hi all
I got some info from secret source who got it from a secret source who heard from someone else secret that got that from someone else secret that what R did with his looper is run facing coils in series, but "cancelling" series, so that when you short, or heavily load, the two facing coils connected in series, it doesnt lug at all with Lenz law  -
BUT the trick,  is to MISALIGN the top core/coil to the bottom core/coil, and this misalignment pulls them sort of 90 degrees out of phase to the sweep of the rotor magnet.
so I tried this out in my 4 magnet rotor, 5 coils each side w/backing magnets R-"variant" ....the misalignment I had set up is:
when the bottom CORE is perfeclty centered to the rotormagnet,,  the top facing CORE,  is NOT centered to the rotor magnet, rather it has it's "trailing edge" centered to the rotor magnet...so in my R-variant test machine, the way it looks from looking from the side at it, as the rotor spins counter-clockwise,  is that the top coil is about 6mm to the right, of the bottom coil  and they are not perfectly lined up anymore....you cant really see it at first glance - you have to really look for the misalingment - maybe R did this in his videos and photos, but you coulndt tell through the videos and photos...
The way I did this was to just shift the whole upper plate over a little bit so the whole stator plate of coils becomes misaligned.....then I just ran one or two  of the lower-plate coils as motor coils to spin it.
It wasnt  going too fast, was running on only 9VDC, but there was 3V into 850uf cap is what I got, no loading at all to shaft rotation, didnt get any speed up mabye with more RPMS it would... didnt work on it that long of time but it looks really promising, since I chould fill large-size cap without lugging motor to 3V and there are 4 pairs of coils so that is around 12V with no lugging into 4 of these 850uf caps and that is enough power to run it by itself since it can run on a 850uf "run cap" that gets the battery swtiched into it everytime...

anyways maybe someone else here can give it a try- just shift the top plate over a little bit figuring to make 90 degree phase difference from magnet sweep past top core as compared to bottom core is idea - and then have the coils wired series-cancelling too...

Hi Konehead
I  tryed this my self and spent a lot of time with this missalligment of the two coils. If you do it with only one pair of coils you  will get something without lenz but then when you will put all the pair coils you'll get something more but then lenz appears too. Please try it too with all the coils ; maybe you will find something new.
Today i have build a new coil. This one has 11 layers of wire all winded in the same direction (it tooked me half a day to make it).with this coil i tooked my litlle hdd rotor up to 2230rpm with only 24.1mA/12.5V.( with a 1uF cap accros the coil).I think this is a good result

hi Mariu
those are called "directional" wound coils - I assume you wind layer from back to front, and then grab the end of the layer that comes out at the front, and pull it all the way straight-back to the back of it, and start next layer and again, winding from back to front, then pull back to the back again and do it again....so all the layers of vinds "go" the same direction like you say...
What I do is pull it straight back "on top" of the layer, BUT before pulling back. put a layer of telfon plumbing tap over the whole layer, then after that, pull wire straight  back, and lay it on top of the teflon tape-covered layer, then after it is back at the back again, lay another layer of teflon tape over it again, this time covering that pulled straight back portion too....so the straight-back portion of the winds is sandwiched between the teflon to prevent chaffing of the enamel......this however makes not a perfect round  tight looking  coil like yours came out to...I never pullback on top of another pullbacked portion of winds to prevent bulges in final coil shape...
also I made coils before where the "straight back portion" is acutally a thin round tube of tin, and I solder the wire to the tin, so you can make a "capacitor coil" like that, if you also sandwich the tin-tube between some thin tubes of mylar or something similar....these were lots of hassle to wind but they were powerful and worked like caps at same time they were coils...
Acually just last night coincidently, I replaced a couple of the motor-coils in my Romero-variant with some directional coils like this..(not the cap-coils, just regular direcitonals with the teflon tape).
I notice they do help when you have a core - someone else I know confimred it too with tests long ago.... the flux is concentrated, with more of a cannon-like effect so it pushes the rotor magnet harder and faster with less draw like you just got....with aircores, I couldnt find much difference but maybe there is.
I like to tell people it is like the difference between an omni-directional microphone, which picks up sound in the entire room, and a uni-directional microphone, whic picks up only a singers voice, directed right at the microphone....so the directional-winds in amotor coil,  is like the winds in a uni-directional microphone...
As for the series-cancelling idea, so far it looks good for me at least - next step I want to do is the double-FWBRs over each facing pair,,,I have idea that the two FWBRs are of different diodes, so they will also take out more power since they each pick up a little more of each out-of-phase coil....Romero said it made one more volt per coil pair...
Also want to try this series cancelling misalignment thing with some aircores....I have rotovertor AC motor spinning a failry large Mullergen with aircores, and 8 fairly large neomangets in rotor (soon to be only 4 all-N) with 8 aircoils each side of the rotor on stator plates...what I want to do is the outside stator plate is going to have some slots cut into it, were the mounting-bolts go through - so I can rotate the single outside stator plate a bit so its out of alignment while it is actually running, and watch the voltmeter over a big UF cap as it fills, while also watching the ammeter to the rotovertor motor...all this of course with the coils connected series-cancelling...the idea is to really nail the sweet-spot of misalingment where the coils are actually 90 degrees out of phase....also can have dual trace-scope on each coil and see if 90 degrees is really the best out of phase angle to be at or that is jsut theory about 90 degrees,,,,,,
also while testing the series-cancelling misalignment confiuration last night, as you would expect,  I looked at shorting thosecoils, by quick and dirty test of  just touching the two leads of series-connected coils together, so was shorting them at a very random timing........did this with a deadshort over the DC side of the FWBR, and alsw without dead short on DC side of FWBR...
It knocked the voltage up in the 850uf cap both ways - going from 3V to 12V after a few of them...so looks like the peak coil shorting thing can be combined with the misaligned series connection method too....this might be really something, as then it is possible to fill very large caps with coil shorting at peaks, without lenz lugging because of the big cap...
When you got the lenz with lots of coils, did you have FWBRs over each, and they connect at the DC side, in paralell, or did you connect them all first, then put into single FWBR?

