How testatika can produce 3 kW running at low rpm?

[Steven Dufresne]

BTW: Just for the really few, who don't know. The magnets and the second rotor are not really needed. The first machines, didn't have them but worked also. They are just there for improvement, but not needed for the basic principle.

Just one added note to this, in the Amateur video (the one that is a walk through of the Methernitha workshop), Luzi Cathomen, chief engineer at Methernitha, mentions that the disk in the single disk small machine had to turn twice as fast to make up for the fact that there wasn't a second rotor. So the parts for the second rotor are probably the fixed parts behind the disk. That also means there is a certain frequency required.

I also speculate that there is a ring magnet at the bottom center behind the white grill in the single disk small machine but that's just my speculation.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org

[mscoffman]

@steve dufresne

I know that when we were kids and my dad did some welding we used to be around and look at the arc
sometimes and it does make your eyeballs burn. It's like any burn, it heals after a while with no long term effects
as far as I know. It comparable to solar UV burns suffered by high altitude skiers. But i guess it would not good
to keep doing it.

And yes the weak nuclear force itself would be ZPE  but the weak-force is also somewhat of an abstraction
as it is there with all matter.

I wanted to repeat what I said somewhat more abbreviated fashion;  self recruiting static electritic generators tend
to be inherently overunity because the electrons would disspate except that there must be collective force between
them that allows them to become collected and that causes the ability to have an increased field strength needed
for self recruitment and ionizing other matter. So this electroweak nuclear force adds energy and that is the source
of the modest amount of extra energy displayed by the electrons of a static field. So self recruitment seems to imply
inherent overunity which can be seen only with efficient downconversion of static electric charge to electrodynamic
current.



@shanti

The grilles they use would be a death blow for an electrostatic induction machine,
as you would usually really prevent as much as you can any corona discharges.

And how the Testatika is made would really not prevent but provoke corona discharges.
And then the idea came, they want to have corona discharges, this is how this thing works
(well at least the rotary part of it). the principle is simple. If you have an electric field near a
conductor (e.g. from a electret or another charged but insulated conductor), then current would
flow inside this conductor until the electric field in the conductor would be everywhere 0.
But as we know, the electrons will not be evenly distributed in the conductor, especially if
there are sharp edges. There, much more electrons will gather, and the local electron density
in the conductor will be much higher. Due this, at this point a corona discharge will happen.
This means, electrons will fly into the air. This now means, the conductor has not eneough
electrons anymore to have an E-Field of 0, So new current will flow in the conductor (electrons
will be sucked into the conductor). And then the conductor will again have some corona discharge, ...
Sure, the problem is, that the air there would become more and more charged, and therefore it
will not work anymore very good. Therefore you either move the conductor or the air, so that there
can be some air exchange. It will work also without this special movement as the movement
due to the temperature of the air will carry away some charge, but this will not be very efficient.
So all in all what this does, is, the movement of the air will do the work, to let the current flow
(so the air will cool). But due to this principle you cannot get much power out of it. In the test
experiment I made, which was about a grille with the size of half a hand, I could just produce
enough power to light up a little lamp every few seconds. So, while this is surely maybe a nice
toy, to demonstarte someone what FE is, it is completely useless for real power generation.

--->

Agreed. The grill work on an electrostatic machine HV wheel seems anomalous to me also.
Those grill work points would cause high static field strength to occur at the points as you
say. But if one then alternated grill work patterns between different sectors the high potential
areas would alternate making each sector appear independent of the other to some extent. I was thinking
that this was in the nature of developing AC from the Wimshurst machine which is I consider
non-standard. Your idea of using "corona" coupling rather then capacitive coupling is interesting.
I wonder if there were patents for any AC Wimshurst machine that might shed light on some of
this as to why the wheel was designed the way it was. The machine design could have
come directly from Tesla as he supported AC current and Influence machines would have
popular at the time. Except for this, I have never heard of anyone using a static electric machine
as a HV power supply for Vacuum tube type equipment. (other then x_rays tubes), but I think
it might have worked.

One thing is that one needs the machine to *start itself*  and one will need to spend some time
doing it with a vacuum tube.  Even though is may or may not been a pure vacuum inside the tube.

To be honest except for the overall tendency of how component are used, I don't really fully trust
schematics so I think that the details of exactly how the machine works will forever remain
somewhat elusive. I think if I could do measurements on an operating machine I could figure it out.
Also as you say that different eras and output powers of the machine had different components and
circuit designs.

I believe there where ring magnets at the center of those "pots" making the potential for external
power transfers a real possibility, even though the two pots on one machine would probably talk
to eachother first. This means that the tube would simply have to be an active circuit element like
a shiffler circuit and the Wimshurst part of the machine may been used as something that developed
plate voltage for the tube only, as you say. The machine would have still been required to be variable
sized to respond to "demand" differences ie a user's 7 Watt nightlight vs. 1KW resistive heater etc.

:S:MarkSCoffman

[Steven Dufresne]

I wanted to repeat what I said somewhat more abbreviated fashion;  self recruiting static electritic generators tend
to be inherently overunity because the electrons would disspate except that there must be collective force between
them that allows them to become collected and that causes the ability to have an increased field strength needed
for self recruitment and ionizing other matter. So this electroweak nuclear force adds energy and that is the source
of the modest amount of extra energy displayed by the electrons of a static field. So self recruitment seems to imply
inherent overunity which can be seen only with efficient downconversion of static electric charge to electrodynamic
current.

Oh, I see what you're saying now and where you think the extra energy comes from - the work the electroweak force is doing in bringing/holding the like-charged electrons together. However, I thought what brought and kept them together was the presense of something with a net positive charge. You're saying there's a force in and among the electrons alone that does the gathering and holding? Sorry, I can't find a clear enough explanation of the electroweak force that states this. What I find is that the electroweak force consists of the electric force (Coulomb's Law), the magnetic force (F=qvXB) and the weak force. As far as I can see, none of these forces have electrons gathering together without the influence of protons. If you say you've read of such a beast then I'm willing to leave it at that.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org