Tinman
It's best to start logically breaking the problem down into first principals.

1)We know the generator in question works as claimed because it was replicated in this video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8weP9Cpphw
1968 The Generator You Have Never Heard Of - Transverse Flux
A working replication/experiment is the best proof, it works and we can leave it at that.

2)You are correct in implying that the optimal design would use North and South pole magnets on either side of the disk. In fact conventional transverse flux generators do exactly that as shown in the picture below. However, optimized or not the question we want answered is only how and why it works. What I see in the responses are not answers rather guesses or distractions from the actual cause and effect in my opinion.

3)From the statements above we know the concept works and the only requirement is that a changing flux curls around the conductor to be induced. Here we could introduce a new concept so simple it's hard to imagine how anyone could miss it. Let's go back to the left hand rule for electron flow in a conductor as shown below.

The left hand rule shows the magnetic field curling around the conductor clockwise (the fingers) if the electron current was moving through the conductor towards us(the thumb). Likewise, if a process was reversible then the opposite should be true. That is, if we produced a changing magnetic field which curls around a conductor (the fingers) then an electron current should be induced in the conductor (the thumb). In fact this is exactly what we see in the transverse flux generator but for some reason most people cannot put two and two together. It's a very simple concept, it's right there staring at everyone and yet it eludes many, why is that?.

Here's a clue, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYpz9ak34e0
I took a snapshot shown below. Now if the magnetic flux is supposedly enclosed within the core of a toroidal core then how was the thick conductor through the toroid center induced with an electron current which then acted on the magnet inside the conductor loop?. In fact the principal is no different that the transverse flux generator. Whenever a changing magnetic field curls around a conductor in a core an electron current is induced in said conductor within the core.

In fact what was shown here only scratches the surface and it gets even more bizarre on many different levels as we learn new concepts...

AC

Quote from: phoneboy on August 25, 2023, 02:00:00 PM
@Tinman
The current is AC, and its frequency is determined by the rotors rotational speed.  The drawing onepower posted is correct because he's referencing the induced current (left hand rule) not the field generated by us applying an external current through the coil (right hand rule).  E=-dA/dt.  Also, Lenz still applies even though there is no flux cutting.

Yes, his drawing is correct.
So now tell us as to which direction the current will flow, when the magnetic field is going both CW and CCW around the windings.

Quote from: lumen on August 25, 2023, 07:08:09 PM
I'm thinking a magnetic field is always a loop and doesn't just appear in the G segments. It would travel as a loop into the G shaped sections and cut through the coil as it encounters back EMF the same as any generator.
(Had to do a quick picture hack to show poles on the magnet!)

That drawing is correct, and a current would flow through the coil.

I see nothing magical in the tranverse generator/motor. It operates like any generator or motor.
It is though a keen design!


Subject is a bit off for this thread though.
I do see some overunity in the original motoflux design but it's hidden in the force over distance problem of the center director.


The director builds resistive force as it is rotated then causes the rotor to jump (sometimes many detents / revolutions)
If the director is prevented from falling all the way back to the start position then it's possible to conserve some energy for a greater return on the next indexs on the rotor.
That is why there is a break on the output and a constant input to prevent the director from dropping back to position and requiring more energy to start the next rotor detent jump.


Not real clear but anyone building the motoflux will likely encounter this problem.  Leads to the fact that there is some free energy but may also require some beter concept to make more useful.


JMO

Quote from: onepower on August 25, 2023, 07:56:11 PM
Tinman
It's best to start logically breaking the problem down into first principals.

1)We know the generator in question works as claimed because it was replicated in this video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8weP9Cpphw
1968 The Generator You Have Never Heard Of - Transverse Flux
A working replication/experiment is the best proof, it works and we can leave it at that.

2)You are correct in implying that the optimal design would use North and South pole magnets on either side of the disk. In fact conventional transverse flux generators do exactly that as shown in the picture below. However, optimized or not the question we want answered is only how and why it works. What I see in the responses are not answers rather guesses or distractions from the actual cause and effect in my opinion.

3)From the statements above we know the concept works and the only requirement is that a changing flux curls around the conductor to be induced. Here we could introduce a new concept so simple it's hard to imagine how anyone could miss it. Let's go back to the left hand rule for electron flow in a conductor as shown below.

The left hand rule shows the magnetic field curling around the conductor clockwise (the fingers) if the electron current was moving through the conductor towards us(the thumb). Likewise, if a process was reversible then the opposite should be true. That is, if we produced a changing magnetic field which curls around a conductor (the fingers) then an electron current should be induced in the conductor (the thumb). In fact this is exactly what we see in the transverse flux generator but for some reason most people cannot put two and two together. It's a very simple concept, it's right there staring at everyone and yet it eludes many, why is that?.

Here's a clue, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYpz9ak34e0
I took a snapshot shown below. Now if the magnetic flux is supposedly enclosed within the core of a toroidal core then how was the thick conductor through the toroid center induced with an electron current which then acted on the magnet inside the conductor loop?. In fact the principal is no different that the transverse flux generator. Whenever a changing magnetic field curls around a conductor in a core an electron current is induced in said conductor within the core.

In fact what was shown here only scratches the surface and it gets even more bizarre on many different levels as we learn new concepts...

AC

Of course it would work if the magnets had the south going in one end of the core, and the north in the other.
But the design i posted the link to will not work as you claim, and Robert showed in his video is the same design, but it is not what he built. He built one that had a north field going in one side of the core, and a south field going in the other side, which will work.

You stated that it took you one minute to work out how it works when you looked at the drawings from the web site i posted.
So im asking you to explain as to how it works, using the diagram below.

I stated that i can't work out how this design would work, and i still cant.
If the magnets were placed so as the north field went in one side of the core, and the south field went into the other side, then it is just a standard alternator setup.

QuoteI took a snapshot shown below. Now if the magnetic flux is supposedly enclosed within the core of a toroidal core then how was the thick conductor through the toroid center induced with an electron current which then acted on the magnet inside the conductor loop?. In fact the principal is no different that the transverse flux generator. Whenever a changing magnetic field curls around a conductor in a core an electron current is induced in said conductor within the core.

Yes, been there, done that many years ago. But this is also not the same as the setup i posted from the website, as a toroid will generate say a CW north field, and a CCW south field within the windings. The windings passed through the toroids center are nothing more that a loosely coupled secondary winding, and nothing out of the ordinary.

So i do ask again, how does the below generate a current flow through the windings ?
And as the field wraps around the windings in both directions, how does the right hand rule know which way to send the current flow ?

Brad