This ?thread? is about gaining an understanding of a given body of information and aims to develop from it a working conceptual design of the TPU in line with how Steven Mark originally conceived of and built his units.
Some may see the value in this approach, but many will scoff at the apparent absence of real bench work. To them I will only say; get over it or move along. Bench tests and verifications may be performed with this development as required (and possible) along the way.
Although the material indirectly supplied by SM is voluminous, very little of it is useable as a means to solving the TPU mystery. What can be used of it and other incidental sources will be, but the primary inspiration for this development is the material posted by Spherics at the overunity forum: http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,4297.0.html
The Spherics material can not be validated as authentic and true, but to date in my view it represents the most lucid description of how SM's TPU?s might work, and provides actual hardware descriptions which can be tested. Far from perfect and most likely incomplete, but it is the best starting point ever presented on the web. Sadly, Spherics focuses mainly on an improved model and exotic physics explanations without making much reference to how the original SM designs (in terms of hardware) fit into this picture.
This thread will mainly focus on reverse engineering the nuts and bolts of Spherics' material in an attempt to unravel the SM designs, but will inevitably cover aspects of the Spherics design as well. There will be occasion to scrutinize the theory Spherics put forth, with simplified or modified alternatives proposed.
Consider this a work in progress. New material and/or edits will be added as time and insights permit. It?s also not polished, nor error-free.
Thanks for the positive feedback guys!
I hope the minimum to come of this contribution will be to spark a few folks into thinking about this device in the context that it IS DOABLE. Optimistically, it will come close to establishing a sensible and practical framework for which to springboard off in the pursuit of cracking the TPU mystery. Ideally, the final revision of the document will contain all that is needed in terms of practical information to achieve a working build of any one of SM's TPU devices as well as the Spherics design as given.
Here is revision v1.2 (already posted): http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=item110
All document revisions after v1.2 will be posted in this thread.
Regards,
Poynt99
Revision v1.3
Revised opening paragraph Chapter 1
Added Chapter 2
Added Appendices A and B
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=item139
Regards.
Towards Realizing the TPU - Revision V1.4
- Updated Title and TOC
- Edited Introduction
- Edited "Optimum Pulse Setting" paragraph page 13
- Corrected Figures "2e" and "B" for proper NC7SZ74 flip-flop divide-by-2 operation (thank you peterae), added IRF820
- Added Appendices C (Coil Pulsing Methodology - to be added) and D (Saturated Inductive Switch (SIS) - to be added)
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=item216
Regards,
.99
PS. Topic is now unlocked. Feel free to post comments etc.
@ poynt99,
Thanks for making this thread and taking the time to go through a load of info for us.
Take care,
Michel
Thanks god for the first useful thread since months...
A.
Hey Poynt
It's great to see some work being done on this valuable document, and looks like it has some real tasty sections comming.
A very nice document, thanks for compiling this!!!
The harmonics SM was referring to was what Spherics referred to as the NMR of iron. Pulse the three coils at the NMR of iron and the overhead coil at 3x the other coils (harmonic).
Quote from: Super God on January 11, 2009, 07:38:16 PM
The harmonics SM was referring to was what Spherics referred to as the NMR of iron. Pulse the three coils at the NMR of iron and the overhead coil at 3x the other coils (harmonic).
Are you sure of that?
What is the NMR of iron? At what B-field strength? (it varies with the B-field).
.99
Quote from: poynt99 on January 12, 2009, 07:26:59 PM
Are you sure of that?
What is the NMR of iron? At what B-field strength? (it varies with the B-field).
.99
That part of the explanation didn't make a lot of sense. I think EMDevices had a lot to say about it when it was first posted. Maybe he just meant that frequency range, since it is a range based on the B-Field strength as .99 stated.
From:
http://www.crl.nitech.ac.jp/comp/papers/stephacova.pdf
Quote1. Introduction Nuclear magnetic resonance (NMR) is a method sensitive to the local properties of
magnetic materials. It has been applied to YIG containing various substituents or intrinsic substituting
defects on iron and yttrium cation sites [1â€"6]. NMR spectrum of 57Fe nuclei for an ideal YIG structure
contains a single d-line assigned to iron ions in tetrahedral crystallographic sites and two lines a1 and a2
having integral intensity ratio 1 : 3 which correspond to octahedral sites. Spectrum of a-sites splits into
two lines because of the magnetic nonequivalency of a-sites with respect to the [111] direction of magnetization.
Resonant frequencies are proportional to the local magnetic field at iron nuclei by gyromagnetic
ratio 1.377 MHz/T.
??
.99
From Becker:
http://books.google.com/books?id=lV387lG0u_kC&pg=PA29&lpg=PA29&dq=Larmor+frequencies+becker&source=web&ots=d6cEdzKWKu&sig=uc9vrLqKIHvROccPr-MG-5Jn3F8&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=2&ct=result#PPA382,M1
NMRF of Fe: 3.2378 MHz @ 2.35 T
Which works out exactly to the above 1.377MHz/T.
10k G = 1T
Earth's magnetic field varies between 0.3G to 0.6G; Ave = 0.45G
0.45 G = 45uT
The NMRF of Fe in earth's field ~ 62 Hz ?
.99
The question in my mind regarding iron's NMRF and the mention of it in the spherics posts has always been:
What does the NMR frequency of iron have to do with the pulsing frequency in spherics' design when he vehemently avoids the use of Fe, including the use of the iron delay coil?
.99
Quote from: poynt99 on January 12, 2009, 09:56:18 PM
The question in my mind regarding iron's NMRF and the mention of it in the spherics posts has always been:
What does the NMR frequency of iron have to do with the pulsing frequency in spherics' design when he vehemently avoids the use of Fe, including the use of the iron delay coil?
.99
(The iron delay was for a different design using different parameters.)
Maybe with this geometrical arrangement, NMR of iron works.
The delay coil's purpose was just to introduce a delay on the cheap. Any "slow" conductor should do the job.
Spherics spoke little of iron's effects and purpose (aside from providing a delay) in the device and I am not convinced that using its NMRF is integral to achieving a successful design, (geometric or otherwise) esp. since his tetrahedral device contains no iron. Fortunately, we have function generators/oscillators etc.
Spherics left us with some good material, but like all others, there are inconsistencies and gaps, unfortunately. I am not complaining though ;)
.99
btw, I suspect Steven "liked" 35.705 kHz for his 15" TPU, because using 35.7806 kHz is the exact frequency that would cause runaway.
Hello all,
maybe a copper + aluminium core would do the "job"??
Didnt SM told us to use this metals as cores??
Otto
I don't know if there is any type of metallic core in any of SM's devices, but we can't see inside all of them. There doesn't appear to be any core of metal description in the devices we can see. Maybe wattsup's new diagrams (when released) will reveal some new aspects of the devices.
Spherics didn't call for any cores at all for his version.
.99
Quote from: poynt99 on January 12, 2009, 11:07:34 PM
The delay coil's purpose was just to introduce a delay on the cheap. Any "slow" conductor should do the job.
Spherics spoke little of iron's effects and purpose (aside from providing a delay) in the device and I am not convinced that using its NMRF is integral to achieving a successful design, (geometric or otherwise) esp. since his tetrahedral device contains no iron. Fortunately, we have function generators/oscillators etc.
Spherics left us with some good material, but like all others, there are inconsistencies and gaps, unfortunately. I am not complaining though ;)
.99
btw, I suspect Steven "liked" 35.705 kHz for his 15" TPU, because using 35.7806 kHz is the exact frequency that would cause runaway.
The iron delay stuff has nothing to do with the tetrahedral device - it's apples and oranges.
Iron reacts to things in a way and is not beneficial for this application. That is all you need to know.
Are you building it or just agonizing over the details of how it might work?
Hello all,
maybe a fine guy can find the text where SM said in his way to use copper and aluminium as cores??
Sorry, I dont have the time to do it myself.
Otto
PS: maybe then some people would wake up??
Quote from: Grumpy on January 13, 2009, 12:14:43 AM
The iron delay stuff has nothing to do with the tetrahedral device - it's apples and oranges.
No argument here.
Although I did not make it clear, the iron reference was to spherics' mention of SM's use of it in his own devices. I do know the material fairly well btw ;)
One point I am trying to make is with reference to the Fe NMR frequency, and why it was specified for the tetra design. Maybe it is geometry, maybe not. Time will tell.
Quote
Are you building it or just agonizing over the details of how it might work?
The purpose of this thread and the document is outlined in the opening paragraphs. This includes discussion on all aspects of the TPU design and operation.
.99
Quote from: otto on January 13, 2009, 12:29:57 AM
Hello all,
maybe a fine guy can find the text where SM said in his way to use copper and aluminium as cores??
Sorry, I dont have the time to do it myself.
Otto
PS: maybe then some people would wake up??
I really doubt the use of aluminum or copper as a core. SM said that a large piece of aluminum placed near the device changed its operating characteristics to the point it would stop working. I did not find any reference to copper or aluminum cores.
.99
Hello all,
@point99
as said before, maybe somebody can find SMs words where he describes the cores in his fantastic way,ha,ha. I enjoy how he described a lot of the working properties of his devices. Yes, cpooer + aluminium cores are changing the operating characteristics of a TPU. I see this.
Heeeey is it so a big problem to try various cores?
I tried a Metglas core, a copper core, an Aluminium core, an iron core, combinations of all mentioned cores....that are all 5 minutes tests!!
Otto
Quote from: poynt99 on January 13, 2009, 12:58:18 AM
No argument here.
Although I did not make it clear, the iron reference was to spherics' mention of SM's use of it in his own devices. I do know the material fairly well btw ;)
One point I am trying to make is with reference to the Fe NMR frequency, and why it was specified for the tetra design. Maybe it is geometry, maybe not. Time will tell.
The purpose of this thread and the document is outlined in the opening paragraphs. This includes discussion on all aspects of the TPU design and operation.
.99
The delay coil is for an other design as said by Grumpy. The delay coil was a cheap way to produce a signal time delay. BUT the iron was contra productive. It caused huge eddy current problems and destroyed the patterns. But they found out a way not to destroy the patterns, so the device is working with the delay coil near the control coils.
A.
Quote from: poynt99 on January 13, 2009, 12:58:18 AM
No argument here.
Although I did not make it clear, the iron reference was to spherics' mention of SM's use of it in his own devices. I do know the material fairly well btw ;)
One point I am trying to make is with reference to the Fe NMR frequency, and why it was specified for the tetra design. Maybe it is geometry, maybe not. Time will tell.
The purpose of this thread and the document is outlined in the opening paragraphs. This includes discussion on all aspects of the TPU design and operation.
.99
He said:
QuoteThe frequency should be a harmonic of the NMR of iron.
I don't think it matters which harmonic, and expect that higher harmonics would produce more stuff.
A better question is: why can you place two rods of copper formed into 3/4 circles (270 degrees) in the field and measure substantial current and voltage?
@Grumpy HUEG MAGNETIC FIELD!!1111!
Don't forget the the iron delay coil caused the "kick" to appear on the scope when he trimmed it down in length! It seems simple to get a kick after reading Spherics' explanation. I even had an email from him explaining even more. Would you like me to post it?
I'll post it right now as a matter of fact:
Spherics:
Get 4 pingpong balls. Place 3 on a table all touching. Place the 4th on top of the 3 pingpong balls so it touches all the other balls. This defines 4 locations where you can place 4 solenoids pointing towards the center of this structure and guarantee that all 4 coils are equal distance from all the other coils.
With HCP if you pick any ball it touches the maximum number of balls around it which is 12. If you consider waves moving out from a point source they do so in a perfect sphere if there are no other forces acting. So if you want to influence the ether you need to do so in a way that the waves you create in the ether are perfectly timed in relation to each other. With FCC however if you pick a ball and pick all the balls touching that ball you'll find all the balls are not equidistance from each other, their distances apart are different. This make timing of pulses much more difficult because the waves will reach the other coils at different times.
The ether is the medium out of which everything, all elements, is made. Heat, cold are merely ether waves. Why do some elements react and release heat and other react and release cold ? Why are some elements inert ? Matter is spherical waves of different frequencies and complexities. Different elements have different frequencies. Elements whose frequencies are harmonically related can interfere constructively and destructively resulting in another stable spherical wave of another frequency and complexity. As a result of the interacting waveforms other ether waves are generated and propogated outwards this is the heat and cold. The ether itself has a consistent ripple which interacts with all the spherical waveforms of matter and effectively adds energy into the spherical waves keeping them going. This is why electrons appear to orbit with perpetual motion. Of course electrons don't really exist! Observed electrons are merely the artefact of observing an oscillating wave with another thing made of oscillating waves.
Everything is a wave. The source that keeps the ripple going in the ether is unknown, what the ether IS, is unknown.
Light is a wave.
I paraphrase but "In the beginning was nothing and God said let their be light..."
Can be seen to literally mean "In the beginning was 'ether' and God said let their be waves"
And the idea that God is in everything has a new twist if you believe the ether is the mind of God.
Dont get me wrong - I'm spiritual - not a bible thumping religious nut - I just believe that hand-me-down stories tell more than they let on.
For example read the description of the ark of the covenant in the light of it being an electrical device!!
Why 12 hours in a day, 60 minutes in an hour, 360 degrees in a circle, ALL of which are conincidently divisible by 12 ( maximum number of balls that touch a sphere), and 6 (maximum number of balls that touch a sphere in any plane going through a sphere) ?
Why is there a desert in the Middle East that has a continuous thick layer of glass buried within it that is 10 of kilometers wide ?
Where the isotopes and purity indicate a nuclear device fused the sand ?
Why does the Indian Ramayana, Marabharata describe the effect of nuclear missiles when it was written hundreds of years ago ?
My understanding is Steven Mark was developing his spherical 3d sound system. In general we can place the location of sound because of frequency shifting of moving sound; the doppler effect, the phase shifting of sound because a wave from a point source on your left side, has less distance to travel to your left ear than to travel to your right ear, sound attenuation and frequency suppression (apparently the sounds from different directions hit the ear and ear canal in different ways that cause certain bands of frequencies to be subtly suppressed - I don't confess to understand how it does this!).
Obviously ideas on faking 3D sound placement require electronics to subtly alter phasing etc. High quality voice coils on speakers can be wound in a bifilar fashion and can be considered aircore type coils. He noticed an unusual frequency peak in a spectrum anlyser when pulsing the bifilar with two similar waveforms... like many inventions start with the phrase 'that's really strange why did it do that'. An unusual freq. peak ON TOP of what was expected indicates some sort of incoming energy. The rest is how to utilise the effect to extract the energy in such a way that you can use some of the extracted energy to make the event that caused the initial energy bigger. i.e. A positive feedback loop.
Got to go!
Quote from: Super God on January 13, 2009, 10:31:55 AM
@Grumpy HUEG MAGNETIC FIELD!!1111!
Don't forget the the iron delay coil caused the "kick" to appear on the scope when he trimmed it down in length! It seems simple to get a kick after reading Spherics' explanation. I even had an email from him explaining even more. Would you like me to post it?
The iron delay was only used in the bifilar arrangement.
Emails are private, but thanks anyway.
So, why can you place two copper rods, formed into a 270 degree arc, in the field and measure substantial voltage and current (in the field generated in the tetrahedral device)?This is the basis of "induction", how it really occurs.
Anyone?
I have done many tests with all sorts of pulsings, some with my computer audio sound card connected too two mosfets that pulsed dc into all sorts of coils. Even direct pulsing with the audio or FGs.
When he says "two similiar waveforms", this is what I have found. Take any coil, pulse it with two same audio frequencies to find the best resonance or voltage rise off the secondary, then drop one frequency by 1 hertz and shift it out of phase by at least 6.84 degrees and you will create real havoc and stronger voltage rises. lol
All the audio frequency control is done with a computer program. You can open more then one frequency generator program at one time so you can have more then two frequencies if you want. This may be good for initial @Spherics control tests. The limitations is 20khz. The same thing happens with two FGs. I think the talk about not going onto the perfect frequency or the coil will dissintegrate is a misnomer or disinformation. The fact is not that there is disentegration but being at the resonance frequency is not the best or most productive point. It is slightly off resonance that you get the stronger outputs. It's as if the whole cadance of the frequency changes with a punch as the main force and the frequency is riding inside the punch. Geez, or kick.
One frequency creates a static resonant condition, two or more frequencies simulate dynamic movement.
Quote from: wattsup on January 13, 2009, 12:45:37 PM
I have done many tests with all sorts of pulsings, some with my computer audio sound card connected too two mosfets that pulsed dc into all sorts of coils. Even direct pulsing with the audio or FGs.
When he says "two similiar waveforms", this is what I have found. Take any coil, pulse it with two same audio frequencies to find the best resonance or voltage rise off the secondary, then drop one frequency by 1 hertz and shift it out of phase by at least 6.84 degrees and you will create real havoc and stronger voltage rises. lol
All the audio frequency control is done with a computer program. You can open more then one frequency generator program at one time so you can have more then two frequencies if you want. This may be good for initial @Spherics control tests. The limitations is 20khz. The same thing happens with two FGs. I think the talk about not going onto the perfect frequency or the coil will dissintegrate is a misnomer or disinformation. The fact is not that there is disentegration but being at the resonance frequency is not the best or most productive point. It is slightly off resonance that you get the stronger outputs. It's as if the whole cadance of the frequency changes with a punch as the main force and the frequency is riding inside the punch. Geez, or kick.
One frequency creates a static resonant condition, two or more frequencies simulate dynamic movement.
OK wattsup, what is occuring with the two pulses, same parameters, one in each wire of a piece of zip cord, one slightly delayed?
Maybe a picture will help:
.99's doc list a quote from "S" that says the aether field spirals around the toroidal conductor and creates longitudinal waves along the conductor.
Clarification:
Induction by longitudinal waves is the "cold current".
Induction by the spirals is conventional current.
Much more to it than that, but that is the gist of it.
==================================================================
Back to the question:
QuoteSo, why can you place two copper rods, formed into a 270 degree arc, in the field and measure substantial voltage and current (in the field generated in the tetrahedral device)?
Answer: I think these are to be placed horizontally, with their center coinciding with the center of the toroidal , or where the toroid would be located. No length is given for the arcs, but I expect a difference in potential between top and bottom of the vortex. As the vortex rotates, current is converted from the potential energy of the aether to kinetic energy in the conductor. Remebmer from Wilbert Smith's work that a magnetic field is the curl of the tempic field and by rotating this field of aether, we just created a curl which is of course inductive.
Hello all,
Yes Loner, some plastics can also do a great job in TPUs.
Otto
Quote from: Loner on January 14, 2009, 01:13:21 AM
Just 2 Cents. Remember to "Forget" those "Lines of Force" patterns for magnetic fields.
They are NOT straight lines. One must keep that in mind if using standard induction for
the TPU device.... (This seems to be ignored a lot, lately.) That's the simplest way I
can direct some to the effects of metals AND wire layouts. (Actually, not just metals...)
Not sure where "lines of force" was referenced in all of this.
As .99 poynted out, this isn't standard induction by a physical moving magnet or magnetic field created by current in a coil.
@All TPUers
Reading Poynt99s great doc prompted me to think this, i write it here just in case it may help, I´m not saying it´s a solid idea, just that it´s an idea:
When attempting replication of an SM style TPU, it might be worthwhile to wind a fourth control coil, but have this coil the same diameter as the collector coil and place it just above the collector coil in the same orientation as the collector coil. (Could explain OTPU config). It might also work if its circumference ran through the inside of the existing 3 control coils, resting right next to the collector but then maybe the close inductive coupling to the collector would dampen it too much and waste its energy in the collectors load?
