Has anyone here tried replicating Don Smith's 8-coil generator?
http://www.28an.com/altenergypro/device09-2.htm
I found this the other day and it looks really simple to build. I searched the forum but there doesn't seem to be any replication attempts except for some of Don's other devices. Are there any test results that I can examine?
I have begun. I cannot see why this should not be scaled down for economy,
using two magnets and two cores. The trouble is that Don Smith stuff tends
to want high frquencies. But this device may be different to the others. It seems
quite out on a limb.
The critical matter may be what is on the interupting disc. I am starting
with mumetal and another disc of stainless steel. Then will be crushing
up some expendible neo magnets (if this is achievable) and gluing the
powder on to the mumetal.
Don't forget resonance. I strongly suspect that the resonant frequency
of the resulting LR circuit will need to be the same as the frequency at
which the disc interupts the magnets.
Paul-R
Excellent. Thanks for attempting a replication. Please let us know how it goes. If it works for you then I'll attempt replication too.
You can find what you need on page 97:
www.free-energy-info.com/Smith.pdf
The powder on the disc, which is a vinyl record in the prototype can be bismuth, neodymium, or Terfenol-D and is bounded with spray glue. This device supposedly works similar to the Ecklin-Brown generator. This device doesn't use any resonant circuit--its mainly a mechanical generator with a motor that spins a disc. There should a be a hole drilled into the disc for every pair of PVC pipes with magnets and coils. If only one pair of PVC pipes, magnets, and coils are used then just one hole should be fine.
Quote from: Xaero_Vincent on October 28, 2009, 02:00:18 PM
This device doesn't use any resonant circuit...
I'm not so sure. There will be a frequency from the rotating disc which
induces that same frequncy into the coils.
Then the main circuit has LR components, and so, it must have its
own unique resonant frequency if it is driven by an oscillating
source, which is the case.
Paul-R.
See also:
http://www.free-energy-info.co.uk/Chapter3.pdf
Paul-R,
Perhaps the RPM of the rotor will determine the frequency of the current flowing throw the coils. What I meant was no special circuit boards are necessary. The outputs of the coils appear to just go to capacitors and then to a transformer to step-down the voltage.
This is assuming the machine actually works at all; some folks believe the device is fake and that interrupting magnetic fields this way won't generate current through the coils. Hopefully you can give us a definitive answer to that question.
Has anyone here tried replicating Don Smith's 8-coil generator
?
http://www.28an.com/altenergypro/device09-2.htm
Thanks for the link.
Very good stufff this!!!
I have built several tesla coils and know for a fact ,
that the energy can be felt for several feet.
That is,with a resonant circuit of course.
Very interesting indeed.
Look forward to useing some of his circuits for my
on, ongoing experiment.
Thanks
Joe
i have not built it ..
but it seams simple enough
each feed don says 50 watts!!
in his mechanical magnetic kick device ..
im sure you well know how this works ..
there neos inside the coils .. as the plate swipes past the neos it cuts the flux .. as the rotor passes it the flux reconnects ..
ist!
Quote from: Xaero_Vincent on October 29, 2009, 01:18:10 PM
Perhaps the RPM of the rotor will determine the frequency of the current flowing throw the coils....
Yes, it will. And the main circuit components need, in my view, to resonate
at this frequency, this being adjustable with a speed control.
Resonance is everything.
Quote from: innovation_station on October 30, 2009, 08:57:02 AM
i have not built it ..
but it seams simple enough
each feed don says 50 watts!!
in his mechanical magnetic kick device ..
im sure you well know how this works ..
there neos inside the coils .. as the plate swipes past the neos it cuts the flux .. as the rotor passes it the flux reconnects ..
ist!
Actually, Don claims that each pair of coils generates 50 kilowatts (1000 volts @ 50 amps) not 50 watts LOL. I personally don't believe this is possible.
I can be wrong but if this thing generates power then wouldn't current flow through the coils and create a magnetic field (electromagnet)? Wouldn't that increase magnetic resistance of the rotating wheel and therefore act as load?
i beleave your last statement to be untrue ... first of 50 kw ... lol im sure he said 50 w in his video.....
second ... it is clear you have little understanding what this device actually does ...
and sir im not trying to cut you down please dont look at it like that .. ok
now the rotating disc wich is a record ... is coated in a special material that will break a magnetic connection ... verry much like a super conductor ... upon reconnect he draws his power he turns off and on the magnetic flux flowing from the magnet ...
ist!
Quote from: innovation_station on October 30, 2009, 02:38:59 PM
i beleave your last statement to be untrue ... first of 50 kw ... lol im sure he said 50 w in his video.....
second ... it is clear you have little understanding what this device actually does ...
and sir im not trying to cut you down please dont look at it like that .. ok
now the rotating disc wich is a record ... is coated in a special material that will break a magnetic connection ... verry much like a super conductor ... upon reconnect he draws his power he turns off and on the magnetic flux flowing from the magnet ...
ist!
If you listen carefully he says this:
"Each one of those power source will do 50 watts... about 50 watts... I mean 50 kilowatts."
So with 8 coils, he's essentially claiming the total machine output is 400 kW from a 28 mW motor.
Paul-R is replicating this so we'll see what results he gets.
It seems all too good to be true .
Most likely you would fail if you simply built the device the way it is physically shown without being an MIT graduate in EE and knowing what to look for , thats IF his devices are real .
He claims his devices were replicated but I have not seen any proof or demonstrations so far .
Quote from: Paul-R on October 30, 2009, 10:50:42 AM
quote author=Xaero_Vincent link=topic=8219.msg206575#msg206575 date=1256836690]
Perhaps the RPM of the rotor will determine the frequency of the current flowing throw the coils.
Yes, it will. And the main circuit components need, in my view, to resonate
at this frequency, this being adjustable with a speed control.
Resonance is everything.
[/quote]
@Xaero_Vincent,
To further clarify what Paul-R is saying (and forgive me if you already know this)...
