Quote from: TinselKoala on April 01, 2012, 06:13:27 PM
Gamma rays are not "heavy particles." They are photons of EM radiation, like  radio, microwave, IR, visible light, UV, X-rays and gammas, in increasing order of energy per photon. They do carry momentum, they move at the speed of light whatever their energies, and they are massless except for their energy equivalent mass.

The gammas released by electron-positron annihilation are 511 kEv gammas. These are just about the lowest energy gammas that you can have.... lower and you are starting to get into X-ray levels. The alleged transmutation reactions claimed by Rossi release these 511 kEv gammas.... and they are energetic enough to require more than a few millimeters of lead to shield them completely.

I am reasonably certain that there's nothing on these forums to mitigate against free expression of uninformed opinion.  In fact I get the distinct impression that this practice is rather encouraged.  But I'm not sure there's any value in it.  Other than to indulge in a compulsive need to parade one's ignorance.

My dear Tinsel Koala - the most of our mainstream scientists know perfectly well the distinction between alpha, beta and gamma emissions.  Alpha, typically refers to photons and the kind of emissions that are produced by our sun.  And any attendant dangers here can be obviated by nothing more complex than 'sun block' or by the application of membranes that need be no thicker than the chitinous cover over your average sugar ant.  Beta emissions are atomic and, in as much as they're associated with electrons - they relate to the changes in the outer boundaries of our atoms.  These emissions, in turn, can be blocked by by lead, foil and even paper (if it's thick enough).  No real dangers.  Gamma rays, on the other hand, ONLY refer to the particles that comprise the atom's nucleus, being the protons and the neutrons.  And these are somewhat hazardous - in whatever form - highly penetrative - and typically with a frightening and long lasting toxicity.  And also, typically these are proposed to be 'contained' by the strong concrete shielding around our nuclear reactors.  Sadly, there is no known and effective means to dispose of this waste.  Which is an insuperable concern that encourages a great many people to rather dislike the continued and reckless practice of building ever more nuclear power plants to address our energy concerns.

Regarding your 'redefinition' of these emissions.  If you are seriously proposing this then I would suggest you write to our academics - all over the world - and advise them that your opinion here not only matters - but that you prefer it that they all apply this.  Else it is likely to be ignored.  And I doubt that any of our readers here will ever bother to inform them for you - being as it is an eccentric and somewhat inadequate definition - in any context at all.

Your choice
Rosie Pose.

edited.  changed 'reactions' to 'reactors'

Quote from: TinselKoala on April 01, 2012, 06:13:27 PM
Gamma rays are not "heavy particles." They are photons of EM radiation, like  radio, microwave, IR, visible light, UV, X-rays and gammas, in increasing order of energy per photon. They do carry momentum, they move at the speed of light whatever their energies, and they are massless except for their energy equivalent mass.

The gammas released by electron-positron annihilation are 511 kEv gammas. These are just about the lowest energy gammas that you can have.... lower and you are starting to get into X-ray levels. The alleged transmutation reactions claimed by Rossi release these 511 kEv gammas.... and they are energetic enough to require more than a few millimeters of lead to shield them completely.

I agree somewhat, but your argument isn't valid in this case, because we're not dealing with the electromagnetic force (photons, electrons, ect.), but are dealing with the weak nuclear force which is an interaction with the W & Z particles which are more massive, but with an identical Kev to those interactions which are found for the electromagnetic force.  Add up the total mass-energy of the W & Z particles and they will be at or higher than the 511 Kev gammas, which would be similar to the equivalent Kev of the electromagnetic force.  The difference would be between their velocity and momentum (mass and velocity difference).  In other-words, you're trying to wrongly apply the proper force to the correct particles which are responsible for these gamma rays. 

Gravock.

Hello MileHigh,

Congratulations.  It seems that you are now taking up the cudgels against cold fusion - or LENR - as it's also known.  This is comforting as I was beginning to think that you'd overlooked this in your endless denials of efficient alternative energy supply sources.

Quote from: MileHigh on April 01, 2012, 09:17:49 PM
I have always tried to use my critical thinking skills when it comes to evaluating free energy propositions, or in this case, an LENR proposition. You read and take in information from all angles.  One thing that has always set off alarm bells in my head is when the person promoting the proposition says something like, "We will start producing a million units per year starting next year.

Does anybody remember this PESN headline, "Aviso Envisions 1 Million Self-Charging EV Retrofit Stations by 2011 End."  Not that I didn't already know that Ismael Aviso was full of crap, but that laughable statement just hammered home the point and showed how stupid and naive this man really is.  He is just a small guy running a garage or something with a few employees.  You would need a medium-sized army to accomplish what he claimed.

