Hello all,
This thread is for the 3v OU Flashlight projects.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWjs0-WCMzs (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWjs0-WCMzs)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juwm_W5-qAM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juwm_W5-qAM)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_8OlH4kkKM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_8OlH4kkKM)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoGfSDbnwbk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoGfSDbnwbk)
ICs
CD4069 (K561LH2)
http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10001_10001_13231_-1 (http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10001_10001_13231_-1)
MC34063
http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10001_10001_316945_-1 (http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10001_10001_316945_-1)
Translation of PerpettummobileOUFlashLight_02.JPG
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ferrite pot core OB30 M1500. 3 coils 50 turns each using 0.35mm insulated magnetic wire. The induction is 3x716 uH. Standard 2 sections coil holder. One section is used by the bifiler coil (L1 & L2) and the other section is for the L3. Naturally, an air gap of 0.5mm is required (according to the theory).
In accordance with the AN920 document Figure 18 (http://onsemi.com (http://onsemi.com)), the induction should be 115uH. I have achieved the same result by using 20 turns of 0.35 wire. Thus 3x115uH (L1,L2,L3)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
DC inverter converts 3 volts to about 4,5 volts. It have frenquency about 1-50 probarly kiloherc. kl561 like see in video have about 20 herc, because blinking LED. Primary have about 40 turns ticker wire. Secondary have about 500-1000 turns. So here is something like modulation, then mixed low frenquency and hight voltage with hight frenquency and low voltage.
Я проверяя частоту с осцилиографом уже второй транзистор коротнул и испортил С1815.
Quote from: avalon on April 14, 2014, 03:07:44 PM
the blinking LEDs circuit has been confirmed a fake as well. The trick was simple. One of the capacitors is, in fact, an EDLC device (Electric double-layer capacitor). Once you jump-start the circuit it will work for several minutes.
If
C2 (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/136761/) were a high-capacity EDLC device, would the circuit react like this to the pot P1 being turned counterclockwise and then clockwise back again as in
this video (http://youtu.be/gWjs0-WCMzs?t=2m23s) ?
Quote from: verpies on April 14, 2014, 05:17:42 PM
If C2 were a high-capacity EDLC device, would the circuit react like this to the pot P1 being turned counterclockwise and then clockwise back again as in this video (http://youtu.be/gWjs0-WCMzs?t=2m23s) ?
hi verpies,
Avalon didn't knew i reverse engineered directly from video.He didn't know i spotted
1000uf 10v and 470uf on capacitor in video.
Without doing any verification or validation himself and simply said "
double layer capacitor" value used to make it sound like a fake which is more easy to spell than to proof. ;D :D 8)
Last night i came across one of the site which have a online
calculator for MC34063.Do check it out.
http://dics.voicecontrol.ro/tutorials/mc34063/ (http://dics.voicecontrol.ro/tutorials/mc34063/)
Quote from: verpies on April 14, 2014, 05:17:42 PM
If C2 (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/136761/) were a high-capacity EDLC device, would the circuit react like this to the pot P1 being turned counterclockwise and then clockwise back again as in this video (http://youtu.be/gWjs0-WCMzs?t=2m23s) ?
The circuit would react exactly like that.
I do know that here are some die-hard fans who would ignore the very obvious simply because it makes them look bad by association. However, those are the facts. Follow the link I provided and you can see for yourself.
I would be very happy to see a successful replication. There are none. Why is that? Do you really believe that among thousands and thousand of replications we wouldn't see one more successful attempt?
As usual, Ocham's Razor provides the answer. The simplest solution is the true one.
Try for yourself: what is it more likely: a/it is a genuine design and the rest of the audience are imbeciles, or
b/ It is a fake.
I think you get my drift.
Having said all that, nothing would give e more pleasure than to see a genuine replication.
~A
Quote from: avalon on April 14, 2014, 09:28:34 PM
The circuit would react exactly like that.
I do know that here are some die-hard fans who would ignore the very obvious simply because it makes them look bad by association. However, those are the facts. Follow the link I provided and you can see for yourself.
I would be very happy to see a successful replication. There are none. Why is that? Do you really believe that among thousands and thousand of replications we wouldn't see one more successful attempt?
As usual, Ocham's Razor provides the answer. The simplest solution is the true one.
Try for yourself: what is it more likely: a/it is a genuine design and the rest of the audience are imbeciles, or
b/ It is a fake.
I think you get my drift.
Having said all that, nothing would give e more pleasure than to see a genuine replication.
~A
Я на видео сказал - попробуйте сделать чтоб так работало, ждем ваше видео разоблачение с суперконденсатором.
В любом случае никого не буду переубеджать, не хотите не надо.
I said in the video - so try to make that work, waiting for your video exposure from the supercapacitor.
In any case, no one will convince not want not.
In my version be 100 pF, not 510 like in schematic.
Here I get 513 picofards, 0.98 omh resistor, 90 uH inductance, corversion voltage from 3 V to 5 V. Maximum output curent 0.07 A. Frenquency 43 kiloherc.
And in lats picture some impruvement... В последней картинке автору предложение, как немножко или, может, не немножко, усилить мощность.
I try with 330 pikofarads and with 660 picofarads, not get selfrunning. After 1-2 seconds light emiting diode goes dim, then I disconect from 3 V source.
http://speedy.sh/4teBf/MVI-2352.AVI How it works.
Quote from: magpwr on April 14, 2014, 06:19:12 PM
Avalon didn't knew i reverse engineered directly from video.He didn't know i spotted 1000uf 10v and 470uf on capacitor in video.
Don't you think that circuit's behavior after pot turning is more significant than the visual evidence of a capacitor type and value?
After all, a dishonest person can gut a regular electrolytic capacitor and insert a supercap inside ...or a battery.
Quote from: MenofFather on April 15, 2014, 02:20:20 AM
http://speedy.sh/4teBf/MVI-2352.AVI (http://speedy.sh/4teBf/MVI-2352.AVI)
How it works.
MVI-2352.AVI.exe - what are you trying to pull?
Quote from: avalon on April 14, 2014, 09:28:34 PM
The circuit would react exactly like that.
Why?
What would turning the pot counterclockwise and back accomplish?
Quote from: verpies on April 15, 2014, 03:50:17 AM
MVI-2352.AVI.exe - what are you trying to pull?
I dont know whrom were you get exe, for me all normal. Click on
| MVI 2352.AVI (http://www.speedyshare.com/4teBf/download/MVI-2352.AVI)[/color] if you want donwnload. |
[/color][/font][/size]
Quote from: verpies on April 15, 2014, 03:50:17 AM
MVI-2352.AVI.exe - what are you trying to pull?
Hi verpies,
In this link http://www.speedyshare.com/4teBf/MVI-2352.AVI you can download the video file by clicking on the MVI-2352.AVI shown in middle of the top line, next to the word: DOWNLOAD
If you go down to the very bottom of the link , there is also a DOWNLOAD icon in green which would include an exe file enforced by speedshare.com as written in the bottom: Download this file for free using Tiny DM manager (exe app)
Gyula
Намотал на феритового трансформатора сердечник. Тоже нет самозапита. Подозреваю, что либо мой транзистор не достаточно хорош, хоть и называется как надо ,но этих версий, видимо, полно с одинаковым названием, либо витков у той катушки, которая имеет больше витков слишком мало, у меня 350. А другая, которая, к инвертору, имеет 27 витков где-то. Вот эти две причины основные, думаю, почему у меня не работает. Я убрал и второй светодиод, чтоб не потреблял он и у первого, зелёного, поставил вместо 1 килоома 2,2 килоом резистор, чтоб тоже он меньше потреблял, но самозапитки, как говорил, нету. Либо ещё что у меня другая микросхема задающего генератора, которая имеет не 7 ножек, а 8 ножек на плечо. Она может больше потребляет и может немножко по другому работает.
трансформатор такой?
a transformer?
При настройке я не пользовался осциллографом, на моем блоке питания есть амперметр, я подгонял все сопротивления до 0 потребления. Потом все само-запиталось.
When configuring I did not use an oscilloscope on my power supply has an ammeter, I drove all the resistance to 0 consumption. Then all self-energized.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 15, 2014, 07:56:03 AM
трансформатор такой?
a transformer?
Не такой, такие не знаю где продают. Но, думаю, тут смысл не в трансформаторе.
Тут вроде бы продают http://evita.lt/det-2977-product.html (http://evita.lt/det-2977-product.html) эти сердечники, может куплю.
I replicated the circuit but don't have right core.
http://youtu.be/y8NBNkSXtOg (http://youtu.be/y8NBNkSXtOg)
http://youtu.be/xSrs7peY2HQ (http://youtu.be/xSrs7peY2HQ)
Quote from: verpies on April 15, 2014, 03:46:44 AM
Don't you think that circuit's behavior after pot turning is more significant than the visual evidence of a capacitor type and value?
After all, a dishonest person can gut a regular electrolytic capacitor and insert a supercap inside ...or a battery.
hi verpies,
Both did play a part.
I do own capacitors in the farad range but it does have a catch the recommended voltage is 2.5volt maximum is 2.7volts.
Take a look at the 470uf 16volts capacitor
size against a high farad value capacitor if connected to the pin 6 of MC34063.
My dear friend the video which i am interested in and attempted to reverse engineer was only uploaded to youtube on
8th April.
How could any fool blatantly says there is already replication attempt already made which is likely based on other unverified circuit diagram which i am not interested in at all.
"Before the video was even uploaded or existed" :D Do think about it.
It's just a simple distraction for us which i don't fall for too easily.
If i suspect any device is a fake or really hard to replicate with no details provided .I will just ignore and don't waste time&effort even talking about it.
MC34063 and ferrite pot have been shipped out which i likely will received this item around 3week time(max).Best case 2 weeks.
--------------------------------
The creator of the circuit did reveal one hint once current/amperage from power supply(3v supply) to circuit dropped to 0.Then the circuit is self-running.It's simple for me to understand.
Else i was lost on how to find out if circuit goes to self -running besides disconnecting from power supply a couple of times after tuning.
"Answer tune and monitor current drawn at the same time"
Thank you!
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 15, 2014, 12:48:07 AM
I said in the video - so try to make that work, waiting for your video exposure from the supercapacitor.
In any case, no one will convince not want not.
I was only referring to the Russian site which implied that the design was a fake. However, if you have managed to make it work it would be a great help to anyone who's trying to replicate if you were to give that more details about the design.
As a matter of interest I will assemble the circuit in a few days when I have a bit more time. Luckily I have all of the right components.
The results will be posted here. Stand by...
~A
Quote from: MenofFather on April 15, 2014, 02:08:03 AM
I try with 330 pikofarads and with 660 picofarads, not get selfrunning. After 1-2 seconds light emiting diode goes dim, then I disconect from 3 V source.
Do measure current consumption to circuit as you tune which should be 0 or maybe appear negative value once circuit is running.
How about the
counter poise(large square copper track connected to (-) ) beneath the pot core(lower half it looks like copper screw thread hole and solder to sq copper track) which many will overlook.
Does this play a part.I hope you ask...
Quote from: avalon on April 15, 2014, 11:57:06 AM
I was only referring to the Russian site which implied that the design was a fake. However, if you have managed to make it work it would be a great help to anyone who's trying to replicate if you were to give that more details about the design.
As a matter of interest I will assemble the circuit in a few days when I have a bit more time. Luckily I have all of the right components.
The results will be posted here. Stand by...
~A
>:( Считай витки.
Consider the turns.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk
So, how I see, conected to inverter have little ticker wire and 30-40 turns, it is on top. Conected to transistor colector and plus have 50-70 turns of little tinner wire and it is inside.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 15, 2014, 12:50:41 PM
>:( Считай витки.
Consider the turns.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk)
I also see copper tape under and over first winding, how is it connected, to ground?
Look Mr Semenihin's diagram (schema ньюфонарик3.JPG ), it is one primary 10-12 turns and no copper foil.
The secondary has 3 coils, two copper foils and between them are 15-18 turns. A copper foil means one turn with a little gap.
Yes, Yes, thank you, Mr. Semenihin !!!
Please, Which is the button for correct my Writing ?
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 15, 2014, 12:50:41 PM
>:( Считай витки.
Consider the turns.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk
A (big) step in the right direction. This might jump-start successful replications. Kudos to you!
~A
Free energy is wonderful even if it scares some people, like in this movie:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0PLCeeFMl9E
Hi MenoFather,
We will need your help to communicate with the creator of the circuit in Russian.To ask the estimated number of primary and secondary turns in Russian or why the copper foil was used which leave around a 1mm gap without closing loop.
I hope this will solve the free energy mystery once and for all which can put all skeptics past,present and future to rest once and for all. :D
---------------------------------------------
everyone,
I wonder where is stivep /stivep1 when we need him.
As usual please save video 4.
From that transformer gutting video, it can be gleaned that:
- Two or three windings exist.
- Two copper shield layers exist.
- The inner shield is gapped.
- Copper shields are coated with some adhesive.
- Cardboard spacer between center posts of the pot core (thickness?)
- Teflon tape between layers
- Outer winding consists of one complete layer
- Outer winding appears to be darker in color (different enamel or different metal?)
- Inner winding consists of almost two complete layers with no tape in between.
MAYBE:
The outer shield is gapped, too.
Matt Watts (http://mailto://matt@sgforum.info) stated that the inner winding is composed of two parts: Vadik unspools the 1st part up to a point where he pulls the bobbin out of his hand. The 2nd part consists of only a small number of turns and is positioned on one side of the bobbin, not centered over the core's gap. He breaks up the 2nd part with a screwdriver.
Perhaps more details can be gleaned from this video, by people with better eyes. Such as:
1) Turn count
2) Layer count
3) Layer advancement
4) The top winding direction in relation to the bottom winding direction ( a.k.a. dot convention (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dot_convention) )
5) Soldered connections on those coppers shields.
Quote from: magpwr on April 15, 2014, 11:56:02 AM
April[/b].
MC34063 and ferrite pot have been shipped out which i likely will received this item around 3week time(max).Best case 2 weeks.
Hello magpwr
I will order the parts also to do the replication.
PLease tell me what size is the Pot core, and what grade of material did you order?
Thanks
take care, peace
lost_bro
Quote from: magpwr on April 15, 2014, 06:34:06 PM
Hi MenoFather,
We will need your help to communicate with the creator of the circuit in Russian.To ask the estimated number of primary and secondary turns in Russian or why the copper foil was used which leave around a 1mm gap without closing loop.
Ok, I try ask him in russian how many turns.... But I think, that 20 precent is chance, that he answer to my question or maybe less. ;)
Delamorto, сколько имела одна катушка витков и друга в вечном фонарике?
Quote from: lost_bro on April 15, 2014, 08:31:41 PM
Hello magpwr
I will order the parts also to do the replication.
PLease tell me what size is the Pot core, and what grade of material did you order?
Thanks
take care, peace
lost_bro
hi lost_bro,
I'm unable to advise if i had purchased the correct "
Ferrite Pot Core" spec from ebay around 4 days back.
I don't recommend you or anyone to follow me on what i purchase as when it comes to cores as i don't have much of a clue.It is not advisable to follow me for core selection. :)
Source-Ebay.com seller from Bulgaria
P4728 HAGY
47x28mm M2 78 POT P PP Ferrite Core transformer
AL=9500http://www.ebay.com/itm/251473390888?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/251473390888?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649)
This is the second largest pot core i can find in ebay.The largest one in ebay is
70mm diameter but comes with no bobbin at all.
The only reason i selected this 47mm dia core size so that i'm able to scale up easily using same core to a certain extend once self run."Primary objective to cut cost while scaling up"
------------------------------------------------------------------------
In the meantime i hope those whom already completed the circuit do try to replicate winding as shown in video 4 without forgetting the copper shield,gap,insulation in between.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk)
Only once any replication is successful and self-run.Only then we can think about scaling up from there.Always think simple first.I hope to see a successful replication posted while i'm waiting for parts to arrrive. :)
Good Luck.
I try calculate numbers of turns of upper windings in slow motion and calculate about 30 turns. Iner windings can be in 3 time more.
Quote from: MenofFather on April 16, 2014, 04:25:28 AM
Ok, I try ask him in russian how many turns.... But I think, that 20 precent is chance, that he answer to my question or maybe less
I was hoping you would ask him in his YouTube comments and on Russian forums that he often participates in.
Please show him the diagram below and ask him whether his transformer is laid out as depicted on Diag.1 or Diag.2.
Also, please ask him which winding terminals are soldered to the copper shields.
Quote from: MenofFather on April 16, 2014, 05:42:58 AM
I try calculate numbers of turns of upper windings in slow motion and calculate about 30 turns. Iner windings can be in 3 time more.
hi MenoFather,
You are right.
1st layer of bobbin is a copper (tape or foil)with around 2mm gap with a solder somewhere near gap .This is connected to one of the around 90 turns around 22...24AWG insulated copper wire and another is connected to a wire leading outwards to circuit.At the top of 90 turns coil it is also connected to copper(tape or foil) with around 2...3mm gap with solder to wire to coil and another to output.
After which there is a white tape to insulate the 90 turns with copper tape /foil then followed by the estimated 30 turns coil(1 layer only).
I hope this is my correct findings since i played video at 0.1x speed using "VLC player" after downloading from youtube video 4.
Anyone please double verify my findings.This will finalize the winding part i hope.The original core AL value unknown. :) :)
------------------------------------------
If anyone buying a pot core take note of your selected the copper wire diameter around 22AWG...24AWG.The one layer consisting of "30" turns should fit in bobbin base on whatever spec you select,can't be small of course.
The diameter of pot core should be around 4cm estimated with a minimum height for bobbin base on your selected copper wire for the turns.Sorry i still don't know the AL value for the core.
Quote from: verpies on April 16, 2014, 06:11:23 AM
I was hoping you would ask him in his YouTube comments and on Russian forums that he often participates in.
Please show him the diagram below and ask him whether his transformer is laid out as depicted on Diag.1 or Diag.2.
Also, please ask him which winding terminals are soldered to the copper shields.
I ask many questions in comment on youtube, to get answer how exatly need wound... But he not answer. I bealive, that here two standart windings, only maybe conected to copper tape not closed.
Quote from: magpwr on April 16, 2014, 06:22:36 AM
hi MenoFather,
You are right.
1st layer of bobbin is a copper (tape or foil)with around 2mm gap with a solder somewhere near gap .This is connected to one of the around 90 turns around 22...24AWG insulated copper wire and another is connected to a wire leading outwards to circuit.At the top of 90 turns coil it is also connected to copper(tape or foil) with around 2...3mm gap with solder to wire to coil and another to output.
After which there is a white tape to insulate the 90 turns with copper tape /foil then followed by the estimated 30 turns coil(1 layer only).
I hope this is my correct findings since i played video at 0.1x speed using "VLC player" after downloading from youtube video 4.Anyone please double verify my findings.
You, seems, write correct. :D
First layer of maybe cupper tape and second is not shorted in himself. :D
Quote from: magpwr on April 16, 2014, 06:22:36 AM
I hope this is my correct findings since i played video at 0.1x speed using "VLC player" after downloading from youtube video 4.Anyone please double verify my findings.
Quote from: MenofFather on April 16, 2014, 06:48:30 AM
I believe, that here are two standard windings, only maybe connected to copper tape, not closed.
I cannot verify your assertion that the inner winding is composed of only one part. As he unwinds the inner winding, a small group of turns is left behind the unwind-point, while the underlying copper tape is being exposed. The remaining group of turns is attached to something and he cannot unwind them like the rest of the winding, so he breaks them with a screwdriver.
This resembles winding layout depicted on
Diag.2 (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/136850/).
See the photo below:
Quote from: verpies on April 16, 2014, 07:57:21 AM
I cannot verify your assertion that the inner winding is composed of only one part. As he unwinds the inner winding, a small group of turns is left behind the unwind-point, while the underlying copper tape is being exposed. The remaining group of turns is attached to something and he cannot unwind them like the rest of the winding, so he breaks them with a screwdriver.
This resembles winding layout depicted on Diag.2 (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/136850/).
hi verpies,
I noticed the same too but i can't tell from downloaded youtube video played at 0.1x / 1/10x is it because the last few remaining wires "got tangled up" such that it can't be unwind hence the easy way was to break magnet wires to reveal the 1st layer copper tape/foil.
This scenario happens if magnet wire winding became loose maybe.Sorry i can't really tell.
This is my 1st time seeing winding with 2 copper shield with gap at the bottom of 90 turns and at the top pf 90 turns.This is where i need
stivep to come up with any possible theory so that we may know what is actually going on only then the scaling up would be little more easy once we get some understanding on possible "theory of operation"
It reminded me of sr193 and other high power device which we normally get to see with just 1 expose cut copper tube in the center of the core.Who knows maybe the another piece a foil with a gap is conceal nicely from our eyes.But lets not get distracted by other device until we solve this current one which we are focused on.
In the meantime let wait for outcome from others whom i believe already constructed circuit and revealed a non self running video base on older incorrect "winding steps" previously.
Let see if there is any improvement if winding steps is followed as per my observed winding description to Menofather.
Not forgetting the simple tuning steps for 0 amps which is also mentioned <48hours ago in this thread.
Quote from: magpwr on April 16, 2014, 08:32:00 AM
I noticed the same too but i can't tell from downloaded youtube video played at 0.1x / 1/10x is it because the last few remaining wires "got tangled up" such that it can't be unwind
They might have gotten tangled up AFTER he dropped the spool.
But why did this group of turns get left behind during the unwinding of the innermost layer ...
before he dropped it ?
Quote from: verpies on April 16, 2014, 07:57:21 AM
I cannot verify your assertion that the inner winding is composed of only one part. As he unwinds the inner winding, a small group of turns is left behind the unwind-point, while the underlying copper tape is being exposed. The remaining group of turns is attached to something and he cannot unwind them like the rest of the winding, so he breaks them with a screwdriver.
This resembles winding layout depicted on Diag.2 (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/136850/).
See the photo below:
At this point I can add from what Delamorto said:
The underlying copper tape is connected in series with primary coil and the secondary coil is all on top after.
Also I see all these LEDs self runners interlinked (I might be wrong) with same NMR effect... I already explained my thoughts in
http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=2358.msg37723#msg37723 (http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=2358.msg37723#msg37723)
P.S> The http://www.overunity.com/14378/akula0083-30-watt-self-running-generator/msg397475/#msg397475 (http://www.overunity.com/14378/akula0083-30-watt-self-running-generator/msg397475/#msg397475) is one you should look at for circuit diagram and PCB layout. Also it contains mistakes in circuit diagram what needs to be fixed. And semenihin-77 (http://www.overunity.com/profile/semenihin-77.28544/) IS Delamorto ;)
Quote from: T-1000 on April 16, 2014, 08:44:23 AM
At this point I can add from what Delamorto said:
The underlying copper tape is connected in series with primary coil and the secondary coil is all on top after.
Also I see all these LEDs self runners interlinked (I might be wrong) with same NMR effect... I already explained my thoughts in
http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=2358.msg37723#msg37723 (http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=2358.msg37723#msg37723)
hi T-1000,
In series to copper tape (with ~2mm gap)may sound a little misleading for others as i noticed there is only one
"solder point" on shiny copper tape which is easy to spot from video.
Although it may not be wrong to say "in series" since it is also connected to magnet wire and thicker copper wire leading outwards.
---
Haha nice you already drawn it below. :)
Quote from: magpwr on April 16, 2014, 09:02:29 AM
hi T-1000,
In series to copper tape (with ~2mm gap)may sound a little misleading as i noticed there is only one "solder point" on shiny copper tape which is easy to spot from video.Although it may be not wrong to say "in series".
Hopefully Delemorto's quick sketch will help you:
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 15, 2014, 12:50:41 PM
>:( Считай витки.
Consider the turns.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk)
Thanks for video, now someone need to count turns in slow motion mode.
Also as you mentioned, the amount of turns are different each time and until you get same effect (it took for you to rewind 500 times) so ampmeter showed less and less power consumption until it gone down to 0...
Непережывай, тут люди повторят и усовершенствуют схему после таво как на столе будет иметса рабочая копия твоево фонаря.. ;)
Quote from: T-1000 on April 16, 2014, 09:04:13 AM
Hopefully Delemorto's quick sketch will help you:
Has he seen my "not so quick sketch" of the bobbin's cross section?
It would be nice to have those connections of wire windings to the copper foil on
that diagram (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/136850/).
Quote from: verpies on April 16, 2014, 06:11:23 AM
I was hoping you would ask him in his YouTube comments and on Russian forums that he often participates in.
Please show him the diagram below and ask him whether his transformer is laid out as depicted on Diag.1 or Diag.2.
Also, please ask him which winding terminals are soldered to the copper shields.
According to me the beginning of the coil soldered to the shield and the end of the coil soldered the shield 2 to it ...Lacy...
I just counted turns in slow motion of video.
It appears there was 25 turns on isolation on top of copper foil. You might start with 30 then cut wire down until best results if you get 1:1 pot core like there..
Hopefully that helps :)
Hello All:
Quick question:
Does this look like the copper foil tape used in the video?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/One-Side-Conductive-Shield-Copper-Foil-Tape-10mm-X-30m-/190655178902?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c63ef2896
1pc One Side Conductive Shield Copper Foil Tape 10mm X 30m
Product Detail
Description:
100% Brand New
Type : Copper Foil Tape
Material : CU 99.98%
Side : One Sided Conduct
Size : 10mm(width)×30m(length)
Usage : Mainly used to eliminate electromagnetic interference EMI , to prevent body harm from electromagnetic wave. For manufacture of computer peripheral , monitor , or transformer and so on .
Package Include
1pc One Side Conductive Shield Copper Foil Tape 10mm X 30m
Not too expensive.....
take care, peace.
lost_bro
Quote from: HG8AD on April 16, 2014, 12:17:46 PM
According to me the beginning of the coil soldered to the shield and the end of the coil soldered the shield 2 to it ...Lacy...
hi HG8AD,
You have a valid point from photo.Same copper wire can be used without using another copper to link to circuit.
But do try to solder little further away from the gap if you are re-creating copper shield.
But your (cavity or gap) looks little funny it should be across the "bobbin area" for both side.Only one\left copper side is correct ,it seems your "gap" is twice as wide as the original device shown in video 4.
Just try to follow the original layout since it's working device.
If your untested version of copper shielding were to fail it will waste the time taken to wind a another coil."It will be as good as starting from scratch,afresh once more.But i got no say if you got time on your side" :)
Quote from: lost_bro on April 16, 2014, 01:41:54 PM
Hello All:
Quick question:
Does this look like the copper foil tape used in the video?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/One-Side-Conductive-Shield-Copper-Foil-Tape-10mm-X-30m-/190655178902?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c63ef2896 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/One-Side-Conductive-Shield-Copper-Foil-Tape-10mm-X-30m-/190655178902?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c63ef2896)
1pc One Side Conductive Shield Copper Foil Tape 10mm X 30m
Product Detail
Description:
100% Brand New
Type : Copper Foil Tape
Material : CU 99.98%
Side : One Sided Conduct
Size : 10mm(width)×30m(length)
Usage : Mainly used to eliminate electromagnetic interference EMI , to prevent body harm from electromagnetic wave. For manufacture of computer peripheral , monitor , or transformer and so on .
Package Include
1pc One Side Conductive Shield Copper Foil Tape 10mm X 30m
Not too expensive.....
take care, peace.
lost_bro
hi lost_bro,
Before you actually purchase item have you noticed the
width of the copper tape spec
"10mm" or 1cm is actually insufficient to cover the cross section of bobbin winding area.
Why not go for thin "copper sheet or copper foil" which can be cut even with scissors and easy to apply for any size of bobbin height.
Once soldered copper wire to sheet after cutting sheet to bobbin spec.Then stick onto place with see through tape or you can also attach very thin double sided tape under the cut copper pieces.
This would be similar to a copper tape.
This is just my 2 cent worth of advise.I shall leave it to you to decide.
I will try with other windings. one coil 25 about turns, other, 60, maybe turns. Then I regulate inverter potiontiometer, then generaly nothing change, I in series conect miliampermeter and curent practicaly is stable in any position of potiotiometer.
Я ещё несколько раз перемотал катушку, медные ленты не использовал. И меняя какбы напряжение, ток никак не меняеться потребляемый от крутения того резистора, который Вадик крутит на видео, у меня его можно крутить в широких пределах и всё остаёться то само, только в одну сторону закрутив там что-то падает или растёт, но это потому что, видемо, прекращаеться режим инвертера и тоже ничего явного нет, чтоб очень сильно ток упал. У меня сердечник Ш образный.
Мой один инвертер, когда другая микросхема не подключена потребляет от 3 вольт где-то 80-90 милиампер, я это померил, светодиод подключая его или отключая, почти и не видно, как там что-то меняеться, то есть он потребляет около 3 милиампера. Может слишком малая у меня индуктвность, раз так много потребляет сам инвертер, сколько он должен потреблять?
И другая микросхема у меня не работает от 3 вольт, если я питание к инвертору отключаю, провод отпаиваю минуса, который его питает, а от 4,5 вольт работает эта другая микросхема и с отключённым инвертером. Так что если вериться, что там очень точно нужно выставить напряжение, а инвертер только для создания нужного напряжения, то почему бы просто не питать от 4 вольт, например, очень точно выставив напряжение на блоке питания?
Прогнался ещё без 16 ногой микросхемы... и есть такое место где ток самый малый, потом дальше крутить, он вырастает в два-3 раза, потом дальше крутить он опять падает, но не так сильно. У меня потенциометер 4 килоом, а не 10, на всякий случай скажу. Раньше, было 20 килоом, несколько дней назад...
Но то место, где ток самый малый, действительно очень чувствительно, не так уж очень, но достаточно чувствительно.
C осцилиографом кое что выяснил. Частота ДЦ преобразователя у меня сперва 140 килогерц где-то и скважность грубо 50 процентов и амплитуда малая. Потом крутя потенциометер скважность растёт, амплитуда растёт и потом есть перелом, где частота в двое понижаетьсяи. Дальше крутя, амплитуда растёт, скважность растёт, частота в сути не меняеться. Начальная амплитуда где-то в 3-4 раза ниже чем докрутя потенциометер до конца. Это на катушке его смотрел. Сважность в конце где-то 95-98 процентов. Потребление самое малое, видемо, когда скважность около 50 и частота когда вдвое выше.
Ещё страно, что иногда начинает катушка жжужать, хоть вторая часть ещё не подключенна, вторая обмотка и вообще вторая микросхема отключенна.
Quote from: magpwr on April 16, 2014, 05:40:52 PM
hi HG8AD,
You have a valid point from photo.Same copper wire can be used without using another copper to link to circuit.
But do try to solder little further away from the gap if you are re-creating copper shield.
But your (cavity or gap) looks little funny it should be across the "bobbin area" for both side.Only one\left copper side is correct ,it seems your "gap" is twice as wide as the original device shown in video 4.
Just try to follow the original layout since it's working device.
If your untested version of copper shielding were to fail it will waste the time taken to wind a another coil."It will be as good as starting from scratch,afresh once more.But i got no say if you got time on your side" :)
Maybe a possible solution :) ... mine is out of order unfortunately yet... :(
HG8AD, in first picture, I think, you good draw.
Когда катушка начинает жжудать, появляеться нейкий синус и причудливая осцилиограмма, а когда не жжужит, то обычные прямоуголники.
На картинке эта осцилиограма и обычный прямоуголник со скважностью 95 где-то процентов. ;)
У меня были севши батарейки, даже теперь где-то 2,5 вольта и потребление около 200 и даже больше милиампер одного DC преобразователя. Это намотанно на феритовый стержень 0,7 см диаметра 350 витков. И теперь нет того синуса. И поставил 20 килоом резистор переменный вместо 4 килоом бывшего. Было бы хорошо если Вадик померил бы потребление одного DC преобразователя с катушкой (без катушки он будет 0 потреблять), без второй микросхемы.
Я домотал ещё 240 витков, кажеться, на этот стержень, но потребление какое было такое и осталось, не заметил, чтоб уменшилось, а расчитывал, что доматав сильно упадёт.
Quote from: HG8AD on April 17, 2014, 04:44:50 AM
Maybe a possible solution :)
That's a nice hand drawing! I could not draw sth like that without a computer.
It is still not perfect because it is not clear which junction connects with the foil and which connects with the wire.
If only Vadik Guk could draw like that !
Чтоб получить тот синус, нужно очень точно настроить на 20 килоом потенциометре и с 4 килоом потенциометром может легче будет, это в самом начале он получаеться и тогда катушка начинает жжужать. При ниже напряжении он вроде бы легче получаеться. Но может и не в нём тут суть, а может просто Вадик наткнулся на какую-то ошибку микросхемы и поэтому получил самозапит, но я повозился на своём сердечнике стержне и самозапита как небыло так и нет, потребление около 100-150 милиампер. При питании 3 вольт потребление может даже и 200 милиампер или выше и никакие подстройки никак не спускают его. Поэтому может тут суть в медных лентах, я их не мотал. :)
Quote from: MenofFather on April 17, 2014, 06:58:23 AM
Чтоб получить тот синус, нужно очень точно настроить на 20 килоом потенциометре и с 4 килоом потенциометром может легче будет, это в самом начале он получаеться и тогда катушка начинает жжужать. При ниже напряжении он вроде бы легче получаеться. Но может и не в нём тут суть, а может просто Вадик наткнулся на какую-то ошибку микросхемы и поэтому получил самозапит, но я повозился на своём сердечнике стержне и самозапита как небыло так и нет, потребление около 100-150 милиампер. При питании 3 вольт потребление может даже и 200 милиампер или выше и никакие подстройки никак не спускают его. Поэтому может тут суть в медных лентах, я их не мотал. :)
You can guess long as you wish just there is single working principle involved and that was mentioned many times in Russian forums.
Here is excerpt from patent application for all this stuff:
Quote from: T-1000 on April 17, 2014, 07:01:34 AM
Here is excerpt from patent application for all this stuff:
So the bottom winding is split into
two parts and the top winding is not.
So that makes 3 coils total and the text confirms that in the 1
st sentence: "три катушки" = 3 coils.
Is this Russian text translated into English somewhere?
Quote from: verpies on April 17, 2014, 07:20:33 AM
So the bottom winding is split into two parts and the top winding is not.
So that makes 3 coils and the text states that in the 1st sentence: "три катушки" = 3 coils.
Is this Russian text translated into English somewhere?
There is no English translation yet.
Also due 3 topics on 2 different forums I am not sure if here it is best to drop in more information about it but I will try. :)
Delamorto/Akula LEDs flashlights circuits are following that patent application too.
Probably everyone remember self runner circuit - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Du8_moSa7KY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Du8_moSa7KY)
It is real manifestation of what was in patent application.
Here is its top circuit diagram of circuit in that video:
Quote from: MenofFather on April 17, 2014, 02:23:31 AM
I will try with other windings. one coil 25 about turns, other, 60, maybe turns. Then I regulate inverter potiontiometer, then generaly nothing change, I in series conect miliampermeter and curent practicaly is stable in any position of potiotiometer.
Я ещё несколько раз перемотал катушку, медные ленты не использовал. И меняя какбы напряжение, ток никак не меняеться потребляемый от крутения того резистора, который Вадик крутит на видео, у меня его можно крутить в широких пределах и всё остаёться то само, только в одну сторону закрутив там что-то падает или растёт, но это потому что, видемо, прекращаеться режим инвертера и тоже ничего явного нет, чтоб очень сильно ток упал. У меня сердечник Ш образный.
hi MenoFather,
Have you try to swap only one of the winding be it primary or secondary side to solve the issue and measure current consumption again during tuning.
It can be a common mistake normally made on self-made transformer with 4 wires(2 pri, 2 secondary).If connected wrongly the circuit will never oscillate.
By observing video 4 you can almost hear the ticking noise base on slower frequency signal produced by I/C:4069.Do use this frequency of ticking sound as a guide for your circuit.
Have you look into the counter poise beneath the Ferrite core on the copper track which looks near to a square shape(-).
Quote from: magpwr on April 17, 2014, 12:22:00 PM
hi MenoFather,
Have you try to swap only one of the winding be it primary or secondary side to solve the issue and measure current consumption again during tuning.
It can be a common mistake normally made on self-made transformer with 4 wires(2 pri, 2 secondary).If connected wrongly the circuit will never oscillate.
By observing video 4 you can almost hear the ticking noise base on slower frequency signal produced by I/C:4069.Do use this frequency of ticking sound as a guide for your circuit.
Have you look into the counter poise beneath the Ferrite core on the copper track which looks near to a square shape(-).
-------------------------
I can't confirm if this do plays a part-----------------------
I observe the copper\brass screw thread is soldered onto large copper track(square shaped).
Do observe the screw at the center of pot core is metallic instead of plastic.The top half is nicely insulated using the "plastic insulator" with the metallic screw going through it which is also similar shaped for TO-247 heat-sink insulator\mounting kit
Last my version have E core. I try with aliuminum tape conected to first wounded wire and try change position of wires, this nothing change. Now burn 34063 and power sonsumption is about 10-20 miliamperes from 6 volts. Green light flasing. I not have pod core. I then not be burned 34063 have power consumption about 2,5 volts and 200 miliamps and nothing helped to me to make smaller cunsumtion strongly.
Thanks for advice. ;)
Ошибка всех получать автономную работу сразу, на 1 видео у меня не было ключа на возврат энергии, получать нужно импульсы с "фонарик видео 1", их настраивают напряжением питания. Вот когда вы их увидите на осциллографе 1-4 вывод 34063, тогда надо настраивать коммутатор, а до тех пор отключите коммутатор.
Error getting all autonomous work immediately on one video I did not have a key to the return of energy, you need to get pulses with "фонарик видео 1", set up their supply voltage. That's when you'll see them on the oscilloscope output 1-4 34063, then you must configure the switch, but until then disconnect switch.
Здравствуйте Семенихин-77
Спасибо за помощь и информацию, касающуюся вашего pertual фонарик цепи.
Я очень ценю ваши видео ..... я постараюсь повторить вашу схему.
Можете ли вы рассказать нам больше информации о структуре ферритовые катушки?
Я не понимаю, как именно медная лента подключается к проволочных катушек внутри феррита?
Я знаю, вы потратили большое количество времени, работая на изобретения, и я ценю тот факт, что вы готовы, чтобы помочь нам повторить его.
Какой вид феррита наполнение из? Тип феррита Имеет ли разницу в функционирование вашей схеме?
Я надеюсь, что вы будете отвечать на эти вопросы.
Спасибо Вам. и есть великий день!
lost_bro ;D
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 17, 2014, 11:11:57 PM
Ошибка всех получать автономную работу сразу, на 1 видео у меня не было ключа на возврат энергии, получать нужно импульсы с "фонарик видео 1", их настраивают напряжением питания. Вот когда вы их увидите на осциллографе 1-4 вывод 34063, тогда надо настраивать коммутатор, а до тех пор отключите коммутатор.
Error getting all autonomous work immediately on one video I did not have a key to the return of energy, you need to get pulses with "фонарик видео 1", set up their supply voltage. That's when you'll see them on the oscilloscope output 1-4 34063, then you must configure the switch, but until then disconnect switch.
То есть на ножки 1 и 4 микросхемы надо садить осцилиограф? Если мы о том самом жужании говорим, то да, выставлять надо достаточно точно и тогда катушка начинает жжужать и как я показывал, у меня на катушке смотря графом появляеться такая сложная осциграма и виден нейкий синус, вот тогда она жжужит, легче поймать это жжужание, когда резистор 4 килоома переменный, с 20 килоомом резистором гораздо сложнее, там только в самом начале она появляеться, это жжужание, а с 4 килоомным в более широких пределах. Но мне это очень похоже на какую-то ошибку самой микросхемы или когда она работает не так как хотели разработчики её. :) Ещё повторю, я смотрел не на 1 и 4 ножке микросхемы ос-графом но на прямо катушке. :)
Quote from: verpies on April 17, 2014, 06:43:51 AM
That's a nice hand drawing! I could not draw sth like that without a computer.
It is still not perfect because it is not clear which junction connects with the foil and which connects with the wire.
If only Vadik Guk could draw like that !
The second version the goodness factor of an oscillator circuit bigger ...
The Russian hexa is looking for an inverter (K561LH2) ...a now one in him (TC4069) is out of order under 4 V..
Снял кадр, где идут затухания и когда он очень точно настраивает, то может как раз настраивает на резонанс. И поэтому падает потребление. От этого следует что либо может один электролит работает как резонансный конденсатор, либо может можно добавить конденсатор параллельно этой катушке какой нибудь и может тогда будет выше добротность и лучше будет. Но похоже что затухает быстровато, что значит, что можно намотав толще проводом увеличить добротность и тогда может быть больше мощности будет при самозапите.
Here can be resonance. He ajust frenquency to resonance of coil. So I see, that it can work similar like Pantiuchov divice.
Strange I found a clip from 2013 where semenihin-77 is lighting 2 bright LED's, seems he is not improving his circuit?
http://www.2shared.com/file/hBvvbWH_/semenihin-77.html (http://www.2shared.com/file/hBvvbWH_/semenihin-77.html)
More on this circuit:
http://mazeto.net/index.php?topic=8699.0 (http://mazeto.net/index.php?topic=8699.0)
Regards,
scratchrobot
This has got to be the most complicated Joule Thief ever designed.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 17, 2014, 11:11:57 PM
Ошибка всех получать автономную работу сразу, на 1 видео у меня не было ключа на возврат энергии, получать нужно импульсы с "фонарик видео 1", их настраивают напряжением питания. Вот когда вы их увидите на осциллографе 1-4 вывод 34063, тогда надо настраивать коммутатор, а до тех пор отключите коммутатор.
Error getting all autonomous work immediately on one video I did not have a key to the return of energy, you need to get pulses with "фонарик видео 1", set up their supply voltage. That's when you'll see them on the oscilloscope output 1-4 34063, then you must configure the switch, but until then disconnect switch.
hi everyone,
I am guessing semenihin-77 is telling us to look for the waveform as produced by MC36043 only without connecting the switching I/C:4069 which produce the switching signal to the transistor.
This might be related to the tuning steps.
Refer to the basic youtube video 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_8OlH4kkKM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_8OlH4kkKM)
The only thing i can't tell at which point in circuit he obtained the MC34063 waveform.I am only suspecting it is at pin one(Before diode) and (-).
Not forgetting the special winding steps with copper shield for the ferrite pot core to be done beforehand.
But i think the easy approach is to observe "current consumption" to circuit at 3volts during tuning stage.
There is only 2 pots which needs to be tuned.
I am also curious on how high the spikes would be produced by switching transistor(Japanese transistor "C1815" Vce 50volts maximum) on 3volts.
The diode model number is unknown or is it a low drop fast "Schottky diode" around 40...50volts.
---------------
For circuit builder please take note fast switching "
Schottky diode" is commonly used in step up converter circuit.
Example: 1N5817,1N5818,1N5819
----------------------------------
Please do not use the diode 1N400x series at all.The "efficiency" even if used in normal step-up converter circuit would be lowered.
This is really a bad choice 2 ways higher voltage drop across 1N400X series and slower switching capability.
Some more similar design
http://yadi.sk/d/pYQJSGjKDEQVR (http://yadi.sk/d/pYQJSGjKDEQVR)
Your welcome
Quote from: magpwr on April 18, 2014, 07:46:05 AM
....
The only thing i can't tell at which point in circuit he obtained the MC34063 waveform.I am only suspecting it is at pin one(Before diode) and (-).
Yes, you have it, in his text: "you'll see them on the oscilloscope output 1-4 34063," the numbers 1 and 4 means Pin 1 (output) and Pin 4 (-).
Quote
....
---------------
For circuit builder please take note fast switching "Schottky diode" is commonly used in step up converter circuit.
Example: 1N5817,1N5818,1N5819
----------------------------------
Please do not use the diode 1N400x series at all.The "efficiency" even if used in normal step-up converter circuit would be lowered.
This is really a bad choice 2 ways higher voltage drop across 1N400X series and slower switching capability.
For the 1N400x diode series, the equivalent but fast switching series was also introduced, it is the UF400x series, also cheap and good. Of course the diode types 'Schottky' you listed are also ok.
Gyula
Here my version how can maybe possible buil generator on not liner indution http://eurosamodelki.ru/katalog-samodelok/alternativnaja-energetika/generator-energii-na-nelineinoi-induktivnosti (http://eurosamodelki.ru/katalog-samodelok/alternativnaja-energetika/generator-energii-na-nelineinoi-induktivnosti)
Better use mosfets, but then need put ressitors 5 kilooms on every mosfet betwen gate and source and not 1 kiloomh resistor to gate, but 10-20 omh. IR2153 here is standart driver with regulated frenuency, from it going two signal (one workin, other not working, then oher working, one not working), here no two frenquences, only one and this one need regulate then curent gose to zero, then divice selfrun. But here I see error, blue line must be removed, but then using mosfets circuit can not operate properly.
@MenofFather,
maybe with isolated mosfet driver for that mosfet it can work. Like in the chinese DS replication with the 6 HV Fets connected in series
hi Menofather,
I have spotted 1st replication attempt from Russia base on similar key component used:Ferrite pot core.
The circuit didn't work for him but i can't tell merely by looking to see what is wrong since i don't understand Russian.
I can't tell what did he miss eg:fast diode,Coil spec unknown,no tuning was even done in video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=wHPsqVGXrBg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=wHPsqVGXrBg)
This is being discussed in this Russian forum.
http://zaryad.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=8534&sid=44665f28bfdfd77d63d99cdd0f90dcbe&start=20 (http://zaryad.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=8534&sid=44665f28bfdfd77d63d99cdd0f90dcbe&start=20)
----------------------
hi everyone,
Although i have not received the components yet to even start on this project.
I have made a very important finding and likely final discovery for MC34063 on how to reduce current consumption once the circuit is completed.
The capacitor value between pin 3 and pin 4 would need to be changed according to your ferrite core value.
You see the tuning the potentiometer for the MC34063 only set the required boost voltage output,just for example 3volts in 5volts output.
But you see the inductor reading\value on core between connected to pin1 and pin 7 plays a huge role.
Long story made short.By changing the capacitor value 510pf to a higher or lower value all depend on the inductor\ferrite pot value between pin 1 and pin 7 of MC34063.
Steps to take to increase MC34063 efficiency-
1)First try without the switching I/C:4069 (Remove ic from socket or remove resistor to transistor only if everything was soldered onto board without socket)
2)Adjust pot until you get for example 5volts at 1000uf capacitor using 3volts supply.
3)Observe the current consumption to circuit using 3volt supply.
4)If the current drawn by MC34063 is insane high like 200mA or even 100mA with just output to white Led via resistor.
Please alter capacitor value between pin 3 and pin 4 until current consumption is lowered until you find the most suitable capacitor to use for your DIY ferrite inductor/ferrite core.
You will likely notice the voltage across 1000uf capacitor is still at 5volts for example.But this time the overall circuit efficiency is greatly improved at lower current drawn.
-----------------------------------------
My justification-
The capacitor value 510pf is likely a incorrect value since base on my knowledge any windings you do on larger ferrite core then likely it would be in Mili Henry since turns is around 25..30..
Optional L/C meter can be used to verify this.
510pf would be more suited for inductor value around 220uH.
who knows the 510 might be a 510nf instead :D :D :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUW-3yXQIWQ :)
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 19, 2014, 03:16:25 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUW-3yXQIWQ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUW-3yXQIWQ) :)
Hehe, I said you already, akula0083 is all in it :D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7V8vC0UL-XY
Вадим, тебе предложение, как усилить мощность. Диоды шотки только. Мотается дополнительная обмотка, поверх или под низом, не важно, из такого количества витков, как примерно одна из обмоток. И ещё 1 мкф конденсатор добавил, лучше 100 вольт, но он не принципиален, он может повысить мощность.
Quote from: MenofFather on April 19, 2014, 05:53:25 AM
Вадим, тебе предложение, как усилить мощность. Диоды шотки только. Мотается дополнительная обмотка, поверх или под низом, не важно, из такого количества витков, как примерно одна из обмоток. И ещё 1 мкф конденсатор добавил, лучше 100 вольт, но он не принципиален, он может повысить мощность.
Если так подключать все импульсы испугаются :)
Quote from: T-1000 on April 17, 2014, 07:47:45 AM
There is no English translation yet.
Also due 3 topics on 2 different forums I am not sure if here it is best to drop in more information about it but I will try. :)
Delamorto/Akula LEDs flashlights circuits are following that patent application too.
Probably everyone remember self runner circuit - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Du8_moSa7KY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Du8_moSa7KY)
It is real manifestation of what was in patent application.
Here is its top circuit diagram of circuit in that video:
I don't understand the meaning of the the "coil 1.4". I can't find any clues in the melnitchenko docs. Where is the additional energy come from? I think the coil shorting isn't the key piece of the OU flashlight.
http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/136900/ (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/136900/)
In this new video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUW-3yXQIWQ&list=FLPKuZ5HpxDHgqdk-z1JjKCg) Akula analyzes Vadik's 3V Flashlight (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/msg397848/#msg397848), which is the subject of this thread.
Akula uses his signal generator instead of the к561лн2 CMOS Hex inverter to generate the low frequency pulsing of the outer winding (19.3Hz)
The yellow channel of his oscilloscope shows the signal at pin 1 of the MC34063 and the blue channel shows the signal at the collector of Q1 (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/136761/) (non-decaying 290kHz oscillations).
He explains the cause of Vadik's inability to light 2 LEDs with his circuit (he blames it on the power consumption of the CMOS chip and on parallel LED connection).
Quote from: verpies on April 19, 2014, 11:29:18 AM
In this new video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUW-3yXQIWQ&list=FLPKuZ5HpxDHgqdk-z1JjKCg) Akula analyzes Vadik's 3V Flashlight (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/msg397848/#msg397848), which is the subject of this thread.
Akula uses his signal generator instead of the к561лн2 CMOS Hex inverter to generate the low frequency pulsing of the outer winding.
He explains the reason why Vadik was not able to light 2 LEDs with his circuit (he blames the power consumption of the CMOS chip for it).
hi verpies,
Base on my previous experiment on HCF4069,i merely grounded all the 3 input of unused inverter else the power consumption may increase if gates within inverter getting stray signal.
The current on 3.4volt battery is mere 450uA with high efficient bright green Led which is connected to 27k ohms in series which i have attached the video previously few days back.
I know 27k ohms may sound a little too high but it works for me.
I manage to find a ferrite pot core of mere 3cm diameter locally which is small.This may not be recommended for this project.
Using 22AWG wire i can only wind around 17 turns on each layer and insulated each layer with trimmed transparent tape.Hence i created 3 layers of 17turns and 4th layer of around 10 turns.
17x3=51+10=61 turns.Copper shield with gap is used on both sides.
The other primary turns is around 17 turns ,1 layer.
Following the video 4 i also used hard paper and cut into a small circle and merely placed on the center of core to form a gap between the ferrite half and to ensure the 2 ferrite half never touches.
I then seal off with tape around the 2 half of core.
Using the common 2SC1815 merely connected to signal generator via 1k resistor with 3.4v battery and used 61 turns winding only.
Between positive and transistor collector i have also connected to self made bridge rectifier using 4 x <30ns TO-220 600v diodes.
Objective to find out what kind of dc voltage i would get from
Bemf on 3.4volts battery.
Final result i have obtained maximum dc voltage of around 120volts using 9KHZ on 10% duty cycle sq wave.
The most interesting part is the current draw on 3.4volt battery is mere
2mA.I wonder if the 2 copper shield have anything to do with it.
I did not mention i have used 1000uf capacitor on emitter and (+) on test circuit.
I have also connected to a 5uf 275AC capacitor to the rectified output which increase voltage a little more.
I will need to find time tomorrow to try inserting signal to 17 turns just to see if i can obtain maximum voltage from 61 turns coil.
Quote from: magpwr on April 19, 2014, 12:36:59 PM
Following the video 4 i also used hard paper and cut into a small circle and merely placed on the center of core to form a gap between the ferrite half and to ensure the 2 ferrite half never touches.
I then seal off with tape around the 2 half of core.
Warning: If my M.O. of this circuit is correct then you should not use acoustically dampening materials such as a vinyl or Teflon tape on the core.
The ideal insulating spacer separating the core is mica (because it does not dampen ultrasonic core vibrations). Paper is worse than mica but not as bad as vinyl tape.
Quote from: magpwr on April 18, 2014, 11:19:53 AM
who knows the 510 might be a 510nf instead :D :D :D
It can't be. The circuit is just a standard step-up converter. Att 3.3v 25 deg C, Pin7 - 3.3v and Pin5 - Gnd, 510nf would represent about 300 ms switching time. That's in the region of 3 Hz.
Incidentally, 510pf should make between 32 kHz to 40 khz depending on some other factors.
~A
Quote from: verpies on April 19, 2014, 11:29:18 AM
In this new video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUW-3yXQIWQ&list=FLPKuZ5HpxDHgqdk-z1JjKCg) Akula analyzes Vadik's 3V Flashlight (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/msg397848/#msg397848), which is the subject of this thread.
Akula uses his signal generator instead of the к561лн2 CMOS Hex inverter to generate the low frequency pulsing of the outer winding (19.3Hz)
The yellow channel of his oscilloscope shows the signal at pin 1 of the MC34063 and the blue channel shows the signal at the collector of Q1 (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/136761/) (non-decaying 290kHz oscillations).
He explains the cause of Vadik's inability to light 2 LEDs with his circuit (he blames it on the power consumption of the CMOS chip and on parallel LED connection).
Oh, the prophet has spoken...
As usual, his speech was full of cryptic messages and zero usefulness.
Also, I've got a feeling that he could not replicate the circuit in a self-sustained mode. Hence - his video is full of nonsense blabbing.
~A
Quote from: avalon on April 19, 2014, 03:29:40 PM
It can't be. The circuit is just a standard step-up converter. Att 3.3v 25 deg C, Pin7 - 3.3v and Pin5 - Gnd, 510nf would represent about 300 ms switching time. That's in the region of 3 Hz.
Incidentally, 510pf should make between 32 kHz to 40 khz depending on some other factors.
~A
hi avalon,
I did not construct circuit yet.I merely inject 9khz signal to transistor C1815 on breadboard which is connected to my untested winding.
The objective was merely to find out the bemf or ideal bemf i would be getting from the winding with the 2 copper shield(gapped).
The 61 turns is 470uH as measured on my L/C meter.This isn't the right core i think since it's smaller.
From here i may able to know if the bemf is able to sustain circuit.
As i mentioned previously
120volts maximum i have got on 9khz at 10% duty cycle for my case,current drawn mere
2mA on 3.4volt AA Li-ion battery.
Power input base on 3.4v x 2mA = 0.0068watt.Power output needs to be measured later on .It's Sunday morning over here as i am typing this. :)
From here i might able to tell if there is ou effect.Result will be posted later <2hours.
It's only the output current which i have not measured yet.I will just use 1Kohms 1% resistor to know the current in mA.
If you guys simply replicate without knowing how it actually works may spell disaster if it fails and if we don't know on how to debug and solve.
"It's my way of optimizing time while waiting for components"---------------------------------------------
Latest result on power input to power output efficiency related to Bemf on 61 turns winding.
Merely used 1 diode 1N5819 connected to collector and negative.Output of diode is connected to 5uf capacitor which is also connected to negative.
Input - 0.0066Amp X 3.4V =0.020watt
Output- 4.21v x 0.00421Amp =0.0177watt (With 1k 1% resistor as load)
Power in/out Efficiency max:88.5% after changing frequency close to original 9khz under 1k load.
---------------------------
I have not tried mixing 2 different frequency yet.Honestly l'm little lost now... :D :D :D
Quote from: verpies on April 19, 2014, 01:32:27 PM
Warning: If my M.O. of this circuit is correct then you should not use acoustically dampening materials such as a vinyl or Teflon tape on the core.
The ideal insulating spacer separating the core is mica (because it does not dampen ultrasonic core vibrations). Paper is worse than mica but not as bad as vinyl tape.
hi verpies,
I agree with you on "dampen ultrasonic core vibrations" part.
My focus during winding was merely on electrical isolation <50volts using common vinyl tape.
Hi MenoFather,
I just spotted this latest video from Artur Shahinyan (http://www.youtube.com/user/Artspi1) (The person whom attempted replication using exact same ferrite core)whom just uploaded 2nd video few hours ago.