Coils have a resistance to being energized, called inductive reactance (unit is ohms.) The formula for it is:
XL = 2 x pi x f x I
where pi is 3.14159, f is the frequency from the rotor speed, and I is the inductance of the coil.
Capacitors also have a resistance to being energized, called capacitive reactance (unit is ohms.) The formula for it is:
XR = 1 / (2 x pi x f x C)
where C is the capacitance.
It seems the coils are using pretty thick wire and with not a lot of turns so this seems to be your fixed starting point. So pick your magnets, your length of the coils, wire thickness and number of turns. Calculate coil inductance (unit is henries, H) as:
I = ur x 1.67 x 10^-6 x ([N^2 x A] / l)
where ur is the permeability of the core (??? what value of ur to use for a magnet ???, air is 1, iron core is 100), N is the number of turns, A is the area of the face of the coil (in square meters, A = pi x radius x radius), and l is the length of the coil (in meters.)
Next, pick a frequency, f. This is the RPM of the rotor multiplied by the number of holes (or metal sections between the holes, same number).
Plug the frequency, f, and your inductance, I, into the formula for XL and see what you get. This is the coils' resistance to being energized.
Now in the device 09 circuit it looks like the coils and the capacitor are in parallel. The way the work in this case is when the coils are being energized, the capacitors are denergizing (discharging) and vice versa. For this back and forth to work with the least amount of loss, you want the inductive reactance to be equal to the capacitive reactance. This is called resonance and it is how a typical crystal radio tunes in a specific frequency and minimizes all others. So you want XL = XR. We know XL from our last calculation above. Since,
XR = 1 / (2 x pi x f x C), and XL = XR
we want to solve for C, the capacitance, so we rearrange things and get,
C = 1 / (2 x pi x f x XL)
So now we know the capacitance of the capacitor we need to find/make.
So, yes the frequency is determined by the rotor speed, but the coils and caps have to be designed for or tunable to that frequency otherwise your losses will be tremendous. And after you've gone through the calculations you'll likely find you'll want to change your frequency to get a more reasonable capacitance.
Unknowns for me at least are what is the value of ur for the magnets and what is the effect on a permanent magnet core on a resonating coil?
-Steve
http://rimstar.org http://wsminfo.org
PS. I highly recommend anyone whose never done the calculations to do them and see what values you get for inductance and capacitance and see how easy/hard it is to find/make components that have those values and then go back and adjust the calculations and so on. How many people build devices without knowing that they may not be working because of huge losses because they don't know how to calculate them?
PPS. I'm not an EE. I know this stuff because I learned from my mistakes. Now I pay attention to this stuff. Just trying to pass it on to others so we can all succeed.
steve i do agree with you ...
and if it was 50kw/ coil wow... but
i still seem to think you do not need all the resonant tuneing ... this thing can work in a much simpler operation..
the tuneing is needed to tune your coil .. what i speek of is diffrent than dons device ..
however they share some common things the only tuneing required is to the PERMANT MAGNET ;) :D
anyhow im gonna leave it alone .. :)
ist!
i know his work is verry real ... 8) :P
do dons demo
THIS CONSISTED OF A TESLA COIL RUN FROM BATTERIES AND 2 INSOLATED STEEL PLATES OF THE SAME SIZE AND AN EARTH GROUND ... THROW SOME LIGHT BULBS IN LINE ... WATCH EM LIGHT UP FULL BRIGHT! ;)
IF YOU WANT CHEEP SIMPLE PROOF OF MASSIVE AMOUNTS OF FREE ENGERY .. AS SOME CALL IT
TESLA CALLED THIS CONVERSION .. ;)
Steven, thanks for the formulas. I can't remember formulas to save me.
This is all I can solve for inductance now since I don't know the length of the cable to solve l or A nor the permeability of the Neodymium magnet core with coils wrapped around a PVC pipe with an air gap in-between.
I = ur * 1.67 * .000001 ([100 * A] / l)
I can tell based on the light shining off the coils that there are 10 windings. The wire looks to be about 8 AWG?
One thing that makes the whole thing dis-believable is the math used here:
http://web.archive.org/web/20060516002624/www.altenergy-pro.com/device09-2.htm
8 coils, each producing 1000V @ 50A therefore equates to 8000V * 400A = 3.2 Megawatts? WTF? If the coils were connected in parallel then the amps would increase while the volts stayed the same and vice versa.
This leads me to believe that there were no accurate measurements done by Don. 1000V @ 50A might be possible but the number is too rounded and "on-the-dot". Why isn't it something like 982V @ 49A--something more believable than a perfect 50kW?
Regards,
Vincent
There are not 8 coils, but 16. Each coil on one side is connected in bucking mode to another coil on the other side of that central board, that has a turning, whatever.
http://www.28an.com/altenergypro/device09-1.htm
But I am leary on this one because of the stated outputs.
Maybe 1000v 50mA. Still that would be a generous success.
16 air coils. Or 8 bi-coils each in bucking mode.
That dc motor seems too small but who knows for sure. Thane Heines is doing some pretty amazing things with his rotor and coils, what's not to say the coils don't assist that small motor to turn the rotor more.
That center rotor would have to have 8 fins that block (whatever) otherwise if all those dual coils are connected to each side of the same bus bars (terminals), all would have to react at the same time. Or, if there are less then 8 fins, while some are blocked, others would be unblocked and all being on the same parallel circuit may be causing some other effect that is generating major havoc as output.
Lastly, given this design using single layer winds, why not then consider putting multiple single winds, one over the other and again all paralleled. Meaning first layers all paralleled, second layers all parelleled, etc. Why stop only at one layer.
It is either that this device works, or the inventor just wanted to catalog all his builds during the years, good or bad, working or not working, and just put it on the net with some small description, purporting some wishful output results. I don't know for sure.
wattsup ..
