Building a self looping "SMOT"

[MileHigh]

Webby1:

If you have contact between the magnet and the metal ball, the ball will typically jump to the middle of either face of the magnet where the field lines emerge.  So that is your lowest potential energy.  Then you have to do work to pull the ball away and that ties into the convention that TK mentioned.  If you have to work on a system to move it from it's rest state, then by convention that's negative energy.  When the system does work on you, that's positive energy.

But you don't always have to be in contact with a magnet to be at the bottom of a potential well for a given setup.  For the rails, you assume that the ball stays on the track.  So within that confine the bottom of the well is a certain spot on the track.

As we know with big neo magnets the trip to the bottom of the magnetic potential energy well can be a perilous journey.  They can smash themselves up or crush your fingers.  Then when you finally pull them back apart you have "charged" them with potential energy that came direct from your own brute force and of course that came from the sun.

With regard to the strength of the field, it will simply increase the steepness of the walls and the depth of the magnetic well.  The actual motive force has to do with the changing of the strength of the magnetic field with respect to displacement.  If the field is constant, the spherical ball will not experience a force on it.  So I suppose a strong absolute field strength and a rapidly changing field strength in a certain direction gives you the most force.

I hope that answered your question.

MileHigh

[Liberty]

Webby1:

If you have contact between the magnet and the metal ball, the ball will typically jump to the middle of either face of the magnet where the field lines emerge.  So that is your lowest potential energy.  Then you have to do work to pull the ball away and that ties into the convention that TK mentioned.  If you have to work on a system to move it from it's rest state, then by convention that's negative energy.  When the system does work on you, that's positive energy.

But you don't always have to be in contact with a magnet to be at the bottom of a potential well for a given setup.  For the rails, you assume that the ball stays on the track.  So within that confine the bottom of the well is a certain spot on the track.

As we know with big neo magnets the trip to the bottom of the magnetic potential energy well can be a perilous journey.  They can smash themselves up or crush your fingers.  Then when you finally pull them back apart you have "charged" them with potential energy that came direct from your own brute force and of course that came from the sun.

With regard to the strength of the field, it will simply increase the steepness of the walls and the depth of the magnetic well.  The actual motive force has to do with the changing of the strength of the magnetic field with respect to displacement.  If the field is constant, the spherical ball will not experience a force on it.  So I suppose a strong absolute field strength and a rapidly changing field strength in a certain direction gives you the most force.

I hope that answered your question.

MileHigh

"Then when you finally pull them back apart you have "charged" them with potential energy that came direct from your own brute force and of course that came from the sun."

Just to inject a point.  When you pull the magnets back apart, the magnets expend more energy to keep you from doing this due to the magnetic lock.  If this is not true and your statement above is true, you should be able to charge up magnets.  I have never seen this done or proven, and don't believe that it is possible to "charge" a magnet by pulling them apart.  I don't see that magnets are discharged either.  Magnets can become unaligned, and appear to be weakened if particles become unaligned, but can be realigned again, but are never "charged" by an outside source. 

By spreading magnets apart, there is room to travel to the magnetic field again.  By this, there is now potential energy available again from the magnet to the steel ball to perform work.  (travel distance with velocity).

[MileHigh]

Webby1:

I think we are in agreement.  The field is not a source of work at all.  Rather, you do work on the field.  You move a ball from point A to point B and you expend work to do that.  You can then exploit your own work later, and let the ball move from point B to point A and turn your millstone.  It's almost like the field is a "backdrop" that you are moving around in.  It's very analogous to a gravitational field.  You do the work to pump the water into the water tower, and then later you extract that work when you turn on a tap.

The gravity field around the water tower is as dead as a doornail.  It's up to you to move up and down in it.  The same things apply to charged objects moving up and down in an electric field.  All three work the same way.

Liberty:

I did not literally mean "charge" the magnets like changing their physical properties.  The magnets don't change.  I meant "charge" in a metaphorical sense.