Фонарик 02
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izqV7lAPhMU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izqV7lAPhMU)
Kindly tell us what was his findings base on what looks like a Back Emf signal shown on oscilloscope without using 8 pin i/c in socket.Thanks.
For everyone fyi- "Oscilloscope probe is connected to transistor collector and negative for measurement base on video"
I noticed he did not insulate the copper wires(at both opening of ferrite) from touching the ferrite core which may hinder output.Please do advise him.
Just notice this time he did use cut paper in circle in the center to prevent 2 ferrite half from touching each other."This is recommended"
Quote from: magpwr on April 19, 2014, 10:46:10 PM
I did not construct circuit yet.I merely inject 9khz signal to transistor C1815 on breadboard which is connected to my untested winding.
The objective was merely to find out the bemf or ideal bemf i would be getting from the winding with the 2 copper shield(gapped).
You are on the right path as far as I am concerned. I, too, am going to do in-depth ferrite research.
My approach is slightly different, though.
I have a 2 ch arbitrary waveform generator which can generate any signal I want (up to 14 bit resolution) from DC to 40Mhz.
I am going to sweep frequency range using different coils and ferrites in order to see if the ferroresonance can, indeed, be harnessed.
So, it is not so much the bemf that I am researching but the individual resonance frequencies for different types of ferrites and coils.
I can easily program the signal generator to emulate 34063 signals on one channel and the oscillator/switch signal on another channel.
Moreover, I can independently time-shift these two signals to emulate any possible synchronization scenario imaginable.
I will post the results here if there is anything interesting found.
~A
Here i draw schematic how can be possible make generator on notliner induction. IR 2153 need 15 volts minimum and I not shore or on it works how need, so I draw on NE555.
And atach image how wery fast close mosfet transistor, better use that metod.
Quote from: MenofFather on April 20, 2014, 03:08:14 AM
Here i draw schematic how can be possible make generator on notliner induction. IR 2153 need 15 volts minimum and I not shore or on it works how need, so I draw on NE555.
And atach image how wery fast close mosfet transistor, better use that metod.
hi MenoFather,
To be honest i don't dare to try on work on any circuit where there is no video presentation done.
I only work on circuits which have a higher probability of success or those that i am interesting in ,not necessary it will be a success 100% of the time. :)
I noticed for some strange reason the Russian forum is down today which also discuss on 3volt ou light.
http://zaryad.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=8534&sid=44665f28bfdfd77d63d99cdd0f90dcbe&start=20 (http://zaryad.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=8534&sid=44665f28bfdfd77d63d99cdd0f90dcbe&start=20)
The use of the PNP Darlington (eg TIP125 or similar) to turn off the mosfet is a great idea. The faster and more cleanly you can turn off the mosfet, the greater the spike/ringing you will get from the switched inductor. A fast diode and Darlington as shown in the drawing could help, if that is the desired product.
hi everyone,
I can't tell if this is the 1st successful replication attempt since i don't understand Russian.Base on observation he manage to get green light blinking but unsuccessful when attempting to light red Led for long.
Please jump to 48min of the video.I can't tell what is he talking about the transistor.Please assist...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oweZgIVZ-LY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oweZgIVZ-LY)
The sound on flyback core sounds little like a untuned radio.
I wonder if the 2 wire (+) and (-) in the original video is acting like antenna pickup unknowingly."Just guessing"
Quote from: magpwr on April 20, 2014, 07:49:40 AM
hi everyone,
I can't tell if this is the 1st successful replication attempt since i don't understand Russian.Base on observation he manage to get green light blinking but unsuccessful when attempting to light red Led for long.
Please jump to 48min of the video.I can't tell what is he talking about the transistor.Please assist...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oweZgIVZ-LY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oweZgIVZ-LY)
The sound on flyback core sounds little like a untuned radio.
I wonder if the 2 wire (+) and (-) in the original video is acting like antenna pickup unknowingly."Just guessing"
Because the power gain is about 1 watt or so it comes down to electronics power consumption and balance as well. If you manage to get economic chips for generators, it will be left enough to power on LED.
Also the noise you hear in video is the result of magnetostriction ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetostriction ) which is involved in 2 clashing frequencies from 2 generators (the second is resonant when coil get shorted).
The trick there is most likely to turn magnetic domains mechanically out of XY axis to Z axis and that movement still results on induction which is not tied to pulsing coil from main generator anymore...
Quote from: magpwr on April 20, 2014, 07:49:40 AM
hi everyone,
I can't tell if this is the 1st successful replication attempt since i don't understand Russian.Base on observation he manage to get green light blinking but unsuccessful when attempting to light red Led for long.
Please jump to 48min of the video.I can't tell what is he talking about the transistor.Please assist...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oweZgIVZ-LY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oweZgIVZ-LY)
The sound on flyback core sounds little like a untuned radio.
I wonder if the 2 wire (+) and (-) in the original video is acting like antenna pickup unknowingly."Just guessing"
Here is mine video. Here is no selfrunning. How I say, curent consumption is about 100-200 miliamperes on 3 V. I try 3 diferent cores and not get selfrunning. But not try pot core. My best results, then I disconectn 16 leg chip, then I get smallest consumption with 4 kiloomh potentiometer regulatet in right position about 50-30 miliamperes and then core begin screaming (жужать). ;D
Quote from: T-1000 on April 20, 2014, 09:27:29 AM
Because the power gain is about 1 watt or so it comes down to electronics power consumption and balance as well. If you manage to get economic chips for generators, it will be left enough to power on LED.
Also the noise you hear in video is the result of magnetostriction ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetostriction (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetostriction) ) which is involved in 2 clashing frequencies from 2 generators (the second is resonant when coil get shorted).
The trick there is most likely to turn magnetic domains mechanically out of XY axis to Z axis and that movement still results on induction which is not tied to pulsing coil from main generator anymore...
Hi T-1000,
This is definitely new for me T-1000 ,did check the wiki link awhile ago.Only through experimenting i learn better from mistakes.
--------------------------------
hi everyone,
I have just constructed 1/2 of the circuit on circuit board merely using 4069 ,transistor with led.
This is my findings using 10uf capacitor for 4069 with test coil actually draw more current from battery compared to 4.7uf on bread board.
It's is like higher duty cycle on 10uf .I would be trying on 4.7uf,2.2uf and 1uf since the capacitor would charge alot quicker the duty cycle would be reduced as well,but frequency will increase which can be change using screw driver. :D
From my experiment conducted in the morning i find that between 10% duty...18% yield the best result for Back emf.
So is this a different replication? Not using the pot core at all? No big PCB copper area? Pretty impressive if you ask me.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zilk7itV6k
Quote from: magpwr on April 20, 2014, 04:20:21 AM
hi MenoFather,
To be honest i don't dare to try on work on any circuit where there is no video presentation done.
I only work on circuits which have a higher probability of success or those that i am interesting in ,not necessary it will be a success 100% of the time. :)
I noticed for some strange reason the Russian forum is down today which also discuss on 3volt ou light.
http://zaryad.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=8534&sid=44665f28bfdfd77d63d99cdd0f90dcbe&start=20 (http://zaryad.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=8534&sid=44665f28bfdfd77d63d99cdd0f90dcbe&start=20)
Looks like that site is up, but the topic is deleted.
Всем привет! Я нашел как поднять мощность. Схему упростил, второй генератор и ключ теперь не нужен. Пока веду опыты и настраиваю новую схему, немного в видео как это будет выглядеть. Небольшие пояснения- стартует от низкого напряжения, главное поймать первый импульс, потом питание переходит само на себя в высоком напряжении и контролируется порог микросхемой 34063. Я уже близок к получению полной автономности с большой выходной мощностью. :)
Hello! I found how to increase the power. Simplified scheme, the second generator and the key is no longer needed. While leading experiences in and configure the new scheme, a bit in the video how it will look. Small-explanation starts from a low voltage, the main catch the first pulse, then the power turns on itself in the high voltage threshold and controlled chip 34063. I'm close to getting full autonomy with high output power. :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QImfZ1ZpxOA&feature=youtu.be
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 20, 2014, 02:50:42 PM
Всем привет! Я нашел как поднять мощность. Схему упростил, второй генератор и ключ теперь не нужен. Пока веду опыты и настраиваю новую схему, немного в видео как это будет выглядеть. Небольшие пояснения- стартует от низкого напряжения, главное поймать первый импульс, потом питание переходит само на себя в высоком напряжении и контролируется порог микросхемой 34063. Я уже близок к получению полной автономности с большой выходной мощностью. :)
Hello! I found how to increase the power. Simplified scheme, the second generator and the key is no longer needed. While leading experiences in and configure the new scheme, a bit in the video how it will look. Small-explanation starts from a low voltage, the main catch the first pulse, then the power turns on itself in the high voltage threshold and controlled chip 34063. I'm close to getting full autonomy with high output power. :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QImfZ1ZpxOA&feature=youtu.be (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QImfZ1ZpxOA&feature=youtu.be)
Nice! Keep up the great work! 8)
Quote from: 4Tesla on April 20, 2014, 02:09:22 PM
Looks like that site is up, but the topic is deleted.
hi 4Tesla,
It looks like the Russian discussion site was "rebooted" with no topics inside at all.
Maybe the admin are trying to recover the Russian forum little by little."I don't want to know how or why it went down recently" ???
I find that Akula intentionally showed the recent circuit track to camera which made me believe that he is actually observing this site from far. :)
It will be better if Akula decides to show on how the winding for "any of his device" is done along with the circuit.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 20, 2014, 02:50:42 PM
Всем привет! Я нашел как поднять мощность. Схему упростил, второй генератор и ключ теперь не нужен. Пока веду опыты и настраиваю новую схему, немного в видео как это будет выглядеть. Небольшие пояснения- стартует от низкого напряжения, главное поймать первый импульс, потом питание переходит само на себя в высоком напряжении и контролируется порог микросхемой 34063. Я уже близок к получению полной автономности с большой выходной мощностью. :)
Hello! I found how to increase the power. Simplified scheme, the second generator and the key is no longer needed. While leading experiences in and configure the new scheme, a bit in the video how it will look. Small-explanation starts from a low voltage, the main catch the first pulse, then the power turns on itself in the high voltage threshold and controlled chip 34063. I'm close to getting full autonomy with high output power. :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QImfZ1ZpxOA&feature=youtu.be
Thanks for sharing your work!
Regards
Quote from: magpwr on April 20, 2014, 01:20:11 AM
I just spotted this latest video from Artur Shahinyan (http://www.youtube.com/user/Artspi1) (The person whom attempted replication using exact same ferrite core)whom just uploaded 2nd video few hours ago.
Фонарик 02
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izqV7lAPhMU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izqV7lAPhMU)
Those pulses are very strange. They appear to be high frequency despite the core being stimulated only with ~10Hz rectangular pulses.
Their amplitude seems to be increasing and their count appears to be
integer depending on the position of the pot core halves.
Can anyone explain this?
P.S.
That video was shot upside-down, so it helps to turn it around.
Quote from: verpies on April 20, 2014, 09:57:36 PM
Those pulses are very strange. They appear to be high frequency despite the core being stimulated only with ~10Hz rectangular pulses.
Their amplitude seems to be increasing and their count appears to be integer depending on the position of the pot core halves.
Can anyone explain this?
P.S.
That video was shot upside-down, so it helps to turn it around.
I also sometimes get that wery short pulses of about 20 herc and they have inside frenquency 200 kiloherc about, how that explain I don't known.
It looks to me like a transistor is being overdriven into non-linear behaviour, perhaps heating a junction and causing a frequency shift.
It shouldn't surprise you to see a high frequency oscillation or ringing when you pulse an inductor with a slower square or rectangular pulse! The sharper the edges of the slow pulse, the greater the amplitude of the higher-frequency ringing, and the lower the resistive and radiative losses, the longer the ringing will persist before decaying (Q). If your slow pulses are happening before the ringing completely decays it will look like constant HF oscillations superimposed on the slower stimulating pulses.
The coils being encased in ferrite leave only one explanation the system is setting up standing waves,
reflection.
I do not understand how a system such as this can pull in outside energy,,,,,,,,,,,,although there are wires leading in and out.
NMR maybe but I dont think a system using NMR will ever supply any big current unless doped, but even then the coil configuration has to be right.
IE: you cant pulse a coil with neg energy and expect to get back or collect neg energy, you will always get pos.
Lets say your using a thorium doped core and pulse the coil with neg energy from a bat, you will get nada always pos and will deflect the thorium electrons.
But if you use two chokes one doped and one not, pulse the non doped core then feed the bemf into the doped core then you can collect the electrons from the thorium.
Times are changing
This post may get me in hot water
Quote from: verpies on April 20, 2014, 09:57:36 PM
Those pulses are very strange.
Those are found if coils are scatterwound (meaning that the wire isn't laid down side by side).
I can hazard a guess that the coils are hand wound in a hurry.
Have a look...
Update: It is without a doubt a typical subharmonic (and/or chaotic) ferroresonant operation.
BTW, these are the collector of C1815....
The circuit is powered by a pair of AA batteries (3.2v). However, the amplitude of the signal is nearly 50v
~A
Some more food for thoughts....
If a copper shield is present in the coil it would be an equivalent to, roughly, 11pf capacitance.
296kHz resonance would then be possible with a 27.019 mH coil.
This translates to some 500 turns if the pot core in the picture is used.
~A
More Brain Food ??!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKmW7HxXvas&feature=youtu.be
Cheers Grum.
OK, now we are getting somewhere...
As usual, the secret was rather simple.
Everyone assumed that the switch coil (collector of C1815) was a single coil. Am I right guys? [Oh, I am so fed up with cryptic messages from the authors that a simple answer would feel like a XMas present].
Anywayt, it appears that the coil is, in fact, three coils as in the drawn schematics.
I've managed to get some very encouraging results by re-winding the coil in accordance with recommendations by Melnichenko (attached).
I'll have to re-design the circuit as I suspect there are some errors in it. A sort of a test for the replicators. It may work by getting the coils synchronize is a challenge. It also makes it very susceptible to voltage fluctuations.
I will perform a series of test with the new coils as soon as I reprogram my signal generator and write a scrip for Matlab. If the results I am getting now are confirmed by new upcoming experiments it would mean that much higher power can be harnessed that way. No more blinking LEDs.
~A
Whoops...
Forgot the attachment. I am sure everyone has seen it...
~A
Quote from: avalon on April 21, 2014, 04:29:58 PM
Everyone assumed that the switch coil (collector of C1815) was a single coil. Am I right guys?
I admit making this assumption based on the xformer gutting video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk&feature=youtu.be&t=0m45s).
Quote from: avalon on April 21, 2014, 12:02:50 PM
Those are found if coils are scatterwound (meaning that the wire isn't laid down side by side).
I can hazard a guess that the coils are hand wound in a hurry.
Have a look...
Quote from: avalon on April 21, 2014, 12:04:36 PM
BTW, these are the collector of C1815....
Can you show the signal applied to the base of this transistor? ...or at least describe its shape, frequency and amplitude as well as the relation of its edge to these fast pulses at the collector.
Quote from: avalon on April 21, 2014, 12:39:59 PM
If a copper shield is present in the coil it would be an equivalent to, roughly, 11pf capacitance.
296kHz resonance would then be possible with a 27.019 mH coil.
This translates to some 500 turns if the pot core in the picture is used.
That does not compute. The experimenter in
that video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izqV7lAPhMU&feature=youtu.be&t=0m44s) states 25 turns for one winding and 50 turns for the second.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 21, 2014, 10:40:17 AM
It looks to me like a transistor is being overdriven into non-linear behaviour,
OK, nonlinear C-E characteristic would explain the non-sinusoidal shape of these pulses.
Nonetheless, the base of the transistor seems to be fed with constant current while these fast pulses are occurring.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 21, 2014, 10:40:17 AM
It shouldn't surprise you to see a high frequency oscillation or ringing when you pulse an inductor with a slower square or rectangular pulse!
It doesn't, but the non-decaying envelope (even increasing) of these 90kHz pulses surprises me when I remember that the coil is pulsed with only ~10Hz.
The integer count of these pulses, as the core's gap is varied, also is strange, but can be explained with soliton reflection from the ends of a mismatched waveguide.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 21, 2014, 10:40:17 AM
If your slow pulses are happening before the ringing completely decays it will look like constant HF oscillations superimposed on the slower stimulating pulses.
There is time for 10000 of these fast pulses between these slow pulses (100ms vs. 10µs), so this is not the case.
hi everyone,
I have attached screenshot of my back Emf produced by the 61 turns on 22AWG with copper shield with gap(gap align inside and outside during turning stage) on <3cm diameter pot core.This is my 1st winding attempt on small locally available pot core while waiting for 4.7cm diameter pot core.
Voltage 3.9volts(Li-ion)
current:6mA drawn for 5% duty cycle base on frequency 10hz.
Frequency applied:10hz....3khz produced same waveform as attached,no changes.Changes in waveform starts from 4.3khz onwards for my case.
The setup remains same using signal injected to base of C1815 transistor via 1k resistor.I'm also using 1000uf capacitor at emitter and (+) of my test circuit.
I got to head out.Time to work. ;D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BNgo09N0yM
Wesley
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolytic_capacitor = http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xpFMUPV1QOw
... e.t.c...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjkV4SYUwhQ
&
http://www.google.com/patents/US3434029
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_cell + http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JS1XclcWCe0
Quote from: avalon on April 21, 2014, 04:29:58 PM
OK, now we are getting somewhere...
As usual, the secret was rather simple.
Everyone assumed that the switch coil (collector of C1815) was a single coil. Am I right guys?
From + and colector transistor is a single coil with two cuper not shorted tapes, conected to that coil. But maybe cuper tapes is not nessary.
Quote from: magpwr on April 21, 2014, 10:19:36 PM
hi everyone,
I have attached screenshot of my back Emf produced by the 61 turns on 22AWG with copper shield with gap(gap align inside and outside during turning stage) on <3cm diameter pot core.This is my 1st winding attempt on small locally available pot core while waiting for 4.7cm diameter pot core.
Voltage 3.9volts(Li-ion)
current:6mA drawn for 5% duty cycle base on frequency 10hz.
Frequency applied:10hz....3khz produced same waveform as attached,no changes.Changes in waveform starts from 4.3khz onwards for my case.
The setup remains same using signal injected to base of C1815 transistor via 1k resistor.I'm also using 1000uf capacitor at emitter and (+) of my test circuit.
I got to head out.Time to work. ;D
Can you try the exact same setup but with a different transistor like 2n2222a (metal can), 2n3904, or some other similar NPN silicon type? I'm wondering how much of this behaviour is due to overdriving the transistor rather than some strange inductor behaviour.
Also, I'm losing track of the actual circuit you are using. Can you please show the _exact specific circuit_ you used to make the scopeshot, just for me? Thanks.
(I've looked through my stash of Japanese transistors-- I have hundreds of them-- but sadly not a single 2sc1815. Have you tried a higher-voltage transistor like 2sc1514? )
I read this in the 2sc1815 data sheet just under the AbsMax rating table, so it must be important:
QuoteNote: Using continuously under heavy loads (e.g. the application of high
temperature/current/voltage and the significant change in temperature, etc.) may cause this product to
decrease in the reliability significantly even if the operating conditions (i.e. operating
temperature/current/voltage, etc.) are within the absolute maximum ratings.
Please design the appropriate reliability upon reviewing the Toshiba Semiconductor Reliability Handbook
("Handling Precautions"/"Derating Concept and Methods") and individual reliability data (i.e. reliability test
report and estimated failure rate, etc).
Quote from: magpwr on April 21, 2014, 10:19:36 PM
I have attached screenshot of my back Emf produced by the 61 turns on 22AWG with copper shield with gap(gap align inside and outside during turning stage) on <3cm diameter pot core.This is my 1st winding attempt on small locally available pot core while waiting for 4.7cm diameter pot core.
The period between your pulses is approximately 400ns. The Russian guy had 11µs.
Maybe with a larger core it will be longer.
What is the pk-pk voltage amplitude of the signal applied to the 1k resistor ? Any DC offset ?
Quote from: magpwr on April 21, 2014, 10:19:36 PM
Voltage 3.9volts(Li-ion)
current:6mA drawn for 5% duty cycle base on frequency 10hz.
Frequency applied:10hz....3khz produced same waveform as attached,no changes.
The setup remains same using signal injected to base of C1815 transistor via 1k resistor.I'm also using 1000uf capacitor at emitter and (+) of my test circuit.
Like this ?
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 22, 2014, 10:03:06 AM
Can you try the exact same setup but with a different transistor like 2n2222a (metal can), 2n3904, or some other similar NPN silicon type? I'm wondering how much of this behaviour is due to overdriving the transistor rather than some strange inductor behaviour.
Also, I'm losing track of the actual circuit you are using. Can you please show the _exact specific circuit_ you used to make the scopeshot, just for me? Thanks.
(I've looked through my stash of Japanese transistors-- I have hundreds of them-- but sadly not a single 2sc1815. Have you tried a higher-voltage transistor like 2sc1514? )
I read this in the 2sc1815 data sheet just under the AbsMax rating table, so it must be important:
hi TinselKoala,
This is the hardest part to advise,base on what if component is altered.2N2222 plastic transistor is definitely the most popular transistor for any low voltage circuit.
I can try out the available 2N2222 transistor only tomorrow and advise,its kinda late now over here.
Since i am living in Asia access to Japanese transistors is easy ,C1815 already existed around 20years ago when i first came across this transistor.
Quote from: verpies on April 22, 2014, 10:16:29 AM
The period between your pulses is approximately 400ns. The Russian guy had 11µs.
Maybe with a larger core it will be longer.
What is the pk-pk voltage amplitude of the signal applied to the 1k resistor ? Any DC offset ?
Like this ?
hi verpies,
You got it that's my setup as describe. :)
The square waveform was set at 5volt
vpp.
Since i merely constructed only 1/2 the circuit using 4069 using 10uf i noticed the blinking of led is slower.
Since base on known fact our human eyes can only detect up to
18hz led blinking rate.
Base on original video it looks somewhere between 10hz...15hz
In another words the capacitor value 10uf may need to be reduced to 4.7uf or 2.2uf .I have not tried checking the frequency from 4069 using 10uf yet.
The duty cycle need to be low to consume less power from battery.It's the reason why i mention the cap value needs to be 4.7uf or 2.2uf."But not tested yet to let me see waveform."
Base on my posting earlier in the day.I did not mention the waveform /vpp is also the same for duty cycle between 5%to 15% .I just played it safe for comment purpose at 5%.
The big different is input current consumption between 5%...15% .At 15% duty i think i was around 38mA.
Quote from: verpies on April 21, 2014, 07:59:01 PM
That does not compute. The experimenter in that video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izqV7lAPhMU&feature=youtu.be&t=0m44s) states 25 turns for one winding and 50 turns for the second.
Glad you agree. However, I have checked (as you can see from the picture).
Little it may be it give us a clue. It basically means that the shield is irrelevant.
~A
Quote from: verpies on April 21, 2014, 07:53:35 PM
Can you show the signal applied to the base of this transistor? ...or at least describe its shape, frequency and amplitude as well as the relation of its edge to these fast pulses at the collector.
Of course, though I am not sure how's that going to help.
Here it is. The second trace is the collector signal.
~A
Quote from: avalon on April 22, 2014, 12:24:37 PM
Of course, though I am not sure how's that going to help.
Here it is. The second trace is the collector signal.
~A
Am I reading the scope right? The Blue trace is the signal to the base of the 2SC1815? The channel is set to 5 V/ Div? So you are applying pulses of about 9V peak to the Base of the transistor?
But... but.....
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 22, 2014, 03:02:28 PM
Am I reading the scope right? The Blue trace is the signal to the base of the 2SC1815? The channel is set to 5 V/ Div? So you are applying pulses of about 9V peak to the Base of the transistor?
But... but.....
Hmm.... I don't get it either. The signal amplitude on the base is 2.4V
I have attached a couple of pictures. The first one is on the output of 74HC14AN (pin 6) and the second one is @ the base of C1815.
The power supply is 3.30 v
I have no idea how the error occurred.
~A
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 22, 2014, 03:02:28 PM
The Blue trace is the signal to the base of the 2SC1815? The channel is set to 5 V/ Div? So you are applying pulses of about 9V peak to the Base of the transistor?
But... but..... VEBO is 5V Max.
Maybe he was measuring on the other side of the base resistor that dropped the voltage.
Quote from: avalon on April 22, 2014, 03:17:44 PM
Hmm.... I don't get it either. The signal amplitude on the base is 2.4V
I have attached a couple of pictures. The first one is on the output of 74HC14AN (pin 6) and the second one is @ the base of C1815.
The power supply is 3.30 v
I have no idea how the error occurred.
~A
That makes a lot more sense. Maybe the scope probe attenuation was misset or something. Thanks for checking.... but now my theory about overdriving the transistor is out the window, I guess. Still, that collector current trace doesn't look right either.
Quote from: avalon on April 22, 2014, 03:17:44 PM
Hmm.... I don't get it either. The signal amplitude on the base is 2.4V
I have attached a couple of pictures. The first one is on the output of 74HC14AN (pin 6) and the second one is @ the base of C1815.
The power supply is 3.30 v
I have no idea how the error occurred.
~A
Avalon,
The signal indicated by your scope at the base of your transistor looks like a square wave with a peak to peak value of 800mv or so. It also has a DC offset of approx. 200mv above ground when the driver IC output is low. Looking at your schematic, this is just what would be expected.
Regarding the transistor, the base-emitter junction appears to the outside world as a simple diode. This "diode" (the base) begins to conduct at around .65volts (relative to the emitter) and will conduct a lot of current, just like a diode. However, looking at the absolute maximum allowed base to emitter current in the data sheet TK provided, the base-emitter current must be limited so as not to exceed 50ma or the base junction can be damaged.
In the top scope trace, your driver IC is outputting a 3.2 volt or so pk-pk square wave. The driver IC cannot pull its output all the way to ground, so you have a slight offset above ground indicated of a few hundred millivolts when the output is low.
The voltage between the base and emitter of a silicon bipolar transistor that is turned on will always be one silicon diode voltage drop, or between .6 and .8 volts, depending on how much current is being applied to the base and the temperature of the transistor. Remember, a bipolar transistor is a current controlled device, not a voltage controlled device like a MOSFET. The amount of current flowing thru the base-emitter junction is multiplied by the current gain of the transistor and that product of base current times the current gain determines the max current that can flow thru the collector emitter junction.
In your circuit, your driver IC puts 3.2V on the 1K resistor. The base-emitter voltage is about .7V. So, (3.2V-.7V)=2.5V, which is the voltage drop across the 1K resistor when the transistor is on. 2.5V/1000R equals 2.5ma of base current.
Regarding your scope. The numbers in the first box at the lower left are the delta V cursor readout. Your V cursors are not really set to measure anything in the screenshots you provided. Using the cursor controls, move the lower horizontal dotted line (the Vref cursor) up to the channel one ground reference, which is the arrow at the left of the screen labeled "1". Now move the upper V cursor to the top of the channel one square wave and your cursor readout will reflect the the actual voltage being output from your IC (upper screen) or applied to your transistor base (lower screen).
Similarly, you can use the time cursors to measure horizontal features.
I can't make any sense of the "Vbt" readout, perhaps TK or someone else can enlighten us.
Also, it looks like the trigger is set for a falling edge on channel one but the trigger level is set higher than the signal on channel one.
TK can be a great help with "scoposcopy" skills.
Regarding the weird collector waveforms, try disconnecting your coil and run a 1K resistor from the 3.3V rail to the transistor collector and then take a look at the collector signal with your scope. If it remains flaky, your transistor has issues.
PW
Added: Also, always try to align the channel ground reference markers with a major division on the graticule. This makes it much easier to measure voltage off the screen by counting division.
Wesley Translate's Akula video #16: Akula's TPU part 5
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lpx1SJdXnmo&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lpx1SJdXnmo&feature=youtu.be)
Wesley
[size=0.85em]
Не знаю, что было раньше, но теперь поставил новую 34063 микросхему, поставил 560 пикофарад купленый конденсатор и без второй микросхемы потребление 7 милиампер.
I now use new 34063 and put 560 picofarad capasitor and now curent consumption wihout second chip (it disconected) is 7 miliamps from 6 volts. But probarly I somewere made error.
Похоже правильно всё спаял и напряжение поднимает, вход 3 вольта, на конденсаторе 1000 мкф больше, но тот раз было 100-200 милиампер, а теперь 7-20 милиампер где-то или может я попортил и теперь микросхему и она не так работает как надо? Или может тогда было где-то ошибка в плате?..
Seems no errors, all errors i find and fix, maybe 34063 I brake.
hi TinselKoala, (http://www.overunity.com/profile/tinselkoala.13644/)
I have attached scope shot of 2N2222a and ZTX857 (300volt transistor)
The duty cycle for 2N2222a would have to be reduced to 3% instead of 5% to maintain similar current consumption around 6mA.
The ZTX857 (300volt transistor )needs just 1% duty cycle to get around 316volts at around 6mA at 5% duty cycle it would be around 12mA.
Another interesting thing to note at 43Khz which is injected via transistor to primary coil of 17 turns would get me maximum voltage of 3volts at secondary 61 turns.
I have controlled the duty cycle to <20% to get 3volts at secondary at the same time to consume low current.
Since i did not get the MC34063 to test,lets assume if i were to tweak the output frequency from MC34063 at pin 1 to 43KHZ ,maybe by changing to suitable cap or adjusting voltage.
Then maybe this 3volts which would be present at 61 turns secondary would be amplified by the back emf by switching transistor."This is just my unconfirmed theory"
----------------------------------------------
Lastly base on recent Akula video lighting Led with flyback (NO PSU).If you noticed carefully there is 2 PWM I/C might be TL494 since there is 2 timing capacitor which is connected to the same pin for 2 I/C.
There 5 tuning knob.One i/c have duty cycle with frequency control and another I/C have the same thing but with additional fine tuning for frequency(Total 5 tuning).
I don't how mixing 2 frequency on 2 separate primary coil of flyback which connected to one end likely connected to positive supply can generate ou after looping back from secondary coil.
If you study 3volt ou flashlight circuit there should be 2 different frequency as well.
I have merely presented back emf around 10hz signal from I/C 4069 .(Bare in mind keep duty cycle low) .
Once i received MC34063 and larger 4.7cm diameter ferrite core i will complete the circuit.
------------------------------------
This is my latest findings using 4069 Photo and video attached.10uf capacitor unchanged in circuit with current consumption around 38mA using 3.9volt(Li-ion AA battery size)."I would need to use 3volts later on"
This is very interesting discovery i just made upon tuning 4069 to around 11.8hz..12hz suddenly there would be a bigger spike which appear and remain high as attached.The rest of the smaller ones is 20volts.
@magpwr:
Thanks for doing those tests. It looks like the 2n2222a is doing almost the same thing as the 2sc1815. I just woke up, haven't yet had my morning coffee. I'll be thinking about this and doing some fiddling around later today.
Thanks again... cheers!
--TK
Quote from: stivep on April 22, 2014, 10:27:42 PM
Wesley Translates Akula video #16: Akula's TPU part 5
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lpx1SJdXnmo&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lpx1SJdXnmo&feature=youtu.be)
Thanks for your translation effort.
How are the copper foils connected to the windings?
Like this?
The data sheet for the MC34063A is very interesting.
Do you find the VCE Max = 40V interesting?
Since there is 80V (sometimes 110V) across the collector-emitter junction of the MC34063's output transistor, this voltage exceeds its maximum VCE rating by over 200% and suggests that reversible avalanche breakdowns of this junction is occurring.
This reminds me of Itsu's and mine avalanche nanopulse generator. See this video (http://youtu.be/s-Alj7gm0RA?t=0m26s) and this (http://youtu.be/eAMby3BVa74?t=1m0s) one..
Perhaps the observed train of pulses (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/137294/) are several C-E avalanche breakdowns in quick succession.
P.S.
Weren't nanopulses deliberately used in the Dally contraption?
Quote from: verpies on April 23, 2014, 08:34:29 AM
Do you find the VCE Max = 40V interesting?
And the 7mA needed to get the output switch to conduct.
Verpies, What Mos-fet did you used? I used an IRFZ44n and it didn't work. :-\
Quote from: conico on April 23, 2014, 12:02:05 PM
Verpies, What Mos-fet did you used? I used an IRFZ44n and it didn't work. :-\
Didn't work, how? Did it not switch, did it blow from overvoltage, did it pop open and let the white smoke out.... or what?
Or did it "not work" simply by shutting off the LEDs when the power was removed? Good luck finding one that does "work" in this manner!
@Verpies, what do you see at Pin 12 of the hex inverter chip, the mosfet Gate? Can you take a scopeshot there?
ETA: What happens to my IRFZ44ns when they don't work:
@PW.
Thank you for your post.
The truth is that I, practically, never use my DS203. It's a dinky little thing but I found hunting through some 4 buttons and 2 knobs tiring.
It is, however, a very convenient tool to quickly snap a signal and store it. That was exactly what I did. I only cared about the input and didn't setup anything else.
All the best,
~A
Quote from: conico on April 23, 2014, 12:02:05 PM
Verpies, What Mos-fet did you used? I used an IRFZ44n and it didn't work. :-\
Ask Akula. That's his circuit - not mine.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 23, 2014, 12:30:02 PM
@Verpies, what do you see at Pin 12 of the hex inverter chip, the mosfet Gate? Can you take a scopeshot there?
I cannot because I did not build Akula's circuit. The scopeshot is his.
I have an HCF4069 and IRFZ44 didn't switch . Tomorow I will take an CD4069 and an IRF520-540.
I believe you didn't use the 100 ohm resistor and your irfz44 blown
Quote from: verpies on April 23, 2014, 01:15:55 PM
I cannot because I did not build Akula's circuit. The scopeshot is his.
Ah, OK, sorry, I thought you had built it. I was just wondering what the mosfet Gate drive signal looked like coming out of the inverter stage.
I really don't understand how the mosfet in this circuit is supposed to be switched. The inverter chip is only supplied with the 3 volts input power and the sine wave input is only a couple of volts p-p. How can the output of the inverter stage reach the 4.5 volt (approx) gate threshold voltage of a mosfet?
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 23, 2014, 02:38:10 PM
I really don't understand how the mosfet in this circuit is supposed to be switched. The inverter chip is only supplied with the 3 volts input power and the sine wave input is only a couple of volts p-p. How can the output of the inverter stage reach the 4.5 volt (approx) gate threshold voltage of a mosfet?
Dear Tinsel Koala.
As we have become very aware that deliberate errors are commonplace, could it be a humble Bi polar transistor ?? :)
Just a thought !!
Cheers Grum.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 23, 2014, 02:38:10 PM
I really don't understand how the mosfet in this circuit is supposed to be switched. The inverter chip is only supplied with the 3 volts input power and the sine wave input is only a couple of volts p-p. How can the output of the inverter stage reach the 4.5 volt (approx) gate threshold voltage of a mosfet?
Some MOSFETs have much lower V
GS(TH) than 4.5V.
For example the M8208 (http://web2.cetsemi.com/PDF/SO-8-N/M8208.PDF) has a typical gate threshold voltage of 1.2V and as low as 0.5V.
Yes, the MOSFET family with low gate-source threshold voltage is called logic level gate type if you wish to search for them. Several manufacturers produce them.
Gyula
Well, maybe I'll be able to find a logic-level mosfet locally. Does anyone know the part number specified for the schematic?
Meanwhile I'm 95 percent finished with a build. I'm experimenting with a different construction technique than I usually use. I ordered 3 MC34063A chips for 3.99 US from an Ebay seller, they should be here in a couple of days. Saturday or Monday, probably. Still need a couple of resistors and a capacitor, which I'll get from my local supplier tomorrow. I've got an IRF3205 in there now even though I don't expect it to work. The wires are to the transformator which I haven't wound yet.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 23, 2014, 02:38:10 PM
I really don't understand how the mosfet in this circuit is supposed to be switched. The inverter chip is only supplied with the 3 volts input power and the sine wave input is only a couple of volts p-p. How can the output of the inverter stage reach the 4.5 volt (approx) gate threshold voltage of a mosfet?
hi TinselKoala,
The fav 600volt mosfet
47N60C3 which i normally use in my experiment do have a gate turn on voltage threshold from 2volts...4volts for low current.For max current from mosfet gate plateau voltage is 5.5v.
Do check datasheet for your selected mosfet.
OK.... here's something of a teaser. I did get the mosfet to switch. See the scopeshot below.
I don't have the MC34063 or some other components on the "input" side, nor any coil yet. I'm just testing the inverter-mosfet "output" side to see if the inverter functions and drives the mosfet.
So I'm giving the board about a 3V supply to power the chip. And I'm using the Interstate Function Generator to inject a sine wave signal into the Pin 13, monitoring on the bottom trace of the scope. And I'm monitoring the mosfet Drain response on the top trace. Both traces are set to 2 v/div. The scopeshot shows one possible response waveform. But there are others! My setup is very sensitive to the input voltage to the board; a hair more than 3 volts and it works better, the mosfet will now turn fully on.... but with just a bit more, the mosfet then _stays_ fully on 100 percent .... impossible to explain in text really, so I shot a video, but it will be an hour or so before it's done processing and uploading. Meanwhile... the sinus signal to the inverter does result in a response at the mosfet, at least I know that much.
The nice square flat tops on the Drain trace are at the supply voltage and indicate the mosfet fully OFF.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 23, 2014, 06:24:18 PM
Meanwhile I'm 95 percent finished with a build. I'm experimenting with a different construction technique than I usually use.
That's nice! Even suitable for high frequency signals.
Did you cut grooves in that laminate with a milling cutter?
Quote from: verpies on April 23, 2014, 08:12:18 PM
That's nice! Even suitable for high frequency signals.
Did you cut grooves in that laminate with a milling cutter?
Heh... .No, I used an Xacto miter box and a small hacksaw blade to cut the material. It's ordinary circuit board material. I cut some long skinny strips, then sawed slots thru the copper every 0.1 inch to make isolated segments or pads, then cut two 7-segment and two 4-segment bits from the strips and glued them to the baseboard with superglue to make the chip socket mounts. Then I positioned the "positive supply rail" strip along the top, and added 5 more little individual pads for the junction points. This turns out to be a very easy technique, and as you point out, the 100 percent ground plane and tight layout should help for HF .
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 23, 2014, 08:19:19 PM
No, I used an Xacto miter box and a small hacksaw blade
...and I was thinking a milling machine or at least a Dremel tool for such precision work. Nice "hack"saw job, anyway.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 23, 2014, 07:59:26 PM
OK.... here's something of a teaser. I did get the mosfet to switch.
This might piss you off but I think I heard the Akula persona say that the entire CMOS Hex Inverter chip was disconnected while making this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lpx1SJdXnmo&feature=youtu.be).
You'd have to get a confirmation from a native Russian speaker, though.
Quote from: verpies on April 23, 2014, 08:26:39 PM
...and I was thinking a milling machine or at least a Dremel tool for such precision work. Nice "hack"saw job, anyway.
Thanks but it's really not that precise.... pads are different sizes, angles aren't right, edges aren't straight... it looks more precise than it actually is, I guess. Rough and ready...
Quote
This might piss you off but I think I heard the Akula persona say that the entire CMOS Hex Inverter chip was disconnected while making this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lpx1SJdXnmo&feature=youtu.be).
You'd have to get a confirmation from a native Russian speaker, though.
No, not pissed at all, I expect goalposts to move, designs to be changed, errors in schematics, etc. And I don't expect it to work at all, really, so if it does I'll be really happy and surprised. ;)
I think that the DC-DC converter chip should light the LEDs at least, whether the output stage is there or not. But it will take me until next week to find out, probably. By then I expect at least two more new and different designs from Akula.
My video showing the effects I found so far is uploading now and should be ready in a few minutes:
http://youtu.be/nJ1dyzst2Rc (http://youtu.be/nJ1dyzst2Rc)
I think that the inverter chip is really underdriven and underpowered, so it's behaving strangely.
Sorry I forgot to push the "publish" button. YouTube keeps improving, and improving, and improving....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJ1dyzst2Rc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hVMPRLHpKQ&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hVMPRLHpKQ&feature=youtu.be)Wesleys News video#1 of Ruslan Kalabuhov Free Energy
Wesley
FONAR 3 FINAL ....
DELETE VIDEO YOTUBE ..
https://cloud.mail.ru/public/1404c889d895/%D0%B8%D1%82%D0%BE%D0%B3%20%D1%84%D0%BE%D0%BD%D0%B0%D1%80%D1%8C%20%E2%84%963.mp4
Quote from: verpies on April 23, 2014, 08:26:39 PM
...and I was thinking a milling machine or at least a Dremel tool for such precision work. Nice "hack"saw job, anyway.
This might piss you off but I think I heard the Akula persona say that the entire CMOS Hex Inverter chip was disconnected while making this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lpx1SJdXnmo&feature=youtu.be).
You'd have to get a confirmation from a native Russian speaker, though.
It looks to me like the same basic schematic, actually. The schematic in the video must be showing the "old" version, I think, that has more of the inverter chip used. But the Greyed out area doesn't include one of the inverters in the chip.... I think that "most" of the inverter chip is disconnected. But it looks to me like the rest of the schematic is the same, just oriented differently.
Dear TinselKoala,
You were able to test the complete circuit board 3V OU Flashlight ? Hopefully it will work.
Regards
Quote from: havuhung on April 24, 2014, 01:09:22 PM
Dear TinselKoala,
You were able to test the complete circuit board 3V OU Flashlight ? Hopefully it will work.
Regards
No, not complete yet, my order of MC34063A chips has not yet arrived. They will probably be delivered Saturday or Monday. Without the chip I am just able to test the inverter and mosfet side of the circuit.
I will be winding the transformator on a ferrite core from a TV flyback transformer.
Can not keep oscillations going, but getting closer :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jds2Sxg9W4M (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jds2Sxg9W4M)
You may also like this, testing the ferrite pot core at different frequency's
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqcGLExTymo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqcGLExTymo)
Regards,
Quote from: scratchrobot on April 24, 2014, 04:03:38 PM
Can not keep oscillations going, but getting closer :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jds2Sxg9W4M (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jds2Sxg9W4M)
You may also like this, testing the ferrite pot core at different frequency's
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqcGLExTymo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqcGLExTymo)
Regards,
hi scratchrobot,
It looks like your device was just to about to self run for few seconds longer than the rest then it stops.
Do try to change resistor to white led with a little higher value.
Do prevent the copper wire from touching the ferrite core.
I am sure someone may ask you where to get the ferrite pot core online base on the one your are using video. :D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mG_FsBn2qxk
Wesleys News Overunity com presents :
Free Energy Device - Akula 1 KWatt Unit - no fuel needed
Wesley
Wesley.... thank you for your translations. Akula seems to be violating the law of Conservation of Miracles!
Meanwhile I am still continuing to build and test just one of his claimed miracles.
Here's a little test of the input side, still with no MC34063, but testing the LEDs running on the two large capacitors in the circuit:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbNxHAlYC9U (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbNxHAlYC9U)
Just think how long they would stay lit if the input reservoir cap was a multiFarad supercap instead of an ordinary 3300 uF electrolytic. And that's straight DC...
And then figure in the oscillator and Joule Thief effect..... quite long "unpowered" run times could result.
(I keep forgetting to mention that for the unmarked diode, I am using 1n5819 Schottky.
Many thanks to slider2732.... who told me where to get a MC34063 chip quickly and cheaply.
The Dollar Tree stores sell a couple of different USB car charger adapters for a dollar each. One dollar US. It contains a MC34063A chip, a 1 amp fuse, an LED, a couple of electrolytic capacitors, a 4000-series diode and a little inductor, as well as a USB connector. For one dollar!
I paid 4 dollars for three chips from an Ebay seller and I thought that was a good deal! They won't arrive until Monday, probably. But now I have one to play with, if I can get it out of the USB adapter without damaging it.
Good tip Slider2732!
So I put the chip into my build. Still without any inductor, I'm playing around. Some interesting behaviour again:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsMxiI4T37I
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 25, 2014, 03:32:23 AM
Still without any inductor, I'm playing around. Some interesting behaviour again:
An inductive 0.33Ω resistor?
Quote from: verpies on April 25, 2014, 04:10:58 AM
An inductive 0.33Ω resistor?
Well, the 0.33 ohm is made up of the three 1 ohm metal-film resistors in parallel. So there is some small inductance there. But would it make any difference, where it is in the circuit?
If I'm reading the schematic right the main inductor has 27 and 54 milliHenry windings, not a tiny value at all. In fact I don't see how the heavy windings on Akula's flyback core ferrite can reach those values. I've already put a few hundred turns on mine and am only up to 6 mH or so.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 25, 2014, 04:37:50 AM
Well, the 0.33 ohm is made up of the three 1 ohm metal-film resistors in parallel. So there is some small inductance there. But would it make any difference, where it is in the circuit?
If I'm reading the schematic right the main inductor has 27 and 54 milliHenry windings, not a tiny value at all. In fact I don't see how the heavy windings on Akula's flyback core ferrite can reach those values. I've already put a few hundred turns on mine and am only up to 6 mH or so.
I did hear Wesley say 5.4mH in his translation video.
Well, that's good news, I was afraid I'd run out of wire.
I wonder how many other "mistakes" there are on the schematic I'm working from, which definitely does say 27 and 54 mH.
However, I've tried the lower value side with several different inductors from 6 mH to around 900 mH and they all "work" in the sense of making the LEDs light up brightly. Just using the inductor on the "27 mH" side and nothing on the other side, those wires still disconnected. The heavier the inductance the less current is drawn by the device overall, in my preliminary tests. The thing works as a Joule Thief, needing less than 2 volts from the supply to light up the two LEDs in series to extreme brilliance, with an oscillation of flat-topped spikes of about 9 V peak.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 25, 2014, 09:47:23 AM
I wonder how many other "mistakes" there are on the schematic I'm working from, which definitely does say 27 and 54mH.
Both of these schematics shown here (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/msg399366/#msg399366) state 27 and 54mH.
Wesley says 5.4mH, common sense agrees with this.
What does Akula say? Is there a link to that video without Wesley's voiceover ?
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 25, 2014, 09:47:23 AM
...with an oscillation of flat-topped spikes of about 9 V peak.
But not the 80V
P-P shown on Akula's scopeshot (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/137294/).
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 25, 2014, 09:47:23 AM
Well, that's good news, I was afraid I'd run out of wire.
I wonder how many other "mistakes" there are on the schematic I'm working from, which definitely does say 27 and 54 mH.
However, I've tried the lower value side with several different inductors from 6 mH to around 900 mH and they all "work" in the sense of making the LEDs light up brightly. Just using the inductor on the "27 mH" side and nothing on the other side, those wires still disconnected. The heavier the inductance the less current is drawn by the device overall, in my preliminary tests. The thing works as a Joule Thief, needing less than 2 volts from the supply to light up the two LEDs in series to extreme brilliance, with an oscillation of flat-topped spikes of about 9 V peak.
This chip is also used as an LED driver as you are probably aware, so its presumably quite efficient at this task.
I'm still considering the possibility of coin-cell or two in a pot, wired internally to the pot solder tabs. Its a pity we cannot see the underside of the 3V OU flashlight board, so that it might be possible to draw up a meaningful schematic.
Quote from: magpwr on April 24, 2014, 06:18:52 PM
hi scratchrobot,
It looks like your device was just to about to self run for few seconds longer than the rest then it stops.
Do try to change resistor to white led with a little higher value.
Do prevent the copper wire from touching the ferrite core.
I am sure someone may ask you where to get the ferrite pot core online base on the one your are using video. :D
Thanks for the tips, i will try them. The ferrite pots i used are B65701W 30 x 19 i got them from ebay.
I will also try other ferrite pots with the circuit. I don't think the circuit will self run but i like trying different coils to see what happens.
Regards
Quote from: verpies on April 25, 2014, 10:56:44 AM
Both of these schematics shown here (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/msg399366/#msg399366) state 27 and 54mH.
Wesley says 5.4mH, common sense agrees with this.
What does Akula say? Is there a link to that video without Wesley's voiceover ?
I don't know, I am just working from the "official" schematic.
Quote
But not the 80VP-P shown on Akula's scopeshot (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/137294/).
That's right.... just almost exactly one tenth of the value shown on that scopeshot. Of course we don't know that the probe attenuation matches the channel setting....
More troubling is the waveform itself. I am not seeing anything like that, yet. In Akula's shot it appears that the frequency of the spikes is modulated by the voltage of the sinusoid from the secondary. But please don't forget that I don't have the complete inductor in my testing yet. However, the transformer inductors I have tried seem to have no effect of the "secondary".
If the actual inductances used are 2.7 and 5.4 mH, I should be able to get those values on my flyback ferrite easily enough. I'll be doing these tests with a full transformator later on this afternoon.
The DC-DC chip starts behaving strangely when the supply voltage is below 2 volts. I'm wondering now if the Akula waveforms are made by underdriving the chip.
Quote from: scratchrobot on April 25, 2014, 01:41:11 PM
Thanks for the tips, i will try them. The ferrite pots i used are B65701W 30 x 19 i got them from ebay.
I will also try other ferrite pots with the circuit. I don't think the circuit will self run but i like trying different coils to see what happens.
Regards
Apparently the ferrite pot cores are not necessary. Akula has shown several different versions that don't use the pot core.... it is another Red Herring in my opinion. Good that you are trying them though... but I am building this version which does not include the pot core, just an ordinary flyback transformer ferrite. Of course Russian ferrites are special..... aren't they?
Quote from: Hoppy on April 25, 2014, 11:01:59 AM
This chip is also used as an LED driver as you are probably aware, so its presumably quite efficient at this task.
I'm still considering the possibility of coin-cell or two in a pot, wired internally to the pot solder tabs. Its a pity we cannot see the underside of the 3V OU flashlight board, so that it might be possible to draw up a meaningful schematic.
I think that the schematic is actually correct... as far as it goes, and with the problem of the decimal point still unresolved. The DC-DC-LED side works fine by itself, the inverter driving the mosfet works fine in isolation....
Yep, with proper setting of the trimpot and the inductor on the "primary" side (the side connected to 43063 chip) the current draw can be minimized, and I already know that the circuit will light the LEDs brilliantly using a 3v button cell, eg CR2016. But for how long? Soon, I will know that too.
Quote from: Hoppy on April 25, 2014, 05:12:10 AM
I did hear Wesley say 5.4mH in his translation video.
Wesley's translation is wrong. Karnaukhov said 54 mH, not 5.4 mH.
There are many more discrepancies in Wesley's translation. He needs to work on his Russian. (Come to think of it, he needs to work on his English too.).
~A
Quote from: avalon on April 25, 2014, 02:06:52 PM
Wesley's translation is wrong. Karnaukhov said 54 mH, not 5.4 mH.
Then Akula's core must have a hell of a permeability.
Quote from: avalon on April 25, 2014, 02:06:52 PM
Wesley's translation is wrong. Karnaukhov said 54 mH, not 5.4 mH.
There are many more discrepancies in Wesley's translation. He needs to work on his Russian. (Come to think of it, he needs to work on his English too.).
~A
Bad form Sir !! >:(
Are you multi lingual ??
Wesley has helped us in so many ways. I feel you owe him an apology !!
Grumage.
Hi All,
I made a compilation movie of the last 2 videos from Akula,
cause he seemed to have deleted his youtube channel....or I still
can not find it anymore.
Fortunately I did save these movies and have also put in the circuit diagrams,
at least for the higher power versions...cause the newest was not yet posted,
when I made this video...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GtDDQA3U4g (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GtDDQA3U4g)
Enjoy !
Regards, Stefan.
Neither Russian nor English is Wesley's native language.
There are so many Russian native speakers on this forum, yet I don't see them translating videos. If they did, he would not have to.
looks like 5.4mH and 1.25mH to me..... (Edit: no I'm wrong, 54 and 22)
http://youtu.be/Lpx1SJdXnmo?t=51s (http://youtu.be/Lpx1SJdXnmo?t=51s)
and my crude drawing.... though it apparently doesn't apply for the flyback ferrites
someone should do a better job :) the bottom and top foil windings should be the same way... and the first extends backwards from the direction the secondary is wound... then at the end, it extends backwards from the direction of the winding
(Edit: rotation is kinda backwards, resembles video more if flipped upside down)
Quote from: d3x0r on April 25, 2014, 03:38:53 PM
looks like 5.4mH and 1.25mH to me..... (Edit: no I'm wrong, 54 and 22)
http://youtu.be/Lpx1SJdXnmo?t=51s (http://youtu.be/Lpx1SJdXnmo?t=51s)
and my crude drawing.... though it apparently doesn't apply for the flyback ferrites
drawing is a joke ...
someone should do a better job :) the bottom and top foil windings should be the same way... and the first extends backwards from the direction the secondary is wound... then at the end, it extends backwards from the direction of the winding
Quote from: verpies on April 25, 2014, 02:33:23 PM
Then Akula's core must have a hell of a permeability.
Yep. I don't think it's possible to get that high inductance with what he showed (number of turns and core). Of course that's not the only impossibility around this circuit and claims....
???
Quote from: Grumage on April 25, 2014, 02:44:44 PM
Bad form Sir !! >:(
Are you multi lingual ??
Wesley has helped us in so many ways. I feel you owe him an apology !!
Grumage.
100% agreed. Good post Sir.
Bill
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 25, 2014, 01:46:04 PM
Apparently the ferrite pot cores are not necessary. Akula has shown several different versions that don't use the pot core.... it is another Red Herring in my opinion. Good that you are trying them though... but I am building this version which does not include the pot core, just an ordinary flyback transformer ferrite. Of course Russian ferrites are special..... aren't they?
Yes the russian ferrites must be special ;)
I also do not understand Akula, first he makes kilowat device and now he makes a led circuit because it's popular in forums. Also Delamorto made device with 2 bright leds last year in russian forums, now he starts over to convince us with one led. I bed there is a small hidden battery maybe in capacitor.
Хорошо я объясню принцип резонанса и как его найти. Только от этого мой карман тяжелее не станет :-\.
Я показывал в "Фонарик видео 1" как я нашел резонанс с ферритовыми чашками, сейчас объясню подробно.
На каркас мотается катушка, ее индуктивность в чашках должна быть 115 uH, на чашки наклеивается медная фольга, к ней подключаете осцилограф. Генератором прямоугольника ищите резонансную частоту феррита, так как он сегнетоэлектрик то в резонансе у него синус будет увеличиваться, максимальная амплитуда синуса- наша частота. Это способ узнать частоту любого феррита в домашних условиях :). Далее все просто, чтоб использовать этот резонанс - нужно его снимать, для этого мотается контур LC на эту частоту резонанса. Один конец контура всегда подключен на входящий конденсатор, а второй коммутируется ключом. Вот так это работает, да на советских ферритах это просто.
Well , I will explain the principle of resonance and how to find it . Only from my pocket harder will not :-\ .
I showed in the " Фонарик видео1" I found resonance with ferrite cups, now explain in detail .
On the frame is wound coil , its inductance in cups should be 115 uH, cups on a copper foil glued to it connect oscilloscope . Generator rectangle looking resonant frequency ferrite , as it is in resonance ferroelectric his sinus will increase, the maximum amplitude of the sine - our band. It is a way to learn any frequency ferrite at home :) . Then everything is simple to use this resonance - you need to take it off , this teeter LC circuit for the frequency of resonance. One end of the circuit is always connected to the incoming capacitor , and the second key is switched . Here 's how it works , but on the Soviet ferrites is easy.
Молодец что рассказал, но поясню что в генераторе импульсов есть dc-dc преобразователь в принципиальной схеме которую ты кинул.
semenihin-77 (http://www.overunity.com/profile/semenihin-77.28544/), ждём нового видео с самозапитом.
Я не утверждаю, что так как у меня -правильно.... Напротив я за поиски нового, так как не получилось выжать больше чем на видео. :-\
Я думаю на сердечнике из титаната бария попробовать, у меня были хорошие опыты с ним. ;)
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 26, 2014, 04:38:08 AM
Я не утверждаю, что так как у меня -правильно.... Напротив я за поиски нового, так как не получилось выжать больше чем на видео. :-\
Я думаю на сердечнике из титаната бария попробовать, у меня были хорошие опыты с ним. ;)
Я думаю если выжать все из феррита с большей мощностью, то можно будет повторять не так точно кол-во витков и т.д. больше людей смогут повторить :)
I replicate this device with original ferrite and chips, without copper Foil - see no sense to make this with foil.
don't work without batteries..