BRO..
hummmm im going to have to think on my responce to your reply ..
i will try to set this in to context!
what don does in the demo is ... the best place to start
you can see there is NO ELECTRICAL CONNECTION BETWEEN THE PLATES .. LOW VOLTAGE WILL NOT PASS FROM PLATE 1 THROUGH THE PLASTIC TO PLATE #2 THEN OUT TO EARTH GROUND..
TRY IT CONFIRM THIS DOES NOT TAKE PLACE WITH OUT THE USE OF THE TESLA COIL ...
NOW CONDUCT THIS EXPARIMENT AGIN .. USEING A BATTERY POWERED TESLA COIL .. AND YOU NOW HAVE ELECTRICAL CONDUCTION THROUGH THE PLASTIC ..
OK
I CAN FROM THIS DEMO DRAW 2 CONCLUSIONS .. OR MAYBE MORE ..
CONCULSION #1 PLATIC BECOMES CONDUCTIVE UNDER HIGH VOLTAGE HIGH FREQ! AND THE ELECTRICTY FLOWS RIGH THROUGH LOOKING FOR THE PATH OF LEAST RESISTANCE TO GROUND ...
OR
COCCULSION #2
AND THIS IS DONS CONCULSION .. WICH I FEEL IS TRUE .. HE THINKS THE ELECTR.ICTY FROM THE TESLA COIL STOPS AT THE PLATE AND WHAT YOU ARE SEEING ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE PLATE IS A REFLECTION FROM THE INTERACTION OF THE ENVIRMENT .. OK I CAN SEE THIS TO BE THE CASE .. SOMEWHAT ..
BASICALLY HE IS GETTING AN NATURAL ELECTRIC REFLECTION FROM NATURE.. BECAUSE HE IS MANIPULATING NATURE VIA ELECTRICAL MEANS .. NOT MAGNETIC MEANS ..
IN THE 16 COIL UNIT HE IS MANUNIPULATING THE PERMANATE MAGNETS FLUX FLOWS .. FAST!!! LIKE NANO SECOND FAST .. AND WHEN THEY RECONNECT IN THE DEVICE HE IS HARNISSING THE ENVIRMENT REFLECTION .. ELECTRICS THAT WAS CAUSED VIA MAGNETIC MANUPOLATION ..
THOUGHTS ARE SCARTERED ON THIS .. AT THE PRESENT ..
I MAY HAVE TO REWATCH THE VIDEO FOR THE SECOND TIME ..
IST!
The picture in Vincent's message 4 gives the idea that each magnet is within
its own tesla coil.
Do you all agree?
Paul-R
No, I do not agree at all with that drawing, especially with neo magnets, and more especially because if you wind the coil on the magnet, then that rotor is totally useless, and there is no way you are going to move a neo field.
In the original photo text, you can read this........
"A mille watt motor turns the magnetic shield which separates the magnet pairs at their Bloch wall separation provides magnetic fluxing and useful Electrical Energy."
How the hell can you turn a rotor in a magnets blotch wall. The blotch wall is the center part of the magnet. How do you propose to do that. Does not make any sense at all.
Maybe he considered each coil pair to make only one coil and the center is the blotch wall, but then again, this is not possible since those coil winds will define the polarities at each end and each will have its own center blotch wall. So again, no go.
Also, what magnetic shield. There is only one type of shield known and patented to work and I talked to the inventor some time ago and did a report to the forum. And that shield, in order to act as a shield must go in and out of a magnetic field, in to shield and out to reset itself. If there are magnets all around, how can you even think of having a rotating magnetic shield. Again does not make sense because if the center of the coils are magnets, given their mutual proximity, that shield will never see a non-magnetic area.
If he said the rotor held 8 magnets that turn to impress upon the 16 air coils, OK, but not in the way he is saying.
Anyways, that is the problem with such devices when the info on them if so sparse.
None of it makes any sense at all. For me anyway. So what I am thinking is this man is totally off the rocker and is explaining things in a very incorrect manner with obvious false information.
wattsup BRO IM SAD YOU FEEL THIS WAY ...
lets imagine the neos are in BUCKING CONFIG... THE RECORD IS COATED IN A VERRY SPECIAL MATERIAL WICH HAS HARDLY SEEN PUBLIC EYES MUCH LESS THE PATTEND OFFICE ;)
AND THIS MATERAL CAN BREAK A MAGNETIC CONNECTION INSTANOUSLLY ..
WHAT THEN IS THE RESULT?
HE SAID YOU CAN USE POWERED NEODIMUM DUST TO COAT THE DISC ... WITH AN EPOXY COMPOUND ...
HAS ANYONE DONE ANYTHING WITH HPS'S IN THE PAST ? IN A BUCKING CONFIG?
IST
SURE I HAVE LOL ;) :D
I have tried this method before and it is always the same thing! Lenz's law will apply and destroy any chance of OU.
Any device that depends on field density or field direction to move or gain energy will never work because Lenz's law will always apply.
The ONLY method that avoids Lenz's law is the one that never changes field density or field direction.
???? ;D
@wattsup
QuoteIn the original photo text, you can read this........
"A mille watt motor turns the magnetic shield which separates the magnet pairs at their Bloch wall separation provides magnetic fluxing and useful Electrical Energy."
How the hell can you turn a rotor in a magnets blotch wall. The blotch wall is the center part of the magnet. How do you propose to do that. Does not make any sense at all.
I think your question relates to the very fundamentals of polarity, If I have a rubber band and I stretch it out with both hands then one half of the rubber band will be near my left hand and one half near my right hand. In between these two halves will be the center of the rubber band and this center will fall on neither the right nor left hand side, it is the point of neutrality having no polarity (left/right). Also, if we release the rubber band the polar condition or stress has not neutralized itself as thought, it has simply ceased to exist. All cultures speak of this, some refer to it as "the trinity of unity", trinity meaning 3, two polarities separated by a region of impolarity. Everything that is polarized has three components not two as most see it, we should also note that the center is impolar, having no poles as it defines the separation of the poles.
