Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board

[groot]

hello

Finally i got to do some tests of my own.
Aprox. 450khz  and 22.5volt 0.35 amp.  75 feet single wire transmission  .
At load ( small automotive light bulb )  22.5 v 0.75 amp .

I have failed to send surface wave . Tx was inside the building while testing so
hight of top load was limited. To me more important question is:
For surface wave do i need my ground to be in one vertical line with coil and top load??? Mine was not.
Is the image in the ground dependent on ground rod location ?
Next time how should i prepare myself? Having ground rod 3 or 4 feet away is ok or its no no??

Thx 

[ramset]

 Just a note
Previous experiments presented by gotoLuc  utilized parts and things on hand


When this topic was formally started orders were placed for components and pieces necessary to do a more focused or specific Zenneck topology as outlined in Wesley's many contributions .


ATM Luc has an issue with his computor crashing .(no net access ATM for his personal acc't)


He also has some other commitment (not FE related ..but definitely  "green theme " energy production)
Which he needs to get done these next few weeks .

[gotoluc]

Luc,

Is the conventional explanation that far fetched?

Tesla performed one-wire transmission of power via patent 593,138, and there is the occasional application in modern times as well using high voltage and earth as a return.

The Tesla method above involves using real earth grounding at each end, and yours does not, but high voltage and/or high frequency currents can find their way to earth ground one way or the other. The TX and RX sites can be many kms apart because the earth is one large ground plane.

I don't know if your TC's would operate properly if the terminal caps were earth grounded to their own separate ground points, but it would be interesting to see if that worked and also increased the efficiency of energy transfer.

Regarding the question of lifting the entire experiment away from the earth to prove or disprove the earth return theory, I would say would be difficult to achieve. I envision two helicopters, each suspending a TC about 1000 feet off the ground, separated by 1000 feet.

One thing to consider; why does your experiment require high voltage, and/or high frequency to work? High voltage is easy to imagine, because it can involve the ionization of air molecules to create a conductive path, but what about high frequency? If energy is not being radiated via E-M waves, then might there be another mechanism involved that is creating a return path? If the above helicopter experiment still worked, then I might be inclined to think so. For example, could air behave like a RCL transmission line at high enough frequencies?

Another thing to consider; if a longitudinal wave is being transmitted and received, why is one wire between the two sites required?

Well, I'm not the only one that finds your explanation of the TC top capacitance completing the current loop "through ground" to be far fetched.
I explained your hypothesis to the 87yo retired Lockheed Martin EE and Physicist that comes for coffee each morning and his reply was, I don't think so.
He hasn't yet found an acceptable explanation on how the current loop occurs.

To further prove or disprove the possibility of ground transmission, I put together a new test using 3/4" x 10 feet long copper pipes as grounding rods 15 feet apart to verify if it's even possible to use the ground to replace the single wire.


Test results: https://youtu.be/1D8N8Jq5mzs


Regards
Luc

[gyulasun]

Hi Luc,

Would you check the TX coil operating frequency by a frequency meter (if possible) to see if it changes when you ground its bottom
to the buried copper pipe versus the frequency when its bottom is connected to the 15' wire?

I know the oscillator automatically follows the TX coil resonant frequency but the RX coil cannot do this,  so in case the operating
TX frequency happens to change when you swap from the wire to the grounded copper pipe, the TX coil is happy to resonate at a
new frequency (the oscillator follows any change) but the RX coil may get detuned and this may be misleading when estimating
power transfer. 
I am not saying this is the main reason why the bulb is not lit at all when the grounding is used, just a headups that the RX coil
may get detuned.

It is possible you have already tested such detuning effect?

Thanks,
Gyula

[gotoluc]

Hi Luc,

Would you check the TX coil operating frequency by a frequency meter (if possible) to see if it changes when you ground its bottom
to the buried copper pipe versus the frequency when its bottom is connected to the 15' wire?

I know the oscillator automatically follows the TX coil resonant frequency but the RX coil cannot do this,  so in case the operating
TX frequency happens to change when you swap from the wire to the grounded copper pipe, the TX coil is happy to resonate at a
new frequency (the oscillator follows any change) but the RX coil may get detuned and this may be misleading when estimating
power transfer. 
I am not saying this is the main reason why the bulb is not lit at all when the grounding is used, just a headups that the RX coil
may get detuned.

It is possible you have already tested such detuning effect?

Thanks,
Gyula

Hi Gyula,

You have a good point there and I didn't think of confirming if the circuit frequency changed but I'll check that tomorrow.
However, I don't think it's a matter of the circuit detuning but rather a matter of introducing a resistance of 2k Ohm (I now measured) between the grounding rods compared to the 15 feet of 14 AWG wire which is only in the milli Ohms range.
So my thinking is. it's the grounds high resistance that's choking the power transfer.

The point of the demonstration was mostly to demonstrate how bad of a conductive path the ground is in my area which is the path poynt99 believes is how 15 watts worth of current is using as a return path through the ground between the TC top capacitance.
So if I can't transfer any power 15 feet away using 10 feet deep copper grounding rods, then how can the TC top capacitance do it?

I'll confirm if the circuit stays tuned to 1.1Mhz once connected to the grounding rod.

Regards
Luc