>:(
When i disable MOSFET and 100 Om & K561LH2 - this decreases current from the battery. Then current is very small, 1 - 3 milliamps, and LED glow (weakly),
but without battery - don't work
Quote from: scratchrobot on April 26, 2014, 12:24:45 AM
Yes the russian ferrites must be special ;)
I also do not understand Akula, first he makes kilowat device and now he makes a led circuit because it's popular in forums. Also Delamorto made device with 2 bright leds last year in russian forums, now he starts over to convince us with one led. I bed there is a small hidden battery maybe in capacitor.
Yes. I think Hoppy may have found the "smoking gun". There is no real reason why the potentiometer case tabs should be soldered to the negative bus of that particular circuit board.... but a button cell concealed inside the potentiometer case would cause this soldered tab connection to make perfect sense. I can testify that the 3V circuit I have been examining will run with _brilliant_ LEDs for a long, long time -- more than six hours, it hasn't gone out yet -- on a single CR2016 battery, about the size of a US quarter dollar coin. Different 3V button cells could be concealed in two of the pots on the multi-pot Akula board very easily. Or a supercapacitor could be re-sleeved with a different label, this would get the unit through any of the short demonstrations we have seen.
Meanwhile, I've completed winding a transformator on the flyback ferrite core. I spent a couple hours tuning and fiddling but I still haven't been able to get waveforms that look like what Akula showed for this circuit. I get brilliant LEDs and low current consumption but still not sufficient signal through the transformator to cause the mosfet to switch in the complete circuit. Definitely not 80 v p-p at the anode of the diode. And of course when power is _really_ removed the LEDs fade out over a few seconds. There is something missing....
Quote from: Sergh on April 26, 2014, 05:35:25 AM
I replicate this device with original ferrite and chips, without copper Foil - see no sense to make this with foil.
don't work without batteries..
>:(
Me too.
But I actually did put something like the copper foil into my transformator on flyback ferrite. I used a brass tube for the central part of a bobbin, then wound the smaller winding onto this, electrically connected one end to the tube. Then when the first winding was completed I wrapped it in aluminum foil tape, connected this tape to the second winding and wound more wire over the foil. Why not.
Still it doesn't work without batteries.
Did you get any scope waveforms like Akula's ?
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 26, 2014, 05:41:12 AMDid you get any scope waveforms like Akula's ?
With this probably in Akula's video is error - divider of its scope in the wrong position.
Тhus Switch on Probe must set in 1:10 position, not in 1:1.
We see 70 volts, but really there 7 volts.
s. this Image from Papuas message (http://translate.google.ru/translate?sl=ru&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=ru&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fmatri-x.ru%2Fforum%2Findex.php%2Ftopic%2F1017-%25D1%258F%25D1%2587%25D0%25B5%25D0%25B9%25D0%25BA%25D0%25B0-%25D0%25BC%25D0%25B0%25D0%25B9%25D0%25B5%25D1%2580%25D0%25B0%2Fpage__st__3960%23entry209039&edit-text=&act=url):
, other waveforms almost similar.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 26, 2014, 04:38:08 AM
Я не утверждаю, что так как у меня -правильно.... Напротив я за поиски нового, так как не получилось выжать больше чем на видео. :-\
Я думаю на сердечнике из титаната бария попробовать, у меня были хорошие опыты с ним. ;)
Вы показываете в своем последнем видео другую схему без чипа преобразователя, вы можете рассказать нам больше о том, что?
Quote from: scratchrobot on April 26, 2014, 06:25:50 AM
Вы показываете в своем последнем видео другую схему без чипа преобразователя, вы можете рассказать нам больше о том, что?
Это были мои попытки сделать устройство на другом принципе, я не смог его пока запустить. Видео удалил чтобы не смущало других.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 26, 2014, 02:53:43 AM
Хорошо я объясню принцип резонанса и как его найти. Только от этого мой карман тяжелее не станет :-\ .
Я показывал в "Фонарик видео 1" как я нашел резонанс с ферритовыми чашками, сейчас объясню подробно.
На каркас мотается катушка, ее индуктивность в чашках должна быть 115 uH, на чашки наклеивается медная фольга, к ней подключаете осцилограф. Генератором прямоугольника ищите резонансную частоту феррита, так как он сегнетоэлектрик то в резонансе у него синус будет увеличиваться, максимальная амплитуда синуса- наша частота. Это способ узнать частоту любого феррита в домашних условиях :) . Далее все просто, чтоб использовать этот резонанс - нужно его снимать, для этого мотается контур LC на эту частоту резонанса. Один конец контура всегда подключен на входящий конденсатор, а второй коммутируется ключом. Вот так это работает, да на советских ферритах это просто.
Well , I will explain the principle of resonance and how to find it . Only from my pocket harder will not :-\ .
I showed in the " Фонарик видео1" I found resonance with ferrite cups, now explain in detail .
On the frame is wound coil , its inductance in cups should be 115 uH, cups on a copper foil glued to it connect oscilloscope . Generator rectangle looking resonant frequency ferrite , as it is in resonance ferroelectric his sinus will increase, the maximum amplitude of the sine - our band. It is a way to learn any frequency ferrite at home :) . Then everything is simple to use this resonance - you need to take it off , this teeter LC circuit for the frequency of resonance. One end of the circuit is always connected to the incoming capacitor , and the second key is switched . Here 's how it works , but on the Soviet ferrites is easy.
Congratulations! You have invented the Joule Thief!
;)
Quote from: Sergh on April 26, 2014, 06:02:43 AM
With this probably in Akula's video is error - divider of its scope in the wrong position.
Тhus Switch on Probe must set in 1:10 position, not in 1:1.
We see 70 volts, but really there 7 volts.
s. this Image from Papuas message (http://translate.google.ru/translate?sl=ru&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=ru&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fmatri-x.ru%2Fforum%2Findex.php%2Ftopic%2F1017-%25D1%258F%25D1%2587%25D0%25B5%25D0%25B9%25D0%25BA%25D0%25B0-%25D0%25BC%25D0%25B0%25D0%25B9%25D0%25B5%25D1%2580%25D0%25B0%2Fpage__st__3960%23entry209039&edit-text=&act=url):
, other waveforms almost similar.
Well spotted. I thought the same thing, posted yesterday, because of the nearly exact factor of 1/10 on the traces I get. But I had no evidence.
You have definitely shown that the Yellow probe is set to 1X and this would account for the "error".
Blue probe appears to be _not connected_ to circuit... but there is something else underneath the probe that IS connected to the circuit. Power?
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 26, 2014, 06:35:56 AM
Это были мои попытки сделать устройство на другом принципе, я не смог его пока запустить. Видео удалил чтобы не смущало других.
Благодаря Я останусь с этой схемы тогда. У меня другой вопрос, если вы не возражаете.
На видео, где вы расслабиться катушку, последний слой провода не подключен?
Катушка с медью напоминает мне о Качер вы сделали лет назад?
спасибо
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 26, 2014, 06:44:27 AMBlue probe appears to be _not connected_ to circuit... but there is something else underneath the probe that IS connected to the circuit. Power?
Maybe it is Ground from Scope Probe? :-\
Quote from: Sergh on April 26, 2014, 07:04:57 AM
Maybe it is Ground from Scope Probe? :-\
Possibly. The scope appears to be set to 1 ms/div horizontally, so the frequency of the sinus isn't the mains line frequency, it does appear to be the stated 270 Hz or so. But the probe tip seems to be disconnected!
It is the ground of the probe. You see him disconnect it later on in the video. The ground on the other probe is not connected!
He also has a lead plugged into the external trigger on the scope.
Only having one scope ground connected doesn't bother me much. Not nearly as much as not having the probe _tip_ connected, but still showing a signal!
Could it be connected to a bare wire coming from the pot core, a wire so thin it doesn't show up well on the image?
Hoppy, this is normal. For low-frequency measurements will be only one connection to ground.
Сейчас я исследую другие сердечники, мне кажется что феррит не идеален для такого устройства.
К сожалению мой генератор не совсем исправен, поэтому я немного мучаюсь при настройке.
Now I'm looking into other cores, I think that the ferrite is not ideal for such a device.
Unfortunately my generator is not quite working properly, so I am suffering a bit when adjusting.
http://youtu.be/zjzvmhRfa08
3v OU Flashlight - remains unclear, why the resonant frequency is 269 - 270 hertz?
Wow! I am suffering as you adjust, too!
A whining signal generator and an oscilloscope! And mostly flat lines on the scope! Nice old-new Russian tech, a round CRT in a square bezel, LOL.
Just for that, now you have to watch this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZFSnLgXfQE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZFSnLgXfQE)
Quote from: Hoppy on April 26, 2014, 07:26:44 AM
It is the ground of the probe. You see him disconnect it later on in the video. The ground on the other probe is not connected!
He also has a lead plugged into the external trigger on the scope.
Ah hah. Perhaps this means he is injecting a signal from a FG and triggering off that. I suspected this earlier.
But the scopeshot appears to indicate that the trigger channel is Ch2 (Look just below the blue pen pointer in the last scope image up above.)
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 26, 2014, 07:42:52 AM
Wow! I am suffering as you adjust, too!
A whining signal generator and an oscilloscope! And mostly flat lines on the scope! Nice old-new Russian tech, a round CRT in a square bezel, LOL.
Just for that, now you have to watch this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZFSnLgXfQE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZFSnLgXfQE)
The trolling and missunderstanding of working principles behind the scenes do not help and only confuse people.. is that what you want? Just think about consequences for a minute.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 26, 2014, 07:31:29 AM
Only having one scope ground connected doesn't bother me much. Not nearly as much as not having the probe _tip_ connected, but still showing a signal!
Could it be connected to a bare wire coming from the pot core, a wire so thin it doesn't show up well on the image?
Yes, it could be.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 26, 2014, 07:42:52 AM
Wow! I am suffering as you adjust, too!
A whining signal generator and an oscilloscope! And mostly flat lines on the scope! Nice old-new Russian tech, a round CRT in a square bezel, LOL.
Just for that, now you have to watch this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZFSnLgXfQE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZFSnLgXfQE)
Wow! Can I have the winding details of your coil. ;)
Quote from: T-1000 on April 26, 2014, 07:47:51 AM
The trolling and missunderstanding of working principles behind the scenes do not help and only confuse people.. is that what you want? Just think about consequences for a minute.
They could not be any more confused than they were at the beginning of this saga!
Quote from: T-1000 on April 26, 2014, 07:47:51 AM
The trolling and missunderstanding of working principles behind the scenes do not help and only confuse people.. is that what you want? Just think about consequences for a minute.
No, what I want is for YOU to think about the consequences and implications of someone -- Akula -- who posts a dozen different designs, all using common components, that all are "working" for HIM but for nobody else .... and whose "workings" can be easily explained by simple fakes.
Don't you think it's rather remarkable that a single small CR2016 cell can keep a bunch of LEDs lit brilliantly for _hours_? Don't you think that it is at least plausible that Akula has concealed a couple of batteries inside his mysterious potentiometer bodies that are soldered into the circuit?
Or don't you like the Hungarian Rhapsody?
Let's see your concerted effort to reproduce one of Akula's designs. Please report your step-by-step progress. Thanks in advance.
Quote from: Hoppy on April 26, 2014, 07:57:24 AM
Wow! Can I have the winding details of your coil. ;)
Sure. I used a ferrite core from a TV flyback transformer. Made in China, no doubt, which is on the same land mass as Russia.
I made a bobbin using a brass tube for the center and a couple of plastic discs for the ends. The tube fits nicely over the ferrite core. I then soldered one end of some #27 magnet wire to the brass tube, and wound a bunch of turns onto the form. The inductance of this winding is about 6 milliHenry. Then I took some aluminum duct tape and wrapped that around the first winding, electrically connected it to another piece of #27, and wound the second winding over the aluminum tape. This second winding measures something like 24 milliHenry. Then I put another layer of blue masking tape on the outside.
To get to the stated values on the schematic I would have to use a much bigger coil form, or much smaller wire, neither of which I have on hand. But Akula showed this setup working with just a few turns of heavy wire on his flyback ferrite, I thought.
To avoid confusion.... don't even _think_ about testing your circuits with a small battery to see how long they will run! That would just be trolling!
:o :-[ :-X :'(
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 26, 2014, 07:42:52 AM
Just for that, now you have to watch this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZFSnLgXfQE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZFSnLgXfQE)
It was always obvious that a button cell powered boost converter can power two LEDs for a long time.
...but what was that thing at 8:30 (http://youtu.be/NZFSnLgXfQE?t=8m30s) ?!
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 26, 2014, 04:38:08 AM
Я не утверждаю, что так как у меня -правильно.... Напротив я за поиски нового, так как не получилось выжать больше чем на видео. :-\
Я думаю на сердечнике из титаната бария попробовать, у меня были хорошие опыты с ним. ;)
Я пробовал, как только мог, самозапит не получаеться, мне было бы хорошо хоть какой самозапит зделать, поэтому информация, сколько витков было на какой катушке, было бы хорошо и ленты медные замкнутые или не замкнутые знать бы.
Quote from: Hoppy on April 26, 2014, 07:26:44 AM
It is the ground of the probe. You see him disconnect it later on in the video. The ground on the other probe is not connected!
He also has a lead plugged into the external trigger on the scope.
on rigol scopes the ground is not isolated, so connecting one is the same as connecting both. (and most inexpesnsive digital scopes)
Quote from: d3x0r on April 26, 2014, 10:09:05 AM
on rigol scopes the ground is not isolated, so connecting one is the same as connecting both. (and most inexpesnsive digital scopes)
This is not best practice and can give anomalous readings. I'll leave you to find out why, as I'm not here to enter into a discussion on how and how not to use a scope. I accept that its unlikely to make much difference in this particular case, given that the circuit is already full of anomalies!
Quote from: verpies on April 26, 2014, 09:26:46 AM
It was always obvious that a button cell powered boost converter can power two LEDs for a long time.
...but what was that thing at 8:30 (http://youtu.be/NZFSnLgXfQE?t=8m30s) ?!
Obvious to you and me perhaps, but evidently not so obvious to a lot of other people.
.... and haven't you ever seen a Naked Troll before? ....
;)
Quote from: Hoppy on April 26, 2014, 11:05:47 AM
This is not best practice and can give anomalous readings. I'll leave you to find out why, as I'm not here to enter into a discussion on how and how not to use a scope. I accept that its unlikely to make much difference in this particular case, given that the circuit is already full of anomalies!
Very true all of that.
The circuit does have substantial HF components in the signal though, because of the fast rise and fall times of the output of the MC34063, and is radiating a tiny little bit of power in the RF, so for quantitative readings, and to assure isolation from mains pickup, the probes both should be properly grounded of course.
I suppose I should explain the alt.snakeoil Video Report.
Stefan left a comment on the video and I replied; I'll repost it here just for the record.
Stefan said,
Quote
Hi TK, so where did you hide the battery ?
Where do you think Akula hides his battery in the Latern circuit as he shows at the end, that no capacitor contains a battery...hmm, do you think he has cut and pasted his videos and exchanged parts during the edits ? His last videos seemed to be filmed in one go though....hmm...so where do you think he has hidden something...?
And I replied,
QuoteIt's a single CR2016 flat coin cell, just taped to the underside of the board and connected by short bits of magnet wire, making contact when the weight of the board presses them together. The battery is smaller than a US quarter dollar coin and as thin as a dime. The thing ran all night long with brilliant LEDs, over eight hours, on that little battery. It finally stopped running when the battery open-circuit voltage was about 2.6 volts. The MC34063 chip is amazing and very versatile.
In some of Akula's videos the board has several potentiometers, and two, but not all, of the pots have their cases soldered to the ground rail of the circuit, as Hoppy discovered. It would be very easy to put batteries inside the cases of these dummy pots, making contact with the case to the negative pole and running the positive out one of the three regular potentiometer leads or with a tiny wire invisible on the video..
Recently we have seen a video from someone else, who demonstrates power wires that are just very thin magnet wire. Smaller than #30 or #32 can't be seen in most video resolutions.
I'm still trying to figure out how to get the precise waveforms he showed, with the spike train and the sinusoid. The chip in my build makes some strange waveforms, it is true, so maybe I just haven't gotten all the parameters right yet. I'm not ready to dismiss the waveform as fake. I think most of Akula's circuits work just as he has described and demonstrated -- they are proper Red Herrings -- and the only thing I think is faked is the running without outside or stored power.
Thanks for watching... and for not "dissing" the demonstration!
(The installed battery can even be recharged quite a bit, by hooking up the external power supply for a few minutes.)
@ Tk
do it & show it. why you wasting the time in what you dont belive?
Quote from: tysb3 on April 26, 2014, 01:00:08 PM
@ Tk
do it & show it. why you wasting the time in what you dont belive?
Am I wasting your time? Sorry. Just put me in your "ignore" list and keep on trying to get Akula's circuits to work as he demonstrates, then. Please pay no attention to my demonstrations, since they are wasting your time.
I am doing just exactly what I believe in, which is to examine claims of overunity performance, using the best methods I have available to me. If I can't get the claimed performance, no matter what I do, using the exact specifications of the claimant, but I _can_ get the claimed performance by a simple conjurer's trick... I am tempted to draw certain conclusions from that. If nobody else is able to get the claimed performance either, no matter what they do... the temptation gets stronger and stronger. Meanwhile I will keep reporting what I find from my testing, and my time is my own to waste, mostly.
So now I've tried a TIP3055 transistor (thanks Bill!) instead of the IRF3205 mosfet. The TIP3055 does switch and produces another set of different waveforms from the circuit. But with the heavier inductance on the 34063 chip side and the lighter inductance on the transistor side! And as usual phasing is important, I get different waveforms with swapping phase on one coil. Tuning (setting the potentiometer) has a great effect just as expected, since it controls the amplitude of the chip's output oscillations.
But whenever I pull the outside power, the system reverts to straight DC drive, keeping the LEDs lit for a few seconds on the stored energy in the big capacitors.
@Tk
I forgive you my wasted time :)
I asking you what is your reason to waste your time?
Despite the using the best methods you have you can not prove that Akula's device isn't overunity.
Quote from: tysb3 on April 26, 2014, 02:44:53 PM
@Tk
I forgive you my wasted time :)
I asking you what is your reason to waste your time?
Despite the using the best methods you have you can not prove that Akula's device isn't overunity.
Why should TK, or anyone for that matter, have to prove that ANY device is NOT overunity? As we have all said on this forum for years now, it is up to the claimant to PROVE his or her device works, not up to others to disprove it.
TK has been attempting to replicate one of the many "claimed O.U." devices from this person. When he sees that it can not work as advertised, I believe he then begins to think of the many ways it could have been faked. Remember Mylow? When TK suggested that he might be using fishing line, he was attacked but, as we now all know, TK was 100% correct. TK has good instincts along with a wealth of knowledge so, I listen to him. Maybe you should too?
Bill
Quote from: tysb3 on April 26, 2014, 02:44:53 PM
@Tk
I forgive you my wasted time :)
I asking you what is your reason to waste your time?
Despite the using the best methods you have you can not prove that Akula's device isn't overunity.
As long as I have blinking lights, spinny things, and multiple oscilloscopes going on in the lab, my housemate thinks I'm doing something productive, and she leaves me alone. Otherwise, I might have to wash the dishes or clean the bathroom or something.
Right, I can't prove Akula's device isn't OU. I can prove that mine isn't, though, and I'm trying my best to make it functionally identical to his.
It all boils down to what Pirate said: it is the claimant's responsibility to provide enough evidence to support his claim. So far, we are working with the spotty incomplete and error-ridden data that Akula has provided, with Wesley's much appreciated help. But it really isn't enough. So I'm exploring the problem space.
You might better be asking "why does Akula waste everyone's time with partial information and inconclusive demonstrations.... when he should really be working in a secret military lab making fuelless power supplies for Russian submarines and spy satellites?"
I know why.... and I think you do too.
8)
@ Pirate88179 (http://www.overunity.com/profile/pirate88179.8844/)The problem is that the claimant don"t want to disclose all essential important details. and if you don't believe him you are wasting the time with no reason.
It's better reason to show, how you can fake this device.
Here are some more facts I've gathered.
1. The TIP3055 works, whereas the mosfet I tried did not. That is, the bipolar transistor is switching fully when it gets the appropriate output voltage from the inverter chip, and it pulls down the positive rail when it does, and I get a good signal, although not a pure sinus or at 270 Hz, from the testpoint, at certain very precise settings of the trimpot.
2. The signal from the anode end of the Schottky diode I am seeing is very similar to the Akula signal, but at about 1/10 the claimed amplitude, and still without the regular response to the amplitude of the sinus. I get 7-8 volts maximum amplitude from the chip here. Have we determined for certain that Akula's probe for this channel is incorrectly set?
3. I tried a 34063 chip from another manufacturer and got somewhat different waveform results. The first chip is marked "sum" which is a mark I don't recognize (the chip from the dollar store USB adapter.) The chips I ordered from Ebay arrived today, and they are marked "ON" which is ON Semiconductor and corresponds to the data sheet attached below, for 34063AP1. I think I like the ON Semi chip best.
4. The system is also very sensitive to supply voltage and current. The first PSU I used was my small HP721A which has 225 mA current limiting. But I've found that at 3 volts supply the circuit wants to draw as much as 270 mA, so some of my early results are contaminated by the PSU current limiting function rolling back the voltage. With a stronger regulated supply I get, again, somewhat different performance at 3 volts input.
5. No matter what I try so far, in terms of coils, phasing, pot settings, PSU settings, whatever... as soon as I unplug the power the system reverts to straight DC to the LEDs from the capacitors, and it fades out over a few seconds.
@Tk
I think not only in Russia secret military lab but in USA secret military lab knows more than Akula.
Akula just "wasting" their secrets.
Yes, you are probably right.
ETA: I forgot to mention that the 270 mA is the maximum draw. The current draw goes way down when the trimpot is adjusted right, and for the alt.snakeoil trial run with hidden battery I had the current draw down to around 25 or 30 mA by adjusting the pot to the point where the LEDs just started to dim.
OK, here is an example scopeshot from my build.
I am inputting 3.0 volts and the system is drawing about 80 mA. I have the TIP3055 transistor instead of a mosfet in place. I have the larger inductance of the flyback ferrite transformator hooked to the 34063 side and the smaller inductance to the inverter side. Phasing makes a difference. Scope probe positions as on the schematic. The LEDs are blindingly brilliant, much brighter than in the alt.snakeoil video. Potentiometer adjustment is critical.
The rest of the needed info is on the image. The top trace portion that is outlined in yellow, and the corresponding areas on the other cycles, is filled with the spiky output of the 34063 but at very high frequency; the scope can't show them at this slow timebase. They appear to be happening at about 40 kHz but the frequency fluctuates rapidly.
So far, this is the most "sinus" like signal that I have been able to get from the inverter Pin 13 - coil "secondary" connection. Doesn't it look like a great shark fin? I wonder if that has any significance.
:o
I suppose I should hook up the DSO for more detail. It's a lot easier to explore the problem space with the analog scope though, since changing settings is a lot easier on the analog.
OK.... mosfet switching success....
Without changing _any_ settings, I put in a BUZ11A mosfet instead of the TIP3055. The resulting waveform is almost identical to the above! But the current draw went down to 60 mA. And the LEDs seem even brighter, if that's possible.
The BUZ11A has a lower gate threshold voltage than the other mosfet I used.
I am kind of disappointed because the big TIP3055 looks very macho on my board. Much more macho than the puny TO220 case BUZ11A. But the mosfet does not suffer from the base-emitter current problem, as long as there is sufficient juice to fill the gate capacitance in the first place.
Because all designs are incomplete?
Much time is spent on confusing people ...
Akula = confusion (No full and clear circuit.)
Don Smith = impossible to get those components. (No full and clear circuit.)
Kapanadze = Never public all .. for me it is fake.
The resonance exists, but I do not let us see it ...
..but there are people in this forum that is dedicated to confuse.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 26, 2014, 02:53:43 AM
Хорошо я объясню принцип резонанса и как его найти. Только от этого мой карман тяжелее не станет :-\.
Я показывал в "Фонарик видео 1" как я нашел резонанс с ферритовыми чашками, сейчас объясню подробно.
На каркас мотается катушка, ее индуктивность в чашках должна быть 115 uH, на чашки наклеивается медная фольга, к ней подключаете осцилограф. Генератором прямоугольника ищите резонансную частоту феррита, так как он сегнетоэлектрик то в резонансе у него синус будет увеличиваться, максимальная амплитуда синуса- наша частота. Это способ узнать частоту любого феррита в домашних условиях :). Далее все просто, чтоб использовать этот резонанс - нужно его снимать, для этого мотается контур LC на эту частоту резонанса. Один конец контура всегда подключен на входящий конденсатор, а второй коммутируется ключом. Вот так это работает, да на советских ферритах это просто.
Well , I will explain the principle of resonance and how to find it . Only from my pocket harder will not :-\ .
I showed in the " Фонарик видео1" I found resonance with ferrite cups, now explain in detail .
On the frame is wound coil , its inductance in cups should be 115 uH, cups on a copper foil glued to it connect oscilloscope . Generator rectangle looking resonant frequency ferrite , as it is in resonance ferroelectric his sinus will increase, the maximum amplitude of the sine - our band. It is a way to learn any frequency ferrite at home :) . Then everything is simple to use this resonance - you need to take it off , this teeter LC circuit for the frequency of resonance. One end of the circuit is always connected to the incoming capacitor , and the second key is switched . Here 's how it works , but on the Soviet ferrites is easy.
I have a new russian pot core to play with and i wound a coil on it, took 3 layers of wire to get 115 uH.
Now i will try your method to find resonance of ferrite.
Why everybody is talking about Akula, i thought we were replicating Semenihin-77 device?
Quote from: scratchrobot on April 27, 2014, 12:12:02 AM
I have a new russian pot core to play with and i wound a coil on it, took 3 layers of wire to get 115 µH.
I have seen the Russians write мкХ or mkH when they mean µH. I've seen them abbreviating mkH to mH, too >:(
Quote from: scratchrobot on April 27, 2014, 12:12:02 AM
Why everybody is talking about Akula, i thought we were replicating Semenihin-77 device?
Because we are distracted by a video of a very similar device made by Akula.
Quote from: verpies on April 27, 2014, 05:48:04 AM
I have seen the Russians write мкХ or mkH when they mean µH. I've seen them abbreviating mkH to mH, too >:(
Because we are distracted by a video of a very similar device made by Akula.
Exactly!
Semenihin-77 posted a new video,
http://youtu.be/eac1_pLNhnQ (http://youtu.be/eac1_pLNhnQ)
Hi scratchrobot,
In the video clip, I guess that's a piece broken out of a toroidal magnet speakers? . . :D
Quote from: havuhung on April 27, 2014, 10:20:59 AM
Hi scratchrobot,
In the video clip, I guess that's a piece broken out of a toroidal magnet speakers? . . :D
Hi havuhung,
I have no idea, maybe or ferrite, looks like he solder on it, maybe he put copper tape on it?
I will try it on different materials, looks interesting to me ;)
It's BaTiO3 (barium titanate).
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Piezo-Barium-Titanate-Ceramic-Material-Silver-Plated-/150750545080?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item23196ec4b8 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Piezo-Barium-Titanate-Ceramic-Material-Silver-Plated-/150750545080?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item23196ec4b8)
In the description it says that John Hutchinson made a battery out of material just like this that never needed charging :o
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1a1c0y_barium-titanate-test_news (http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1a1c0y_barium-titanate-test_news)
More distractions ;D
Hi scratchrobot,
Thank you.
This morning's scopeshot.
3.0V input 320 mA
LEDs one blue, one white
flyback ferrite core halves separated by 2mm wooden spacer and tightened down with clipspring
Larger inductance on inverter side, smaller on 34063 side
2.2 pF capacitor across the 3.3 K resistor
very careful tuning of trimpot
Both channels at 2 V/div, 5ms/div horizontal
I'm preparing a video of some interesting things I saw last night, before I changed the LEDs and added the little capacitor.
I'll be switching to the digital scope this afternoon.
I think that the inductances I am using are waaaay too large (about 6 and 20 milliH). I'll be winding another coil bobbin with less wire later on this afternoon. I am now thinking that the 27 and 54 numbers might actually be 2.7 and 5.4 milliHenry or even 27 and 54 microHenry.
Quote from: scratchrobot on April 27, 2014, 10:00:37 AM
Exactly!
Semenihin-77 posted a new video,
http://youtu.be/eac1_pLNhnQ (http://youtu.be/eac1_pLNhnQ)
Nothing at all remarkable in that video that I can see. I don't understand most of what he's saying, but he's using a 1 volt signal of 121 kiloHertz and showing that the LEDs don't light when directly connected to the FG but do light when he has more inductance or capacitance in the circuit. I have many videos that show the same thing as small parts of other demonstrations. This does not appear to me to have anything to do with the Akula 3v flashlight circuit.
The material does not look like BaTiO to me. But who knows what Soviet surplus barium titanate might look like.
my English is bad but I'll try to explain that you have no chance to tune Akula's device if you don't know how it works. I hope Wesley will translate latest Akula's conversation on skype. but in short, Akula's devices is working on core resonance. It's different cores - different resonances. for example one Akula's core have 3,5 Ghz resonance. transistors switching time need to be shorter than this frequency. the high and low frequency generators need to be harmonics oscillators on cores resonance frequency.
from start you need to find core resonance that you have.
the transistors switches need to be switch on-off in one time
and there is more what to be explained but I hope somebody do better than me
@TK
***** Nothing at all remarkable in that video that I can see *****
In comments he mentioned that the material is BaTiO3.
However, I completely agree with you. This phenomenon is well known and has been used for donkey's years (echo sounders etc.)
~A
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 26, 2014, 04:20:31 PM
As long as I have blinking lights, spinny things, and multiple oscilloscopes going on in the lab, my housemate thinks I'm doing something productive, and she leaves me alone. Otherwise, I might have to wash the dishes or clean the bathroom or something.
Right, I can't prove Akula's device isn't OU. I can prove that mine isn't, though, and I'm trying my best to make it functionally identical to his.
It all boils down to what Pirate said: it is the claimant's responsibility to provide enough evidence to support his claim. So far, we are working with the spotty incomplete and error-ridden data that Akula has provided, with Wesley's much appreciated help. But it really isn't enough. So I'm exploring the problem space.
You might better be asking "why does Akula waste everyone's time with partial information and inconclusive demonstrations.... when he should really be working in a secret military lab making fuelless power supplies for Russian submarines and spy satellites?"
I know why.... and I think you do too.
8)
А что поступали предложения? ;D
То что я сделал -результат моих изысканий за 5 месяцев, и я не уверен что так правильно.
Ребята придумайте что нибудь новое, я например ищу альтернативные варианты, например резонанс в сегнетоэлектриках.
Я думаю не стоит повторять то в чем не разобрались, не получиться просто копировать.
P.S. Я отправил ферритовые чашки из моих видео человеку с этого форума, на изучение, думаю скоро все повторят, а может и сделают лучше.
What I did is the result of my research for 5 months, and I'm not sure so right.
Guys come up with something new, I like looking for alternatives, such as resonance in ferroelectrics.
I think you should not repeat what is not understood, not be able to simply copy.
P.S. I sent ferrite cup of my video person on this forum, to study, I think soon all repeat, and maybe do better.
Ya nye govoryu po-Rooski. Ochyen ploho.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 27, 2014, 02:14:14 PM
Ya nye govoryu po-Rooski. Ochyen ploho.
Google to help ;)
Quote from: tysb3 on April 27, 2014, 01:51:29 PM
my English is bad but I'll try to explain that you have no chance to tune Akula's device if you don't know how it works. I hope Wesley will translate latest Akula's conversation on skype. but in short, Akula's devices is working on core resonance. It's different cores - different resonances. for example one Akula's core have 3,5 Ghz resonance. transistors switching time need to be shorter than this frequency. the high and low frequency generators need to be harmonics oscillators on cores resonance frequency.
from start you need to find core resonance that you have.
the transistors switches need to be switch on-off in one time
an there is more what to be explained but I hope somebody do better than me
I listened to that TeamSpeak conference. While it made me more sympathetic towards Roman himself, it highlighted the fact that he himself has no idea whatsoever as far as the true nature of the processes is concerned.
Another interesting fact is that he went to Germany to demonstrate his skills. One month (and many thousands of Euros) later he admitted defeat. Some suggested that at home he uses a RF transmitter to induce voltage and that his circuits are simply cleaver receiver fakes. (This, kind of, makes you remember one of his videos where he's adjusting frequencies and the circuit's producing a typical receiver noise, doesn't it? )
You are right in saying that understanding the principle is the key to success. However, at this stage, it seems we all have no clue.
Some of the greatest discoveries have been made by chance. Whatever it is Roman has stumbled upon, he's not sharing.
~A
Quote from: avalon on April 27, 2014, 02:18:44 PM
I listened to that TeamSpeak conference. While it made me more sympathetic towards Roman himself, it highlighted the fact that he himself has no idea whatsoever as far as the true nature of the processes is concerned.
Another interesting fact is that he went to Germany to demonstrate his skills. One month (and many thousands of Euros) later he admitted defeat. Some suggested that at home he uses a RF transmitter to induce voltage and that his circuits are simply cleaver receiver fakes. (This, kind of, makes you remember one of his videos where he's adjusting frequencies and the circuit's producing a typical receiver noise, doesn't it? )
You are right in saying that understanding the principle is the key to success. However, at this stage, it seems we all have no clue.
Some of the greatest discoveries have been made by chance. Whatever it is Roman has stumbled upon, he's not sharing.
~A
Don't get me wrong....
I truly believe that ferro-resonance is for real.
~A
8)
I think one of Akula's traces might be inverted.
(My shot: Both channels at 2v/div, 5 ms/div horizontal. Bottom channel is inverted in scope.)
This is using a different inverter chip than used before. This is with a CD4069CN, also marked as MM74C04N, I think made by National Semiconductor. The previous shots and video were using a Motorola chip marked MC14069UBCP.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 27, 2014, 02:16:39 PM
Google to help ;)
To help what, rolling laughter? Google translates Russian even worse than I do, nearly. Don't you wind up laughing when you read a Google translation of a long English technical passage?
Spasibo anyhow. Nichego nye ponyemayu. Excuse my Texan accent.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 27, 2014, 02:07:46 PM
P.S. I sent ferrite cup of my video person on this forum, to study, I think soon all repeat, and maybe do better.
Why not the whole working circuit?
~A
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 27, 2014, 02:27:25 PM
To help what, rolling laughter? Google translates Russian even worse than I do, nearly. Don't you wind up laughing when you read a Google translation of a long English technical passage?
Spasibo anyhow. Nichego nye ponyemayu. Excuse my Texan accent.
Yes. But without it even worse
Almost forgot.
A schematics for the latest Akula's circuit has just surfaced on a Russian forum.
Here it is.
~A
If it shows 9 volts being fed into the circuit, how is this supposed to be self-running? Did I miss something here?
Bill
Quote from: Pirate88179 on April 27, 2014, 02:47:07 PM
If it shows 9 volts being fed into the circuit, how is this supposed to be self-running? Did I miss something here?
Bill
Those are just contacts for the 9 volts battery. Here is the board
~A
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 27, 2014, 02:07:46 PM
А что поступали предложения? ;D
То что я сделал -результат моих изысканий за 5 месяцев, и я не уверен что так правильно.
Ребята придумайте что нибудь новое, я например ищу альтернативные варианты, например резонанс в сегнетоэлектриках.
Я думаю не стоит повторять то в чем не разобрались, не получиться просто копировать.
P.S. Я отправил ферритовые чашки из моих видео человеку с этого форума, на изучение, думаю скоро все повторят, а может и сделают лучше.
What I did is the result of my research for 5 months, and I'm not sure so right.
Guys come up with something new, I like looking for alternatives, such as resonance in ferroelectrics.
I think you should not repeat what is not understood, not be able to simply copy.
P.S. I sent ferrite cup of my video person on this forum, to study, I think soon all repeat, and maybe do better.
Я хочу повторить то, что вы сделали, и не против, как это работает, но если вы думаете, что мы не должны быть в состоянии простого копирования, то я понимаю, но зачем создавать головоломки?
Пожалуйста отправлено феррита чашку Magpwr, он был одним из первых, кто хотел повторить из вашего видео.
спасибо
I wish to replicate what you did and don't mind how it works but if you think we should not be able to simple copy then i understand but why create puzzle?
Please sent ferrite cup to Magpwr, he was one of the first who wanted to replicate from your video.
Thanks
Quote from: avalon on April 27, 2014, 02:44:22 PM
Almost forgot.
A schematics for the latest Akula's circuit has just surfaced on a Russian forum.
Here it is.
~A
One more thing. Both chips are TL494.
~A
I think this guy found something useful too.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ql2zfs5vevM
Whatever, dude.
Oops, I forgot to invert the lower channel. "Correct" now:
;)
3.0 V, 50 milliAmps input power, brilliant blue and white LEDs.
8)
Re fly back ferrite core, if any one has an old fly back transformer, If you heat it up very carefully to about 200 deg c you can pull it apart, but be very careful as it becomes brittle, and make sure its the same temp in the middle at both joint ends before you pull it apart.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on April 26, 2014, 02:53:43 AM
its inductance in cups should be 115 uH, cups on a copper foil glued to it connect oscilloscope .
A question, if I may...
Why 115uH?
Also, when you glue a copper strip to the pot do you, actually glue 2 strips for the lower and the upper part of the pot or just one to wrap both?
~A
Quote from: tysb3 on April 27, 2014, 03:10:03 PM
I think this guy found something useful too.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ql2zfs5vevM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ql2zfs5vevM)
Yes, that's interesting. I like Grumage's experimental attitude.
Also interesting is what happens when I increase and decrease the gap in the ferrite core above.... the amplitude of the signals does NOT vary, but the _frequency_ of the sinusoid and the bursts does. Larger gap, higher frequency. I interpret this to mean that the inductance I am using (number of turns) is really too large. I am seeing my effects in the scopeshot above at 1/5 the frequency of the Akula scopeshot effects, and if I didn't have the wooden spacer in the coil, it would be at 1/10 the frequency of Akula's.
Quote from: tysb3 on April 27, 2014, 01:51:29 PM
my English is bad but I'll try to explain that you have no chance to tune Akula's device if you don't know how it works. I hope Wesley will translate latest Akula's conversation on skype. but in short, Akula's devices is working on core resonance. It's different cores - different resonances. for example one Akula's core have 3,5 Ghz resonance. transistors switching time need to be shorter than this frequency. the high and low frequency generators need to be harmonics oscillators on cores resonance frequency.
from start you need to find core resonance that you have.
the transistors switches need to be switch on-off in one time
and there is more what to be explained but I hope somebody do better than me
Hello All:
I believe this to be relevant concerning ferroresonance and dimensional resonance:
and in relation to AC power systems:
"Ferro-resonance can generate overvoltages of upto 12 times line to ground source voltage upon opening a single phase device or poorly synchronised 3 phase device. Voilent failure can occur exposing personnel to the high voltage failure and accompanying conditions. Ferro-resonance conditions can result in damage to lightning arresters, switching devices, buried cable, transformers and associated equipment.
Ferro-resonance can be initiated when all of the following elements are present and the switching means at the dip point or takes off when a single phase device or an unsynchronised 3 phase device that does not operate all phases within 1/2 cycle.
1.System grounded at the source, but with no ground at the transformer bank
2. Shielded cable length or overhead conductor length sufficient to create the capacitance necessary
3. Transformer size that permits saturation of the iron core at the operating voltage
4. Transformer unloaded or lightly loaded.
Prevention or control of ferro-resonance can be by:
1. Using wye-wye transformer withboth neutrals grounded and tied to systems neutral
2. Using only phase-to-neutral (not phase-to-phase) transformers connections for single pahse transformers.
3. Limiting length of underground cable
4. For poorly synchronised switching devices, extra resistive load of 2% of the transformer capacity on underground cable. "
Ref:www.tpub.com/doeelecsafety/electri... safety
Food for thought, and it does correlate with the Russian stories of the cores self-destructing after a short runtime:
take care, peace
lost_bro
Well done TK, so what about the Secondary coil ?
What voltage and current can you get from it ?
Do you feed this spikey signal to the primary of the flyback transformer
and is the pure sine wave then at the secondary ?
Can you bridge rectify the secondary and feed it back to the input then ?
Many thanks.
Regards, Stefan.
Quote from: hartiberlin on April 27, 2014, 05:02:56 PM
Well done TK, so what about the Secondary coil ?
What voltage and current can you get from it ?
Do you feed this spikey signal to the primary of the flyback transformer
and is the pure sine wave then at the secondary ?
Can you bridge rectify the secondary and feed it back to the input then ?
Many thanks.
Regards, Stefan.
The circuit is wired exactly as Akula's schematic below, except that I added a 2.2 pF ceramic capacitor across the 3.3K resistor. (And my big input reservoir cap is 3300 uF not 2200 uF.) I have the smaller of my inductances (about 6 milliH) connected to the 34063 side and the larger (about 20 milliH) connected to the 4069 side. I am using BUZ11A mosfet, CD4069CN from National Semiconductor, MC34063API from ON Semi. One blue and one white LED.
The system is very sensitive to input voltage, potentiometer setting and coil ferrite gap (thanks for suggesting I look at varying this gap). Also coil phasing, we are all used to swapping connections of one coil if it doesn't "work" the first time, right?
The spike voltage on the top trace is set by the pot and the DC_DC chip's other components, but the range of "tuning" to see this waveform is so narrow that the spike voltage does not vary in that range. It maxes out at about 2.5 times input voltage. Akula's "80 v p-p" here must be from setting his probe/scope attenuation incorrectly, as I am seeing exactly 1/10 that value at maximum.
The sinus waveform can be gotten to make a little more voltage than is shown on the scope but then the top trace changes as well, by reducing the length of the bursts of oscillation, and if the pot is turned too far in either direction the sinus flattens out and no bursts happen.
I don't think it can be connected differently or looped back in the way you are thinking.
I think that the inductances I'm using are too large, which accounts for the slower main frequency I'm getting. I think this, because when I separate the core halves, the frequency of the sinusoid goes up and up, until the cores are too far apart and the thing stops working.
The ferrite I am using is from a TV flyback transformer. It is conductive, measuring almost exactly 50 ohms per centimeter on the surface, contacted with point probes. The coil bobbin inner tube is a brass tube and it is in contact with the ferrite and connected to the inner winding as well.
But it still goes straight to DC and fades out in a couple seconds when I pull the input power plug.
:'(
Your copper foils are wrong...
watch the video again, they're both connected on the secondary. (secondary being the lower uH coil)
the first cut he makes; the outside foil; leaves a short wire;
This is the start of the unwind of the secondary. The primary has two long leads on it that he start to unwind and finishes with; without connection tot he copper foil
Quote from: scratchrobot on April 27, 2014, 02:58:53 PM
Я хочу повторить то, что вы сделали, и не против, как это работает, но если вы думаете, что мы не должны быть в состоянии простого копирования, то я понимаю, но зачем создавать головоломки?
Пожалуйста отправлено феррита чашку Magpwr, он был одним из первых, кто хотел повторить из вашего видео.
спасибо
I wish to replicate what you did and don't mind how it works but if you think we should not be able to simple copy then i understand but why create puzzle?
Please sent ferrite cup to Magpwr, he was one of the first who wanted to replicate from your video.
Thanks
hi scratchrobot,
I might be the first person to be interested in the device but i am definitely a lousy presenter through youtube video.Hence i am not the right candidate maybe TinselKoala (http://www.overunity.com/profile/tinselkoala.13644/) would do. :)
Do reveal to us if your replication is a success since you have the exact same Russian made ferrite pot core.
I have read this somewhere in internet it looks some of the old soviet made ferrite core are
irradiated as part of the manufacturing process."Sorry i am unable to validate if this is true".
I am just thinking if this
irradiation process do play a important "OU" role from the particular Russian Yoke to this recent ferrite pot core. ;)
I have recently received the MC34063 but not the ferrite core from ebay yet.
Quote from: d3x0r on April 27, 2014, 05:57:54 PM
Your copper foils are wrong...
watch the video again, they're both connected on the secondary. (secondary being the lower uH coil)
the first cut he makes; the outside foil; leaves a short wire;
This is the start of the unwind of the secondary. The primary has two long leads on it that he start to unwind and finishes with; without connection tot he copper foil
Hmmm.... that won't be easy for me to fix on this bobbin, but I am going to make another one shortly anyway. Good that you told me this before I started! Thanks, or spasibo... ;)
What do you think about the inductance value discrepancy? milliHenries, microHenries, or something in between? Who said what? Do you know how many turns in each winding? I can't watch the video.
Just for fun here's another scopeshot, at the same parameters as above.
The shot below is as described above, with a 1.7 mm thick wooden spacer between the two halves of the flyback core outer leg. Inner leg is probably still touching inside the bobbin. 3.0 V and 50 mA input.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 27, 2014, 06:36:15 PM
Hmmm.... that won't be easy for me to fix on this bobbin, but I am going to make another one shortly anyway. Good that you told me this before I started! Thanks, or spasibo... ;)
What do you think about the inductance value discrepancy? milliHenries, microHenries, or something in between? Who said what? Do you know how many turns in each winding? I can't watch the video.
I dunno... the m could be a scribbled greek u ... wide lead and tail... so micro probably
it's definatly not enough to be milli; tesla coils are 30mH++... which thousands of turns...
and I doubt it means nano
you said yours were about 55 and 22... but 1/10 of that inductance is only 1/3.1 the windings (cause there's a square in there)
There is something wrong here somewhere. :-\
The sinus I am seeing seems to be at the local powerline frequency. I know it is coming from the coil and mosfet switching though, because I can feel and hear the coil vibrating.
I set up the measurements to read the p-p voltage and frequency of the sinus. The two shots below are first, with the core and spacer and spring clamp installed, and second, with the core unclamped and no spacer, chattering away, and retuned for a stable waveform set. Current draw went up to over 300 mA.
OK, I'm done with this coil I think, and I'll be winding another one shortly. Akula couldn't be picking up a harmonic of his powerline frequency, could he?
??? ???
Quote from: d3x0r on April 27, 2014, 06:53:27 PM
I dunno... the m could be a scribbled greek u ... wide lead and tail... so micro probably
it's definatly not enough to be milli; tesla coils are 30mH++... which thousands of turns...
and I doubt it means nano
you said yours were about 55 and 22... but 1/10 of that inductance is only 1/3.1 the windings (cause there's a square in there)
No, that's what the schematic said, 27 and 54 mH (but then someone said Wesley said 2.7 ...?) Mine turned out to measure about 6 and 20 milliHenry. But I am going to wind another lower inductance pair as soon as I have time to make the bobbin.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 27, 2014, 07:07:48 PM
There is something wrong here somewhere. :-\
The sinus I am seeing seems to be at the local powerline frequency. I know it is coming from the coil and mosfet switching though, because I can feel and hear the coil vibrating.
I set up the measurements to read the p-p voltage and frequency of the sinus. The two shots below are first, with the core and spacer and spring clamp installed, and second, with the core unclamped and no spacer, chattering away, and retuned for a stable waveform set. Current draw went up to over 300 mA.
OK, I'm done with this coil I think, and I'll be winding another one shortly. Akula couldn't be picking up a harmonic of his powerline frequency, could he?
??? ???
Might be a good explanation as we know we can light an led with just an antenna and an earth ground. Possibly his circuit is just a good antenna?
Bill
Quote from: Pirate88179 on April 27, 2014, 07:20:53 PM
Might be a good explanation as we know we can light an led with just an antenna and an earth ground. Possibly his circuit is just a good antenna?
Bill
Well, maybe he has some powerful RF or he's living underneath the power distribution block for his apartment building or in a radar station, or something. That might account for the sinus. Once you have that sine wave or any action on the mosfet side, it will affect the oscillations of the MC34063 and cause the burst effect there. But I still don't see how that mechanism could couple into this circuit to light up the LEDs in absence of input power.
The story of him not being able to repeat the effect at another location.... where did that come from? I missed the original source.
It's more like the sine oscillation could be an artifact, common to both his environment and mine, picking up powerline harmonics, and it's being used as another Red Herring. But I think that there still must be either a hidden power source or a deliberate picking up of ambient power. I can't see how it could be done though, with just the existing circuitry. An additional cap or two, a diode, 78L33 voltage regulator and small loop antenna would be sufficient, but it doesn't seem like there is room on his board for all that.
OK, last one for a while.
@ TinselKoala (http://www.overunity.com/profile/tinselkoala.13644/)you are trying to get money from the bank but you don't know where they are. you are trying unlock every doors even toilets doors. you are still too far from the safes doors and you don't know the code of its.
you need to know what Akula was speaking in last conference on the skype:
http://webfile.ru/63bd3cd22caa0cb0343e3c0c52158678
Please save it and try to translate, it contains important information.
Good Day All:
Ok, more info from the PDF I posted earlier:
Interestingly enough this dimensional resonance is famous for destroying ferrite cores.....
take care, peace
lost_bro
@ TinselKoala (http://www.overunity.com/profile/tinselkoala.13644/)
first you need to find core resonance of yours transformer. It could be between 1-3,5 Ghz.
second, you need to adjust (without load and LF switch ) HF generator to resonate the core in his resonance for minimum current draw (I don't remember maybe it could be about 1mA ) from power suply. then try to play with 1 diod on load.
all transistors and diodes need to be possibly highest frequency.
Quote from: tysb3 on April 27, 2014, 08:48:43 PM
@ TinselKoala (http://www.overunity.com/profile/tinselkoala.13644/)
first you need to find core resonance of yours transformer. It could be between 1-3,5 Ghz.
second, you need to adjust (without load and LF switch ) HF generator to resonate the core in his resonance for minimum current draw (I don't remember maybe it could be about 1mA ) from power suply. then try to play with 1 diod on load.
all transistors and diodes need to be possibly highest frequency.
Good Day tysb3:
What is the recommended method to use in order to *find* the core resonance?
take care, peace
lost_bro
@lost_bro (http://www.overunity.com/profile/lost_bro.80143/)
you need to put some winds (not to much) on the core with connection from the middle and connect "bottom" and middle wires to signal generator and "bottom" and "top" wires to oscilloscope. then it's need to put meander signal and seek smal "hills" on the top of meander. the frequency of these "hills" will be core resonance. I think it's not only method but this is what I understand from Akula's conference.
Quote from: tysb3 on April 27, 2014, 08:48:43 PM
@ TinselKoala (http://www.overunity.com/profile/tinselkoala.13644/)
first you need to find core resonance of yours transformer. It could be between 1-3,5 Ghz.
Hmm,
I think this is wrong.
We have here an audio frequency of about 6 to 10 Khz at play probably resonating the core in this
frequency range..You still can hear it...
So no Ghz are required...
Maybe via the spikes higher harmonics, but I guess this will not go into the Ghz range...
Although it will probably depend what ferrite core material you are using...
I wonder why TK´s core has such a low electrical resistance.
Normally Ferrite cores have much higher ohmical resistances....
We surely don´t want to have eddy currents inside the cores...
Regards, Stefan.
@hartiberlin (http://www.overunity.com/profile/hartiberlin.2/)
this is information is from Akula. ant I think you are wrong, sorry. Akula have OU device and you don't :)
sorry for my English grammar.
@hartiberlin (http://www.overunity.com/profile/hartiberlin.2/)
you don't understand. you don't need HF generator to work on the cores resonance frequency. it's need to work on the lower harmonic of this resonance. but fronts of the signals need to be possible vertical. because of this transistors and diodes need to be possible highest frequency.
and I think you need 2 resonances: (1)HF coils resonance (to minimize amps from power suply much as possibly) on lower cores frequency and (2)cores resonance (for OU)
You can actually hear the resonance in his circuit and it is probably such
a dimensional resonance as it is spoken in this Ferrite core PDF file that was just posted..
I just read it.
TK also has such a MnZi core with its low resistance of 50 Ohms/1cm.
These also have these dimensional resonance effects, so the core
is probably right...
Well, maybe you can tell us exactly what Akula said in this Online session ?
in the used circuit, which is a really strange switching circuit
http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/137522/
the lower sine frequency comes probably from the secondary coil with the 100 uF
as LC tank which pulls down the supply voltage via the Q3 MOSFET and thus
switching on and off the DC2DC converter chip MC34063.
Maybe he made an error and wanted to have the the DC2DC chip running
all the time...
As the ferrite core rings at around 8 Khz probably the spike frequency is around
this 8 Khz frequency with this low sine wave modulation or better said chopping it...
In this video he shows the scope shots:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lpx1SJdXnmo
I wonder why TK does not have the underlayed sine wave, where the spikes occur on the yellow channel....
Maybe he must avoid full dimensional resonance that shatters the core sooner or later ??
So he tries to change the spike frequency around the resonance frequency like a FM modulation ?
Regards, Stefan.
Hi everyone,
it is my first time posting and may I add it is a lovely sunny day in South Africa. I have been doing research into alternative energy devices for a few months now and thought it was time to share/help.
There are several ways of getting energy "from no where", BUT lets not skip over this 'no where' just to see something MAYBE working by poking in the dark. Lets look at the concepts behind what is happening and then develop it from there. First of all: What are we really after? Answ: control of electron flow. Before we can make electrons flow we need to find the best source where we can trade or trick to get some.
We know nature have tons of "misplaced/free roaming" electrons and when they get together we see things like lighting and static discharge - so NO question that it is there for the taking. Where are do these electrons hiding when not being conducting to earth? Short answ: the ionosphere. Think this way: give the electrons in the ionosphere a reason/pathway to flow into the earth and then put your load in series with that pathway. What do you think would happen? Sounds like the Tesla/Kapanadze devices?
BUT this is only one way of doing things AND you can combine methods to achieve the desired end result. NOW onto the method used or being searched for in this thread.
We need a source of electrons. We know metals have "loosely bonded" electrons - this is why they conduct electricity (they are willing to swap out electrons if pushed to do so). We also know metals are willing to give up electrons in exchange processes - we call these batteries , where by chemical or molecular bonding "swop outs" we can harvest electrons. SO we know there is energy in metals.
What if there is ANOTHER way of getting the electrons from metal? THERE IS! Science call it Nuclear Magnetic Resonance (NMR) and it is used in NMR Spectroscopy equipment all the time - once again we thus know it exist and is possible. NMR uses the principal that specific elements vibrate/resonate at specific frequencies. At these frequencies they "give off" or radiate electrons - this is how you identify what molecular elements you are testing in your spectroscope. Because it is SO specific it is easy to miss. DON'T GIVE UP AFTER 10 MINUTES OF TRYING!!! It is a needle in a haystack.
HOWEVER, the plot thickens. Electrons have WEIGHT - take a high voltage, high frequency source, connect a thin enamel wire to each end, place the other ends of the two wires close to each other to create a spark gap or plasma discharge space, offset these ends such that they are not aligned. Now you have been taught that electricity always takes the shortest path, right? What you will find is that it does not jump straight from the one end to the other, it flows in an S-shape. Why is this? Well, the electrons are "running" down the wire at high speed. As they reach the end of the wire their momentum forces them to continue straight UNTIL the pull of the potential difference sway them in another direction and an electron "wind" path is created. This is proof of the fiscal weight of electrons.
THE PUNCH LINE OR TRICK:
-----------------------------------
If we can make electrons "spin" in a certain direction and then move away the molecule that electron belongs to quick enough then, at least for a moment, that electron will remain spinning in its location due to the torque of spinning weight and therefore it will be free roaming - now give it a path to conduct to somewhere else and place your load in series with that path.
How do we move the molecule away fast enough? Short answer: Nuclear Acoustic Resonance (NAR). This happens when the fiscal structure containing the molecules starts to vibrate at IT's (structure) specific resonance. It is clear from the experimenting and devices/circuits being constructed in this forum, in this thread that you are close. BUT remember it is a needle in a haystack - finding it is not easy, but it IS possible.
SUMMERY:
Achieve NMR perpendicular to NAR and create a conducting path (with your load in series) for the free roaming electrons. HOW: A ferrite core is a structure that contains metal that can vibrate/resonate fiscally and it contains loosely spinning electrons that can be spun in a certain direction by applying a magnetic field of the right strength.