Now to answer your question, every polarity must be defined by it's "three" components. Take two magnets in repulsion, we will say the two north poles are facing inward. We now have seven conditions, from right to left we have a south pole, bloch wall, north pole, bloch wall,north pole,bloch wall,south pole. What!! -- yes, a bloch wall is defined as a separation of polar regions having no polarity but there is no distinction as to "the" polarity. Two magnets in attraction, the north/south poles in attraction will have a bloch wall between them as well.
Also, consider that the power of a pole is defined by it's difference to something else and this difference is a potential, this can be the opposite condition of the opposite pole, or empty space having no polarity or the bloch wall having no polarity. Magnetism, light, electricity, gravity, heat, etc... -- all differences or stressed conditions are polarized and all polarities are separated by an impolar region which defines there differences. The first question we should ask about the Smith machine is ---- Are the magnets in opposition or attraction as both conditions will produce a bloch wall between them?.
Regards
AC
If the magnets are in repulsion, the shield will be greatly attracted to and will take a good amount of energy to remove.
If the magnets are in attraction, the shield will be easy to remove but harder to insert. The fact remains, this device will never be OU.
If it was even close to achieving over unity, it would only be due to the fact that some part of the operation was acquiring gain from the part of the operation that is not changing the field density or field direction.
I have tried shield methods.
There is however a way to build a motor that is free from Lenz's law! I am not sure about posting it knowing someone will make a zillion buckazoids on it but I just might anyway.
@lumen
QuoteIf the magnets are in attraction, the shield will be easy to remove but harder to insert. The fact remains, this device will never be OU.
I am not sure who to believe, you who have never had a working machine or Don Smith, an engineer/energy consultant with over 40 years experience and many patents to his name who has supposedly built many tested working machines:). The fact remains, if this was easy everyone would be doing it.
QuoteAny device that depends on field density or field direction to move or gain energy will never work because Lenz's law will always apply.
This would seem to be a very broad all encompassing statement, I have found Lenz Law does not always apply for very simple reasons. Lenz Law is not a law, it is a theory based on the fact that few people understand "what" it is. Lenz theory relies on the fact that an induced current will produce a field in opposition to the one which created it. The key word here is "CURRENT", If a current does not develop in an induced coil there is no Lenz theory. Tesla liked to store the induced potential difference or voltage as capacitance in the coil, an electric field, to which Lenz theory does not apply. Once the inducing force had subsided he would then discharge the capacitance hence--no current to oppose--no lenz theory applies. This is what Thane Heinz is doing with his machine, I know this because when I chatted with him he agreed this is exactly what he is doing. If you want to change the rules at the very least you must understand them.
Regards
AC
Yeah but its not easy and it cant be built without very specific knowledge . Tuning , materials and dimensions . Otherwise it doesnt work .
If he shows the device out in public you can bet that the hidden complexity is such that you should just forget about it . Otherwise you will just become an irrelevant theorist fool, linking , youtoubing and depending and never actually accomplishing anything that saves a single dime for you and your family .
Well, I could defend myself and state that I have been a mechanical engineer for 20 years and computer programmer, and a CNC machinist for 15 years and have done electrical circuit design and built my own CNC machines. Also have been doing magnetic testing on most of the projects in this forum, to confirm operation (they don't). Did I mention I play the guitar?
Anyway, you would simply not believe me!
You could build this to see how well it works yourself.
Now that I just read about patent withholding in another thread, I am leaning toward posting the real solution, otherwise it would likely be kept from production somehow.
I will start a new thread if I post the motor plans!
Lumen, There have been many Lenz-less generator. The Ecklin and Ecklin-Brown generators are one example. They were claimed to provide COP >= 3 but actual replications resulted in about 40-50% efficiency, which is far worse than an induction motor.
http://www.overunity-theory.de/bht/bht.htm
Lumen, what COP values does your motor produce with a load?
@lumen
QuoteWell, I could defend myself and state that I have been a mechanical engineer for 20 years and computer programmer, and a CNC machinist for 15 years and have done electrical circuit design and built my own CNC machines. Also have been doing magnetic testing on most of the projects in this forum, to confirm operation (they don't). Did I mention I play the guitar?
Anyway, you would simply not believe me!
You could build this to see how well it works yourself.
I didn't mean to offend you I simply disagreed with your statements, as well I understand there are very many talented people with very diverse backgrounds in this forum. I do believe you have the qualifications you have stated but I think we can agree that your qualifications and my own guarantee nothing as far as success is concerned, determination is very important. What I find most interesting is that you play guitar, lol, I was a part time musician for many years as were my parents, this is a common thread found in many inventors. It implies a creative mind, an inquisitive mind as well as the tremendous benefits of understanding sound, longitudinal waves, frequency,wave period and their relationships, harmonics etc... .
In any case I wish you the best of luck
Regards
AC
I gave up looking for the method to build a generator that would be OU because, if you need a coil to extract the output then if any load is applied, (as in current drawn) Lenz law will increase the work required to run it. Always!
Simple concept #1: If you cut a single magnetic line of force work can be done, if work is done, then it takes work to undo it.
Quote from: Xaero_Vincent on October 31, 2009, 04:57:40 PM
Lumen, There have been many Lenz-less generator. The Ecklin and Ecklin-Brown generators are one example. They were claimed to provide COP >= 3 but actual replications resulted in about 40-50% efficiency, which is far worse than an induction motor.
http://www.overunity-theory.de/bht/bht.htm
Lumen, what COP values does your motor produce with a load?
Well you tell me, in the energy world it is all uttered, in all overunity systems it all deals with the switching technique and yes zero point/energy from the vaccum deals with every single thing and it acts like a pump, even that gravity motor you saw working on youtube is extracting energy from the vaccum and you would find an incomeing energy source.
Quotewhat COP values does your motor produce with a load?
That's the interesting part!
