us? It tells us that you stand ready to accept as factual those things that agree with your worldview, regardless of corroborating evidence, and put the burden on others to disprove the validity of that information. That's fine as a personal choice, but you are not going to convert anyone like that.
Very well said Utilitarian. I will have to read more of your analytical writing.
Dave
I'm afraid it becomes critically relevant when those relatives are involved in secret societies and making slaves out of us all.
Other than that I couldn't care less who related or who connected to or who knows whom.
When there is a conspiracy against humanity afoot, if you're smart you'll start looking for who's all connected.
To offhandedly dismiss connections between suspects as a stand alone issue without considering all the relevant evidence is a rather narrow minded approach to any inquiry.
I must say it is refreshing to have dialogue without personal remarks.
Regards...
Quote from: 1quasar1 on June 09, 2009, 07:50:05 PM
Very well said Utilitarian. I will have to read more of your analytical writing.
Dave
Yes. Good post.
Quote from: Cap-Z-ro on June 09, 2009, 08:12:20 PM
I'm afraid it becomes critically relevant when those relatives are involved in secret societies and making slaves out of us all.
This comment seems like speculation to me.... But I guess you could say the wealthy have the poor working for them.. But that isn't slavery.
Slavery...or as its sometimes called, 'wage slavery', is maintained through income and property tax.
Otherwise there would simply be a 'consumption tax' only...because everybody consumes.
We own nothing...we pay tax on everything.
We are no farther ahead at the end of the week than the slave of the american south...the great majority of what ever you earn is returned to the master through taxes.
This makes it extremely difficult to rise above that level.
Regards...
Quote from: Cap-Z-ro on June 09, 2009, 10:38:54 PM
Slavery...or as its sometimes called, 'wage slavery', is maintained through income and property tax.
Otherwise there would simply be a 'consumption tax' only...because everybody consumes.
We own nothing...we pay tax on everything.
We are no farther ahead at the end of the week than the slave of the american south...the great majority of what ever you earn is returned to the master through taxes.
This makes it extremely difficult to rise above that level.
Regards...
Don't kid yourself... there are BIG differences between owning your own house (via mortgage) and paying property taxes.. vs. being a slave in the south 100 years ago...
It is true that corporate entities (the rich) can manipulate the system (and people), and exploit tax laws that the poor cannot (or don't know about) to pay little or no taxes at all... I agree this isn't fair. But your views on these situations are very pessimistic and extreme. You are free to learn these tricks and use them for your own benefit, that is the difference between being a laborer (slave) and a business owner (the master)... Lots of very poor people are now very wealthy and not part of some 'crime' family or organized group.
I think the divide between rich and poor creates the illusion there is a secret society... When in fact, there probably isn't (today at least)....
80+ years ago the rich had even more power to manipulate, and there might have been 'evil wealthy groups' that manipulated laws, etc.. The mafia is a good example of this... Or even good ol' boy networks. But now days, I think it's much harder to have a large organized crime networks (in the US, at least)....
Bottom line, semantics discounted...income and property taxes are repressive, with that intent.
Repression is the way slavery.
We are just fooling ourselves to think our governments are not organized crime.
Regards...
Quote from: Cap-Z-ro on June 10, 2009, 06:05:26 AM
...income and property taxes are repressive, with that intent.
Again.. This is speculation at best. Show some "concrete proof" of the above statement.
Quote from: Cap-Z-ro on June 07, 2009, 06:12:50 AM
Any further posts with nothing concrete to offer will just be removed in the future.
Regards...
Quote from: Cap-Z-ro on June 10, 2009, 06:05:26 AM
Bottom line, semantics discounted...income and property taxes are repressive, with that intent.
Repression is the way slavery.
We are just fooling ourselves to think our governments are not organized crime.
Regards...
Do you think there is any chance at all that the intention of income taxes and real estate taxes is to generate money for the government to operate, rather than an effort to enslave its people via economic repression?
Do you know of any other way for the government to make money? I think income taxes are overly complicated and real estate taxes, while simple, are a little high. If the government was more efficient and less wasteful, we could have lower taxes, but even under ideal conditions, the government still needs quite a bit of money to operate.
I would not be opposed to scrubbing the US income tax system for some kind of a sales tax, but at least income tax is a progressive type of tax, where you could have lower income individuals pay a lesser percentage in taxes. A sales tax system is regressive, in that it forces the poor to spend a higher percentage of their earnings in taxes, compared to the wealthy. (A wealthy person can afford, for example, to spend only 10% of his income, and thereby pay no taxes on 90%, while a lower-income individual may end up spending 100% of his income on necessary items, paying sales tax on all of his income, in effect.)
So how would YOU propose that the government of any nation get necessary funds to operate? There are things that we need government for, and those things require money. Or are you a complete anarchist? What type of taxation system does not enslave, and how would such a system differ from what we have in most western countries today?
Did you mean "Regressive?" That is the term for taxes that are "unfair" in that they affect poorer people more than the wealthy.
A "Progressive" tax is graduated to income, a Regressive tax is not.
Sales taxes are "Regressive" (all pay the same percentage), income taxes in most countries are "Progressive" (the more we make the higher the percentage).
The recent movement for the "Fair Tax" (as some Conservative pols such as Mike Hucklebee were for), is a giant sales tax; and gets around the concept of regressiveness for the working-poor, in that they would be forced to petition the government for rebates... Lol something that the rich folks would NEVER wish on themselves ;)
I know a lot of working-poor folks who are none-the-less proud; and have no wish to be forced to go beg to the government for money.
Not only that, but instead of buying stuff, corporations could still cheat by leasing stuff and using barter trade to get around the sales tax.