It should be noted that these devices will not last forever, BUT they are a gazilion times better than any known battery process. Now you have concrete known processes to follow and use to achieve electron harvesting. Hope I have helped you out of the darkness :)
The capetonian
@ all
I'm very sorry for my mistake. ferrite cores resonance is in Mhz range, not in Ghz. It's to be right 1 - 3,5 Mhz
Here is some fuel for our solid state fire: http://www.google.com/patents/US20110044419
The capetonian
there is what we see on Akula's scope:
TK said:
QuoteI made a bobbin using a brass tube for the center and a couple of plastic discs for the ends. The tube fits nicely over the ferrite core.
You might want to consider that the brass tube bobbin will act as a low ohmic shorted turn and soak up a lot of your switchers energy. It will need a vertical slot to avoid this. Best to use something non-metallic to avoid this and eddy losses.
(old switchmode designer)
Quote from: magpwr on April 27, 2014, 06:11:35 PM
hi scratchrobot,
...
Do reveal to us if your replication is a success since you have the exact same Russian made ferrite pot core.
I have read this somewhere in internet it looks some of the old soviet made ferrite core are irradiated as part of the manufacturing process."Sorry i am unable to validate if this is true".
I am just thinking if this irradiation process do play a important "OU" role from the particular Russian Yoke to this recent ferrite pot core. ;)
...
---
I really am talking quite outside my area of expertise. But nuclear irradiation per sei is a valid manufacturing process,
I think going by the name of "activation". One common product I know is activated is heat-shrink-tubing. I believe
florescent light & CRT phosphors are activated, and maybe piezo elements. It may be that only "select personnel"
would know what is actually going on in an activation manufacturing step.
It's important to remember that only *Neutron radiation* makes normal materials radioactive through
neutron synthesis. Other form of radiation won't and might be useful for other reasons in modifying material
characteristics. I believe it is fairly easy to intentionally filter out most neutrons from an activation beam.
One important reason for activating plastic is changing the chemical cross linking pattern of it. So if plastic is
included in the construction of a fly-back transformer it could very well be that they are using irradiation to
modify it. The inside of a TV CRT support circuit is a nasty location because high voltage present creates
ozone, a highly reactive chemical and the HV field present cause other chemicals from the air to condense
there. So I would expect that they maybe trying to get a leg up by hardening plastic in a way it will eventually
experience within the TV circuit. But I would probably consider neutron activation of components irresponsible.
Remember too before we had semiconductors, we had 0A2 vacuum high voltage rectifier tubes apparently a
potent source of x-rays operating in that same circuit. So long live, LCD's Liquid Crystal Displays.
:S:MarkSCoffman
Quote from: Vortex1 on April 28, 2014, 08:50:17 AM
TK said:
You might want to consider that the brass tube bobbin will act as a low ohmic shorted turn and soak up a lot of your switchers energy. It will need a vertical slot to avoid this. Best to use something non-metallic to avoid this and eddy losses.
(old switchmode designer)
Yes, I know. Don't the specified foils in Akula's coils also have this effect? I think they are continuous wraps all the way around.
I reasoned that the specific material (copper) is likely a small Red Herring, just a minnow, but the known electrical properties should be approximated if possible, so I simply used the brass tube as a substitute, performing dual function of physical support and electrically connected "copper foil". Since I don't have any copper foil or tape in stock at the moment. For the other "foil" I used aluminum duct tape. But I'm told I have it connected incorrectly. Strange, considering my scopeshots.
Do we really think that these foils are the key to keeping the LEDs lit when the power is disconnected? Slot, eddys, or not?
I have learned a lot from my experimentation over the past day, and having slept on it, I am starting to come to some conclusions that might not be obvious to people who are only theorizing about things like magic radioactive Soviet ferrites without actually having done any comparison testing.
For example.... mull on this. In my apparatus the bursts of oscillations from the MC34063 chip are creating the sinusoid from the transistor side, by transformer action .... not the other way around, as I thought at first. When the chip is precisely tuned, it picks up ambient LF EM and makes rail-to-rail noise bursts, which override the chip's normal nicely rectangular pulsetrain output. This rail-to-rail noise is transformed by the coils into a sinusoidal response which is amplified somewhat by the transistor. There is a complicated feedback relationship, but the result is easy to confirm... once you have the burst oscillations and the sinusoid established by careful tuning of the trimpot, you can _remove the core_ from the coil set (or I can, anyway)... and you can then, by carefully re-tuning.... re-establish the exact same burst oscillations from the 34063 but of course now there won't be any, or very little, transformer effect so there won't be a sinusoid and the transistor or mosfet won't switch.
At the moment I am certain that my apparatus is responding to the mains powerline LF EM when precisely tuned. Sure, this is a "resonant" effect. But not having to do with the core, since it can happen without the core at all! The question then becomes, what in Akula's environment makes the 270 Hz LF EM that his circuit seems to be responding to? I am 99 percent sure that his board is also picking up and responding to ambient EM in this manner. This isn't the secret to keeping the LEDs lit after removing the obvious power wires, though! At least I see no way for this behaviour to couple power into the capacitors so that the chips and LEDs will keep running when the primary power is removed.
Quote from: tysb3 on April 28, 2014, 07:45:03 AM
there is what we see on Akula's scope:
I think you are wrong. The burst oscillations from the MC34063 chip can be made very easily _with no core at all_ in the coil set.
I just now generated the scopeshot below, by completely removing the core and placing it on the other side of the table from the coil set, and slightly -- very slightly -- retuning the trimpot (which is a 20-turn trimmer, and only needs to be turned 1/16th of a turn or less).
My ambient EM is at my mains frequency of 60 Hz. Akula's circuit is picking up and responding to something in his environment that is making the 270 Hz signal that the 34063 is responding to.
Quote from: tysb3 on April 27, 2014, 07:55:21 PM
@ TinselKoala (http://www.overunity.com/profile/tinselkoala.13644/)you are trying to get money from the bank but you don't know where they are. you are trying unlock every doors even toilets doors. you are still too far from the safes doors and you don't know the code of its.
you need to know what Akula was speaking in last conference on the skype:
http://webfile.ru/63bd3cd22caa0cb0343e3c0c52158678 (http://webfile.ru/63bd3cd22caa0cb0343e3c0c52158678)
Please save it and try to translate, it contains important information.
Isn't that where he admits that he couldn't reproduce the "self running" effect outside his laboratory?
I think I probably know more about this specific circuit than you do. Since most of what you have posted is wrong. GigaHz resonance? Give me a break. None of Akula's constructions are capable of doing anything coherent at such high frequencies, so I think that you don't know what you are talking about.
Quote from: hartiberlin on April 27, 2014, 10:34:28 PM
You can actually hear the resonance in his circuit and it is probably such
a dimensional resonance as it is spoken in this Ferrite core PDF file that was just posted..
I just read it.
TK also has such a MnZi core with its low resistance of 50 Ohms/1cm.
These also have these dimensional resonance effects, so the core
is probably right...
Well, maybe you can tell us exactly what Akula said in this Online session ?
in the used circuit, which is a really strange switching circuit
http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/137522/ (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/137522/)
the lower sine frequency comes probably from the secondary coil with the 100 uF
as LC tank which pulls down the supply voltage via the Q3 MOSFET and thus
switching on and off the DC2DC converter chip MC34063.
No, I no longer think this is how it is working. The sinus is created by the oscillation/noise bursts, not the other way around. Please see my earlier posts and the #11 scopeshot above.
Quote
Maybe he made an error and wanted to have the the DC2DC chip running
all the time...
As the ferrite core rings at around 8 Khz probably the spike frequency is around
this 8 Khz frequency with this low sine wave modulation or better said chopping it...
In this video he shows the scope shots:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lpx1SJdXnmo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lpx1SJdXnmo)
I wonder why TK does not have the underlayed sine wave, where the spikes occur on the yellow channel....
Maybe he must avoid full dimensional resonance that shatters the core sooner or later ??
So he tries to change the spike frequency around the resonance frequency like a FM modulation ?
Regards, Stefan.
Didn't you see all the scopeshots I've posted? The underlying sine wave should be clear to you in this scopeshot. Whether it is there or not depends on the pot setting.
At the very beginning of that video that Stefan linked above, you can see that he has the scope probe leads looped around the light fixture which is very close to the scope and the circuit under test. Is that a CFL in that fixture, I wonder....
:-\
what is the high voltage lines frequency in that area? 270Hz does not seem divisible by 50 evenly. I am not a high voltage Line man or engineer thus someone with knowledge in this area would be a help. Comments?
Quote from: starcruiser on April 28, 2014, 10:40:42 AM
what is the high voltage lines frequency in that area? 270Hz does not seem divisible by 50 evenly. I am not a high voltage Line man or engineer thus someone with knowledge in this area would be a help. Comments?
The ~270 Hz figure is calculated by Akula's scope and it also corresponds to reading the trace by eye and doing the math. But it could be a result of a harmonic of a slightly fluctuating mains frequency of about 50 Hz... maybe. Or the nearby CFL (if that's what it is) could be making some subharmonic of its oscillation frequency. I just can't tell unless I can duplicate the frequency as well as the general waveshape.
My circuit behaves like a very sensitive EM detector of sorts. I injected a 270 Hz positive squarewave pulsetrain at the inverter pin 13 input, using a FG, and got the following result. The squarish pulses are the "normal" output of the MC34063 and I think their width depends on the inductance of the coil half that is connected to the chip: less inductance, narrower pulses I think.
I'm working on another coil bobbin that will have inductances in the 30-60 microHenry range instead of the large milliHenry inductances I'm now using. Later this afternoon I should have some results from those.
Quote from: Vortex1 on April 28, 2014, 08:50:17 AM
TK said:
You might want to consider that the brass tube bobbin will act as a low ohmic shorted turn and soak up a lot of your switchers energy. It will need a vertical slot to avoid this. Best to use something non-metallic to avoid this and eddy losses.
(old switchmode designer)
I join the Vortex1 post :)
According to me this the yellow brass tube, secondary coil,, short-circuit with encumber the sign reduces the circle goodness of the transformer , PP and the lane width....
It will need a long slot to 1mm width avoid this
,, yellow brass tube to is ground wire,,
Excuse me for the bad English :(
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 28, 2014, 12:57:06 PM
The ~270 Hz figure is calculated by Akula's scope and it also corresponds to reading the trace by eye and doing the math. But it could be a result of a harmonic of a slightly fluctuating mains frequency of about 50 Hz... maybe. Or the nearby CFL (if that's what it is) could be making some subharmonic of its oscillation frequency. I just can't tell unless I can duplicate the frequency as well as the general waveshape.
My circuit behaves like a very sensitive EM detector of sorts. I injected a 270 Hz positive squarewave pulsetrain at the inverter pin 13 input, using a FG, and got the following result. The squarish pulses are the "normal" output of the MC34063 and I think their width depends on the inductance of the coil half that is connected to the chip: less inductance, narrower pulses I think.
I'm working on another coil bobbin that will have inductances in the 30-60 microHenry range instead of the large milliHenry inductances I'm now using. Later this afternoon I should have some results from those.
Cool TK, looking forward to your results.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 28, 2014, 09:53:31 AM
Yes, I know. Don't the specified foils in Akula's coils also have this effect? I think they are continuous wraps all the way around.
They're not; they are all gapped...
... much like the copper tube with a slit in several kapandaze gens
Well, OK, I'll put a slot in the next ones then, but I think you are having a problem because my waveforms sure do look a lot like his, even without a slot.
Is anyone willing to predict an observable difference, with and without slot? Because I have enough wire and brass tubing to make identical coils, one with and one without slot, for actual experimental comparison in this system ... something I'll bet you have never done. I'm not saying there is no effect, because obviously... I have not yet done the experiment. But I'll bet my next paycheck on this: the slot won't make the LEDs stay on after the power is removed.
Meanwhile, here's a short video where I try to explain the 'embedded sinus' waveform that appears and disappears in the MC34063 Pin 1 output signal.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBQwAlm-ryM
I switched the inductances around because the converter chip seems to like the larger inductance rather than the smaller one. In fact I should mention that I made a coil of about 600 microHenry and the chip didn't like it, drew 500 mA and heated up. But of course I didn't have a slot. Do you think that made a difference? I dunno. So I'm going to try 5.7 milliHenry next. With and without a slot.
Quote from: starcruiser on April 28, 2014, 02:51:36 PM
Cool TK, looking forward to your results.
My results on that are that the chip doesn't like very small inductances, evidently, and it's even really hard to make coils that low on the ferrite I'm using anyway. But this is not the final word on small inductances yet.
I'm willing to try just about anything.
Slotted bobbin:
I think it was either Itsu or Hoppy that tried tests with and without the "magic capacitive copper band" and saw NO DIFFERENCE.
It was a thrill for me to see someone made a proper A-B comparison test like that.
IMHO the copper band is all part of the "secret sauce" not for the possible over unity, but to DRAW PEOPLE IN - A HOOK.
The real vortex technology in action. (Try listening to "I Want You Back" and "ABC" by the Jackson 5.)
Yep, thanks for that reference MH. Special pleading, post hockery unless demonstrated otherwise.
Nevertheless I am proceeding forthwith.
The inner winding: One layer of #27 on the slotted brass tube, black wire connected to tube and start of winding, yellow wire connected to slotted outer foil and end of winding. With and without closed ferrite inserted (still has very thin mica original spacer in the square part). Gapped ferrite will come in somewhere between these values.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 28, 2014, 09:25:26 PM
Yep, thanks for that reference MH. Special pleading, post hockery unless demonstrated otherwise.
Nevertheless I am proceeding forthwith.
The inner winding: One layer of #27 on the slotted brass tube, black wire connected to tube and start of winding, yellow wire connected to slotted outer foil and end of winding. With and without closed ferrite inserted (still has very thin mica original spacer in the square part). Gapped ferrite will come in somewhere between these values.
that's on 2mH? (the glare on the scale is kinda bad )
Nitpick; the foil winding is the outside winding.... (the other coil is under it... ) also I think maybe the side /direction of that winding matters...
the outside foil should be essentially opposite the wire windings from the connecting point to the other side... the inner side should be essentially a continuation of the winding... so both the outside and inside foils are connected on the same edge relative to their gap (if it's the left side of the gap on the bottom, it's the left side of the gap on the top)
foil - coil connected to foil's - coil - foil
Quote from: d3x0r on April 28, 2014, 10:02:18 PM
that's on 2mH? (the glare on the scale is kinda bad )
The readings are in milliHenry.
Quote
Nitpick; the foil winding is the outside winding.... (the other coil is under it... ) also I think maybe the side /direction of that winding matters...
the outside foil should be essentially opposite the wire windings from the connecting point to the other side... the inner side should be essentially a continuation of the winding... so both the outside and inside foils are connected on the same edge relative to their gap (if it's the left side of the gap on the bottom, it's the left side of the gap on the top)
Yeah.... riiiight. We are not working with microwave gigahertz technology here.
I did get the gaps opposite one another, does that excite you at all?
Quote
foil - coil connected to foil's - coil - foil
That's not what somebody else said. I wish you lot would make up your minds.
Anyhow, here's the completed coil, outer winding:
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 28, 2014, 10:35:34 PM
The readings are in milliHenry.
Yeah.... riiiight. We are not working with microwave gigahertz technology here.
I did get the gaps opposite one another, does that excite you at all?
That's not what somebody else said. I wish you lot would make up your minds.
Anyhow, here's the completed coil, outer winding:
ya; don't know how obvious it could be to remove the outer foil first then the first coil unwind..
I'm not sure why Ghz tech is mentioned...
I'm just saying, the current is going to flow clockwise and counterclockwise in the foil windings... so the attachment on one side of the gap or the other is going to be opposite polarity
In regards to coil turns, when Akula dismantles the coil he appears to remove off fairly equal lengths of wire with each pull. The count for the first winding is 23 lengths and 26 for the second winding.
Edit: I have now tried new software and the probe does appear to be connected.
I don't know but is not working.
In my device , primary of the transformer is 22,7 mH and secondary is 7,9-8 mH.
I used one copper foil with 2-3mm gap on start and one to the end.
The size of the gap will seriously affect the inductance, but in a flyback converter is essential to allow a quick reset of the remanence flux for the next cycle to operate without getting into saturation, which will waste a lot of energy. Without a proper gap, remanence will build over several cycles until the core goes into saturation. Current then goes way up and power thruput diminishes.
It is a balancing act between required inductance, frequency of operation, gap size etc.
Best to use a current shunt resistor 0.1 ohm in series with the inductor and observe the current ramp. Any sudden upturn at the end of the current ramp indicates saturation so either gap too small, frequency too low, or inductance too low.
Careful design of a switchmode converter requires critical adjustment of these parameters. Most designers choose an operating frequency then adjust the other parameters for best efficiency while additionally considering the power thruput desired.
I know this is not a normal design, but it is best to study the fundamentals of flyback switchmode design to avoid much hunting in the dark, and have a better overall understanding of how the core/inductor actually functions in such a design. It is not a normal transformer action.
I'm happy to see the slot was put in the brass tube. Pushing any serious power without the slot would cause severe heating / meltdown of such an induction furnace.
Regards, Vortex1
aka ION from OverunityResearch
Quote from: Hoppy on April 29, 2014, 03:24:49 AM
In regards to coil turns, when Akula dismantles the coil he appears to remove off fairly equal lengths of wire with each pull. The count for the first winding is 23 lengths and 26 for the second winding.
Edit: I have now tried new software and the probe does appear to be connected.
the inner coil will have a smaller average diameter and be a lower inductance also... but 23 lengths is more turns on a smaller diameter.... (no help I know)
Quote from: d3x0r on April 28, 2014, 10:02:18 PM
that's on 2mH? (the glare on the scale is kinda bad )
Nitpick; the foil winding is the outside winding.... (the other coil is under it... ) also I think maybe the side /direction of that winding matters...
the outside foil should be essentially opposite the wire windings from the connecting point to the other side... the inner side should be essentially a continuation of the winding... so both the outside and inside foils are connected on the same edge relative to their gap (if it's the left side of the gap on the bottom, it's the left side of the gap on the top)
foil - coil connected to foil's - coil - foil
All right, I have remade the coil to conform as best as I can to these specifications.
What high power are we talking about? If anyone can make a one-watt induction furnace I'd like to see it melt something. The very most power I have seen in this circuit is 3 volts at 500 mA DC and at that, the MC34063 chip runs hot. Nothing else gets even perceptibly warm, ever.
Reading is in milliHenry as usual.
And here are a couple of representative screenshots.
I determined last night that the BUZ11A mosfet doesn't really switch properly, even when the strong sinusoid from Pin 13 is present. To see if the transistor or mosfet is actually switching, you need to monitor the Collector or Drain signal, it's the only way to be sure. I say again: the noise bursts are causing the signal to the inverter which results in the transistor switching, not the other way around. There is feedback to be sure, but it does not seem to be the case that the DC-DC converter chip is responding to being pulled down when the mosfet switches... because my mosfet wasn't switching.
However the TIP3055 does switch properly, as you can see from the scopeshot below showing the collector (inverted) trace.
Note that I am now at 1 ms/div horizontally and the sinus oscillations are in the ballpark of the signal on Akula's screen. It's not stable for me, though, and I have some hypotheses about that, such as my lack of a nearby source that is singing at that frequency.
(These are made with the inner, smaller inductance on the transistor side and the larger on the 340963 side.)
ETA: Disregard the numbers in the "measurement" box.... they are using the entire buffer, I forgot to reset it to just use between cursors. So the measurements are including lots of time of unstable waveforms or even non-oscillating blanks. Please just read the traces themselves using the channel voltage setting and timebase. Sorry about that!
ETA2: I am happy to report that the circuit does not respond any more to the 60 Hz mains frequency. So going to the smaller inductances might have been a right guess.
inductance
http://youtu.be/zvVJH-Py39c (http://youtu.be/zvVJH-Py39c)
Quote from: scratchrobot on April 29, 2014, 11:45:55 AM
inductance
http://youtu.be/zvVJH-Py39c (http://youtu.be/zvVJH-Py39c)
Yep, that's what ferrite cores do.
And the gap in the core halves fitting together is usually done to prevent the core from saturating, and it can also be used to regulate inductance as you are showing, in a limited range. Vary inductance and you vary resonant frequency, naturally. A mechanical vibration will cause the inductance to change in synch, so there can be feedback between the mechanical and electrical "vibrations" in the transformator.
You must have a lot of wire on that little coil former.
Quote from: Hoppy on April 29, 2014, 03:24:49 AM
In regards to coil turns, when Akula dismantles the coil he appears to remove off fairly equal lengths of wire with each pull. The count for the first winding is 23 lengths and 26 for the second winding.
Edit: I have now tried new software and the probe does appear to be connected.
hi Hoppy,
I do notice the same thing related to some similarity in term of winding between primary and secondary.Taking the width of around 22awg per strand of magnet wire.It look like it's around 60turns give or take.
But there is always a small catch.Base on one of my quick experiment done few months ago to verify inductance reading base on "1 turn /1 loop" around various ferrite &iron powder core which also included my most expensive "nanocrystalline core"
I find that even for 1 wire loop inductance test on various core the uH reading differs a lot.Fyi only-The nanocrystalline core did produce the highest reading for 1 loop test at 44uH.
Now lets get back to the topic-If we want to achieve a particular uH reading since all of us around the world would likely be using various types of pot core or flyback core."
The number of
turns applied for me or anyone to achieve a particular uH or mH reading cannot be applied for another person whom is using another type of core."This is a fact"
If Akula is using 50 turns estimate on 2000nm pot core to achieve the required uH reading .We can't follow the same number of turns unless we do have the same set of core.But we can alter winding to get the required uH or mH reading.
---------------------------------------
Latest update-
It seems i have missed the delivery of the 4.7cm pot core which i would need to collect from post office tomorrow.But i don't have copper foil in hand yet at this moment.
--------------------------------------
Latest discovery related to my
experimental Don smith device(Not due for video release until i increase input voltage by around 5 fold to my 3meter oxygen free 5 turn 8AWG primary cable) after getting the long waited 2000volt capacitors which i also need to connect in series and parallel formation to support higher voltage."2KV Capacitors are already getting warm at mere 60volts to primary."
There is interference to my portable "digital FM radio" located around 4 meters away only once i hit resonance besides the bulb getting brighter at secondary."The reception became bad that i can barely hear music being played from radio"
I then recall base on Chinese forum link found on page 260 of PJKbook.
This word as found in Chinese forum would be of interest for some of us related to resonance on how it works"Yes some are my own connecting words just to make more sense".
It goes something like imagine knocking on the bowl constantly at the right timing
the frequency/ringing of bowl would increase and increase.But If we knock on the bowl too soon or too late after the previous knock it won't work."It would hinder the acceleration of ringing frequency"
"Remember the knocking is done in low frequency <12hz but the end result produced is high frequency" Similar to current 3v ou light device ....
For Don smith device the applied frequency base on their experiment is around 210khz...230khz to primary.But at resonance for the team it went up to Mhz range 50Mhz.
For my case at this point it's just 172khz base on 5 turns uH reading 2.65uH and induction capacitor 0.3x uf ,due to existing IGBT limitations."It's already causing unexpected interference on the FM band"
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 29, 2014, 11:43:55 AM
And here are a couple of representative screenshots.
I determined last night that the BUZ11A mosfet doesn't really switch properly, even when the strong sinusoid from Pin 13 is present. To see if the transistor or mosfet is actually switching, you need to monitor the Collector or Drain signal, it's the only way to be sure. I say again: the noise bursts are causing the signal to the inverter which results in the transistor switching, not the other way around. There is feedback to be sure, but it does not seem to be the case that the DC-DC converter chip is responding to being pulled down when the mosfet switches... because my mosfet wasn't switching.
However the TIP3055 does switch properly, as you can see from the scopeshot below showing the collector (inverted) trace.
Note that I am now at 1 ms/div horizontally and the sinus oscillations are in the ballpark of the signal on Akula's screen. It's not stable for me, though, and I have some hypotheses about that, such as my lack of a nearby source that is singing at that frequency.
(These are made with the inner, smaller inductance on the transistor side and the larger on the 340963 side.)
ETA: Disregard the numbers in the "measurement" box.... they are using the entire buffer, I forgot to reset it to just use between cursors. So the measurements are including lots of time of unstable waveforms or even non-oscillating blanks. Please just read the traces themselves using the channel voltage setting and timebase. Sorry about that!
TK,
I don't understand the purpose inverter section. Even when the MOSFET or transistor is turned on, it seems all it would do is apply an additional 200R load to the supply rail.
Also, keep in mind that CMOS inputs typically have input overvoltage protection. Typically these are diodes or "pseudo" diodes made from additional CMOS elements. Normally these diodes turn on at .5-.6V below ground or above Vcc. Many of the input protect schemes do incorporate an internal resistance for current limiting when the diodes turn on, but the actual circuit topology used can vary between manufacturers. I believe this is why you noted a difference in behavior with a different mfg device.
In one of your first videos on this circuit, as you increased the FG input to the inverter and the P-P V of the FG exceeded the rail, you can see the rail increase on the peaks as the input diodes begin to conduct. At least that is what it looked like to me.
PW
Here's a comparison between the Collector of the TIP3055 and the Pin13 input signal to the 4069 inverter stage. The collector trace is High, at the supply voltage, when the transistor is OFF and drops to near the zero baseline when the transistor is ON and carrying current from collector to emitter. Neither trace is inverted.
And here I've take out the TIP3055 and replaced the BUZ11A mosfet. I've made no adjustments, not even tweaking the pot.
You can see that the Drain voltage remains at the supply voltage of 3 volts or just under, and barely moves when the large amplitude sinus happens on the input to the inverter. So the positive rail cannot be being pulled down to make the bursts to make the sinusoid.... it is the other way around. The sinus is the "input" from the bursts which make the sinus in the transformer, which then switches the transistor. The bursts and sinus occur whether or not the transistor or mosfet is switching, though, so pulling down the positive rail can't be the cause. At least that's how I'm thinking at the moment.
Quote from: picowatt on April 29, 2014, 12:31:26 PM
TK,
I don't understand the purpose inverter section. Even when the MOSFET or transistor is turned on, it seems all it would do is apply an additional 200R load to the supply rail.
Also, keep in mind that CMOS inputs typically have input overvoltage protection. Typically these are diodes or "pseudo" diodes made from additional CMOS elements. Normally these diodes turn on at .5-.6V below ground or above Vcc. Many of the input protect schemes do incorporate an internal resistance for current limiting when the diodes turn on, but the actual circuit topology used can vary between manufacturers. I believe this is why you noted a difference in behavior with a different mfg device.
In one of your first videos on this circuit, as you increased the FG input to the inverter and the P-P V of the FG exceeded the rail, you can see the rail increase on the peaks as the input diodes begin to conduct. At least that is what it looked like to me.
PW
The purpose of the inverter section is to act as a Red Herring. There is another one of Akula's miracle versions that only uses the 34063, no inverter. And as I show in the scopeshot above, it is unlikely that any mosfet would actually switch. So the whole thing actually has zero function if a mosfet is used. The TIP3055 does work though.... but does it have a material effect on the operation of the device? Not that I can tell. The LEDs still dim and go out in a few seconds after the power is removed. Duh.
I've lost count of how many different devices and schematics he's published. It's like LMM on methamphetamine, good thing I can't read Russian.
Yes, I agree with your analysis of the inverter functioning.
Thanks for looking and posting, I really appreciate your insights and thoughts on this matter.
@magpwr:
You are right about turns vs. inductance. The way I do it is empirically. I wind a few turns onto the form and then strip off a tiny bit of insulation from the wire and take an inductance reading. Then I know, ballpark, my own particular microH/turn ratio, so I can wind some more turns, then check inductance again, until I get to the desired inductance. In that last coil outer winding I was shooting for 5.7 mH and wound up with about 5.9 mH, not bad for an amateur. I couldn't even tell you how many turns, less than 150 but more than 100 probably.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 29, 2014, 01:25:48 PM
The purpose of the inverter section is to act as a Red Herring. There is another one of Akula's miracle versions that only uses the 34063, no inverter. And as I show in the scopeshot above, it is unlikely that any mosfet would actually switch. So the whole thing actually has zero function if a mosfet is used. The TIP3055 does work though.... but does it have a material effect on the operation of the device? Not that I can tell. The LEDs still dim and go out in a few seconds after the power is removed. Duh.
I've lost count of how many different devices and schematics he's published. It's like LMM on methamphetamine, good thing I can't read Russian.
Yes, I agree with your analysis of the inverter functioning.
Thanks for looking and posting, I really appreciate your insights and thoughts on this matter.
TK,
I see R3 is a 100R not a 200R, so I should have said that even if/when the MOSFET/transistor does turn on, it only appears to apply an additional 100R load to the rail. I am, however, surprised that the sine wave gets through with C5 installed (assuming I am looking at the correct schematic).
PW.
IF YOU NEED COPPER FOIL TAPE:
I have found some copper foil tape at my local hardware store in the gardening section. It seems snails don't like copper so if you put some copper tape around your pot plant they keep away. I say let the snails feast, we've got something better to do with copper foil tape :D
PS: You may have missed my post 298 and 300 on this thread. I hope admin is quick with this one :-\
Quote from: dewetw on April 29, 2014, 04:27:18 PM
IF YOU NEED COPPER FOIL TAPE:
I have found some copper foil tape at my local hardware store in the gardening section. It seems snails don't like copper so if you put some copper tape around your pot plant they keep away. I say let the snails feast, we've got something better to do with copper foil tape :D
PS: You may have missed my post 298 and 300 on this thread. I hope admin is quick with this one :-\
Good idea. Also, craft stores sell it in their stained glass section. I got some there for making circuit board traces.
Bill
Quote from: dewetw on April 29, 2014, 04:27:18 PM
IF YOU NEED COPPER FOIL TAPE:
I have found some copper foil tape at my local hardware store in the gardening section. It seems snails don't like copper so if you put some copper tape around your pot plant they keep away. I say let the snails feast, we've got something better to do with copper foil tape :D
Thanks for the tip. Yes, I know about snail repellent and also about stained glass copper foil. I'm working on a very tight budget and I already have a big roll of aluminum duct tape, and some brass tubing of the ideal size for a bobbin for the flyback core. I'll be happy to review any empirical reports you have that show an Akula device running on copper foil, but another identical one not running on aluminum foil.
Quote
PS: You may have missed my post 298 and 300 on this thread. I hope admin is quick with this one :-\
I didn't miss the post of the patent concerning Cold Fusion ignited by Nuclear Acoustic Resonance.... it was very amusing. I generally prefer the SF pulp magazines like Analog and SF&F, but occasionally the USPTO does publish a good one.
And the other post concerning your explanation and theories of operation are also very amusing. But you seem to be missing an important point. It does not matter what your theory is, how smart you are or how beautiful your mathematics. If it doesn't agree with experiment, it's wrong. (Apologies to Richard Feynman.) What "we" or at least I am doing here is examining a claim that a particular device behaves in a certain manner. This device is constructed of COTS (commercial off the shelf) parts and enough information has been presented about its construction and operation that any person "skilled in the art" should be able to build one and duplicate the results. There is no unusual theory or explanation required or demanded, and unnecessary speculation and even _wrong_ theoretical ideas are not very helpful, in my opinion. If you bake a cake according to a recipe, no theory of ovens or cakes is required, the recipe either produces an edible cake without burning the house down... or it doesn't. If it doesn't, and you've not done something stupid like failing to cut slits in your foils ... then there is something wrong with the recipe. Maybe you've got a recipe for a tuna casserole, thinking it's a cake. Not going to get a chocolate cake from that! Even though it's a good recipe. Or maybe the recipe doesn't make anything at all, like so many we see here. At least Akula's recipe is making something!
(Using the mass of the electron in an attempt to explain the S-shape of the plasma channel between two HV electrodes.... that was great, really enlightening. Are you a CRT designer, I wonder? Have you done much work with high voltage apparatus, plasma streams, corona discharge, static electricity? I'd love to hear about it.)
In this case.... no cake so far. Nuclear Acoustic Resonance hitting the wrong note in my apparatus, preventing the LEDs from operating? Great, please provide some empirical support for that conclusion. Secret irradiated Soviet ferrites necessary? Great, send me a set, and I'll do what apparently nobody else has actually done: I'll test them side by side with fake Chinese ferrites in the same apparatus, and we shall see what difference the irradiation makes.
/sarcastic rant
:P
Quote from: picowatt on April 29, 2014, 01:38:14 PM
TK,
I see R3 is a 100R not a 200R, so I should have said that even if/when the MOSFET/transistor does turn on, it only appears to apply an additional 100R load to the rail. I am, however, surprised that the sine wave gets through with C5 installed (assuming I am looking at the correct schematic).
PW.
I've lifted that C5 cap several times to see the effect on operation, and it appears to be necessary to see the sine wave. Without it I just get big noise spikes everywhere, no coherent patterns that I can tell.
The schematic I'm using, with my current changes, is attached below.
What is the result? LEDs are lit without 3v power?
TK:
I hear your rant. It gives a good idea of the approach to the problem. I.t.o. backing cakes don't you need the correct recipe? Correct ingredients? Maybe get on a plane and go see Akula (who's name is Roman and has dark slightly curly hair, roundish face with green tinted brown eyes, not the tallest guy either, about 25 - 28 years of age).
ALL:
Something to experiment with, no promises tho, and yes I have practically done this. Put two coils on the ferrite. One across each joint of the ferrite . Create an air gap on one side BUT no gap on the other side by tilting the one half. The coil on the gaped side is your driving coil, the other is the receiver. Play with the applied frequency. Drive it with a balanced wave (aka pos swing = neg swing), square wave works well. E-cores also work, the drive coil can be on the middle or outer arm, receiver on the outer. Since it is an interruption of conductance of resonant flux effect the amount of flux is determined by the load matching and the air gap. It is like a Joule ringer with much less turns on the output and can be tuned by the air gap.
I have another project that I am working on and the business to run so might not get over here as often as I'd like.
Have fun!
PS: Tip for NAR - modulate one frequency onto another. One for magnetic resonance and one for acoustic resonance. That is why you see two waves on akula's scope. Also, the core material does play a big role. You can make your own ferrites. But I don't think this is the correct thread for that. Good luck with of the shelf - unless you are an old russian. Unit then, check out this guy (best science guy on youtube, well in my oppion): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSZGUV8D19I
The capetonian
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 29, 2014, 10:37:42 PM
I've lifted that C5 cap several times to see the effect on operation, and it appears to be necessary to see the sine wave. Without it I just get big noise spikes everywhere, no coherent patterns that I can tell.
The schematic I'm using, with my current changes, is attached below.
hi TinselKoala,
It looks like you are following the Akula variation.Have you considered implementing resistor in series with Led(Limit current to led) and discharge resistor(around 560...3.3k ) connected in parallel with C5 100uf to ensure the sine wave looks like nice sine wave. :)
-----------------------------------
Finally received the 4.7cm diameter Ferrite pot core as attached after waiting for nearly one month.Now i shall patiently wait for copper foil to magically appear at my door step. :D
Hi TinselKoala,
Do you have the time to test your circuit according to the attached circuit?
GL.
Quote from: Groundloop on April 30, 2014, 08:08:25 AM
Hi TinselKoala,
Do you have the time to test your circuit according to the attached circuit?
GL.
Yes, I have time and that test is on my schedule, already anticipated. ;)
Thanks for your work on the other circuit schematic by the way, I'll be starting a build on that one later this afternoon.
Meanwhile, I've cleaned up a few discrepancies and am now able to get a much more stable performance over a wider "tuning" range. Here's a shot of the current performance. This is at 3.0 V, about 70 mA input. (Since this is a pwm circuit, the current draw is set by the tuning and can go anywhere from zero (with LEDs dark) to around 400 mA with brilliant LEDs (no burst oscillations)).
Unfortunately the LEDs still fade out over a couple of seconds when the input power is removed.
ETA: I removed the 2.2 pF cap across the R2.
Quote from: magpwr on April 30, 2014, 05:56:29 AM
hi TinselKoala,
It looks like you are following the Akula variation.Have you considered implementing resistor in series with Led(Limit current to led) and discharge resistor(around 560...3.3k ) connected in parallel with C5 100uf to ensure the sine wave looks like nice sine wave. :)
-----------------------------------
Finally received the 4.7cm diameter Ferrite pot core as attached after waiting for nearly one month.Now i shall patiently wait for copper foil to magically appear at my door step. :D
No, I hadn't considered it, but now I will. Thanks for the suggestions.
ETA: Bridging the C5 with reasonable resistance values had no real effect that I could tell. But adding a 100R at the cathode end of the LED string to ground did help to stabilise the envelope! Thanks for that suggestion. It added a little current but made the burst oscillation/sinus waveforms a lot more stable, actually. Thanks again!
Unfortunately... the LEDs still dim and go out when the power is removed.
@all
Very sorry for interjecting here. Just wanted to know if you guys are having any trouble getting to page 69 on the Akula 30 thread. Hmmmmmmmmm. All other pages are fine except the last page 69. Maybe the number says it all. hahaha
While I'm at it, as some are working this circuit, please take a known object on the circuit, get its dimensions, then extrapolated the dimensions of the ccore Akula is using. Very important to do now.
wattsup
Quote from: conico on April 30, 2014, 02:17:10 AM
What is the result? LEDs are lit without 3v power?
Not for me. Only for Akula, in Akula's laboratory.
"yet"
:P
Acording what akula about 1W lantern 2 (with supply) and 3 (without supply) one frenquency is 4-7 herc and duty cycle 50 precents, other frenquency is 400-460 herc. But ferroresonance frenquency can be higher, for example 1.6 megaherc. So duty cycle of 400 kiloherc, let say, frenquency must be 12 precents.
But inportant is fast closing one and other mosfet, to not make mistakes, better use wery fast closing one and other mosfet. Then we hear sound of 5-15 kiloherc in video, here is sound of mixed two frenquencies, how, something like that, explain Akula.
Quote from: wattsup on April 30, 2014, 10:51:33 AM
@all
Very sorry for interjecting here. Just wanted to know if you guys are having any trouble getting to page 69 on the Akula 30 thread. Hmmmmmmmmm. All other pages are fine except the last page 69. Maybe the number says it all. hahaha
It doesn't seem to be working for me either, I can't get to any pages there. Probably somebody posted a huge image or something.
Or the MiBs have gotten to it finally....
Quote
While I'm at it, as some are working this circuit, please take a known object on the circuit, get its dimensions, then extrapolated the dimensions of the ccore Akula is using. Very important to do now.
wattsup
Huh? Can you translate that into a language I might understand?
I am using a flyback transformer ferrite, made of two identical halves. The round part that goes inside the coil is 14.4 mm diameter and the square part outside the coil is 14.4 mm x 11.5 mm. The overall length when assembled is 62.8 mm and the width is 40.0 mm. It has the stock spacer glued to one face of the squareish part, mica I think, 0.33 mm thick, about. It's held together by a spring clip that fits into grooves in the outside surfaces of the squarish part. Right now I am using it without any extra spacers. I like it very much.
As far as I can tell this is not an irradiated Soviet ferrite. It measures 50 ohms/cm on the surface, contacted with point probes. I think it came from a Japanese TV set, Mitsubishi big screen, IIRC.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 30, 2014, 09:39:14 AM
No, I hadn't considered it, but now I will. Thanks for the suggestions.
ETA: Bridging the C5 with reasonable resistance values had no real effect that I could tell. But adding a 100R at the cathode end of the LED string to ground did help to stabilise the envelope! Thanks for that suggestion. It added a little current but made the burst oscillation/sinus waveforms a lot more stable, actually. Thanks again!
Unfortunately... the LEDs still dim and go out when the power is removed.
hi Tinselkoala,
It seems there is indeed improvement in your waveform. :)
Do try to ignore the 270hz ,as the core value used is different from Akula.If you force it to be even close the 270hz ,you might be compromising efficiency unknowingly.
I was hoping you used 220...330ohms in series with Led.But i think it's ok with 100 ohms. :-X
"blue Led do consume little more current than typical green or white led."
The high efficient green led i used in the original circuit connected to 4069 is 27kohms instead of 1kohms and yet i can see it's bright enough.The old green led purchased over 10years ago don't even come close."Pri objective was to lower circuit current draw before even receiving core or MC34063."
The shape of blue waveform near the top peak looks a little strange.I think i have seen this waveform before likely related to capacitor value 100uf or 1000uf which might be little high do try mixing capacitor eg:47uf+22uf=69uf or 47uf+47uf(low ESR this way) to observe the effect.
Hello All
Sorry Off topic:
Page 69 of akula0083-30-watt-self-running-generator doesn not open for me this morning...
Anyone else with same problem?
thanks
take care, peace
lost_bro
Quote from: MenofFather on April 30, 2014, 10:53:46 AM
Acording what akula about 1W lantern 2 (with supply) and 3 (without supply) one frenquency is 4-7 herc and duty cycle 50 precents, other frenquency is 400-460 herc. But ferroresonance frenquency can be higher, for example 1.6 megaherc. So duty cycle of 400 kiloherc, let say, frenquency must be 12 precents.
This is theory, not useful to me at present.
Quote
But inportant is fast closing one and other mosfet, to not make mistakes, better use wery fast closing one and other mosfet. Then we hear sound of 5-15 kiloherc in video, here is sound of mixed two frenquencies, how, something like that, explain Akula.
This is empirical fact, very useful. The configuration of the dual 494s in the circuit is arranged to produce this kind of "beating", that is the sound of mixed frequencies creating a third frequency from reinforcement and cancellation of the two input signals. Beat notes.
Now yesterday as I recall you were saying that only one of the mosfets needs the Miller clamp for fast shutoff. But now are you saying they both should have the clamp? It's a good thing I bought two PNP transistors, then....
But this thread is about a different circuit altogether. You are talking about the other circuit, with 2x TL494 and 2 mosfets. This thread is about the circuit using the MC34063 and the hex inverter chip, single mosfet (transistor).
@magpwr: At first I thought that the 270 Hz was due to the circuit picking up some stimulus from the environment. I still might think that, I'm not sure. But if it is, I clearly have the same stimulus in my environment here.
So it seems that you are saying that there is some property of the core, not related to inductance, that determines "efficiency" and that my core, being different.... even though it makes nearly identically the same frequency, same waveforms by using the same external component values.... only the pot setting could be different.... might need to be tuned to some other frequency to reach the necessary "efficiency" to keep the LEDs lit when power is removed?
Sorry, I don't buy that, it's hand-waving special pleading. Let's see some working device, from someone other than Akula, that uses this schematic, works at a different frequency and keeps the LEDs lit. That would be evidence. Or even.... send Akula a Japanese ferrite and let him show how it makes the LEDs stay on at a different frequency.
LOL.....
:P
@TK
About the core size, if you take any component on a photo like a mosfet that we know has x dimension, you can figure out the core dimension Akula is using. Your measurements are close to what I have as well but is it close to the one Akula is using.
I am saying this because yesterday when I received my ETD29 ecores for the AKula 30 device, I realized that this particular ecore, that others are using as well, is way to small. Even your ccore is at least twice the size. So just make sure the core sizes are comparable to the Akula device you are working on.
All the best.
wattsup
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 30, 2014, 11:08:16 AM
This is theory, not useful to me at present.
This is empirical fact, very useful. The configuration of the dual 494s in the circuit is arranged to produce this kind of "beating", that is the sound of mixed frequencies creating a third frequency from reinforcement and cancellation of the two input signals. Beat notes.
Now yesterday as I recall you were saying that only one of the mosfets needs the Miller clamp for fast shutoff. But now are you saying they both should have the clamp? It's a good thing I bought two PNP transistors, then....
But this thread is about a different circuit altogether. You are talking about the other circuit, with 2x TL494 and 2 mosfets. This thread is about the circuit using the MC34063 and the hex inverter chip, single mosfet (transistor).
I seems make mistake, need fast close one and other mosfet. But maybe more important fast close mosfet who works on feroresonance (200-400 kiloherc can be mosfet frenquency).
I make mistake and write into not needed topic. But no is topic about 1 W akula divice (lantern 2 and 3), so were me write this words or is that topic?
Quote from: MenofFather on April 30, 2014, 12:54:55 PM
I seems make mistake, need fast close one and other mosfet. But maybe more important fast close mosfet who works on feroresonance (200-400 kiloherc can be mosfet frenquency).
I make mistake and write into not needed topic. But no is topic about 1 W akula divice (lantern 2 and 3), so were me write this words or is that topic?
No matter, I can use the Miller clamp on both or just the lower one. I have transistors!
It's being discussed in the "Akula 30 W " thread, which is having problems today, I think.
Meanwhile here are two zooms into the oscillation/noise portion of the signal. The first one is at 500 microseconds per division, the second one is at 20 microseconds/div. The square-topped pulses are the normal output of the MC34063 chip. They are happening at a variable frequency controlled by the circuit's feedback loops and are happening here at a frequency of about 25 kHz max in the "bunched up" bursts. The spike and ringdown on the very top... seen in the second picture... there are about four peaks in 20 microseconds, for a frequency of about 200 kHz for this resonant ringdown. If I did the math right.
Is this the "ferroresonance" you are talking about?
(Both shots are from the same data capture, I just zoomed in to make these images. The dotted red lines are the trigger location, so you can orient the two shots.)
ETA: The bursts themselves are happening at about 300 Hz in this shot, and this is the frequency one can feel and hear in the core vibrations.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 30, 2014, 01:22:45 PM
No matter, I can use the Miller clamp on both or just the lower one. I have transistors!
It's being discussed in the "Akula 30 W " thread, which is having problems today, I think.
Meanwhile here are two zooms into the oscillation/noise portion of the signal. The first one is at 500 microseconds per division, the second one is at 20 microseconds. The square-topped pulses are the normal output of the MC34063 chip. They are happening at a variable frequency controlled by the circuit's feedback loops and are happening here at a frequency of about 25 kHz max in the "bunched up" bursts. The spike and ringdown on the very top... seen in the second picture... there are about four peaks in 20 microseconds, for a frequency of about 200 kHz for this resonant ringdown. If I did the math right.
Is this the "ferroresonance" you are talking about?
(Both shots are from the same data capture, I just zoomed in to make these images. The dotted red lines are the trigger location, so you can orient the two shots.)
I not shore is here feroresonance. Here is other circuit. To find ferorerosonance use one turn on primary and one turn on secondary, on secondary put 10 omh resistor and oscilioscope. And put into primary from range 800-2000 kiloherc frenquency of 5 volts and were you get maximum amplitude on that resistor, here and is ferroresonance. Seems i write coresct. Akula say about one turn... but other part of his words I now not remember. Need relisten conference....
Or you can use other numbers of turns, if you get same frenquency of fading out vibration, then here can be ferroresonance...
But... but.... TK.... you may say.... what about the envelope? Yours is all wavy and Akula's maintains a constant amplitude.
Ok... then I'll just have to turn off Bandwidth Limiting on my scope.
No changes in Any Settings, except turning off BWL in the oscilloscope:
Quote from: MenofFather on April 30, 2014, 01:33:40 PM
I not shore is here feroresonance. Here is other circuit. To find ferorerosonance use one turn on primary and one turn on secondary, on secondary put 10 omh resistor and oscilioscope. And put into primary from range 800-2000 kiloherc frenquency of 5 volts and were you get maximum amplitude on that resistor, here and is ferroresonance. Seems i write coresct. Akula say about one turn... but other part of his words I now not remember. Need relisten conference....
Or you can use other numbers of turns, if you get same frenquency of fading out vibration, then here can be ferroresonance...
This is one of the standard ways of determining resonance in a coil/core. What part is the "ferro" part and what part is just ordinary electrical LCR resonance?
Please do re-listen to conference and let us know what you can get from it. I am finding your comments very helpful, actually, even if you are sometimes wrong!
::)
By the way... current draw is 110 mA at 3.0 V and when I pull the power it takes the LEDs about 4 seconds to fade out completely.
I am afraid to say that I have Joule Thiefs that do much better than that and use a lot fewer components.
:-\
:'(
:-* :-* :-* :-*
Questions!
sorry!
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 30, 2014, 02:05:10 PM
By the way... current draw is 110 mA at 3.0 V and when I pull the power it takes the LEDs about 4 seconds to fade out completely.
I am afraid to say that I have Joule Thiefs that do much better than that and use a lot fewer components.
110mA at 3V is way too much. All you need is to generate spikes on driving transistor and shut it off as soon as LEDs get lit then wait until capacitor gets discharged and LEDs are in off state again before next pulse train...
Also for resonance - the effect is same as per Lithuanian experiment just on much smaller scale which is not harmful to health. So you need to reach NMR conditions of black hard ferrite (won't work on greyish soft) to have additional energy input there;)
@ Tk
"I am afraid to say that I have Joule Thiefs that do much better than that and use a lot fewer components."
yes, you opened the toilets doors in the bank. there is no money.
Quote from: tysb3 on April 30, 2014, 02:30:11 PM
@ Tk
"I am afraid to say that I have Joule Thiefs that do much better than that and use a lot fewer components."
yes, you opened the toilets doors in the bank. there is no money.
hi,
Thanks for your useless comment which serve no valuable purpose in this forum at all. :P
Until akula thread will be fixed I will just leave my reply to this thread:
Quote from: tysb3 on April 29, 2014, 10:52:23 AM
@wattsup (http://www.overunity.com/profile/wattsup.3755/)
.
wattsup (http://www.overunity.com/profile/wattsup.3755/):
"@T-1000 just posted that the resonance has to reach the cores resonance (simply put) to have some "nuclear" effect. But how the hell do you except to achieve anything of that level if your circuit is locked at 300KHz. Something is wrong with the values."
T-1000 (http://www.overunity.com/profile/t-1000.27480/):
"In this case the LC resonance frequency must match ferrite natural resonance frequency or its harmonics."
for example: if you have yours transformers ferrite resonance 2.23 Mhz, you could reach the core resonance excitation with coils resonance on 22.3 Khz or 223 Khz
The best hit is on 1/2 1/4 and 1/8 of material resonant frequency. If you are going to build it and have proper ferrite core - you will see... :)
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 30, 2014, 02:05:10 PM
By the way... current draw is 110 mA at 3.0 V and when I pull the power it takes the LEDs about 4 seconds to fade out completely.
I am afraid to say that I have Joule Thiefs that do much better than that and use a lot fewer components.
:-\
:'(
:-* :-* :-* :-*
hi,
What about adding 100nf capacitor in parallel with 100uf capacitor to smooth the ripples in the sine wave.
1n5819 may not able to handle 80volt...90volt spikes since it's design up to 40volts.
maybe UF4004 would fare better.
--------------------------
I wonder if the insulating mica sheet would convert radiation into electrical pulses which produce ou."Just theory"
Quote from: T-1000 on April 30, 2014, 02:42:20 PM
Until akula thread will be fixed I will just leave my reply to this thread:
The best hit is on 1/2 1/4 and 1/8 of material resonant frequency. If you are going to build it and have proper ferrite core - you will see... :)
yes, I'm not right in details, but I understand how it works.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 30, 2014, 02:02:14 PM
This is one of the standard ways of determining resonance in a coil/core. What part is the "ferro" part and what part is just ordinary electrical LCR resonance?
::)
I also think, that akula can use LC resonance but he can think, that it is feroresonance. But if he not make mistake, then if you change number of turns on secondary coil and primary, you must find same frenquency were amplitude rise. That frenquency is feroresonance. :D
Quote from: magpwr on April 30, 2014, 02:44:40 PM
hi,
What about adding 100nf capacitor in parallel with 100uf capacitor to smooth the ripples in the sine wave.
1n5819 may not able to handle 80volt...90volt spikes since it's design up to 40volts.
maybe UF4004 would fare better.
--------------------------
I wonder if the insulating mica sheet would convert radiation into electrical pulses which produce ou."Just theory"
There are no 80-90 volt spikes. Akula's scopeshot is showing you the result of having your scope and probe attenuations misset.
He is using 1x atten on the probe and has the scope thinking it's at 10x. The actual vertical resolution on Akula's screenshot is 5v/div, not 50v/div and his cited 80 v p-p is actually only around 8 v p-p... just like mine.
ETA: I just tried a couple different 100 nF caps, one poly film and one ceramic, across the 100 uF capacitor. No effect that I can detect.
If speake about 3v OU Flashlight, then that is capasitor, 510 nanofarads or 510 picofards?
So let me get this straight. I am using Akula's circuit with only two substitutions: A TIP3055 that switches, instead of a mosfet that doesn't switch, and a 100R resistor in series with the two LEDs on the cathode end to ground.
I've corrected the seeming errors in the inductances stated on the original schematic and I've found that the inductances were likely reversed in the original schematic somehow. After much effort tuning and fiddling and substituting, winding several different coils and exploring the problem space nearly full time over the last three or four days... and I have actually reproduced, as far as I can tell, the exact waveforms that Akula is exhibiting. Frequency, amplitude, envelope, harmonics, noise... it is all there. I am less than 5 percent off in any direction.
Yet many of you are telling me I need some other ferrite material. Even though I have the exact same waveforms.
PLEASE EXPLAIN in actual terms that have meaning, with references to checkable credible sources, how this can possibly be.
It certainly seems to me that if I had different material that resonated at a different frequency I would not have these waveforms using these component values. Anyone care to challenge this, perhaps with _a demonstration of your own_?
Quote from: MenofFather on April 30, 2014, 03:12:07 PM
If speake about 3v OU Flashlight, then that is capasitor, 510 nanofarads or 510 picofards?
I have 510 picoFarads.
Current schematic:
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 30, 2014, 02:02:14 PM
This is one of the standard ways of determining resonance in a coil/core. What part is the "ferro" part and what part is just ordinary electrical LCR resonance?
::)
Good afternoon TK.
Hope this is helpful,,,, lots of info.....
take care, peace
lost_bro
This would not fit with the other attachments:
take care, peace
lost_bro
Thanks, lost_bro.
In the "Formula" slide, what are the units of ID and OD? mm, cm, inches, furlongs?
I think that formula is for toroids but I can approximate a toroid with a rectangular shape, don't you think?
I believe my ferrite is the MnZi material, since it has 50 ohm/cm conductivity.
Well, using the formula with cm as units gives me 29. And using mm as units I get 2.9. (I used 50 mm for OD and 25 mm for ID).
Are these Hz? Cycles per microsecond? What did I do wrong?
From the slide:
FMR = 5700/(3.142 * ((10 * OD) + ( 10 * ID)/2))
Quote from: T-1000 on April 30, 2014, 02:19:30 PM
110mA at 3V is way too much. All you need is to generate spikes on driving transistor and shut it off as soon as LEDs get lit then wait until capacitor gets discharged and LEDs are in off state again before next pulse train...
I know that. Tell it to the circuit though! I can certainly get the current draw to go quite low, to 30 mA or less, with still pretty bright LEDs. This is driving the MC34063 chip +properly+ though, not with all the feedback and noise and undervoltage that this circuit provides. There is only one tuning pot, after all, and one simply forgets about waveform and cranks the pot a bit in the "dim" direction until one sees a current and brightness value that one likes.
I would appreciate seeing some valid measurements... and trustworthy ones... from Akula while he's making this same set of waveforms. That would be helpful, don't you think? Do you think we'll ever see such? I don't.
Quote
Also for resonance - the effect is same as per Lithuanian experiment just on much smaller scale which is not harmful to health. So you need to reach NMR conditions of black hard ferrite (won't work on greyish soft) to have additional energy input there;)
So you believe. Do you have any evidence for this belief?
Do you actually understand what Nuclear Magnetic Resonance means? Do you believe that this circuit depends on NMR in some way?
I operated a NMR spectrograph machine for the first time over thirty years ago, but there we were concerned mainly with flipping hydrogen protons at their resonant frequencies when bathed in an RF field. It's a chemical analytical tool. The power required is rather large, IIRC... and that's just affecting single, deshielded protons clinging onto the outside of larger molecules. (The frequency of flipping of a proton depends strongly on its immediate electron environment so much can be determined about molecule shape and composition by looking at the NMR spectrum of its hydrogen protons.) I have to admit that I know nothing of NMR in compounds made of large metal ions and alloys, but I suspect that there is nothing I can do in my laboratory that will affect the nuclei of these atoms. Your results may differ. May I see your data and demonstrations?