In a typical motor, work is done by applying current to generate a field that forces against another field to cause rotation. If no rotation occurred and the fly back from the collapsing field was recovered, one could recover a large portion of the applied current. However, if any rotation occurred, then the collapsing field cannot ever be fully recovered because the field it is now in, is a different value than the field when the current was applied.
Because my design cuts no lines of force and never changes field direction, it should be able to obtain about.....I guess I really cannot calculate this. I may be able to get this info from the magnetic modeler I used to design it. I was working on the magnet only version of this device because it will show beyond any doubt that it is OU. Though the magnet only version would be mostly a novelty device because it would not produce much output, it would be per.....per.....pet....perpetual....ah...I wasn't sure I should say that.
If you apply current to a coil standing in free space, then collect the fly back from the collapsing field and nothing changed, but work was still done.
I can say that the more current you would apply the more torque you would get, but the more load applied would never increase the required current. Operating it in reverse will not make a generator because no field lines are cut or changed.
I know it's strange sounding and I am just a bit pissed because I have been off from work for about three months and I thought I could get this built and show it working on the tube, but now, I have been called back to work and now all my time is going back to make someone else more money.
All I needed was about one more month off from work. Going back might last only a short time, so I hesitate to post the plans in case I might have time to work on it again in a week or two when I'm out of work again.
I don't think I should be talking about a different device in someones thread, so I will quit. I'm just a bit excited about this concept because I have already tested in Maxwell and confirmed it's operation.
One last thing for those who wonder where the energy comes from.
If I had a 1kg weight and dropped it, how much energy would I get?
The question then is, "how far will it fall?" and the answer is FOREVER.
No, not possible in gravity, but it is possible in a magnetic field!
Same torque applied forever!
@lumen
QuoteOne last thing for those who wonder where the energy comes from.
If I had a 1kg weight and dropped it, how much energy would I get?
The question then is, "how far will it fall?" and the answer is FOREVER.
No, not possible in gravity, but it is possible in a magnetic field!
Same torque applied forever!
LOL, these are the important questions the average person never considers that a creative mind must by its very nature--- the "what if" scenario. To truly understand something we have to see it from every angle from all perspectives, we have to remove the confines of the system that limit it. Cool, regardless of what you decide to do it's nice to hear a fresh perspective rather than the dull monotonous drone of the skeptics hovering about.
AC
Quote from: wattsup on October 31, 2009, 01:37:24 PM
In the original photo text, you can read this........
"A mille watt motor turns the magnetic shield which separates the magnet pairs at their Bloch wall separation provides magnetic fluxing and useful Electrical Energy."
How the hell can you turn a rotor in a magnets bloch wall. The bloch wall is the center part of the magnet.
I wonder if Don considers the two magnets as a "magnet pair", a one magnet
system, but with a gap in the middle (through which the interrupting disc passes).
Then, I suppose, we could say that the disc does as he says.
Paul-R
@AC
Good to hear from you. OK, OK, I"ll bite on the pseudo blotch wall argument existing between the coils or magnets more specifically. After considering this from many angles, the only way I could see this as mildly possible is if the cores of the coils where in fact magnets, but definitely not neo magnets, but most likely Alnico magnets. Alnicos will send their flux further out but weaker. Neos will have a field closer in but way to strong to try and shield out.
Now the cylinder, onto which each coil is wound, is either fully comprised of a magnet, or the cylinder has multiple linings with a smaller magnet placed inside, this to block the magnets flux from exiting the open end and over the coil that is wound over it.
The left magnet end that is closest to the rotor has its flux field going far enough to cover the right coil. The right magnet end that is closest to the rotor has its flux field going far enough to cover the left coil. So.......when the rotor is open, each magnet covers the opposing coil and when the rotor is closed, each magnets flux is blocked. The rotating rotor alternates the open and closed, or free and shielded moments of the magnets going over their opposite coils. That would make a field move over the coils. But which polarity of the magnets is facing inward and outward. The coil pair bucking wind is a given so this simplifies the question. Then the actual test design would have to integrate a way of permitting the removal of the magnet from the coil center in order to turn it around and try it in the other way. Otherwise my best guess is one North and one South facing the rotor. This will ensure a differential flux in from one coil to other to provide energy flow directionality.
The other question would be rotor material, but if the material existed and was dia-magnetic, then there cannot be any drag exerted onto the rotor, hence the dc motor would be free to turn at its maximum, even with the coils being more and more energized by the fluctuating field. This would be a dragless generator.
So.........this may have something to it after all. Regarding the outputs mentioned, I doubt it, but will not bet anything on it either way. I'll save my money for more toys instead. Testing on this could be done with just one coil pair and two magnets to start with. If the effect pans out, then one could consider a full build. But, again the main trial and error effort will be the rotor material. You would have to do tests with materials, a magnet and a compass, with a second smaller magnet further away to bias the compass needle.
gk kindly posted a link for you guys ...
wattsup i think your verry close in your last statement!!!!
i had a quick look ... but i got other things to do too...
so here is the link ..
no more guessing ;) ;D ;D 8)
ist!
http://www.free-energy-info.co.uk/Smith.pdf
i would have modded my last post but the time ran out on it ...
so ill add this .. there is 1 device or 2 i really WANT TO MAKE FROM DONS WORK ...
THEY WOULD BE THE PLASMA INTERACTION DEVICES
COME ON NOW .... DO THEY LOOK THAT HARD ? ;D LOL!
