Ibpointless2 Crystal Cells

[NickZ]

  I have not been able to obtain the steady 450mA or so, of current like the Ib's Blue Cell has gotten and can also maintain under the load of the meter.
So I think that the process that he is using that enables such high current levels without oxidation needs to be looked into. As nobody has gotten that high a reading before, especially from such a small cell. 
  I will make a cell tomorrow that will use a solid brass 1/4" rod and aluminum wire wrapped around the rod. As I don't have Epsom, I will use just  plain table salt and white glue mix, for now, and see what happens. I'm interested in seeing if the glue-salt mix can be applied and work properly without any other separator between the two metals. I will cover the whole outside aluminum wire cathode with a second coat of just the glue to seal the first layer. Once you mix the glue with the table salt you only have a minute or so before it heats up fairly hot, and hardens.
  Regular salt absorbs water like a sponge, even my E-poxy/salt cells were practically dripping water after some days, which is why they are working now, but not at first. It's hard to avoid galvanics when there is water present, as it over powers the non-galvanic action that is happening at the same time.  I will look for the Epsom/salt substitute when I can though, as I'm real into get some amps... instead of milliAmps

[ibpointless2]

  I have not been able to obtain the steady 450mA or so, of current like the Ib's Blue Cell has gotten and can also maintain under the load of the meter.
So I think that the process that he is using that enables such high current levels without oxidation needs to be looked into. As nobody has gotten that high a reading before, especially from such a small cell. 
  I will make a cell tomorrow that will use a solid brass 1/4" rod and aluminum wire wrapped around the rod. As I don't have Epsom, I will use just  plain table salt and white glue mix, for now, and see what happens. I'm interested in seeing if the glue-salt mix can be applied and work properly without any other separator between the two metals. I will cover the whole outside aluminum wire cathode with a second coat of just the glue to seal the first layer. Once you mix the glue with the table salt you only have a minute or so before it heats up fairly hot, and hardens.
  Regular salt absorbs water like a sponge, even my E-poxy/salt cells were practically dripping water after some days, which is why they are working now, but not at first. It's hard to avoid galvanics when there is water present, as it over powers the non-galvanic action that is happening at the same time.  I will look for the Epsom/salt substitute when I can though, as I'm real into get some amps... instead of milliAmps

I highly advise you to not use table salt and stick with Epsom salt and salt substitute. Using a lot of metal is key to amps.

But if you do use table salt let us know how it works out for you.

[ibpointless2]

It might not do what I expect on second thought. Equalizing the metal electrodes might make it worse. I guess thats what experimenting is all about...

Now I really think we need to sit down and play with these both in mixture and methods of creating the diode like structures. Maintaining the structures  after they have been made is another later on problem.

IB how did you make your big sealed battery in a concise step by step explanation? Since that is the most current I have ever saw coming from these batteries including John B's. You have something there and we need to explore that way first.

If I remember you had a copper pipe in the center? Why is that? What was your thinking there?

Don't get the wrong impression. I am thinking that is probably the best way to get an even charge to the copper mass. That is probably the best idea yet. My thinking is that the medium flows through the tube contacting all the internal surface and increases the interaction strength with the improved ambient charge flow.

One of the thing I hear you saying a lot is how the water does it magic once it is locked in it's structure. Well the water is still free to move in that structure. It has breathing room so to speak. So the water sloshes back and forth in that structure changing the potentials of each face of the structure.
Remember water reacts to static potentials ie. charged comb next to water stream will bend the stream slightly. That must mean water has a static field as well like any other matter or in some way conducts static fields.

Think about how magnets are made and you will see the parallels I am trying to draw between the two processes. Just from what you guys have done already proves you are setting up diode like channels in the matter of the crystals that block one way and allow the opposite way. Although the channels are weak they add up. More pumps in series the stronger the current. Parallel doesn't seem to do anything with these batteries and I know why. Think about diodes and how they work. The more you have in series the better the ability to resist the reverse flow. In our case the reverse flow is the resistance to pressure or load. I hope that helps to further your understanding.

I want to take you back to our experiments with the Captret. In fact this is the same process as we are doing here. The battery is replaced by the electrodes. In the Captret it used a quasi battery already, the electrolytic capacitor. What we have done is copy that method but we are using the difference between two metals in the ambient environment to supply the potential difference instead of the battery. We never could loose the stigma of illegitimate operation because we used a battery. Even though my battery never lost one volt the captret could not keep the diode like formation inside of it for long and lost the ability to provide a load substantial flow because the crystals in the electrolytic were not locked in.

At least you are making headway in that direction by replacing the battery with something that will never loose it's charge if you can protect the matter that is providing the potentials. You are very correct in your assumptions that a galvanic reaction is bad in this situation. But I beg to differ with you that an oxide layer can not protect the metals. When water is locked into the structure and only used inductively how can the water even touch the metal? We know tons about static induction but never thought It could do what we needed. From what you have seen from your own experiments, has your ideas changed about this process now? The oxide layer is made in much the same way as the water example but the water is not so dense in this case it is air. The crystal formation of the oxide layer is made from a lot of heat(charges) and the medium is the air. Air is just water broken right? Well replace what we are doing here with the water video and you will see the parallel, I hope. The organization of the crystalline lattice is controlled by the metal itself or grown from the metal. Think of the metal as a seed crystal and a source of matter for this process.

Another avenue to understand this process is this one: http://crystalradio.net/minerals/index.shtml

The only reason they are using oxides is because of the type of crystals they are using. Ones with tons of water will kill the electrodes if they are not protected. So maybe the answer is to use Nicks process and nix the water all together??

I used a copper tube because it gave a good surface area to work with.

The only time water is important in my cells is when they're first made. The water in Elmer's glue allows the Epsom salt and salt substitute to combine, this combining makes for the real magic. You then must allow for the water to evaporate, this is why i say wait 12 or 24 hours.

Once the cell is dry, some cell can take up to a week to dry, than no more water is needed for it to run and at this point you can spray paint the cell to further protect it.

There is nothing special about the big blue cell, sorry to lead people on. Don't get me wrong its the most powerful cell i have made so far and runs my LCD clock and pulse motor just fine. The big blue cell is just Elmer's glue with Epsom salt and salt substitute mix together and placed on a copper tube wrapped with magnesium ribbon ( both metals separated by hot glue). The more metal you use the more amps you get. 

[NickZ]

   Ib2:
  Ok, thanks for letting us know about the hot glue separating the two metals from a short circuit, very important point.
I already have the brass rod ready made with an cloth separator between the rod and the aluminum wire wrapping, so, I'll just pour the regular salt/ glue mix on top of that, for now. I'll get your salt mix going soon as I can, but I'm far away from a grocery that carries the salt substitute, or pharmacy with Epsom.
I was wondering about the separator layer as you had not mentioned it before, and I didn't know if it was going to work without it. Now I know...

[nightlife]

 I built two very small cells and I am getting great results. The cells are about 1 inch long and about 5/32's thick. There is very little mixture but I am still getting 1.16 volts each. This was a test to see if it is worth testing on a microscopic level. I believe the test warrants further testing at a microscopic level. The difference is my next testing will be with the use of plates insted of tubes and rods.
Please note that my cells use no water or heat or any kind initial power to jump start them.