Yes, there is something wrong on the last page of the Akula0083 thread that is preventing it from loading. You can get to the last loadable page here:
http://www.overunity.com/14378/akula0083-30-watt-self-running-generator/1005/
Hello All:
OK, trying to figure this out.
*Ferromagnetic Resonance is also called spin precession resonance.
*The loss factor, which is the normalization of loss tangent per unit of permeability, is a material property describing the loss characteristics per unit of permeability.
*This remains true so long as the increase in height/length does not cause the core to be in dimensional resonance.
Dimensional Resonance is *DIFFERENT* from Ferromagnetic Resonance (spin precession resonance).
take care, peace
lost_bro
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 30, 2014, 03:56:30 PM
Well, using the formula with cm as units gives me 29. And using mm as units I get 2.9. (I used 50 mm for OD and 25 mm for ID).
Are these Hz? Cycles per microsecond? What did I do wrong?
From the slide:
FMR = 5700/(3.142 * ((10 * OD) + ( 10 * ID)/2))
Hi TinselKoala,
I recall a similar formula which originally was given in a data sheet by Philips (acquired later by Ferroxcube) and the core material was 3R1 with square loop (nearly rectangular hysteresis loop) feature also for MnZn ferrite material. However that formula from Philips did not include a 10 times multiplier in its denominator, and there seems to be a parenthesis shift at the end too in the formula you were given, see the Philips formula in Page 8 of the attached file.
With your OD=50mm and ID=25mm, the mechanical resonant frequency for the core comes as 48.4 kHz from the Philips formula.
Maybe tuning the core to this frequency could give something useful...
Gyula
Quote from: gyulasun on April 30, 2014, 05:36:06 PM
Hi TinselKoala,
I recall a similar formula which originally was given in a data sheet by Philips (acquired later by Ferroxcube) and the core material was 3R1 with square loop (nearly rectangular hysteresis loop) feature also for MnZn ferrite material. However that formula from Philips did not include a 10 times multiplier in its denominator, and there seems to be a parenthesis shift at the end too in the formula you were given, see the Philips formula in Page 8 of the attached file.
With your OD=50mm and ID=25mm, the mechanical resonant frequency for the core comes as 48.4 kHz from the Philips formula.
Maybe tuning the core to this frequency could give something useful...
Gyula
OK, just to clarify from the attached PDF file posted earlier:
take care, peace
lost_bro
Took a few hours to build this Akula dual 494 switcher. I tested both channels independently with dummy resistor loads.
Channel 1 Frequency range around 13 kHz to 400 kHz, duty cycle control, 0 to 45%
Channel 2 Frequency range around 26 kHz to 800 kHz duty cycle control 0 to 90%
With five parameters and such wide adjustability, it would seem difficult to hit the sweet spot.
I used ten turn trimmers for good resolution of setting.
Note that one of the trimmers, the 10k hooked to pin 1 sets the voltage shutdown level.
Core and coil testing is the next phase.
Regards, Vortex1 aka ION from Overunityresearch.com
Quote from: Vortex1 on April 30, 2014, 06:01:22 PM
Took a few hours to build this Akula dual 494 switcher. I tested both channels independently with dummy resistor loads.
Channel 1 Frequency range around 13 kHz to 400 kHz, duty cycle control, 0 to 45%
Channel 2 Frequency range around 26 kHz to 800 kHz duty cycle control 0 to 90%
With five parameters and such wide adjustability, it would seem difficult to hit the sweet spot.
I used ten turn trimmers for good resolution of setting.
Note that one of the trimmers, the 10k hooked to pin 1 sets the voltage shutdown level.
Core and coil testing is the next phase.
Regards, Vortex1 aka ION from Overunityresearch.com
Good that you did it that way, it gives me a better idea for my own layout, which I'm starting to build.
Some questions if you don't mind.
1. What specific exact schematic did you use?
2. I see you are Miller-clamping both mosfets. What PNP transistors did you use here?
3. And... do you really really think you are going to need those large heatsinks? Let's see.... if a 9v battery is capable of supplying 9 amps into a dead short for a few minutes... wow. You must be expecting some pretty serious overunity to need those big heatsinks.
4. What mosfet part number are you using? I will be starting with IRF3205 I think, which has such a low Rdss that it probably won't need a heatsink even with 9 amps DC flowing through it.
The device is supposed to use LEDs for the "load" isn't it? LEDs are very non-linear, they behave nothing like resistors. Your load resistors aren't going to give you a proper idea of the circuit's operation or performance.
I was expecting one of the 494s to have a much lower operating frequency.
How are you going to get batteries into those tiny trimpots? I think Akula is probably using button cells inside two of his potentiometers. ;)
Quote from: lost_bro on April 30, 2014, 05:58:51 PM
OK, just to clarify from the attached PDF file posted earlier:
take care, peace
lost_bro
OK, using that formula I also get 48.4 kHz, which makes a lot more sense and agrees with the result Gyula posted. Units are important!
Thanks much.
However.... I am pretty sure that formula is for a one-piece toroid. The fact that we are all using multipiece cores will probably screw that up.
The schematic was derived by a couple of fellows at Overunityresearch, I may not be at liberty to post their detailed work. I will check in with them, or since they read here, they can chime in.
I'll see if I can post you a link: http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=2420.msg38115#msg38115 (http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=2420.msg38115#msg38115)
The heatsinks are just insurance should I get into a saturation condition when I hook up the inductor, never hurts to have a little extra heatsinking, besides if this doesn't work as advertised, I would like to use the driver for other experiments. I will also be driving some larger ferrites, perhaps from a power supply so I can watch the power consumption as I tune.
I used 220 ohm load resistors so that I could observe the switching without a lot of ringing etc, it is just a first step to see if everything is working correctly, then I will build the rest, including putting in some of the transient protection diodes and a properly wound and gapped ferrite core, MnZn type.
I know about LED's non-linearity, they are not necessarily the only devices I will use as a load test.
I am well aware of the limitations of a 9 Volt battery, and I do not expect any serious overunity.
The Miller clamps are specified as 2n3703, but faster devices could be used if needed.
I'm using IRF530's because I have them on hand, 14A 100V, nanosecond switching ability 0.16 ohm rds(on)
Should I perhaps not be posting here? I haven't done so in a few years but was very active in the past.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 30, 2014, 06:26:52 PM
However.... I am pretty sure that formula is for a one-piece toroid. The fact that we are all using multipiece cores will probably screw that up.
Good evening TK
Yes, you are correct... It is for a Toroid.
I guess I just wanted to expose the fact that the anecdotal information of * Core self-destruction* is not based on Fantasy or Imagination but does has a * rational * explanation.
We have to start somewhere with this.....
take care, peace
lost_bro
Quote from: Vortex1 on April 30, 2014, 06:44:26 PM
The schematic was derived by a couple of fellows at Overunityresearch, I may not be at liberty to post their detailed work. I will check in with them, or since they read here, they can chime in.
I'll see if I can post you a link: http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=2420.msg38115#msg38115 (http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=2420.msg38115#msg38115)
The heatsinks are just insurance should I get into a saturation condition when I hook up the inductor, never hurts to have a little extra heatsinking, besides if this doesn't work as advertised, I would like to use the driver for other experiments. I will also be driving some larger ferrites, perhaps from a power supply so I can watch the power consumption as I tune.
I used 220 load resistors so that I could observe the switching without a lot of ringing etc, it is just a first step to see if everything is working correctly, then I will build the rest, including putting in some of the transient protection diodes and a properly wound and gapped ferrite core, MnZn type.
I know about LED's non-linearity, they are not necessarily the only devices I will use as a load test.
I am well aware of the limitations of a 9 Volt battery, and I do not expect any serious overunity.
The Miller clamps are specified as 2n3703, but faster devices could be used if needed.
I'm using IRF530's because I have them on hand, 14A 100V, nanosecond switching ability 0.16 ohm rds(on)
Should I perhaps not be posting here? I haven't done so in a few years but was very active in the past.
Glad You're back V...its been a while.
I look forward to reading more of your posts.
Regards...
Quote from: Cap-Z-ro on April 30, 2014, 07:33:00 PM
Glad You're back V...its been a while.
I look forward to reading more of your posts.
Regards...
Thanks Cap, yes time flies......
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 30, 2014, 03:30:05 PM
I have 510 picoFarads.
Current schematic:
hi TinselKoala,
I just saw the latest version of schematic you posted this morning.
The version i was trying to convey to you last night-The "Led needs to be connected to resistor in series" then connect in parallel with 1000uf capacitor.
Looking at this version of schematic and zooming into the role of I/C:4069 which is used merely to invert signal from one of the gates.
I am just thinking if using 2n3906 or any high hfe pnp transistor to do the same job of inverting signal to npn transistor .For my case for npn transistor it would be tip31c or BDX34 (A...C).
Quote from: magpwr on April 30, 2014, 10:17:14 PM
hi TinselKoala,
I just saw the latest version of schematic you posted this morning.
The version i was trying to convey to you last night-The "Led needs to be connected to resistor in series" then connect in parallel with 1000uf capacitor.
Looking at this version of schematic and zooming into the role of I/C:4069 which is used merely to invert signal from one of the gates.
I am just thinking if using 2n3906 or any high hfe pnp transistor to do the same job of inverting signal to npn transistor .For my case for npn transistor it would be tip31c or BDX34 (A...C).
Aahh... I drew the schematic wrong. The capacitor is tied to ground, so it is wired as you say, not as I have in the schematic, if I am understanding you. I'll have to change the graphic right away. I just put it into a new video, too. Gaaahhhh, there is always a typo somewhere. Thanks for pointing it out.
Sure, a transistor makes more sense than using a single gate of a hex inverter. But the earlier version that Akula posted of this schematic, and maybe a device, had all the gates being used to light up a couple more LEDs, and so the inverter chip is a "legacy" leftover from that. Even though those LEDs don't really participate in the "free energy" part of the circuit. So he cut them out of the schematic.
By the way, I am trying to track down the person who drew up the schematic I am using and posting, to thank him or her. I see, I think, that it was first posted here by 4Tesla, and carries the name of Vadik Guk. I know it was added to a bit by verpies, and I've posted my own changes and values into it as well. I really would like to give credit to everyone who helped make that schematic image.
In the closeup below you can see the three elevated pads for the LEDs. The black cylinder is the 1000 uF cap, its negative lead is soldered to the ground plane and the red wire is its positive lead, going to the Anode pad of the Blue LED. The Cathode pad of the White LED is connected to the 220R which is then connected to the ground plane. So I got the wiring right but the schematic insert wrong.
I tried the 220R but I think I'll go back to the 100R.
Quote from: Vortex1 on April 30, 2014, 06:44:26 PM
The schematic was derived by a couple of fellows at Overunityresearch, I may not be at liberty to post their detailed work. I will check in with them, or since they read here, they can chime in.
I'll see if I can post you a link: http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=2420.msg38115#msg38115 (http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=2420.msg38115#msg38115)
The heatsinks are just insurance should I get into a saturation condition when I hook up the inductor, never hurts to have a little extra heatsinking, besides if this doesn't work as advertised, I would like to use the driver for other experiments. I will also be driving some larger ferrites, perhaps from a power supply so I can watch the power consumption as I tune.
I used 220 ohm load resistors so that I could observe the switching without a lot of ringing etc, it is just a first step to see if everything is working correctly, then I will build the rest, including putting in some of the transient protection diodes and a properly wound and gapped ferrite core, MnZn type.
I know about LED's non-linearity, they are not necessarily the only devices I will use as a load test.
I am well aware of the limitations of a 9 Volt battery, and I do not expect any serious overunity.
The Miller clamps are specified as 2n3703, but faster devices could be used if needed.
I'm using IRF530's because I have them on hand, 14A 100V, nanosecond switching ability 0.16 ohm rds(on)
Should I perhaps not be posting here? I haven't done so in a few years but was very active in the past.
I lost a nice long answer to this.... but please DO keep posting here, and in the other thread that is now working again, if the images there can get sized down....
Thanks for your answer and details. I'm going to use the NTE374 for the clamps when I build it up, I think. I just mentioned the 9v battery as the example of the maximum sustained current that could reasonably be expected to contribute to mosfet heating; the big sinks are a joke if the only thing you intended to use the circuit for was Akula stuff, but you are making more of a general purpose item and maybe you will encounter mosfet heating. I know it can happen very quickly when it happens. But we live for the thrill, don't we?
;)
Scoposcopy meets Akula:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHAc7kDY4-w
@lost_bro
You should change your name to found_bro. You are on the right path and have posted all the relevant information regarding torque of electron spin in the material and the accompanying magnetostrictive effect. PLEASE TELL ME YOU ARE BUILDING CIRCUITS ALREADY??? We used the magnetostrictive effect of pure nickel tubes back in 2003 to do simultaneous multi-level sensing of the throth separation tanks at Anglo gold and platinum mining in South Africa. Nickel has a far superior ferro movement vs iron or other obtainable metals.
For better performance the nickel tubes was annealing (basically heated, current applied to it to align electron spin and cooled in this way). This permanently changed the properties of the material itself and much less energy is needed to achieve the magnetostrictive effect (which is the return energy that get induced back into the receiving coil). Since the electron spin is now aligned there is no need to pulse a driver coil to do this just to break it (spin direction) up again and repeat - you can imagine the energy saving.
Your core should have the highest possible amount of nickel in it and electron spin annealed in a fixed position.
The capetonian
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 30, 2014, 03:18:37 PM
So let me get this straight. I am using Akula's circuit with only two substitutions: A TIP3055 that switches, instead of a mosfet that doesn't switch, and a 100R resistor in series with the two LEDs on the cathode end to ground.
I've corrected the seeming errors in the inductances stated on the original schematic and I've found that the inductances were likely reversed in the original schematic somehow. After much effort tuning and fiddling and substituting, winding several different coils and exploring the problem space nearly full time over the last three or four days... and I have actually reproduced, as far as I can tell, the exact waveforms that Akula is exhibiting. Frequency, amplitude, envelope, harmonics, noise... it is all there. I am less than 5 percent off in any direction.
Yet many of you are telling me I need some other ferrite material. Even though I have the exact same waveforms.
PLEASE EXPLAIN in actual terms that have meaning, with references to checkable credible sources, how this can possibly be.
It certainly seems to me that if I had different material that resonated at a different frequency I would not have these waveforms using these component values. Anyone care to challenge this, perhaps with _a demonstration of your own_?
If this words to me, then let me see you drawed schematic. And I nothing say, that you core is from not good material.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 30, 2014, 03:30:05 PM
I have 510 picoFarads.
Current schematic:
http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/137847/image//
So you can not replicate this schematic? If you say, that it is exatly like Vadim schematic, then it is not exatly like Vadim, here many diferences, inductance not that addadet resistors and so on. If you replicating Akula divice with pot core, here also not exatly like in him, because he in video say, that other generator not used, but you using two generators, he use ony one.
:)
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 30, 2014, 10:39:48 PM
In the closeup below you can see the three elevated pads for the LEDs. The black cylinder is the 1000 uF cap, its negative lead is soldered to the ground plane and the red wire is its positive lead, going to the Anode pad of the Blue LED. The Cathode pad of the White LED is connected to the 220R which is then connected to the ground plane. So I got the wiring right but the schematic insert wrong.
I tried the 220R but I think I'll go back to the 100R.
hi TinselKoala,
It's afternoon over here.
I took a look at the circuit once more.
I do find there is
no recovery at all from higher voltage potential found across 1000uf capacitor and back to the MC34063 in order to create a self run.
It looks like-The higher potential is merely used to
power 2 led in series besides
charging 1000uf capacitor and also serve as
voltage reference for P1 base on current circuit layout.
Can you try to see if there is any drop in input current after connecting wire(temporary) from output of D1 to MC34063 pin7.
Do try to connect battery or 3v power source few times to circuit -Akula style as seen in video for 2nd experiment after connecting temp wire as well.
Did you ever notice any hint of "overunity" performance in your annealed nickel tubes?
I should think that the scientists that could figure out how to use magnetostriction in a flow process at a gold mine could figure that out too. There is more "gold" in an overunity process than there is in the mines of South Africa, and if you believe Akula it's a lot easier to get to, as well.
Electron spin resonance is a far cry from NMR even though some of the same principles are at play.
Where is the spin-polarized annealed nickel in Akula's 3v flashlight, though? I must have missed it....
Quote from: MenofFather on May 01, 2014, 04:48:47 AM
http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/137847/image// (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/137847/image//)
So you can not replicate this schematic? If you say, that it is exatly like Vadim schematic, then it is not exatly like Vadim, here many diferences, inductance not that addadet resistors and so on. If you replicating Akula divice with pot core, here also not exatly like in him, because he in video say, that other generator not used, but you using two generators, he use ony one.
:)
What are you talking about? I am using the schematic you linked, yes. It has only one "generator", the MC34063 chip. Please explain how I am able to generate the exact waveforms that Akula shows if the circuit I am using is wrong.
Why don't you show us some of YOUR work? Let us please see YOUR version of this project, and please don't forget to show it running without any power supply attached.
Quote from: MenofFather on May 01, 2014, 04:43:46 AM
If this words to me, then let me see you drawed schematic. And I nothing say, that you core is from not good material.
I have showed my drawed schematic many times. Each time I make a variation I show the variation. By exploring _many variations_ I have identified errors in what has been reported -- the inductance values, which side gets which inductance, the fake "80V p-p" report due to his mis-setting attenuations.... and I have now arrived at the same instrumental measurements that Akula has shown. And you are waving your hands about and doing "special pleading". Go ahead and send me some magic ferrite material and I'll be happy to test it, since YOU CANNOT REPORT ANY TESTS OF YOUR OWN that support your claims.
I have added ONE resistor to the original schematic, based on a suggestion made yesterday. It helps and hurts, as I have described above. I have changed the value of ONE input filter/reservoir capacitor from 2200 to 3300 uF. I made up the 0.33 ohm value by paralleling three 1.0 ohm resistors and I made the 510 pF value by putting 2 1000 pF caps in series and finding ones that would give the 510 pF value exactly. Akula has shown many circuits "working" with a flyback ferrite instead of a pot core, including this one, I thought.
If you want to criticize my work, please do not misrepresent it while you are doing so. If you think that the 3300 uF cap is an "unsuitable" substitution... I'll be happy to change it. What do you predict will happen when I do?
I am still waiting for an explanation of how, if my circuit is somehow "wrong", I get these waveforms.
(Don't forget that Akula's scope is not showing 50 v/div but is actually showing 5 v/div and at less resolution than he could be using if he had set his scope correctly. I apologize for having "garage sale" equipment.... but at least I know how to use it. )
Quote from: magpwr on May 01, 2014, 04:58:12 AM
hi TinselKoala,
It's afternoon over here.
I took a look at the circuit once more.
I do find there is no recovery at all from higher voltage potential found across 1000uf capacitor and back to the MC34063 in order to create a self run.
It looks like-The higher potential is merely used to power 2 led in series besides charging 1000uf capacitor and also serve as voltage reference for P1 base on current circuit layout.
Can you try to see if there is any drop in input current after connecting wire(temporary) from output of D1 to MC34063 pin7.
Do try to connect battery or 3v power source few times to circuit -Akula style as seen in video for 2nd experiment after connecting temp wire as well.
I'll try what you suggest, along with all the other suggestions I have received from people who seem coherent and have some actual knowledge. I must say, though, that I am getting fed up with the special pleadings, handwavings, and the resorting to more claims without evidence. I've shown to my satisfaction that the circuit I have constructed isn't picking up significant energy from the environment, that it can be made to run for a _long_ time on tiny concealed batteries, and that the circuit works to make the instrumental measurements that Akula has shown.... in short it does everything that Akula has shown. Everything. Akula simply has not shown yet where he hid the battery or the tiny thin supply wires.
If you want me to believe that different ferrite material -- the Soviet material -- will perform differently, please provide some evidence! And if you say, "well, look at Akula's circuit, he uses Soviet ferrites and they work!" I will just laugh at you. (Do we actually even have evidence that Akula himself is using "soviet ferrite" material? I'll bet his are made in China just like everyone else's.)
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 01, 2014, 06:19:48 AM
What are you talking about? I am using the schematic you linked, yes. It has only one "generator", the MC34063 chip. Please explain how I am able to generate the exact waveforms that Akula shows if the circuit I am using is wrong.
Akula use one generator and not clearly see how it circuit conected, so I not recomendate replicate akula lantern with pot core. I recomendate replicate lantern with two Tl494.
Tinkola, and indution not 5.9 miligenriesa and 2.6, miligenries, but 59 and 26 miligenries must be, if you replicating akula lanter with pot core. In video seems is 5.4 milihenries but writen 54 milihenries, see how many errors have this circuit? Or maybe here microhenries?
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 01, 2014, 06:19:48 AM
Why don't you show us some of YOUR work?
I now working, but until I not get selfrunning why you need my work? Ok here some my work https://archive.org/details/MVI2356 (https://archive.org/details/MVI2356)
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 01, 2014, 06:47:36 AM
I'll try what you suggest, along with all the other suggestions I have received from people who seem coherent and have some actual knowledge. I must say, though, that I am getting fed up with the special pleadings, handwavings, and the resorting to more claims without evidence. I've shown to my satisfaction that the circuit I have constructed isn't picking up significant energy from the environment, that it can be made to run for a _long_ time on tiny concealed batteries, and that the circuit works to make the instrumental measurements that Akula has shown.... in short it does everything that Akula has shown. Everything. Akula simply has not shown yet where he hid the battery or the tiny thin supply wires.
If you want me to believe that different ferrite material -- the Soviet material -- will perform differently, please provide some evidence! And if you say, "well, look at Akula's circuit, he uses Soviet ferrites and they work!" I will just laugh at you. (Do we actually even have evidence that Akula himself is using "soviet ferrite" material? I'll bet his are made in China just like everyone else's.)
hi TinselKoala,
I know it can be frustrating at times
especially if there is no supporting evidence to support the suggestion.I do admit to save time sometimes we tend to leave certain supporting\justification comment out.
This is the time line-
For my case imagine this around 4th day during reverse engineering stage with verpies whom drew me a circuit.I then execute purchase of 4.7cm ferrite pot core online since i'm in living in an island(50km wide) in the heart of Asia.There are limited electronic component available locally.
(In the meantime there are some of the confusing circuit diagram which people posted which are crazy in design and with no supporting video ;D )
Then out of the blue the 3v ou circuit creator then reveal his circuit along with pcb layout which tallies with verpies drawn circuit.
Even more stranger than strange itself- Akula(Shark) suddenly showed up with his version of mini ou device and the unwinding part soon followed after.
Currently waiting for copper shield/foil to arrive."This waiting game sucks"
Quote from: MenofFather on May 01, 2014, 08:11:21 AM
Akula use one generator and not clearly see how it circuit conected, so I not recomendate replicate akula lantern with pot core. I recomendate replicate lantern with two Tl494.
Tinkola, and indution not 5.9 miligenriesa and 2.6, miligenries, but 59 and 26 miligenries must be, if you replicating akula lanter with pot core. In video seems is 5.4 milihenries but writen 54 milihenries, see how many errors have this circuit? Or maybe here microhenries?
As I said before.... you are welcome to criticize my work but please DO NOT MISREPRESENT it.
If you had only been following my reports and videos, you would know that the numbers cited on the original schematic for the induction of the coils are not believable. Here is why: 59 and 26 MILLI Henry is not obtainable without lots and lots of wire. 59 and 26 MICRO Henry is waay too small, one or two turns and you are already over those values. Wesley has translated and gives one of Akula's coils as 2.7 MILLI Henry or something like that, one tenth of what is cited on the schematic. There has been much confusion before, mister GigaHertz, with Russian speakers about the unit prefixes. But I am an empiricist, I do not make claims without evidence. I have tried MANY DIFFERENT combinations of inductances, more than I have talked about here, and my best performance as I am using now, uses one-tenth the values on the original schematic -- the translation error was made by whoever wrote the diagram in the first place. The transposition of the core inductances is because the MC34063 chip does not like very small inductances on its input; the circuit _WORKS_ to produce the instrumental measurements without chip heating and excessive current draw only with a larger inductance on the chip side. The reason I know this stuff is because I have actually tried all these different variations and I can provide step by step evidence that I am correct.
The schematic actually comes originally from a schematic in one of Akula's videos, so if you want to complain about the wiring as given on the schematic, complain to him, not to me. If you find things that you would like to discuss, like the inductance issue, please do your homework before you bring it up.
Quote from: MenofFather on May 01, 2014, 08:25:39 AM
I now working, but until I not get selfrunning why you need my work? Ok here some my work https://archive.org/details/MVI2356 (https://archive.org/details/MVI2356)
Good for you, you are working, that enhances your credibility in my eyes.
Why have you not got selfrunning? That decreases your credibility in my eyes, since you claim to know what the factors are that are keeping ME from attaining self-running..... Are you having problems locating irradiated Soviet ferrites?
Matthew Chapter 7, verses 3-5.
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 01, 2014, 03:15:19 PM
Are you having problems locating irradiated Soviet ferrites?
Akula use not soviet ferite in 1W divice with flayback core.
Lasersaber
has done some increadible work based on the same look pot core, check his video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dq9NQhzdw0
Lasersaber
is using a core based on N22 material made by Epcos. The indicated metals for this material is NiZn of which Ni (nickel) is dominant. I feel like such a dummy now, eish :-\ O no wait :-X
Greets All,
How do i take the core of a tv flyback without breaking it.
I tried looking online but not much info.
I have the same core as TinselKoala, i guess.
See the pic attached
Thnx in advance!
Greets JB
Quote from: JohnnBlade on May 01, 2014, 06:48:05 PM
Greets All,
How do i take the core of a tv flyback without breaking it.
I tried looking online but not much info.
I have the same core as TinselKoala, i guess.
See the pic attached
Thnx in advance!
Greets JB
Good evening Johnnblade
What I do is :
1. un-soldier all the wires
2. remove as much plastic as I can *without* breaking the ferrite
3. boil in water in old pan or pot.
When still hot the glue/silicon will be soft and can then remove ferrite from housing.
Hope this helps.
take care, peace
lost_bro
Thnx Lost Bro,
I will try it right away
Greets JB
Quote from: lost_bro on May 01, 2014, 08:00:29 PM
Good evening Johnnblade
What I do is :
1. un-soldier all the wires
2. remove as much plastic as I can *without* breaking the ferrite
3. boil in water in old pan or pot.
When still hot the glue/silicon will be soft and can then remove ferrite from housing.
Hope this helps.
take care, peace
lost_bro
TK and all,
good replications,
but now we know TK is using a MnZi material ferrite core and can not get OU with it
but Lasersaber is using NiZn ferrite core and gets extreme run times on a charged capacitor
and pretty high load LED bulb.
So it probably also depends all on the material of the used ferrite cores.
So better try to get NiZn cores for your ferrite material.
Regards, Stefan,
@Lost Bro,
Thnx man, it worked!
Easier then boiling an egg, i placed a pan with cold/warm water on fire and boiled the whole flyback just like that, i took nothing off. All took about 10 min to cook, and the core came right of without any effort.
Since i was busy i did another core, but not knowing that when i placed the 2e core into the boiling water it cracked into 4 pieces :) so it was a good lesson not to dump a core into boiling water :)
Good shit Lost Bro!
Now lets try some Akula stuff ; )
Greets JB
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 01, 2014, 03:15:19 PM
Matthew Chapter 7, verses 3-5.
I liked that. Very clever.
~A
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dq9NQhzdw0 lasersaber has something like success
Lets forget about miss quoted wood in the eyes. To make progress in science you need to take theory to fact, you need theoretical scientists to work with practical scientists. We have that here. I am both but don't always have time to get to the practical. Understandable there is a lot of opinionated people on the net that confuses the identification of legitimate theorist. Keep in mind it is called the THEORY of relativity (Einstein). Most of what Tesla did was theory based. In his patent you would often see (no model) printed at the top. Theory is taking aim, putting it to practice is shooting. Would you really want to just shoot wildly into the air hoping to hit something?
A core is a core is a core, as long as it looks the same right? Just like a to220 silicon device is a to220 silicon device is a to220 silicon device right? And if something looks the same and it is the same part from the same manufacturer it must be the same, right? Note the comment lasersaber makes about why his one transformer works and the other does not. Now think about the multiple OU devices that worked but could not be recreated, not even by the inventor themselves. Could it be that not all logic works by accurately copying the original because of oblivious differences?
Can the properties of core material change? According to Epcos the N22 material can be permanently changed/damaged if subjected to a magnetic field of too much intensity. Can other things change/damage it? Excessive heat (400C +) would. We can use this our advantage to anneal and permanently rotate and fix the electron spin.
Nickel makes for an interesting read on wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nickel
It was first defined in Germany (guess what country is next door?). It, along with iron is believed to be what the majority of the core of the earth consists of - we know that the earth has a permanent magnetic field, this only happens with aligned electron spin. The stuff in the earth is heated. The earth spins on its axis. Is it a coincident that the north and south pole is perpendicular to the rotation of the earth? An earth that has nickel as part of its core? Nickel that is heated and in doing so allowed to align its electron spin with that of the torque vector of the spinning mass that is the earth? Electrons that aligning because they have mass and thus torque spin of their own? Torque that aligns to torque? Torque that creates a magnetic field perpendicular to it? Does this mean that if we are able to control the direction of spin, we also control the torque spin and thus control the magnetic field? If we can control the magnetic field, does this mean we can make it fluctuate? What if we place an electrical conductor like a copper wire coil round this fluctuating magnetic field?
Could all this be just coincidental?
More about nickel. Nickel is one of only 4 known ferromagnetic elements at room temperature. Iron(Fe), cobalt(Co) and gadolinium(Gd) being the other 3. Note: manganese(Mn) is not one of them. Why have a core based on manganese (MnZn) then and expect it to interact with an magnetic field in the same way as nickel based (NiZn) one? The QEG is based on a specific steel alloy (M19 C5, aka electrical steel) core, an alloy containing both iron(Fe). If you do not use the correct core material in the QEG it does not work. If the QEG does not go into resonance, it does not produce extra energy out. The QEG "builds up and goes into resonance". NAR? NMR? Both maybe?
I believe that what we are trying to achieve and what is being done by the QEG is the same - this is great news.
Also think about this: the bedini device only produces OU sometimes. It has been reported that the weaker ferrous magnets produce better results than neodymium magnets. Could it be because the neodymium is not one of the 4 ferro elements? - I'll investigate this further. Here too we see aligned electron spin and controlled magnetic fields.
What Akula is doing, what bedini is doing and what is claimed in the QEG just have too many coincidences to ignore. Lets use this to our advantage: find the commonalities, derive theories, test and eliminate to move forward. There is a some more interesting things to note about nickel I will communicate at a later stage.
The capetonian
Quote from: JohnnBlade on May 01, 2014, 10:09:34 PM
@Lost Bro,
Thnx man, it worked!
Since i was busy i did another core, but not knowing that when i placed the 2e core into the boiling water it cracked into 4 pieces :) so it was a good lesson not to dump a core into boiling water :)
Good shit Lost Bro!
Now lets try some Akula stuff ; )
Greets JB
Good day JohnnBlade
Super glue it!!! The core will still work, maybe the permeability is off, but still works just fine.....
take care, peace
lost_bro
Quote from: dewetw on May 02, 2014, 04:48:29 AM
Could all this be just coincidental?
More about nickel. Nickel is one of only 4 known ferromagnetic elements at room temperature. Iron(Fe), cobalt(Co) and gadolinium(Gd) being the other 3. Note: manganese(Mn) is not one of them. Why have a core based on manganese (MnZn) then and expect it to interact with an magnetic field in the same way as nickel based (NiZn) one? The QEG is based on a specific steel alloy (M19 C5, aka electrical steel) core, an alloy containing both iron(Fe). If you do not use the correct core material in the QEG it does not work. If the QEG does not go into resonance, it does not produce extra energy out. The QEG "builds up and goes into resonance". NAR? NMR? Both maybe?
I believe that what we are trying to achieve and what is being done by the QEG is the same - this is great news.
Also think about this: the bedini device only produces OU sometimes. It has been reported that the weaker ferrous magnets produce better results than neodymium magnets. Could it be because the neodymium is not one of the 4 ferro elements? - I'll investigate this further. Here too we see aligned electron spin and controlled magnetic fields.
What Akula is doing, what bedini is doing and what is claimed in the QEG just have too many coincidences to ignore. Lets use this to our advantage: find the commonalities, derive theories, test and eliminate to move forward. There is a some more interesting things to note about nickel I will communicate at a later stage.
The capetonian
And lets not forget about Stanley Meyer with his famous Stainless Steel tubeset and his 5-coil Vic set up which boasted a complex interaction between *distributed* COIL capacitance and an elusive inductance value..............
In the end even S.M. went to lengths to analyse the composition of his *original* tubeset, because even he was *not* sure of the chemical composition or processing that made his system function.
It was *speculated* that he purchased the *original* S.S. tube material from a metal scrap yard, and did *NOT* know the actual composition or *processing* used in his original tubeset.
Now rethinking along the lines presented, it could be possible that some industrial process was used on that original S.M. steel, and that that is the *trick* to making it work!!!
Yes, think outside the box.........
take care, peace
lost_bro
@ lost_bro (http://www.overunity.com/profile/lost_bro.80143/)
and people on Stanley Meyer don't know what is purpose of HF generator. I think it is for the steal plates atomic resonance, like Akula's device.
Quote from: tysb3 on May 02, 2014, 10:42:31 AM
@ lost_bro (http://www.overunity.com/profile/lost_bro.80143/)
and people on Stanley Meyer don't know what is purpose of HF generator. I think it is for the steal plates atomic resonance, like Akula's device.
Good day tysb3
Yes, exactly my point, I do *not* believe it to be coincidence and it would *not* surprise me the least to find out that the M.O. for these devices are related............
take care, peace
lost_bro
the ferro resonance could be free energy pump from the "zero point" energy.
Replication of the flashlight device by Vladik Hook.. in russian 4 clips..
"Well , I will explain the principle of resonance and how to find it . Only from my pocket harder will not : - \ .
I showed in the " Torch Video 1" I found resonance with ferrite cups, now explain in detail .
On the frame is wound coil , its inductance in cups should be 115 uH, cups on a copper foil glued to it connect oscilloscope . Generator rectangle looking resonant frequency ferrite , as it is in resonance ferroelectric his sinus will increase, the maximum amplitude of the sine - our band. It is a way to learn any frequency ferrite at home :) . Then everything is simple to use this resonance - you need to take it off , this teeter LC circuit for the frequency of resonance. One end of the circuit is always connected to the incoming capacitor , and the second key is switched . Here 's how it works , but on the Soviet ferrites is easy."
Vladik Hook...
Vadik Hook,, Akula0083 replication 1 watt device..
Flashlight 4 video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk)
#3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWjs0-WCMzs&list=UU3TN2P5gnS3l3mm-Qf53eqQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWjs0-WCMzs&list=UU3TN2P5gnS3l3mm-Qf53eqQ)
#2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juwm_W5-qAM&list=UU3TN2P5gnS3l3mm-Qf53eqQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juwm_W5-qAM&list=UU3TN2P5gnS3l3mm-Qf53eqQ)
#1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_8OlH4kkKM&list=UU3TN2P5gnS3l3mm-Qf53eqQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_8OlH4kkKM&list=UU3TN2P5gnS3l3mm-Qf53eqQ)
Acca..[/font]
The #3 is very convincing.
;)
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 02, 2014, 07:38:16 PM
The #3 is very convincing.
;)
Yea very convincing super capacitor connected to jule theaf :)
It works until small super capacitor is drained and than stops
Quote from: NETIKS on May 02, 2014, 08:25:03 PM
Yea very convincing super capacitor connected to jule theaf :)
It works until small super capacitor is drained and than stops
Yes, the circuit works great as a JT all right, although the current can be a bit higher than a real JT might need. But at 10 mA input the LEDs are still pretty darn bright and the thing will run on a 3V button cell like CR2016 for eight hours or more. (I hope you saw the alt.snakeoil Video Report.)
So a supercap that would keep it going for ten or twenty minutes isn't too hard to imagine. And the circuit would behave just in that way, too, when he turned the pot past the optimum point. Goes out, then needs to be retuned/recharged.
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 02, 2014, 11:08:56 PM
So a supercap that would keep it going for ten or twenty minutes isn't too hard to imagine.
The author would have to reskin the supercap because the videos show regular electrolytic cap labeling and cans.
Also a supercap can be conceivably inserted inside a gutted electolytic cap if it is smaller. Like in a Russian Matryoshka Doll (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matryoshka_doll).
I think Akula was accused of this Matryoshka technique on a Russian forum and that's why he gutted his electrolytic caps on video later.
Vadik Guk never gutted his elcaps on video.
More about magnetism, quantum state, aligning of particles and the materials involved. Note the part where he says "no one can explain it"
:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFAOXdXZ5TM
and this one...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TKSfAkWWN0
Quote from: verpies on May 03, 2014, 03:12:21 AM
The author would have to reskin the supercap because the videos show regular electrolytic cap labeling and cans.
Possibly, but here is a 50 farad supercap that looks like a regular cap unless the video or photos are very clear. I have some of these that are 10 Farads and I have to have my glasses on to tell them from my other caps. It has the same style stripe on the side to show the - lead. You can run for a very long time on 50 farads.
Bill
Quote from: Pirate88179 on May 03, 2014, 11:13:21 AM
Possibly, but here is a 50 farad supercap that looks like a regular cap unless the video or photos are very clear. I have some of these that are 10 Farads and I have to have my glasses on to tell them from my other caps. It has the same style stripe on the side to show the - lead. You can run for a very long time on 50 farads.
Bill
Thats what Im talking about :)
Quote from: tysb3 on May 02, 2014, 11:39:31 AM
the ferro resonance could be free energy pump from the "zero point" energy.
Please, nuclear man, stop pontificating.
We need facts, not conspiracies theories and half-baked populist miracle ideas.
~A
Quote from: avalon on May 03, 2014, 11:46:41 AM
Please, nuclear man, stop pontificating.
We need facts, not conspiracies theories and half-baked populist miracle ideas.
~A
I don't want to start wasting this place arguing to mentally weak people. If you want to arguing with me then open the new thread.
there was my discussion about this with people like you: http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=1195.200 now I don't have registration there.
Quote from: Pirate88179 on May 03, 2014, 11:13:21 AM
Possibly, but here is a 50 farad supercap that looks like a regular cap unless the video or photos are very clear.
I remember that in those videos I could read the capacity of one of them in µF.
The other one I don't remember but magpwr reverse-engineered these videos in details and is more authoritative about them.
Quote from: verpies on May 03, 2014, 12:35:13 PM
I remember that in those videos I could read the capacity of one of them in µF.
The other one I don't remember but magpwr reverse-engineered these videos in details and is more authoritative about them.
100Farad 2.7V
Quote from: verpies on May 03, 2014, 12:35:13 PM
I remember that in those videos I could read the capacity of one of them in µF.
The other one I don't remember but magpwr reverse-engineered these videos in details and is more authoritative about them.
Yes, I think I saw that on one of those caps in video 3...I could not make out any writing on the other one. Just a possibility to consider.
Bill
Quote from: tysb3 on May 03, 2014, 12:30:18 PM
my discussion about this with people like you: http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=1195.200 now I don't have registration there.
Calm down, atomic boy. I am sure no one wants to argue with you.
Just asking you to stick to the topic, leaving your exciting opinions and brilliant ideas on various matters to yourself.
~A
N.B. You are not from Chernobyl by any chance?
Ok, another replication attempt with similar results as the ones before on this thread.
Using the TKLABS V1.4 diagram (thanks TK), with some component modifications for:
the transistor, its an IRFS630a MOSFET
The D1 diode is an MUR120
The inverter is a HEF4069UBP
The transformer is a E-core for the time being with low inductance, but with the copper tape both inside and outside.
the rest is as close as i could get it with the components available.
supply voltage and potmeter adjustments is very critical as mentioned before.
First run trail today, see screenshot and video.
Screenshot shows:
Purple trace (3) drain voltage
green trace (4) gate signal
yellow trace (1) top of D1 diode (MUR120)
blue trace (2) pin13
All with reference to ground.
Video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35HnqJeJzJs&feature=youtu.be
Regards Itsu
Quote from: itsu on May 03, 2014, 05:05:53 PM
Ok, another replication attempt with similar results as the ones before on this thread.
the transistor, its an IRFS630a MOSFET
Regards Itsu
You guys do know a PNP != FET ... the current doesn't go through the gate, and you'll likely need a pulldown to relieve the gate voltage...
a transistor the current always flows from the gate ... so it is a self pulldown...
so this inverter chip; is it meant for a mosfet or a transistor?
Edited: nevermind; I know the point isn't how it should conventionally work... maybe the specs are confused because it's an exploit of a flawed thing
so ya; ignore that
Quote from: itsu on May 03, 2014, 05:05:53 PM
Ok, another replication attempt with similar results as the ones before on this thread.
Using the TKLABS V1.4 diagram (thanks TK), with some component modifications for:
the transistor, its an IRFS630a MOSFET
The D1 diode is an MUR120
The inverter is a HEF4069UBP
The transformer is a E-core for the time being with low inductance, but with the copper tape both inside and outside.
the rest is as close as i could get it with the components available.
supply voltage and potmeter adjustments is very critical as mentioned before.
First run trail today, see screenshot and video.
Screenshot shows:
Purple trace (3) drain voltage
green trace (4) gate signal
yellow trace (1) top of D1 diode (MUR120)
blue trace (2) pin13
All with reference to ground.
Video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35HnqJeJzJs&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35HnqJeJzJs&feature=youtu.be)
Regards Itsu
Looks nice Itsu... you are off to a good start I think. You can already see one thing: your mosfet isn't really switching at all, the Drain is staying at Battery voltage, yet you have oscillation bursts and the beginnings of a sinus signal. Do you have the larger inductance on the 34063 side? If not.... try it. Also try sticking an NPN transistor in there instead of the mosfet. B=G, C=D, E=S.
The schematic in that nice format is, I think, originally verpies's work, and it has gone through some changes, as you see. My last version is still working strong, drawing about 10 mA, making the approved waveforms, humming the ferrite, but the LEDs still go out when I pull the power.
:'(
Delamorta video 4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk)
Did everyone see the spacer in the center of the pot core at time 1:20?
Quote from: dewetw on May 01, 2014, 06:09:31 PM
Lasersaber
has done some increadible work based on the same look pot core, check his video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dq9NQhzdw0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dq9NQhzdw0)
Cool! 8)
Quote from: dllabarre on May 03, 2014, 10:11:07 PM
Delamorta video 4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk)
Did everyone see the spacer in the center of the pot core at time 1:20?
Yes, see.
Quote from: dllabarre on May 03, 2014, 10:11:07 PM
Delamorta video 4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYEuV-ji4tk)
Did everyone see the spacer in the center of the pot core at time 1:20?
hi dllabarre,
I was thinking if this dielectric was a just piece paper cut into circle" or a circular piezo element."I know i can't cut hard paper into a perfect small circle such as these unless i have the right tool"
Maybe "piezo produce electricity or electrical spikes" from the "vibration" between the 2 half of the ferrite pot core based on original circuit diagram."I know this is a long shot" :D
In science we got to look at things from various angle which produce interesting answers from each and every individuals.
TKola and others you use 5,4 and 2,7 milihenries, but here can be 54 and 27 milihenries. I calculate that about 130-190 turns have 54 milihenries coil of this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGjlXAHpMKI (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGjlXAHpMKI) And he core can be big and have hight prmability.
Quote from: MenofFather on May 04, 2014, 04:42:51 AM
TKola and others you use 5,4 and 2,7 milihenries, but here can be 54 and 27 milihenries. I calculate that about 130-190 turns have 54 milihenries coil of this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGjlXAHpMKI (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGjlXAHpMKI) And he core can be big and have hight prmability.
hi Menofather,
Since you are able to understand Akula words better than us why not you try to replicate the device and then show us where we had done wrong.
I will be happy to listen to you after your successful replication."I am still learning"
May be can help to someone...
it would be important that loops in cores not be conductive; and hence spaced... if your ferrites are conductive; I assume some ceramics aren't.
Okay Every time I see a schematic like laser saber's and TK's I go rewatch the video... the foil connections are not part of the higher inductance coil.
http://youtu.be/Lpx1SJdXnmo?t=5m38s
Which means, given 2 coils, and 2 foils, and 1 coil not connected to a foil at all... means the other coil is the only one connected.
THe fist foil is cut, and it is attached to a wire that goes deep into the coil, and is somewhat not near any other wire... then the primary which is from 2 long leads...
someone said my picture was a joke... I don't know what your source is for the schematics but they're still not correct...
Quote from: 4Tesla on May 04, 2014, 12:19:01 AM
Cool! 8)
You connect 100farad small super capacitor and it will run for days on one charge but the light intensity is low
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 03, 2014, 08:45:59 PM
Looks nice Itsu... you are off to a good start I think. You can already see one thing: your mosfet isn't really switching at all, the Drain is staying at Battery voltage, yet you have oscillation bursts and the beginnings of a sinus signal. Do you have the larger inductance on the 34063 side? If not.... try it. Also try sticking an NPN transistor in there instead of the mosfet. B=G, C=D, E=S.
The schematic in that nice format is, I think, originally verpies's work, and it has gone through some changes, as you see. My last version is still working strong, drawing about 10 mA, making the approved waveforms, humming the ferrite, but the LEDs still go out when I pull the power.
:'(
Yes, i was wondering what that MOSFET/Transistor is doing there as all the symptomes (oscillations, blinking leds, humming transformer) can be seen without it switching, so i guess these symptomes are not what we looking for.
I swapped the transformers severall times and ended up with the larger (i have 1:3) inductance at the 34063 side to come up with this present signal
In the other situation (larger inductance at the inverter side) i have mainly evenly spread higher frequency pulses which give no reaction at all on pin13.
I will use transistors as well in the next tests.
I followed your testing with the 4069 only (no 34063, no coils) using the FG as input on pin 13 and could recreate those same signals, only my supply voltage needed to be more (between 3.5 - 4V) to get these same results.
When i receive my pot cores, i will double check on the winding/construction of the coil/foil as like d3x0r says, it could be constructed wrongly now as i have it (like in the diagram).
Regards Itsu
Quote from: magpwr on May 04, 2014, 04:57:49 AM
hi Menofather,
Since you are able to understand Akula words better than us why not you try to replicate the device and then show us where we had done wrong.
I will be happy to listen to you after your successful replication."I am still learning"
Because you replicating, I working on other divices and I not have that wire. I not beleave that here enouch information to replicate me sucsesffuly, but others belive and replicating and maybe more know how 14 ping generator work and in electronic. They bulded that schematic, so them easily something change, I not build that schematic, so me harded make this schematic. If somebody not like building how I advicing, then can not build.
Is he on this forum?
Quote from: verpies on May 04, 2014, 10:59:18 AM
Is he on this forum?
http://www.overunity.com/profile/lasersaber.21749/
http://laserhacker.com/?p=401
Quote from: MenofFather on May 04, 2014, 04:42:51 AM
TKola and others you use 5,4 and 2,7 milihenries, but here can be 54 and 27 milihenries. I calculate that about 130-190 turns have 54 milihenries coil of this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGjlXAHpMKI (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGjlXAHpMKI) And he core can be big and have hight prmability.
Perhaps you have made another error in your calculations, because I have well over 300 turns of #27 on the coil on a good flyback ferrite and it only measures 20 mH. There is simply not enough room on the bobbin for two coils at 54 and 27 mH unless one uses very fine wire.
AND not only that but your oscillation and burst frequencies will be much lower than those shown on Akula's scopeshot if you use the heavier inductances.
If you think otherwise, that is fine..... as long as you can provide some experimental evidence for your thinking. Remember... I actually have data from a real device that support my contentions.... not just calculations.
Quote from: 4Tesla on May 04, 2014, 11:10:21 AM
http://www.overunity.com/profile/lasersaber.21749/ (http://www.overunity.com/profile/lasersaber.21749/)
http://laserhacker.com/?p=401 (http://laserhacker.com/?p=401)
Yes, he checks in here sometimes, when he's not too busy actually performing his laboratory work.
Quote from: NETIKS on May 04, 2014, 05:58:02 AM
You connect 100farad small super capacitor and it will run for days on one charge but the light intensity is low
That's right, and even on a smaller, non-supercap one can keep a LED or two lit up brilliantly for long enough to do a YT demonstration. One can even charge the system wirelessly.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvfXdEb4xKM
Quote from: MenofFather on May 04, 2014, 06:11:54 AM
Because you replicating, I working on other divices and I not have that wire. I not beleave that here enouch information to replicate me sucsesffuly, but others belive and replicating and maybe more know how 14 ping generator work and in electronic. They bulded that schematic, so them easily something change, I not build that schematic, so me harded make this schematic. If somebody not like building how I advicing, then can not build.
By "14 ping generator" you are referring to the hex inverter chip? The 74x14 chip is a Schmitt Trigger Hex Inverter, it is used just like a 4069.
http://www.talkingelectronics.com/pay/BEC-2/Page49.html
On some of the Vadik Guk schematics like the one below a couple of the gates of this inverter appear to be used as an oscillator, so could be called a "generator" of sorts. But in the schematic I am using all of this has been removed and only one gate of the inverter is used and so it is _not_ a "generator" of any kind, it simply produces the 180 degree phase difference between the "load" 100R signal and the burst oscillations.
In the other thread you are asking, I think, about how to synchronize the two 494 oscillators or establish a phase relationship. The phase relationship Akula shows in the scopeshots are, I think, produced by the Phase-Locked Loop (PLL) chip CD4046 in one of the schematics, but it may also be possible to synch the two 494s without the PLL.
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 04, 2014, 11:36:52 AM
By "14 ping generator" you are referring to the hex inverter chip?
I now have Vadik guc circuit with 16 pin instead 14 pin chip. But I not known that make more, for me not working Vadim Guk divice. Here is not easy rewound and finding needed wire and wasting time.
Попробовал я эту схему Вадима ещё раз. Без 16 ногового генератора катушки. Идут на перво ножки и минусе пачки импульсов примерно с 50 процентов скважностью и после пачек синусйдальное затухание. Вот почему пачки импульсов идут ,то я не понял. Питал от 2-3 вольт. Пачек частота около 500 герц.
Quote from: MenofFather on May 04, 2014, 12:27:50 PM
I now have Vadik Guk's circuit with 16 pin instead 14 pin chip.
What is the part number of the chip?
Ok, same circuit (TKLABS V1.4) with same components, now with much higher inductance on the E-core transformer.
I have one side 600mH, other side 100mH :o
After some testing i found that the higher inductance coil should go to the inverter (W2)
This way the 1:6 ratio ensures an adequate input pulse for this inverter to produce a good output (gate) signal.
I get the following screenshot (to get the MOSFET activated i needed to raise the supply voltage to 4V (@ 100mA).
All signals compared to ground
CH1 (yellow) top of D1 diode
CH2 (blue) pin 13
CH3 (purple) gate MOSFET (pin 12)
CH4 (green) Drain MOSFET
Regards Itsu
Quote from: itsu on May 04, 2014, 04:53:01 PM
Ok, same circuit (TKLABS V1.4) with same components, now with much higher inductance on the E-core transformer.
I have one side 600mH, other side 100mH :o
After some testing i found that the higher inductance coil should go to the inverter (W2)
This way the 1:6 ratio ensures an adequate input pulse for this inverter to produce a good output (gate) signal.
I get the following screenshot (to get the MOSFET activated i needed to raise the supply voltage to 4V (@ 100mA).
All signals compared to ground
CH1 (yellow) top of D1 diode
CH2 (blue) pin 13
CH3 (purple) gate MOSFET (pin 12)
CH4 (green) Drain MOSFET
Regards Itsu
Looking good... but look at the frequency!
Your very heavy inductances are causing the whole circuit to operate much more slowly than Akula's. In Akula's scopeshot and in my most recent ones, we are using 1 ms/horizontal division and the frequency of the sinus and oscillation bursts is around 280-310 Hz.
You are operating at about 20 Hz, with scope set to 20 ms/division!
Also note that within the oscillation bursts the embedded sinus goes to the zero baseline rather than following the inverter's sinus. This is caused, I think, by the fact that you are providing "adequate" voltage of 4 V rather than just 3V to the circuit.
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 05, 2014, 01:37:36 AM
Looking good... but look at the frequency!
Your very heavy inductances are causing the whole circuit to operate much more slowly than Akula's. In Akula's scopeshot and in my most recent ones, we are using 1 ms/horizontal division and the frequency of the sinus and oscillation bursts is around 280-310 Hz.
You are operating at about 20 Hz, with scope set to 20 ms/division!
Also note that within the oscillation bursts the embedded sinus goes to the zero baseline rather than following the inverter's sinus. This is caused, I think, by the fact that you are providing "adequate" voltage of 4 V rather than just 3V to the circuit.
Right, so lets see what happens when i decent to more normal (in this case) inductances by first lowering the inductance to
the initial reported 54/27 mH, then to 5.4/2.7 mH and finally to 170/300 uH as reported on page 1 of this thread.
For getting back to 3V supply voltage i probably need to use a transistor or a lower G/D voltage MOSFET.
Thanks, regards Itsu
Quote from: MenofFather on May 05, 2014, 01:46:48 AM
HCF4049...
The 4049 is a 16-pin inverting hex buffer. Pins 13 and 16 have no function and are not connected in the chip. It is a 14 pin chip in a 16 pin DIP package.
IMHO, the schematic from the Wesley video with the grayed areas and big X through the inverter is a less viable schematic than the schematic offered by verpies, Vadik Guk and others. Is there really a good reason to use that schematic. What is the rationale?
The schematic I question has an FET or transistor and resistor doing little more than loading the supply and producing the sine wave ripple. This seems to be wasteful of input power.
Most of the other Akula schematics show the mixing of two frequencies in the transformer. I will pursue that approach.
I get a lot of interesting audible ferrite singing at certain settings of the 4069 frequency adjust pot.
Of course since no one has a runner, it is only an opinion, to each his own.
My build attached.
The mosfet/bipolar transistor does not produce the sine wave in the Akula circuit and it does not function by loading down the positive rail. The sinus is produced by the burst oscillations, not the other way around. It has nothing to do with the transistor other than providing a gate/base signal thru the inverter. The proof of this is that the sinus and burst oscillations occur even when the transistor/mosfet is not switching at all, as you can see from my scopeshots and even from Itsu's first shot.
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 05, 2014, 08:14:34 AM
The mosfet/bipolar transistor does not produce the sine wave in the Akula circuit and it does not function by loading down the positive rail. The sinus is produced by the burst oscillations, not the other way around. It has nothing to do with the transistor other than providing a gate/base signal thru the inverter. The proof of this is that the sinus and burst oscillations occur even when the transistor/mosfet is not switching at all, as you can see from my scopeshots and even from Itsu's first shot.
Yes, I can agree with that, the bursts load the supply causing the ripple sine. Either that or the sine is superimposed on C5 by the output of W2.
But lets get to the meat of the question from the first line i.e. the rationale for using a scratched out portion of a schematic from the video. Also, what is the proposed utility of the FET and load resistor R3?
Note also that in the diagram in question C5 effectively shorts the output of winding #2 at high frequencies, creating quite a stress on the driver transistor in the chip and further reducing efficiency. It is a good thing there is current limiting in that 34063 chip.
Would anyone agree that most of the other Akula designs utilize the mixing of two frequencies in the transformer, or at least a variable bias to the core in one of the windings?
Of course I understand that there is no obligation for you or anyone to answer, I am presenting these questions respectfully as they have troubled me.
Quote from: Vortex1 on May 05, 2014, 08:32:37 AM
But lets get to the meat of the question from the first line i.e. the rationale for using a scratched out portion of a schematic from the video.
Since you insist...
The only reason, that I am aware of, for using the scratched out circuit from the Akula's video is that it is the most recent chronologically.
Yes, Vortex1,
try mixing 2 frequencies at 3:1 ratio in the core,
as this will add up the amplitude, if they are in phase and gets nonlinear mixing, due to core saturation
nonlinearity.
Then try to use the frequencies that also ring your ferrite core and see, if you
can extract from this mechanical ringing matched to the LC resonance
with these 2 frequencies, where one frequency is an overtone or lower harmonic and the other is the exact
mechanical ringing frequency,
some good extraction of energy.