MileHigh

[mondrasek]

I've seen material from and about Travis that I am not at liberty to share fully at the moment. I have a video of a 16 minute presentation Travis made but if I show it he is likely to try to sue me, since it is supposed to be "confidential". But on the internet, nothing is really confidential, is it. In the presentation Travis does not claim to have a self running, energy producing machine any more, but he does talk a lot about his business plan, about Tesla and Ford, the Wright brothers and Einstein, about "milestones" and "efforts"... and of course TAZ and ZED and other ridiculous meaningless acronyms. He mentions the lawsuit at 15:32 into the video when he talks about "hard doors closing on us" and trying to find new investors to buy out the old, dissatisfied ones.

Well that is a bit disappointing to me personally.  I was hoping you would be able to share some solid facts to support what you said here:

Don't you remember Wayne Travis, with all his engineers and big machines and two visits from Mark Dansie? He couldn't meet the objections on this forum, couldn't demonstrate his claims, and finally asked for his thread to be closed, with great insults to all his critics. And now he's in full on damage control mode, being sued by early investors and trying to find someone to buy out all the others before they sue him too, because he cannot produce a self running machine like he claimed to.

I understand if you have "evidence" that you cannot share in order to protect yourself from any sort of retribution.  But without that evidence are not your claims against Wayne Travis just as fantastical as his?  And I'm not attacking you or supporting Wayne in this.  I'm just pointing out that hearsay is hearsay.  And that is all you are presenting currently.  I was hoping for more because I had never heard of any law suits and assumed that they would be a matter of public record that we could research.

If you find a way to present evidence of the law suits against Wayne Travis, please do!  I personally hate all the lies, liable, and MIB crap that goes on in these cases while I welcome the unabridged truth.

M.

[TinselKoala]

Well that is a bit disappointing to me personally.  I was hoping you would be able to share some solid facts to support what you said here:

Don't you remember Wayne Travis, with all his engineers and big machines and two visits from Mark Dansie? He couldn't meet the objections on this forum, couldn't demonstrate his claims, and finally asked for his thread to be closed, with great insults to all his critics. And now he's in full on damage control mode, being sued by early investors and trying to find someone to buy out all the others before they sue him too, because he cannot produce a self running machine like he claimed to.

I understand if you have "evidence" that you cannot share in order to protect yourself from any sort of retribution.  But without that evidence are not your claims against Wayne Travis just as fantastical as his?  And I'm not attacking you or supporting Wayne in this.  I'm just pointing out that hearsay is hearsay.  And that is all you are presenting currently.  I was hoping for more because I had never heard of any law suits and assumed that they would be a matter of public record that we could research.

If you find a way to present evidence of the law suits against Wayne Travis, please do!  I personally hate all the lies, liable, and MIB crap that goes on in these cases while I welcome the unabridged truth.

M.

On the contrary, I can provide evidence for everything I've "claimed", and Wayne Travis cannot. That puts us on a completely different footing. Whether or not I want to provide the evidence, and why or why not, is another matter altogether. Travis cannot produce what he claims due to the nature of the world: physics. I don't want to provide you with the complete video because I am not financially able to deal with Travis's lawyers, not because the Universe forbids it.

You do have access to the old thread, I hope. If not I do have it completely archived and can send it to you as a set of zip files. In it you can see Travis making his claims, and you can see the insults that he and others in his camp delivered to people who challenged him to provide evidence. On YouTube you can see Mark's two visits, and you can ask Mark himself about his conclusions wrt Mr. Wayne. So I hope I don't have to provide you with those "evidences" for what I said in the post you quote. And I've already posted a still shot from the video I "claim" to have.

Under the provisions of the DMCA regarding Fair Use for Educational, Critical... or forensic... purposes, I've excerpted the relevant segment from the video that Wayne Travis posted publicly to his YouTube account, and then somewhat later made "private". 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKctCl_pr7A

Pretty funny, huh? Instead of showing a working demonstration model that unequivocally demonstrates the truth of his claims.... he has to admit "expectations not met" and funding not delivered.... because he actually has nothing to show other than his externally pre-charged powered kludges that stop running when the precharge runs out. If he actually had what he claims, investors would be tripping over each other, having fistfights in the hallway, trying to be the first to cut him a big check and get his product into the market. Instead ... you get this. What, four years or more into the project he's still looking for help pushing his rock uphill.