Delighted to read that you try and apply your 'thinking' skills.  Sorry to learn that this sets of loud 'bell' noises in your brain.  I'm afraid there's no solution here.  A hollow cavity is known to exaggerate sound.  And your need to read 'Rossi'  or 'Defkalion' or 'NASA' or 'MIT' when you actually read 'Aviso' - is something that is utterly incurable.  Certainly not until you manage to damp down that 'bell ringing' thing you suffer from.  Regarding the need for a medium sized army to produce a million units of anything at all - then rest assured.  This number of employees is exactly what most of our energy supply users rely on - either directly or indirectly.  And the end users - the beneficiaries - of this 'army', so to speak - is that big that it's global.  Sadly -  the rampant toxicity that they produce is also global.

Quote from: MileHigh on April 01, 2012, 09:17:49 PMRossi is making a similar claim.  Putting all of the testing issues aside, when Rossi claims that he is going to produce a million units per year, that should set off some alarm bells in your head.  Because if any of that is true, we should know were the factory is, we should be aware that they are hiring staff, they should be purchasing equipment, and so on and so on.  It's impossible to set up a factory producing a million units of a device like he is claiming without everyone following this story not being aware of the "footprint."

If there were any standard media coverage of any part of this development - then indeed, I suspect we'd all be hearing about this.  Fortunately our media are ignoring this - as they're of the opinion that LENR is a pathological science.  Which also means that both Defkalion and Rossi can continue 'under the radar' - so to speak.

Quote from: MileHigh on April 01, 2012, 09:17:49 PMAm I roughly correct?  If I am correct in my assumptions then I am telling you this doesn't smell right at all.  I thought by the end of 2011 we were all supposed to be informed and have conclusive proof.  Are we now waiting for the end of 2012?

Clearly you don't follow this too closely.  And you're not correct in your assumptions.  And it seems that it's not only your brain that is effected by that bell ringing but also your sense of smell.

Take care MileHigh,
Rose Pose

Well, I don't get it because for all of my life I understood gamma rays to be high-frequency electromagnetic radiation.

From Wiki:

QuoteGamma radiation, also known as gamma rays or hyphenated as gamma-rays and denoted as γ, is electromagnetic radiation of high frequency and therefore energy. Gamma rays are ionizing radiation and are thus biologically hazardous. Gamma rays are classically produced by the decay from high energy states of atomic nuclei (gamma decay), but also in many other ways. Natural sources of gamma rays on Earth include gamma decay from naturally-occurring radioisotopes such as potassium-40, and also as a secondary radiation from various atmospheric interactions with cosmic ray particles.

Gravityblock, I have never heard of what you are talking about but I did some searching:

QuoteThe W and Z bosons (together known as the weak bosons) are the elementary particles that mediate the weak interaction; their symbols are W[size=85%]

+
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, W[size=85%]

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and Z. The W bosons have a positive and negative electric charge of 1 elementary charge respectively and are each other's antiparticle. The Z boson is electrically neutral and its own antiparticle. All three of these particles are very short-lived with a half-life of about 3×10^âˆ'25 s. Their discovery was a major success for what is now called the Standard Model of particle physics.

QuoteWeak interaction (often called the weak force or sometimes the weak nuclear force) is one of the four fundamental forces of nature, alongside the strong nuclear force, electromagnetism, and gravity. It is responsible for the radioactive decay of subatomic particles and initiates the process known as hydrogen fusion in stars. Weak interactions affect all known fermions; that is, particles whose spin (a property of all particles) is a half-integer.

Also:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radioactive_decay

I looked around for 10 minutes and I don't see any references to gamma radiation being anything else but electromagnetic radiation.  Are you sure of your information?  Are you sure you are not getting your information from a junk science web site?

It's quite important to not redefine terms that have precise definitions.  I am no expert here, just stating what I believe to be true.

MileHigh

Rosie Posie:

QuoteDelighted to read that you try and apply your 'thinking' skills.  Sorry to learn that this sets of loud 'bell' noises in your brain.

So all that you have is an ad-hominem attack?

All of you that are following the Rossi narrative please keep what I said in mind about the claimed "big factory."  You read the quote from the production engineer, it takes somewhere between 200 and 300 engineers to do this.  For the sake of argument, assume about the same number of support and production people when the factory is close to starting production.

So we are talking a couple of years to set up a factory like this and 200 to 300 people working on the project.  Then when you are close to production the head count has to be somewhere between 400 and 600 people.  This is REALITY.

So when you listen to Rossi talk about going into production you know that there has to be real substance.  If by the end of the year he is still a very small operation and he is talking about producing one million units per year starting in 2013 then chances are it's all just bluff and bluster.  If he still hasn't demonstrated valid data verified by independent third parties at the end of this year, then that's two strikes against him.

Just use your common sense.

MileHigh