As with the other coils make this 4th coil bifilar and tune it for max kick response using iron delay. This 4th coil would give height to the vortex, coaxing fresh aether into the circulation. Without it a vortex might not form but instead a stagnant rotating aether toroid.
This 4th control coil would need third harmonic kick freq. the other 3 coils at fundamental freq with 120 degree phasing. Just like spherics timing. SM could have established 120deg phasing by using delay networks on his master oscillator. The 4th vertical coil above the collector could then be timed by having each of the 3 horizontal coils powering through it as Poynt99 suggests.
I also think incredibly sharp and short pulses of high current to the kick coils may be key, so charged 400V low ESR electrolytic cap through very fast switch with saturatable reactor just before kick coil to get as fast a rise as possible.
Seperate Questions)
Has anyone tried to tune a bifilar kick coil using iron delay, and have they seen the mag field pulse be optimised this way when scoping a secondary pickup coil with resistive load attached?
I ask because I just got some nice thin iron wire for delay (flower wire) and plan to do this experiment with fast and sharp pulses of 64V to start with into a 50 turn aircore bifilar with a 50 turn pickup a few inches away wound on the same tubular form, it would be great to hear others methods and results in this area. Like how does the optimum mag flux kick come about when tuning, is it very peaky? Could it be missed by tuning the delay coil too coarsely?
I tried the iron delay of several feet and trimmed it down without success. I have a 200 foot spool now, but have not tried it again. If just a delay is required then there are other ways to do that.
Quote from: Grumpy on January 14, 2009, 10:53:10 PM
I tried the iron delay of several feet and trimmed it down without success. I have a 200 foot spool now, but have not tried it again. If just a delay is required then there are other ways to do that.
@Grumpy, Another quick question: what waveform type did you use to power the delayed bifilar in that experiment?
Quote from: Super God on January 13, 2009, 10:34:29 AM
I'll post it right now as a matter of fact:
Spherics:
My understanding is Steven Mark was developing his spherical 3d sound system. In general we can place the location of sound because of frequency shifting of moving sound; the doppler effect, the phase shifting of sound because a wave from a point source on your left side, has less distance to travel to your left ear than to travel to your right ear, sound attenuation and frequency suppression (apparently the sounds from different directions hit the ear and ear canal in different ways that cause certain bands of frequencies to be subtly suppressed - I don't confess to understand how it does this!).
Obviously ideas on faking 3D sound placement require electronics to subtly alter phasing etc. High quality voice coils on speakers can be wound in a bifilar fashion and can be considered aircore type coils. He noticed an unusual frequency peak in a spectrum anlyser when pulsing the bifilar with two similar waveforms... like many inventions start with the phrase 'that's really strange why did it do that'. An unusual freq. peak ON TOP of what was expected indicates some sort of incoming energy. The rest is how to utilise the effect to extract the energy in such a way that you can use some of the extracted energy to make the event that caused the initial energy bigger. i.e. A positive feedback loop.
Got to go!
More golden information! S is accurate in what he says there about the 3-D methodology.
I was going to save this for the document, but since sg brought it up here in S's message, I'll capitulate a little.
In the early to mid 1990's I was fascinated with and in development of my own 3-D sound system of sorts. In the end time and money was lacking so the project was not completed. In the process however, much was learned about this subject.
True 3-D from two speakers is a two-step process:
1) Eliminate the inter-aural (ear-to-ear) cross-talk, and
2) process the audio in the recording stage to include "spatial" information.
I suspect Steven's goal with his speaker research was to accomplish step 1). It is quite possible that his "Audio-Spatial Effects" patent was an attempt at step 2).
Dramatic results in the audio listening experience can be achieved even by step 1) alone. In order to cancel, eliminate, or minimize inter-aural cross-talk, trans-aural (across the head) correction is applied. When sound from the left speaker reaches the right ear, this is unwanted crosstalk, and in order to cancel it we apply an
inverted, filtered (HRTF), and time-delayed version of the left speaker audio through the right speaker, so that the two sounds effectively cancel when they reach the right ear canal.
There are a few ways of accomplishing this and here is one from Polk Audio:
http://www.polkaudio.com/downloads/whitepapers/SDA_WhitePaper.pdf
I suspect what Steven was working on was a dual voice-coil, single driver version. One voice coil is used for normal channel audio, and the other is for the trans-aural corrected audio from the opposite channel.
In my document I outline a circuit and experiment to find the kick and/or comp field as best I currently understand them. What I did not mention is the suggestion to pulse the second coil in the pair not only in a delayed fashion, but also inverted 180º (switch the leads), even though spherics stated not to. It can not hurt to try both ways imho, because Steven likely did try it.
The delay time setting is based on the time required for sound to travel across the human face to reach the opposite ear. This inter-aural delay time equates typically to about
400us based on a nominal size head.
.99
Further 3-D Sound Reading:
http://profs.sci.univr.it/~dafx/Final-Papers/pdf/Jost-Jot2.pdf
http://www.google.com/patents?id=mMwOAAAAEBAJ&dq=6643375
http://www.google.com/patents?id=UOcOAAAAEBAJ&dq=6577736
http://www.media.mit.edu/~billg/docs/TR-342.ps.gz
http://books.google.com/books?id=h90HIV0uwVsC&pg=PA165&lpg=PA165&dq=distance++ears+transaural&source=bl&ots=diw9TIv6gX&sig=SoRhCPxS64jyYGclv9mbAqWko9Y&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=4&ct=result#PPA165,M1
http://homepage.mac.com/cooperbauck/cbpublications/documents/XTCwhitepaper.pdf
http://www.headwize.com/tech/sibbald_tech.htm
Guys,
I'm lost.I can't follow that multi-pages extremely long threads about SM TPU, finally finding that no real good information is there. Why not put a sticky thread to summarize all findings up today ? That way everybody could just realize if that topic is of some interest for them.
Reading all topics is mostly a waste of time.
My little small advice : drop all electronics, think about tips Steven Mark gave us. I see many fighting with more and more complex oscillators trying to put 3 frequencies or harmonics into ring without results.
Ah...what a waste of time.... :-[
Quote from: poynt99 on January 15, 2009, 12:39:16 AM
The delay time setting is based on the time required for sound to travel across the human face to reach the opposite ear. This inter-aural delay time equates typically to about 400us based on a nominal size head.
Or the circumference of the TPU?
Great info .99
P.S.
My wife just pointed out that the delay for my head will probably be around 800us ;D
Don't waste your time please. If you had read Steven Mark tips carefully you would realize some similarities between TPU and cyclone.Check it.We are deceived about Coriolis force being not real obviously...
Quote from: Yucca on January 14, 2009, 11:05:45 PM
@Grumpy, Another quick question: what waveform type did you use to power the delayed bifilar in that experiment?
square wave
Quote from: Grumpy on January 13, 2009, 11:01:45 PM
.99's doc list a quote from "S" that says the aether field spirals around the toroidal conductor and creates longitudinal waves along the conductor.
Clarification:
Induction by longitudinal waves is the "cold current".
Induction by the spirals is conventional current.
Much more to it than that, but that is the gist of it.
==================================================================
Back to the question:
Answer: I think these are to be placed horizontally, with their center coinciding with the center of the toroidal , or where the toroid would be located. No length is given for the arcs, but I expect a difference in potential between top and bottom of the vortex. As the vortex rotates, current is converted from the potential energy of the aether to kinetic energy in the conductor. Remember from Wilbert Smith's work that a magnetic field is the curl of the tempic field and by rotating this field of aether, we just created a curl which is of course inductive.
Thank you Grumpy.
I will be compiling a list of user's insights etc. (such as this) that help answer some of the yet unanswered questions from spherics' posts for later thought and possible incorporation in the document.
.99
Is anyone willing to show what real "kicks" look like on a scope?
Is anyone willing to provide details for the conversion process and experiments to produce this effect?
(just conversion, not magnification)
I'm thinking about it...
Didn't we try that one already?
Nobody is paying attention and eventually your being accused for not sharing.
It seems this topic is running in a circle.
People come and people go asking the same questions over and over again.
There is no end to it.
Quote from: -[marco]- on January 15, 2009, 10:53:33 AM
Didn't we try that one already?
Nobody is paying attention and eventually your being accused for not sharing.
It seems this topic is running in a circle.
People come and people go asking the same questions over and over again.
There is no end to it.
Ha! Sure. Without a sticky page with a list of propositions and progresses nobody is willing to look at all posts. Single "The TPU uncovered" topic has 107 pages !
Poynt99 is compiling the info into a single document - not all of the posts, just the pertinent details.
I asked about "kick" details just to see if anyone will up the ante.
Marco, you are correct, but Poynt99, Peterae, and a few others are actively experimenting. Others are quietly in the background, but are still working.
I am debating with myself on wether it is safe to post details of conversion without details of magnification. Tesla already detailed conversion very well - of course no one sees it as that, but his images of AC and DC devices utilizing spark gap conversion are just that. If you can't get this far then magnification doesn't matter anyway and the tech is safe from those lacking the knowledge and skill.
The tetrahedral device must perform this conversion as well or it will not work, it just needs to be pointed out and explained, but only up to that point. Magnification is another matter and where one get's into trouble.
Maybe I am just tired of the BS.
I found and threaded this:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=5417.msg122224#msg122224
I felt at the time and still feel this to be a sound basis underlying the use of copper without the technical details of any ou device but its just the basic material and small application.
I asked it to be stickied but it didn't happen.
Then we can pick up copper and turn it into a device.
Otherwise reading, contemplating, winding, pulsing, posting is way out of context with a finished goal. I have alot of coils in two camps. Don't work, and hold promise. A slim goal is to recognized with insight to avoid burnout. I just got over a year of it and personally it is technically non productive. But self helpwise it is necessary. Every so often when I hit a slump I go view my coil and test inventory and ponder over the different configuration with the latest block of info in my head. I always come away fruitful, even at the smallest insight. I can't believe I did that built and tested that back then!
Ya gotta keep hitting yourself with 'It's mine, it's mine, it's mine". Because the majority of you have questions prior to burnout because of the isolation encompassing this technology. Where else are the answers? College, work, public service companies? When you look at the great men of this technology they were and are somewhat alone and obscure. In this involvement you will rock the boat of the sluggards around you. You think starting out alone is tough? Just wait.
Nobody is ever finished and the rest don't understand.
If you build you need the rest and if you don't build you are the rest.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=2535.msg34869#msg34869
--giantkiller. If you are capable, take it easy on yourself.
Thanks GK, but I have never been able to integrate Dave L's explanation with what I know.
Thanks GK, that is marvelous! In my opinion it is very useful.
Kacor
Hi, I am new here, although, I have been reading the threads here for about 3 years, so I am pretty familiar with most thoughts circulating in the overunity world, What I'm thinking is we need some new thoughts and ways of looking at the SM TPU. My first thought is why do supposed replications of Steve Marks TPU look totally unlike anything SM showed. Second thought why does SM's TPU's look exactly like the Devices in Tesla's patent? Steve marks said he really was duplicating Tesla's patent. If we look at Tesla's patent 381,970 Lo and behold it looks exactly like SM's TPU. Now lets do some thought experiments, what this patent is is a rotating magnetic field power distribution device, according to Tesla. He says it resembles a transformer and yes has some transformer action, but what makes it different is he is operating it in a non-transformer way. This device is similar to his rotating magnetic field induction motors but he has eliminated the spinning armature. In his patent he is using, to keep it simple, a 2 phase rotating field. 2 phases 180 degrees out of phase drive the 4 field coils wound first on a steel wire core. In his patent he uses what he calls an exciter to operate the the 4 input coils, at 180 degrees out of phase. Note he calls it an exciter not a generator, he doe's not say all the power output of the device comes from the exciter the output comes from the rotating field. A non-transformer way of operating a transformer. As a generators output is dependant on the speed of rotation so is the output of this device. A input frequency of 5 to 6 KHZ has the same effect as turning a generator at 5000-6000 RPM. The four input coils which are the field magnets of this device can be likened to a car alternator. The power required by the armature coil to energize the alternator is not equal to the total amount of power produced, otherwise the alternator would not produce any usable energy it is the rotating of that magnetic field that produces the output energy. Yes input power is required to rotate it, but being the wires don't move in this device there should be little CEMF in it. A device of this type running at 5KHz which is an audio frequency as SM states would have a slight vibration and gyroscopic feel to it. It also would have a primarily DC output with some 5 KHz hash on it. Phasing, frequency all audio things as SM said. Obviously now days we would not need Tesla's exciter as we can easily generate two 5 KHz sine wave signals 180 degrees apart electronically. If it produces more energy then it uses obviously some could be fed back to keep it operating as in SM's TPU, a small start up battery would be all that was needed. In my thinking these thoughts seem more in line with Steve Marks and what he said and what his device looked like. But you don't have to believe me.
Just trying to input something new.
Room3327
@all
I have started that route , in the jt tread,i have a small Tesla pat transformer(even posted pic), Steven never said that it had no battery.Tesla used the motor as a switching/timing device.Its not tuned yet.
Mk1,
Are you replying to my post, if so, the motor you are referring to in Tesla's patent is not a motor. It is an exciter for the device which must be powered or driven by some other means. The rotation of it (by some other means) provides a dual sine wave output 180 degrees out of phase with each other to drive the rotating magnetic field which actually produces the output of the device. Before we get off on wild tangents here we should be looking much closer at these patents and trying to understand them. Most people here seem to be trying to make mountains out of mole hills and complicating things way past the point of sanity. If this thing is as complicated as people here are trying to make it, How did Steve Marks ever come up with it, because his intelligence was never that great.
Room3327
Hi Room3327 & All
Thanks you for the new thoughts, we need these always. I don't want to offend you but I have to respond a few things.
1./ 6000 RPM (revolution per minute) is only 100 Hz
2./ SM really mentioned a slight vibration but in my opinion its frequency is much more lower than 5-6 kHz. I never tried but I don't think we can feel so high vibration by hand.
3./ Tesla's exciter in my sight is normal permanent magnetic motor/generator with one difference: he used double commutator. I think it is better than what we use it nowadays, because one can easily separate the BEMF.
Kacor
Chef,
Yes it would be 180 degrees out of phase in order to produce a smoothly rotating magnetic field using 2 phases and not 3. If you were to use 3 phases to produce a smoothly rotating mag field they would need to be 120 degrees apart.
And no I do not personally know Steve Marks and I was not putting down his intelligence, I was raising the intelligence of many of the posters here who go into ideas of exotic metals and operating principles that I do not believe were a part of what Marks did.
Kacor,
1. No offense taken, and yes you are right, I made a mistake and did not calculate rpm correctly. Lets see if 1 cycle of input causes the magnetic field to revolve 1 full turn and it is running at 5 KHz it would go around 5000 times per second times 60 seconds in a minute that appears to be 300,000 RPM. A little higher then I thought but great for producing energy.
2. I don't know the answer to the vibration question, not till I get a version built.
3. Look at the drawings in Tesla's Patent and Read the text, Yes it is a PM motor/gen but it purpose and intent in the patent is to be used as a generator not a motor so it has to be driven by an external rotating source. As a gen. its purpose is to generate 2 outputs that are 180 degrees apart ( 1 output is at maximum while the other is at minimum ) these 2 outputs drive the 4 coils in 2 pairs creating a smoothly rotating magnetic field (at 300,000 apparently RPM) in the toroid. Also reading the Cancelling Lenz's law-methods thread will give more in-site. If the coils are not matched very well there will be more losses caused by this according to Tesla.
Thank you all
Please don't take me wrong
I am only here to help.
Room3327
Chef,
You know what, you may be right, I argued with myself about that point 90 or 180, Tesla says 1 is at maximum while the other is at minimum. Studying the exciter I think you are right I think it puts out 2 signals 90 degrees out of phase with each other. But this still doesn't change the operating principle of this device i.e. smoothly rotating magnetic field cutting the output windings with nothing else moving, no wire, magnets, or steel moving in relation to any other. If operated at say 400 Hz, which steel can handle quite, well that would translate to an RPM of 400x60=24,000 RPM. If it has very little CEMF as I suspect, it should be able to produce a lot of output.
Room3327
Chef,
Could be he realized something that was not in the patent, but he probably built the patent in order too realize it.
Tesla shows the output coil not as a single coil but as 4 separate coils, with 4 separate outputs. If the magnetic field of the core is rotating the points of high magnetic intensity, that point of hi. intens. will pass through 1 of the 4 output coils expanding the field in that coil as it travels around the core, expanding the magnetic field inside a coil will induce power into it. Moving the same magnetic field form one end of a stationary inductor to the other won't do a thing as you say. And yes Tesla also mentions there would be some regular transformer action.
P.S. I don't know all there is to know about this, I too am still trying to figure it out like everyone else here, but it just seems to me we all need some new directions to go.
Room3327
@Room3327
All i can say is that there is 8 coils 90 degrees apart,i am building one are you , if you what to argue on detail, go ahead.
Its time that could be spent working with each other .That's my point, that motor action is a switching device (you may call it what you want but it dose operate the phases), A magnetic core only works on ac/pulsed dc, its transformer you still need to power it.
I am just stating in simple terms , for every one , make it as complicated as you want.
Edit: Tesla's goodies are not referred to in there patents because it would not get approved by law , you will only get those by building .
Back then there was no transistor or tubes 555 Or magnetron to switch things.
QuoteAll i can say is that there is 8 coils 90 degrees apart,i am building one are you , if you what to argue on detail, go ahead.
Its time that could be spent working with each other .That's my point, that motor action is a switching device (you may call it what you want but it dose operate the phases), A magnetic core only works on ac/pulsed dc, its transformer you still need to power it.
I am just stating in simple terms , for every one , make it as complicated as you want.
Edit: Tesla's goodies are not referred to in there patents because it would not get approved by law , you will only get those by building .
Mk1,
I am not here to argue with you, sorry if you got that impression. I do believe detail is something a bit missing around here though.
Now trying to work with you, yes Tesla's patent has 8 coils total and I think you are right placing them at 90 degrees apart, by doing so I would think transformer action is minimized. The thing you call a motor is definatly operating the phases, 4 of the 8 coils, arranged as 2 pair. Tesla called it an exciter, it is his patent. I don't know why you think I don't, but yes I believe this works on sine wave AC. If what I am saying is to complicated, I just don't know what to say to this. I think it is great that you are building this keep up the good work!
@Room3327
Start building , i replaced the iron with a iron powder toroid on my toy version to get the basic , and found a lot of stuff, come joint us !
But the core it self has some mystery left to understand, the magnetic current can do work , don't trust your meter try a load on it.
Mk1,
Thank you, and I'm working as fast as I can.
Quote from: Chef on January 21, 2009, 04:58:39 PM
In a normal case, between the control coils, and the output coil, there is no induction, doesn't matter how fast we rotate the vector with the control coils.You can see, Tesla wrapped the output coils, around the control coils, there is a normal transformer action in this case. SM used the output coils as a core, and wrapped the control coils around it. I don't think so, SM just copied that Tesla patent. I think he realized something, what is not in these patents.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=1872.msg21437#msg21437
Boom?
--giantkiller.
Giant,
You have a very impressive amount of knowledge and ability and I bow to that. My thought on this though is that Tesla did not have the knowledge that you have had to draw upon i.e. modern day electrical engineering. It would have been quite hard for Tesla to do the things you have done. Just getting his hands on a signal generator much less a multichannel multiphase one would have sent him over the edge of happiness. I believe it is concensus here that Steve Marks was duplicating Tesla's patent and considering his TPU looks exactly like the drawings in Tesla's patent it makes sense. Now SM had access to much of our modern day electronics knowledge that Tesla did not. Tesla used a rotary device to provide the drive to his 'System of electrical distribution' that he called an exciter. This device puts out 2 AC sine wave signals 90 degrees out of phase. SM did not have to use this device in his time as the electronics to do the same thing existed by then and the audio world was a good place to find them. I am only suggesting that maybe we should take a simpler look at how SM's TPU was built. If the only stumbling block to what I am saying is that a static mag field in the core of an inductor will not induce a voltage but everything else is good we could just be missing 1 thing maybe that is not in the patent.
