Tesla's Charging Circuit and it's Application to Pulse Motors

[Farmhand]

Yes Magluvin, That is the effect, If I remember correctly I mentioned the possibility during the RomeroUK thread. As far as I was aware nobody did anything with it, and that is the first I've seen of your video there. No offence but if that is as far as you took it then it needs to go further. I am describing the coil angles that work for me and showing the current phase differences and Intend to eventually do many tests and develop the principal and side benefits that it allows to be used with it.. Who came up with the idea first is not that important to me, but I did mention it, and it's possible use in the RomeroUK thread as best I can remember and several times since and before that time as well. I certainly don't discount that others have come up with the idea themselves, it does seem obvious. But I think it needs to be described and explained better, hopefully so more people can benefit from it.

Your video shows an increase in speed but I don't see any real time input power measurements or anything. Good stuff. Great to see you got a positive result doing it, Bit of a shame if not many people utilized the principal. It's run of the mill stuff for Tesla coils. 

Regardless I intend show how I'm doing it and as many details as I can.

Also I must say what I'm doing has nothing to do with the "ORBO". Not that I am aware of, I didn't pay much attention to the orbo though.

As well depending on the frequency and the cap size ect. depends on what inductance can be used well, it's all relative. If too much inductance is used then there won't be enough time for the supply voltage to charge the capacitor amongst other things. If "de-q-ing" diode/s are used then the energy cannot return to the supply, many details to cover.

Cheers

P.S. I wish you had mentioned when I said I didn't know where to post about the motor using this principal. If you did I would have posted there as long as there was no insinuation of extra energy involved. 

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[Magluvin]

Yes Magluvin, That is the effect, If I remember correctly I mentioned the possibility during the RomeroUK thread. As far as I was aware nobody did anything with it, and that is the first I've seen of your video there. No offence but if that is as far as you took it then it needs to go further. I am describing the coil angles that work for me and showing the current phase differences and Intend to eventually do many tests and develop the principal and side benefits that it allows to be used with it.. Who came up with the idea first is not that important to me, but I did mention it, and it's possible use in the RomeroUK thread as best I can remember and several times since and before that time as well. I certainly don't discount that others have come up with the idea themselves, it does seem obvious. But I think it needs to be described and explained better, hopefully so more people can benefit from it.

Your video shows an increase in speed but I don't see any real time input power measurements or anything. Good stuff. Great to see you got a positive result doing it, Bit of a shame if not many people utilized the principal. It's run of the mill stuff for Tesla coils. 

Regardless I intend show how I'm doing it and as many details as I can.

Also I must say what I'm doing has nothing to do with the "ORBO". Not that I am aware of, I didn't pay much attention to the orbo though.

As well depending on the frequency and the cap size ect. depends on what inductance can be used well, it's all relative. If too much inductance is used then there won't be enough time for the supply voltage to charge the capacitor amongst other things. If "de-q-ing" diode/s are used then the energy cannot return to the supply, many details to cover.

Cheers

P.S. I wish you had mentioned when I said I didn't know where to post about the motor using this principal. If you did I would have posted there as long as there was no insinuation of extra energy involved. 

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"No offence but if that is as far as you took it then it needs to go further."

None taken. I was just showing an example of making use of the large inductor in a way that doesnt take anything from the system using the orbo effect of the large inductor while it is used for other things. So it shows that along with great efficiency, there is more efficiency to be had with this method. If others want to take it further, its open source info.

I still work with the igniter circuit in some projects. There is efficiency there. From what I have found, Tesla knew that 'holding' the 'points' together, for as long as they are, between ignition firings to energize the primary is a huge waste of energy, all just to eventually release the points to produce the spark. So it is a low freq situation, therefore the 'large inductance' in the patent.  When the cap is discharged into the primary, there is oscillation producing multiple sparks instead of just a single snap. In 'standard' points ignition systems, there is the waste of the holding of the points, but there is a cap(condenser) across the points where when the points release, the cap is across the primary and oscillation happens producing a longer, high power spark time. With out that cap, or if it goes bad, the spark output as a whole is severely reduced.

The igniter is essentially a capacitive discharge charge circuit and is a basic form of MSD ignition.


So along with the efficiency gain of charging of the cap, one must take advantage of that oscillation properly in order to have optimum outputs. By dumping the cap into a coil that requires DC to motivate the rotor is not taking advantage of the oscillation of which there is another level of efficiency if applied properly.

Mags

[Magluvin]

P.S. I wish you had mentioned when I said I didn't know where to post about the motor using this principal. If you did I would have posted there as long as there was no insinuation of extra energy involved. 

