The TPU uncovered? (A PROBABLE technique.)

[Grumpy]

@wattsup,  not sure what you're doing there, but I suspect you're not hooked up correctly to see any delay.  Grumpy's diagram on the previous page is not wired correctly (scope in the wrong place).

Take a look at my new diagram below.

What happens is that when the voltage of the square wave transitions, the iron coil doesn't conduct current right away for that particular polarity, and a voltage drop occurs across it  (V = L di/dt)  and as the current increases other components get loaded and carry the voltage drop, so basicaly this is seen on the scope as a delay(with time pulses, and as a phase shift with sinewaves).

In your case, your Z = jwL,  (an inductor)  and for this you will not see a delay since I suspect the inductance of the iron coil is a very small percentage of the inductance of the larger coil.  What "Z" you use makes a difference.   

Anyway, that's my take on this whole delay business.  If you understand phasors you will see how a coil  (and a capacitor) introduce a 90 degree phase shift.  The iron coil just has more inductance per length of wire compared to copper, but it can't compete with a copper coil that has a huge number of turns.

EM

P.S.  Obviously, both probes are referenced to ground, just like the signal. 

EM is correct.  I moved the probes from the original drawing to the ground side.  At least someone is paying attention.

[Grumpy]

It's sad that a couple of people have tried this experiment and concluded that there is nothing to see.

They post no data other than a picture, if even that.

No one even asked about the length of the iron wire required or the amount of delay - they just jumped to the preconcieved conclusion that it doesn't work as described.  For all they know it takes 100 feet of iron wire or 2 inches.

The required delay could be anywhere from a few ns to a microsecond.  How much iron does that take?

I found one source for velocity of electric wave in iron = 101700 km/s - compared to copper at 299500 km/s.

Anyway if you iron can give you a microsecond - it should be long enough - however long that is.

[forest]

Maybe pulse coil with rectified sinewave.... I have managed to produce high frequency in my coil (which is different then described coil+ iron delay coil) with sinewave 100Hz and squarewave 4.5khz . With sinewave (acutally it is fully rectified wave from cheap PSU) it is easier to get effect.

[forest]

Much much easier with rectified AC , pulsed 100hz, with squarewave resonance is sharp.and voltage at output lower and input frequency is the same as output so probably no gain.

[pauldude000]

@all

I am going to have to back up grumpy on this, as he is speaking truth. Electricity has been known to travel at different rates of speed through different materials for a long time. The higher the resistance, the slower the propagation.

Nichrome wire (heating elements in electric heaters), for instance takes a LOT longer than iron for electricity to flow through, but heats up MUCH more. This is true for each substance, as the higher the resistance, the higher the heat, the slower the electrons travel through. Substances with lower internal resistance such as gold propagate electricity faster than copper.

However, what I saw in my coil setup was variations on a theme of voltage spikes with phasing. I have seen this in several of my TPU builds, and MANY of the pancake and/or bifiliar coil variations that I have experimented with. I have even seen variations of the theme for the scope shot you posted concerning the magnet motor.

That is why I want to know what you are calling kicks. Like I said elsewhere, I am giving you the benefit of the doubt.

I actually have the feeling that what I am calling kicks actually IS what you are calling kicks. You may disagree, but I am certain you can achieve kicks from AC as well, though I do not know what the effects would be on the negative kick cycles.

Paul Andrulis