Now I am going to suggest something and I may be wrong, but here goes. In an Inductor moving a magnet from one end of the core to the other will not induce a voltage as regardless of the movement the field is static in the core, it is not moving in and out against the coil wires to generate any voltage. But in Tesla's patent he has broken the output up into 4 separate outputs. Now if we apply a rotating magnetic field that has 2 rotating points of high magnetic intensity, as he has done, on opposite sides, these 2 points of hi. intens. now enter and leave the output coils completely, briefly delivering a pulse of power that would show itself as a pulse on top of any transformer action occurring, and very possibly the very kicks that SM talked about. What about 3 output coils being used? I would have to assume that SM used 1 of the four output coils to feed back for operating it and the other 3 for output. I may be way off base but at least it is another way of looking at this. I never noticed SM having to shield his devices and he readily touched and picked them up. Just seems very different to me then what you are doing.
If you have a generator and your prime mover goes way fast you increase the ouput of the generator and decrease the torque required to produce the same amount of ouput. Now at some point your rotating magnetic field producer is gonna blow apart. So the good ole boys said we can just increase the exciter flux and keep that rpm down and boost up that old torque requirement and sell us some coal. I don't think this was Tesla's idea of efficiency. How fast can a rotating magnetic field go before it blows apart?
@GK
Do you have the patent #for the one Tesla refers to his torroidal generator as "having an infinite # of commutator segments". Preciate it if you can post it.
Sparks,
I don't think GK is on line. The patent # would be 381970.
Thanks room 332
There was a patent after 381970 where there is no armature at all. Tesla's and Steven Marks device are the only ones I have ever seen that used windings like that. Alternators and electric motors all use their coils facing the rotor. I believe that this was done simply because that is the way dc motors were made. I use to test ac motor stators for lamination integrity. We would take a loop and wind it like the 381970 was wound. Then we would hit it with highfrequency and monitor the waveform on an oscilliscope. Any eddy currents where the laminations had shorted would show up on the scope as the magnetic field advanced around the stator not out through the airgap like nowadays induction motors. The only motor that utilizes the bfield of a solenoid is a shaded pole motor. This was produced because they are real easy to manufacture and wind. The magnetism does advance through the core but again the rotor only sees a very slow magnetic field flux shift that is resisted by the air gap.
Sparks,
There are 2 patents after this that show the same kind of device and winding #382282 and #390721. # 382282 shows the same kind of device with a rotor at the center, that may be what you are referring to. Sounds like it was a fun job.
Thankyou I'm checking them out. Tesla stated in one of his patents that it would be a good idea to wrap some iron wire around the whole deal also. This is starting to sound like what they do with flybacktransformers. They put steel on the outside of the copper too. They also put breaks in the core to make sure that the magnetic domains don't get sticky and dump the polarization. The rotating field cant rotate if you turn the ring into a speaker magnet.
@all
Try to check all of Tesla patent , most of the good stuff is on more then one patents, he patented parts that was easier to pass approval.
Try google patent, I my self saved all of them in a secure location, it a mater of time before they cut the access to the documents.There is also a list on keelynet.
Good luck!
Mark
Hi, I am here. And yes those are the 2 patents.
In case some of you haven't read All I posted here goes. My first weeks in I went through Tesla's patents. When I saw the 381970 ring and the connections I dug further into how he made his core. Laminated iron. So that is where I started. I then printed all of his patents out and put the diagrams in front. I am visual. At the time I didn't realize the importance of what the action was.
I was heading towards the Very Large Array in Arizona, designing my controller on a laptop as a passenger thinking this was the most coolest thing that could be done. I was very wrong. I did get it simulated while on the road.
After we reached the VLA and got checked in my buddy asked me if I wanted to watch the movie Contact. Sure! Again.
When the movie got to the point of the transparent plates as a cube my jaw dropped in total ectasy. The patent diags hooked togther too. I was jumping around so bad they took me for beers, plural! Nobody knew what the hell I was jamming about.
I couldn't wait to get home. My living room was empty so I laid the floor with the patents like a huge jigsaw puzzle and I read.
The rest is history. This is the greatest adventure on the Earth. It goes infinitesimally small to infinitesimally large.
Youtube: electric universe, Walter Russell, John Keely SVP.
von Braun came to the U.S. to meet with Tesla then went back to Peenemunde.
Walter Russell and Sam Clemmons met with Nikola Tesla.
Stanley Meyer talks about his core in his video.
This rabbit hole goes very, very deep.
--giantkiller.
--giantkiller.
I don't understand all this secrecy...
Here is Nikola Tesla winding TPU : http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a2/Ttesla.jpg
In the 382280 patent the last portion says that we don't want any induction currents going on between windings so that it works by dynamo (dc) currents.
This is rather peculiar. He wants to make sure that there are no induced currents yet he is transforming ac. (more like running a magnetic wave accelerator) What Tesla understood and utilized many many times is that in a solenoid winding the magnetic field compression moves through space. It does not arise at all points in the interior of the solenoid instantaneously. You will notice that his high frequency transformers use a primary wrapped around just a few turns of his secondary. Because he wants the magnetic compression to TRAVEL through the core. It's like moving a horseshoe magnet perpendicular to a wire at a very very high speed.
In the particular Tesla Patent 381,970 on page two line 30 he is referring to two applications having "Serial No" (does he mean patent no.) 252,132 and 256,561. What is he talking about ?????????? I have never seen such a patent number from Tesla.
If you read the patent very carefully he is revealing much to the reader. He is using what we would consider a secondary as the primary. Then on the primary (that we would cinsder to be a secondary) as outputs, he is using two in parallel to go to one load and two inseries to go to the other load. This provides him with two distinct output levels to drive differing loads, all from the same supply.
The real important stuff is that he uses an exciter mechanically driven generator.
He dumps this into the main generator where he produces a magnetic field rotation like spinning the rotor of an alternator up to 10,s of thousands of rpms Then quite explicitly he tells us that if the rotor inside this spinning field is allowed to turn with the speed of the rotating magnetic field we got no output. If we brake the rotor we get some ouput. If we drive the rotor in opposition to the rotating magnetic field we get more output. The exciter does not load up when he gets his ouput.
A saturable core inductor amplifying and rectifying the ac pulses from the exciter.
Quote from: wattsup on January 23, 2009, 10:41:10 AM
In the particular Tesla Patent 381,970 on page two line 30 he is referring to two applications having "Serial No" (does he mean patent no.) 252,132 and 256,561. What is he talking about ?????????? I have never seen such a patent number from Tesla.
If you read the patent very carefully he is revealing much to the reader. He is using what we would consider a secondary as the primary. Then on the primary (that we would cinsder to be a secondary) as outputs, he is using two in parallel to go to one load and two inseries to go to the other load. This provides him with two distinct output levels to drive differing loads, all from the same supply.
How about 2 pairs of frequencies surrounding the 4x harmonic of C2 from Keely's work. They did talk to each other. The coil has 4 segments and the pairs are bucking. Very versatile device.
--giantkiller.
Quote from: forest on January 23, 2009, 04:36:04 AM
I don't understand all this secrecy...
Here is Nikola Tesla winding TPU : http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a2/Ttesla.jpg
There is a whole 'nother universe behind this. Keely's charts have the same designs as most Crop circles. Does any one see this?
This is all tied together, very completely.
--giantkiller.
@ All,
Thank you, this is the conversation I was trying to get started here. GK- yes Tesla does state thin steel (lamination's). He says thin strips, plates or wire of soft iron. Soft iron wire being what SM probably used to begin with, I believe he states that himself in one of his video's. It sounds to me like Tesla is trying to minimize any inductive transformer action and utilize the rotating field as the primary generating action. He makes clear that any variation of the intensity of the rotating poles will set up other currents in the output coils that will effect efficiency. He says care needs to be taken in designing and proportioning the generator and in distributing the coils in the ring. I think maybe the generator has a large diameter in relation to it's thickness to lessen any magnetic field interaction on the far side of the coil from the rotating high intensity point. I believe the object here is to get this device to work like a rotating magnetic dynamo and minimally as a transformer.
Continuing these thoughts, with the use of soft steel for a core you can't run it any higher then about 500 Hz max. which would be 500x60 or 30,000 RPM. If as I suspect SM went to ferrite cores, something Tesla did not have in his day, then this could be operated at much higher frequencies. 5KHz input would now be equivalent to 300,000 RPM, I would think a lot of power could be generated, just think of spinning a normal generator at 300,000 RPM.
And keep in mind here, there is nothing moving except the magnetic field!
Quote from: Room3327 on January 23, 2009, 12:50:03 PM
Continuing these thoughts, with the use of soft steel for a core you can't run it any higher then about 500 Hz max. which would be 500x60 or 30,000 RPM. If as I suspect SM went to ferrite cores, something Tesla did not have in his day, then this could be operated at much higher frequencies. 5KHz input would now be equivalent to 300,000 RPM, I would think a lot of power could be generated, just think of spinning a normal generator at 300,000 RPM.
And keep in mind here, there is nothing moving except the magnetic field!
I agree with you. However using electronic circuit for driving such coil might be problematic.Better is to use positive feedback with negative regulator to set device rotating magnetic field exactly at required power output for connected load.That means a tiny load (resistance?) connected continuously to sustain rotation of magnetic field ?
Forest,
I agree that in the real world you would want to use feedback for control of the input, so you only use as much input as is required for the output you need. But I disagree about using an electronic circuit for driving it. Electronically creating a 2 Phase sine wave drive 90 degrees out of phase is pretty easy today. This would give easy control of operating frequency's and other parameters and is easily amenable to feedback control. You could use frequency control to increase or decrease output. It would also be cheaper and easier to build then a Tesla exciter.
P.S. Don't forget SM used electronic control of his devices.
Quote from: Room3327 on January 23, 2009, 03:51:31 PM
Forest,
I agree that in the real world you would want to use feedback for control of the input, so you only use as much input as is required for the output you need. But I disagree about using an electronic circuit for driving it. Electronically creating a 2 Phase sine wave drive 90 degrees out of phase is pretty easy today. This would give easy control of operating frequency's and other parameters and is easily amenable to feedback control. You could use frequency control to increase or decrease output. It would also be cheaper and easier to build then a Tesla exciter.
P.S. Don't forget SM used electronic control of his devices.
Yes,but don't forget what SM told us about using electronic and why we should experimenting with vacuum tubes . Anyway I think that it's perfectly realizable without electronics. Look at perepiteia.
Quote from: Loner on January 24, 2009, 03:46:04 AM
Also, for the TPU, would any ferro core be required? Would it not be simpler, if a true
90 degree operation is desired, to simply simulate one with the outer coil having a DC
bias, establishing containment and allowing greater inner field density? That would
certainly eliminate the saturation that would have happened at the high load.....
Steven already said this is not about induction.
If you needed a place for particles to freely float around, like in a particle accelerator, would you put a core in there??
I for one would not.
As for this thread, if the author was given the real operating priciple, he would dismiss it and continue to build yet another theoretical thread with another shitload of poyntless data and all the guy's will add their thought's to it, but there will be no end to it, it has happend before.
No realizing the TPU.
Marco.
yes is spin fast like jet engine turbine <<like my tpu strong sparks > whit my small adapter ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Tesla designed his transformer to be a voltage multiplier. He wants to get some highvoltage to overcome the transmission line drop. He knows that the faster the magnetic lines of force change around a conductor the higher the voltage. The only rectifier in those days were commutators. So he designs a static commutator utilizing magnetic fields. Now his ac exciter pulses are converted to magnetic compression waves that circulate about the core. Any conductor in this field then sees this magnetic field changing around it and induces a current that opposes this magnetic field shift but in this case the primemover isn't going to bog down it could care less abount counteremf and all that shit because it is in a different electrical inertial frame of reference than the play going on at the generator. The higher the frequency of an event the more chance there is to convert it into a low frequency event of more meaningful kinetic energy conversion. So the relatively high frequency occurance at the exciter is converted into the low frequency occurance of dynamo currents. DC is about as low as you can go on frequency conversion.
Everything has ac flowing through it. Just a matter of converting it into lower frequency of higher amplitude.
The question still remains what scource of highfrequency was SM using to create his dynamo. This was battery technology not a free energy device by his own words. The hf torroidal transformers in his machines are a dead give away as well as the meltdown of his core in the video where some clown is running around showing us the crossection of the torroid while SM and others in a state of panic screw around with what appears to be a glowing element used in his signal transmitter. Could SM have been converting hf given off by a chemical reaction into lowfrequency pulsed dc? Isn't that what you do when you do a Tesla coil? Could be something as simple as burning nitrogen and oxygen in a spark gap and converting it to electricity.
@sparks
You are very right. There is something happening much more important and that is his use of the converter is reducing the induction in the generator and hence the inherent generator drag on his drive motor. He could have shorted the generator output with a standard load as we all do today and then be exposed to the drag, but no, Tesla does things in the "best" way possible to advantage economy of function. How you treat the output is just as important as how you produce the juice. No capacitors. Just make the juice and get it out and away from their, asap.
Here's something else about the converter. Page 4 line 64
"The construction may be carried further, as above pointed out, by enclosing these coils with iron - as, for example by winding over the coils a layer or layers of insulated iron wire."
Imagine having such a toroid that is then covered with iron wire. You can then cover the iron wire with another pick-up coil to grab more juice back for added efficiency. Hmmmm.
@sparks
I have done much testing on the SM FTPU both in the center toroid types and the outer rings with the outer coils.
For the toroid, nothing makes any sense at all. Chokes used with such a big toroid being either laminated or ferrite cored, given the wire AWG used, would have required much more then the one layer windings with such thin wire to really do anything on the realm of significant coupling action. This is not normal.
As for the outer rings 2-3 turns and outer coil of approx 10 turns per quad, there again after so many types of pulsing there is nothing happening in the 5khz range. The only activity of coupling action from the outer coil being pulsed and measuring off the inner ring (or vis-versa) was happening at the 2mhz range which is the maximum my FG can go. I am convinced that the frequencies used in the FTPU are anywhere between 2-20mhz (or higher) but not in the 5khz range that SM said.
The references made of a slight vibration in the realm of 5khz if caused by kicks would confirm the above. If a kick is to happen between other spikes, then the frequency has to be much much higher then the 5khz to then at least get kicks at 5khz. At 1 kick out of 100 cycles, you are already at 500khz. At 1 kick at every 400 cycles you get to 2mhz.
The again the FTPU could work at 5khz inorder to capture the power emitted by the adjacent HV lines since NOTHING in standard pulsing that range has any effect. The HV frequency as shown by EM when matched to SMs 5khz frequency claim is toooooooooo much of a coincidence to be ignored.
I wonder what the frequency was of EMs miniTPU. I think it was in the 20mhz range but could be wrong.
Now, on the other hand, for the toroid, if one looks up HF transmitters using the bucking coil configuration, you will find various uses in the category of baluns and that would also explain the meager windings. You could then postulate that the ring is a receiver and the TPU is working in a loop.
I put up a pdf file on my OU ftp site located here;
http://www.purco.qc.ca/ftp
click - Researchers - Balun Information - HFbaltransys.pdf
If you look at page 20, this will give you an idea on what the toroid(s) may be. There are tons of SM TPU photos and nick-nacks on the site for all.
Then there is the most puzzling side. I once did a test using the FTPU outer rings, coil as primary and ring as output secondary. The primary was connected to a Tesla ozone patent set-up so the outer ring coil was the primary of the working circuit. This actually gave the best coupling effect I have seen in any of my tests. But here is the question. To do this you need a coil of high induction and where in the FTPU could you see such a coil. It's not the outer coils or rings, it's not the center toroid, so where??????? It could be the one hidden on the lower disk or it could be placed inside the center of the reel structure since we see there is something there when he turns it over. I thought it looked like a microphone to induce high frequency audio feedback.
Anyways, for me it is only a question of time before I get the solution of the FTPU. There are not 1000 parts to make. The builds are very easy in variations so there should be no excuse for others to not do some DIRECTLY RELATED testing in this regard. But hey. To each his own. lol
If I was an R&D manager, I think I would have a good idea on how to go about doing the many tests to figure it out, but alone, it is always more difficult and time consuming.
@GK
I will get the Keely book. I am due for a good sofa read.
@Room3327
I think the fastest turning objects are only in the 100,000 rpm range. These are generally flywheel batteries and these flywheels are encased in carbon enclosures in case one should fly apart, it would be one hell of a bang.
@marco
I think we are doing the best we can with what we have and what we know.
Quote from: wattsup on January 24, 2009, 11:08:11 AM
@marco
I think we are doing the best we can with what we have and what we know.
The best you can ?
I think you cannot do worse.
Quote from: -[marco]- on January 24, 2009, 05:41:20 AM
As for this thread, if the author was given the real operating priciple, he would dismiss it and continue to build yet another theoretical thread with another shitload of poyntless data and all the guy's will add their thought's to it, but there will be no end to it, it has happend before.
No realizing the TPU.
I think he already has it, but he's not boldly stating this.
Quote from: Grumpy on January 24, 2009, 11:45:43 AM
I think he already has it, but he's not boldly stating this.
Well if that is true, he would not dismiss it right?
So why did he?
Trust me, He's not even close.
@Wattsup
The rotating magnetic field is just one of the effects of the tpu. Electrical resonance can not be disregarded. The highfrequency transformers used in SM's oscillators and capacitors are tuned to be in resonance and coupled to the input windings of the Tesla solid state alternator. This therefore represents a conversion from highfrequency low amplitude energy to lower frequency high amplitude conversion. The resonant high frequency circuit can oscillate virtually forever if it does no work. When the inductance in the resonant circuit appears as a loosely coupled transformer the resonant circuit oscillates undamped. In the TPU this effect results in a highspeed magnetic field rotation as opposed to a highvoltage low amperage event as one would normally see in a Tesla transformer utilizing highfrequency conversion.
And I'll be damned but Tesla along with others figured out the Earth is a bigold inductor resonating a 7something hertz. So we are virtually inside a big old piece of wire between the capacitor and the inductor. Now how the hell do we add some resistance to this ringer?
Wattsup,
I'm not sure where you are coming from, but the rotation I am talking about is not physical rotation of the device, yes physical rotation can not be taken very high, I actually don't even know of anything that can rotate at 100,000 RPM. The rotation I am talking about is a magnetic field rotation, Magnetic field lines rotating about the core. Do you think there is a limit to the rotational speed of a magnetic field with no mass accompaniment. We have no mass moving to limit rotational speed, now there may be a top speed involved such as the speed of light but 300,000 RPM is not that great. To achieve 300,000 RPM speed in the core we need only to drive this with 5KHz.
I hope this brings the obfuscation of this thread to an end, please, we have a good basic operating principle here to work with. If we can avoid too much wild theorizing on this thread we can keep everyone here working on good principles and maybe get somewhere.
Thank you
Room3327
Quote from: Room3327 on January 24, 2009, 12:44:14 PM
Do you think there is a limit to the rotational speed of a magnetic field with no mass accompaniment.
Room3327
One more time,
Magnetic fields are stationary in space therefore they cannot rotate.
100.000 RPM is nothing i have seen a physical system rotate twice that fast.
We need only this we need only that core here core there and now all of a sudden we have a good basic operating principle.
You have nothing, and that was the poynt.
Quote from: Chef on January 24, 2009, 12:43:52 PM
There are no crossing high voltage power lines above Poynt99 head, so he is not even close? :P
In case you were thinking this was about the powerlines, i can refresh your mind, because it is not.
