@lumen: gwandau gets it. Too bad you don't. Rossi's statements are incompatible with reality. This is separate from the issue of whether or not his reactor works.... what seems certain is that IF it works, it is not working the way he seems to be trying to make us believe it works.

Rossi has said many times that the device makes gammas and that the heat is produced by these gammas being absorbed in lead shielding, within and outside the reactor, and that the water is then heated by the lead. But this seems incompatible with other things he's said and also with the actual designs of the reactors we know about.

And of course your TIG welder is not a _source_ of power, it is a mechanism for dissipating power, and when you attempt to dissipate that much power in that small a space.... thank you for making my point for me... you melt metals, even very refractory ones like tungsten.

@TinselKoala:
First of all, you're not going to get the details you're looking for by trying to trick Rossi into a premature disclosure of his device.  I guarantee you this will not work.  He has said all along that parts of his reactor will remain a secret until his patents have been awarded/granted him.  Since you don't have all the information (or even ANY of the critical information) you can guess, assume and insinuate all you want to but he's outsmarted his competition and you're no exception.

Secondly, all people are REALLY going to care about is that it works (because most people are not scientists), it saves them money on energy costs, and that it's safe to use.  The safety issue is neatly taken care of by U.L. because once they grant the certification(s) needed by Rossi, it will be safe for use in any public place or home.  U.L. has NEVER certified ANY device that has injured the public through radiation exposure (just in case you're trying to imply this).

And lastly, 1/2 a million people are not going to listen to you as evidenced by their own actions in pre-ordering Rossi's E-Cat (Thank God).  So maybe you can sell your wares elsewhere as more people have pre-ordered this product than have even read this thread. 


Better luck next time,

Chess

Quote from: chessnyt on June 09, 2012, 02:11:10 AM
@TinselKoala:
First of all, you're not going to get the details you're looking for by trying to trick Rossi into a premature disclosure of his device.  I guarantee you this will not work.

How do you get that from anything I've said? I am not trying to "trick Rossi" at all. I am pointing out that he HAS indeed said what some people in this thread seem to think he hasn't said: that there are gammas, and that the heat comes from the lead absorbing and thermalizing the gammas. ROSSI SAID THIS over and over. Is it true, or not?

QuoteHe has said all along that parts of his reactor will remain a secret until his patents have been awarded/granted him.  Since you don't have all the information (or even ANY of the critical information) you can guess, assume and insinuate all you want to but he's outsmarted his competition and you're no exception.

Outsmarted his "competition"? Have you checked out Defkalion lately? I laugh at you and your "outsmarted". Defkalion --- if you believe them at all --- is so far ahead of Rossi it makes him look like... well, like an incompetent fraudster.

Quote
t
Secondly, all people are REALLY going to care about is that it works (because most people are not scientists), it saves them money on energy costs, and that it's safe to use. 

Sure. Show me one that works. Remember the "1 MW Plant"? The one that only made less than half that much, and did that while a 500 kW diesel genset was running behind it? Remember? Did that one really work? I don't think so, and some other people who were there don't think so either. If YOU had what Rossi claims, couldn't YOU demonstrate it unequivocally, without revealing your secrets? I certainly could.

QuoteThe safety issue is neatly taken care of by U.L. because once they grant the certification(s) needed by Rossi, it will be safe for use in any public place or home.  U.L. has NEVER certified ANY device that has injured the public through radiation exposure (just in case you're trying to imply this).

I don't know what U.L. has or has not certified, but I can point you to MANY cases where the "public" has been injured by radiation exposure from APPROVED medical and research devices. Approved by U.L.? How many gamma producing home fusion reactors has UL "Approved"? You are just being silly. Here's the deal: IF the device produces measurable gammas AT ALL, it will never get UL approval. And if it does NOT: then Rossi has lied to you and to me. And THAT is my point: What Rossi says is different from the truth. And example after example can be given of this.

Quote
And lastly, 1/2 a million people are not going to listen to you as evidenced by their own actions in pre-ordering Rossi's E-Cat (Thank God).  So maybe you can sell your wares elsewhere as more people have pre-ordered this product than have even read this thread. 


Better luck next time,

Chess

Let me know when you get your "pre-ordered" product. What have you really got? An email.

What "wares" am I selling? Just the truth. Gammas and lead, from Rossi's lips to your ears. Ignore what he says and make up your  own explanations if you like... but I've shown you what ROSSI SAID. 

Remember Sterling Allen? He went to see a genuine overunity mo-gen in South Africa a couple of months ago. He was ready with CASH to buy  one, but the people were so nice that they didn't take his money (actually the money he solicited from his fans), but said they would GIVE him one of the first production models. Very clever. If he'd paid for it, they would have to come through. Since he didn't...... well, we all know what happened next, don't we: Nothing. And you and all the rest of your "half a million" Rossi pre-orders are in the same boat..... waiting for something to happen, and the date keeps being pushed back.

I'm not the one who needs "luck". If you want to hope and pray that Rossi will save the world, that's your business, and your money to invest and throw away. But when somebody wants to claim that there are no Gammas and that the lead can't be heating the water and that Rossi doesn't lie.... then they really should have to explain the quotations from Rossi where he says that there ARE gammas and that the heat comes from the LEAD SHIELDING heating the water. You think that I have no information... but I have collected just about everything that I can find concerning Rossi, and I know what he has SAID publicly. Going from what Rossi has SAID and the actual, verifiable DATA that exists.... I can tell you that there are glaring inconsistencies, and if you choose to ignore them, fine, go ahead. But don't go around saying Rossi isn't claiming gammas and lead heating the water, because he certainly has been saying that.... and if you think it's impossible, like Gwandau... I agree with you. And that is my point.

TinselKoala:

Everyone here already understands everything you just repeated again!
So.... what is your point?

The point is simply that Rossi is known to make statements that do not reflect reality. You, apparently, can therefore pick and choose what you wish to believe. I believe data, not words, and the data that are available to the public do not support Rossi's claims. And that is it, plain and simple. The only evidence for Rossi's claims is to be found in Rossi's claims. If you choose to believe them, that is your business, but you are doing it on faith, not reason.