Builds

[MarkE]

  Mark,
>>   It is up to you to show an example where the First Law of Thermodynamics can be shown to be false.  If you can achieve such an amazing feat  <<

Again, you missed the obvious. It states isolated system. Most systems, an example is about any mechanical system can be opened when ever the engineer who designs it wishes it to be so. By adding a heat exchanger, they just opened the system while controlling it's exposure.
Nuclear power plants have cooling towers which control heat build up from the fission process. By doing so, they control the entropy suffered from such a process by controlling it by opening it to an opposing potential, cold water. This prevents a meltdown like what happened at Chernobyl in the Ukraine when the fission process generated to much heat. I think they put the rods back in too quickly which caused the meltdown. They did not know at that time that the hot rods turned their energy inward when they were no longer exposed. They learned something new that has changed how such incidents are contained. If they would have slowly reinserted the rods, then their fission process would have slowly abated allowing the rods to cool.
This kind of goes to a new principle in physics that I have realized, it's one that allows for photosynthesis to work. No scientist has yet realized the behavior that allows CO2 + H2O > CH2O + O2. They just don't know how to do that unless it is on paper.
I plan on getting an Organic Chemist to demonstrate a process that can make that happen. And if it works the way I believe it does, then Global Warming could be either slowed or stopped.
Of course, for that to happen would mean that engineers and scientists would need to work together to design an industrial process that mimics nature. Then and possibly only then CO2 emissions from coal fired power plants can be reduced to safe for the environment levels.
And would you like to know the kicker ? I'd have to keep my present job if I want to eat. Realizing a new principle does not put money in someone's pocket.


edited to correct grammar somewhat

Jim you objected that I did not spell out in sufficient detail why it is that a gravity / over balanced wheel can work.  I've now done that for you in terms of conventional science.  That leaves us down to your contention that energy/matter is not conserved.  CoE is a First Principle.  You've got an incredible mountain to climb in order to overcome CoE.

Your argument seems to be that all one needs to do is "open the system".  Sure, provide the needed energy and you can spin a wheel.  Gravity won't be supplying that energy.

[j_lindgaard1]

Grimer, extraordinary claims require compelling evidence.  If you, or Jim, or anyone else have compelling evidence that shows that gravity is not conservative, then by all means please show that evidence.

  Mark,
>>  extraordinary claims require compelling evidence  <<

It seems like you need to be in control. Nobody needs to prove anything to you.
A forum is for discussing ideas. Closed minded people are really in the wrong place.
After all, seeing a perpetual wheel work would not let you understand why, you would only know that it does.
You know, like Thermodynamics. What constitutes an isolated system ? That would depend on your frame of reference.
Take you for instance, you are an isolated system. You can not consider a perspective different than your own.
It's people like you who make things difficult for everybody else, you really contribute nothing.

   Jim

edited to add a pic of where I'm at. I'll be starting the build over because this is a learning process. As a result, it requires more
than having an access to a computer terminal and demonstrating I forgot to stay awake in school.
What this will do is let me see it in action. Using vacuum to pump water from wells has been done for over a century so what I'll be demonstrating is an old way of doing things. Of course, with Bessler, he might've been first with the vacuum pump, not sure of the origin of when first use was known.

[MarkE]

  Mark,
>>  extraordinary claims require compelling evidence  <<

It seems like you need to be in control. Nobody needs to prove anything to you.
A forum is for discussing ideas. Closed minded people are really in the wrong place.
After all, seeing a perpetual wheel work would not let you understand why, you would only know that it does.
You know, like Thermodynamics. What constitutes an isolated system ? That would depend on your frame of reference.
Take you for instance, you are an isolated system. You can not consider a perspective different than your own.
It's people like you who make things difficult for everybody else, you really contribute nothing.

   Jim

edited to add a pic of where I'm at. I'll be starting the build over because this is a learning process. As a result, it requires more
than having an access to a computer terminal and demonstrating I forgot to stay awake in school.
What this will do is let me see it in action. Using vacuum to pump water from wells has been done for over a century so what I'll be demonstrating is an old way of doing things. Of course, with Bessler, he might've been first with the vacuum pump, not sure of the origin of when first use was known.