Your becomming almost predictable Chef, any idea what that means?
Marco,
It is not me you are saying has nothing, You are saying Tesla has nothing. This isn't my idea! I am merely trying to get to the bottom of what Tesla's idea's were. What are you trying to do?
P.S. I'm not saying the magnetic field is rotating per se, Not me but Tesla says that it is the 2 points of highest magnetic intensity that are rotating.
Quote from: wattsup on January 24, 2009, 11:08:11 AM
@GK
I will get the Keely book. I am due for a good sofa read.
You will not able to rest, my friend.
@all,
Statement made of
Intrtoductory pulse. Can you say 'Magnet swipe'?
Quick, you won't be sorry...
Page 134, 2nd column, top paragraph:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=get218
Now we have reference to this action by Keely, Telsa, Steven Mark of kicking in the resonance. And then what is mentioned? You
can transmit very large power through resonance. And the transmitting device is fed by the Resonant coupling with the universe properties.
Most here are taught by
Dominant Current layer. There are 2 more layers for all this TPU topology, Tesla and Keely to be understood. This is what is hidden in the Tesal patents and clearly spelled out by Keely.
And did you know Keely and Cayce had meetings over the benefits of SVP in health issues(Dotto ring)? Keely could touch things and make them work. Cayce could touch bodies and diagnose them. Pomerlou could think frequencies and make coils ring.
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Daniel_Pomerleau_Free_Energy_Coils
@Marco,
you are right. Same old psychology in these threads. Alot of Edisons have come and gone. Some still hold onto old school. That is too bad.
--giantkiller.
@ wattsup wrote: -
"Then there is the most puzzling side. I once did a test using the FTPU outer rings, coil as primary and ring as output secondary. The primary was connected to a Tesla ozone patent set-up so the outer ring coil was the primary of the working circuit. This actually gave the best coupling effect I have seen in any of my tests. But here is the question. To do this you need a coil of high induction and where in the FTPU could you see such a coil. It's not the outer coils or rings, it's not the center toroid, so where? It could be the one hidden on the lower disk or it could be placed inside the center of the reel structure since we see there is something there when he turns it over. I thought it looked like a microphone to induce high frequency audio feedback."
The coil of high induction has to be the one with most turns. Remember what SM said about cutting as many copper wires as possible with magnetic flux. I would say this is the outer coil but this must be bifilar, very high inductance and not connected to anything at each end (ends left floating). I would connect the two strands in Tesla series (end of one winding connected to the start of the other winding). The collector would then be a number of turns of heavy copper wire ( very low inductance coil) in close proximity to the bifilar coil. The high inductance bifilar coil might be made of iron wire? I would say that the toroids are HV generator to pulse a control coil, again wound in close proximity to the other two coils. The open bifilar should have the effect of boosting the coupling between the collector and the control coil and. The whole unit should find its own natural resonance and tune itself to the load, so long as the bifilar coil is left open ended.
I see no precision in the construction of SM's TPU's. In fact the build looks quite sloppy, so I do not see why we should assume any real critical aspects other than getting the coils in very close proximity to each other. I can see that there may well be three groups three coils around the circumference of the big TPU to increase power output and these may be working at different frequencies but not necessarily creating a rotating magnetic field.
Hoppy
Quote from: Room3327 on January 24, 2009, 01:27:31 PM
Marco,
It is not me you are saying has nothing, You are saying Tesla has nothing. This isn't my idea! I am merely trying to get to the bottom of what Tesla's idea's were.
First of all i'm not saying that Tesla had nothing, these are your words.
Tesla knew how to make things work but he never figured out why they did what they did.
Please get to that bottom of what Tesla's idea's were ,maybe you will find out he was a clever normal person who discoverd alot of things, but he wasn't a god.
He also made alot of mistakes ,which is human.
Quote from: Room3327 on January 24, 2009, 01:27:31 PM
What are you trying to do?
I am fighting an endless battle in the hope it will end one day.
@Room3327
I thought you were referring to the rotational speed of the generator in the Tesla patent.
@sparks
I think I got exactly what you mean. Surprised?
The FTPU has a second ring coil and that explains why the winding wires had certain changes in their visual diameters when looking real close up. The outer ring is the output converter coil and now to only make high voltage spikes, that's easy. The outputs I have already traced.
Holly shit. Next experiments. Another insulated bailing wire ring with one thin wind and one thicker wind.
Quote from: Hoppy on January 24, 2009, 01:38:39 PM
I can see that there may well be three groups three coils around the circumference of the big TPU to increase power output and these may be working at different frequencies but not necessarily creating a rotating magnetic field.
It's not possible without rotation. I haven't said which field, but we have to move it....
A.
Quote from: wattsup on January 24, 2009, 01:51:29 PM
@Room3327
I thought you were referring to the rotational speed of the generator in the Tesla patent.
@sparks
I think I got exactly what you mean. Surprised?
The FTPU has a second ring coil and that explains why the winding wires had certain changes in their visual diameters when looking real close up. The outer ring is the output converter coil and now to only make high voltage spikes, that's easy. The outputs I have already traced.
Holly shit. Next experiments. Another insulated bailing wire ring with one thin wind and one thicker wind.
GK4 right out of the 381970 patent. Just dont touch it when it is on. Keely damaged his left hand around the late 1800s. Check out the pictures of him. He hides his left hand.
--giantkiller.
Quote from: Chef on January 24, 2009, 01:56:16 PM
It was just a joke, I think you know, why I made that. :P
I have no idea, could you please tell me?
Well i have no idea either, but sometimes that happens.
I was just wondering if you knew why.
Nevermind bro.
Quote from: Antimon on January 24, 2009, 01:56:01 PM
It's not possible without rotation. I haven't said which field, but we have to move it....
A.
Thanks,
This info goes for "the tip of the day"
I really hope they will drop the magnetic part some day.
Damn it is such a simple concept a child could get it. Take a sinewave as it appears on your scope. Now start to shorten the time axis while maintaining in your mind what it is doing to the wave amplitude. As you compress the time or x axis your voltage should be going up and up the screen. When you get the x axis to reach zeropoint notice that your voltage level is now lets say off the screen off the planet and terminates at some event horizon line. Now go the other way and you can see that the wave can expand to a great many frequencies as you lengthen the time axis. Now shoot that time axis until your sinewave is flattened. Now you have a dc bias of infinite wavelength. One oscillation from o-1000 volts in a nanosecond will expand to o to how many volts in say an hour. Not much but the current or reaction of the mass to force should be quite lengthy.
If we use the coils of a motor as the inductor in a resonant circuit. Within the inertial frame of the resonant lc circuit the rotation of the motor and mechanical loading of such is not there. The motor loading resides in the inertial frame between the motor shaft and stator only. The oscillations of the resonant circuit therefore are undamped by the motor loading. Einstein or someone said that all physics are the same for every inertial frame of reference. The problem occurs when the observer has to look at two inertial frames of reference at the same time.
What laws govern the interaction of two inertial frames of reference seems to be where quantom physics falls apart.
I have such concept ; we need 3 elements:
- rotating magnetic field + a power source to sustain it at constant start speed
- output coil
- element which accelerates rotating magnetic field to generate exactly required power for connected load to output coil, it may be called control element
It's obvious that rotating magnetic field must be able to move alone without power source connected directly, because acceleration of it will broken any electronic generator.
It's obvious that between all elements Lenz's law principles must be used to keep acceleration at safe level and remove runaway probability.
There is another possibility not related to magnetic field , but that idea is too crazy to mention it now.In that second idea rotation speed is constant value depended maybe only on device diameter, but I can't imagine how magnetic field would behave in that situation and everything else also...
Guys, please don't forget the physics.
Power=torque*2*pi*frequency
It doesn't matter how fast you spin, you will never get overunity. In this case its only possible when you overcome lentz law.
A.
There was another gentleman who went about the task of rectifying AC and built a MAGNETIC DIODE and got alot more out than in most probably by accident. Daniel McFarland Cook. This is basically a couple of old school ignition coils hooked in an interesting parallel configuration and excited by an ac pulse.
Another interesting effect is the acceleration of a dcmotor when there is no external field to limit it's acceleration. As the armature accelerates it needs less and less current from the battery. At what rpm will the armature need microvolts to further it's acceleration. At a million 5million probably about the time the armature rpm gets beyond the speed of light and we cant find the commutator anymore.
Move the fields and the mass will respond. Move the mass and the fields will respond.
perepiteia is negating Lenz's law for example
Lenz law applies only to physics residing in the same inertial frame of reference without consideration of spacetime curvature or vacuum fluctuations about a field of mass. It is a specific case mathmatical solution of maxwells equations and far from the last word on induced voltage. It should be called the lenz effect not the lenz law.
@Loner
To answer your question there is a quote
SM Fairy Tale
Quote. the king was relieved that they had taken the shortcut ..but when he saw all he other uninvited guests he realized that disconnecting the main return wire was a bad mistake. He grabbed a few of them and put them to work ...he was able to send some of the others back down the original wire in the hope that they would find another king to annoy But there were too many of them so he quickly found another big wire that led somewhere else and joined them together. he managed to get most other uninvited guest to go down that one, away form his kingdom.. told them tell the others that the party was over but they were having such fun ,weaving and winding ..jumping and pushing.
@ all
I don't know how many of you have read that fairy tale, and also don't know how many of you think it is really not a tale.
Bless you all
Kacor
@sparks
Regarding the Cook coils, I had built 3 of them in variations of winds and materials. The best one is still the first one I made (right) using iron wire core. Funny I was thinking of taking them out again under some new pulsing methods (when I have the time). Regarding the Cook coils, it is said that it should be used in tandem with other driving methods or apparatus but I have not figured it out yet, The way the original patent shows the connections as a cross from one primary to the other secondary and back make for some weird scope shots when pulsing either AC sine or DC. There is more on these builds in this thread: http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=2630.msg37613#msg37613
This week I am going to make a new FTPU outer ring using the same iron wire (insulated) and wind some coils over it to see the effect.
Quote from: wattsup on January 25, 2009, 01:17:23 PM
@sparks
Regarding the Cook coils, I had built 3 of them in variations of winds and materials. The best one is still the first one I made (right) using iron wire core. Funny I was thinking of taking them out again under some new pulsing methods (when I have the time). Regarding the Cook coils, it is said that it should be used in tandem with other driving methods or apparatus but I have not figured it out yet, The way the original patent shows the connections as a cross from one primary to the other secondary and back make for some weird scope shots when pulsing either AC sine or DC. There is more on these builds in this thread: http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=2630.msg37613#msg37613
This week I am going to make a new FTPU outer ring using the same iron wire (insulated) and wind some coils over it to see the effect.
Funny , I have built my tpu the same way as brnbrade coil, except output coil is crossing iron core like in Gunderson patent. That was my theory based : instead of rotating magnetic field, just allow to create stationary electric waves in coils around core and let the Earth rotate it.
If that works , and it should according to MCFarland and others the problem remains , how to collect electricity for output.
What's going on with brnbrade topic. All responses from brnbrade was removed ! I wanted to follow that topic but it's really hard because all responses are removed !
@watsoup
i see your coils i see in the midle coils there is two coils i thing you whill have some dc voltage very small dc voltage if you put two separated long antenas simple wire i thing is like caps is charging itself whit potencials charging THING LIKE THIS AND TRAED THIS ONE COIL IS LIKE ONE PIN FROM CAP ATHERE COIL IS ANTHERE PIN FROM CAP AND I THING YOU WHILL HAVE SOME TO COLECT OF FREE ENERGY OR
OH TO NOT FORGET YOU MAST MAKE 3 COILS <PICK UP COIL TO GET SOME POTRNCIAL DC VOLTAGE FROM THIS TWO COILS WHIT THIS ANTENAS
8)
I WHILL SAY SOME ATHERE POTENCILA ELKTRICYTY IS MORE POWERFULL THEN CLASICAL ELKTROMAGNET FORCE FILD WHIT THIS YOU ONLY NEED JUST LITLE INPUT TO PICKUP DC VOTAGE
Quote from: forest on January 26, 2009, 04:50:49 PM
What's going on with brnbrade topic. All responses from brnbrade was removed ! I wanted to follow that topic but it's really hard because all responses are removed !
Forest,
I have upload the notes and images I have on brnbrade. Hopefully you will find what you need.
It is a 1.7M D/L in html format.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=get219 (http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=get219)
-Duff
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=item220
you will need Multisim 10
Quote from: Mannix on January 26, 2009, 11:23:57 PM
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=item220
you will need Multisim 10
Hi Sir Mannix,
are this the kicks we are looking for so long time? I think so and it looks great and so simple. Did you test it also in real?
Thanks
Norbert
Just in case some members do not have access to Multisim a screen shot is attached.
Thanks Lindsay. Take care.
nap
Nice amplifier setup, but it is just an electronic circuit. Where in this do you expect to find any overunity and by what mechanism?
Quote from: Room3327 on January 27, 2009, 01:44:10 PM
Nice amplifier setup, but it is just an electronic circuit. Where in this do you expect to find any overunity and by what mechanism?
You do the simulation first before you ask and read what SM told us.
Oh, Shut my mouth and do as told, so sorry. But someone should tell you that those are just transformers and no transformer is overunity. It is also common knowledge that there is not more energy in a BEMF spike then the energy that went into creating it. It is also a fact that rogue waves do not contain any more energy then the waves that went into creating it. And if you are going to be daring enough to pump RF energy into basically, a transmitting coil with an attached recieving coil, you deserve to be burned and hurt. Yea. I know the truth hurts! And I will also add, as I was told by the NEC at one point," There is no configuration of PM magnets and transformer combinations that have ever been modeled (and they have modeled a lot) that ever showed any sign of overunity".
Quote from: slapper on January 27, 2009, 12:38:16 PM
Just in case some members do not have access to Multisim a screen shot is attached.
Thanks Lindsay. Take care.
nap
This cicuot shown very "unfortunatly"
Also nothin is say over the imepancie. and ration of the transformers. Even the biasing of the transitors (10 / 100kohm divider separated with secondary of Transformer is not usual . We will see the coming problems...
Gustav Pese
@sparks
Regarding the FTPU outer rings (2), now if we supposed that each ring is made of insulated iron wire that is one length turned three times and connected end to end to make a mobius type loop. Now, let's say you have one coil wound all around the loop that we would call the secondary. Then you have one coil wound over just 1/3 of the loop called the primary.
We already know that in standard laminated core coupling, the flux moves in the laminations relative to the primary polarities then to the secondary and thus creates the transfer.
Now in this case, when the primary hits the insulated iron wire (equal to laminate core), since it is insulated and turning three times back onto itself, does this mean with one pulse on primary, the flux will make three turns inside the secondary wind.
This would be equal to what @grumpy showed in his recent document on toroid windings, having one primary over several toroids transfering to many secondaries. The idea behind having a three ring laminate is that if the primary is well timed to expend the least energy possible (most bang for the buck which can be done very easilly with Tesla Ozone Patent shorting method), there may be a cumulative effect over the secondaries and produce some OU.
I know some will say "there goes wattsup again with his standard thinking", but this would not be so standard if the flux can turn three times inside the secondary winding. We are always trying to push current inside a copper condutor to impart coupling to other copper wires when we already know the best way is to move the flux in a laminate and if this flux can turn and turn many times very fast, I think it should make some interesting results.
In any case, I will make one this week and test it.
Quote from: rensseak on January 27, 2009, 02:09:45 PM
You do the simulation first before you ask and read what SM told us.
The circuit is a variation of a "Ring Oscillator".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ring_oscillator
It can be built with capacitors instead as shown, but the reason for the transformer approach should be obvious.
A possible means to an end.
.99
Hi all
You will have to run the sim to see what happens..its not supposed to be an overunity circuit ...they dont exist ! Its just a little circuit that runs in the simulator to portray a turbine. There is nothing special about any of the values.
The Transistors should be replaced with tubes....tubes just wont simulate so i used transistors to show it but I hope that some of you get the idea of an electronic turbine spinning up from this. I would hope that some of you might perfect this...even get tubes running on the sim....I couldnt but Im no expert at Multisim.
You have all heard the warnings
what are the limiting factors to the rpm of this thing ?
Please just run the sim and muck around with the values, Each transformer is a collector/control combination.
but just imagine those coils configured in a ring so that they interact with each other any way you think will work....
What if they run at different rates...have we 3 cannons?
Perhaps it's worth a real build to see if anything different happens. I find it very interesting at least and I hope that it will help us learn something useful to pass on to each other .
Any way its .. a good starting point and I think it asks some pretty good questions of us .And you can stay at the computer if you like ...just dont expect a simulator to show anything but the timings and how the coils interact with each other at lower speeds.
this is like professor seike's stuff check him out ,and jln labs gstrain device
Lindsay
Quote from: wattsup on January 27, 2009, 04:09:45 PM
@sparks
Regarding the FTPU outer rings (2), now if we supposed that each ring is made of insulated iron wire that is one length turned three times and connected end to end to make a mobius type loop. Now, let's say you have one coil wound all around the loop that we would call the secondary. Then you have one coil wound over just 1/3 of the loop called the primary.
We already know that in standard laminated core coupling, the flux moves in the laminations relative to the primary polarities then to the secondary and thus creates the transfer.
Now in this case, when the primary hits the insulated iron wire (equal to laminate core), since it is insulated and turning three times back onto itself, does this mean with one pulse on primary, the flux will make three turns inside the secondary wind.
This would be equal to what @grumpy showed in his recent document on toroid windings, having one primary over several toroids transfering to many secondaries. The idea behind having a three ring laminate is that if the primary is well timed to expend the least energy possible (most bang for the buck which can be done very easilly with Tesla Ozone Patent shorting method), there may be a cumulative effect over the secondaries and produce some OU.
I know some will say "there goes wattsup again with his standard thinking", but this would not be so standard if the flux can turn three times inside the secondary winding. We are always trying to push current inside a copper condutor to impart coupling to other copper wires when we already know the best way is to move the flux in a laminate and if this flux can turn and turn many times very fast, I think it should make some interesting results.
In any case, I will make one this week and test it.
Interesting idea.However.... In that case the bigger output from TPU the more iron core turns should be there and TPU should be much higher. I don't see that being a case for TPU according to SM videos. Rather different approximation seems true : more output power means higher TPU diameter.Anyway, very good idea.
Has anybody made a request for a Wiki site go along side with the discussions?
It would sure help with consuming all of this data...
@wattsup
You can look on this from a radio wave perspective also. Any radio man knows in his antennae system how to use a standing wave ratio meter. If you want to get the signal out there you don't want your waves stuck in the coax. What if we intentionally create a standing wave field in a virtual piece of coax could this standing wave field turn into a rotating standing wave field?
@sparks
Exactly my idea except stationary rotating waves. What is the difference ? I don't know ,but I know that Tesla generated stationary waves and electricity is like two electromagnetic curled waves propagating along wire : magnetic over the surface while electric inside.
I have a question : if you put two electric currents into primary of transformer what is the result on secondary ? I mean : are they THE SAME CURRENTS just with different voltage whic are coming out of magnetic field of transformer OR COMPLETLY NEW CREATED currents ?
Why is this important ? If they are the same just with different voltage they will not merge no matter how we try, but if they are NEW just with proper parameters corresponding to primary currents , then we have in really new area.
Can someone propose experiment to validate such concept ?
I think you SHOULD deep analyze how important is my previous question, I realized that now.
Ride 'em, cowboy! 8)
Any noise in your power supply is like a bur under your saddle. It might be small but it is fast! Kapeesh?
Don't grab the bull by the ring.
There are 2 types of questions. Those that you can google answers and those that you have to test. Start your own desktop rodeo. Everything from goat ropers to bucking broncos.