LOOK WHAT I FOUND ;D
http://images.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://scopeboy.com/elec/plasma/globe2-1.jpg&imgrefurl=http://scopeboy.com/elec/plasma/index.html&usg=__yvHsepe7R05clUON1GA9mobeZYk=&h=522&w=400&sz=25&hl=en&start=38&sig2=AJ1OBpoV2KKTVCA94KwBjA&um=1&tbnid=6jEhvlGkYDr7EM:&tbnh=131&tbnw=100&prev=/images%3Fq%3DPLASMA%2BGLOBE%26imgsz%3Dm%26imgtbs%3Dz%26ndsp%3D20%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-GB:official%26sa%3DN%26start%3D20%26um%3D1&ei=Y-HuSt7GFt_UlQf1qIiABQ
IT ALMOST LOOKS LIKE A JT POWERING THE UNIT........ HUMMMMM
http://images.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://cyclotron.lbl.gov/images/plasma.jpg&imgrefurl=http://cyclotron.lbl.gov/88History.html1.html&usg=__4dzB2ywh2TE2KVSH2jn39VwXEso=&h=319&w=312&sz=14&hl=en&start=120&sig2=xcA4vKhK3ziPnWB3rSz_Ug&um=1&tbnid=-_Dw8vM1urlDjM:&tbnh=118&tbnw=115&prev=/images%3Fq%3DDON%2BSMITH%2BPLASMA%2BBALL%26ndsp%3D20%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-GB:official%26sa%3DN%26start%3D100%26um%3D1&ei=SePuSs7_FpPIlAfO3YmABQ
CHECK IT OUT ...
OK NOW REALLY IM DONE WITH DON SMITHS WORK FOR NOW ...
IST!
ENJOY..
WATE 1 MORE PIC ;D ;) ;) 8)
Are you talking about device #4 with the plasma globe?
Someone here tried replicating it.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=502.0
It produced no power, let alone overunity. I think device #9 is the one to try replicating. Syncing resonance is surely important for obtaining any power from it but whether OU is here is to be seen--I doubt it now judging by the un-success of others.
have a look at dons advanced plasma unit ..
why is the plasma centered .. 90 deg to the plates ...
the plates are CAPS...... maybe its a FLUX CAP VIA PLASMA INTERACTION ..
PLASMA HAS ELECTRIC INTERACTIONS MAGNETIC INTERACTION AND I BET GRAVITO MAGNETIC
AND WHO KNOWS WHAT ELSE ..
don does the demo ... in his advanced plasma device it is the same demo he does in the video useing a BATTERY POWERED TESLA COIL .. but in the tc coil demo he is manipulasing via cold electric means ..
the plasma device via plasma .. wich im wondering if plasma is cold electricty in a vaccume in electromagnetic resonance ..
hummmm
ps some time ago i had a plasma vortex .. magnetic controlled spinner designed ..
the only thing i thought it needed that i could not do myself .. was some contact points ..
placed within the vaccume tube...
i left it alone .. it was not plasma time yet... ;D 8) but basically as it spunn the plasma vortex .. it could make contact with the out pins.. but the plasma must stay plasma in the vaccume .. and i dont know weather it would collapse upon conductive contact!!
outta here.. ist!
so it apears to me at this time ... that don has come up with a better way to do it ... ;D
don is useing THE SAME MEDIUM TO ACCESS.... VIA PLASMA ,MAGNETIC RESONANCE COLD ELECTRICTY .. ECT...
WHAT IS HE MANUIPLATING ... ?
SOME WILL SAY DON IS TAPPING THE WHEEL WORK OF NATURE ..
SOME WILL SAY HE TAPPED AMBIENT NOISE ..
SOME SAY HE IS A HOAX .. AND A FRAUD ..
SOME SAY HE IS MANIPULATING THE ENVIRMENT TO WICH WE LIVE ..
SOME SAY HE IS DISTURBING EQULIBRIUM..
WELL
I SAY .. HE IS USEING WHAT WAS GIVEN TO BE USED! ;)
IST!
DON HAS AN EXCLANT UNDERSTANDING OF TESLAS WORK!
PEROID!
NOW CONDUCT THIS EXPARIMENT AGIN .. USEING A BATTERY POWERED TESLA COIL .. AND YOU NOW HAVE ELECTRICAL CONDUCTION THROUGH THE PLASTIC ..
I would need to know just for starters,the resonant freq of this 14",,12 volt Tesla coil,,,14" and 12 volt don't lend itself (in a practical,Tesla coil build) to
very much electric flux.I would be very curious of
the tank capacitor and spark gap??
Resonance is the key,,and usually works by the matching of capacitor,break rate,cut-off time to
the primary in order to excite the secondary,at
resonance,,,any idea the resonant freq of the TC?
j.
I CAN MANIPULATE SOURCE ENGERY IN 1 PULSE ...
AND IT HAS SQUAT TO DO WITH RESOSNANCE !
YOU GET MORE WHEN YOU PUSH IT MORE ..... HENCE RESONANCE
AND IT HAS A HOLE LOT TO DO WITH BREAKING THE FLOW OF ELECTRICTY... AND REDIRRECTING IT TO SUIT YOUR NEEDS... THIS IS TESLAS KICK THIS IS THE DIRRECT EFFECT OF CAUSEING A DUSTURBANCE IN THE NATURAL EQULIBIRUM .. THIS IS NATURE BALLANCEING HERSELF TO COMPENSATE FOR WHAT YOU DID TO HER!
TAKE A LONG POLE ... GRAB 1 END OF IT I GRAB THE OTHER I PUSH YOUR WAY ... I STOP ... YOU PUSH MY WAY ... NOW IM ASSUMEING YOU ARE BIGGER THAN MY SELF ... AND YOUR PUSH IS MORE POWERFUL ... SO I HARNESS SOME OF YOUR PUSH ... I THEN PUT SOME OF THAT PUSH BACK IN IF I SO DESIRE SO THAT MY PUSH IS NOW BIGGER THAN MY LAST PUSH .. ;) THIS IS SELF DESTRUCT MOTHOD OF THE SMTPU AS I STILL BELEAVE ...
NOW
BASICALLY MY DEVICES WORK LIKE THIS I PUSH SHE PUSHES BACK .. I COLLECT THAT .. I PUSH AGIN ... SHE PUSHES BACK... I COLLECT AGIN .. THE COLLECTION WILL BE STORED IN THE NEWEST TECK ULTRACAPS .. ON THE PLANET ... USED FOR CARS AND SUCH ... ;) HOUSES .... YA KNOW
I HAVE ALREADY PROVEN THIS ALL TO BE THE TRUE REALITY ON THIS SITE IN THE JT THRED ..