In that the idea was to make a "level playing field for everyone", that concept was a huge failure... And went over like a turd in a punch bowl ;)
So we should not be deceived by that and other similar plans (...it also ignored Social Security taxes completely): It is just another plan to screw-over poor people and make life easier on the wealthy... Lol, life is easy enough for them now ;)
The real problem with our tax system is that any jerks with enough money for Lobbyists and for campaign donations, can get loop-holes for their corporation.
"Toyoda USA" is a make-believe holding company that amazingly never shows any profits, so it never has to pay any taxes in the US . Many other corps are obviously American, yet they use offshore holding companies to hide their profits from taxes. Some corporations actually profit tax-wise from closing PROFITABLE factories in the US and moving them to China... We actually PAY them to screw American workers out their futures, and give their jobs to COMMUNISTS.
The corporate tax system is OBVIOUSLY DESIGNED for abuse.
If corporations were forced to pay their fair share, and their 40,000 pages of "gray-area" loopholes removed, not only would tens of thousands of scum-bag lawyers be out of work, lol, but we would not have a serious budget deficit.
These cheating corporations benefit greatly from being "American", from having this system to operate in... Where their transportations costs are low and usually reliable, their economic stability is (USUALLY) predictable, where they can get reasonably educated workers, and where there is general stability needed to plan and grow. THEY SHOULD PAY FOR THIS PRIVILEGE (people in countries like Mexico would love to have these advantages). They should pay just like we all do. But since they have the politicians in their pockets, they get away with cheating us all.
If we want to change things, that's were we are going to have to start.
It is my belief that the monetary system supplanted the barter system for the purpose of gaining control over the goods and services offered by others.
Further to that...back in the 30's someone devised an economic system, whereby everybody was required to work for 20 years at a rate of 4 hrs a day 4 days a week.
At the end of that period you are free to resume your 'pursuit of happiness'...or continue working for as long as you wish.
When your 20 years are done, you are permitted to retire with full purchasing power.
I have a hard time finding anything wrong with that theory.
The theory is that for every task required by a society, the wide variety of humans ensures that from among them there are people uniquely suited for that task.
Regards...
Quote from: Cap-Z-ro on June 10, 2009, 04:02:44 PM
It is my belief that the monetary system supplanted the barter system for the purpose of gaining control over the goods and services offered by others.
Further to that...back in the 30's someone devised an economic system, whereby everybody was required to work for 20 years at a rate of 4 hrs a day 4 days a week.
At the end of that period you are free to resume your 'pursuit of happiness'...or continue working for as long as you wish.
When your 20 years are done, you are permitted to retire with full purchasing power.
I have a hard time finding anything wrong with that theory.
The theory is that for every task required by a society, the wide variety of humans ensures that from among them there are people uniquely suited for that task.
Regards...
The problem with the barter system is when you want to buy something, you have to scramble to find something the seller will accept in trade. This may be somewhat eased if there is a universal good that everyone sort of accepts (like cigarettes in prison), with the knowledge that it can easily be offloaded onto someone else, but then, that universally desired good becomes the new currency, and so you are back to money.
Also can you imagine the difficulties of buying something like a house, and hoping the bank will take your truckloads of corn in exchange?
You will notice that I deleted your last 2 paragraphs.
You will receive no reply from me when you resort to personal remarks.
You just can't help I guess.
The system was called 'technocracy'...look it up before making comments which relate to the monetary system, and are not relevant to the topic raised.
Then if you can post your thoughts or questions without trying to tie a can on someone in the process, I will reply in kind.
Quote from: Cap-Z-ro on June 10, 2009, 07:03:14 PM
You will notice that I deleted your last 2 paragraphs.
You will receive no reply from me when you resort to personal remarks.
You just can't help I guess.
The system was called 'technocracy'...look it up before making comments which relate to the monetary system, and are not relevant to the topic raised.
Then if you can post your thoughts or questions without trying to tie a can on someone in the process, I will reply in kind.
I have looked up technocracy, and cannot figure out what that has to do with barter.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technocracy_(bureaucratic) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technocracy_(bureaucratic))
As far as the censored section, you are being awfully sensitive. OK, substitute "you" for a hypothetical person.
In the current system, anyone, including you, me, our friends and neighbors, is free to pursue whatever vocation will allow them to work 4 hours per day and maintain a savings, so that after 20 years, that person can retire.
This may seem like a difficult task, but only if one limits oneself to working for someone else. I know plenty of self employed people, or people who own businesses, who only work 4 hours or less per day. You, me, and everyone else who lives in the majority of the western world is generally capable of starting such a business, if one puts his or her effort to it.
I guess a big difference is, everyone retiring with FULL purchasing power as opposed to very few.
And the system operates under the principle of contribution through cooperation...more of a resource management pool than a simple person to person barter.
Personal comments do not belong in debate...unless they are complimentary.
Regards...
Cap-z-ro,
What is your definition of concrete evidence?
I find much irony in your comments about it. (This is not a personal remark, btw)
Not sure what you're referring to.
Regards...
Quote from: Cap-Z-ro on June 10, 2009, 09:40:25 PM
I guess a big difference is, everyone retiring with FULL purchasing power as opposed to very few.
And the system operates under the principle of contribution through cooperation...more of a resource management pool than a simple person to person barter.
Personal comments do not belong in debate...unless they are complimentary.
Regards...
You are describing some kind of communist utopia. From each according to his abilities to each according to his needs, right?
That is a really nice system to think about, but there is no evidence that it would work in practice. My theory is that there is too much opportunity for free riders and there is little incentive to excel and compete.
To the extent communism has been attempted, it has been a spectacular failure.
It appears as though you are too preoccupied with applying labels to things before you've achieved comprehension of the subject matter.
Communism has no place in this discussion...you need to go back and read the descriptive.
Regards...