Jim, ideas are all fine and well.  In fact ideas are great.  Determining what ideas can be realized and which are flights of fancy is a matter of evidence.  The more extraordinary the claim the more compelling the required evidence must be in order to convince any rational person.

Perpetual wheels don't work and never have.  That is the observed fact.  If someone wishes to believe that they are possible, they are free to travel down that road.  If they expect rational people to follow, then they need commensurate evidence of their idea. 

It's not a personal thing.  It's not a control thing.  It's just nature.

Good luck with your work.  Suction pump methods go back at least to the ancient Egyptians.

[Grimer]

  Mark,
>>  extraordinary claims require compelling evidence  <<

It seems like you need to be in control. Nobody needs to prove anything to you.
A forum is for discussing ideas. Closed minded people are really in the wrong place.
After all, seeing a perpetual wheel work would not let you understand why, you would only know that it does.
You know, like Thermodynamics. What constitutes an isolated system ? That would depend on your frame of reference.
Take you for instance, you are an isolated system. You can not consider a perspective different than your own.
It's people like you who make things difficult for everybody else, you really contribute nothing.

   Jim

I couldn't have put it better myself, Jim.


To be absolutely honest, I couldn't have put it as well.


The reason the Keenie and Bob's uncle's devices worked (and doubtless Bessler's too) is that they offloaded half the 3rd derivative energy to outside the system, i.e. the earth, like the sling-shot or gravity assist.  This leaves the other half available for doing useful work.


In the RAR you can see the offload device in the outboards weights which are laid on the floor during part of the cycle. Keenie achieves the same effect with a ratchet and pinion on a leyshaft.

[j_lindgaard1]

Jim, ideas are all fine and well.  In fact ideas are great.  Determining what ideas can be realized and which are flights of fancy is a matter of evidence.  The more extraordinary the claim the more compelling the required evidence must be in order to convince any rational person.

Perpetual wheels don't work and never have.  That is the observed fact.  If someone wishes to believe that they are possible, they are free to travel down that road.  If they expect rational people to follow, then they need commensurate evidence of their idea. 

It's not a personal thing.  It's not a control thing.  It's just nature.

Good luck with your work.  Suction pump methods go back at least to the ancient Egyptians.

   Mark,
Considering that you openly ignore what has been engineered, it is a control thing. Why ? It has to be proven to you on your terms.
With something like CO2 + H2O > CH2O + O2 happens in nature. The science you keep referring to can not explain photosynthesis. Why ?
What you fail to understand is that physics is according to the natural order of things. Engineering is not physics even though physics sometimes is used to explain engineering.
As to your  >> The more extraordinary the claim the more compelling the required evidence must be in order to convince any rational person. <<

The uneducated accept what they do not understand. Consider mag lev trains. They float on air. They are accepted by people who do not understand electromagnetic theory. A rational person will accept something without extraordinary proof, it happens all of the time.
A rational person knows they don't need everything proven to them. Also, there are physicists who believe perpetual motion may be possible. The link is to a video of a machine that operates perpetually. While technically it is a SMOT device, it proves critics like you wrong.

  By the way, Stefan has observed this in person so it is what it claims to be. And as such goes, perpetual motion does not say peform work but merely a system that continuously functions. I hope you enjoy choking on all of your erroneous posts. After all, it will only take a simple demonstration being repeated of how photosynthesis happens. No extraordinary proof, just a basic demonstration of an as yet undiscovered process that is known to happen which allows you to live.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlx2PgESXhs


edited to add; Mark, you need to remember something even if it's only one thing. If I am right, then it will give me a chance to try and make known what might help to slow Global Warming. I think Global Warming is much more of a concern than your opinion.
It requires more than just knowing what allows for photosynthesis. Chances are the same engineering principle would need to be applied to the desalination of sea water. If it works, it could make desalinated water about as cheap as regular tap water.
And to throw some numbers at you. In the next 50 years, the U.S. population is expected to grow by more than 100 million people while fresh water supplies are dwindling. The world wide population is expected to blossom from the 7 billion of today to more than 9 1/2 billion people.
Solutions are needed, not people who say I want to be a road block. If you read my other thread, you'll see that I have learned while others just kept posting like yourself. After all these years, they're still saying the same things while I think I can make a difference because of what I have learned from pursuing perpetual motion and Free Energy principles. Nobody learns from doing nothing.