Quote from: konehead on January 22, 2012, 01:39:31 PM
Hi Khwartz

Hi! thanks for replying 

QuoteThe switch coming off the coil is not right

Do you mean "S1"?

Quote- it disconnects the coil.

Yes, it connects it to the first battery, right? it's like in your "BackEFM/Recoil recovery battery charger", so i don't see the problem here; I've checked my schematic: it's exactly the same wiring... :/

QuoteThat is what the motor-coil switch is supposed to be doing.,.

"S1"?

Quotethe FWBR "2nd switch" only connects the backemf/recoil circuit to fill cap or hit load...

ok, thanks having specified for "2nd switch" only function

Quotethat circuit is for pulse widht adjsutment for coil-shorting at peaks, not for a motor coil pulse....they are different

Ok, understand.

Quote- you modified a coil-shorting cirucit, instead you should modify a motor coil pulsing circuit wiht the FWBR and 2nd swiitch...

Indeed, I had taken your motor coil pulsing circuit and just replace the "2nd switch" by the BidMOFSET circuit, but I understand now that useless because no need of width adjustment ?
but can't we replace each time each switch by 1 Hall and 1 Bid, I mean theoretically?

Quote from: konehead on January 22, 2012, 04:17:19 PM
hi all
I got some info from secret source who got it from a secret source who heard from someone else secret that got that from someone else secret

Hi again Kone, and thanks for the "secret source who got it from a secret source who heard from someone else secret that got that from someone else secret"-secret

Quotew/backing magnets R-"variant"

Sorry, what means "w/backing"? is that wiring backward like counter-clock the down-coil, when the up-coil is clock wired?

Quote....the misalignment I had set up is:
when the bottom CORE is perfeclty centered to the rotormagnet,,  the top facing CORE,  is NOT centered to the rotor magnet, rather it has it's "trailing edge" centered to the rotor magnet...so in my R-variant test machine, the way it looks from looking from the side at it, as the rotor spins counter-clockwise,  is that the top coil is about 6mm to the right, of the bottom coil  and they are not perfectly lined up anymore....you cant really see it at first glance - you have to really look for the misalingment - maybe R did this in his videos and photos, but you coulndt tell through the videos and photos...

Wow! what a breakthrough if it works! Very well see

QuoteThe way I did this was to just shift the whole upper plate over a little bit so the whole stator plate of coils becomes misaligned.....then I just ran one or two  of the lower-plate coils as motor coils to spin it.
It wasnt  going too fast, was running on only 9VDC, but there was 3V into 850uf cap is what I got, no loading at all to shaft rotation, didnt get any speed up mabye with more RPMS it would... didnt work on it that long of time but it looks really promising, since I chould fill large-size cap without lugging motor to 3V and there are 4 pairs of coils so that is around 12V with no lugging into 4 of these 850uf caps and that is enough power to run it by itself since it can run on a 850uf "run cap" that gets the battery swtiched into it everytime...

Wish that you're right!!
Could you tell me the frequency of filling/empty cap cycle?
Am I correct to calculate this way: 1/2 * (4*850*10^(-6)[F]) * 12^2[V] =~ 0.252[J] by cycle ?
or voltage doesn't drop to zero Volt I supposed... so from which voltage to which voltage it oscillates by each cycle please?
It will train me to calculate an estimation of the outpower.