The GK4 was heterodyned. ;)
--giantkiller. OMG.
:o ;D
The answer to my question WILL RESOLVE much of uncertainty about free energy in induction coils (for example in Bedini circuits)
IF currents are new, then THERE IS NOW possibility that EXTERNAL MAGNETIC FIELD when properly applied to magnetic field of inductor WILL SHOW ITSELF in resulting current as ADDED energy.
IF currents are not new, there is no such posssibility.
Sorry for poor English but I'm so exited.
Three coils wrapped around a common core. You can use copper wire air whatever depends on the frequency. Top coil input sine sawtooth whatever as long as it is impeded.
Two ouput coils out of wack as far as impedance matching. Pull a load.
Allow time to get some ambient magnetic field input to reset the core.
KICKS FOR FREE
@sparks
You are getting better and better with those Egyptian Hieroglyphic designs. Just joking.
On your previous post, if standing waves can be used, please explain how in the FTPU this could be done with what is already there. My idea of the iron ring is because there is a ring and there is winding in the actual TPU. Explanations and ideas should be as close to the device depiction as possible. A coil, ok, which one, where is located, etc. If you guys can keep this to specific parts of the TPU, then maybe we will understand more.
@forest
Regarding your post one more rings for the larger TPU, I don't know. It seems there is still only 6 total loops when you look at the cutaway photos. The 6 looped ring is simply of greater diameter.
About frequencies, yes, guys have done this on the forum for years. Look up Otto's ECD. In some of my coils I have found that if you pulse one frequency to find the resonance, then apply the second frequency at the same frequency minus 1 hertz and shift it's phasing by at least 6.84 degrees, you get real havoc and more voltage production.
But frequencies will depend on the power type AC square/sine, straight dc or pulsed dc or reverse pulsing dc, all of these will produce different effects.
Hello all,
@wattsup
sorry to jump in but in a TPU is a ring. But not an iron ring. Its a copper ring.
Maybe you can show me where the cutaway photos are?
Otto
@otto
Hope you are doing well.
First of all, don't ever be sorry for jumping in otto. We always like what you have to say and teach and reading between the lines. lol
Well,,,,, the FTPU ring could be either iron wire, copper wire or other wire, but to better understand this, unfortunately all types must be tested. The logic behind each wire type must be looked at until we can understand the best methods. Same for the LTPU.
Everything I have on all units, photos, diagrams etc., is now available to everyone on my ftp site which is located here http://www.purco.qc.ca/ftp/.
Just look in the Steven Mark sub directory to find the TPU type and go from there.
Any file with the word "cut" will be off the cutaway video. I kept one of my companies open just for OU stuff because I can then declare all my R&D expenses. Why not.
I wanted to make this ftp site so I could have an easy way of finding things when I am not at home and also to provide others with all the images, etc., in one convenient location and not have to search the Forum, which is getting to be more and more loaded with so many other things. You and Roberto are on there also. If there are things you would like me to remove, let me know. Or add, then send it to me at contactOU@purco.qc.ca. Remove the "OU" from the e-mail I just gave you.
So I am not saying it is iron wire, but "if" it is iron wire, what would be the dynamics.
One main or major thing about the TPUs is the builds are all made with coil winds that are not that precisely spaced. This indicates that they are all relying on a main principle of operation that has enough leeway to accommodate build variations as long as the main principle is adhered to, the device should work.
Another important note about the FTPU center toroid and the LTPU center toroids. They do not seem to have the same winds. On the FTPU the winds seem to be much more with a finer wire and many layers, so the toroid in the FTPU could provide a point of high induction. In contrast to the LTPU toroids that have a set and clealy vissible limited number of winds that I have already drawn and identified.
Then the question is why would you have more winds in the FTPU and I think it is related to the fact that the FTPU outer winds could never provide the point of high induction because there is simply not enough wire there, whereas in the LTPU SM could be using the outer winds to also provide the high induction point while using the toroids as an output regulator since the LTPU toroids halves are in parallel and there are two of them to handle the higher voltages.
I could go on and on for pages.
Now regarding the FTPU I know now there is a small transistor that has three long thin legs and there are some capacitors (3) one beside the other, then there is the front EM capacitor and there is also another EM capacitor in the back. There is also a 1" long resistor or fuse resistor.
If anyone is good with circuits, I would need a table of components that someone would require if they wanted to make a transistor oscillate at 5khz, 10khz, 15khz, 20khz, 2mhz, 5mhz, 10mhz and 20mhz. Based on a driving voltage of 3vdc. If anyone can give me the capacitor values required then I could look them up, see how they look in reality and compare them to what is in the FTPU. So you see, I have been trying to keep a certain level of methodology but my EE to do such a table is not good enough.
I know alot more today on the FTPU wiring and will make a new wiring diagram when time permits. But for now it is really looking, making and testing many variations. What else is possible to do in such circumstances? Those who are on this know of the many variables.
I also sent an e-mail to Jack Durban asking if he found his BETA video but have not received an answer from him. Booo hooo. That would have been great to have a better video copy.
Thankyou Wattsup for your work and sharing!! So if we take a hf signal and inductively feed it to two chokes with different impedance matching but one is altered by the saturation parameters compared to the iinductance of the copper could we get some voltage between the two chokes that is unexpected. Both chokes are setup to choke the ac input but one takes a little longer than the other.
Spherics mentioned SM discovered this effect working with timing elements for his audio timing elements. This anamolous spike could be captured by a capacitor. I'm going back to square one on this deal and see if I can get the anamolous spike on my oscope messing with two identical torroidal chokes and changing one so that the copper in one is altered along with the core but still designed to choke the same frequency.
great discussions here
I wonder,
if we were to introduce electron tubes to our experiments ,might the potentiol of an electron tube to generate and use high speed electrons have any additional characteristics that silicone devices could not handle?
I do not refer to switching times form dirty pulses but the ability of a tube to react to the high speed particles in the "havoc" that has been mentioned here.
If we create havoc with electron tubes driving flux cancelling bifilar rings will it be "pure" havoc ?
We do need to use all the clues, as muddy as they might seem but , we most certainly need to use the actual specifics given .
It might be a long road in either case ..but we all have been given a shortcut.( that very,very few seem to want to include)
Steven said that he would never have discovered it using ss devices...and that tubes are just as important today as they were back then ..
Ultra high speed particles are common to every single device so far ..... dont shunt them with things that were never designed to deal with them.
Just look at the spec sheets of ss...then tubes..You might say that tubes dont have nearly as many "specifications"
It may be that a bunch of wire can be excited to perform like a tube by using ss to initiate the reaction required if the bunch of wire is just right.
Just trying to help with the little that I have Just Ignore this if it doesnt fit .It is interesting whatever you do
Lindsay
@wattsup
I am open to everything.
Here are photos of both tubes mentioned 5AR4 and 5U4 GB.
Shit. They are not that complicated a design for tubes we usually see such as the pentode and triode type tubes that have so many complex areas. This is simple shit. Very symmetric just like the TPUs. I wonder if I can find a wiring diagram for these tubes. lol.
So here is another question.
Anode - Cathode - Plate
Does an Anode have a north and south polarity? Does a cathode have a north and south polarity? If not, can a ring only have one polarity? Can you have two rings with one polarity each?
Added:
Found pdfs and put them here.
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Steven%20Mark/tubes/5AR4/5AR4.pdf
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Steven%20Mark/tubes/5U4%20GB/5u4-gb.pdf
Quote from: wattsup on January 31, 2009, 12:48:06 AM
@wattsup
I wonder if I can find a wiring diagram for these tubes. lol.
Added:
Found pdfs and put them here.
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Steven%20Mark/tubes/5AR4/5AR4.pdf
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Steven%20Mark/tubes/5U4%20GB/5u4-gb.pdf
I know nothing about tubes :-( It was always and still is a mystery for me how they do electron multiplication. I mean I was told (don't know if this is correct) that AC signal put into it with a small DC put on grid. The output seems to have current enlarged with electrons from DC signal ??
Could somebody explain it and how it relates to TPU ?
@Loner
I saw video about first TPU which was producing volts but very little amps.Apparently part of final TPU was not there, only kicks accumulate, no current.
In the days preceeding tubes and solidstate there was a need for rectification.
Two inventors that I know of went about this. Daniel McFarland Cook and Tesla.
Tesla had to make a diode to interface with Edison's dc system to make Westinghouse's new ac system retrofittable to existing dc distribution and loads. Tesla's dynamic transformer was never used as Westinghouse made more money selling motor generator sets than implementing Tesla's dynamic transformation system. Both men accomplished this by the use of lumping two chokes on a common core. The response of the two different inductance rated windings to a common core saturation change were magnetically additive on a close coupled basis between windings. The resultant dc then distributed through the dc load. A diode suffers from the lack of positive and negative charge carriers to handle the current. Whereas in the skin of a conductor we find ample free electrons and holes. A conductor can also transmit energy as a longitudinal or sound type wave through the electron cloud. This phenomenon allows for very rapid communication of a magnetic field anamoly on one end of the wire to appear at the other end of the wire. This information exchange is not resisted as in conventional current flow as it does not involve electron acceleration but what could be more looked on as diode hole oscillation.
@all
I don't know will it help to understand the mystery of the TPU or not but I found an interesting thing about of vacuum tubes.
There are many difference between SS and tubes but the biggest one is:
tubes can work without supply. (Heating is need!)
No, I'm not fool!
There are two example:
The first one is double diode: without load the output voltage is 2,5 V and 1V with 50 microampere.
The second one is an oscillator with a pentode. Its output is 300mV HF. The inner resistance of the pentode (in that case) is very low and its gain is only 2....3.
Hoping you find it also interesting (maybe useful) information.
Bless you all
Kacor
http://www.rexresearch.com/moray/speech.htm
Thomas Moray used cold cathode tubes ,linking several coils in perfect resonance to isolate the resonant circuits so that there was no "feedback"
there are many writings from this man.
Combine Moray's work with Steven Mark's information about tubes and some interesting correlations are found.
It is MY opinion that the electron tube is used to initiate the catalyst in the same way that a spark is used to light a fire.
From all the info that I released, it is clear that unless tubes are used initially we have little chance of seeing the effect.
But of course later units did not have them, but used devices that duplicated their function, devices that took a team 10 years to make .
Personally I think that are a form of mag amp/saturable inductor but we will probably never get the specifics of this part of the device.
Without specific info about that and no running generators what chance would we have to design such a thing from such a long way off.
Those tube pictures are Excellent...I suggest to read morays writings at this point. If nothing else you might see just how different this is from the conventional understanding that we have absorbed for the purpose of maintaining machines that pump from central source to heat wasting destinations.
After all, we only need information that allows us to contribute to society as we know it. In one strange way , the better your education the harder it might be to absorb..as that does not make any body out to be dumb or stupid...just unaware....yet
Playing with these possibilities will make you isolated from your peers , socially inoperative, and I suggest that it might not be a good idea.
You dont go down to your local and discuss resonance do you?
the party will end..you will have less friends....however your only true friends may admire you more ...want to test this?
Tell people that you know of devices that will give them free power and they just want to know . Where do you get one? obviously if the power is free they should not have to pay much for it. This is the commercial problem that every inventor of these things has faced. All that is left is for lots of people to nail this down and make common knowledge by their own re discovery and sharing of it.
Put money in the picture and this stuff becomes priceless, which is the very process that kills it ..we all have played a part in that and may continue to do so.
enough spruke from me ..for now ,thanks for listening
Good hunting
Lindsay
read pages 514 to 520 from this 1893 publication of the American Journal of Science.
http://books.google.com/books?id=F_UQAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA518&lpg=PA518&dq=iron+wire+resonance&source=bl&ots=GbTpOoetoM&sig=aih1UUR2SP-YKCVqH1-gu54hkPc&hl=en&ei=XyqFSbbOM4zgMNHMmc0D&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=2&ct=result#PPA514,M1
M. I. Pupin (PhD), professor at Columbia College of New York, even thanks Mr. Tesla for his help on some of the previous pages. This paper describes his experiments in resonance and his observation of strange hysterisis effects created by inserting iron wires inside a coil (to change it's self inductance since iron is magnetizable) His setup is basic: an alternator to produce a steady frequency source of current; a transformer; and a coil and variable capacitor forming a resonant tank circuit. The thin iron wires are inserted one by one, or in bundles, inside the coil center, or core, to affect it's self inductance.
It's pretty neat to read such old literature, and you can see the very first signs of magnetostriciton at work, even though it wasn't fully recognized at the time. Notice the low frequency resonance that can be achieved, and the "singing wires", and heat buildup.
EM
P.S. Take a look at the modern problem of ferro-resonance in power distribution.
http://www.electricnet.com/article.mvc/Ferroresonance-A-Brief-Explanation-0001?VNETCOOKIE=NO
To be successful in replicating a SM style TPU (the original) one needs to understand these issues, as the SM's TPUs are resonant devices tuned to the magnetic energy around them originating from the overhead power lines. These devices are not overunity or free energy, but they are conversion devices like SM says himself. What is needed is a high Q form of resonance to build up sufficient voltage in the magnetic loops (i.e, the TPUs), and LC resonance might prove useful at only close proximity to the lines, on the other hand, ferroresonance and magnetostriction allow for the realization of higher Q mechanical vibration tank circuits that can effectively capture the energy from the power lines at a greater distance from them, just as SM demonstrated outside the mansion.
Some additional comments from our friend :
I take a motor having, say eight poles, and wrap the exciting coils of four alternate cores with fine insulated iron wire. When the current is started in these coils it encounters the effect of the closed magnetic circuit and is retarded. The magnetic lines set up at the start close to the iron wire around the coils and no free poles appear at first at the ends of the four cores. As the current rises in the coils more lines are set up, which crowd more and more in the fine iron wire until finally the same becomes saturated, or nearly so, when the shielding action of the iron wire ceases and free poles appear at the ends of the four protected cores. The effect of the iron wire, as will be seen, is two-fold. First, it retards the energizing current; and second, it delays the appearance of the free poles. To produce still greater difference of phase in the magnetization of the protected and unprotected cores, I connect the iron wire surrounding the coils of the former in series with the coils of the latter, in which case, of course, the iron wire is preferably wound or connected differentially, after the fashion of the resistance, coils in a bridge, so as to have no appreciable self-induction. In other cases I obtain the desired retardation in the appearance of the free poles on one set of cores by a magnetic shunt, which produces a greater retardation of the current and takes up at the start a certain number of the lines set up, but becomes saturated when the current in the exciting coils reaches a predetermined strength.
In the transformer the same principle of shielding is utilized. A primary conductor is surrounded with a fine layer of laminated iron, consisting of fine iron wire or plates properly insulated and interrupted. As long as the current in the primary conductor is so small that the iron enclosure can carry all the lines of force set up by the current, there is very little action exerted upon a secondary conductor placed in vicinity to the first; but just as soon as the iron enclosure becomes saturated, or nearly so, it loses the virtue of protecting the secondary and the inducing action of the primary practically begins.
Best regards
Nikola Tesla
Quote from: forest on February 01, 2009, 06:14:49 AM
Some additional comments from our friend :
I take a motor having, say eight poles, and wrap the exciting coils of four alternate cores with fine insulated iron wire. When the current is started in these coils it encounters the effect of the closed magnetic circuit and is retarded. The magnetic lines set up at the start close to the iron wire around the coils and no free poles appear at first at the ends of the four cores. As the current rises in the coils more lines are set up, which crowd more and more in the fine iron wire until finally the same becomes saturated, or nearly so, when the shielding action of the iron wire ceases and free poles appear at the ends of the four protected cores. The effect of the iron wire, as will be seen, is two-fold. First, it retards the energizing current; and second, it delays the appearance of the free poles. To produce still greater difference of phase in the magnetization of the protected and unprotected cores, I connect the iron wire surrounding the coils of the former in series with the coils of the latter, in which case, of course, the iron wire is preferably wound or connected differentially, after the fashion of the resistance, coils in a bridge, so as to have no appreciable self-induction. In other cases I obtain the desired retardation in the appearance of the free poles on one set of cores by a magnetic shunt, which produces a greater retardation of the current and takes up at the start a certain number of the lines set up, but becomes saturated when the current in the exciting coils reaches a predetermined strength.
In the transformer the same principle of shielding is utilized. A primary conductor is surrounded with a fine layer of laminated iron, consisting of fine iron wire or plates properly insulated and interrupted. As long as the current in the primary conductor is so small that the iron enclosure can carry all the lines of force set up by the current, there is very little action exerted upon a secondary conductor placed in vicinity to the first; but just as soon as the iron enclosure becomes saturated, or nearly so, it loses the virtue of protecting the secondary and the inducing action of the primary practically begins.
Best regards
Nikola Tesla
Do you have any idea what Tesla was talking about regarding bold statement ?
Sorry forest back to the kicks and tubes. The below is talking about spark gaps but the same can be applied to a tube or diode. It's about impulse energy or what to do with the kick.
In most over-voltage spark gaps avalanches of electrons move towards the anode. As the number of electrons increases Coulomb's law states that also the field strength increases. The strong field accelerates the avalanche. A slow rise time of the voltage lets the electrons drift towards the anode before they can generate an avalanche. Electrophilic molecules capture electrons before they can generate an avalanche. Thermal effects destabilize a homogeneous electron discharge and ion diffusion stabilizes it.
@EM
Tesla did a patent on an improved transformer. An improvement on the ones being utilized on the poles down the street. One that creates a rotating magnetic field as described by forrest. By using magnetic shielding on different EXCITING
coils. This rotating magnetic field needs only another set of coils to experience the rotation. Unlike the classical transformer where the magnetic shielding is destroyed by the secondary current draw. Tesla is shuffling it around.
In a torroidal transformer the current draw of the secondary does not effect the impedance of the primary. The current draw of the secondary is magnetically out of phase with the primary input. Attention to retainance of the magnetic core material must be adressed. If the core appears as saturated to the next ac or dc pulse excessive current is drawn from the line. As most magnetic materials saturation parameters are set by the ambient magnetic field of the Earth the core of a torroidal transformer can effectively capture this diffusion capacity or it's ability to reset the magnetic domains of the core. When the Sunspots hit this becomes quite apparent to transformers as they go into oversaturation. Not so apparent is the input from the more constant coronal mass ejections of the Sun creating bow shock waves transmitted into the poles incessantly.
Hello all,
nice discussion.
We know that SM first used tubes and then transistors. Fine!
Here my short story:
A few months ago I made 3 tube oscillators and connected them somehow to my TPU. Nothing. I changes the values of the components and the connections in the TPU. Nothing.
Today I was very "clever" and took 1 12AU7 tube from my oscillators. Connected the 12,6V heating, the anode voltage and wanted to pulse this tube with a transistor. In this way I thought I dont need oscillators made with tubes.
Before I connected the pulses I wanted to see the working properties of a 12AU7 triode and then I saw it:
The grid needs NEGATIVE pulses.
So why are we pulsing our TPUs with positive pulses? Maybe Im wrong. Its worth a try. PNP MOSFETs.
Otto
Quote from: otto on February 01, 2009, 10:01:57 AM
So why are we pulsing our TPUs with positive pulses?
Most are not. The majority of circuits shared have the switch at the negative end of the coil circuit. They are switching the negative side.
However, driving a grid negative is not unusual. It is unusual if you have no applied anode current and scope the anode (plate) anyway. re: SM comments about heater voltage appearing on the plate current...
Why not hitem both with positive bias real quick and see what makes it through the grid in the way of accelerated electrons.
Hello all,
a few hours ago I saw that my tube transformer can give me only 10V for the tube heating....
I have another very big transformer to drive my tubes.
Its sooooo boring to pulse the coils with transistors. It seems thats finally tube time for me.