INFACT IM BUILDING A UNIT PUBLIC IN NOT LONG ... THAT WILL DELIVER MANY KW .. AND IT IS SELF RUNNING ..
ALL THE INFO IS ALL READY POSTED IN THE JT THRED ...
IST!
OOO AND GUESS WHAT THERE IS NO 0 ZILCH NA DA 1 BATTERY LOL ;D ;D ;D ;D
NO BATTERIES PEROID LIFESPAN OF THE CAPS IS LONGER THAN YOURS....
if the info i was given is correct on the caps then i have a reserve of 32400WATTS...
what is the material of sheet that can intercept magnetic field in don machine?
Quote from: winsonali on November 22, 2009, 08:03:25 PM
what is the material of sheet that can intercept magnetic field in don machine?
Various materials have been mentioned. He has suggested grinding up neodymium
magnets, and sticking the powder to, possibly, stainless steel. "Magnetostrictive"
gets mentioned, but this stuff is fabulously expensive. I am going to try grinding up
the ceramic stuff you get in 3.5" floppy drives. It is pretty easy to do. And then
glue it on to a disc of SS. It may not work, but it is easy to try.
it seems to me that what he wants is a magentic barrier to interrupt, and I am
surprised nobody has mentioned mumetal, particularly since you get the stuff in
old scrapped hard drives. (Around the magents under the coil).
Quote from: Paul-R on November 23, 2009, 11:09:43 AM
Various materials have been mentioned. He has suggested grinding up neodymium
magnets, and sticking the powder to, possibly, stainless steel. "Magnetostrictive"
gets mentioned, but this stuff is fabulously expensive. I am going to try grinding up
the ceramic stuff you get in 3.5" floppy drives. It is pretty easy to do. And then
glue it on to a disc of SS. It may not work, but it is easy to try.
it seems to me that what he wants is a magentic barrier to interrupt, and I am
surprised nobody has mentioned mumetal, particularly since you get the stuff in
old scrapped hard drives. (Around the magents under the coil).
yikes ... intresting you say that .....
im not telling why public.... ;) :o :o :o
w
can you make it liquid ... dont honestly know much about that material .. but it clicks ... :)
I have tried this with rotating Stainless Steel scissor like blades long time ago.
I tried stationary coils/stationary magnets/rotating disk setups,
I also tried stationary coils/stationary disk/rotating magnets setups,
And stationary disk/stationary magnets/rotating coils setups.
All without luck and as a result i am convinced the magnetic field is a property of space and has no connection to the magnet other then the effect that is percieved.
Paul-r if you do find something intresting,i still have hundreds of old 3.5 alswell as a lot of old hard drives too.
I would be happy to crush them up to try something new.
Marco.
Hi All
Probably by the time you commented on this device you didn't know about the A videos of Don L smith on youtube, but I do recall in one of this he said "people had a problem making this and I have to tell them how, they are making them in Russia now" this quote is not verbatim but you can watch the video and confirm the idea behind it, thing is, he was an engineer and way beyond even tesla at least technology wise, he assumes everyone trying to build this devices knows the simple basics of engineering for he is used to it!... In reality we are a bunch of dummies overseing this facts, I do have some engineering experience, not to say it is our fault , he said he is not saying everything but you can see in his eyes the benevolent profesor that he is, just trying to make us think on our own,I believe he was just trying to tell us that: study the basics and you will tune up this machine just right for it needs to be in resonance.Variable speed controllers and so forth sound just right from that point of view, -easy?- not even for the intuitive mind!, otherwise we would've have this machine already... One thing I do know due to my experimenting, even the wrong type of capacitors will set you up for failure, some retain this hight frequency electricity some don't, I know because I pulsed several types of capacitors, and batteries, sounds complicated? basically I just shorted out a capacitor and batteries charging circuit!-manually-but if I didn't do it just right, nothing would show up on the multimeter! John Bedini has a video were he shows 2 types of electricity the yellow one and the most intriguing one , also mentioned by tesla and described as a "gas",etc, that can't be easily measured: the blue spark energy...this last one killed almost instantly by the yellow one, see? see the predicament? we have to be faster than this forms of energy! Bedini figured out how to separate both of them! I've seen both sparks while at it,The right capacitor and battery able to retain this tricky blue spark will light up an LED but a multimeter will give you no reliable readings and viceversa, our instruments are not suit up for the task but you can observe the physical effects somehow, it lights up brightly for and instant then again it is just from one manual pulse! I thing Smith-obvioulsy- found the way to make this pulse continuous. I did used a radio "cheap"(you can't find sh... over there this days), excuse me radio shack 12v 7amh battery to reach 150,200 volts in a recharcheable disposable camera cap, I know many would say," Ho it is just a memory effect of this type of cap" But I don't think so, ok ok go to the forum related to it, but see? you must thing "multidemensionally" everything is related...Then again it begs the question, where is he now? what hapened to all of this great machines ? Where are the fabulous applications of this technology?, Do you know what I would do if all of this were practical and the world wouldn't believe me?, which I think is the case.... I would make my money and dissapear in brasil living in my own supersecret facility , why would I save a world that don't want to be saved?
Yes just like Tesla and Marconi it's been said did that very same thing... But don't loose faith please, do it for all of the innocents whom don't know better...
Cheers
A couple of points I would bring up about don's device are 1. I believe Don used neodymium powder which you can by online and which has not been magnetized to cover his disk.
2. The thing to understand about magnets and their bloch walls is that when you place to magnets together in attraction mode the bloch walls of each magnet will MOVE to the center, the junction between the two magnets leaving one whole magnet North and the other whole magnet South! It's because the bloch walls can move in this way that the magnetic fields become stretched all the way into the center. Now if the magnets are not fully in contact then the bloch walls will move inward perhaps 80 or 90 percent of the way in. When you break this magnetic connection with a neodymium coated disk the bloch walls momentarily spring back to their centers. So, it's the moving block walls and the accompanying magnetic fields that cause an electrical current to be formed.
