FIRST FREE ENERGY DEVICE REACHES MARKET IN OCTOBER -- The Game Changer is Here

[TinselKoala]

Again. With utmost respect to the poster.

Ainslie said,

TK is yet to give us evidence of that factory that 'burned down' that also resulted in Rossi's inability to deliver anything at all to that DoD as TK politely refers to it.  Therefore any 'assumption' related to this claim - is void.  But don't let this lack of evidence spoil your argument MileHigh.  Rather let TK provide some evidence to back this 'truth'.  And then.  In line with good argument which would counter any ham fisted efforts at propagandising - we'd be able to establish the 'real' truth as you refer to it.  And how about 'them apples'?  I'm not sure I understand this question - in any context at all.  But that's probably because I'm not as young as I once was. 

And Ainslie said,

Please DO study the DoD document.

The fire and the reason that Rossi couldn't deliver anything at all to the DoD..... is mentioned at the top of Page 6 in the DoD report. How about them apples?

Isn't it interesting that RA questions the competency of the Army research team that did this work, but accepts without question the "tests" that Rossi has so far performed on the ECat?

It doesn't matter who you are, what government agencies are funding your work, how competently you report it, or how good your laboratory is.... if you disagree with RA about anything, you are wrong, and the DoD let slip through their fingers a revolutionary new power converter. QED.



(Which Ross still hasn't been able to build again, to this day--- or he would most certainly be using it in conjunction with the copious hot air and steam flowing from his ECats.)

[chessnyt]

Howdy all,

Chess just as a reminder of sorts, that lead paint can't be sold or used anymore .... that being said.

I doubt that the process of getting a UL listing ( Underwriters Laboratory ) http://www.ul.com/global/eng/pages/  and/or  a CSA ( Canadian Standards Association ) http://www.csa.ca/cm/ca/en/home from the testing and evaluation of the device prior to any sales or installations in the United States and Canada possibly world wide.

This usually takes fourteen units of the item or device getting a listing and the money for the for the approved testing agency to give the listing for the product, this is a requirement through all insurance companies whom give coverage for anywhere the item or product can be installed like a home, business or industry without exception.

This process can take years all it takes is one failure in any area of testing for a life safety issue and it goes back to the place of manufacture for corrections and resubmitting the item again until approval, this can go on over and over again. If my memory is correct the microwave oven took over a year for the first one. The military use if any is somewhat different they can do what they want as the general public is not involved and insurance claims not usually a issue maybe some cover ups are.

A device or item not having a UL or CSA listing and is not 100% safe in all respects will never be sold or be installed without some type of testing agency certification, this is a US State and Federal law insurance company driven.

Cheers,
FuzzyTomCat

@fuzzytomcat:
I appreciate and thank you for your constructive input into this discussion.  The certification process is one area Andrea Rossi has been diligently working on personally to expedite (if possible) the UL's timely approval.  If you care to read back through the thread, you will learn that this topic was originally addressed by Andrea Rossi some time ago.  This having been said, you can understand that Rossi has not overlooked this obstacle from the onset.

This is what Andrea Rossi has to say about the UL certification status today:

"The certification process is going on. By the way, yesterday I spent all the day with the certification engineers and we made substantial progress. In this very moment I am working at my desk to make the paper work they asked me yesterday. It will take all today (Saturday) and tomorrow (Sunday), just to give you an idea of our endeavours on this issue." --Andrea Rossi


Regards,

Chess

[MileHigh]

Rosemary:

Chess that's indeed really, really good news.  WOW.  My concern - not sure that it's valid - is that this also sounds a bit 'monopolistic'.  Why only 'one' producer per country.  Isn't that somewhat 'agin' our monopolist concerns?  In any event.  The 'real truth' as MileHigh puts it - is that this is something less than  75 days from fruition.  And as bad as my math is - that's the countdown to FINALLY attesting to the reality of over unity.

So what am I implying by the term "real truth?"  The implication is that what one perceives to be the truth is not necessarily the truth.  You perceive through the window of your own preconceptions, ignorance, and prejudice.  Who is anyone to say what the "truth" is if they are not fully informed?  That problem runs rampant on the free energy forums.

You say, "FINALLY attesting to the reality of over unity" because you think that's a true statement.  But the "real truth" is that this stuff has never ever been pitched as over unity.  This is supposed to be a system that runs on nuclear power, and that by definition is not over unity.  So what you are counting down to is something that is supposed to be attesting to the reality of low energy nuclear reactions that are burning nuclear fuel.  Mass is being converted into energy, E = Mc^2.