I have good coils, very good cores and now its time to figure out what to do with tubes. Maybe you know it but Im always thinking in a contra way to say so.
On the other hand Im always thinking about what SM did. Did he use tube oscillators + amplifiers? If so, what kind of signals did he get on the output of this amplifiers? Sines? Or kicks? Are then the kicks converted into sines inside the TPU? I alreday saw a long time ago.
If we use PNP MOSFETs whats the difference? I mean the difference between NPN and PNP Kicks to say so.
I can imagine there is a difference. Not at all frequencies but at some of them I can imagine that the TPU is then easier "connected" to the earths magnetic field. And in the moment when this "connection" happens ........BOOOOOM!!!!
As you see I have a lot of questions for myself and I know I have to work hard to get all needed questions.
A lot of guessings and speculations. I only wanted to show the people here what I want to do, nothing else.
Otto
Quote from: kacor on January 31, 2009, 12:12:07 PM
@all
I don't know will it help to understand the mystery of the TPU or not but I found an interesting thing about of vacuum tubes.
There are many difference between SS and tubes but the biggest one is:
tubes can work without supply. (Heating is need!)
No, I'm not fool!
There are two example:
The first one is double diode: without load the output voltage is 2,5 V and 1V with 50 microampere.
The second one is an oscillator with a pentode. Its output is 300mV HF. The inner resistance of the pentode (in that case) is very low and its gain is only 2....3.
Hoping you find it also interesting (maybe useful) information.
Bless you all
Kacor
from SM
http://www.zpenergy.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1826
I originally got the idea from electron circuits which use vacuum rectifiers like the 5U4 GB or 5AR4 etc. The plate has a high voltage potential with lots of useable power available. You cant get to it or use it for anything without applying a heating voltage to the cathode or what is the cathode potential of the tube. So, you put in a small voltage of 5 volts AC 60 Hz which heats up the cathode and welcomes the electron stream from the plate. Or actually the other way around, but not important for this example of my thoughts. Now the high voltage power goes through the cathode and travels through the coils of the 5 volt transformer along with the 5 volt AC. if the plate voltage is not rectified then it is AC with a potential 60 Hz frequency. That combines with the 5 volt 60 Hz in the coil of the htr transformer and generally amounts to nothing. In fact the power of the 5 volt transformer amounts to nothing. It is an insignificant power supply except when the two transformers get slightly out of phase with each other, or when they are connected in reverse of one another.Then you can measure all kinds of things going on. You can generate all kinds of hash and multiple frequencies, and I do mean all kinds. What I measured during this process was very interesting. All these frequencies occasionally met at the same time with a much larger kick at the output.
So I take it that the tubes make a huge difference?
As far as I know tubes were invented to replace spark gaps, commutators and other strange devices used in oscillators. SM found a way how the process of resonance in tubes+ transformers circuits. I believe it's the same as described by Tesla. He was able to charge a capacitor and discharge it with not diminishing oscillations - every spikes carry the full energy of capacitor.Then by varying frequency he was able to obtain any power in secondary. That's clearly described in his notes and interview...
If someone has a triode and experience , would be nice to check about those HV hash going back to heater transformer and if that's related to any current applied to the grid at all.
That's not explain how SM was able to go further and eliminate any tubes, spark gaps. commutators. It's hard to believe for me that the same effect may be done efficiently with mosfets....
One must consider the bifilar wound coil connected magnetically additive pulsed at a frequency that chokes the acpulse as being quite like SM describes the transformer action that gives rise to the kick. This kick will also be stored in the capacitance setup between coils. Succesive pulsing adding charge to this capacitor until such time that the coils insulation or dielectric field is compromised or discharged.
@Mannix
I have looked into Moray for the first time. Thanks. I'm a Moray virgin. But funny most of what he said I had already known instinctively. It is good to get confirmation from the past. Too bad he was concerned about keeping the secrets that got him nowhere. But I learned alot from the reads. Just more mysteries to solve.
We will find parallels with all of the past investigators because we are still dealing with the same energies.
@All
First of all - very good posts. Thanks.
My question regarding if an anode and cathode have both the north and south or positive and negative polarity was to stress the fact that they should not have both polarities. Looking it up further I have found that they can be one or the other, but not both. An anode can be positive or negative depending on the usage. Same with the cathode. So in essence both the anode and cathode are extremities of a discharge either applied from an outer current source or via an internal "prestored dielectric charge" and are both "mono-polar". They can provide a means of applying an electrical influence on a non-wire mass. A spark gap has a dielectric conductor which is non-wire mass we call space. The same space between the two levels of the rings in the FTPU.
The action in the outer rings of the FTPU cannot be coupling based because there is simply not enough to do a coupling in the traditional sense as in a laminated transformer. The device runs with gain. The vacuum tube needs no coupling. All it knows is that if such and such a small amount of material is electrically heated to x degrees, it will impart the source electrons to the nearest damn thing around, in its case, it's a oppositely charged (not charged by potentialized) plate.
So the problem behind the heating of the TPU is probably due to the fact that it is very normal to get such heat, and if SM said "this was normal", he would have given away too much of the secrets, so he switched it into a problem instead. Let the perceived (pseudo) problem be the distraction. This also gave him good reasons to continue the R&D into the later designs, to try and correct the problem that will always be. Consider that if the heat is normal, who cares, since it is free energy anyways. A light bulb gets hot but it keeps lighting, so if the bulb lit by itself, would you care about the heat. No. But if you made it into a problem that had to be solved, this is a very good distraction.
Why did I ask this question. Well always going back to the TPUs. The toroid and outer coils could not provide such an anode/cathode effect because they hold both polarities. So maybe the outer rings are only connected on one side with the other side left open ended to make an anode and a cathode. Given the proper energy influence, maybe they produce a potential between them and the outer coils then catch this potential. Like the anode/cathode of a capacitor and the dielectric being in this case open space.
The gain aspect would then be normal since if the anode and cathode produce a directional energy transfer through the dielectric of space, and if the outer coils then become electrically charged, and since the outer coils are wound around the anode and cathode, the increase in electric charge of the outer coil will increase the potential surrounding the anode and cathode thus increasing the directional anode/cathode energy flow, thus increasing again the energy in the outer coils and this compounds one on top of the other as an additive effect. It would equal a self-dielectric-exciting-capacitor. And if the potential was right, it could attract energy from the Cosmos as Moray put it.
There are so many possible ways to look at a TPU, it is very easy to stray off in one direction for years and years, but what is keeping me well "grounded" is always looking back to the devices themselves and asking, ok where does this theory physically fit inside a TPU with its limited coils, SS components, etc. If the theory fits, then looking further is justified, if it does not fit, then guys should probably look elsewhere to save time.
Case in point. I made a small insulated iron three loop mobius ring. Put a small one layer primary covering about 25 degrees of the ring and wound a one layer Litz wire (175 strands of 48 awg) secondary all around. And again the only coupling action occurred above 2mhz. Nothing below. Nothing at 5khz range at all. I drove it with AC sine/square and dc pulsed. Otto, I drove it from the positive side, then from the negative side. All of these little tests provide more information but do not point to a logical means of making the TPU work. Could be the same set-up but different use will get to further down.
The only real odd ball of the TPUs is the OPTU. Two rings but only one with a wind. WTF. This goes against all the other unit designs. It was demoed in a garage with two big table lamps. I have already discussed a step by step method of how to "realistically" fake the demo. The demo could have been faked since SM at that time needed another device to show some progress. That unit was never seen again in other demos. The whole thing is a major quagmire because we are dealing with dark videos, a 2nd rate engineer report, no real serious testing reports, an inventor with a major sob story, many devices that are "all" supposed to work, investors that have most likely been burned, MIB paranoia, and more. So all is possible. The FTPU could have been the device that he got from Europe and all the rest could have been faked. Or all are real and the OPTU (black goose) is a fake. WTF. They could all be real.
Then you think that there is a guy named Madoff could concoct a ponzi scheme and defraud countless billions from what we would consider to be the most sophisticated investors in the world and the organizations that control them, then how easy can it be to defraud a few investors with a nice looking TPU. I know it is hard to read but unfortunately it is the reality any TPUer has to deal with. Working to make a TPU always knowing in the back of your mind that it could have been faked from day one. SOaB.
So we keep going.
I know this is a long post so sorry but I wanted to get back to the anode/cathode theory and how it could fit inside the FTPU.
Give an anode and a cathode a permanently excited dielectric and they will produce an energy output continuously. So let's look at this in the nuts and bolts of how it could fit inside an FTPU.
The toroid has to half wound coils so we can easily see there MUST be a coupling action there or a point of transfer from one to the other. Yes they could be used as regular chokes but such regular chokes are a dime a dozen for smoothing output voltages of 60 volts so why would you use such an elaborate toroid for such a mundane usage. Because it is not a choke.
Take the two rings, one end of each is left open, the other end goes to each side of only one of the half coils in the center toroid. So one of the center toroid coils has one end going to one ring and the other end of the same half toroid going to the other ring. Automatically these simple connections have now transformed the rings into an anode and a cathode. Now pulse the outer coils that surround each ring and find the frequency that may simulate or better still "replicate" a dielectric radiance. Bingo, your rings are now running as the poles of a constant capacitor or battery. Now connect your output to the other half coil in the toroid.
This provides a vacuum tube type design where the source energy in isolated from the load side via the plate, the source energy in the TPU is isolated by the toroid halves. This also would explain why the outer coils where not so diligently wound. The required effect was not winding critical. This also can be extended to all other TPU designs.
Notice in the LTPU his meter showed maximum amperage above the toroids. That confirms that the toroids are the transfer point. Two toroids means four rings, two anodes, two cathodes in the LPTU. Not three.
This is how I try to think about the problem, always bringing the theory back to the nut and bolts of the device itself. The above tells me this is feasible since all the elements are there. There is also room for some variations but the parts physically fit. So this will be the next tests. lol
wattsup
QuoteThe only real odd ball of the TPUs is the OPTU. Two rings but only one with a wind. WTF.
LOL ! :) :)
I feel you frustration wattsup. This variety is what holds the secrets in conjuction to knowing the magnetic field orientation and the source of the power. The upside down shutdown is another powerfull clue in how to wire up the device so one phase is 90 degree lagging, which won't work when upside down.
gosh, there's so much energy to be had from powerlines and the principle is so simple !!!
EM
It is important to note how free electrons move. Wikepedia has a good article on this. Please also consider that a good conductor needs not be heated it's atomic structure has plenty of free electrons in it's skin. Free electrons have a preference for migration. Three poynting vectors must be considered. Gravity dielectric and magnetic. Kicked off the mass of the conductor and allowed to not return to the conductor results in the mass of the conductor loosing weight or becoming positively charged. If the free electrons are propelled by any one of the vector forces away from the cathode the complete mass of the cathode is a positively charged capacitor plate and will become relavent to any scource of negative charge. In the first tpu it is obvious that SM employs a magnetic flux field and a gravitational field to insure that free electrons do not return to the conductor and leave the conductor cloud with an inordinate amount of holes in it.
Quote from: EMdevices on February 01, 2009, 03:14:06 PM
LOL ! :) :)
I feel you frustration wattsup. This variety is what holds the secrets in conjuction to knowing the magnetic field orientation and the source of the power. The upside down shutdown is another powerfull clue in how to wire up the device so one phase is 90 degree lagging, which won't work when upside down.
gosh, there's so much energy to be had from powerlines and the principle is so simple !!!
EM
Em, a device that could tap power lines would also be a fantastic invention, think of the applications ,legal or otherwise.
If you can devise a way to do so you would have certain rights to it and it would fit well within our existing technology.
I stongly urge you to develop this idea as it would be very useful technology and Im sure that you could sell this idea much more easily that one that tunes int something else.
If you were able to prove that Steven used your suggested method then many people here would be very gratefull to you as well.
A working circuit that is simple as you say ...one that you have actually used to extract high power from oh lines.
Even a few videos with qualified engineers reports might to the trick .
There have been many times that it would be much easier to believe what you are suggesting.
Please Do it If you are able and willing and please show it if you succeed
But...Please would you create an appropriate thread for it ..or prove it 100%
Lindsay
Hello all,
@wattsup
a 3 loop iron wire .......we need highly accelerated particles!!! An iron core or iron wire will slow down the particles and only heat is the result.. So, you have a contra effect. Instead of an acceleration you have as a start point a slowing down of the particles.
Its better to build a TPU with a copper core, pulse this with tubes and THEN slow down the particles so you can light a bulb.
Ever tried to pulse only the core?
Otto
Quote from: otto on February 02, 2009, 01:30:51 AM
Hello all,
@wattsup
a 3 loop iron wire .......we need highly accelerated particles!!! An iron core or iron wire will slow down the particles and only heat is the result.. So, you have a contra effect. Instead of an acceleration you have as a start point a slowing down of the particles.
Its better to build a TPU with a copper core, pulse this with tubes and THEN slow down the particles so you can light a bulb.
Ever tried to pulse only the core?
Otto
That would mean that the control windings would be used to control the timing of the core/collector pulses....
That must be why they are called control windings.
Let me jump ahead here...the control windings would be used to drive the grids ...or be rectified and only high speed particles would be passed , at the right time to the collector.And would depend on their position in relation to the collector sections ..surely it cant be that simple or can it?
That would be like a Moray device where the secet was to use electron tubes to prevent feed back from one part of the circuit to the next BUT would allow FEED FOWARD.of the particles at just the right time if everything is just the right place for the "alledged"acceleration to take place.....
I wonder how many might actually set this accelerator up and see what they can achieve without mollasses screwing things up
Good one Otto!
Be carefull
Faraday unipolar dynamo is a device which is using such principle at least that is an explanation I found. Electrons in rotating copper disc are speed up by magnetic field interaction and current show itself between shaft and an edge of the disc. It's a closed conductor surface, and also because of that it is inefficient. Some currents are used up to heat disc because they are flowing in closed path.
What if the same concept is used within TPU for collecting current generated from rotating magnetic field ?
Of course here it's not a disc inside (could be also) but Tesla has given improved schematic of unipolar dynamo with disc shattered into separate not connected areas.
I think to build TPU we should :
1. Implement efficient rotating magnetic field around ring with high speed
2. Implement collecting coils , maybe based on Faraday unipolar dynamo concept
Hello all,
@Mannix
I pulsed a core. Result, wonderful light.
I pulsed only the collectors. Result, wonderful light.
I pulsed a combination of 2 collectors AND just 1 core. Result, best light so far. With a current of say 2A at 20V. Yes I know. Its a lot of current. No, the light was not full lighted. The point was to see how I could use the core. Of course my core is on 1 end open. When I shorted the core I saw the current rising and then I lost the light.
In the past I pused all kinds of transformers and feeded the signals into the TPU coils. I wanted really big signals. I also tried it with a camera flash unit. It worked great but at lower frequencies then we need.
In this moment I have connected my controls in series with the collector.
Now people imagine to pulse a control coil and the result is feeded into a collector. Have you all enough imagination??
It seems that a nice adventure is waiting. If I fail - no problem - then I have made something wrong and there is no way to be dissapointed. Im not the brightest "lamp" here, ha,ha.
Otto
Quote from: forest on February 02, 2009, 03:25:49 AM
Faraday unipolar dynamo is a device which is using such principle at least that is an explanation I found. Electrons in rotating copper disc are speed up by magnetic field interaction and current show itself between shaft and an edge of the disc. It's a closed conductor surface, and also because of that it is inefficient. Some currents are used up to heat disc because they are flowing in closed path.
What if the same concept is used within TPU for collecting current generated from rotating magnetic field ?
Of course here it's not a disc inside (could be also) but Tesla has given improved schematic of unipolar dynamo with disc shattered into separate not connected areas.
I think to build TPU we should :
1. Implement efficient rotating magnetic field around ring with high speed
2. Implement collecting coils , maybe based on Faraday unipolar dynamo concept
Yes,
but we will need near light speed particles and its the tubes that are the only things with a chance to deal with them.
A rotating mag field I believe is secondary to the particle accelerator which is running at incredibly high speeds in a circle ...which are simply beyond the design paramaters of ss and accidentally/fortuitously within the characteristics of many tubes which produce particles of high speed and who really knows how high in different conditions than those for which they were designed.
Its no surprise that ss had taken over for so many things because "WE DO NOT NEED THE SPEED ANY MORE" in energy using devices ..do we?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betatron
Now it's clear why TPU does not work when turned back. It still works but no output, no slowdown electrons appear . Betatron needed an electrons source also. Does copper wire contain enough electrons or must be filled up before speed up action occur ? I'm sorry Mannix that we are so dumb (I am :'()
it may be interesting for you that I'm quite sure Hubbard used the same principle and magnetic fields are crucial for that action, but that's my personal opinion.It may be interesting because Hubbard used different embodiment which could potentially eliminate problems with core heat and frequency limits.I state that because apparent output from his little device was much higher then TPU.
Regards
forest (Dumb)
Nobody is dumb we all are learning (hopefully)
Much of the info is only now ringing all the right bells . I do not know why I was so slow to make the right connections.
Gray, hubbard ,moray, sweet.,.etc etc the only exception is hendershot who had something a bit closer to Stevens devices
they all rely on what I will loosely call dilectric action......did you know that static discharges from unrolling sticky tape produces xrays?
None of this means that any of us will be able to build a tpu...but we should at least be using all of the specific clues given, and the most important one is the bottles IMHO
hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
IMAGEN LIKE YOU HAVE MAGNETS << particles >> IN TO THE SOME TRIODE
AND THEN YOU WHILL NEED ONLY CONTROL GRID ;) ;) ;)
SUMARY OF THIS IF YOU TRANSFORM <<ELKTRONES TO MAGNETS <<particles>>.>
THEN ??? ??? ??? ???
I want you guys to suceed in your endevours because this TPU technology is amazing no matter where the power comes from, but in case you guys missed it:
you can pulse all sorts of geometries and cores untill you're blue in the face, but you won't duplicate SM's technology unless you are close to powerlines and have that INHERENT FREQUENCY OF THE EARTHS MAGNETIC FIELD surrounding your device.
So go experiment in the proximity of powerlines and your sucess will quickly follow ! (100 ft is close enough, don't go any closer)
According to the "master", energy has to come from somewhere and SM couldn't be more plain and direct when he said his device converts energy and is tuned to the earth magnetic field (in the first video), and there is a whole lot of energy in the proximity of powerlines going up into the kHz frequencies, and the fact that the mansion is near HV lines is not simply a coincidence, it is part of the secret !
I'm just trying to help, it pains me to see folks talking about such esoteric subjects and cherished fantacies. At least, test these exotic devices next to powerlines and then you might stand a chance to suceed !!!
EM
Quote from: EMdevices on February 02, 2009, 01:28:37 PM
I want you guys to suceed in your endevours because this TPU technology is amazing no matter where the power comes from, but in case you guys missed it:
you can pulse all sorts of geometries and cores untill you're blue in the face, but you won't duplicate SM's technology unless you are close to powerlines and have that INHERENT FREQUENCY OF THE EARTHS MAGNETIC FIELD surrounding your device.
So go experiment in the proximity of powerlines and your sucess will quickly follow ! (100 ft is close enough, don't go any closer)
According to the "master", energy has to come from somewhere and SM couldn't be more plain and direct when he said his device converts energy and is tuned to the earth magnetic field (in the first video), and there is a whole lot of energy in the proximity of powerlines going up into the kHz frequencies, and the fact that the mansion is near HV lines is not simply a coincidence, it is part of the secret !
I'm just trying to help, it pains me to see folks talking about such esoteric subjects and cherished fantacies. At least, test these exotic devices next to powerlines and then you might stand a chance to suceed !!!
EM
Oh NO! EM if you solve how cyclones are powered by proximity to powerlines I would be glad if you start another interesting thread of discussion...