Many thanks.
Regards, Stefan.
JUST IN CASE the answer to the following question is "No", use a springy (non dampening) spacer between the potcore halves.
Q: "A magnet is pulled out of a shorted superconducting aircoil. Does the final current induced in that coil depend on how quickly the magnet is pulled out ?".
Quote from: Vortex1 on May 05, 2014, 08:32:37 AM
Yes, I can agree with that, the bursts load the supply causing the ripple sine. Either that or the sine is superimposed on C5 by the output of W2.
But lets get to the meat of the question from the first line i.e. the rationale for using a scratched out portion of a schematic from the video. Also, what is the proposed utility of the FET and load resistor R3?
I don't think I'm using the "scratched out" or rather greyed out portion of a schematic. Please see below.
The FET and the R3 appear in the schematic that is purportedly the schematic used to make the scopeshot and the "perpetual" shining LEDs. Beyond that you will have to ask Akula what they might be for.
Quote
Note also that in the diagram in question C5 effectively shorts the output of winding #2 at high frequencies, creating quite a stress on the driver transistor in the chip and further reducing efficiency. It is a good thing there is current limiting in that 34063 chip.
Yes I see that. That's one reason why you can't use very small inductances like the microHenry range. The input current goes way up and the chip heats significantly, even on the 3.0 volt supply.
Quote
Would anyone agree that most of the other Akula designs utilize the mixing of two frequencies in the transformer, or at least a variable bias to the core in one of the windings?
Of course I understand that there is no obligation for you or anyone to answer, I am presenting these questions respectfully as they have troubled me.
Yes, that's what it looks like to me. That is the Red Herring in these designs. They all (when corrected properly) "work" to produce the waveforms and measurements (under power) just fine, and the "theory" of ferroresonance, beat notes, phase reinforcement, resonant pumping, all of that is the saturated color of the Red Herring. You chase after the Red Herring, thinking it will lead you to the Bright Shiny Objects.... but in reality you are just another fish and if you aren't careful you'll get eaten by the sharks.
Even in this design, as you can see in the original Vadik Guk version above, there are two oscillators meant to be beating against each other. (Some stages of the inverter are used as oscillator, and in the "scratched out" portion of the diagram below, the same is happening.)
Thank you for your thoughts on this. Attached below are the two schematics I have on file, one by Vadik Guk, another variation by verpies.
In the Wesley video schematic, around the scratched out 4069, I see two oscillators, but these seem to be stand alone LED pulsers, thus not very influential to the core except for loading effects of the supply. The remaining inverter (pins 12,13) appears to be sensing voltage on W2 and acting as a driver for the FET. Again this FET and resistor seem to be directly shunting the supply and does not seem to have a useful purpose, unless it's purpose is to provide a variable loading of the rails based on W2 output.
This schematic (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/138063/) was an earlier work in progress based on magpwr's reverse-engineering work done directly from Vadik Guk's video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWjs0-WCMzs&list=UU3TN2P5gnS3l3mm-Qf53eqQ). This schematic is not accurate.
The other schematic (http://www.overunity.com/14378/akula0083-30-watt-self-running-generator/msg397642/#msg397642) is a more recent one drawn by me after Semenihin-77 posted his schematic of the same circuit here (http://www.overunity.com/14378/akula0083-30-watt-self-running-generator/msg397475/#msg397475). This schematic is accurate if Semenihin-77 posted a good info.
Quote from: itsu on May 04, 2014, 04:53:01 PM
Ok, same circuit (TKLABS V1.4) with same components, now with much higher inductance on the E-core transformer.
I have one side 600mH, other side 100mH :o
After some testing i found that the higher inductance coil should go to the inverter (W2)
This way the 1:6 ratio ensures an adequate input pulse for this inverter to produce a good output (gate) signal.
I get the following screenshot (to get the MOSFET activated i needed to raise the supply voltage to 4V (@ 100mA).
All signals compared to ground
CH1 (yellow) top of D1 diode
CH2 (blue) pin 13
CH3 (purple) gate MOSFET (pin 12)
CH4 (green) Drain MOSFET
Regards Itsu
This looks just spot on.
As a matter of interest, have you checked the native resonance frequency for the core?
~A
Quote from: avalon on May 05, 2014, 12:32:09 PM
This looks just spot on.
As a matter of interest, have you checked the native resonance frequency for the core?
~A
no, i have not checked that, you mean like this E-core picture?
@All,
I also was wondering what this MOSFET/transistors function was in this circuit, anyway i have swapped the MOSFET for a transistor (MJE13009) and now i can get a similar screenshot as the earlier one, but now with a supply voltage of 2.3V (@50mA) see screenshot below.
Still with this high inductance (100mH/600mH) in the transformer.
Same setup as earlier screenshot, but purple is now on the base, green the collector.
Regards Itsu
Itsu:
Your waveforms look quite normal for TKLABS v1.4 schematic.
The modulation and cutoff of the switcher resulting in the sine wave seem reasonable for a secondary loaded with a 100uF capacitor. This is like the switcher looking into a near dead short at high frequencies (not considering leakage inductance and esr of the capacitor.)
If you want more "action" try the Vadik Guk or verpies schematic version posted above. The switcher chip will operate in a more normal mode without such a difficult capacitive load on the secondary.
Regards, ION
Quote from: avalon on May 05, 2014, 12:32:09 PM
This looks just spot on.
As a matter of interest, have you checked the native resonance frequency for the core?
~A
Spot on -- nearly --, but at 1/20 the frequency of Akula's scopeshot. Also the embedded sinus is showing adequate supply voltage to the 34063: it is switching cleanly rather than following the sinusoid during the bursts.
Guys,
Let's think about this more analytically.
The two core halves apparently are vibrating mechanically, creating a variable air-gap between them.
The variable air-gap means that any coil wound on this core possesses variable inductance (dL/dt).
This variation is in all probability sinusoidal because elastic bouncing and mass-spring vibrations are inherently sinusoidal.
The variation in this inductance can be sensed on-the-fly with high frequency LC oscillator formed by one of the windings resulting in frequency modulation (FM) or by measuring the rise-time of the current ramp (di/dt) when this winding is charged by a constant voltage source.
When a constant frequency PWM modulator chip is supplied with smooth voltage source and subjected to a constant load while its output is connected to such variable inductance winding and its feedback loop is correctly configured - its driving output will experience pulse width modulation (PWM) proportional to the inductance of the winding.
If the PWM modulator chip is operating at relatively high frequency, the integration of these variable pulse widths will yield a low frequency signal that is proportional to the air-gap between core halves.
It can be argued that this LF signal also represents an instantaneous width of that air-gap ...or relative position of core halves.
All very straightforward and conventional like in a linear inductive encoder (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_encoder).
Inductance of the transformer coils reduced to 56mH and 27mH.
As always, the core halfs firmly forced together by electrical tape with a piece of paper inbetween the 2 outer legs of the e-core.
Highest inductance to W2 as the other way around gave no stable signals no matter how i varied the voltage and/or the pot meter.
No sign of any prolonged functioning after removing the supply voltage (here again 2.3V @50mA)
The transistor (MJE13009) still in use.
Note the pin 13 sign wave now increased to 53Hz.
Next will be further reducing of the inductance to 5.6 and 2.7mH
Regards Itsu
Quote from: itsu on May 06, 2014, 04:24:59 PM
Inductance of the transformer coils reduced to 56mH and 27mH.
As always, the core halfs firmly forced together by electrical tape with a piece of paper inbetween the 2 outer legs of the e-core.
Highest inductance to W2 as the other way around gave no stable signals no matter how i varied the voltage and/or the pot meter.
No sign of any prolonged functioning after removing the supply voltage (here again 2.3V @50mA)
The transistor (MJE13009) still in use.
Note the pin 13 sign wave now increased to 53Hz.
Next will be further reducing of the inductance to 5.6 and 2.7mH
Regards Itsu
hi Tinselkoala and itsu,
There is one small noticable difference between Akula's version and Tinselkoala along with itsu.
I have attached the edited scope shot to show where i spotted something like
"resonance within resonance" at these area.Upon observing carefully i can't help noticing for Akula there is much more of resonance within resonance base on scope shot provided from him.
I only spotted the difference only after itsu provided his latest scope shot which i compared against Tinselkoala's base on my memory then compared against Akula version.
Got to rush off bye for now.....
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 27, 2014, 02:21:44 PM
8) I think one of Akula's traces might be inverted.
(My shot: Both channels at 2v/div, 5 ms/div horizontal. Bottom channel is inverted in scope.)
So I surmise that Itsu's scopeshots are different because none of his channels are inverted
Quote from: itsu on May 06, 2014, 04:24:59 PM
As always, the core halves firmly forced together by electrical tape with a piece of paper in between the 2 outer legs of the e-core.
How does the LF sinus signal frequency respond to various tensions squeezing the core ?
Quote from: verpies on May 06, 2014, 07:22:27 PM
How does the LF sinus signal frequency respond to various tensions squeezing the core ?
I think with the screw through a pot core, that it is very tightly compressed... maybe 20-50 inch-pounds
don't go chasing waterfalls?
Kinda wish there was just a thumbs up button (for magpwr's post)
might be fun to strip the black backgrounds to alpha and overlay things
(not for me just sayin)
Quote from: magpwr on May 06, 2014, 06:22:56 PM
hi Tinselkoala and itsu,
There is one small noticable difference between Akula's version and Tinselkoala along with itsu.
I have attached the edited scope shot to show where i spotted something like "resonance within resonance" at these area.Upon observing carefully i can't help noticing for Akula there is much more of resonance within resonance base on scope shot provided from him.
I only spotted the difference only after itsu provided his latest scope shot which i compared against Tinselkoala's base on my memory then compared against Akula version.
Got to rush off bye for now.....
I think that happens when the supply voltage isn't adequate for the 34063. Instead of dropping all the way to the baseline, the bottom of the chip's pulse oscillations only follows that sinus shape. If you increase the supply voltage a tiny bit, or even change the setpoint pot, the chip will switch fully and the embedded sinus within the pulse "boxes" or bursts goes away. The parts between the pulses will still be there.
Quote from: verpies on May 06, 2014, 07:22:27 PM
How does the LF sinus signal frequency respond to various tensions squeezing the core ?
The tighter you have the core squeezed, the lower the frequency of the sinus. If you separate the core the frequency goes up and up until it drops out.
This of course is because this changing gap changes the inductance of the coils. It also must change the dimensional resonant characteristics of the core.
I think I illustrated this in one of the videos.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHAc7kDY4-w (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHAc7kDY4-w)
around 4 minute mark. I think I got the directions right.
Quote from: magpwr on May 06, 2014, 06:22:56 PM
hi Tinselkoala and itsu,
There is one small noticable difference between Akula's version and Tinselkoala along with itsu.
I have attached the edited scope shot to show where i spotted something like "resonance within resonance" at these area.Upon observing carefully i can't help noticing for Akula there is much more of resonance within resonance base on scope shot provided from him.
I only spotted the difference only after itsu provided his latest scope shot which i compared against Tinselkoala's base on my memory then compared against Akula version.
Got to rush off bye for now.....
Sigh....
I apologize for having a better screen resolution on my scope..... :-\
(Note that the frequency of the sinus and bursts is about 300-310 Hz, not the higher figure given in the "measurement" box.)
I took a little time to grok the skematic.
If the LED is on (which is a result of switching on the self triggered primary)
then the chip is on... (the second half the k561(unspellable)h2 )
which I guess then becomes another signal geneartor? not sure of the internals of the k561? ya okay they're just gates looped to be a pll of sorts that allows the secondary to back pulse...
I seee..... it's one of those phase-matching things too... so it's using a transformer bidirectionally...
I dunno it looks like a bleed valve ....
... so the VCC from the chip is gates to the gate ..
-------
Okay so right; the right side is a frequency delay probably with self feedback in lack of other stimulus... driven by the primary from the mc403063 thing;
so it's a bidirectional communication ... so side a drive results on side b and side b drive (but how is it you can drive and receive? well.. that's the magic of the right side, it allows a bleed in the opposite direction ..
and I guess on the source side, the noisier/sharaper the square waves, every wave is part of a perfect square pulse but we know that
hmmmm
so that's what happens when the second side doesn't work...
so okay schematic done; and the right side turns out to be intended to work but doesn't... so that terminates in a capacitor.
Now if the drawing of the foil windings connected to the others was correct....
Mangled schematic.
Edit2 : Added dots to indicate start of winding.. both windings in same direction
Quote from: d3x0r on May 06, 2014, 09:56:55 PM
Mangled schematic.
Edit2 : Added dots to indicate start of winding.. both windings in same direction
You are "assuming" that the designer of the circuit intended for the burst oscillations to drive the lower-frequency switching of the secondary, thus achieving something like phase-synchrony or locking, at different frequencies. But what reason do you have for your assumption? Maybe the 100R resistor is supposed to add energy by converting some of its mass, under the influence of the spiky oscillation bursts, and feed this energy back into the system via radiant energy. That could be why the CMOS - type inverter is specified. Couldn't it?
My point is that there is no evidence that the various circuit tricks to synchronize two sets of oscillations, fast and slow, have anything to do with the LEDs remaining lit. You are chasing Red Herrings.
But if you must, you can try the original Guk version or one of the more recent suggestions up above, where the right-hand coil part is actually switched by the transistor/mosfet in one way or another. However I think you will find that your resulting waveforms may be different _than what Akula actually showed_.
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 07, 2014, 05:00:26 AM
You are "assuming" that the designer of the circuit intended for the burst oscillations to drive the lower-frequency switching of the secondary, thus achieving something like phase-synchrony or locking, at different frequencies. But what reason do you have for your assumption? Maybe the 100R resistor is supposed to add energy by converting some of its mass, under the influence of the spiky oscillation bursts, and feed this energy back into the system via radiant energy. That could be why the CMOS - type inverter is specified. Couldn't it?
My point is that there is no evidence that the various circuit tricks to synchronize two sets of oscillations, fast and slow, have anything to do with the LEDs remaining lit. You are chasing Red Herrings.
But if you must, you can try the original Guk version or one of the more recent suggestions up above, where the right-hand coil part is actually switched by the transistor/mosfet in one way or another. However I think you will find that your resulting waveforms may be different _than what Akula actually showed_.
no I'm assuming that akula is correct when he states, he started probing the circuit, and found out the other half was actually defunct. (so beyond your lots of words to hide the fact that the coil is wrong what's your point? you're not even commenting about my anaylysis of the circuit in d3x0rese terms....
and as then no schematic matches the coil akula uses.
but besides that; could put it in a sim and give it sufficient power and see what it does given a sine wave with proper power... or you could jump proper power to it and pulse it inline and see....
Edit: and I'm not assuming the designer intneded for the busts... I *think* he was trying to head in a different direction and found that worked out better anyway.
Quote from: verpies on May 06, 2014, 07:18:29 PM
So I surmise that Itsu's scopeshots are different because none of his channels are inverted
Well, i can "fix" that by swapping the W2 leads over.
Concerning the squeezing i can concure with TK's comments.
Regards Itsu
Well... the upper left pin of the pin 1 of the mc34063 is where akula's video indicate noise... so I don't see what that would have to do with wither a mosfet or a transistor in the spot that's been swapped...
so what pin 13 of the right side thing is receiving is a sine wave... I think everyone has demonstrated that... but does anything in side 2 really have to be there after pin 13?
right? that's what I just saw when I rewatched it... and I think that's what you guys have.. pin 1 left, pin 13 of right in yellow and blue?
Edit: Prefix: Meant to say, I think you guys have the driver part of the circuit OK ... right? you're just missing sustenance.
so the sine wave on the yellow is a reflection of the sine wave that's on the blue that doesn't really do anything... there would have to be a diode between the cap and the coil, otherwise the first thing the cap will do is dump back into the coil and never have a chance to power the chip... which is reflected back to the primary and ends up being the real power to the load...
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 06, 2014, 09:34:05 PM
Sigh....
I apologize for having a better screen resolution on my scope..... :-\
(Note that the frequency of the sinus and bursts is about 300-310 Hz, not the higher figure given in the "measurement" box.)
hi Tinselkoala,
Long story short -Tinselkoala you have successfully replicated the waveform as revealed by Akula."I can feel you are really close"
After seeing the recent replies from you with Akula screenshot.
It just hit me
"peak burst" isn't as high or higher than the sinewave at pin 1.This is it
"the missing ingredient" i have found out why the device you have built wasn't going into overunity(forever) mode. :D
Do observe carefully at the edited Akula screenshot as attached where we can see the burst is higher than the sinewave at pin 1 before diode.
This burst is what making his device run in over-unity mode without needing external power source.
Solution-
At this moment what i can think in order to resolve the issue your having
in order to get your "burst peak" higher than sine wave is to do a basic modification to the circuit schematic itself.
My justification in editing this circuit as attached-we know that higher dc source or boosted dc source in this case will produce higher "Bemf"/Burst peak as compared to using the lower voltage source which was in this case 3volt or little less."This is a known fact lower dc voltage source will yield lower bemf even if pulsing at the optimal frequency"
-------------------------------------------
Another /not recommended /crazy/alternative way(But does not give the solution) to get your circuit to go into fake ou mode without battery once oscillation started is to inject BURST signal(With higher peak than sinewave) at the pin 1(MC34063) but triggering signal should only start at the right point in sine-wave.
"This 2nd part maybe a time wasting suggestion"
I also noticed that ... he has the scope ground connected to the board... that means he's grounded too... could be floating power back from there... (more probably if it's a battery powered meter, but grounded none-the-less)
Quote from: itsu on May 07, 2014, 05:19:47 AM
Well, i can "fix" that be swapping the W2 leads over.
Concerning the squeezing i can concure with TK's comments.
Regards Itsu
hi itsu,
I can't help noticing your lovely burst peak is higher than sine wave similar to Akula.
Does this results in lowering the over current draw base on your applied solution.
Kindly revert thanks.
and for better clarity... the starts of windings should all be in on the same start of all windings...
Edit: And; if it's not a PLL, then it's a delay line of some sort. just 15ns gate delays...(probably shorter with more modern hardware)... could be a pulse shaper maybe.... although I'm curious, I should note again, it doesn't really matter cause it doesn't work... it doesn't do its intended function
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 07, 2014, 05:00:26 AM
You are chasing Red Herrings.
... it's just a song (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8WEtxJ4-sh4)
Я не думал что столь простое устройство так извратят :).
В первом видео я говорил про резонанс, и что нужно его поймать, это никто не сделал.
Я продолжаю попытки увеличить мощность в разы, и сделал катушку с выносным конденсатором, для лучшей подстройки, теперь резонанс ловиться очень легко, а амплитуда синуса больше 100 вольт.
Я могу поделиться видео на этапе настройки, вы сами убедитесь что резонанс поймать легко, и не нужно все усложнять. ;)
Частота колебаний очень низкая, слышен за кадром писк трансформатора, обе его половинки в этот момент сильно прижимаются друг к другу. Общее потребление падает в резонансе. Так и должно быть.
На видео я убрал ключ коммутации, он при настройке не нужен, он нужен только для заворота питания.
I did not think that such a simple device so pervert :) .
In the first video I was talking about resonance, and what needs to catch it, that no one did.
I keep trying to increase capacity at times, and made a coil with an external capacitor for better tuning , resonance now caught very easily, and the amplitude of the sine is greater than 100 volts.
I can share video during the setup phase , you'll see that the resonance catch easily, and do not need to complicate things . ;)
The oscillation frequency is very low, audible squeak transformer behind the scenes , the two halves of his at this point strongly pressed against each other . Total consumption falls in resonance . So it should be .
In the video, I removed the key switch , it is not necessary when setting up , he only needed to power inversion .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qjB6xoXhPM
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 07, 2014, 07:56:39 AM
Я не думал что столь простое устройство так извратят :) .
В первом видео я говорил про резонанс, и что нужно его поймать, это никто не сделал.
Я продолжаю попытки увеличить мощность в разы, и сделал катушку с выносным конденсатором, для лучшей подстройки, теперь резонанс ловиться очень легко, а амплитуда синуса больше 100 вольт.
Я могу поделиться видео на этапе настройки, вы сами убедитесь что резонанс поймать легко, и не нужно все усложнять. ;)
Частота колебаний очень низкая, слышен за кадром писк трансформатора, обе его половинки в этот момент сильно прижимаются друг к другу. Общее потребление падает в резонансе. Так и должно быть.
На видео я убрал ключ коммутации, он при настройке не нужен, он нужен только для заворота питания.
I did not think that such a simple device so pervert :) .
In the first video I was talking about resonance, and what needs to catch it, that no one did.
I keep trying to increase capacity at times, and made a coil with an external capacitor for better tuning , resonance now caught very easily, and the amplitude of the sine is greater than 100 volts.
I can share video during the setup phase , you'll see that the resonance catch easily, and do not need to complicate things . ;)
The oscillation frequency is very low, audible squeak transformer behind the scenes , the two halves of his at this point strongly pressed against each other . Total consumption falls in resonance . So it should be .
In the video, I removed the key switch , it is not necessary when setting up , he only needed to power inversion .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qjB6xoXhPM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qjB6xoXhPM)
Ты, яснее и подробнее объясняй, а то многое из того, что ты объясняешь не понятно, а как потом повторить, если не понятно, что ты там объяснил? И чтоб точно знать, что получиться самозапитка, а не паять лишбы паять ,вот если так объяснишь, чтоб повторяемость была стропроцентная, практически, тогда и повторять все захотят, а то ведь ты, к примеру, когда разматывал даже катушки не размотал их медленно, чтоб можно было посчитать витки и посмотреть как ленты те приклеплены медные. Тут даже с теми самими витками может не получиться, а если ещё и витки не те будут, то совсем ничего не получиться, тут не большая мощность, поэтому любое отклонение может привести к неудаче. Сначала пусть получат хоть ту мощность, которую получил, а потом начнут усовершенствовать.
Quote from: MenofFather on May 07, 2014, 08:25:20 AM
Ты, яснее и подробнее объясняй, а то многое из того, что ты объясняешь не понятно, а как потом повторить, если не понятно, что ты там объяснил?
Это требование, или просьба?!
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 07, 2014, 08:35:14 AM
Это требование, или просьба?!
Просьба, у меня нигде нет требования, везде просьбы либо советы.
Ну тогда совет дня - соберите и найдите резонанс.....а потом уже питание заворачивайте.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 07, 2014, 09:38:56 AM
Ну тогда совет дня - соберите и найдите резонанс.....а потом уже питание заворачивайте.
Как мне заворачивать и искать, если оно не будет работать? Я много времени потратил на это, у меня не заработало. Ещё дальше тратить время не вижу смысла пока не будет ясных пояснений как настраивать и мотать.
Could everyone post in English only , :-\
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 07, 2014, 07:56:39 AM
I keep trying to increase capacity at times, and made a coil with an external capacitor for better tuning , resonance now caught very easily, and the amplitude of the sine is greater than 100 volts.
I am, for one, is grateful for the video. However, the biggest questions I have are all regarding the coil and the external capacitors.
You see, the ferrite cores available to us are, somewhat, different to yours. It doesn't mean that we can't make it. It simply means that we are not able to directly replicate your device.
What would really help is the actual data of the coil, i.e. the number of turns and/or inductance as well as the value of the external capacitor.
If I were to have those, I would adjust my device accordingly.
Another question is about the scope. Where do you connect you scope to and what was that frequency. You mentioned that the frequency is low, but how low is low?
I hope that you can answer these questions. I would have thought that we can help but we need to level with you first before we can go further.
~A
Амплитуда синуса зависит от частоты, а частота от емкости. Подбирается конденсатор на максимальную амплитуду резонанса, это будет самая эффективная частота. Я пробовал от 10микрофарада до 1нанофарада.....остальное пока не могу сказать.
Я пробую 2 последовательных CREE светодиода.
The amplitude depends on the frequency of the sine and the frequency of the container. Selected capacitor at the maximum amplitude of the resonance, it is the most effective frequency. I tried to 10mikrofarada to 1nanofarada else ..... I can not yet say.
I try 2 consecutive CREE LED.
Quote from: itsu on May 07, 2014, 05:19:47 AM
Concerning the squeezing i can concure with TK's comments.
What if you keep the squeezing force constant and superglue two large masses to the core laid horizontally?
(a heavy glass ashtray for exampe, or tea cups ...or anything else non-magnetic and non-conductive)
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 07, 2014, 07:56:39 AM
Я могу поделиться видео на этапе настройки, вы сами убедитесь что резонанс поймать легко, и не нужно все усложнять. ;)
I can share video during the setup phase , you'll see that the resonance catch easily, and do not need to complicate things . ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qjB6xoXhPM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qjB6xoXhPM)
Why was this video "removed by the user" ?
Does anyone have it?
Hi All,
Would it be fair to view the Core, Coils and the Capacitive Plates like the following:
-->A Simple, Cheap Free Energy Generator -- But How Do You Collect and Use the Energy? <-- (http://www.cheniere.org/misc/static%20poynting%20gen.htm)
Note: Each Copper Shield is a Capacitor Plate.
All the Best
Chris
...
~A
Quote from: verpies on May 07, 2014, 06:50:40 PM
Why was this video "removed by the user" ?
Maybe user remove.
Quote from: EMJunkie on May 07, 2014, 10:06:23 PM
Hi All,
Would it be fair to view the Core, Coils and the Capacitive Plates like the following:
-->A Simple, Cheap Free Energy Generator -- But How Do You Collect and Use the Energy? <-- (http://www.cheniere.org/misc/static%20poynting%20gen.htm)
Note: Each Copper Shield is a Capacitor Plate.
All the Best
Chris
Yes i think that is what semenihin-77 is saying.
Quote from: scratchrobot on May 08, 2014, 04:31:31 AM
Yes i think that is what semenihin-77 is saying.
YES! 8)
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 08, 2014, 06:00:42 AM
YES! 8)
Then i will first try if i can get resonance with help of external capacitor.
Thank you :)
Quote from: avalon on May 07, 2014, 10:28:55 PM
...
~A
:D
Очень похоже на то что надо, только надо емкость подобрать по максимальному пику и контролировать потребление.
Very similar to what is necessary, just need to pick up the capacitor at the maximum peak and control consumption.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 07, 2014, 02:28:33 PM
Амплитуда синуса зависит от частоты, а частота от емкости. Подбирается конденсатор на максимальную амплитуду резонанса, это будет самая эффективная частота. Я пробовал от 10микрофарада до 1нанофарада.....остальное пока не могу сказать.
Я пробую 2 последовательных CREE светодиода.
О какой ёмкости говориться, которая между 3 и 4 ножкой у 34063 микросхемы или о какой?
Quote from: verpies on May 07, 2014, 05:56:24 PM
What if you keep the squeezing force constant and superglue two large masses to the core laid horizontally?
(a heavy glass ashtray for exampe, or tea cups ...or anything else non-magnetic and non-conductive)
Maybe build a 4 sided structure from glass plates with the pot core halves glued to two inside surfaces with a small gap. The tiny amount of flexing should be tunable, as also the gap. A cutoff section extruded aluminum channel might work, but for really hi Q, maybe construct from hi carbon steel with magnetically insulating risers.
I'm thinking of gluing the core halves to the inside poles of a U shaped piece of non-metallic hi Q material, open portions of the cup cores facing each other, gap adjustable. This could make for a dandy parametric inductor.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BTW, the above posted schematic (circuit.png)makes a bit more sense than any of the schematics I've seen, the transistor VT1 acting as a synchronous rectifier switch to utilize the hi Q ringing of the tank circuit and add to the 470uF.
As shown, with a low frequency drive for the transistor, and un-synced to the main oscillator, it is hit or miss rectifier, hoping to close on the peak of a positive excursion of the ringing frequency and open at the peak of the last positive, it will add 1/2 cycle of the ringing energy to the 470uF storage cap. It will zero to a null, operating randomly unless the LF oscillator can lock to a subharmonic of the main oscillator.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 08, 2014, 07:48:06 AM
:D
Очень похоже на то что надо, только надо емкость подобрать по максимальному пику и контролировать потребление.
Very similar to what is necessary, just need to pick up the capacitor at the maximum peak and control consumption.
Latest: 5 mA @ 2.6V, 68V ~ secondary (21V~ before)
~A
Quote from: Vortex1 on May 08, 2014, 09:46:55 AM
I'm thinking of gluing the core halves to the inside poles of a U shaped piece of non-metallic hi Q material, open portions of the cup cores facing each other, gap adjustable. This could make for a dandy parametric inductor.
It would.
...and if you had a short HF low current winding there, its inductance would reflect the instantaneous width of that gap. A very useful information.
The MC34063 can extract this info as an easily integrateable pulse widths, when operating in constant current mode with constant load.
What is your idea how to utilize the kinetic energy gained by the core halves?
If understand correctly; these circuits comprise only two signal generators, one coil and one load. They are tuned using the signals.
Can I then expect a similar degree of success developing and experimenting with software that:
frequency = lower limit of soundcard (20Hz)
While frequency is lower than upper limit of soundcard (20KHz)
Generate a fixed duration burst of signals (two harmonically related sine waves?) out of the two soundcard channels (low or high Z?) into a coil/circuit, back out into a soundcard input (low or high Z?).
When the input signal falls below a fixed threshold; record the timestamp and frequency, increment the signal frequency by a factor (double?)
Loop
The frequency that created the longest interval between timestamps would then be the most interesting.
I'm thinking that the soundcard is the signal generator and the load, so what else would the circuit need besides a coil? Would the input or output impedance match the soundcard range at all?
I'm probably oversimplifying this, but how?
Quote from: verpies on May 08, 2014, 05:11:29 PM
It would.
...and if you had a short HF low current winding there, its inductance would reflect the instantaneous width of that gap. A very useful information.
The MC34063 can extract this info as an easily integrateable pulse widths, when operating in constant current mode with constant load.
What is your idea how to utilize the kinetic energy gained by the core halves?
There are many ways to do this, but one way without complicating things too much would probably be to use the core halves themselves as generators by adding a bias, either extra current in one winding or PM.
Of course a completely separate coil / magnet would extract energy and also dampen the Q
My potcores arrived (4.7cm / Al 9500) so i went for the 5.4 / 2.7mH setup using a pot core.
I used another fet (BS170), but there was no noticeable difference with the MJE13009 transistor
Screenshot is taken at 3.3V @310mA
5.4mH is at W2, but i tried many variations like swapping W1/W2, swapping the leads on W2 and/or W1, varying the voltage
and off course the pot meter.
Never did the leds want to stay on longer after removing the supply voltage.
Next i will try to move the MOSFET/transistor like suggested by Vortex1 here:
http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/msg401301/#msg401301
Regards Itsu
Quote from: itsu on May 09, 2014, 11:47:19 AM
My potcores arrived (4.7cm / Al 9500) so i went for the 5.4 / 2.7mH setup using a pot core.
......
Regards Itsu
Good day Itsu
Have you tried to 'characterize' the 'ferro-resonance' frequency of this new POT core?
Do you have access to a spectrum analyzer?
I agree with Vortex1 (ION) that one could spend an eternity trying to guess the tuning for this animal without some kind of starting point for reference.
I would love to know if anyone has used a spectrum analyzer, like the Rigol seen in the Akula videos to 'characterize' their cores?
To carry out a thorough analysis of the problem one must consider *all* of the datum .... maybe we should consider to look at it from the frequency domain perspective. Apparently Akula did....
take care, peace.
lost_bro
I am speechless over here.
I do no know for sure what I have found, but my 3v flashlight V2.0 went crazy.
The power supply is at 2.59V, but I now have over 1 kV on the secondary! (540V in the picture)
It is, obviously, a resonance, but at this stage I am inclined to think it is a magnetostrictive resonance excited by an external (primary) magnetic field.
Anyway, at 230V ~ RMS it looks like I have enough power to light up a relatively big CFL light bulb while having the circuit self-sustain.
~A
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 01:53:00 PM
I am speechless over here.
I do no know for sure what I have found, but my 3v flashlight V2.0 went crazy.
The power supply is at 2.59V, but I now have over 1 kV on the secondary! (540V in the picture)
It is, obviously, a resonance, but at this stage I am inclined to think it is a magnetostrictive resonance excited by an external (primary) magnetic field.
Anyway, at 230V ~ RMS it looks like I have enough power to light up a relatively big CFL light bulb while having the circuit self-sustain.
~A
Dear Avalon.
What the Guys over at SETI would have called, the WOW signal !! :)
Keep up the great work.
Cheers Grum.
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 01:53:00 PM
I am speechless over here.
I do no know for sure what I have found, but my 3v flashlight V2.0 went crazy.
The power supply is at 2.59V, but I now have over 1 kV on the secondary! (540V in the picture)
It is, obviously, a resonance, but at this stage I am inclined to think it is a magnetostrictive resonance excited by an external (primary) magnetic field.
Anyway, at 230V ~ RMS it looks like I have enough power to light up a relatively big CFL light bulb while having the circuit self-sustain.
~A
:o перебор.....
bust
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 01:53:00 PM
I am speechless over here.
I do no know for sure what I have found, but my 3v flashlight V2.0 went crazy.
The power supply is at 2.59V, but I now have over 1 kV on the secondary! (540V in the picture)
It is, obviously, a resonance, but at this stage I am inclined to think it is a magnetostrictive resonance excited by an external (primary) magnetic field.
Anyway, at 230V ~ RMS it looks like I have enough power to light up a relatively big CFL light bulb while having the circuit self-sustain.
~A
Before you lose your voice it is important to note input current and voltage as well as output current and voltage even if into a load resistor, which I prefer. As an example, a 1 or 2 Watt carbon slug resistor of the proper value on your secondary will tell quickly if you have real power.
It is easy to get high voltage especially from a tank circuit or self capacitance of the output coil if unloaded. How is your secondary connected or is it floating? Best to supply the schematic you are currently using in your test and the probing points with a note.
CFL's are a bad choice for a load unless you have previously characterized it's light output. They can be lit with very low current high voltage, high frequency if you don't warm the filaments.
With the resistor, heating will tell the whole story and they are easy to characterize. The best is a low power incandescent 7 Watts or less, they are available up to 220 Volts. The relative brightness of such a lamp is an indicator of real power plus you can characterize it by temperature which is easy to measure with today's DMM's. Just glue the thermocouple to the bulb envelope and characterize it ahead of time by creating a chart of input power vs. temperature. Same for a resistor.
If you can get your circuit to sustain disconnected from the power supply for a very long time (hours or days), you have achieved it load or no load, as the chips and switching losses themselves are a load albeit small.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 09, 2014, 02:10:52 PM
:o перебор.....
bust
I know, right?
Anyway, I am re-building the circuit again. At some stage the voltage increased even further and the coil started 'dancing' around the table. Then (with a big spark) both LEDs, MC34063, and a couple of capacitors gone up in smoke.
BTW, the power supply is limiting the current to 100 mA max so all that power didn't come from the PSU.
~A
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 01:53:00 PM
I am speechless over here.
I do no know for sure what I have found, but my 3v flashlight V2.0 went crazy.
The power supply is at 2.59V, but I now have over 1 kV on the secondary! (540V in the picture)
It is, obviously, a resonance, but at this stage I am inclined to think it is a magnetostrictive resonance excited by an external (primary) magnetic field.
Anyway, at 230V ~ RMS it looks like I have enough power to light up a relatively big CFL light bulb while having the circuit self-sustain.
~A
Good job :)
I got smoke from my scope :(
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 02:43:36 PM
I know, right?
Anyway, I am re-building the circuit again. At some stage the voltage increased even further and the coil started 'dancing' around the table. Then (with a big spark) both LEDs, MC34063, and a couple of capacitors gone up in smoke.
BTW, the power supply is limiting the current to 100 mA max so all that power didn't come from the PSU.
~A
Well that is more interesting if the current was limited, but what was the value and voltage rating of your storage capacitor, they can store a lot of energy over time by charging up despite the current limiting of your supply, especially if you lost voltage feedback to pin 5, the duty cycle would increase and voltage on the rail would soar on that capacitor. Can you reference the schematic you are using.
Also a good forensic analysis of your coil winding technique would be an important post mortem so that it can be replicated.
Quote from: Vortex1 on May 09, 2014, 03:05:59 PM
Can you reference the schematic you are using.
The schematic is on the page 5 of the Onsemi datasheet. The only difference is that I use a variable resistor on the feedback (22K) and there is the secondary coil.
The coils are 37mH primary and 57 mH secondary.
~A
Hi all,
beware of the probe setting 1:1 or 1:10: i saw plenty of volts just because probe was set to 1:1 and scope to 1:10.
For the moment no positive result or my own clone of this LED OU circuit: it works fine as a standard step_up circuit.
When the output 1000µF is removed, the 34063 is always working at its maximum frequency: why removing it ?
Regards.
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 02:43:36 PM
I know, right?
Anyway, I am re-building the circuit again. At some stage the voltage increased even further and the coil started 'dancing' around the table. Then (with a big spark) both LEDs, MC34063, and a couple of capacitors gone up in smoke.
BTW, the power supply is limiting the current to 100 mA max so all that power didn't come from the PSU.
~A
Perhaps a bigger/larger load? Sounds promising though. keep up the good work!
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 02:43:36 PM
I know, right?
Anyway, I am re-building the circuit again. At some stage the voltage increased even further and the coil started 'dancing' around the table. Then (with a big spark) both LEDs, MC34063, and a couple of capacitors gone up in smoke.
BTW, the power supply is limiting the current to 100 mA max so all that power didn't come from the PSU.
~A
Все верно, у меня сгорал диод максимум :) Вся "соль" чтоб найти консенсус между напряжением емкостью всех конденсаторов и частотой. Если нагрузка постоянная то добивайтесь понижения потребления подбирая частоту резонанса, когда вы будете очень близко- ток будет прыгать от - до +, задача найти баланс, очень тонкий баланс.
Сейчас я ищу резонанс по току, резонансная катушка имеет мало количество витков, а конденсатор больше емкость.
В любом случае вы поняли что надо найти, мои поздравления!
All right, I burned the diode maximum :) All the "salt" to find a consensus between the voltage capacity of all capacitors and frequency. If the load is constant for lowering consumption picking up the resonance frequency when you are very close, the current will jump from - to +, the task to find a balance, a very delicate balance.
Now I'm looking for current resonance, has little resonance coil number of turns, and large capacitors.
In any case, you realize that it is necessary to find, congratulations!
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 03:18:46 PM
The schematic is on the page 5 of the Onsemi datasheet. The only difference is that I use a variable resistor on the feedback (22K) and there is the secondary coil.
...and the secondary coil is connected to this circuitry (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/136761/) ?
How was the transformer constructed? Any copper tape shields?
Quote from: verpies on May 09, 2014, 05:23:40 PM
...and the secondary coil is connected to this circuitry (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/136761/) ?
How was the transformer constructed? Any copper tape shields?
I'm gonna guess the secondary was open circuit. Very high voltage rise is possible on this winding if it resonates with inter layer winding capacitance and the resonant frequency of the winding is hit. But voltage alone is not power, there is no mention of a load.
If the voltage divider R1 and R2 from the data sheet p5 were replaced with a pot (as he says it was) without a limiting resistor, the boost voltage could have gone very high, well above the 28 volts for the given values when the pot was turned close to ground. Exceeding 40 volts would put the chip into "who knows what operation" before it self destructed.
A properly sized resistor must be put in the ground leg of the pot to insure over voltage does not occur.
Just for the record...
I am not looking for power output from this circuit. In fact, I could not care less.
All I want is to go to the bottom of this and find out exactly what makes it 'tick'.
We all know by now that it is some kind of resonance. However, I want to know more. I want to know exactly which one. Then and only then will I be able to construct a power generating circuit reliably.
The coils that I am using do not have copper shields. After winding and re-winding coils about zillion times I have concluded that the shields are not necessary. Neither are the air gaps in cores. Those exist for are for a specific reason only: fine-tuning the inductance in order to achieve the desired resonance.
The problem still remains of how to determine the resonant frequency of the core. (Yes, I have tried all known methods and still not happy about them).
~A
The only reason that makes it 'tick' is on how you wound your coils. Nothing more, nothing less. It is on the winding direction and winding position that the Inductance are easily destroy or nullified. Just examine how is your coils wound. A picture to post here wound be greatly appreciated with everyone.
Just take a lot of pictures on how you build and wound your Coils that all. It will work better if it is coreless + HF, but if we say low Frequency then you will need the Core to boost the Magnetics.
All others needed to know is how you wound your coils. The correct and exact direction and size, Just the Coils dude nothing more. Meow
Meow ;D
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 08:31:37 PM
Just for the record...
I am not looking for power output from this circuit. In fact, I could not care less.
All I want is to go to the bottom of this and find out exactly what makes it 'tick'.
We all know by now that it is some kind of resonance. However, I want to know more. I want to know exactly which one. Then and only then will I be able to construct a power generating circuit reliably.
The coils that I am using do not have copper shields. After winding and re-winding coils about zillion times I have concluded that the shields are not necessary. Neither are the air gaps in cores. Those exist for are for a specific reason only: fine-tuning the inductance in order to achieve the desired resonance.
The problem still remains of how to determine the resonant frequency of the core. (Yes, I have tried all known methods and still not happy about them).
~A
Avalon said:
QuoteAfter winding and re-winding coils about zillion times I have concluded that the shields are not necessary. Neither are the air gaps in cores. Those exist for are for a specific reason only: fine-tuning the inductance in order to achieve the desired resonance.
Actually in a flyback converter the gaps in the core allow a fast collapse of the remnant magnetic field. Yes, they do also change the inductance, but that is an unwanted by product of the gap, which also reduces inductance thus requiring more copper and ferrite. You could design an efficient inductor that has no gaps with the same inductance and it will be smaller and use less copper and ferrite material, a one piece toroidal construction for example, but it will not work properly in a flyback converter. Remnant magnetism in such a device will not allow a high duty cycle without some means to reset the core on a cycle by cycle basis. It is possible to design a special class of flyback converter using such a core with a special "reset" winding and associated circuitry.
The theoretical considerations of the magnetics requirements and operation of the standard boost flyback converter as noted on page 5 of the Onsemi 34063 data sheet is well documented in the literature.
http://electronicdesign.com/energy/mind-gap-and-improve-your-low-power-flyback-transformer-design (http://electronicdesign.com/energy/mind-gap-and-improve-your-low-power-flyback-transformer-design)
Then there is also the distributed gap type of core:
http://www.mag-inc.com/products/selecting-a-distributed-air-gap-powder-core-for-flyback-transformers
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 03:18:46 PM
The schematic is on the page 5 of the Onsemi datasheet. The only difference is that I use a variable resistor on the feedback (22K) and there is the secondary coil.
The coils are 37mH primary and 57 mH secondary.
~A
After noted success (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/msg401846/#msg401846)
Onsemi datasheet (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/137433/)
and your second socket is empty...
so 2 windings on a pot core; how leedskalnin-esque; he claims you can start such a configuration itself and get a continual voltage...
there is just a cap to ground and ground on the secondary?
Does it work on... a flyback?
I guess it's cause the chip's pretty low freqency... better to have a high-ish inductance...
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 08:31:37 PM
The problem still remains of how to determine the resonant frequency of the core. (Yes, I have tried all known methods and still not happy about them).
My previous post suggests a PC / soundcard based automated test to iterate over a range of frequencies to determine the resonant.
I can write the code. Can anyone design a circuit?
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 08:31:37 PM
Just for the record...
I am not looking for power output from this circuit. In fact, I could not care less.
All I want is to go to the bottom of this and find out exactly what makes it 'tick'.
We all know by now that it is some kind of resonance. However, I want to know more. I want to know exactly which one. Then and only then will I be able to construct a power generating circuit reliably.
The coils that I am using do not have copper shields. After winding and re-winding coils about zillion times I have concluded that the shields are not necessary. Neither are the air gaps in cores. Those exist for are for a specific reason only: fine-tuning the inductance in order to achieve the desired resonance.
The problem still remains of how to determine the resonant frequency of the core. (Yes, I have tried all known methods and still not happy about them).
~A
How big is your core? do you have a datasheet for it?
1: $170.93 150mmx30mm (http://www.epcos.com/inf/80/db/fer_07/pch_150_30.pdf) Core height up to 45 mm for
transformers up to 100 kW :)
mouser has pot cores... (http://www.mouser.com/Passive-Components/EMI-RFI-Components/EMI-RFI-Suppressors-Ferrites/Ferrite-Cores-Accessories/_/N-bw7tbZscv7?Keyword=pot+core&Ns=Core+Size%7c1&FS=True)
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 09, 2014, 04:28:58 PM
Все верно, у меня сгорал диод максимум :) Вся "соль" чтоб найти консенсус между напряжением емкостью всех конденсаторов и частотой. Если нагрузка постоянная то добивайтесь понижения потребления подбирая частоту резонанса, когда вы будете очень близко- ток будет прыгать от - до +, задача найти баланс, очень тонкий баланс.
Сейчас я ищу резонанс по току, резонансная катушка имеет мало количество витков, а конденсатор больше емкость.
В любом случае вы поняли что надо найти, мои поздравления!
All right, I burned the diode maximum :) All the "salt" to find a consensus between the voltage capacity of all capacitors and frequency. If the load is constant for lowering consumption picking up the resonance frequency when you are very close, the current will jump from - to +, the task to find a balance, a very delicate balance.
Now I'm looking for current resonance, has little resonance coil number of turns, and large capacitors.
In any case, you realize that it is necessary to find, congratulations!
hi semenihin-77,
May i ask what the diode number you are using in your circuit.
(Я хотел бы спросить, какие диод номер, который вы используете в вашей цепи.)
May i ask is there a need to change 510pf capacitor value on MC34063 pin 3 and pin 4 to a higher value to around 2000pf capacitor.
(Я хотел бы спросить, есть ли необходимость изменить 510пф конденсатор значение на MC34063 контакт 3 и контакт 4 на более высокое значение примерно 2000пф конденсатор.)
---------------------------
I am using
freetranslation.com (http://www.overunity.com/freetranslation.com) which seem to produce little better grammatical accuracy than google translate when i convert from Russian to English.
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 01:53:00 PM
I am speechless over here.
I do no know for sure what I have found, but my 3v flashlight V2.0 went crazy.
The power supply is at 2.59V, but I now have over 1 kV on the secondary! (540V in the picture)
It is, obviously, a resonance, but at this stage I am inclined to think it is a magnetostrictive resonance excited by an external (primary) magnetic field.
Anyway, at 230V ~ RMS it looks like I have enough power to light up a relatively big CFL light bulb while having the circuit self-sustain.
~A
hi avalon,
That signal amplitude looks very promising. :)
Are using the typical EPCOS core for experiment?
I had plans to scale up after a successful experiment.I have attached a ref MC34063 circuit which used for stepping up to 400volts.
Just use the external transistor and mosfet part and connect pin 1 to positive via resistor and pin 2 become output.
Not forgetting the diode needs to be changed to fast response high voltage diode.
while shopping for cores...
stats of ferrite cores (including pot) (http://www.elnamagnetics.com/wp-content/uploads/catalogs/Magnetics/2012_Ferrite_Catalog.pdf)
how to design/pick a core... (https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CCkQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mag-inc.com%2FFile%2520Library%2FProducts%2FFerrite%2FInductorDesignWithMagneticsFerriteCores.pdf&ei=k51tU872AcTfoATHr4KACA&usg=AFQjCNE2Yj9LLr67iuJgQwgeBmhDR8C-Mw&sig2=uFyl1-SO2ZS2MdTCiYICag&bvm=bv.66330100,d.cGU&cad=rja)
How to pick a core, need a target inductance, a target turns and/or current (2 of the above)
They have cores with a AL of 25,000 ; permability of 10000 at 10Khz; ...
Number of turns = 1000 * sqrt( L / AL ) so for 53mH; / 25000 .... would be like 2 turns :) in a 30mmx19mm, (13.3 center core)
; need a more specific target than 'round'
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 08:31:37 PM
The coils that I am using do not have copper shields.
It's good to have a concrete reply.
Quote from: Vortex1 on May 09, 2014, 06:11:19 PM
I'm gonna guess the secondary was open circuit.
...but Avalon did not reply to that, so we have to guess.
Quote from: Vortex1 on May 09, 2014, 06:11:19 PM
Very high voltage rise is possible on this winding if it resonates with inter layer winding capacitance and the resonant frequency of the winding is hit.
My thoughts exactly.
Quote from: Vortex1 on May 09, 2014, 06:11:19 PM
But voltage alone is not power, there is no mention of a load.
Didn't Avalon report burning out some high power LEDs at high brightness? You cannot light such LED's with voltage alone.
Quote from: magpwr on May 09, 2014, 10:03:25 PM
hi avalon,
That signal amplitude looks very promising. :)
Are using the typical EPCOS core for experiment?
I had plans to scale up after a successful experiment.I have attached a ref MC34063 circuit which used for stepping up to 400volts.
Just use the external transistor and mosfet part and connect pin 1 to positive via resistor and pin 2 become output.
Not forgetting the diode needs to be changed to fast response high voltage diode.
Hope you dont mind I modded your circuit just a little :)
I wouldnt recommend anyone building this circuit, it will be very dangerous.
Also it might hurt a led ;D
The core that I am using is a standard 35mm dia core (35 x 22mm)
The secondary is connected in exactly the same way as in TK v1.4. I am not using 4049-based switch for now in my v2.0.
Different cores (I have tried about 40 so far) require different set of capacitors. The range is huge, from pFs to uFs.
I use an external breadboard to quickly change the capacitors.
The LEDs used are from my old 9W LED bulb. 3W, 1.5A
The diods are 1N5819
In order to find the core resonance I have made a pulse circuit (2 ch, IXDD609 driver + IRF640). My DG4062 is connected via LXI to a PC where I run a specially programmed VI (virtual instrument). One channel of the VI is sweeping frequencies and also triggering the second channel synchronously. In other words, I shoot different duty cycle pulses filled with other channel frequencies. The fill frequencies are in the range of 100 Hz to 60 Mhz.
So far I have found a specific pot core (35 x 22) that responds very well to roughly 125 kHz. This is the core I am using and it is the one that managed to produce hundreds of volts when tuned to the core frequency. Interestingly, I have 2 more cores which look the same but I can only get the response from one only. I have found that my E-core (ETD49) responds on 1.61 Mhz.
The coils are wound using a coil winder, so no scatter wound coils here. The secondary is first, then the primary.
~A
One more thing that I forgot to mention is that during the resonant peak both halves of the core are attracted to each other with such force that it is simply impossible to separate them with one hand. The force is similar to a pair of my 1 inch neodymium magnets.
Once the frequency is off so goes the attraction.
~A
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 01:53:00 PM
I do no know for sure what I have found, but my 3v flashlight V2.0 went crazy.
~A
coils reosnance calculator - LCT
http://www.1728.org/resfreq.htm
if we take the time (frequency) of 115200Hz and 53mH; the capacitance would be 36pF; looks like the capacitance of a scope probe.
What was suggested in the circuit is something like 1000uF -2200uF ... which would be a frequency of more like (at 1000uf, 53mH; 21.82 Hertz so....
that puts it in the realm of wall power; if used more like 132uf 53mH is 60.059 Hertz....
Quote from: avalon on May 10, 2014, 01:48:44 PM
One more thing that I forgot to mention is that during the resonant peak both halves of the core are attracted to each other with such force that it is simply impossible to separate them with one hand. The force is similar to a pair of my 1 inch neodymium magnets.
Once the frequency is off so goes the attraction.
~A
это главное! ;)
Quote from: avalon on May 10, 2014, 01:48:44 PM
One more thing that I forgot to mention is that during the resonant peak both halves of the core are attracted to each other with such force that it is simply impossible to separate them with one hand. The force is similar to a pair of my 1 inch neodymium magnets.
Once the frequency is off so goes the attraction.
~A
Good day Avalon
Do you know the Ferrite Grade/number?
You mentioned that having 3 seemingly identical pot cores, only one will respond in this manner..... must be different ferrite material?
take care, peace
lost_bro
Quote from: lost_bro on May 10, 2014, 03:05:00 PM
Do you know the Ferrite Grade/number?
All 3 cores are the same (supposedly) and came from the same source.
Here is the datasheet...
~A
Quote from: avalon on May 10, 2014, 03:36:53 PM
All 3 cores are the same (supposedly) and came from the same source.
Here is the datasheet...
~A
hi avalon,
Thanks for attaching the datasheet for the pot core which you use.
Looks like the Permeability 2000 or 2000nm (Russian) .The mystery to solve the overunity for this circuit is getting closer and closer by the day.
I'd believe itsu is using the exact same core as i am 4.7cm AL9500 HAGY .I managed to bump into the datasheet for this old pot core which i found the material for my core is Mg-Zn.It's a grey soft core(T-1000 you were 100% right).This material won't do.
I knew it i had a weak point when buying pot core since i didn't know what to get couple of weeks back.
AKULA FULL VIDEO ...
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCe-rV_geumWg3VXqgZ9pjvw/videos?view_as=public
Lasersaber progress https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6B79UJGoNJE
Quote from: d3x0r on May 11, 2014, 06:26:30 AM
Lasersaber progress https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6B79UJGoNJE
Вот ради этого все и выкладывалось! :) Новые идеи и варианты воплощения.
That's all for this and spread! :) New ideas and embodiments.
Quote from: magpwr on May 11, 2014, 12:26:29 AM
hi avalon,
Thanks for attaching the datasheet for the pot core which you use.
Looks like the Permeability 2000 or 2000nm (Russian) .The mystery to solve the overunity for this circuit is getting closer and closer by the day.
I'd believe itsu is using the exact same core as i am 4.7cm AL9500 HAGY .I managed to bump into the datasheet for this old pot core which i found the material for my core is Mg-Zn.It's a grey soft core(T-1000 you were 100% right).This material won't do.
I knew it i had a weak point when buying pot core since i didn't know what to get couple of weeks back.
Hello MagPwr
"Thanks for attaching the datasheet for the pot core which you use."
spec sheet specifies this core as type 77 ferrite material.
Please see below:
Magnetic Properties View Magnetic Properties of Ferrite Materials
31 Material A MnZn ferrite designed specifically for EMI suppression applications from as low as 1 MHz up to 500 MHz. This material does not have the dimensional resonance limitations associated with conventional MnZn ferrite materials. Round cable EMI suppression cores, round cable snap-its, flat cable EMI suppression cores and flat cable snap-its are all available in 31 material.
33 Material An economical MnZn ferrite designed for use in open circuit applications for frequencies up to 3.0 MHz. Rods are available in 33 material.
43 Material This NiZn is our most popular ferrite for suppression of conducted EMI from 20 MHz to 250 MHz. This material is also used for inductive applications such as high frequency common-mode chokes. EMI suppression beads, beads on leads, SM beads, multi-aperture cores, round cable EMI suppression cores, round cable snap-its, flat cable EMI suppression cores, flat cable snap-its, miscellaneous suppression cores, bobbins, and toroids are all available in 43 material.
44 Material A NiZn ferrite developed to combine a high suppression performance, from 30 MHz to 500 MHz, with a very high dc resistivity. SM beads, PC beads, wound beads, round cable snap-its, and connector EMI suppression plates are all available in 44 material.
46 Material Our latest material development is a MgZn ferrite intended for suppression applications. This material does not use nickel in its composition, hence it avoids potential environmental issues as well as reduces the cost of the material component of suppression parts. The suppression performance of the 46 material is similar to our widely used 43 material. The new Fair-Rite grade 46 is supplied in the larger sizes of the round cable EMI suppression and snap-it cores.
51 Material A NiZn ferrite developed for low loss inductive designs for frequencies up to 5.0 MHz.
52 Material A new high frequency NiZn ferrite material, that combines a high saturation flux density and a high Curie temperature. SM beads, PC beads and a range of rod cores are available in this material.
61 Material A high frequency
NiZn ferrite developed for a range of inductive applications up to 25 MHz. This material is also used in EMI applications for suppression of noise frequencies above 200 MHz. EMI suppression beads, beads on leads, SM beads, wound beads, multi-aperture cores, round cable snap-its, rods, antenna/RFID rods, and toroids are all available in 61 material.
Strong magnetic fields or excessive mechanical stresses may result in irreversible changes in permeability and losses.
