The bearing motor

[tinman]

It means that two fields from two separate sources can add or completely cancel out and that is highly significant.

Put the two fields together and is everything still "uniform" or not?

Your analogy is no good, it doesn't even make sense.  As a result it falls apart.

Sorry, but I am starting to run out of gas.  If you are told your analogy is no good, one would hope that you would go back to it and try to figure out what could possibly be wrong with it and then tweak it and make it make sense.  Not everything is reversible like you are trying to imply.  However, if you are not willing to go back and re-examine your analogy with a critical eye and look for possible problems, then the only viable alternative is spoon-feeding.  It's not going to sink in like that so the ball is in your court.  You can look for flaws in your logic and try to fix things, or not.

I attached your graphic again.  Is the left grey arrow coming out of the page or going into the page?  This is an ongoing issue with you, not providing enough detail.  Are you supposed to be showing a homopolar motor or the grasshopper oscillator?   One more time, what you presented here is a mess where what the graphic is suggesting and your text do not jive, so I am not going to comment.  There are a handful of issues in your points here and without any resolution to those issues I won't comment.

Sometimes you need to take a break after you write something up.  Just wait a day and then reread your points and you might be somewhat shocked at how many things are either missing, or don't make sense, or are ambiguous.  I am a details person and you are not a details person.  It makes a technical discussion very difficult.

Again, I can only recommend the following:

1,  Obtain complete mastery over the way the homopolar motor works.
2.  Explain exactly how the swirling aquarium business works.3.  Then you are in a position to tackle the bearing motor and figure out exactly how it works.

MileHigh

I made it very clear MH as to what direction the arrow is pointing in my description. It would seem that you fail to realise that we are talking about a rotation here.
Quote: Now how be that, when apparently the two forces at right angles to the wire are in opposite directions
So,the original arrow shows a force that would push the wire away from us,and cause the magnet to spin in a cloclwise direction looking down on top of the magnet. So as i stated that the force on the other wire is in the opposite direction,this force would cause the magnet to spin anticlockwise looking down on top of the magnet.
I am not sure how that is not clear to you when you consider that the forces create rotation in this case.

I have done the aquarium test many time's--Have you forgot?.
Do you remember that i completely insulated the outer perimeter of the magnet,and the magnet still spun-->that one had many of you baffled-->back in Theo's thread it was.
Then i did the same test with an electromagnet,and there was no spin-->remember.?

[MileHigh]

I made it very clear MH as to what direction the arrow is pointing in my description. It would seem that you fail to realise that we are talking about a rotation here.

I told you that it's messed up.  The current directions in your diagram do not make a spinning motor, yet you claim it spins, and your added arrow in the diagram itself is ambiguous.  You are supposed to make the direction for the arrow clear in the diagram itself.  If you are not going to follow-up and at least have a look at what I am saying there is no point.

I have done the aquarium test many time's--Have you forgot?

Yes, I was aware of your testing but I did not really follow your experiments or watch your clips.   I simply asked you if you could explain what is observed in a typical Acca-type aquarium vortex clip, and I assume that your clips were very similar.   So in response to my question you don't answer it and instead make reference to your own tests.  That doesn't answer my question and I am not convinced that you can explain the infamous vortex in the aquarium.  I am simply asking you as a challenge and as a lead up to understanding the bearing motor.  I figure if you get the homopolar motor and the aquarium vortex stuff then you will be in a good position to tackle the ball bearing motor.  I honestly don't have a solid explanation for how the ball bearing motor works with the actual source for the torque nailed down and fully explained.

[MileHigh]

So,the original arrow shows a force that would push the wire away from us,and cause the magnet to spin in a cloclwise direction looking down on top of the magnet. So as i stated that the force on the other wire is in the opposite direction,this force would cause the magnet to spin anticlockwise looking down on top of the magnet.

The above is an example of your near-continuous shifting of gears and changing the subject matter or responding about subject B when the question was about subject A.  In a homopolar motor the magnet does not spin, the paperclip does the spinning.  This whole discussion has not been about spinning magnets at all.