Meantime, I will give you some interesting info. Once upon a time Tesla considered a metallic ring turning around Earth equator in direction opposite to the rotation of Earth.He surely was able to imagine the huge current flowing inside such metallic ring.But that was theoretical investigation,right ? Hmm...
Read this :
"When the brush assumes the form indicated in Fig. 16, it may be brought to a state of extreme sensitiveness to electrostatic and magnetic influence. The bulb hanging straight down from a wire, and all objects being remote from it, the approach of the observer at a few paces from the bulb will cause the brush to fly to the opposite side, and if he walks around the bulb it will always keep on the opposite side. It may begin to spin around the terminal long before it reaches that sensitive stage. When it begins to turn around principally, but also before, it is affected by a magnet, and at a certain stage it is susceptible to magnetic influence to an astonishing degree. A small permanent magnet, with its poles at a distance of no more than two centimetres, will affect it visibly at a distance of two metres, slowing down or accelerating the rotation according to how it is held relatively to the brush. I think I have observed that at the stage when it is most sensitive to magnetic, it is not most sensitive to electrostatic, influence. My explanation is, that the electrostatic attraction between the brush and the glass of the bulb, which retards the rotation, grows much quicker than the magnetic influence when the intensity of the stream is increased.
When the bulb hangs with the globe L down, the rotation is always clockwise. In the southern hemisphere it would occur in the opposite direction and on the equator, the brush should not turn at all. The rotation may be reversed by a magnet kept at some distance. The brush rotates best, seemingly, when it is at right angles to the lines of force of the earth. It very likely rotates, when at its maximum speed, in synchronism with the alternations, say 10,000 times a second. The rotation can be slowed down or accelerated by the approach or receding of the observer, or any conducting body, but it cannot be reversed by putting the bulb in any position. When it is in the state of the highest sensitiveness and the potential or frequency be varied the sensitiveness is rapidly diminished. Changing either of these but little will generally stop the rotation. The sensitiveness is likewise affected by the variations of temperature. To attain great sensitiveness it is necessary to have the small sphere s in the centre of the globe L, as otherwise the electrostatic action of the glass of the globe will tend to stop the rotation. The sphere s should be small and of uniform thickness; any dissymmetry of course has the effect to diminish the sensitiveness. The fact that the brush rotates in a definite direction in a permanent magnetic field seems to show that in alternating currents of very high frequency the positive and negative impulses are not equal, but that one always preponderates
over the other.
Of course, this rotation in one direction may be due to the action of two elements of the same current upon each other, or to the action of the field produced by one of the elements upon the other, as in a series motor, without necessarily one impulse being stronger than the other. The fact that the brush turns, as far as I could observe, in any position, would speak for this view. In such case it would turn at any point of the earth's surface. But, on the other hand, it is then hard to explain why a permanent magnet should reverse the rotation, and one must assume the preponderance of impulses of one kind."
Similar concept was a theme of long conversation between me and my friend. All I always knew is that : if you be able to produce current inside SOMETHING (like plasma or air) which is rotating in different direction then Earth , or not rotating with Earth or at least rotating slightly slower then Earth surface, then you would be able to tap really large amount of power by using potential difference and charged particles. Apparently it's not a theoretical task, because cyclones exists and TPU also. ;D
Anyway I'm a theorist only with two left hands for manual work ;-)
@EMdevices: When do you finally stop it. Its not possible to get these powers from the power lines. You are always talking, prove it when you have the solution!!
A.
Those pictures are only schematic of what I call "cyclone effect", it's not TPU!
We have a ring or tube of flowing particles (current) in circle.
In Fig 1 we have normal current or particles stream sustained by some force like battery or other. if we turn back the circuit the flow is reversing direction and the output still manifest itself on output wires.
Very symmetrical.
In Fig 2 we have "cyclone effect" - external force is driving particles which are essentially "levitating" in absent of this driving force.Like magnet over superconductor (or opposite ?). This external force is unidirectional so after turning back the ring particles movement is slowed down,stopped and reversed but that's another issue, anyway the output ceased by the configuration of tapping wires (which has to be similar in case of such accelerator ring)
@all,
Is it possible that the TPU (which I nothing about) has 2 air currents moving in it in opposite directions? We all know what happens when two air masses run against each other in different directions and look how much power is created there. If you guys are talking about how the TPU needs something connected to a ground (Earth), then isnt it just possible that there is static electricity being created in that ring? That this device is like creating lightning inside it by air friction?
Mark
Two relative scalar waves sharing a common field.
Quote from: Smart Monkey on February 02, 2009, 05:03:00 PM
Two relative scalar waves sharing a common field.
Interesting.I'm lost with all those scalar waves, but there is something in it...How scalar waves are related to stationary electric waves ?
@forest
Your figure 1, for the reverse to be true, it has to be the same way as the plain and switch only the arrows. As you show it now, it is only left view and right view of the same direction.
I have been following the work here for almost 2 years now and as far as I can recall EM has always contributed in a positive and constructive manner and has always backed up his posts with good science.
I think it's a shame that a few of you are being RUDE to him.
In my mind it says more about your character than his...
Quote from: duff on February 03, 2009, 01:00:50 AM
I have been following the work here for almost 2 years now and as far as I can recall EM has always contributed in a positive and constructive manner and has always backed up his posts with good science.
I think it's a shame that a few of you are being RUDE to him.
In my mind it says more about your character than his...
I agree,
Em is Honestly trying to help us as he sees fit.
This is very hard and Em thinks he has the solution.
I hope he will share the solution and not just tell people to stop wasting their time , but show them so.
This is why people get a bit bad mannered..because they see his suggestion as bad mannered its a cycle that best to stop.
I think he has contributed a lot in the past ..but dont forget he has played a few naughty tricks as well.
We need our belief systems to be validated and is very difficult not having an actual solution in front of you.
so for em its power lines...end of story unless he can actually do it.
Im still interested in what he has to say except for when he goes house hunting with the wrong house.
I still say If he can do it he will be a rich man very soon.
As I dont know of any body else who has ever done it with great power levels.
Lindsay
We are complicated people and understanding a tpu might well be as hard as other things
Quote from: wattsup on February 02, 2009, 10:51:32 PM
@forest
Your figure 1, for the reverse to be true, it has to be the same way as the plain and switch only the arrows. As you show it now, it is only left view and right view of the same direction.
@wattsup
It's true , believe me I checked on ring because it was hard to visualize. If you have a circuit in ring shape and DC current is flowing in it, mark an arrow in direction of flow on bottom and top of the ring. Then turn ring as SM shown in video.Arrow will point in opposite direction because flow is still the same inside ring but symmetry is different (like in mirror).Of course connection to power source is untouched.
In case of Fig 2 , flow is sustained by external force (!) which is out of this symmetry manipulation and always point in one direction. It's like sparks likes to say : different frame of reference. ;D
Look what I found.
http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/445045/particle-accelerator/60511/Betatrons
"(...) An electromagnetic wave is in effect a combination of oscillating electric and magnetic fields vibrating at right angles to each other. The key with a particle accelerator is to set up the wave so that, when the particles arrive, the electric field is in the direction needed to accelerate the particles. This can be done with a standing waveâ€"a combination of waves moving in opposite directions in an enclosed space, rather like sound waves vibrating in an organ pipe. Alternatively, for very fast-moving electrons, which travel very close to the speed of light (in other words, close to the speed of the wave itself), a traveling wave can be used for acceleration."
A copper conductor is a room temperature negative plasma. The ionized neuclear cores are distributed in the core of the conductor whereas the electron cloud is in the skin of the conductor. Please click on the link below for a better understanding of how and why SM utlized the high frequency kick. The kick can reach into the gamma ray portion of the emwave spectrum. The photon stream introduced into a plasma resulting in the below described events.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plasma_acceleration
@EM
Do you have any idea what the ambient HV is like. I mean is it mostly positive or negative or both or is it mostly static waves or magnetism. There must already be tons of documentation on the type of this ambient energy. I don't really know anything about the subject but there should already be instruments that could be modified to catch more of this energy. I say push ahead and let the chips fall where they may. If that is proven to be the case, then that is really SMs problem because we will still work to make a "real" TPU. And, in any case, what we do to find the TPU will help you find if this can catch HV from the lines. lol
@otto
I am thinking the tube analogy was for system function. While using the tubes, SM must have had an idea to replicate the tube but in regular atmosphere. When you send 5v to the cathode, this low frequency voltage creates a semi-plasmid condition of the cathode that increases the molecular frequency of the cathode material. The incoming electrons cannot stay in such a dynamic plasmid condition so they shoot off the cathode and once free they are attracted to the plate collector but at the speed of their impact with the plate. So you can increase the frequency of a material by heating it or you can increase just the frequency without the direct heating.
So I understand what you are saying but I still need to look in other avenues just to make sure.
Looking into Dielectric materials, I found these two web sites located here;
http://www.birkelbachfilm.de/e/index200.htm
http://www.ttiinc.com/object/me_zogbi_20071015.html
Notice that the FTPU was on a plastic reel, the OTPU had two plastic rings and the later TPUs had some black material in the rings that could be some type of polysulphone.
Then I found this document and I put it on my ftp site here;
http://www.purco.qc.ca/ftp/Researchers/Plasma%20Research/
Just click on the pdf file. Check the first paragraph on page 5. Sometimes, someone elses problem can be a solution if we read between the lines.
Before I continue with various FTPU builds, I am making a diagram of how I think it is and will post it here. The diagram will propose various wiring schemes for testing. I know that @Vortex1 would be interested in this since he has been waiting for some time now and if there are others able to do some testing with the wiring diagrams and come back with results.
If these results could be tabulated, then such information would be useful for the next round of tests and eventually, we could pin down a closer build spec.
About the rings, remember "wire is very important". Yes is could be a copper wire ring, but is it one strand or multi insulated or non-insulated strands. I am also looking into a ring using tantalum wire (if I can find it), because tantalum is a known capacitor material. Or better still to use rings that have the same material as the anode and plate materials of a vaccum tube. So one ring in one material and the other ring in another material, since one would be positive and other negative potentials.
From the third link above, I am thinking the ring could be teflon coated aluminium wire of about 12-14 awg. The telfon would make a very good dielectric for the outer coil to effect. The outer coil wire is not regular either. I would say the outer coil insulator is transparent and very thin to have th ebest or closest contact between it and the ring, but I have not found a wire that would give a good visual.
It just means more fun.
Quote from: wattsup on February 03, 2009, 12:40:31 PM
@EM
Do you have any idea what the ambient HV is like. I mean is it mostly positive or negative or both or is it mostly static waves or magnetism.
If you are reffering to the ambient potential between the earth and the ionosphere, the answer to your question simply depends on your reference points.
If earth is one plate of the capacitor and the sky is the other, and you put a third between them, it's polarity will depend on your reference point and the distance between the other plate.
But any piece of metal is always charged to a certain potential as showed by Mr Herman Plauson.
Tesla explained when his radiant event was triggerd it could be two things, he never really found out which one it was.
His first explenation was that the radiant event charged up things so they would be charged more positive then the ambient potential.
Whenever this happens, the ambient potential will restore the charge diffrence, and thus there will be a flow of energy between the two reference points, tha charged metal and the surrounding environment.
Thi also explanes why one wire transmission works because the energy simply flows in and out of the entire local area.
The second explenation Mr.Tesla gave was that due to the high voltage bombardement, the metal gave up it's environmental charge.
This will make the metal charged less positive in respect to the ambient potential and again it will restore the balance so we have again a flow of energy between the metal and the local area.
Mr Tesla never found out which one it was.
But personally i do not think the energy in the tpu is comming from the charge between the earth and the sky.
If you look at the first reciever coil in a radio it consists of one coil coupled to the antenna and the other end connected to ground.
This concentrates the energy out of the RF spectrum arond the coil, so that it can be picked up by the second coil which is resonant to the desired frequency we want to recieve.
If we want to recieve energy from ELF or VLF waves we would need an antenna by the size of Texas, because the frequency is so low.
Think for a second a coil by the size of Texas, and then think powerlines......
The ELFand VLF waves are concentrated around these lines because the powerlines act like a wave guide.
In theory the powerlines are comparable to the first reciever coil in a radio.
Now we only need to build the second reciever coil(s) and place them in the field created by the first (powerline) reciever coil.
I am sure some radio engeneers that are here know what can be done with the ratios between the two coils to make it pick up just a portion of the energy available, making the second coil compact, and pherhaps even as small as a tpu itself.
If the above doesn't ring any bells, then so be it, but i am with EM on the powerline theory.
Marco.
I believe energy in TPU is normal current unfortunately.That's why it's dangerous,a lot of amps.
Tesla used something else, I tend to imagine it as a longitudinal waves in Earth magnetic field.A lot of variety configurations exactly like in electronic circuit. You can have Ac like waves,DC (+ or -) like and so on.
That's why so many effects.But that's not TPU I think, however a TPU which would produce harmless cold electricity would be perfect!
Please pay attention Forest, if the tpu act like the second coil in a radio, this would indeed be normal current.
However if you take a close look at the moment Steven connects and disconnects loads to his device you will see there is a great deal of high voltage there.
This probably is some RF component, but it can be something else.
In either case it can be converted to traditional current so in both cases it would lead to the same output.
M.
Steven said that they never knew where the power actually came from and I believe him.
If it was power lines ,then im sure he would have known that
However persuing the low frequency reciever is valuable in any case and there is valuable application regardless.
Stay with us on this EM, Im excited about any device that can be tuned to extract energy from a distance from any thing with the kind of power demonstrated.
@-[marco]-
My question to EM was more directly related to the energy around the HV lines near the mansion.
I was thinking exactly the same thing about the whole electrical grid could be used like Moray if there was a power failure, hence no voltage in the grid, just make a Moray device, get a good ground, latch onto the electrical and bingo.
hello
i was allways think that TPU is like metal detector "upside down stuff"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_detector
Well Steven said there were engineers that measured the local field strength.
I often wonder what equipment they used, simply because HV lines that close to the demonstration HAVE to show up on good equipment.
Steven said they never found anything, so pherhaps somebody has to go up there and measure it again :-\
Even on a spectral analysis from a loose piece of wire, the powergrid is dominant visible.
Pherhaps the engineers conciderd it normal and their equipment was unable to detect VLF or even ELF waves.
M.
hello
i second thing
positive lighting hhmm i believe that was sm little story about tesla
and positive lighting is 10* stronger then negative lighting and only 5% all the lightins are positive why?
then i have to find out if there is a similar thing positive lighting and inrush current "vacuum tubes"
let see i have the find some books or maybe internet will help me
bye
It should be clear that the devices will be so big that you cannot imagine to capture ELF and VLF waves, for example from power lines. No chance with the size of stevens devices. The next proof is that the field lines must be in an exact direction, that means a little movement of the coil means no power any more and that means a little angle, not a turn over. You should think about that.
A.
Quote from: zapnic on February 03, 2009, 07:26:27 PM
hello
i second thing
positive lighting hhmm i believe that was sm little story about tesla
and positive lighting is 10* stronger then negative lighting and only 5% all the lightins are positive why?
then i have to find out if there is a similar thing positive lighting and inrush current "vacuum tubes"
let see i have the find some books or maybe internet will help me
bye
this can help
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corona_discharge
Quote from: wings on February 04, 2009, 05:13:25 AM
this can help
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corona_discharge
positive
Quote from: wings on February 04, 2009, 05:13:25 AM
this can help
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corona_discharge
negative
@otto
I read your posts on the other thread but came back to this thread to not spread out.
Tube locations in SM tpus.
ftpu - center underneath what I thought was a microphone diaphragm or battery. It would have at least 1/2"-3/4" clearance all around if inside the reel center tube. SM was extra careful not to put his fingers on it when he turned it over you can see his hesitation on where to land one of his fingers. Ouch.
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Steven%20Mark/ftpu/ftpu-battery1.jpg (http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Steven%20Mark/ftpu/ftpu-battery1.jpg)
optu - Again the oddball unit. The only place I can think of is inside the metal box at the output????? There are tubes that are encased in a metal cover. But let's skip this one because there are many things that don't simply equate to the others.
stpu - 6tpu - Will depend on the answers to some of the questions below.
mtpu - ltpu
I do not think he would put a tube sideways inside the center plastic box.
What bugs me about these two devices is the false center boards.
Why go to the trouble of making that false board.
Now if I take the 60 volts of the ftpu, I'd say he needed 6 volts to start and keep it going,that's 10%, so if the ltpu is making 800 volts, I'd say he would need a minimum of 80 good dc volties with some amperage to back it up. So WHERE could he stash that much juice? Under the danged flagin center board. We already know about that. Right?????
So....800 V from the ltpu.
If you get 300v per tube, you would need 3 tubes. But three tubes would not need 80 volts. OK. We know that tubes get hot, but I need to know the answer to the following questions.
Q1: If a tube is rated to have 5v input to heat the cathode, if you only put 3 volts, will it still work but at a lower voltage output and a lower heat dissipation rate? If I needed only 3 tubes, but decided to use 6 tubes, but at the 3 volts level instead of 5 volts, would the tubes still work?
Then answer this one.
Q2 The high voltage off the tube plate(s) will be unstable. OK
Do two mobius rings do the same thing as a full wave bridge rectifier? Seems to me every time I would pulse an AC sine wave into a pair of mobius rings the output would always come out dc no matter what?
Then answer this one.
Q3: What effect can you put on a vacuum tube by applying outer influences such as the center mag field of a toroid bucking coil or a positioned magnet? Can such an influence change the cathode condition or output frequency or anything else inside a vacuum tube such as increasing havoc? We have tried quenched reed switches. What about quenched vacuum tubes?
Then answer this one.
Q4. Can't remember where I read it but it said some tubes will not work optimally upside down? If that was the case with the ftpu, then of course he would not want to say why it would not work upside down. lol
@otto, I would not say it will not work with solid state. Say instead, once we know how it works with tubes, we can migrate this effect to SS. That is more right in my mind. A tube transfers from the cathode to the plate via the air. A toroid transfers from the primary to the secondary via the core. The tube provides no back and forth interplay. A toroid does. In your tests, you may consider providing the 5volts to the tube via a primary loop that can recycle that 5 volts back. But let's continue.
The stpu and 6tpu have enough width of the toroid wall to hide a small tube but only if it is not run at full applied voltage to the cathode otherwise I feel the TPU would melt much more then we can see in the videos. The melting we see is from inside homogeneous heating that you would get if the tube was run at a fraction of the design voltage. Otherwise the tube would have created real smoke. If the tube was designed for 300 volts output and it only produced 100 volts, can we assume the tube was running at 1/3 applied voltage to the cathode.
In the 6tpu it is the same effect but he could have 2 tubes.
mtpu = 4-6 tubes.
ltpu - 8-12 tubes could be hidden inside the ring and enough batteries under the center board.
SM does not leave anything in his demo video to "chance". The cut away sequence was supposed to impart the illusion of a random cutting event of the tpu, but I am convinced there was nothing random about the specific parts of the ring he did cut. Nothing was left to chance especially to give away any more information then was necessary about the ring contents. The random act is an illusion to try and get you to think the ring is made in the same way all around.
So yes, tubes is possible if the answers to the questions above fall into a realistic range. Otherwise, if a tube has to have 5 volts and has to create the known heat levels, then tubes are not in the tpus.
But I know me, and I will still push the SS side for now until I have completely put forth a build and tested it. I am almost finished my plans and will post it soon, but without tubes. I am sure it will give you some ideas regardless.
