Is this the first selfrunning overunity motor w/o batteries ? Mike?s motor

[bitbo]

your wrote:
>I would say that you have achieved something great.

Hey, slow down a bit !
What you have measured is a voltage, not a wattage !
Power is VA (which means Volt*Ampere).
You need to measure Volt and Ampere (via a shunt) using a dual
channel oszilloscope. I could not explain it here in detail, read a good
book or google for it. A multimeter is useless when you are trying to
measure power in an inductive (coil) circuit.

But Watt here and Volt there - the one and only thruth is running on a cap !!!

BTW: In Johns video you can see how he speed up his device by hand. This "hitting by hand" inserts a very huge amount of energy into his cap! If he would disconnect all the elecrtical stuff it would run free at least 3 minutes with that amount of energy inserted. His video tells me, that he has nothing (that time). Mike instead touched his device slightly and it speed up automatically. Think about that...

Bye bitbo

PS: My parts arrive this week and my fingers can?t await to start building - keep you infornmed !

[dingbat]

I'm asking for help here guys, because I'm confused.

First there is this video from John that seems to verify the window motor can run on its own:
http://video.google.com/url?docid=-8484430750184911575

Then some time later we have John coming back with another video claiming that Mike faked his motor, and that he was cheating by using a hidden battery.

So John has at least 2 videos now showing his window motor running on nothing but a capacitor, yet he says Mike's is a fake.

Could someone clue me in please?

Why aren't we all building John's version of his window motor if it already is a self-runner?

Darren

BTW: In Johns video you can see how he speed up his device by hand. This "hitting by hand" inserts a very huge amount of energy into his cap! If he would disconnect all the elecrtical stuff it would run free at least 3 minutes with that amount of energy inserted. His video tells me, that he has nothing (that time). Mike instead touched his device slightly and it speed up automatically. Think about that...

bitbo answers part of your question.

It is very telling to read through the gn0sis thread, paying very close attention to the evolution of the posts of John Bedini, his associates, and "disciples" (for lack of a better word).  I'll leave it at that.

It is also valuable and informative to carefully go through every post of Mike.

Hey, slow down a bit !
What you have measured is a voltage, not a wattage !
Power is VA (which means Volt*Ampere).
You need to measure Volt and Ampere (via a shunt) using a dual
channel oszilloscope. I could not explain it here in detail, read a good
book or google for it. A multimeter is useless when you are trying to
measure power in an inductive (coil) circuit.

But Watt here and Volt there - the one and only thruth is running on a cap !!!

I agree completely.  All of the scope shots are somewhat meaningless without knowing the phase and amplitude of the currents in the system.  Running on a capacitor is almost incontrovertible evidence.

[dingbat]

the one and only thruth is running on a cap !!!

I think this is very important.  I think that batteries in the system, even if for 20 years on the same battery, is not convincing.  The size of motor we are talking about, running under no load, could run for a very long time on the size of batteries being used.  One motor in this thread ran for almost a week on two very small batteries.

Doing what Mike's video showed is the only convincing "proof" of a functional system.  Of course the whole setup would have to be examined for validity.

I am very bothered by batteries in the system.  It would take years to prove anything was happening, and then you wouldn't be sure.

[dingbat]

I connected it to my motor using the previously posted diagram below.

This is what I got. It looks nothing like Mike?s shots, but It does have some rather large spikes every 3 or so cycles. The motor was running on a 5v battery and the spikes show at 21v on the scope. It didn?t make any difference if the hall sensor and SSR relay were operational or not. (I don?t have the Crouzet yet and was using another SSR).

What does it all mean !!!!!

Sam,

Connecting the scope according to that drawing leads to potentially confusing results.  It is somewhat uncertain what you will get with the scope connected there, partly because of where the ground lead is connected, and partly because of the diode and ssr.

I would like to make a motion that we collectively decide where to do scope measurements for future comparisons.

One location I would like to see is right across the capacitor - ground lead on negative side of cap, positive lead on the positve side of the cap.  This would show us to what degree any of the spikes are getting to the cap.

Another location that is of interest is right across each of the 3 windings.  Negative probe on the bottom of the windings (as drawn) and the positive lead on the top (dot terminal) of the windings.  This is 3 separate scope shots.

Anybody else have any ideas on where scope shots should be taken?  Or any comments on the drawing location?

[tonyc]

Hi Tony.

Sorry you had already wound your coil...oh well, you'll have tighter coupling and a tighter wound coil-mass than most others. There's no reason to believe that this is a problem though, so hats off to you. Maybe you could send a pic?

Did you wind with the rotor in place, or insert it after as I suggested to Peter? Aside from taking 4 hours, how was it?

I don't think the brass tubing is going to interfere any more than a steel shaft will, and we know Mike used a threaded steel rod.

What size of wire etc?

Darren

Hi Darren ,
               Pic is attached , the coil is 80mm*90mm so it's prety small. I made the holes for the rotor axel after winding. I decided to removed the 2 brass guides (shown in pic) but the hole does slowly close onto the rotor axel. I will try to fix that with small timber wedges or try to hold it apart with cable ties. Two of the wires are aprox 100 meters of .254mm (30 gauge) and the 3rd is .3mm (28 gauge). I wound 3 layers of the .3mm first then started twisting then finished with 3 layers of 3mm. I ended up with 40 ohms on the .254 wires and 31 ohms on the .3mm. I was hopeing for over 40 ohms on all 3.
   I have assembled and ran the motor useing only 2 of the windings and the standard Bendini window motor circuit. I am a little disapointed as it needs 15 volts and 0.1 amp to maintain its speed. This is due mainly to bearing alignment I think. I will fix that and try again. I want to get the motor running as well as I can before I add the extra circuit and use the 3rd winding.
 Please note that I am a farmer and have little electronics knowledge so don't take any notice of what I do :-) But feel free to criticise.

Cheers    
           Tony.