Also I have been thinking about a homopolar type of setup where the wire remains stationary and the magnet does indeed spin.  My preliminary thoughts are that the magnet will spin but not because of some kind of a pushing force on the magnet due the force on the external wire.  It's more complicated than that and I believe the current has to flow through the cylindrical magnet itself for the magnet to spin.  You could have a very similar setup where there is no current flowing through the magnet itself which I believe will result in no magnet spinning.  Likewise, if the wires do make contact with the magnet then the actual reason for the magnet spinning has nothing to do with forces on the external wires.  All of this is with moderate to high confidence and if I had a setup I would do some tests to confirm or deny all of this as well as making a diagram to explain it.

So as you can see, the issue of the magnet in a homopolar motor spinning could be a whole new ball of wax with a completely different explanation for the process.  Hence the desire to stick with one subject at a time with no switching topics on the fly.  I am balking because now you are switching over to talking about spinning magnets and when you think of a homopolar motor you think about the spinning paperclip and not about a spinning magnet.

[tinman]

The above is an example of your near-continuous shifting of gears and changing the subject matter or responding about subject B when the question was about subject A.  In a homopolar motor the magnet does not spin, the paperclip does the spinning.  This whole discussion has not been about spinning magnets at all.

Well i dont know where you have been MH,but all the homopolar motors i have made have the magnet spining while the wire remains stationary.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s138-oe79_I

Also I have been thinking about a homopolar type of setup where the wire remains stationary and the magnet does indeed spin.  My preliminary thoughts are that the magnet will spin but not because of some kind of a pushing force on the magnet due the force on the external wire.  It's more complicated than that and I believe the current has to flow through the cylindrical magnet itself for the magnet to spin.  You could have a very similar setup where there is no current flowing through the magnet itself which I believe will result in no magnet spinning.  Likewise, if the wires do make contact with the magnet then the actual reason for the magnet spinning has nothing to do with forces on the external wires.  All of this is with moderate to high confidence and if I had a setup I would do some tests to confirm or deny all of this as well as making a diagram to explain it.

So as you can see, the issue of the magnet in a homopolar motor spinning could be a whole new ball of wax with a completely different explanation for the process.  Hence the desire to stick with one subject at a time with no switching topics on the fly.  I am balking because now you are switching over to talking about spinning magnets and when you think of a homopolar motor you think about the spinning paperclip and not about a spinning magnet.

Well,see there lies the problem.
I have all along been talking about the spining magnet homopolar motor,as it relates to the bearing motor,where thw wires dont spin,and the ball's(which may be the magnets)are spining.
I have also on many occasions mentioned Mag'e experiment with the rolling(spining)magnet,and stationary wires.
I think you got one thing in your head,and it stuck. While me and Mag's were refering to the version where the magnet is in motion.

[MileHigh]

You are right there is a problem.  This is bloody ridiculous so I am giving up.  The average person thinks about a spinning paper clip on top of an AA battery that is sitting on top of a cylindrical magnet when you say, "homopolar motor."   I did the YouTube search and the vast majority of of homopolar motors on the first two pages of search results are the spinning paper clip type.  There are some with spinning magnets also.

There are some with spinning magnets but what the hell are we agonizing about the Lorentz forces on the wires of the paper clip for if the wires don't even move?  That's what the force vectors on the wires are for - to explain what makes the paper clip spin.  Look at my attached diagram with the two wires that make contact with the cylindrical magnet and the subsequent discussion about the forces on the wires to make the paper clip spin.   If you are talking about a spinning magnet then you should be talking about explaining the forces on the magnet itself to make the magnet spin.

I annotated your graphic to make it fit what you are actually supposedly talking about.   Note the force vectors on the wires are removed because they have absolutely nothing to do with what you are talking about.  There must be a force on the magnet itself which you haven't discussed or tried to explain properly.  The current on the left wire is in the wrong direction and you never tried to correct it and in fact it would be in the wrong direction for a spinning magnet or for a spinning paper clip.  If you wanted to make what you were talking about clear you would have put an arrow on the magnet to show the fact that it is spinning as a standard accepted convention for drawings.

It's a mess Tinman and I am giving up.  You need to learn to communicate clearly and effectively.  Now that we know what you are talking about I challenge you to explain how the spinning-magnet version of a homopolar motor works.  Likewise I am not convinced that you can explain the swirling water in the many Acca aquarium videos.  I think both a worthwhile challenge for you if you want to pursue this exploration and learning experience before you address the bearing motor but it's up to you.  I am bowing out of this discussion.