67 Material A high frequency NiZn ferrite for the design of broadband transformers, antennas and HF, high Q inductor applications up to 50 MHz. Toroids, multi-aperture cores and antenna/RFID rods are available in this material. Strong magnetic fields or excessive mechanical stresses may result in irreversible changes in permeability and losses.
68 Material Our highest frequency NiZn ferrite intended for broadband transformers, antennas and HF high Q inductor applications up to 100 MHz. This material is only supplied to customer-specific requirements and close consultation with our application staff is suggested. Strong magnetic fields or excessive mechanical stresses may result in irreversible changes in permeability and losses.
73 Material A MnZn ferrite, supplied only in small cores, to suppress conducted EMI frequencies below 50 MHz. EMI suppression beads, beads on leads, SM beads, and multi-aperture cores are all available in 73 material.
75 Material A high permeability MnZn ferrite intended for a range of broadband and pulse transformer applications and common-mode inductor designs. Toroidal cores are available in 75 material.
76 Material A MnZn ferrite with a 10K permeability and an acceptable Curie temperature for broadband and pulse transformer designs and common-mode choke applications. Toroids are available in 76 material.
77 Material A MnZn ferrite for use in a wide range of high and low flux density inductive designs for frequencies up to 100 kHz. Pot cores, E & I cores, U cores, rods, toroids, and bobbins are all available in 77 material.78 Material A MnZn ferrite specifically designed for power applications for frequencies up to 200 kHz. RFID rods, toroids, and E & I cores are all available in 78 material.
79 Material A high frequency material for power applications up to 750 kHz. This MnZn power ferrite is available in customer specific core designs.
95 Material A low loss MnZn ferrite material for power applications up to 200 kHz with low temperature variation. New type 95 Material is a low loss power material, which features less power loss variation over temperature (25-120oC) at moderate flux densities for operation below 200 kHz. Shapes available in 95 material are Toroids, U cores, Pot Cores, RM, PQ, EFD, EP.
97 Material A low loss MnZn ferrite material for power applications up to 400 kHz. New type 97 Material is a low loss/higher frequency power material. It features minimal power loss at 100oC at moderate flux densities for operation below 400 kHz. This material is available as special order for customer specific applications.
98 Material A low loss MnZn ferrite material for power applications up to 200 kHz. New type 98 Material is an improved version of Fair-Rite's 78 Material, this material supplies, lower power loss at 100oC at moderate flux densities for operation below 200 kHz. Shapes available in 98 material are Toroids, U Cores, E & I Cores, Pot Cores, RM, PQ, ETD, EFD, EP, EER.
Apparently the #77 material Ferrite is ALSO a MnZn composition, NOT NiZn......
Seems the NiZn composition materials are susceptible to some type of molecular modification from Strong Magnetic Fields.
so what gives?
take care , peace
lost_bro
Quote from: avalon on May 09, 2014, 02:43:36 PM
I know, right?
Anyway, I am re-building the circuit again. At some stage the voltage increased even further and the coil started 'dancing' around the table. Then (with a big spark) both LEDs, MC34063, and a couple of capacitors gone up in smoke.
BTW, the power supply is limiting the current to 100 mA max so all that power didn't come from the PSU.
~A
I suspect that your 1kv and even the 540 v readings are erroneous. Look at the components in the circuit: 60 V is well over the ratings of everything except the wires themselves, unless you used unnecessarily high voltage electrolytics.
Yes, I will bet my bottom dollar (not far away now) that all the power did come from the PSU, and was stored in the capacitors until it was released through a failed component. Just for grins, charge up a 2200 uF capacitor to 60 volts then short it with a bit of wire. Report your experience here, if you can still see to type.
;)
Good work anyhow. But what are the black clipleads attached to the front face (calibration terminals?) of your oscilloscope? Please explain, I've never seen anything like this in use to make a measurement before.
I am still waiting for an explanation for this fact:
We can produce waveforms that are identical to Akula's scopeshot, with the same circuit, but NO LEDs remaining on perpetually.
And the corollary question: How can a "wrong" ferrite material wind up producing the same waveforms when stimulated in the same way by the same circuit ?
The fact that the same waveforms are produced by the same circuit strongly indicates to me that we are using the same ferrite material, and/or we are operating at such paltry low frequencies that the material isn't all that important. I reject the claim-without-evidence that two "identical" circuits except perhaps the ferrite material, could make identical waveforms, but only one of them keeps the LEDs lit after removing power.
TK:
This is a very logical conclusion with which I totally agree. Folks can make of it what they will. Duplicate the waveforms but no O.U. Maybe you should try your circuit in his lab? As I suggested a while back, before you told me that his device ONLY works in his lab, it is receiving energy from somewhere, probably man made.(Electrosmog) This would not make him a fraud per se, but it would explain what you are seeing in your lab.
Has anyone asked him why he thinks his circuit only works in his lab? What does he think the reason is? If this turns out to be the case it is still cool as it is "free to him energy", and lighting leds for free is always a good thing. I like this result much better than recovering supercaps with regular cap sleeves.
I guess we will see? Great work on this by the way. As always, I learn a lot from you.
Bill
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 11, 2014, 02:47:12 PM
I am still waiting for an explanation for this fact:
We can produce waveforms that are identical to Akula's scopeshot, with the same circuit, but NO LEDs remaining on perpetually.
And the corollary question: How can a "wrong" ferrite material wind up producing the same waveforms when stimulated in the same way by the same circuit ?
The fact that the same waveforms are produced by the same circuit strongly indicates to me that we are using the same ferrite material, and/or we are operating at such paltry low frequencies that the material isn't all that important. I reject the claim-without-evidence that two "identical" circuits except perhaps the ferrite material, could make identical waveforms, but only one of them keeps the LEDs lit after removing power.
and difference in the windings of the inductors....?
Quote from: d3x0r on May 11, 2014, 03:16:34 PM
and difference in the windings of the inductors....?
But that would produce different waveforms no?
Bill
Quote from: Pirate88179 on May 11, 2014, 03:24:34 PM
But that would produce different waveforms no?
Bill
No; it's the output of the chip.... can't say the resulting wave is exactly the same; apparently it's maybe nearly congruent but without a slight gain
a 1:3 transformer input and output look the same as a 1:3.5
Quote from: d3x0r on May 11, 2014, 03:26:01 PM
No; it's the output of the chip.... can't say the resulting wave is exactly the same; apparently it's maybe nearly congruent but without a slight gain
a 1:3 transformer input and output look the same as a 1:3.5
if the foils are the same, the coil becomes directional also, so it's important to know which side was ground and which side was power....
you end up with a CW(foil), CCW(wire) and CCW(wire) inductors or CCW(foil), CW(wire) and CW(foil)
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 11, 2014, 02:47:12 PM
I am still waiting for an explanation for this fact:
We can produce waveforms that are identical to Akula's scopeshot, with the same circuit, but NO LEDs remaining on perpetually.
And the corollary question: How can a "wrong" ferrite material wind up producing the same waveforms when stimulated in the same way by the same circuit ?
The fact that the same waveforms are produced by the same circuit strongly indicates to me that we are using the same ferrite material, and/or we are operating at such paltry low frequencies that the material isn't all that important. I reject the claim-without-evidence that two "identical" circuits except perhaps the ferrite material, could make identical waveforms, but only one of them keeps the LEDs lit after removing power.
I don't see any identity in presented there scopeshots with Akula's scopeshot
Quote from: tysb3 on May 11, 2014, 05:43:01 PM
I don't see any identity in presented there scopeshots with Akula's scopeshot
Please point out the differences.
Quote from: d3x0r on May 11, 2014, 04:03:03 PM
if the foils are the same, the coil becomes directional also, so it's important to know which side was ground and which side was power....
you end up with a CW(foil), CCW(wire) and CCW(wire) inductors or CCW(foil), CW(wire) and CW(foil)
Try again; the connections are opposing... so you get cw, ccw, cw or ccw, cw, ccw
A) Reference wire pairs, 1 layer of tape removed; dark pair to the left(higher mH), white pair (lower mH).
b) How much of a gap the outer copper has; and the solder point for the secondary (white wire)
c) foil being removed, short wire cut, still is a pair with a white wire
(c-d) unwind primary, and a layer of tape between W1 and W2
d) beginning to unwind inner coil, from short wire that was cut in B
e) the gap of the inner foil, the connection point, oriented to match the others.
I really don't mind someone challenging me rather than letting me think I had it spot on; other than that the foils are only attached to the lower mH coil.
a worse drawing
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 11, 2014, 07:30:44 PM
Please point out the differences.
akula yellow is higher; (1 and a part divs at 5v is 7V vs mostly 3 divs at 2V is 6V )
TK blue is higher (3 divs at 1V vs 2 and a part divisions at 1V)
akula assume scope has x10 set and it means 5... ( spanning 1 division is a little more than 5V and a part divisions would be 7V... vs 3 divs at 2V or 6V in the yellow)
so it can be seen the blue reflected back to yellow in TK is a higher amplitude relatively than akula.
Edit; oh 1 and 2 aren't what I thought they were... they're closer than I originally noted had 1V and 2V backwards
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 11, 2014, 07:30:44 PM
Please point out the differences.
@TK
Can you please post Scope Shots of your C1 VE+ and VE- Rail! Voltage and Current if you could, Please.
The reason I ask is:
Quote
Typically the Magnetic Field and Current follow the Right Hand Rule but the Voltage is in the opposite direction...
Thanks
All the Best
Chris
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 11, 2014, 02:40:54 PM
Yes, I will bet my bottom dollar (not far away now) that all the power did come from the PSU, and was stored in the capacitors until it was released through a failed component.
I can assure you that you are wrong. I now have stable 400-500V ~ under load (2 * 1W Cree) with no failed components @ 2.6V DC / 12 mA.
I am too busy studying the effect for the moment but will post something later for everyone to have a look at.
~A
Quote from: avalon on May 12, 2014, 09:07:33 PM
I can assure you that you are wrong. I now have stable 400-500V ~ under load (2 * 1W Cree) with no failed components @ 2.6V DC / 12 mA.
I am too busy studying the effect for the moment but will post something later on for everyone to have a look at.
~A
Quote from: avalon on May 12, 2014, 09:07:33 PM
I can assure you that you are wrong. I now have stable 400-500V ~ under load (2 * 1W Cree) with no failed components @ 2.6V DC / 12 mA.
I am too busy studying the effect now but will post something later for everyone to have a look at.
~A
Sounds Excellent, can't wait to get the details on this!!!!!
take care, peace
lost_bro
Quote from: avalon on May 12, 2014, 09:07:33 PM
I can assure you that you are wrong. I now have stable 400-500V ~ under load (2 * 1W Cree) with no failed components @ 2.6V DC / 12 mA.
I am too busy studying the effect for the moment but will post something later for everyone to have a look at.
~A
@Avalon,
This sounds very promising!
If you wouldn't mind checking for possible Arch's across windings. The first thing that comes to mind is that there may be a possible Arch that may be causing what your seeing.
If there is no Arch's then check for a pot or resistor that may be bad.
Good work!
All the Best
Chris
Quote from: EMJunkie on May 12, 2014, 11:39:30 PM
If you wouldn't mind checking for possible Arch's across windings. The first thing that comes to mind is that there may be a possible Arch that may be causing what your seeing.
I agree. The trouble is to how to actually prove (or disprove it). I cannot open the pot for the sweet resonance spot goes away. Apart from that, it is quite difficult to separate the halves of the pot once in the sweet spot. However, I am working on it and promise to post the results.
~A
Quote from: avalon on May 12, 2014, 11:54:08 PM
I agree. The trouble is to how to actually prove (or disprove it). I cannot open the pot for the sweet resonance spot goes away. Apart from that, it is quite difficult to separate the halves of the pot once in the sweet spot. However, I am working on it and promise to post the results.
~A
Hey Avalon,
If I may recommend a full documentation of where you are, from Turns to Pot Specs (Especially Permeability), Circuit frequency and duty.
Then maybe putting Circuit in a dark room and trying to see if the arch is visible. You should be able to see it on your scope, I don't recommend trying because it could damage your scope...
It may come down to a Coil Re-Wind to check for visible signs of arching?
All the Best
Chris
Quote from: EMJunkie on May 13, 2014, 01:15:57 AM
Hey Avalon,
If I may recommend a full documentation of where you are, from Turns to Pot Specs (Especially Permeability), Circuit frequency and duty.
Then maybe putting Circuit in a dark room and trying to see if the arch is visible. You should be able to see it on your scope, I don't recommend trying because it could damage your scope...
It may come down to a Coil Re-Wind to check for visible signs of arching?
All the Best
Chris
You already have it. I have posted earlier the datasheet for the pots I am using, as well as the inductance (37 mH and 57 mH). I used the calculation formula from the datasheet to determine the number of turns.
The rest is coming.
~A
Someone could replicate this?
I think it's fake
Quote from: alejandroguille on May 16, 2014, 02:49:07 PM
.. I think it's fake
Depends on what you're talking about. It is not OU.. but it is a real self running looped circuit with a run time dependent on cap size. It is basically a very, very efficient LED driver.
Check out lasersaber's work on this transformer. He is using a simplified circuit, but same principle:
http://laserhacker.com/
Quote from: 4Tesla on May 17, 2014, 04:28:56 PM
.. but it is a real self running looped circuit with a run time dependent on cap size. It is basically a very, very efficient LED driver.
According to Avalon it is more than that.
In this post (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/msg402307/#msg402307) he writes that he is getting 500-600V under load and some power anomalies
Well; This somewhat works.... (https://www.youtube.com/edit?video_id=YsorE1JD7HM)
I tried another coil and it failed... but this works pretty good so maybe I can swap it now...
was thinking...
I have no diodes to ground... there's never a replenish of ground-water... I tried a few places but just ended up pulling .4A so... ya I should had another coil.
I added aluminum foil plates to my coil; and left the ends free; it does help a little; but it's only a 45pF cap... I dunno maybe now that it's pulsing well I can detect an inducted field on it too... still might be backwards on that.
Edit:
Did some testing thinking about the foils; reversing them is as good as removing them; and it changes the stability; as it decays it re-pulses bright then to dim then bright... instead of a gradual decay.... They are both connected to the collector/drive coil.
I think you can just add capacitance across the coil (in parallel) and get the same effect though... maybe; there is an inductive component to that..
Edit: It's an MPSA18 not 16.
Quote from: d3x0r on May 18, 2014, 04:14:33 AM
Well; This somewhat works.... (https://www.youtube.com/edit?video_id=YsorE1JD7HM)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsorE1JD7HM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsorE1JD7HM)
Quote from: verpies on May 17, 2014, 06:33:37 PM
According to Avalon it is more than that.
In this post (http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/msg402307/#msg402307) he writes that he is getting 500-600V under load and some power anomalies
I'd sure like to see some solid evidence of those high voltages. Scopeshots, with confirmation that probe and scope channel attenuations are set properly, and a measurement made on a _known_ high voltage source with the same probe/channel settings, for comparison. There may be other spurious sources of high-voltage readings as well, such as stray inductances.
An illustration, from a different experiment, of high... and spurious.... voltage readings caused by stray inductance in the measurement circuit:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufEZW5iTv6Y
When the battery voltage is measured _properly_ it can be seen that all of that voltage oscillation amplitude is just due to stray induction and is _not_ reflecting anything real happening at the battery.
@TinselKoala
I'd like that, too. Those are valid concerns.
On the other hand I know that it is possible to get those kinds of voltages from JT-type systems running on very low input voltages. I still want to see some confirmation, though.
Попробовал использовать заводскую катушку от БП просто для проверки возбуждения контура. :D
Для тех кто не любит мотать :-\
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 19, 2014, 04:42:19 AM
Попробовал использовать заводскую катушку от БП просто для проверки возбуждения контура. :D
Для тех кто не любит мотать :-\
http://youtu.be/auEuQgW-qek (http://youtu.be/auEuQgW-qek)
that you? то есть вы?
is that running on power?
Remarkable! Another mystery scopeshot! No information as to the point probed, the scope settings or anything. But it looks cool, so why not post it?
Where is any indication of 500-600 volts? Are you lighting up six 90-volt neons in series brightly with less than 1.5 volts input, or are you just making two little LEDs glow a little bit with a capacitor charged to 3 volts?
Hi All,
Why dont some of yall in here join the Akula Circuits chatroom in skype.
lots of real info, and some real smart peepz in here, and peepz sharing stuff on the QEG get removed from the chatroom
skype:?chat&blob=XGTkDNsCkIfBfprBrruXrX7sG2hGIQ_M3pd5PkQOApnZncHx2bobZdNhAgzC2A4IVFvG69E7MmggQIo8rUXKbYvJ5OF-vEmxksv_6cPOuxMevheC6C8vNo9XXKedCxU5AbvFrLad_M_vWW9vD3PGh6Eg8TlKaEhaFJfVkC5p7fx5wQl-SMLqQaCTlTlWkrkssdxYSDYzM5KM (http://skype:?chat&blob=XGTkDNsCkIfBfprBrruXrX7sG2hGIQ_M3pd5PkQOApnZncHx2bobZdNhAgzC2A4IVFvG69E7MmggQIo8rUXKbYvJ5OF-vEmxksv_6cPOuxMevheC6C8vNo9XXKedCxU5AbvFrLad_M_vWW9vD3PGh6Eg8TlKaEhaFJfVkC5p7fx5wQl-SMLqQaCTlTlWkrkssdxYSDYzM5KM)
open any skype chat window, paste the link, then click on it, and you will be taken to the chat group
Greets JB
Quote from: JohnnBlade on May 19, 2014, 09:31:13 AM
Why dont some of yall in here join the Akula Circuits chatroom in skype.
Skype is a surveillance system.
Quote from: verpies on May 19, 2014, 11:31:15 AM
Skype is a surveillance system.
Go Microsoft!!!!!!!!!!!
Quote from: verpies on May 19, 2014, 11:31:15 AM
Skype is a surveillance system.
hi,
It's a open to all discussion ,secured communication is not required in this scenario.
someone got lucky?
As promised, here is the video re: resonance in ferrites.
http://youtu.be/-FVX5EcWtXM
~A
Quote from: avalon on May 20, 2014, 05:29:26 PM
As promised, here is the video re: resonance in ferrites.
http://youtu.be/-FVX5EcWtXM (http://youtu.be/-FVX5EcWtXM)
Kudos for trying to show how the attenuations of your scope probes are set, but what are you measuring with these probes? Where are these probes connected and to what circuit?
Unfortunately, at the highest resolution of that video available on YT,
I cannot clearly see the probes' attenuation switches nor any characters on the scope's screen nor on the signal generator, except for the big LED display of the power supply.
I even have to assume that the left LED display shows the supply current expressed in Amperes and the right LED display shows the supply voltage expressed in Volts. Correct?
I think you are showing that at 17mA and 12V power supply you have some high voltage spikes on the red channel, but I cannot see how high these spikes are (the scope's display is not intelligible at 480p resolution)
Are those spikes measured across some resistive load or are they merely unloaded voltage spikes?
Where is the anomaly? There are many inductive circuits that can produce naked 1kV spikes out of 10mA 12V power supply.
Quote from: verpies on May 20, 2014, 07:17:39 PM
Kudos for trying to show how the attenuations of your scope probes are set, but what are you measuring with these probes? Where are these probes connected and to what circuit?
Unfortunately, at the highest resolution of that video available on YT, I cannot clearly see the probes' attenuation switches nor any characters on the scope's screen nor on the signal generator, except for the big LED display of the power supply.
I even have to assume that the left LED display shows the supply current expressed in Amperes and the right LED display shows the supply voltage expressed in Volts. Correct?
I think you are showing that at 17mA and 12V power supply you have some high voltage spikes on the red channel, but I cannot see how high these spikes are (the scope's display is not intelligible at 480p resolution)
Are those spikes measured across some resistive load or are they merely unloaded voltage spikes?
Where is the anomaly? There are many inductive circuits that can produce naked 1kV spikes out of 10mA 12V power supply.
Attention to details clearly isn't your forte.
3 coils (20 turns each, 24G), 2ch driver (IDDX609 + IRF640), no capacitors connected to the coils. Each coil has a negligible resistance.
The third coil (red channel) is the load coil. The resistor in the picture is 5.1 om.
Outside the resonance the circuit exceeds the set current limit of 1.5A. However, @12v 14 mA output is 560V p-p in core resonance.
Like verpies said... what's the anomaly?
When you first mentioned these high voltages, we were discussing the 3V OU Flashlight circuit using the 34063 and the inverter chip, with input of 3 volts. Weren't we? That's the claim that I challenged, and still do. Now you are showing a completely different circuit with a big inductor being pulsed.
So? Did you miss my scopeshot, and the 6-series stack of NE2s as confirmation, showing pulses well over 600 volts, from nothing more than a depleted AAA battery?
I can tell that the probes are set to 10x attenuation. And I don't challenge your measurements, since you aren't using the circuit I thought you were using. And I still say.... so?
Tinsel, I have a question, I have two quite small 3.7 volt 20 mAh batteries from a couple of busted power meters, they would fit easily into a fairly small pot and I can imagine how to wire it as well. The question is - How long do you think a small battery like that could light up a string of say 6 x 5 mm white LED's if I used very small pulses to a coil at about 20 Hz and used the discharge to light the LED's ? I think quite a while, but maybe not. I could maybe fit two into one pot, then connect the terminals to two of the pins of the pot and solder the pins to the rail, some way to trigger it to start and hey presto. I guess the pot can be a switch as well, hahahaha.
..
Quote from: avalon on May 20, 2014, 07:54:09 PM
Attention to details clearly isn't your forte.
It is hard to see the details. I simply cannot read digits on the scope's display, not to mention the markings on the ICs of an unknown circuit :(
Hello,
Chris Sykes ( Hyig.org) has posted a vid:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7eJevE1FEas (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7eJevE1FEas)
Regards
Kator01
Quote from: Farmhand on May 21, 2014, 02:27:35 AM
Tinsel, I have a question, I have two quite small 3.7 volt 20 mAh batteries from a couple of busted power meters, they would fit easily into a fairly small pot and I can imagine how to wire it as well. The question is - How long do you think a small battery like that could light up a string of say 6 x 5 mm white LED's if I used very small pulses to a coil at about 20 Hz and used the discharge to light the LED's ? I think quite a while, but maybe not. I could maybe fit two into one pot, then connect the terminals to two of the pins of the pot and solder the pins to the rail, some way to trigger it to start and hey presto. I guess the pot can be a switch as well, hahahaha.
..
I showed the full "3V" circuit running for a long time on a single thin CR2016 button cell here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZFSnLgXfQE
and if you use "Joule Thief" technology you can light up your 6 LEDs for even longer than shown in that video. Triggering it with a touch is easy, as TinMan has demonstrated. Many JT variants need a little "tickle" to start oscillating and this behaviour can be "tuned" into just about any JT variant circuit by careful choice of component values.
Ironically... many of my own JT circuits work _better_ if you use two or more LEDs _in series_ as the load. The DALM variant with four blue LEDs has them all in series, and it runs for many minutes on a single tiny AG1-LR621 button cell.
I can think of no other good reason that Akula's pots... only two of them, not all.... have their cases soldered to the negative "ground" rail of that circuit. I think there is a good chance that he has batteries in there. But also.... very fine magnet wire, like #32 and below, will not show up on videos made for YouTube, and are plenty sturdy enough to allow powering LEDs and even some incandescent loads from an out-of-frame power source.
Two signal generators can be used together to produce interesting effects. Usually there will be a "trigger/synch" output and a "trigger" or "gate" input. You can use one signal generator to "gate" or trigger the other one's signal, so in effect you can set up the same kinds of "beating" from two frequencies that the dual 494 and similar circuits use. My old F43 even has a "VCF" voltage-controlled frequency input so that a second voltage source (like another FG) can control the frequency of the F43, in addition to the gating and phase-locking capabilities.
Even signal generators without these explicit input-output hookups can still be "daisy-chained" by connecting their outputs in series, so that one oscillation is superimposed on the other one.
These might be a fraction big for the pot in the picture, but I like the battery in the pot idea so I might try to make one to trick my brother :) Those button cells hold a fair bit of charge don't they ? These don't seem to hold over 3.5 volts for long but are rechargeable, I think they need a good charging a few times, I had to use a three pack of AAA's and a resistor to charge them up a couple of cycles and they are improving, in the meters they get fully discharged if the meter is taken out of the wall.
..
Quote from: Farmhand on May 21, 2014, 10:58:46 AM
These might be a fraction big for the pot in the picture, but I like the battery in the pot idea so I might try to make one to trick my brother :) Those button cells hold a fair bit of charge don't they ? These don't seem to hold over 3.5 volts for long but are rechargeable, I think they need a good charging a few times, I had to use a three pack of AAA's and a resistor to charge them up a couple of cycles and they are improving, in the meters they get fully discharged if the meter is taken out of the wall.
..
Should be investigated when (exact date) appeared AKULA with their circuits.
Something important is trying to cover.
Quote from: Farmhand on May 21, 2014, 10:58:46 AM
These might be a fraction big for the pot in the picture, but I like the battery in the pot idea so I might try to make one to trick my brother :) Those button cells hold a fair bit of charge don't they ? These don't seem to hold over 3.5 volts for long but are rechargeable, I think they need a good charging a few times, I had to use a three pack of AAA's and a resistor to charge them up a couple of cycles and they are improving, in the meters they get fully discharged if the meter is taken out of the wall.
..
Hi Farmhand,
There are more choices Battery: Rechargeable 3.6 Volt Lithium Coin Cell Button Battery LIR2450 For Audio Equipment (Voltage: 3.6V Capacity: 120mAh Dimension: 24.5*5.0mm Weight: 5.0 gram) ;D
Well I made up a JT and it runs from a AAA battery, it's a great LED driver, I've only got 2 x 5 mm LED's on it, it's running at about 135 kHz with about a 2 uS discharge time into the two LED's. Don't know how much power it's using, must be a bit because the LED's are bright. I'll try more tomorrow.
Below is the Collector to ground wave form and the base to ground wave form. I'll try more load or to use less input. I should use it powered by a AAA to charge the two 20 mAh batteries in series with the LED's or something.
Oh, I used a MPSA06 transistor and 200 kOhms on the trigger winding with a small capacitor I think 100 pF, arranged as in the recent drawings, kind of.
Quote from: avalon on May 20, 2014, 07:54:09 PM
Attention to details clearly isn't your forte.
3 coils (20 turns each, 24G), 2ch driver (IDDX609 + IRF640), no capacitors connected to the coils. Each coil has a negligible resistance.
The third coil (red channel) is the load coil. The resistor in the picture is 5.1 om.
Outside the resonance the circuit exceeds the set current limit of 1.5A. However, @12v 14 mA output is 560V p-p in core resonance.
Hi Avalon,
Have you loaded the output coil with say a 10 kOhm or any suitable resistor? I would like to know what voltage level remains from the 560Vpp voltage and presently I have no means to repeat such test. In your video the load was the 10x probe input impedance (maybe 10 MOhm//15 pF), right? (the 5.1 Ohm resistor was floating in the air)
Thanks, Gyula
Quote from: gyulasun on May 21, 2014, 05:09:00 PM
Hi Avalon,
Have you loaded the output coil with say a 10 kOhm or any suitable resistor? I would like to know what voltage level remains from the 560Vpp voltage and presently I have no means to repeat such test. In your video the load was the 10x probe input impedance (maybe 10 MOhm//15 pF), right? (the 5.1 Ohm resistor was floating in the air)
Thanks, Gyula
@12k load - 78 V p-p (12.00V 10 mA)
@1K - 18V p-p (12.00V 9 mA)
~A
Update: With a 1K load the frequencies have changed. Now I have got the proper resonance back to [roughly] the same levels as before:
@1k load - 460 V~ p-p, (36V Cyc RMS), 12v 0.2A. No capacitors connected yet.
I am now sure I can get much better readings once the coils are LC tuned.
~A
Got any NE2 neons?
Quote from: avalon on May 21, 2014, 10:38:09 PM
Update: With a 1K load the frequencies have changed. Now I have got the proper resonance back to [roughly] the same levels as before:
@1k load - 460 V~ p-p, (36V Cyc RMS), 12v 0.2A. No capacitors connected yet.
I am now sure I can get much better readings once the coils are LC tuned.
This is excellent work, Avalon.
Would you be kind enough to explain the role of the toroidal coil in your setup?
Thank you.
Quote from: yfree on May 22, 2014, 11:24:20 AM
Would you be kind enough to explain the role of the toroidal coil in your setup?
Just a choke.
~A
Quote from: avalon on May 21, 2014, 10:38:09 PM
@12k load - 78 V p-p (12.00V 10 mA)
@1K - 18V p-p (12.00V 9 mA)
~A
Update: With a 1K load the frequencies have changed. Now I have got the proper resonance back to [roughly] the same levels as before:
@1k load - 460 V~ p-p, (36V Cyc RMS), 12v 0.2A. No capacitors connected yet.
I am now sure I can get much better readings once the coils are LC tuned.
~A
Thanks for testing it. I think when the load resistor was 1 kOhm, the input current draw went up towards the 200 mA because of the normal transformer operation (coils are on a common closed core).
If I saw correctly in the video, the core resonance occured around 17 kHz, right?
Have you considered putting the transformer core onto a light, elastic material like a piece of sponge to support it, instead of the glass? I mean the mechanical amplitude at core resonance may get damped on the hard surface of glasstop, though the insulating tape you wrapped up the coils may help to avoid damping.
Gyula
Quote from: gyulasun on May 22, 2014, 05:09:07 PM
Thanks for testing it. I think when the load resistor was 1 kOhm, the input current draw went up towards the 200 mA because of the normal transformer operation (coils are on a common closed core).
If I saw correctly in the video, the core resonance occured around 17 kHz, right?
Have you considered putting the transformer core onto a light, elastic material like a piece of sponge to support it, instead of the glass? I mean the mechanical amplitude at core resonance may get damped on the hard surface of glasstop, though the insulating tape you wrapped up the coils may help to avoid damping.
Gyula
The resonance does not occur @17 kHz per se. It is not a specific frequency that is important but a combination of frequencies to which a core is subjected.
The latest results (with a 1k load) showed that the resonance is so sensitive to frequencies that a 0.5Hz difference between frequencies was critical.
As far as the actual core is concerned, I prefer it like it is. I am also studying the effect of the air gap on resonance and need the core easily accessible.
~A
The resonance that I am observing is very much like a MNR resonance except that I am not reading a electromagnetic radiation response from nuclei in magnetic field but rather a complex response from magnetic domains in initial magnetic field.
I am not quite ready to explain he effect in full but it is clear that a right combination can be found on different sets of frequencies.
Quote from: avalon on May 22, 2014, 06:23:37 PM
The resonance does not occur @17 kHz per se. It is not a specific frequency that is important but a combination of frequencies to which a core is subjected.
The latest results (with a 1k load) showed that the resonance is so sensitive to frequencies that a 0.5Hz difference between frequencies was critical.
As far as the actual core is concerned, I prefer it like it is. I am also studying the effect of the air gap on resonance and need the core easily accessible.
~A
The resonance that I am observing is very much like a MNR resonance except that I am not reading a electromagnetic radiation response from nuclei in magnetic field but rather a complex response from magnetic domains in initial magnetic field.
I am not quite ready to explain he effect in full but it is clear that a right combination can be found on different sets of frequencies.
I feel that information is useful for the Dual TL494 people.
Это видео демонстрирует тот эффект что я использовал в фонарике.
This video demonstrates the effect that I used a flashlight.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdPgIQoFaq0
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 23, 2014, 11:53:31 AM
Это видео демонстрирует тот эффект что я использовал в фонарике.
This video demonstrates the effect that I used a flashlight.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdPgIQoFaq0
One coil?
You mentioned that you scope is connected to the power line. Is it in line with the coil? Would you mind to show the schematics?
In any case, very peculiar indeed.
~A
How much power is your signal generator providing to the circuit?
You do know that the voltmeter on your power supply will read the voltage across the output terminals... regardless of whether the voltage is coming from the supply, or from the circuit, right?
So I think your PSU is set to provide the lower voltage, and when you have it hooked to the circuit, it's reading the higher voltage injected by the function generator, or stored in the capacitors. Or perhaps you have one of many different kinds of possible groundloops. Who really knows what is grounded to what, and what is connected together by the scope's ground leads and the PSU's negative output. In my laboratory, I know, and I can isolate the FG and the scope if necessary.
ETA: I have just confirmed this with my FG (Interstate F43) and my main PSU (Topward 6306D). Hooking the output of the FG directly to the output of the PSU, Red FG output to positive, Black FG (shield, ground, isolated) to negative, PSU set to zero voltage output, FG set to produce positive square wave at 1000 Hz. The Digital Voltmeter on the PSU reads the voltage supplied by the FG, even though the PSU is set to make zero voltage of its own. When the PSU is cranked up to make some voltage (careful here!) the meter indicates the higher of the PSU's set voltage and the voltage output of the FG.
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 23, 2014, 01:17:47 PM
How much power is your signal generator providing to the circuit?
You do know that the voltmeter on your power supply will read the voltage across the output terminals... regardless of whether the voltage is coming from the supply, or from the circuit, right?
So I think your PSU is set to provide the lower voltage, and when you have it hooked to the circuit, it's reading the higher voltage injected by the function generator, or stored in the capacitors. Or perhaps you have one of many different kinds of possible groundloops. Who really knows what is grounded to what, and what is connected together by the scope's ground leads and the PSU's negative output. In my laboratory, I know, and I can isolate the FG and the scope if necessary.
hi TinselKoala,
It looks like 1098hz square wave signal being fed into circuit which is switched by a transistor with it's own frequency for mini transformer and step up voltage to 8.9xvolts.
I am unable to spot ou for this one unless it is a "power amplifier" with a ? in my head yet again.
Сами попробуйте, генератор управляет только ключом. Не оказывает влияние на схему и выход своим напряжением.
Держите резонанс и увидите много гармоник , выбирайте ту, что дает больше амплитуды.
Try yourself, generator controls only key. No effect on the circuit and its output voltage.
Keep resonance and see a lot of harmonics, choose the one that gives more amplitude.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 23, 2014, 01:38:52 PM
Сами попробуйте, генератор управляет только ключом. Не оказывает влияние на схему и выход своим напряжением.
Держите резонанс и увидите много гармоник , выбирайте ту, что дает больше амплитуды.
Try yourself, generator controls only key. No effect on the circuit and its output voltage.
Keep resonance and see a lot of harmonics, choose the one that gives more amplitude.
Thank you. Very kind of you.
I am definitely going to try this.
One last question re this setup. Have you tried different capacitor? How would the resulting voltage change outside of the resonance? In other words, how important is the LC resonance in the secondary coil vs ferrite resonance?
~A
I just shot a video demonstrating the PSU reading the FG output voltage, it will be ready in a few minutes. Anything connected to the PSU's output terminals that provides a voltage will show up on the PSU's meter. If some capacitor in the circuit is charged, by the PSU or FG, to 8 volts, then the meter will read that voltage. When the circuit is disconnected, the PSU's meter reverts to showing the unit's set voltage.
Meanwhile, here's a video showing that a mosfet Gate capacitance does pass power from an AC or oscillating signal to the Drain and/or Source pins of the mosfet. IOW, your FG driving only the Gate of a mosfet can indeed be providing power to the circuit.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKF1r6vwUpI (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKF1r6vwUpI)
ETA: You can insure that the FG does "not" pass any power to the circuit through the mosfet Gate by using an optoisolator. Curiously.... putting a Gate signal optoisolator into circuits like these often makes any "OU" effect go away, though. I wonder why that is.....
Quote from: avalon on May 23, 2014, 01:57:06 PM
Thank you. Very kind of you.
I am definitely going to try this.
One last question re this setup. Have you tried different capacitor? How would the resulting voltage change outside of the resonance? In other words, how important is the LC resonance in the secondary coil vs ferrite resonance?
~A
Пробуйте любые, какие понравятся , работает на всех частотах. Главное максимум амплитуды выжать при базовом питании.
Try any of which like to work on all frequencies. Main squeeze the maximum amplitude at the basic nutrition.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 23, 2014, 11:53:31 AM
Это видео демонстрирует тот эффект что я использовал в фонарике.
This video demonstrates the effect that I used a flashlight.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdPgIQoFaq0
Что такое под номером 1 - ток?
2 - напряжение 12 вольт или что?
3- частота задается - так?
4- вспышки этого самого "феррорезонанса" должны превышать по мощности входную мощность -так?
1) В каком частотном диапазоне Вы крутили ручку генератора и какая была форма сигнала?
2) А как примерно был устроен трансформатор?
3) В "Акульих" схемах, генератора два. Один выдает синусоиду, второй выдает импульсы, вызывающие много гармоник, смесь гармоники и синусоиды в трансформаторе должна давать сверхединичность?
Верно?
Поясните, пожалуйста.
"Main squeeze the maximum amplitude at the basic nutrition."
I want that on a T-shirt!
Суть последнего видео показать принцип, который я использовал для автономной работы фонарика. Но не факт, что так правильно. В резонансе сердечник сильно намагничивается, превращаясь в магнит, при этом потребление всей схемы резко падает. Этот эффект я решил использовать как SR193 на ферритовом сердечнике. То что на видео - половина схемы, не хватает катушки съема, которая будет крепиться на оставшуюся часть сердечника. А то что схема возвращает энергию в блок питания , и при этом сильно намагничивает сердечник - огромный плюс! Возможно получиться выжать больше, чем на светодиод в автономной работе. :)
The essence of the video show the principle, which I used for a OU flashlight . But the fact that so correctly. At resonance, strongly magnetized core , becoming a magnet , with the consumption of the circuit drops sharply. This effect I decided to use as SR193 ferrite core . The fact that the video - half scheme lacks coil pickup , which will be fixed for the remainder of the core. And the fact that the scheme returns the energy to the power supply, and thus strongly magnetizes the core - a huge plus ! Opportunity to get to squeeze more than the LED in stand-alone operation . :)
I'm as happy as anyone to engage in thread drift.... but what happened to the "3V OU Flashlight" ? It now seems that some very very different circuits are being discussed. But of course I'm not completely sure, since I don't speak Russian...
Is the purpose of communication to be understood? I'm just an ignorant American, speaking only three languages, and my Russian is limited to "nichego" and "zdrastvstye" so, puzhalusta, govoryim po-Angliskii.
Quote from: tarakan on May 23, 2014, 02:08:30 PM
Что такое под номером 1 - ток?
2 - напряжение 12 вольт или что?
3- частота задается - так?
4- вспышки этого самого "феррорезонанса" должны превышать по мощности входную мощность -так?
1) В каком частотном диапазоне Вы крутили ручку генератора и какая была форма сигнала?
2) А как примерно был устроен трансформатор?
3) В "Акульих" схемах, генератора два. Один выдает синусоиду, второй выдает импульсы, вызывающие много гармоник, смесь гармоники и синусоиды в трансформаторе должна давать сверхединичность?
Верно?
Поясните, пожалуйста.
Я не Акула083, откуда мне знать, что он показывает на своих схемах.
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 23, 2014, 02:23:23 PM
I'm as happy as anyone to engage in thread drift.... but what happened to the "3V OU Flashlight" ? It now seems that some very very different circuits are being discussed. But of course I'm not completely sure, since I don't speak Russian...
Is the purpose of communication to be understood? I'm just an ignorant American, speaking only three languages, and my Russian is limited to "nichego" and "zdrastvstye" so, puzhalusta, govoryim po-Angliskii.
Тема правильная, а вам советую расслабиться с алкоголем, сразу легче станет.
Subject is correct, and I advise you to relax with alcohol, once it becomes easier.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 23, 2014, 02:20:30 PM
Суть последнего видео показать принцип, который я использовал для автономной работы фонарика. Но не факт, что так правильно. В резонансе сердечник сильно намагничивается, превращаясь в магнит, при этом потребление всей схемы резко падает. Этот эффект я решил использовать как SR193 на ферритовом сердечнике. То что на видео - половина схемы, не хватает катушки съема, которая будет крепиться на оставшуюся часть сердечника. А то что схема возвращает энергию в блок питания , и при этом сильно намагничивает сердечник - огромный плюс! Возможно получиться выжать больше, чем на светодиод в автономной работе. :)
The essence of the video show the principle, which I used for a OU flashlight . But the fact that so correctly. At resonance, strongly magnetized core , becoming a magnet , with the consumption of the circuit drops sharply. This effect I decided to use as SR193 ferrite core . The fact that the video - half scheme lacks coil pickup , which will be fixed for the remainder of the core. And the fact that the scheme returns the energy to the power supply, and thus strongly magnetizes the core - a huge plus ! Opportunity to get to squeeze more than the LED in stand-alone operation . :)
OK, I suppose I understand what you are saying. I don't understand why you are excited by it, though. It has been noticed before that inductors with rapidly collapsing magnetic fields produce voltage spikes that can be much greater than the input voltage. Voltage is not power and power is not energy, though.
Quote from: tarakan on May 23, 2014, 02:08:30 PM
Поясните, пожалуйста.
At some point I am going to upload a full resolution version of the clip. It simply takes a lot of time which I do not have at this moment.
As far as the explanation of the knobs and buttons is concerned, I am afraid that that we'd need to skip that for now as it would be, as presume, is of no interest (or use) to others.
So, wait for a better quality video and then see if your questions remain.
~A
Anyhow, here's this, fwiw:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7ohH9ruspE
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 23, 2014, 02:20:30 PM
Суть последнего видео показать принцип, который я использовал для автономной работы фонарика. Но не факт, что так правильно. В резонансе сердечник сильно намагничивается, превращаясь в магнит, при этом потребление всей схемы резко падает. Этот эффект я решил использовать как SR193 на ферритовом сердечнике. То что на видео - половина схемы, не хватает катушки съема, которая будет крепиться на оставшуюся часть сердечника. А то что схема возвращает энергию в блок питания , и при этом сильно намагничивает сердечник - огромный плюс! Возможно получиться выжать больше, чем на светодиод в автономной работе. :)
The essence of the video show the principle, which I used for a OU flashlight . But the fact that so correctly. At resonance, strongly magnetized core , becoming a magnet , with the consumption of the circuit drops sharply. This effect I decided to use as SR193 ferrite core . The fact that the video - half scheme lacks coil pickup , which will be fixed for the remainder of the core. And the fact that the scheme returns the energy to the power supply, and thus strongly magnetizes the core - a huge plus ! Opportunity to get to squeeze more than the LED in stand-alone operation . :)
Пока Вас не забрали КГБшники лил ЦРУшники, запишите все данные в файл, с названиями приборов и прочими данными.
Повторить положительный результат, сложно. А если у Вас горит маленький светодиодик - то еще труднее.
Я хочу повторить этот опыт. Из фильма я не очень много чего понял, поскольку Вы не объяснили что есть что.
Генератор выдавал синусоиду или какую нибудь еще форму, вызывающую больше гармоник, вроде квадратного импульса?
Первый генератор возбуждает сердечник квадратным импульсном, а второй генератор должен выдавать синусоиду на собственной частоте феррита?
На каких все это частотах происходит? Сотни Килогерц?
Как сердечник может намагничиваться переменным током? У него есть насыщение, но тогда обмотка начинает греться.
Скрепки притягивает? А у Вас сердечник собран с зазорами или просто прижаты половинки?
Приведите пожалуйста полную схему Вашего фонаря со всеми деталями. Я хочу поиграться сам.
Осциллограф у меня есть.
Ключ и генератор соберу под задачу.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 23, 2014, 02:23:57 PM
Я не Акула083, откуда мне знать, что он показывает на своих схемах.
Беда наших Кулибиных, что они свои результаты плохо документируют.
Переадресую вопрос Акуле.
Давайте все ему напишем, а то он сам сеет путаницу в сем важном вопросе своей неполной и разрозненной информацией.
Все должно быть записано - списка деталей я пока не нашел.
Или его уже люди в штатском забрали? Или он сам и есть...
Quote from: tarakan on May 23, 2014, 03:54:15 PM
Беда наших Кулибиных, что они свои результаты плохо документируют.
Переадресую вопрос Акуле.
Давайте все ему напишем, а то он сам сеет путаницу в сем важном вопросе своей неполной и разрозненной информацией.
Все должно быть записано - списка деталей я пока не нашел.
Или его уже люди в штатском забрали? Или он сам и есть...
Полная схема в начале ветки, с печатной платой.
И работает?
Quote from: 4Tesla on April 14, 2014, 02:55:28 PM
Hello all,
This thread is for the 3v OU Flashlight projects.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWjs0-WCMzs (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWjs0-WCMzs)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juwm_W5-qAM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juwm_W5-qAM)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_8OlH4kkKM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_8OlH4kkKM)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoGfSDbnwbk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoGfSDbnwbk)
ICs
CD4069 (K561LH2)
http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10001_10001_13231_-1 (http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10001_10001_13231_-1)
MC34063
http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10001_10001_316945_-1 (http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10001_10001_316945_-1)
Translation of PerpettummobileOUFlashLight_02.JPG
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ferrite pot core OB30 M1500. 3 coils 50 turns each using 0.35mm insulated magnetic wire. The induction is 3x716 uH. Standard 2 sections coil holder. One section is used by the bifiler coil (L1 & L2) and the other section is for the L3. Naturally, an air gap of 0.5mm is required (according to the theory).
In accordance with the AN920 document Figure 18 (http://onsemi.com (http://onsemi.com)), the induction should be 115uH. I have achieved the same result by using 20 turns of 0.35 wire. Thus 3x115uH (L1,L2,L3)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Четыре разных схемы вижу. О какой из них идет речь. Я понимаю, что это не очень принципиально, но я не очень хороший электронщик и есть вероятность что схема после моей сборки не заработает.
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 23, 2014, 01:38:52 PM
Сами попробуйте, генератор управляет только ключом. Не оказывает влияние на схему и выход своим напряжением.
Держите резонанс и увидите много гармоник , выбирайте ту, что дает больше амплитуды.
Try yourself, generator controls only key. No effect on the circuit and its output voltage.
Keep resonance and see a lot of harmonics, choose the one that gives more amplitude.
The diode attached in series to the transistor cuts coil from direct reverse short circuit path and is the key to stop wasting energy. As I told you in skype :) With this type of circuit you might see old tiger2007 video what he did with looping it back by the way.
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 23, 2014, 02:00:13 PM
I just shot a video demonstrating the PSU reading the FG output voltage, it will be ready in a few minutes. Anything connected to the PSU's output terminals that provides a voltage will show up on the PSU's meter. If some capacitor in the circuit is charged, by the PSU or FG, to 8 volts, then the meter will read that voltage. When the circuit is disconnected, the PSU's meter reverts to showing the unit's set voltage.
The all transistors are just functioning as DIODEs if connected in reverse way and also in MOSFET there is capacitive loop so nothing new. To
eliminate this you need blocking diodes for reversed currents.
In regards to FG - just put 555 timer in circuit and that will eliminate external FG. Then you can see what is going on.
In regards to circuit in topic - it is operating in same way as akula's flashlights and both are from same source:
http://www.skif.biz/index.php?name=Pages&op=page&pid=103 (http://www.skif.biz/index.php?name=Pages&op=page&pid=103)
https://yadi.sk/d/pYQJSGjKDEQVR (https://yadi.sk/d/pYQJSGjKDEQVR)
Cheers!
no
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 24, 2014, 07:08:20 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aY9_Cjt4Mqc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aY9_Cjt4Mqc) :)
Just place capacitor after diode and attach analog milliampmeter to show power consumption as your PS amp meter is not that sensitive for mili/micro amps draw ;)
Quote from: T-1000 on May 24, 2014, 07:15:14 AM
Just place capacitor after diode and attach analog milliampmeter to show power consumption as your PS amp meter is not that sensitive for mili/micro amps draw ;)
no
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 24, 2014, 07:28:47 AM
Если я это сделаю то измениться LC параметр, а следовательно и уйдет резонанс.
Убрать потребление на данном этапе не есть моя цель!!!
Моя цель максимально намагничивать сердечник для съемной катушки.
The tuning must be with all parts connected including constant load so the resonance won't go away. The freewheeling LC circuit will be always affected in any change of transformer core magnetization which will change inductance of all coils with each try to take energy out of it even if it gets maximum saturation of core when there is no load attached to transformer.
no
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 24, 2014, 07:08:20 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aY9_Cjt4Mqc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aY9_Cjt4Mqc) :)
When your PSU is showing the higher voltage and zero current.... please then vary the output amplitude of the Function Generator to see if this PSU-indicated voltage changes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7ohH9ruspE
Quote from: T-1000 on May 24, 2014, 07:15:14 AM
Just place capacitor after diode and attach analog milliampmeter to show power consumption as your PS amp meter is not that sensitive for mili/micro amps draw ;)
The meters on the Power Supply should _never_ be used to make quantitative calculations or claims. They are just there so you can set the PSU easily. You should always use separate meters connected properly to your DUT to make quantitative measurements. As I've shown the voltage indication may be subject to false indications due to the circuit's voltage actually supplying more than the PSU is set for (and other reasons), and as you note the current indication is only good to two significant digits and is only approximate.
no
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 24, 2014, 09:09:21 AM
Вот так использую конфликт токов получил уже что то в резонансе.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TIkoCZSnEk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TIkoCZSnEk)
Google translates that as:
Quotehere so use current conflict has already received something in the resonance.
Which isn't any language I understand.
The purpose of communication is to transfer information effectively, isn't it? This forum has sections in French, but mostly it is conducted in English, even though it is based in Germany and our host is German. If you want to start a Russian section, you can probably do that easily enough. I won't be reading there, so that might be seen as a benefit to you.
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 24, 2014, 09:16:22 AM
Google translates that as:
Which isn't any language I understand.
"Вот так использую конфликт токов получил уже что то в резонансе.[/size]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TIkoCZSnEk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TIkoCZSnEk)[/font][/size]"
"So I am using conflict of currents(EMF against BEMF) and got something in resonance"
Obviously you cannot push Russians to speak proper English when it comes to specific terms and Russian experimenter with fluent English is rare find ;)
hi semenihin-77,
Please do use www.freetranslation.com (http://www.overunity.com/www.freetranslation.com)to convert Russian to English.
Пожалуйста используйте www.freetranslation.com для преобразования российской на английском языке
--------------
My findings this translation site offer little better grammatical correction as compared to google translate.Everyone please do try out.
Quote from: TinselKoala on May 24, 2014, 09:16:22 AM
If you want to start a Russian section, you can probably do that easily enough. I won't be reading there, so that might be seen as a benefit to you.
I do understand your frustration. However, I must say that I have received a wealth of very useful information from some members here.
Since this is an open forum you have a very diverse community. From complete newbies to real scientists to utter dilettantes posting non-stop without real commitment to knowledge.
Perfect it is not, but whatever the formula is - it's definitely working in my case. Semenihin-77 has shared some very valuable information with us and I am, for one, grateful. He brings new angles and ideas instead of trying to dazzle us with his skills and knowledge as many members here do. I sure hope that he stays and would be happy to communicate in any language of his choice.
~A
Quote from: avalon on May 24, 2014, 11:29:50 AM
I do understand your frustration. However, I must say that I have received a wealth of very useful information from some members here.
Since this is an open forum you have a very diverse community. From complete newbies to real scientists to utter dilettantes posting non-stop without real commitment to knowledge.
Perfect it is not, but whatever the formula is - it's definitely working in my case. Semenihin-77 has shared some very valuable information with us and I am, for one, grateful. He brings new angles and ideas instead of trying to dazzle us with his skills and knowledge as many members here do. I sure hope that he stays and would be happy to communicate in any language of his choice.
~A
I prefer to have Russians here speaking Russian then to not have them here at all.
Like above, I've gain a tremendous amount of new information from Russians over the years.
Google translate isn't perfect but it's better then anything else I've tried.
My only request to the Russian speaking people is to please spell the words correctly in Russian so Google translate will have a chance to translate it.
Thank you,
DonL
I might be in the wrong thread here but their is a lot of frustration about. but could I just give you all this thought. Can I just ask how you have wound the transformer as the akula foto shows half the bobbin primary going one way on one side and the other half you can't see as it's under the secondary, but is it wound in the opposite direction ? could it be that simple ?
A G
Quote from: semenihin-77 on May 23, 2014, 04:18:13 PM
Полная схема в начале ветки, с печатной платой.
Уважаемый semenihin-77,
какая схема из трех, приведенных в первом посте, у Вас лучше всего заработала?
Quote from: tarakan on May 24, 2014, 02:17:17 PM
Уважаемый semenihin-77,
какая схема из трех, приведенных в первом посте, у Вас лучше всего заработала?
Its the very first one with the C1815 transistor. However, a word of caution. No-one has been able to replicate it, as essence of the circuit is not in the schematics but rather in the coils and the ferrite core used.
Understanding the principle behind the circuit is the key and I would suggest, with respect, to postpone your trip to the nearest RadioShack until you now exactly what you are about to do.
~A
This circuit seems to be the most realistic one and I want to replicate it.
I got it off this forum post and fixed it. Part of the circuit was misalligned with the rest.
Quote from: T-1000 on May 24, 2014, 06:38:04 AM
In regards to circuit in topic - it is operating in same way as akula's flashlights and both are from same source:
http://www.skif.biz/index.php?name=Pages&op=page&pid=103 (http://www.skif.biz/index.php?name=Pages&op=page&pid=103)
https://yadi.sk/d/pYQJSGjKDEQVR (https://yadi.sk/d/pYQJSGjKDEQVR)
Cheers!
Thanks T-1000
I find it very interesting the part in the 2nd. Video where he attempts to power-up the GLED device with the battery, but the coil does *NOT* have the POT core attached. In other words, it is just the coil bobbin in the circuit at this time without its POT core attached:
He momentarily touches the battery to the contacts and the smaller RED leds light-up for about 2 seconds and then die out..........
Then he attaches the POT core to the coil bobbin and places the *Metal* screw thru the POT core & bobbin and threads it *into* the PCB.
Now upon touching the battery to the contacts, ALL the LEDs light up very brightly and stay lit.........with the core & Screw in place.
The other interesting part in the 1st video is where he attempts to power-up the GLED and it starts up but the LEDS are dim..... then he grabs the screwdriver and tightens up the center screw on the POT core.
Now, with the center screw threaded into place on the PCB, he restarts the GLED and the LEDS all light up very brightly........
Appears to me that the center screw plays a very serious role in the overall equation of operation.
Thanks again and take care, peace.
lost_bro
Quote from: tarakan on May 24, 2014, 05:50:44 PM
This circuit seems to be the most realistic one and I want to replicate it.
I got it off this forum post and fixed it. Part of the circuit was misalligned with the rest.
There is a separate discussion thread for this circuit. You might want to check it out.
~A
Quote from: avalon on May 24, 2014, 08:13:18 PM
There is a separate discussion thread for this circuit. You might want to check it out.
~A
What is it called?
http://www.overunity.com/14610/akula0083-light-no3-dual-tl494/
Quote from: avalon on May 24, 2014, 10:30:33 PM
http://www.overunity.com/14610/akula0083-light-no3-dual-tl494/ (http://www.overunity.com/14610/akula0083-light-no3-dual-tl494/)
that's not really the same...
MC35blahblah or dual tl494 ... or lasersaber jouleringer extroidinaire something
but regarding your scope and resonance, you said ti was a combination of frequencies... so if you change the yellow while the blue is making a spikey red... so you gain/lose spikeyness?
Hi Lost_bro,
you wrote:
QuoteAppears to me that the center screw plays a very serious role in the overall equation of operation.
I think the role of the center screw is to fix and hold the two pot core halves together.
When you have no any pot core around the bobbin or they are around but the facing halves
are not firmly tightened (i.e. there is air gap betwen them), all this means the inductance of the coil(s)
on the bobbin is not sufficiently high enough for a specific job. By using the pot cores you increase
the inductance to the max possible the pot cores are designed to give and / or to achieve an inductance
value which is already sufficient for the task.
Yes the metal screw influences the inductance of the coils on the bobbin via the pot cores like
a tuning slug core does because it possibly has a u > 1 permeability (unless it is stainless steel
with a u around 1).
But remember that a metal screw can introduce eddy current loss which may not be harmful in this application
but can be in other circuits like narrow band (high Q) LC filters. In the latter case nonmetal fixing means are used
via the through-hole of the pot cores or they are simply glued or clamped together from outside.
Gyula
Quote from: d3x0r on May 25, 2014, 04:40:07 AM
that's not really the same...
