Hi Vince,

You have the idea wrong.

Ignore the design and look at the simple diagram with the end view of 2 ring electrodes.

Assume from that drawing that both electodes are free to rotate on a common axis (but separate bearings).

Heat is supplied to both (or to one and radiative transfer will heat the other) so that we start with 2 non turning electrodes, on independent bearing but on the same axis, and with no magnetic field.

We get thermionic electrons from both and the electrons from A collide with B and the ones form B collide with A. Over a period the number of electrons from A to B must be balanced by the ones from B to A or otherwise there would be a charge inbalance. As the electrodes have the same work function a charge inbalance would be eleiminated as it would simply impede emissions from the electrode with a positive charge and encourage electrons from the electrode with the negative charge.

So electrons will exchange and as there is no magnetic field then the average angle will be perpendicular so there is no torque induced in either electrode.

However......introduce an axial magnetic field and as per the big ring diagram electrons are curled such that the average collision is now biased in a direction thus inducing a torque. The inner torque will be the opposite of the outer electrode torque.

Now in the multielectrode diagram I have simply said let the inner electrode be fixed so that it becomes an input port for heat. The outer electrode is connected the drive shaft.

The vacuum is as you put it preset. The device is vacuum sealed with getters.

The actual drive shaft may just drive a dynamo and so be in the vacuum enclosure or it may be magnetically coupled across a glass barrier to an external drive shaft, either way the vacuum does not require any pumping.

Yes heat is supplied but if the operation is done at room temp then the heat flow is from room temp to the depressed temperature of the electrodes where some rotation has been enduced thus conserving the First Law of TD.

At room temp the torque is miniscule but if the input heat is 1000K then the amps per cm2 becomes large and with a realistic surface area of 10,000´s cm2 the cumulative drive becomes useful.

the point is that there is no exhaust and so the conversion of heat to torque must be 100% thus a violation of the Kelvin statement.

Of course with a 100% efficient conversion process a heat pump can be married to it to effectively extract a significant amount of heat from air.

Does that make sense or have I made it more confused?

Regards
Phil

To Retroworm,

Glad to see you are interested.

I have written to the professor who wrote the paper your referred to and he said it is very interesting and will get back to me with a full reply as soon as he can.

Professor XY Fu said the design is correct.

I wrote to Stephen Hawking hoping to get his approval and awiat his response.

So retroworm you are in good company.

Thanks for your encouraging words.

Regards Phil

At Retroworm,

Sorry I thought the reference you gave was to the latest paper from Germano D’Abramo.

It was in fact from Professor XY Fu of Shanghai university. He has written a later paper where he introduces anothe method. His first valve FX1 showed good results but at 1E-13 amps it seems the conservative side of science ignored him. He is now onto a 3rd valve.

He has been working on the issue for 48 years.

The italian professor has used the idea of combining Ag-O-Cs electrodes with a capacitor such that he can store the charge from 1E-13 amp flows to make a value harder to ignore, perhaps it can then be put into a ballsitic galvanometer. This would seem to be harder for skeptics to deny.

Professor Daniel Sheehan has offered to referee my work if I put it into a paper.

I think the dreamers might actually be making some advance on the ultra conservatives of science.

There are now literally dozens of proposals from respected Professors and probably 100´s from amateurs like me.

Regards

Phil H

Thanks Phil;

I appreciate the simplified explanation. I was under the impression there was a prime mover but I think I can understand the basic Idea now.
In all practicality, however I see one major hurdle in your design. If the unit operates at room temperature or at normally elevated temps there should be no issue but if as you mention the temperatures are extremely high the bearings for both or one of the discs becomes an issue. Conventional bearings do not operate well in high heat and will fail at higher temperatures. If the discs conduct any heat through the shafts to the bearings you will definitely have problems. Placing  the bearing location at points that will not be affected by the heat and restricted by the vacuum chamber could be a real challenge.

Good luck
Vince

At Vince,

As you say Vince the design of such devices are always full of challenges, some as big as the physics. The thermal conduction of course needs to be controlled. Also high reflectivity mirrors are used so that radiative heat is contained.

Having said that there are ceramic bearings suitable for temps even higher than 1000K.

As it happens bearings suitable for high vacuum are usually non lubricated and thus ceramic with its low friction is ideal (just like jewel bearing really).

Regards Phil