Hannon
Motion is relative to the frame of reference of the observer.Or in this case to the frame of reference of the coil it acts upon. The movement of the magnetic field as seen by the coil isnt dependent on moving the magnet if you have command over the magnetic field when created with or by current you just have to provide reversal of motion from the point of view of the coil it is effecting. The motion will turn up as transformation or induction depending on if it is viewed by the coil as linking or cutting. The point of view that counts is the middle coils point of view.
Your going to want that back emf to go into the other coil but not with out control over the time it takes to do so.
Try a table top experiment with one coil and two magnets and a analog meter that will show you that it acts just like pushing a single magnet all the way through the coil so both N and S poles swing the meter pos and neg. only your using two N or two S poles with a gap between them. <=>  Edison made a generator simular to it a long time ago but he used horse shoe magnets and moved the coil in between the poles driven by a prime mover to make the frame of coils move in relation to the horse shoe magnets.

Hanon,


sorry, I meant "or it may flow trough the other PRIMARY"  ...


I have to confess, I know the official definition of the Lorentz force, but I tend to think it is basicly just a Back magnetomotive force like the Lenz effect, but it appears to be unrelated to the pole axis because it increases linear to the inductive coupling, which depends on axis alignement. I probably should consult a book or two  .


Whether like or opposite poles should be used, a socket flow or not, and what frequency, if a test device is once built, this can all be tested in every possible conFigu(E)ra-tion. I have made some tests, as blogged earlier, but my meters are really limited and/or unreliable, and my core also has no gaps as seen in the patent. So I'm looking forward to see some test data by you guys.


Regards

It's been a while since I've been here but I have not been idle.

To recap, the Figuera and Buforn patents are the same thing. The patent drawings are intentionally misleading, in particular, the hinted at coil construction and the missing magnetic circuit. The working principle is the variation of the excitation current in the field coils or the inducing coils as they are called in the patent, in a dynamo. That is all it is, period, the end.

In other words, if you want to be successful then stop building transformers and build a dynamo instead.

The actual DC generator or dynamo is constructed according to the known design principles of the time, those in use around 1900. That means it has an outer steel looped frame with the field coils attached to the inside of it in pairs of north and south, with a minimum of two coils. The induced or armature coils are inside of the frame and the magnetic flux from the field coils passes directly through the induced wires.

The armature coils are not round, they have two straight sides with one side adjacent to a positive field coil pole shoe and the other side adjacent to a negative pole shoe.

The magnetic circuit must direct the flux in a loop from a N coil pole shoe through the induced wire of the armature, through the armature, out through the opposite induced wire of the same coil loop, through a S coil pole shoe and back through the outer frame to the first N coil. The flux path must be of sufficient cross section at all points of the circuit to carry the number of flux lines used.

A dynamo design is based on the number of lines of magnetic flux cut by the armature coils per second as it rotates. The number of flux lines is determined by the area of the field coil pole shoe and the strength of the field coil magnetic properties; type of iron and ampere turns and current. Since ours will not rotate you must calculate based on the flux lines intersecting the copper wire diameter and the number and length of induced wires that will fit adjacent to the pole shoe.

If you want to succeed you must build a dynamo of sufficient size to produce more than enough voltage and current to run the little commutator motor, or your solid state circuit. The current from the dynamo will provide the current for the field coils, just as it does in the old designs. You will need a temporary separate power source sufficient to provide the full startup volts and current needed by your particular dynamo, whatever that may be.

One more tip. By varying the field excitation current according to the patent, you will need to use a commutator and wire sized for additional current since the variation will produce an average current. In other words if your field coils require 2 amps then size the commutator, brush, and wire for 4 amps. The same goes for a solid state circuit.

Here is my parting gift to you. A book written by W. Benison Hird, B.A., M.I.E.E. who was a lecturer on dynamo design at the Glasgow and West of Scotland Technical College. Published in 1908. It contains everything you need to know. Want a dynamo that produces a continuous 500 volt, 200 amp DC, and only requires 19.8 amps of excitation current? It's in there.
Elementary Dynamo Design https://archive.org/details/elementarydynamo00hirdrich

Best Regards to all

Thank you. I am looking forward to studying the document.
My commutator still sparks a little. Still working on it.
Thank you again,

Shadow

Quote from: Cadman on April 27, 2014, 04:02:08 PM
It's been a while since I've been here but I have not been idle.

To recap, the Figuera and Buforn patents are the same thing. The patent drawings are intentionally misleading, in particular, the hinted at coil construction and the missing magnetic circuit. The working principle is the variation of the excitation current in the field coils or the inducing coils as they are called in the patent, in a dynamo. That is all it is, period, the end.

In other words, if you want to be successful then stop building transformers and build a dynamo instead.

The actual DC generator or dynamo is constructed according to the known design principles of the time, those in use around 1900. That means it has an outer steel looped frame with the field coils attached to the inside of it in pairs of north and south, with a minimum of two coils. The induced or armature coils are inside of the frame and the magnetic flux from the field coils passes directly through the induced wires.

The armature coils are not round, they have two straight sides with one side adjacent to a positive field coil pole shoe and the other side adjacent to a negative pole shoe.

The magnetic circuit must direct the flux in a loop from a N coil pole shoe through the induced wire of the armature, through the armature, out through the opposite induced wire of the same coil loop, through a S coil pole shoe and back through the outer frame to the first N coil. The flux path must be of sufficient cross section at all points of the circuit to carry the number of flux lines used.

A dynamo design is based on the number of lines of magnetic flux cut by the armature coils per second as it rotates. The number of flux lines is determined by the area of the field coil pole shoe and the strength of the field coil magnetic properties; type of iron and ampere turns and current. Since ours will not rotate you must calculate based on the flux lines intersecting the copper wire diameter and the number and length of induced wires that will fit adjacent to the pole shoe.

If you want to succeed you must build a dynamo of sufficient size to produce more than enough voltage and current to run the little commutator motor, or your solid state circuit. The current from the dynamo will provide the current for the field coils, just as it does in the old designs. You will need a temporary separate power source sufficient to provide the full startup volts and current needed by your particular dynamo, whatever that may be.

One more tip. By varying the field excitation current according to the patent, you will need to use a commutator and wire sized for additional current since the variation will produce an average current. In other words if your field coils require 2 amps then size the commutator, brush, and wire for 4 amps. The same goes for a solid state circuit.

Here is my parting gift to you. A book written by W. Benison Hird, B.A., M.I.E.E. who was a lecturer on dynamo design at the Glasgow and West of Scotland Technical College. Published in 1908. It contains everything you need to know. Want a dynamo that produces a continuous 500 volt, 200 amp DC, and only requires 19.8 amps of excitation current? It's in there.
Elementary Dynamo Design https://archive.org/details/elementarydynamo00hirdrich

Best Regards to all

Hi Cadman,

Thanks for your kind help. I have a couple of questions:

1- How can we get the wires cut by the magnetic flux? Dynamos are based on that principle but for that the wire must be moved laterally to the magnetic lines. We need to emulate some kind of relative movement to induce the wires!!

2- What the difference between building a transformer and a dynamo? I understand that in transformers the magnetic flux do not hit the wires, just pass across the coil (flux linking). In dynamos the flux must cut the wires (flux cutting), this take us to the first question again: how can we get the flux cutting laterally the wires?

Thanks for your kind help. Your post is exciting with so many tips. Any good result from your device?  I am happy with your help. This night I will study in deep your tips, now I am short of time.

Regards

PS. Which pages on the book you recommend us to read?