From what I gather, one day Rossi talks about it being an LENR fusion process,  and on another day he says it's related to the weak force.  But I think he says the output is basically copper and gamma rays and that's nuclear fusion by definition.  It is not over unity or free energy.

"One producer per country" also sounds overly simplistic and suspicious.  It just doesn't make any business sense.  And like I have said before, the whole concept of a "home" E-Cat doesn't even make any sense.  How can you actually use an E-Cat in your home?  If you live in a warm climate - then what?  You have a nuclear reactor in your home to take your hot showers in the morning and provide hot water for your sink and dishwasher?  That's it???  If you live in a more temperate climate then you can use it to heat your house in winter time I suppose.

It just doesn't jive when there are thousands of industrial customers that would love to have a cheap source of heat for industrial applications running 24/7.  Is Rossi talking about this?  Apparently not so I don't know what gives.  It all just doesn't smell right.

What are you expecting to happen in 75 days Rosemary?  I am asking you this question seriously.  Do you think you will be able to go to a web site and look at E-Cats that you can install into your basement to replace the water heater and furnace?  What?  What do you think will be launched in 75 days?  Same questions for all of you.

More importantly, what would you say if nothing is launched in 75 days?  No web sites, no products, no nothing.  It may be a hypothetical question, but in my personal opinion that's were we will be 75 days from now.  We will have more quotes from Rossi and not much more than that.

I would be thrilled if I was wrong about this whole Rossi deal, but I am trying to be as realistic as possible.

Here is a thought experiment for all of you:  How do you think a young couple with three very young children is going to react if you ask them if they want to put a nuclear reactor in their basement for their hot water?  I have a feeling that you are going to get some push back no matter how many times you try to reassure them that it is safe.

This thread should be interesting 75 days from now for sure.

MileHigh

[MileHigh]

Chess:

"The certification process is going on. By the way, yesterday I spent all the day with the certification engineers and we made substantial progress. In this very moment I am working at my desk to make the paper work they asked me yesterday. It will take all today (Saturday) and tomorrow (Sunday), just to give you an idea of our endeavours on this issue." --Andrea Rossi

I am going to assume that Rossi is talking about the certification process for a "home" E-Cat to be produced on a production line in high volume.  If that is indeed the case then there are some things to ponder.

It would seem to imply that he has real working samples from a pilot run of E-Cats that were built on a production line and submitted to UL.  But the problem is that there is no apparent footprint in the news media about a factory or about a team of design and production engineers that have built prototypes and then built pilot units on the production line.  I would love to see the FMEA analysis report that he submitted to UL for those babies!

If Rossi was saying this after 1 1/2 years of ongoing work at a real bricks and mortar production plant and we saw pictures of him over the months with his engineering staff in online magazines and if we read about the purchases of production line robots in press releases from the various suppliers of robotic technology, etc, etc, - then it would all sound REAL.

But without all of that happening ahead of time, then the quote from Rossi is just more "Rossi says."  It doesn't smell right at all.

MileHigh

[chessnyt]

"One producer per country" also sounds overly simplistic and suspicious.  It just doesn't make any business sense.  And like I have said before, the whole concept of a "home" E-Cat doesn't even make any sense.  How can you actually use an E-Cat in your home?  If you live in a warm climate - then what?  You have a nuclear reactor in your home to take your hot showers in the morning and provide hot water for your sink and dishwasher?  That's it???  If you live in a more temperate climate then you can use it to heat your house in winter time I suppose.

That was a Defkalion statement regarding licensing of THEIR products which they have not specified as of yet. In any event, this would only apply to Defkalion's products and not Rossi's necessarily.  So this is Defkalion's statement and NOT Rossi's. 

It just doesn't jive when there are thousands of industrial customers that would love to have a cheap source of heat for industrial applications running 24/7.  Is Rossi talking about this?  Apparently not so I don't know what gives.  It all just doesn't smell right.

Rossi IS CERTAINLY talking about this.  Here's what Rossi has stated:

"I want to add that we are setting up a division to produce and sell thermal energy, in future electric energy. We are in contact with Companies selling thermal energy to put our plants adjacent to their network to produce energy, inject it in their grid." --Andrea Rossi


Regards,

Chess