Since neodymium powder on the disk would cause a further attraction of the two facing magnets I have to assume Don's magnets were in repulsion mode which would push the two bloch walls to the outer edges of the facing magnets and the disk would then block the repulsion-even adding an attraction by the neodymium bringing the bloch walls back in toward the disk
If you haven't seen them, you might want to check out:
http://www.free-energy-info.co.uk/Smith.pdf
http://www.free-energy-info.co.uk/Chapter3.pdf
along with chapters 5 and 16.
Quote from: allcanadian on October 31, 2009, 03:21:07 PM
The first question we should ask about the Smith machine is ---- Are the magnets in opposition or attraction as both conditions will produce a bloch wall between them?.
Regards
AC
http://www.freeenergyinventions.com/donsmith.html (http://www.freeenergyinventions.com/donsmith.html)
Not the same device, but another of his (Don). In the picture "Useful Circuits From Nikolai Tesla", the one in the lower right corner. Look Carefully, you see that top and bottom windings are NOT turned the same way. Not sure if this is a typo and/or this is also something that is present in Don's devices.
Im trying to learn how to use "LTSpice IV" To learn how to tune these devices.
/Conny
Quote from: johnnyfg on June 01, 2011, 04:42:58 PM
http://www.freeenergyinventions.com/donsmith.html (http://www.freeenergyinventions.com/donsmith.html)
Not the same device, but another of his (Don). In the picture "Useful Circuits From Nikolai Tesla", the one in the lower right corner. Look Carefully, you see that top and bottom windings are NOT turned the same way. Not sure if this is a typo and/or this is also something that is present in Don's devices.
Im trying to learn how to use "LTSpice IV" To learn how to tune these devices.
/Conny
This
D.Smith link explain, that he is fully
unseriosly to
bring such
UNWORKABLE and NONSENSE as "inventor an SCHEMATA SELLER to the pubilc.
THIS IS fully "
destructive" for Beginners, to hope..
and lost money.
This Circuit (Link) contains at minimum 3 BIG "bugs" so
-because any of each. NOTHING can work from this
schemata . Ask your school teacher, your radio-repair-men
or (better an radio amateur) anyone , with "basic" on physic.
find in overview fis bugs. (no needs to learn the text or to
compare with attatched Tesla Patents,(that needs an "higher" understanding in electronics...
So your "sourounding" or users here can explain (each) better than me,because litte bit difficult, my natif language is german, and my englisch ist to low graded , to do the work....
Gustav Pese
Quote from: pese on June 01, 2011, 10:05:12 PM
This D.Smith link explain, that he is fully unseriosly to
bring such UNWORKABLE and NONSENSE
as "inventor an SCHEMATA SELLER to the pubilc.
THIS IS fully "destructive" for Beginners, to hope..
and lost money.
This Circuit (Link) contains at minimum 3 BIG "bugs" so
-because any of each. NOTHING can work from this
schemata . Ask your school teacher, your radio-repair-men
or (better an radio amateur) anyone , with "basic" on physic.
find in overview fis bugs. (no needs to learn the text or to
compare with attatched Tesla Patents,(that needs an "higher" understanding in electronics...
So your "sourounding" or users here can explain (each) better than me,because litte bit difficult, my natif language is german, and my englisch ist to low graded , to do the work....
Gustav Pese
Why so negative?
Who i selling schematics?
I dont sell anything, neither does the site I mentioned.
Im not spending any money, since I use simulation software.
And yes, I know, or assume, that Don Smith deliberately omitted things in his presentations and/or schematics.
because this is an physical - electrival nonsense.
To learn and become knowledges over electrontic .
it dont need to find out fierst the errors and problems
from and author and inventer, that an lot of people
give attention at first.
so mutch errors begnning wron polarit of diode,
wrong application of an voltage divider (that divide also the ampereage
Exa,ple here 1000 to 1.. so the enerie (watts) are also divides 1000:1. So that never an 20KW inverter (12V) can connected this way on an ohnic-resitive divider.
any one have idea, vor the rectifier brige (must bei 10KW and usabel for RF (Highfrequencies. here ist uses 100Khz / 500 Khz about !! Anyone have think about it ?
So you have 3 different points, includes 2 "faults" it have more, sothis divive is an robbery for yoir time, so it dont need
to buy any experimental sets ...
Pese
P-S- (post scripzum)
www.alt-nrg.de/pppp
an enlisch/german link collection of
sense and nonsense alternative energies
and more...
(only links, without any comments.
only inprofessional html-collection
containg selected knowledges looking
now 10 years ofer the net ...
Dear forum users, I posted a letter of such content on the Energetic Forum specifically for Patrick Kelly. I would like to offer you to read it to know the truth.
"Dear Patrick and forum, it is my duty to warn you about the falsification of the replication apparatus of Donald Smith, the so-called Dynatron from forums on Free Energy from the country of Ukraine. None of his equipment is not functioning and does not give the output power exceeds the input.I learned that this man came in contact with Patrick and is trying to turn their device into a new book by Patrick.
I want to warn you Patrick and respected users that Dynatron - this is a commercial project that has nothing to do with science and creativity.You can see this, when you look at the forum link above, where the money is going to develop, but in fact went to the formation of his own private enterprise. He two years of deceiving the people on the forums.
The real purpose of this action, the next hiding information from the inventors of free energy.
Dear Patrick, when Dynatron will tell you that this is a lie, ask other disinterested members of the forums. His task, the maximum display on the television, the Internet and books, but in fact a fiction. If you care of truth, do not include in your edition of the device of Dynatron, unless of course you are interested in the truth.Please do not distribute it lies in your esteemed publication."
Thank you for your attention.
Vasiliy Buslaev