MC35blahblah or dual tl494 ... or lasersaber jouleringer extroidinaire something
but regarding your scope and resonance, you said ti was a combination of frequencies... so if you change the yellow while the blue is making a spikey red... so you gain/lose spikeyness?
Pay attention, man. I was referring to the dual-TL494 schematics posted by tarakan.
~A
Quote from: gyulasun on May 25, 2014, 05:35:11 AM
Hi Lost_bro,
you wrote:
I think the role of the center screw is to fix and hold the two pot core halves together.
When you have no any pot core around the bobbin or they are around but the facing halves
are not firmly tightened (i.e. there is air gap betwen them), all this means the inductance of the coil(s)
on the bobbin is not sufficiently high enough for a specific job. By using the pot cores you increase
the inductance to the max possible the pot cores are designed to give and / or to achieve an inductance
value which is already sufficient for the task.
Yes the metal screw influences the inductance of the coils on the bobbin via the pot cores like
a tuning slug core does because it possibly has a u > 1 permeability (unless it is stainless steel
with a u around 1).
But remember that a metal screw can introduce eddy current loss which may not be harmful in this application
but can be in other circuits like narrow band (high Q) LC filters. In the latter case nonmetal fixing means are used
via the through-hole of the pot cores or they are simply glued or clamped together from outside.
Gyula
Good day Gyula
Yes, I understand the necessity to firmly clamp the ferrites together in relation to the inductance generated......
But, the interesting note to the situation is that the metal screw not only passes thru the POT core but is fastened with threads to what *appears* to be the ground plane.......
If you only need to fasten the halves together, why use a threaded ground plane connection? I think in that case a nylon bolt & nut would suffice.
I ask, what could be the *possible* relationship between the grounded threaded screw & the copper foil windings within the transformer?
take care, peace
lost_bro
Quote from: lost_bro on May 25, 2014, 02:05:23 PM
...
I ask, what could be the *possible* relationship between the grounded threaded screw &
the copper foil windings within the transformer?
...
Hi Lost_bro,
The possible relationship is capacitance I think. This kind of mounting establishes a capacitive coupling
between the ground and the "inner world" of the pot core.
Gyula
Quote from: gyulasun on May 25, 2014, 02:56:31 PM
Hi Lost_bro,
The possible relationship is capacitance I think. This kind of mounting establishes a capacitive coupling
between the ground and the "inner world" of the pot core.
Gyula
Why not use a nylon or ceramic bolt and nut? Or, is the capacitive coupling desirable in this application?
Bill
Quote from: avalon on May 25, 2014, 12:55:52 PM
Pay attention, man. I was referring to the dual-TL494 schematics posted by tarakan.
~A
Was starting to think I was asking the wrong person also ... ya I missed the schematic that was a couple days ago....
but regarding your scope and resonance, you said ti was a combination of frequencies... so if you change the yellow while the blue is making a spikey red... so you gain/lose spikeyness?[/size]
- Oh I see; I gave up after 10 minutes since there was only a small fraction left, I figured you weren't going to get there.
Are high amps good?
Dear Bill,
I do not know why the builder of the setup in question does not use non-metal bolt and nut.
And whether a capacitive coupling is desirable in this application, I can only guess: yes... because
the builder may have found that advantageous.
Sorry.
(When I used pot cores in audio LC filters and one of the coils were ground-independent
in the circuit as the design had it, then the filter response changed a little when I positioned that single
pot core (with the ground independent coil in it) over the PCB ground plane. And I could not use ANY metal
bolts for fixing the cores because at the frequency involved any metal inserted ruined the high Q of the
coils, this increased insertion loss and decreased outside attenuation.
Gyula
Gyula:
Thank you for your answer. I agree it would make sense to use non-metalic bolts but I guess we can assume then that he wants the effect by not using them.
A while back, my company made ceramic tuning tools for companies like Motorola for adjusting their pagers. Metal would alter the results and plastic would deform and not work well over time so, they had us make ceramic tips for all of their trim pot designs of which I think there were like 5. That was like 20 years ago....geeze, I am getting old.
Bill
Quote from: d3x0r on May 25, 2014, 03:10:55 PM
Was starting to think I was asking the wrong person also ... ya I missed the schematic that was a couple days ago....
but regarding your scope and resonance, you said ti was a combination of frequencies... so if you change the yellow while the blue is making a spikey red... so you gain/lose spikeyness?[/size]
- Oh I see; I gave up after 10 minutes since there was only a small fraction left, I figured you weren't going to get there.
Are high amps good?
Of course, high amps aren't good. We all try to reduce the consumption to a bear minimum while maintaining the output. I was showing that at certain combination of frequencies the consumption drops dramatically while still producing the same output voltage. Also, if you watch the clip carefully enough you can see me testing the hysteresis and the Bloch wall at some point.
BTW, there is now a HD version of the clip here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2vrfyqmYvU
~A
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NVBiY13osE&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NVBiY13osE&feature=youtu.be)[/font]Wesley
I am from Russia and I live in the United States and I followed this topic for a while. I am fluently bilingual , but I have no time to translate videos or posts. I am sorry.
I want to conduct an experiment:
Instead of dealing with this complex grid of mixed Russian and Western parts, PWM modules, voltage regulators and other strange devices,
I want to build a testing stand where I can plug a transformer in and try to achieve overunity or ferroresonance by tuning few knobs and watching the output on my oscilloscope.
I am not skilled in electronics well enough to decode the circuit that uses a lot of bipolar transistors and other current-controlled devices. Even if I would have been as skilled as StiveP, Avalon, and other members of this forum, I would not spend too much time decoding a circuit that I may not replicate so it works..
Maybe I am wrong.
The experiment will involve:
1) An Arduino microcontroller -- I have to pick a right one for the task.
2) Two AD9850 or AD9851 modules --
what does "* AD9850 do not have 6 octave, but the AD9851 have." stand for? What is the difference between AD9850 and AD9851?
3) Some means of adjusting frequencies of both modules smoothly, through the microcontroller --
such as a pair of knobs, connected to two rotary encoders or a variable resistors. (2 for 2 DDS boards)
4) Some program with phase shift and synchronisation algorithms that I will have to write.
5) A knob to adjust the phase alignment of two signals.
6) Knobs to tune amplitude of the two generator output signals in an energy-conserving manner. -- saturable reactor transformer or more modern means
7) A set of circuits to convert square wave or sine wave signal output to spike, sawtooth and other shapes on demand, over a wide range of frequencies.
8) Amplifiers that work efficiently with currents and voltages used in the transformer. -- FET/MOSFET or powerful bipolar transistors, maybe appropriate OP AMP ICs.
9) A rectifier circuit.
10) Powerful shunts with analog voltmeters to measure current draw on the input and load test the output of the rectifier.
11) An Oscilloscope -- the only thing that I have
12) Maybe, some feedback for than microcontroller, other than my observation.
As someone who spent a long time in Overunity research online, I realize that some successful inventors that want to bring their ideas to the masses are silenced.
Few more try to sell their ideas and of course financial world doesn't want to support them in any way.
This dates back to the partnership of Nikola Tesla and J.P. Morgan.
I hope that I will not be purged before I can publish positive results.
Also. As I notice, all free energy devices incorporate some kind of a weird transformer and a signal generator. Than there is always a circuit to convert the energy to useful energy, similar to mains AC. Obviously there is also something to power the generator with the output of the circuit.
As time varied, mechanical commutator, electromagnetic machine, saturable reactor, spark gap and transistor means were used in the generator. Therefore voltages and designs varied dramatically. (Saturable reactors are often found inside the weird transformers themselves.)
To get to the fundamental idea that I suspect may be roughly called "ferroresonance", I would like to entirely rule out the generator side of the circuit by making a modern, versatile, custom generator that can synthesize the right frequency and waveform to allow this transformer to show the desired effects.
It may take me a while because of time and financial issues. I am afraid to start building this system because I lack some fundamental knowledge of electronic design.
Is this a wise idea, overall?
I will start a separate thread if you think that this is a wise idea.
Quote from: tarakan on May 27, 2014, 07:22:25 PM
I am not skilled in electronics well enough to decode the circuit that uses a lot of bipolar transistors and other current-controlled devices. Even if I would have been as skilled as StiveP, Avalon, and other members of this forum, I would not spend too much time decoding a circuit that I may not replicate so it works..
Maybe I am wrong.
The experiment will involve:
1) An Arduino microcontroller -- I have to pick a right one for the task.
With such small power circuit it is overkill to use micrcontrollers as they consume much more power themselves than original microchip in delamorto circuit.
Because you have no skils in electronics - you need to find ham radio engineer to assemble working circutis for you or someone else who can do this for you. Otherwise - there are a lot of handful tutorial videos in Youtube for learning radio electronics assembly.
Cheers!
Quote from: T-1000 on May 28, 2014, 05:17:33 AM
With such small power circuit it is overkill to use micrcontrollers as they consume much more power themselves than original microchip in delamorto circuit.
Because you have no skils in electronics - you need to find ham radio engineer to assemble working circutis for you or someone else who can do this for you. Otherwise - there are a lot of handful tutorial videos in Youtube for learning radio electronics assembly.
Cheers!
1) I can power microcontrollers separately and not consider their power consumption in the experiment. The point of the experiment is to design a circuit to prove a point, not to get "overunity". 30 watts is plenty to drive a microcontroller, even a small computer. Versatility is the key. When I find out what I want, I will go for efficiency - design a specific circuit for an output of a specific waveform. This was the original plan, at least.
2) I am skilled enough to design my own simple amplifiers, I prefer FETs. Decoding the circuit that someone else designed is not my thing. This voltage regulator in the video makes me wonder if all those components were placed for a good reason or only because the inventor had them at hand...
Maybe FBI added those components to confuse those who try to replicate the circuit.
All I need to know is what waveform was created under what conditions. Correct? This is where I will need some help.
Quote from: stivep on May 27, 2014, 03:11:07 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NVBiY13osE&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NVBiY13osE&feature=youtu.be)[/font]Wesley
Can the transformer in the bottom generator serve as a magnetic reactor that is used to control current?
Quote from: avalon on May 25, 2014, 09:49:51 PM
Of course, high amps aren't good. We all try to reduce the consumption to a bear minimum while maintaining the output. I was showing that at certain combination of frequencies the consumption drops dramatically while still producing the same output voltage. Also, if you watch the clip carefully enough you can see me testing the hysteresis and the Bloch wall at some point.
BTW, there is now a HD version of the clip here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2vrfyqmYvU
~A
Just watched your last video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgYLVyswgeQ
Part of the waveform looks a lot like the latest waveform Akula shows in his last video.
Can you post a schematic of circuit........
and, its OK to talk in your vids......
Thanks
peace,
lost_bro
Quote from: lost_bro on June 02, 2014, 03:04:12 PM
Part of the waveform looks a lot like the latest waveform Akula shows in his last video.
It is and also not quite. Simply because I use a different ferrite.
His is MnZn whereas mine is MgZn. Hence - slightly different waveforms. The principle, however, is the same.
~A
UPDATE: just realised that the schematics is not entirely correct. The two function gens are not sin and saw. In fact it is configured as a double pulse with adjustable width, period and repetition. For my pot it is 645 Hz, 188 kHz and 50ms.
I'm glad to see that you realize that FGs can be chained in various ways, to make whatever oscillatory beats with whatever phase relationship may be desired.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3T6kEic5G0
Psh... 3300uF that's only 3x what I used, and I get 1% of the runtime...
4:53 - 6:25 before he shorts it out and gives up. With not just a glimmer of light......
92 seconds
Looks like a variation of the cuk converter
Quote from: TinselKoala on June 02, 2014, 04:23:51 PM
I'm glad to see that you realize that FGs can be chained in various ways, to make whatever oscillatory beats with whatever phase relationship may be desired.
...it took me way too long.
Quote from: avalon on June 02, 2014, 11:00:22 PM
...it took me way too long.
There are several ways to do it. You can use one to "gate" the other one by using the synch output and trigger inputs. You can also simply connect the raw outputs in series, but this usually doesn't give you precise control of the phase relationship.
From a couple of years ago (my how time flies...):
FGs in series:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8szx6Fa19s
(I get kind of jumbled in the verbal description in that vid, misstating the FG names and voltages a couple of times, but the overall concept should be clear enough)
From last year:
gating one FG by the other FG:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cijCvoz179I
Some FGs have things like VCF inputs, where you can use one FG to control the _frequency_ of the other one, not just the amplitude. This is really handy if you don't have a frequency sweep function, for example.
Bottom line: with two or more FGs connected together in various ways you should be able to reproduce the frequencies and phase relationships and beat notes and mechanical resonances that are made by the oscillator portions of the Akula circuits. This may help experimenters to find what cores really do, without necessarily needing to construct the actual circuit first.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TLshXC-xF4 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TLshXC-xF4)
Wesley presents Daly part #2 Free Energy Device (schematic)
Wesley
Wesley presents:Daly part #3 Free Energy Device (schematic)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KR99TnupvOU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KR99TnupvOU)
Wesley
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cOepViJhHTA
Wesley
Hi everybody,
just want to ask why this thread stopped so abruptly, thought there seemed to be some progress ?
Is there a follow-on thread or something ?
cheers
Quote from: tarakan on May 28, 2014, 12:07:39 PM
1) I can power microcontrollers separately and not consider their power consumption in the experiment. The point of the experiment is to design a circuit to prove a point, not to get "overunity". 30 watts is plenty to drive a microcontroller, even a small computer. Versatility is the key. When I find out what I want, I will go for efficiency - design a specific circuit for an output of a specific waveform. This was the original plan, at least.
2) I am skilled enough to design my own simple amplifiers, I prefer FETs. Decoding the circuit that someone else designed is not my thing. This voltage regulator in the video makes me wonder if all those components were placed for a good reason or only because the inventor had them at hand...
Maybe FBI added those components to confuse those who try to replicate the circuit.
All I need to know is what waveform was created under what conditions. Correct? This is where I will need some help.
I did the same, got my signal to drive the transistor from a pc and played with the frequency and duty factor. This for the Akula eternal lantern . Normally I should get an increase in voltage higher than the power supply if I get the right signal, Im I correct ? However, I did not get anything ou, all I want now is a kit if someone did it.
i am play with pulse train al kind of frequency an so far nothing even near as avalon result :(
It looks like you've just about got the oscilloscope figured out, though. Congratulations on that!
Were you able to "unlock" the scope's extra functions and higher bandwidth? I'm curious because my DS1054Z should be delivered to me tomorrow, from a new production batch from Rigol.
What is the firmware version and board revision number of your scope, if it's not too much trouble?
Thanks in advance--
--TK
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 07, 2015, 08:44:30 AM
It looks like you've just about got the oscilloscope figured out, though. Congratulations on that!
Were you able to "unlock" the scope's extra functions and higher bandwidth? I'm curious because my DS1054Z should be delivered to me tomorrow, from a new production batch from Rigol.
What is the firmware version and board revision number of your scope, if it's not too much trouble?
Thanks in advance--
--TK
my ds1054 work over 100Mhz ;D
I made dill with diller-i order from chehoslovakia- and receive already unlocked scope. In phase of scope invastigations what to by i download program for key unlock scope so you can try.
send me PM with email -ill send you program
Quote from: eugene900 on April 07, 2015, 11:47:15 AM
my ds1054 work over 100Mhz ;D
I made dill with diller-i order from chehoslovakia- and receive already unlocked scope. In phase of scope invastigations what to by i download program for key unlock scope so you can try.
send me PM with email -ill send you program
Thanks, I have the keygen program already, in HTML, Windows and Linux command-line versions. (The Linux is source code + makefile and needs to be compiled for your actual system, but that's as easy as running the makefile from your command line.) I've tested them all with some serial numbers I got from the web, and they all work. Of course I haven't actually tested the keys they spit out, but at least they all spit out the same key when a serial number and option code is entered.
Quote from: TinselKoala on April 07, 2015, 04:14:47 PM
Thanks, I have the keygen program already, in HTML, Windows and Linux command-line versions. (The Linux is source code + makefile and needs to be compiled for your actual system, but that's as easy as running the makefile from your command line.) I've tested them all with some serial numbers I got from the web, and they all work. Of course I haven't actually tested the keys they spit out, but at least they all spit out the same key when a serial number and option code is entered.
Hope that will work in real because unlocked scope is great value for money :) and work brilliant, just one remark- cooling fan produce bunch of noise but as long i have guaranty don't want to open and reduce fan speed or found some other solution
Quote from: eugene900 on April 07, 2015, 07:08:22 PM
Hope that will work in real because unlocked scope is great value for money :) and work brilliant, just one remark- cooling fan produce bunch of noise but as long i have guaranty don't want to open and reduce fan speed or found some other solution
It's easy enough to remove the "warranty" sticker without damaging it. You heat it up with warm air from blowdryer and carefully slide some slick paper (like glossy photopaper or similar) underneath it, carefully working a little bit at a time. Keep it on the slick paper for storage, then you can replace it on the scope if you need to send it back for warranty.
A couple of fans have been mentioned as quiet replacements:
Gelid Silent 5
or
Fractal Design FD-FAN-SSR2-50
I've already ordered one of the FD fans from a seller in Houston, should be here in a few days. $9.99 USD plus tax, free shipping. If the scope is so noisy it keeps me awake, I'll put the new fan in.
TK:
On a slightly related topic, the Raspberry Pi 2 is brand new and very exciting for the hobbyist.
http://www.raspberrypi.org/raspberry-pi-2-on-sale/ (http://www.raspberrypi.org/raspberry-pi-2-on-sale/)
QuoteLet's get the good stuff out of the way above the fold. Raspberry Pi 2 is now on sale for $35 (the same price as the existing Model B+), featuring:
A 900MHz quad-core ARM Cortex-A7 CPU (~6x performance)
1GB LPDDR2 SDRAM (2x memory)
Complete compatibility with Raspberry Pi 1
Because it has an ARMv7 processor, it can run the full range of ARM GNU/Linux distributions, including Snappy Ubuntu Core, as well as Microsoft Windows 10.
You can run Kodi/XBMC on it and it can decode 1080p H264 video no prob! You effectively have a Linux quad-core computer the size of a credit card for $35 USD plus keyboard, mouse, monitor.
I may buy one so that I can Velcro a media center computer on the back of my TV!
MileHigh
Quote from: MileHigh on April 07, 2015, 09:52:17 PM
TK:
On a slightly related topic, the Raspberry Pi 2 is brand new and very exciting for the hobbyist.
http://www.raspberrypi.org/raspberry-pi-2-on-sale/ (http://www.raspberrypi.org/raspberry-pi-2-on-sale/)
You can run Kodi/XBMC on it and it can decode 1080p H264 video no prob! You effectively have a Linux quad-core computer the size of a credit card for $35 USD plus keyboard, mouse, monitor.
I may buy one so that I can Velcro a media center computer on the back of my TV!
MileHigh
ether receiver may be damaged by static electricity... at least mine isn't working right anymore - I have a nylon brush on this new vacuum and it builds a nice static charge; discharges into my hand as I vacuum :) but passed that over the ether cable and the network no longer works
just really wanted to post SOMETHING.
Here we describe an interesting chopper spark PLL: http://gorchilin.com/articles/scheme/pll (http://gorchilin.com/articles/scheme/pll)
replica
not working :P
few attempt of acula lanterns ;D ALL NOT ANY OU EFFECT just regular oscillators. Wonder how much more i should build before finally will start study Tesla drawings and start pray to understand how is working-then build something my self :P ;D
Hi,
i hope anybody can help me. I wanna replicate this circuit, but the coils confuses me.
Quote from: 4TeslaFerrite pot core OB30 M1500. 3 coils 50 turns each using 0.35mm insulated magnetic wire. The induction is 3x716 uH. Standard 2 sections coil holder.
One section is used by the bifiler coil (L1 & L2) and the other section is for the L3. Naturally, an air gap of 0.5mm is required (according to the theory).
First is a copper foil, then solder a wire and the copper wire, right?
Then wrap tape over it. Then wind bifilar?
If i have success, i wanna create a pcb in eagle and order few pieces.
I hope i get reply.
Thanks for your help, i really appreciate, it. ;)
Best regards,
Mike
Quote from: avalon on May 21, 2014, 10:38:09 PM
Update: With a 1K load the frequencies have changed. Now I have got the proper resonance back to [roughly] the same levels as before:
@1k load - 460 V~ p-p, (36V Cyc RMS), 12v 0.2A. No capacitors connected yet.
~A
Ok, i doubt a bit about this:
Even if you have 100V @ 1kOhm, it will give you 100mA at the resistor, which is 10 Watt.
It will smoke and burn then...
@Avalon: Your last post is 17 Month ago, are you still there?
Thanks a quick reply or an update of what you did the last year
bitbo
Quote from: eugene900 on May 03, 2015, 09:13:03 AM
few attempt of acula lanterns ;D ALL NOT ANY OU EFFECT just regular oscillators. Wonder how much more i should build before finally will start study Tesla drawings and start pray to understand how is working-then build something my self :P ;D
Do you want to sell the green one - i am interested !?
Please PM me....
bitbo
Hi any one got this thing to work ? I have 2 sets of ferrite resonant cores but nothing special, did any one ever get this device to work ?
:P
Of course Not
But great for spend time doing something :-)
Quote from: eugene900 on April 03, 2018, 07:45:31 PM
:P
Of course Not
But great for spend time doing something :-)
well have you seen this ?
not sure how to wind coils yet !
AG
I resized your image from above , so we don't have to run back and forth to read the page
maybe remove yours?
truth that was quick ;D I have a set to post so reduced to 65% will post now
No i dont see that model because dont play with this discovery channel for a while. Hovever few years try this anx that and found non of this nog working. Ill be glad to yoy or somebody can proof any of this lights shematic actualy work. BTW if something is working will be not published on internet. People are god but not so much :-)
The developer of the scheme "Flashlight Over Unity"- "Not a square" from Ukraine . This combination was launched in 2014. Recently, at one of the Russian-language forums (Wanderer-2 (https://strannik-2.ru/index.php/forum/index)), this scheme was proposed by the author for experiments. In a short period of time, the scheme was repeated by three participants of the forum. The peculiarity of the work is that in addition to the LEDs, the battery is charged. Undercharged battery restores charge increasing its voltage.
I made a publication on this topic in Russian (https://zen.yandex.ru/media/id/5c01a2bcbf4b0f04178227d6/vechnyi-fonarik-ili-mini-btg-5d1c397ecc20a700ae50f17c)
Good luck!
If it is OU why does it need a battery ? ::)
Hello everyone,
As the topic was brought up after years of silence, I would like to share little secret behind this little device.
The whole circuit is making ferro-resonance which in turn is making strongest magnetostriction (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetostriction) possible. Because it is also electrical resonant system it does not take much for this effect to happen and is running close to unity in terms of COP. Just that is not enough for making circuit self-run and the second source of power is needed.
And here is where Piezoelectricity (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piezoelectricity) effect utilization comes into action. While having grinded piezoelectric ceramic material film on top of copper foil and having 1 foil inside of coil and 1 foil outside of coil will make good mechanical power conversion into electricity (which would be wasted otherwise). Make it right and it will give decent high voltage power from resulting magnetostriction vibrations. Then feeding that back into circuit makes device run for weeks or months until ferrite core finally breaks into pieces from mechanical damage.
Hopefully that clarify what is happening in those circuits.
Cheers!
Quote from: T-1000 on July 03, 2019, 02:05:37 PM
Hello everyone,
As the topic was brought up after years of silence, I would like to share little secret behind this little device.
The whole circuit is making ferro-resonance which in turn is making strongest magnetostriction (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetostriction) possible. Because it is also electrical resonant system it does not take much for this effect to happen and is running close to unity in terms of COP. Just that is not enough for making circuit self-run and the second source of power is needed.
And here is where Piezoelectricity (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piezoelectricity) effect utilization comes into action. While having grinded piezoelectric ceramic material film on top of copper foil and having 1 foil inside of coil and 1 foil outside of coil will make good mechanical power conversion into electricity (which would be wasted otherwise). Make it right and it will give decent high voltage power from resulting magnetostriction vibrations. Then feeding that back into circuit makes device run for weeks or months until ferrite core finally breaks into pieces from mechanical damage.
Hopefully that clarify what is happening in those circuits.
Cheers!
High T1000 any chance of a sketch or photo or any other information on this please.
Aliengrey,
start here and move forward:
https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&rurl=translate.google.de&sl=ru&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=https://strannik-2.ru/index.php/forum/prakticheskaya-elektronika/220-u-menya-interesnaya-skhema%3Fstart%3D750&xid=17259,15700023,15700186,15700191,15700256,15700259,15700262&usg=ALkJrhhKkgZdw8f5_1xwfQXVCtCnqOcfEQ (https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&rurl=translate.google.de&sl=ru&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=https://strannik-2.ru/index.php/forum/prakticheskaya-elektronika/220-u-menya-interesnaya-skhema%3Fstart%3D750&xid=17259,15700023,15700186,15700191,15700256,15700259,15700262&usg=ALkJrhhKkgZdw8f5_1xwfQXVCtCnqOcfEQ)
LED1 is in wrong direction, because the blue coil of Tr1 gets negativ at the hot end ( while the transistor collector current in the red coil of Tr1 increases) and current is drwan from the positive pole of the battery to this hot end and down to negative pole of battery.
This redrawn scheme also provides data for the number of windings.
Took me 8 hours to read the complete discussion via google-Translator.
Another remark on the winding direction of the three coils on TR1: all coils are wound in one direction.
In the scheme of user GREEN the arc-arrow is wrong ( hot ends are correct )
Hope this helps.
Mike
Thanks might have a go at that one there seems to be some stuff that has been thought out and works.
But there is more.
From what I have read the effect is not magnetostriction based but its a prnciple - yet to be veryfied - called "Magnetic Flux Multiplication".
On page 56 user "extreme spin" posted a link to this website here however google-translator does not show the circuit-diagramms
https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=de&sl=ru&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2F001-lab.at.ua%2Findex%2Frazmnozhenie_magnitnogo_potoka%2F0-20 (https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=de&sl=ru&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2F001-lab.at.ua%2Findex%2Frazmnozhenie_magnitnogo_potoka%2F0-20)
even on the original site here : https://rakarskiy.io.ua/s2618323/razmnojenie_magnitnogo_potoka_rmp (https://rakarskiy.io.ua/s2618323/razmnojenie_magnitnogo_potoka_rmp)
Grafic are missing and if I go to the source of this information : https://001-lab.at.ua/index/razmnozhenie_magnitnogo_potoka/0-20 (https://001-lab.at.ua/index/razmnozhenie_magnitnogo_potoka/0-20)
Mozilla blocks the site because of security-reasons.
edit: I found the original Text, please see attachment
My search engine wont connect with that site it says it's trying to down load malware.
you can get toroids wit hysteresis they are the old type used in computer memory
they would be used in switching memory circuit and i read they can stor magnetic field.
yeah something is wrong with this site.
go back to my previous post and see my attachement.
Mike
Kator01
I think this may be related. I plan to check it , waiting for some MKP capacitors to test.
Quote from: forest on July 07, 2019, 03:57:36 AM
Kator01
I think this may be related. I plan to check it , waiting for some MKP capacitors to test.
That circuit is not related to LED flashlight. The original circuit was creating resonance in ferrite and also had static potential taking back to circuit for creating second power input.
For example, akula was explaining how to create ferro-resonance and taking static potential from copper plates on both sides of the coil:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_U4mSUz04cg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_U4mSUz04cg)
And the demo circuit with step-down from potential taken from plates on core mixed with piezoelectric material:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxYX_ZC1XNo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxYX_ZC1XNo)
From the closest near-unity replications you can also check on lasersaber circuit - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RXolkA08uk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RXolkA08uk)
http://laserhacker.com/?p=491 (http://laserhacker.com/?p=491) (not utilising static potential as a second power source back to circuit)
Cheers!
forest,
Interesting yes and not related to the flash-circuit. In welseys thread there was a similar circuit however there was a periodic short-circuit at peak power of the left coil.I am really curious of what you will come up with, good luck
@T-1000 :
all those endless russian videos do not help here simply because we do not speak your language. It was already much work to go through all the postings of the realstannik-forum via google translator.From what I read today the users are frustrated and beleive that this is no valuable approach.
Besides there is a much more simple LED Flasher based on negistor-circuit.
Edit: we should be correct when we talk about phyhical phaenomena that is:
Akula certainly is not experiencing ferroresonance but rather creating ultrasound by magnetostriction and this can happen at diffreren frequencies.Otherwise he would have killed his small transformer in a few seconds...somthing what happenes mainly in power-networks.
Ferroresonance is clearly defined:
https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/engineering/ferroresonance (https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/engineering/ferroresonance)
Key points: "approaching the knee of the BH-Curve and the remaining much lower inductance in combination with capacitance (series resonance) -> current spike
Mike
Quote from: Kator01 on July 08, 2019, 07:41:02 PM
Akula certainly is not experiencing ferroresonance but rather creating ultrasound by magnetostriction and this can happen at diffreren frequencies.Otherwise he would have killed his small transformer in a few seconds...somthing what happenes mainly in power-networks.
As I mentioned before, it was creating vibrations needed for piezoelectricity to work. And it was created by resonant approach while consuming microwatts of power. Then feeding back power in circuit from piezoelectricity is more than enough to loop circuit and light up few LEDs.
Cheers!
May I ask what Q factor of resonant circuit means to you ? Can we have such situation that the input power to the radio transmitter is far less then the radiated power on antenna ? I think this is the key topic for very wide range of OU schematics
Quote from: forest on July 09, 2019, 01:39:22 AM
May I ask what Q factor of resonant circuit means to you ? Can we have such situation that the input power to the radio transmitter is far less then the radiated power on antenna ? I think this is the key topic for very wide range of OU schematics
I am talking about high Q achieved in the coil. Also to keep low current draw the resonant circuit needs only fraction of power and feeding spikes instead of sinus/50-50% square wave is more than enough. So feeding pulse train with like less than 5% duty cycle signals also helps with low current draw.
And did you ever tried to hammer ferrite with second spike on peak of BEMF pulse?
Actually that second scope shot above from Akula's video where the waveform suddenly changes
into a big spike was due to a defect (bug) in Akula's Atten brand scope. That Atten scope has the
same internal hardware (Atten was just a rebranded scope with Siglent hardware inside) and I
was able to reproduce that exact waveform on my Siglent scope, and I demonstrated that the waveform
the scope showed was actually due to a glitch (bug) in the scope's hardware or software. The waveform shown
in the video was a false waveform due to the bug in the scope's hardware/software. There is a thread here
on this where I posted my own similar scope shots and demonstrated that it was due to a bug in the scope.
Who posted this 3volt flashlight? that doesn't work? I knocked this up on a breadboard most of the resister values are wrong
as the switch circuit wouldn't run the pot cor makes a nice squealing noise but doesn't give a sine or square wave out and the
one half of the 4069 doesn't do anything as the circuit isn't finished if a transistor is put between the smoothed output of the PWM
and the rest of the circuit and timed correctly it might be a different story, see the circuit.
To be honest I don't know why i bother on this tread as it is totally dysfunctional from what it was as many of the design guys have
gone.
Quote from: T-1000 on July 09, 2019, 07:59:53 AM
I am talking about high Q achieved in the coil. Also to keep low current draw the resonant circuit needs only a fraction of power and feeding spikes instead of sinus/50-50% square wave is more than enough. So feeding pulse train with like less than 5% duty cycle signals also helps with low current draw.
And did you ever tried to hammer ferrite with the second spike on the peak of BEMF pulse?
T100 Hi
Now that is an interesting idea if your piezo xtal will fit in with the buzzing ferrite
but it would require to have a holding container as some of the older pot cores use to have and a sort of washer around the edges so the center of the piezo can move.
Raymondo
Text from the discussion post of the video.
QuoteAssembled this scheme, about 5 years ago. The circuit operates with a very low current.Current not more than 5 mA. The circuit is very important for the length of transformer wires. The optimal length is 12-13 cm, tried with other transistors does not work. Only works with 2Т603А. The scheme gives impulses 85кГц, in fact the author of this show. The led limits the voltage to 2 volts. If you replace the led to a resistor, the voltage can be raised to 3.5 V. the current of more than 5mA to raise is not possible. Many thought over this scheme, the best result from it not to squeeze.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=42&v=A2zrJi63ErE
Nothing shines. an hour of time wasted. :( >:(
Yeah... These bullshit things "need tuning".
Please translate this.
https://overunity.com/12736/kapanadze-cousin-dally-free-energy/21600/
We'll find a way to this flywheel bullshit if its true what we saw on video.
There has got to be a way to make free energy with a flywheel. The dean drive can produce an invisible force in the vacuum of space, this is insane and absurd but true, there has got to be more secrets to this.
Quote from: kolbacict on September 05, 2019, 02:24:09 PM
Nothing shines. an hour of time wasted. :( >:(
QuoteThe optimal length is 12-13 cm, tried with other transistors does not work. Only works with 2Т603А.
I think the author of the video didn't say the ferrite ring core material also matters, the length of the wires and probably he made the cut.. More I think if he collected a second time using time he wouldn't have come out. A third-party radiation source is impossible because it is impossible to excite a closed core at a distance. Despite the fact that the battery to hide in his scheme nowhere.
Kolbasist, tell the author of the circuit on KT603A that he is Cat Basilio.
https://i9.banknn.ru/9dfbepofyfte3_gw7rwl.png
(from Soviet folklore)
QuoteA third-party radiation source is impossible because it is impossible to excite a closed core at a distance.
I agree with that.
Generation really is, if you apply a little power to different points.
even the LED lights up a bit.
but just take away the food, everything goes dead. :)
:D :D
My idea, a long-playing flashlight.
On a large core (not too long), wind the coil as follows:
excitation of L2 by a" thin " wire, taking into account the trigger L3, at the planned frequency, with periods up to the maximum saturation of the core.
Removable L1, simultaneously "flashlight", is made by section, the maximum possible, b wire in both halves, so that the reverse pulse voltage was 2 times greater than the excitation voltage. Capacity C1 selected according to the battery capacity and charged before starting the system. During ex, the battery is disconnected. C1 can be selected from three different tanks connected in parallel.
According to the already proven scheme, at the time of disconnection of the key current passes from the capacitor C1, through the winding L1, resistor R1, to the led and lights it. The spin of the current in the wire is close to zero. The field in the kernel also has a slight deviation from zero. In parallel, the current through the coil of the trigger L3 enters the base of the key, and it opens. When L2 is excited, the core is magnetized to the design state, at which point the key closes, and the core field is discharged into the capacitor C1 through L1, in the direction of self-induction inertia, according to Faraday current induction rules. The discharge voltage will depend on the formula for the EMF = V * W * L and the current formula I = EMF (L1) - U(C1) / R (L2)+ R(D1)+R (C1)
of course, the dynamics will drop to zero, and at some point the current will move from the capacitor along the chain through the led and the process will repeat.
Checking calculations. (https://strannik-2.ru/media/kunena/attachments/587/2019-09-04_130746.jpg)
It makes sense to wind the coil only on very unusual "cores".
It would be interesting to use the Wiegand sensor as the core and secondary coil. For example, WG112:
https://belchip.by/sitedocs/wg.pdf (https://belchip.by/sitedocs/wg.pdf)
Yeah right! (Armedbrain and ratarsky) Explain where the Extra energy is coming from! all I can see is losses with your set up, exp;lain your coil winding and how you encounter the effects of skin effect, Also with the flywheel energy will be lost with spin up and down inertia ect and friction ect, etcetera and then there is lens laws ect, you were saying about gutters and bodily fluids ect, well drink your poison of your own choice and be merry as you do.
Raymondo
Quote from: Sergh on September 06, 2019, 03:50:17 AM
It makes sense to wind the coil only on very unusual "cores".
It would be interesting to use the Wiegand sensor as the core and secondary coil. For example, WG112:
https://belchip.by/sitedocs/wg.pdf (https://belchip.by/sitedocs/wg.pdf)
The sensor is necessary for more powerful devices. The principle of operation of static convectors on the use of their fields are shown in my post above. "Unusual" core is your term.
That looks like basic ferrox years ago they used cores in computer memory with hysteresis many cores today no longer have that property
one way is to use magnetic material that's easy to 'flip' its polarity and wind a coil-over it to do so, or add a neo similar-sized device and use a coil and instead of flipping just turn the pair on and off.
Raymondo
Quote from: Raycathode on September 06, 2019, 04:10:22 AM
Yeah right! (Armedbrain and ratarsky) Explain where the Extra energy is coming from! all I can see is losses with your set up, exp;lain your coil winding and how you encounter the effects of skin effect, Also with the flywheel energy will be lost with spin up and down inertia ect and friction ect, etcetera and then there is lens laws ect, you were saying about gutters and bodily fluids ect, well drink your poison of your own choice and be merry as you do.
Raymondo
QuoteThe discharge voltage will depend on the formula for the EMF = B * W * L and the current formula I = EMF (L1) - U(C1) / R (L2)+ R(D1)+R (C1)
Use a core based on iron, calcined it in hydrogen. The smoother the hysteresis the better. The magnetic permeability of iron is very interesting.
In my version, the polarity change is asymmetric.
Quote from: rakarskiy on September 06, 2019, 04:14:29 AM
The sensor is necessary for more powerful devices.
You did not understand anything.
Vigand sensor should be tried to use as a power unit. The output of the sensor (not the module) gives weak 2 volts 10 microseconds signal pulses. Microwatts. They should be tried to be used to power the device. In the sensor there is a small coil wound on a core made of a very specific alloy with amazing magnetic properties.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiegand_effect (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiegand_effect)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barkhausen_effect (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barkhausen_effect)
Although my forecast is pessimistic .. maybe, maybe not. this idea may somehow turn out to be FE, if come up with some special design of the magnetic field exciter in the sensor. For example, use a magnetization with a permanent magnet in conjunction with a resonant coil, which creates additionally weak magnetic field pulses.
Sergh, you have a receiver, but you lack a field. I just decided to get enough magnetic flux. According to this scheme, the battery was discharged about a day, on a conventional prefabricated ferrite. I think a regular bolt with nut (annealed in fire) would be more effective than ferrite. What for? I'll leave it to you to sort it out.
At least such a core can actually be induced from under the table
powerful transmitter.
Quote from: kolbacict on September 06, 2019, 05:25:36 AM
At least such a core can actually be induced from under the table
powerful transmitter.
Of course, you can even insert a micro battery inside the winding, it will be easier. :D ;)
But this will not solve the problem of creating a real device.
Quote from: rakarskiy on September 06, 2019, 05:19:08 AMI think a regular bolt with nut (annealed in fire) would be more effective than ferrite.
It will not be better. Even an annealed iron wire with a diameter of 0.8 millimeters for welding is bad as the magnetic core of a transformer.
Ordinary electrical steel for transformer cores is a complex product.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical_steel (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical_steel)
Special ferrites for transformer cores are high-tech products with minimal losses. Just do not use ferrites from the trash.
Quote from: rakarskiy on September 06, 2019, 06:20:44 AM
Of course, you can even insert a micro battery inside the winding, it will be easier. :D ;)
- people think that small watch batteries are hidden in transistors KT603A :)
Who disputes, but there are such interesting data: ССЫЛКА (https://dpva.ru/Guide/GuidePhysics/ElectricityAndMagnethism/MagneticPermeability/MagneticPermeabilityGenaralTable/)
It all depends on the task, in our case, the material should rest on demagnetization. :)
High permeability - and what's the point?
Metglas alloy has even higher permeability than ultrapure iron, and low losses. Transformers on such cores don't produce free energy.
https://web.archive.org/web/20120206100947/http://www.metglas.com/products/page5_1_2_6.htm (https://web.archive.org/web/20120206100947/http://www.metglas.com/products/page5_1_2_6.htm)
Quote from: Sergh on September 06, 2019, 08:15:22 AM
High permeability - and what's the point?
Metglas alloy has even higher permeability than ultrapure iron, and low losses. Transformers on such cores don't produce free energy.
https://web.archive.org/web/20120206100947/http://www.metglas.com/products/page5_1_2_6.htm (https://web.archive.org/web/20120206100947/http://www.metglas.com/products/page5_1_2_6.htm)
No point arguing, "everyone has a right to their own rake"! FORMULA OF MAGNETIC INDUCTION FOR THE CORE OF THE SOLENOID (https://i0.wp.com/electrosam.ru/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/Sol-4-1.png?resize=233%2C67&ssl=1): Only (Mu0) need to write like (Mu * Mu0)
Where
N- is the number of turns of the solenoid
l - long solenoid
n - number of turns per unit length
I - Current in the solenoid
Mu - magnetic permeability of the medium inside the solenoid
Mu0 - magnetic constant
Mu - (magnetic permeability of the medium inside the solenoid) Just enter 1/10 of the value of 20,000, get 2,000 and enter the formula for the core 30 mm long. Divide the resulting value by 2 and substitute it into another formula. which I designated in the description on the diagram. For a frequency of 5 kHz (conversion to speed, I hope you know how, iron does not like high frequency).
The closer you place the L1 winding to the core at the ends, the better. In general, study all the materials about Tesla transformers, there is nothing new here.
*******
The shows, with the help of this scheme (https://overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/dlattach/attach/173969/image//), from different authors, are gaining momentum. Did they know how to make a show, put it together in plain sight, put it to work??? and run and run differently .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=399&v=qCi2-6kAkqA
Quote from: Raycathode on September 06, 2019, 04:10:22 AM
Explain where the Extra energy is coming from!
all I can see is losses with your set up, exp;lain your coil winding and how you encounter the effects of skin effect, Also with the flywheel energy will be lost with spin up and down inertia ect and friction ect, etcetera and then there is lens laws ect, you were saying about gutters and bodily fluids ect, well drink your poison of your own choice and be merry as you do.
Raymondo
If I understand the process correctly;
By modulating the inductance of the core (as in a Magnetic Amplifier / Saturable Reactor), one can create a hysteresis loop that is inverted in a portion of the cycle. This inverted region has a mathematically negative inductance and depending on the phase-angle might be used to explain the excess energy (or energy destruction). Normal normal core/electric/hysteresis losses of course still in effect, so a system that employs such a modulation is not automatically COP>1.
The closest analogy would be throwing a baseball from a moving car vs standing on the ground. When throwing a baseball forward while the car is moving forward, the velocities of both systems are added. Due to the nature of a mag-amp, a similar act can be done in a predominantly one-way action (since the modulation/control winding of such a transformer is not significantly affected by the load winding).
The reason high-permeability cores tend to be used in such systems is because it allows larger changes in inductance per-unit time. Parametric variation of inductance.
A modern circuit simulator that can handle parametric variations of L or C should be able to demonstrate these same nonlinear effects, but Steinmetz/Dollard mathematics can also be used to gain a more classical understanding. ;)
I suspect the Russian tinkerers have a hard time articulating these concepts themselves due to the language barrier.
Anyway, I hope that explanation is concise enough to make sense. :)
Further references:
http://www.tuks.nl/pdf/Reference_Material/Steinmetz/Reaction%20Machines%20chapter%20in%20Alternating%20Current%20Phenomona.pdf (http://www.tuks.nl/pdf/Reference_Material/Steinmetz/Reaction%20Machines%20chapter%20in%20Alternating%20Current%20Phenomona.pdf)
https://youtu.be/DBX1-POuJMw?t=76 (https://youtu.be/DBX1-POuJMw?t=76)
http://www.tuks.nl/wiki/index.php/Main/EnergeticFormPosts (http://www.energeticforum.com/159983-post470.html)
You did not realize that in the scheme I proposed, there is no change in the magnetization of the nucleus in the classical sense at all. The nucleus may even remain at a certain level of magnetization. Only to remove more, you need another combination or item (not listed in the diagram). After all, energy is a more commercial term, an engineer is interested in forces, potentials and their combinations. Sincerely, good luck to you all!
As I suspected, this russian guy trolls people because he knows that everything has to be just right with the core and you have 0.01% chance of making it work.
Whats to say there is not a magnetic core conspiracy and basically we would need to make one ourselves? I read this before, it makes sense.
Make the scheme, with all possible core that you can buy online and see if it works, then we will know if this conspiracy is true.
Put 400$ of core, wind for 40 hours of coils. And you will have known all permutations allowable to you.
My opinion of this: too annoying for the amount of wattage provided.
Quote from: ARMCORTEX on September 06, 2019, 12:01:28 PM
As I suspected, this russian guy trolls people because he knows that everything has to be just right with the core and you have 0.01% chance of making it work.
Whats to say there is not a magnetic core conspiracy and basically we would need to make one ourselves? I read this before, it makes sense.
Make the scheme, with all possible core that you can buy online and see if it works, then we will know if this conspiracy is true.
My opinion of this: too annoying for the amount of wattage provided.
Honey, if you're accusing, you must have a good reason! I wonder what reason you have? Your worldview is probably different from mine. But that doesn't change the facts. Any core of soft magnetic material increases the electrical voltage of the coil (winding) in the magnetic field of the core, N times. Here's how to use the question I just suggested. This scheme forces spectacle to remain, but not forever.
Yeah I am accusing of hoax.
Make this with all core possible, then put device in faraday cage.
My worldview: Not everybody will get OU, this is obvious. There is also many low IQ people that must remain workers, its unsustainable for everybody to have beautiful lakehouse retreat with OU. I am not talking of engineers or doctors they love to work and we need them, so they dont care about buying energy. Only inventors that will continue working can have OU/wise enough to saveguard the secrets.
Quote from: ARMCORTEX on September 06, 2019, 12:37:21 PM
Yeah I am accusing of hoax.
Make this with all core possible, then put device in faraday cage.
My worldview: Not everybody will get OU, this is obvious. There is also many low IQ people that must remain workers, its unsustainable for everybody to have beautiful lakehouse retreat with OU. I am not talking of engineers or doctors they love to work and we need them, so they dont care about buying energy. Only inventors that will continue working can have OU/wise enough to saveguard the secrets.
Is it serious? If you read the instructions for the "trolls of the office", how to deal with us, that is, the rules of"demand proof, treat everything by the way, extinguish, extinguish.".... In fact, you just blow the dust in order to believe the reader that try my proposed scheme is not worth it. Let the reader make his own decision, let him have that right
Quote
Re: 3v OU Flashlight
"Reply #737 on: Today at 09:02:06 AM »
My idea, a long-playing flashlight.
On a large core (not too long), wind the coil as follows:
excitation of L2 by a" thin " wire, taking into account the trigger L3, at the planned frequency, with periods up to the maximum saturation of the core.
Removable L1, simultaneously "flashlight", is made by section, the maximum possible, b wire in both halves, so that the reverse pulse voltage was 2 times greater than the excitation voltage. Capacity C1 selected according to the battery capacity and charged before starting the system. During ex, the battery is disconnected. C1 can be selected from three different tanks connected in parallel.
According to the already proven scheme, at the time of disconnection of the key current passes from the capacitor C1, through the winding L1, resistor R1, to the led and lights it. The spin of the current in the wire is close to zero. The field in the kernel also has a slight deviation from zero. In parallel, the current through the coil of the trigger L3 enters the base of the key, and it opens.When L2 is excited, the core is magnetized to the design state, at which point the key closes, and the core field is discharged into the capacitor C1 through L1, in the direction of self-induction inertia, according to Faraday current induction rules. The discharge voltage will depend on the formula for the EMF = B(Tl) * w(m/s) * l(m) and the current formula I = EMF (L1) - U(C1) / R (L2)+ R(D1)+R (C1)
of course, the dynamics will drop to zero, and at some point the current will move from the capacitor along the chain through the led and the process will repeat.
This is not a durable device. I shared my thoughts completely unselfishly, there is no need for a public continuation, as we see!
I never down an inventor.
I like to down the idiot who cross out a working device, just because he did not try all permutations. You go through this when you have zero knowlege, to not do this and cross out is arrogance. The rest of component is copper.
I would like as many people as possible to do try it. You like this idea?
I propose to him my advice to solve this without the need for higher knowledge and further debate, this is all passive component.
What is 400$ and 40 hours besides a guarantee that everything can possibly be tried for OU?
When/if success is achieved, we can investigate further.
Material needed: Faraday cage, as much variety of small cores as obtainable, a circuit that can quickly be changed.
Instructions: Wind all coils, try all coils, put the coils that function into faraday cage.
The magnetic field in the nucleus, the Faraday cell, is not a hindrance. A friend of mine in Siberia, I even recommended putting the device in Faraday's cage for his personal safety. Not all devices are safe.
Moreover, I do not consider myself an inventor, I am a researcher. And before you do anything. prefer to undertake engineering calculations in order to obtain the expected results for implementation. You're more of a merchant, I have a lot of them knocking on my door.
I wish you wisdom, because in the Russian faith, there is exact knowledge.
Quote from: ARMCORTEX on September 06, 2019, 02:32:04 PM
I never down an inventor.
This a flat out LIE!
You have put down Floor and myself several times because we are taking the time to investigate the interactions of magnets. Yet you have not shown anything you have built that refutes what we have been looking at. You are nothing but a troll (probably paid) that continually tries to derail the research and testing of others.
You need to go back to your own thread and continue to beg for a physicist to do the calculations for your device. Obviously you can't do the calculations yourself, but claim to know more than anyone else. What a joke you are!
Quote from: citfta on September 06, 2019, 02:47:37 PM
This a flat out LIE!
You have put down Floor and myself several times because we are taking the time to investigate the interactions of magnets. Yet you have not shown anything you have built that refutes what we have been looking at. You are nothing but a troll (probably paid) that continually tries to derail the research and testing of others.
You need to go back to your own thread and continue to beg for a physicist to do the calculations for your device. Obviously you can't do the calculations yourself, but claim to know more than anyone else. What a joke you are!
HAHAHAH... You are not inventors...
Where is your device? Where is your complete CAD file.
Quote from: rakarskiy on September 06, 2019, 02:46:31 PM
The magnetic field in the nucleus, the Faraday cell, is not a hindrance. A friend of mine in Siberia, I even recommended putting the device in Faraday's cage for his personal safety. Not all devices are safe.
Moreover, I do not consider myself an inventor, I am a researcher. And before you do anything. prefer to undertake engineering calculations in order to obtain the expected results for implementation. You're more of a merchant, I have a lot of them knocking on my door.
I wish you wisdom, because in the Russian faith, there is exact knowledge.
I have my own designs, and I dont sell untill I have it working 100%. I hate scammers, only dumb failures scam.
How do you know I am really interested in OU? This subject is only a side interest of mine.
Only millionnaires can play around with these concepts of big flywheels and precisely made concepts, and I intend to be a millionnaire soon.
And millionnaires dont need to sell OU devices to stay millionnaires, theres an idea on every street corner for me, you dont know my master enterprising.
I can pay my taxes to the queen in a big chunk, buy some lakefront property, and be auto-sufficient. After that, I guess I have my CNC machines and can just repair my boats after that. Not everybody can have this.
How much does a welded frame cost, a nicely machined piece of metal, how much do all of these things cost? You are not at this level, yet.
Quote from: ARMCORTEX on September 06, 2019, 03:03:14 PM
I have my own designs, and I dont sell untill I have it working 100%. I hate scammers, only dumb failures scam.
How do you know I am really interested in OU? This subject is only a side interest of mine.
Only millionnaires can play around with these concepts of big flywheels and precisely made concepts, and I intend to be a millionnaire soon.
And millionnaires dont need to sell OU devices to stay millionnaires, theres an idea on every street corner for me, you dont know my master enterprising.
I can pay my taxes to the queen in a big chunk, buy some lakefront property, and be auto-sufficient. After that, I guess I have my CNC machines and can just repair my boats after that. Not everybody can have this.
How much does a welded frame cost, a nicely machined piece of metal, how much do all of these things cost? You are not at this level, yet.
Any device or development costs money. You just have not seen any such device. Look. today it is already sorted out, the best are created. But without the magnets not work.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tab04qqeFwI
Good knowledge of electrodynamics, electromechanics and magnetism will help you in your search. The Russians have a saying: if you want to hide, put it in a prominent place.
I would like to see how this pulse really accelerates the flywheel, with an wifi accelerometer or encoder. And how this measures to "impact mechanism".
This is not the testbench I have in mind. but certainly, it could be implemented as you show, this is another feature of the testbench.
How does these images from Kolbacit come into play? They are about Kapanadze flywheel.
https://overunity.com/12736/kapanadze-cousin-dally-free-energy/21600/
Quote from: rakarskiy on September 06, 2019, 10:03:13 AM
No point arguing, "everyone has a right to their own rake"! FORMULA OF MAGNETIC INDUCTION FOR THE CORE OF THE SOLENOID (https://i0.wp.com/electrosam.ru/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/Sol-4-1.png?resize=233%2C67&ssl=1): Only (Mu0) need to write like (Mu * Mu0)
Where
N- is the number of turns of the solenoid
l - long solenoid
n - number of turns per unit length
I - Current in the solenoid
Mu - magnetic permeability of the medium inside the solenoid
Mu0 - magnetic constant
Mu - (magnetic permeability of the medium inside the solenoid) Just enter 1/10 of the value of 20,000, get 2,000 and enter the formula for the core 30 mm long. Divide the resulting value by 2 and substitute it into another formula. which I designated in the description on the diagram. For a frequency of 5 kHz (conversion to speed, I hope you know how, iron does not like high frequency).
The closer you place the L1 winding to the core at the ends, the better. In general, study all the materials about Tesla transformers, there is nothing new here.
This simple formula will not give any free energy.
Large magnetic permeability allows you to push 1 times more energy through a smaller cross section of the magnetic circuit.
The energy from this does not increase. The best transformers in the world work with efficiency below 100%.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_induction (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_induction)
Quote from: Sergh on September 07, 2019, 02:33:51 AM
This simple formula will not give any free energy.
Large magnetic permeability allows you to push 1 times more energy through a smaller cross section of the magnetic circuit.
The energy from this does not increase. The best transformers in the world work with efficiency below 100%.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_induction (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_induction)
Transformers work on the effect of mutual induction, more than introduced, it is impossible to take. Do you know the difference between mutual induction and induction? And the magnetic field in the core is really N times greater. And this formula is unacceptable for a transformer.
The operation of my circuit is based on the delay, reverse magnetic hysteresis. And the "spring" magnetic field in the abutment, the better.
Да, привет Челябинскому Региону! Мое предложение сутки пока в силе!
1. A static magnetic field does not produce energy.
2. A person, who changes the magnetic field, requires food for this.
;D
"Free" energy from small hidden battery - enough for 1 year:
https://quickjewelryrepairs.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/WatchBattery.jpg (https://quickjewelryrepairs.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/WatchBattery.jpg)
Quote from: Sergh on September 07, 2019, 08:16:10 AM
1. A static magnetic field does not produce energy.
2. A person who changes the magnetic field requires food for this. ;D
Here I with you agree, there is no movement there is no EMF (potential difference electric tensions). But you probably do not know what a cost-free Controlled Reverse hysteresis of the magnetic field, with periodic unipolar excitation of this field.
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/Solids/ferro.html
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/Tables/magprop.html#c2
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/Solids/hyst.html#c2
There is nothing that is not known to classical physics, here is an engineering solution that is what is valuable for technology. Traditionalism is not always the truth.
Quote from: rakarskiy on September 06, 2019, 10:03:13 AM
No point arguing, "everyone has a right to their own rake"! FORMULA OF MAGNETIC INDUCTION FOR THE CORE OF THE SOLENOID (https://i0.wp.com/electrosam.ru/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/Sol-4-1.png?resize=233%2C67&ssl=1): Only (Mu0) need to write like (Mu * Mu0)
Where
N- is the number of turns of the solenoid
l - long solenoid
n - number of turns per unit length
I - Current in the solenoid
Mu - magnetic permeability of the medium inside the solenoid
Mu0 - magnetic constant
Quote from: Sergh on September 07, 2019, 02:33:51 AM
This simple formula will not give any free energy.
Large magnetic permeability allows you to push 1 times more energy through a smaller cross section of the magnetic circuit.
The energy from this does not increase. The best transformers in the world work with efficiency below 100%.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_induction (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_induction)
The formula can work if permeability is varied with respect to time.
Quote from: Reiyuki on September 07, 2019, 10:43:54 AM
The formula can work if permeability is varied with respect to time.
The smooth cascading of the magnetization to ZERO. If this problem is solved, efficiency > 1
It is only with the material needed magnetic memory.