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Yes, i understand. Some do not condone 'extra' energy.    But this site is suppose to be about extra energy, isnt it?    Thats what most are here for. Some not.

[Farmhand]

So along with the efficiency gain of charging of the cap, one must take advantage of that oscillation properly in order to have optimum outputs. By dumping the cap into a coil that requires DC to motivate the rotor is not taking advantage of the oscillation of which there is another level of efficiency if applied properly.

Mags

I disagree, that's baloney in my opinion, the oscillation does not happen when a de-q-ing diode is used. The oscillation you seen is the result of your setup alone and there is no evidence that it happens all the time. And I can tell you the oscillation is a result of the energy sloshing back and forth. An ignition coil in a car works at different frequencies and when the resonance frequency of the charging circuit's L/C is reached there is no back flow of energy, the oscillation is the result of the inductance of the charging coil and the capacitance not operating at the resonance frequency, it doesn't need to, It is not a good thing in my situation and is merely a consequence of Tesla having no diodes to use.

You ought to do some research on resonant charging circuits. Here- http://www.richieburnett.co.uk/dcreschg.html find the part on extinction frequencies and the de-q-ing diode.

Some text on extinction frequencies.

However, we also discussed how the capacitor voltage continues to oscillate freely about the HVDC supply voltage, and returns to zero volts at regular intervals. It is clear that any attempt to fire the spark gap when the capacitor voltage is near zero volts will process little power ! These points are marked by RED arrows.

We can quickly see that the capacitor voltage returns to zero after every complete period of the resonant charging circuit. Therefore attempting to fire the gap at whole multiples of this period will achieve no power throughput. In fact the firings only serve to reinforce the natural oscillation of the charging circuit, but do not remove any energy from the system.

Any firing rate which is a factor of the resonant charging frequency forces the power throughput to zero. I refer to these firing rates as "extinction frequencies".

De-Q-ing the charging circuit

The extinction frequencies occur because the capacitor voltage returns to zero after reaching its peak value. This occurs because current begins to flow from the tank capacitor back through the charging inductor after the capacitor has reached maximum voltage. We would very much like the capacitor voltage not to fall, and instead remain at its maximum voltage for two reasons. Firstly this ensures maximum power throughput, and secondly we have freedom in our choice of exactly when to fire the spark gap.

This can be achieved by placing a high voltage diode in series with the charging inductor as shown. The diode allows current to flow from left to right through the inductor, charging the capacitor as before. However, it prevents the inductor current from changing direction and halts the resonant process when the capacitor is at twice the supply voltage.

Honestly you make your own self look silly.

And I bet you only tried that setup after I mentioned it in the RomeroUk Muller thread. Makes sense since you didn't mention it during the entire time I posted about what I am doing. 

You show no evidence of the claim you make about the oscillation. And an oscillation in a charging circuit means very little.

You show some degree of wanting to dismiss what I am doing by what you say.

It won't work, The thing with the oscillation is pure rubbish. I have to say.

Now I have good reason to ignore you.

Go to Richie Burnett and tell him he is not utilizing the charging circuit in the best possible way for him. Sheez

It is my opinion that if Tesla had of had a semiconductor diode he would have used it in that circuit, and I think he would have done so because it is an improvement to the circuit.
And is an obvious one. However the circuit will still work without it, but not as well or as versatile.

Tesla's patent is about the ignition coil, but the resonant charging circuit can be used in many other ways, the best way to use it is the way it works best in the situation you use it in.

If we take hard evidence and apply logical thinking the possibilities are obvious.

This thread is in the Tesla Technology section where there is no overtone of needing to be about free energy or OU. But to be technical, the motor only uses free energy form the sun it cost nothing for the electricity to run it. So it's a machine that runs on free energy because that is all I've supplied it so far. Free solar energy. I see no reason to try to make free energy from free energy. I want to find efficient ways to use my free energy. 

Cheers

[Farmhand]

There are now 5 video's in the first post. I'll start on the basic simplified drawing today.

For those interested that is, those not interested should refrain from posting. There is no reason or need to make this any more complicated or confuse the subject. It's a simple principal and the way I apply it to the motor is just one way. It can be done in any way that it works.

The basic purpose is to provide an increased voltage into the charge capacitors for powering the motor coil/s, the secondary purpose is to help drive the rotor as any normal coil does, by magnetizing force due to current flow. The rest is details. It works and is efficient but it isn't free energy and I see no way it can be, it's just better use of the energy.

Once again seeing just a rotor spin and/or speed up does not impress me much. I will be using the motor to drive loads of different kinds. As I am already doing, the motor has many hours of continuous work done already and is almost constantly running. This is called utilizing energy with a machine to do useful work effciently.

Cheers