Maybe one more logic item to point out. We'll take the ftpu again as an example. This is about the output of the tpu. Since we cannot really pinpoint a tank capacitor in the ftpu, we can assume that the tank capacitor is the load. When he puts the meter terminals to the output, he closes the output circuit just like when you connect a light to the secondary of a working transformer. When the light is not on, the primary side is still working even thought the secondary is not connected. So look to do the same thing. Let the load complete the output loop. This is why you could have two mobious loops on the output. Remember the stpu had two rigid, I would say metal extensions coming out about 1 1/2" out of the toroid where he connected the lamp and meter. When he put the meter probes to touch the two outputs, they did not move at all. Why not just have wires. Why rigid metal ouputs?????
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Steven%20Mark/stpu/stpu-rigid-ouput1..jpg (http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Steven%20Mark/stpu/stpu-rigid-ouput1..jpg)
OK last thing about tubes. They can be dangerous if pulsed in certain frequencies they are supposed to produce even x-rays. So please be careful and don't cook your own body when testing them. Others may know more about this but I know care should be taken.
Quote from: wattsup on February 07, 2009, 02:52:14 PM
OK last thing about tubes. They can be dangerous if pulsed in certain frequencies they are supposed to produce even x-rays. So please be careful and don't cook your own body when testing them. Others may know more about this but I know care should be taken.
And just how fast are those electrons ??? are there other states???...................................................BINGO!
A little off-topic. Hmm...Am I crazy or we are touching more then a solution for TPU ?
What if ( just theoretically) electricity is basically a wave and only because conductor is a very bad waveguide we have a lot of reflections forming "particles" called "electrons". ? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interference
If we want to realize a tpu we need
1) tuning hardware for around 5 to 6 kHz
2) a source of ambient energy (hint, hint :) )
To address the first point, you will realize it is not so eazy to get low resonance with a decent quality factor from mere coils and capacitors (LC tank circuits) What realy is needed is a high quality type of resonator and based on the clues from the videos, these can be the mechanical/vibrational type. Sonic speeds are so much slower then the speed of light and also the resistance (or loss) of energy in a tank is lower.
A few type of devices can be built, and I belive have been built by SM, but I can not escape the feeling that he mentioned "bailing wire" because it is critical. If you read about magnetostriction and the Wiedemann effect (torsional effect) you will realize how nicely it fits in. Now we can couple magnetic fields at 90 degrees to each other and create strains and acoustic waves in a wire that is precut to a certain length to be resonant at that frequency. Here's just one website that mensions magnetostriction type of sensors: http://www.swri.org/3pubs/brochure/d17/magneto/magneto.htm
The OTPU could be using the vibrational properties of the rings, so simular concepts but different geometry.
I get quite a bit of induction near power lines, I'm working to build my resonator, and some of these acoustic resonators can have quality factors up to 70000, which means the little voltage I might get induced in a simple coil can be amplifyed that much more. (I get induction of 0.01 volts not so far away from the lines, so imagine I multipy by 70 000, I would be getting 700 volts !!!!! )
EM
P.S. there are many different configurations for this magnetostriction effect. We can drive the collector with DC and drive the controls with AC or vice versa. Just to illustrate one configuration here's a diagram. Here I drive the iron wire with DC voltage to impose a circular magnetic field inside of it. The control coils then produce an oscillatory longitudinal field inside the wire. The two fields will interact and produce a strain or wave of acoustic energy inside the wire that travels back and forth (only if the wire is magnetic). At the right frequency it will resonate, and it will have high Q. (or low loss) There are several patents out there utilizing this phenomena for high quality resonators.
Tesla's secondaries look like helical resonators loaded with a torroidal cap sometimes spherical. Driven at say a quarter wavelength or any other frequency insuring an antinode at the base and a node at the top. A lot of energy can be stored in this standing wave field as each input signal adds to the energy intensity standing in this field. How does this standing wave or dense energetic field relate to the rest of the ambient conditions? The energy is not being radiated from the circuit but mother nature knows things are different over there. What is her response? If we look at what Tesla was doing in his magnifying transmitter the standing wave goes undamped. His special expensive ground transmitted a longitudinal em wave through the electron field of the Earth as the ground connection represents just an anitnode and the wave spreads out longitudinally in the Earth inductor. This creates a standing wave pattern with nodes and antinodes along the spherical inductor. Lets plop down a ground connection and run it into another helical resonator. Say the ground is on a nodal plane. The resonator doesnt give a damn because it just recreates the standing wave along it's helical geometry with the nodes fallling at different geometrical spots on the helice. The receiver helice tuned so that the node again ends up on the top of the helical resonator and the capacitor loading is identical to the transmitter. Now you need to tap the sw. The voltage between the nodes and antinodes is one way. Or the current between the nodes and antinodes is another. The transmitter remains undamped but not the receiver. Mr. Tesla was getting his input energy for free mind you.
Yes; I charged the condenser with 40,000 volts. When it was charged full, I discharged it suddenly, through a short circuit which gave me a very rapid rate of oscillation. Let us suppose that I had stored in the condenser 10 watts. Then, for such a wave there is a flux of energy of (4 x 104)2, and this is multiplied by the frequency of 100,000. You see, it may go into thousands or millions of horsepower.
@Mannix.
Quote from: Mannix on February 07, 2009, 05:29:12 PM
And just how fast are those electrons ??? are there other states???...................................................BINGO!
I don't know.................but I do know how to play BINGO. lol
@otto
OK here is a question.
Run with gain. A small transistor can run with gain because when I give it 1.5 volts on the gate it let's x amount of voltage to pass and as I give it more and more it will let more and more into the circuit and so on. Would this be
correct? So a simple transistor could be a simple escalator if left to its devices.
@EM
Thanks for your post. Yes it could be directly related to vibration since vibration is movement, no matter how small. You can turn a magnet inside a coil, you can make a coil that resembles a magnet with sections that pulse in sequence or.... you can vibrate a magnet inside a coil. All are forms of movement.
I am putting up a FTPU - Circuit #1 which is really the first one to show the relationships as I see it between the rings, the coils and the toroid. You will notice the parallel between your last diagram and this one, regarding the ring and coil. In your diagram you are showing the ring energized by a battery. In mine, I am energizing the ring via the natural induction that will develop off the polarities of the half toroid.
Transformers usually work from primary to secondary and as such the winds are different. When you have two identical winds on a toroid, this will permit a back and forth movement and make room for tremendous harmonic havoc.
Pulse the right half toroid will also pulse the outer coil and induction will happen through the toroid core and through the ring backwards to the other half toroid on the ring side back towards the other side. This is like a quadruple resonance potential. This will be my first build tests.
Now the circuit will change with the so many variables possible but in general, these are the components one would work with adding maybe two more components by the end of testing. I wanted to put this up as a basis to START.
The ring is simply a three loop mobius of thin insulated bailing wire (iron wire). The outer coils will have to be experimented for actual connection directions to establish a positive potential on one ring and negative on the other.
Let the fun continue.
The simple charging of a capacitor can run with gain. Tesla told us how a loong time ago. Charge her up slow. Let her go fast. Make sure things oscillate a bit from your hammer blow. Mother nature remembers. What SM was doing is no different. Charge up the cap. Dump her into a helical resonator. Tap the current so you don't screwup the primary oscillations. You can throw an arrow at a target or you can invest it into pulling a string on a bow. Which is the biggest bang for the buck/target.
Yes; I charged the condenser with 40,000 volts. When it was charged full, I discharged it suddenly, through a short circuit which gave me a very rapid rate of oscillation. Let us suppose that I had stored in the condenser 10 watts. Then, for such a wave there is a flux of energy of (4 x 104)2, and this is multiplied by the frequency of 100,000. You see, it may go into thousands or millions of horsepower.
@sparks
I wonder how can you utilize the energy you receive through the sudden discharge? This is the point in this, isn't it.
Starting with 10 W and then? Please continue.
Thanks, Gyula
The gain of the system is the rate of the discharge. Which then is duplicated again and again as it oscillates in the same helical resonator. A discharge of say a watt stored in a high voltage capacitor discharged in a nanosecond into a dead short can get into current levels of thousands of amps. Thousands of amps oscillating in a tuned circuit is alot of power. If the wave goes undamped by inductive or capacitance coupling to the oscillator by a load things go into overunity real fast. Does a radio station pull anymore input energy if there are millions of antannes receiving it's signal or just one. Add up all the antennae gain on the trillions of possible dipole antennaes in a broadcast field and compare that to the wattage used to produce the signal.
It does not matter how many antenna's are listening to the same station.
People who claim they have to raise transmitting power when more people are listening , are talking plain BS.
The energy is transmitted in all directions evenly, it does not matter if there are just one or a million recievers in the field.
What does matter for good reception, is the field strength.
If it is high enough you can power anything.
Marco.
Hello all,
@wattsup
sorry, Im weekends off line.
I know that in a TPU is NOT a tube hided. Thats for sure. In my post I only wanted to say the people to use tubes because its easier with them. Its clear that then we have to switch to transistors.
To your questions:
Q1: I think the tubes needs all the heating voltage but Im not sure. As Im working maybe 1 week with tubes Im a newby with them.
Q2: sorry, I dont know.
Q3: this I dont WANT to answer because I need a few days.
Q4:as I suppose I have the wrong tubes, another question that I cant answer.
What I know is that my tubes are working in a totally different manner. This has nothing to do with transistors. We cant compare tubes and transistors in our case of a TPU.
I had luck and found at home a rectifier tube and connected this to my tube triodes. Again the situation changed.
Have you ever connected your MOSFET to your coils and got a signal but without a + or - from the power supply???
Yes youre every day with MOSFETs but if you dont connect +12V of more to your coils you have nothing.
I have a veeeeery big signal with my tubes. WITHOUT a connection to + or - on the other side of the coils.
Yes, I know the risk of X-rays but I dont care.
EM mentioned a source of ambient energy!!! Nice.
Your last question:
yes, a transistor can run with gain but....always this "but".....let us think about a MOSFET: the drain voltage maybe 500V or more. If more what happens?
My tubes have a plate voltage of 400V. But the highest plate voltage for my tube is 300V. What happens with my tube? NOTHING!!!! And what would happen with a transistor if there would be 1 of the parameters much bigger then we can see in the technical papers? They blow!!! I have blown a lot of them.
Then there is another question:
What if we need a lot of kilovolts in our coils. I had a lot of time such a voltage. Can MOSFETs handle such a voltage?? I mean can they handle the frequency + the voltage + .....who knows what else is going on in the coils that we dont see and dont know.
It seems that we also dont WANT to know about the power source in a TPU.
Otto
PS: as you see wattsup, my help was really not great.
Say you need to short a capacitor in 10 nanoseconds or less and cause a huge current surge through your rc network. A semiconductor is a glorified variable resistor. It is gonna pop as soon as you trigger the discharge. A rectifier tube has a much better chance. It has a hell of a lot more charge carriers. But there is a ss device called an avalanche diode. I think wattsup and BEP identified one used shunting SM's capacitors. These devices are capable of ABSORBING high energy transients in high power circuits. They use them to make microwave oscillators. They are operated in reverse bias mode making them really fast. So we're up into the gigahertz as far as frequency of the rlc circuit design. Tesla was really excited when he discovered radar. The signal goes so far and then it comes back. Basically using space itself as a reflector. Tesla also knew the power of dumping a capacitor across a dead short. He spent years developing mechanical shunts.
I'm thinking about kicks... Normally you can have any currents flowing across wire, be it 12V of large current or HV kicks of very short period but almost no amperage.SM said that it makes no difference and such mix happen for heater transformer in vacuum tube.
I don't know if I got it right ,nut seems that there is a very rare incident when low voltage large current mixed wih HV kick create new current, of power being almost multiplication of HV from kick and large current from lower one.Or the kick is alone overunity, but then I have no clear solution, how step it down to get large amps.
One other thing we gotta consider is that we don't want to radiate any energy out of the system. Therefore the resonant frequency of the circuit should be low.
So if SM has an offtuned rlc tank going he probably designed it around a frequency he is familar with and doesn't radiate. If you study Tesla's experiments you begin to realize that Tesla used what he called current waves. The best way I can describe this is that you create a mechanical wave through the electric field. You gotta bunch of charged particles standing around in any electric field. You don't push the electrons or the lack thereof in any direction. You compress and rarify the field like in a sound wave. The energy concentration into his device is from the high current high speed shorting of a capacitor. This event is then replicated in the rlc. What is unique is that by offtuning you can move the nodes and antinodes along your secondary. Like when I use to tune this old electric organ I had. You hit two tones and counted the beats. The more you off tuned the faster it would beat. You could tune it so that the beat was so fast it became inaudible. But you knew it was still there.
I have a little stupid question because I have no scope and never worked with it.
Assume you have perfect AC signal on screen, how do you know what amount of power it is ?
I mean : you can have simple oscillator wave when total wave has power of discharged capacitor, then you can have Tesla oscillation (theoretically) on screen. Tesla stated that each wave part has total energy of capacitor. How do you differentiate ?
Also would be interesting to know if that multiplication is done already on primary side or after transformation into secondary stationary waves. He said that the output power was multiplication of capacitor energy on primary and frequency on secondary (pulses per second).
My friend has a tesla coil and he puts small neon bulbs in a line up and down the resonator. Then he tunes it so the pattern of neons light up at the harmonics he is after. You can't get near this coil without messing with the tuning.
Could inertia effect in TPU be related also to mass increase due to almost light speed inside ? Just an idea... I know that it could easier explained by interation with Earth magnetic field...
Just finished building my first FTPU rings (actually second from way back).
The build is extremely easy to make the outer rings. For this one, I had some 12awg copper stranded wire with a very thin nylon coating so I could not resist using it instead of the iron for now. The three loops are 7" dia. and connected together to make a mobius. at the connection is my input and the outputs are at 1 1/2 loops on the other side. On this I wound 18awg copper stranded wire that had a fairly thin plastic insulation. I am only looking for wires that have a thin covering otherwise the effect may be lost if toooo thick. The coil is wound 24 turns per half loop always the same direction per two halves with about 6" of loose wire per half to permit multiple connection schemes.
My toroid is a 2" dia. with about 32 winds per side.
I will be pulsing AC square/sine, DC and audio to see the differences.
I'll put up a photo on the build tonight.
I will me making a few more of these FTPU builds with varying loop types, wires, etc.
@Forest
The thing about the TPU when all is said and done is that SM himself finally stated that it was all about the kicks. I don't give a shit if he used them to pulse a laser that burnt a hole through a piece of wood it all boils down to something so simple it is inconceivable to most. Grumpy must have said it 20 or 30 times. You charge up a capacitor with 1watt and release it so you get megawatts. You can charge up a magnetic capacitor also it doesn't matter. It's time that screws everyone up. Everyone will say well it took you an hour at so many amps to charge up that capacitor. And your discharge only lasted for a couple of nanoseconds. Ya that was the first wave of energy and then it sloshes back and forth a couple of 100,000 times. There is very little work done charging the capacitor. Then when the seam of the tank ruptures it blows a hole right through anything in the way. Does it make any difference how long it took to concentrate this energy. Not when your standing in another part of the building blown right through a wall and the compressor tank has turned to ice.
Sparks, I figured it out maybe.It's not about kicks at all, but about what you can DO with THEM if you have them synchronized, self-sustained. And it's all about a big but very short magnetic spike THEY create. Am I right ? And of course speed of recreation this effect around...
You got it. Tesla utilized the kick years ago. He would take a generator and charge up a capacitor (sometimes just used the capacity of the primary system itself) to 40,000 volts or whatever the alternators could handle before they shorted. Then he would short this primary capacitor out across a spark gap and load capacitor. The capacitor would be part of a resonant lc tank operated at high q. Each time the energy was stored in the inductor the capacitor would appear as empty to the input and the primary capacitor would short into the rc capacitor and then the inductor would follow in short order and push the load capacitor to a higher voltage. You can see by this that soon you need to stop inputting energy or else this expotential gain in amplitude of the rc current and voltage rise is gonna go over the top. One time he screwed up and the power in the system got dumped on the alternators supplying the primary resonant circuit and blew them up. Sympathetic vibrations all the way. The load was pulled off either by using the inductance as motor windings or the voltage as lighting. Parallel operation across the rc network. Of course one of the motors could be the input alternator after a while as long as the coils were of proper inductance and didn't screw up the oscillations. Tesla was after turning the whole Earth into a rc tank circuit so he didnt bother much with worrying about feedback.
Nice drawings there wattsup and marco,
I was looking at the patent posted and the person claims he was getting between 2.5 and 3 volts from a 5 killowatt AM radio station at a distance of about 5 miles, wow !!, now imagine what you can get from a 150 killowatt "radio station" 100 feet away LOL :) ;D :)
EM
@EM
What's freaky about what @marco put up is that there are many tpu elements in it. lol
Aerial and ground could be the two rings
36 and 37 could be the toroid
One way or the other.
About 2 miles away from my home, there is are 2 x two hv lines that converge together and head for Montreal like the letter "Y". Imagine being where both lines meet.
The ftpu build is dumb easy, there are not many variables.
Making variations of this will be easy using different cores etc.
Here is a photo without the toroid in the center.
Regarding the toroid again, I know, what a pain.
I have done tests with two toroids that have the one layer wind and pretty massive core like the one in the FTPU. It does not make any sense to have so much mass in the core if you are only making a one layer of 32 turns. Where else in electronics would you see such a coil to core mass disparity? I mean that little amount of turns of copper on such a sizable core seems not enough to make even a tickle on the core. Especially the laminated rolled iron core type toroids. I think this would then have to be a metglass type special material that is highly responsive given the size involved and lack of turns. Unless this is again the Ozone Patent and that round object that is between the ftpu rings is a coil of high inductance that you would need to create a high voltage capacitor discharge. Shit. I will try that angle next.
Hmmmmmmm. Wire is very important. lol
Quote from: EMdevices on February 10, 2009, 08:37:10 PM
Nice drawings there wattsup and marco,
I was looking at the patent posted and the person claims he was getting between 2.5 and 3 volts from a 5 killowatt AM radio station at a distance of about 5 miles, wow !!, now imagine what you can get from a 150 killowatt "radio station" 100 feet away LOL :) ;D :)
EM
I hope this idea is true. It would be nice to find the solution.
While the circuit posted certainly works, no different than one of Stiffler's in my opinion, it is a wideband circuit. How does he think the power is coming from 'a' nearby station? The majority, maybe?
Then there is a difference between radiation from a broadcast station and power lines. Broadcast stations are made to broadcast. Power lines null radiation, of the energy travelling in the wires, on at least one plane.
Now, if they are simply used as the primary antenna element and these devices are designed to couple to those lines.... maybe. Certainly not coupling for the line frequency. There is not enough radiated energy. Instead of kilowatts try gigawatts. Still not possible.
Radiated energy is a fun topic. Did you know in thermography you can see a very hot object as room temperature, simply because the object may reflect the overriding lower ambient temperature? I'm talking about hundreds of degrees difference.
Why? Because the volume of the ambient washes out the smaller point of higher temperature and that point is more reflective than emmissive.
Point the same non-contact thermal device to the clear sky on a very hot day (not at the Sun). Do you see the temperature of the air above you? No. Your device should read 'OL' as it can't read the low temperatures of outer space.
I think there may some value in this idea about power lines but it will make no difference if they have voltage applied or not.
BEP
Maybe the power companies are getting smart and using the transmission lines to setup some harmonics on em. Longitudinal emwaves through the skin of the conductor instead of pushing amps. I think GE is ready to do this. Tesla was ready to do this but he found the Earth had alot more potential to create standing waves in than what I see up on the towers. Those conductors are hollow with some kinda dielectric material in em to minimize selfinductive losses. Big ole piece of inside out coax. :-\ Too bad they didn't spiral wind them. Resistance of the line would be negligible as the conductor itself would send the signal instead of using all that voltage to push it through. They do rectify older power lines that are considered inefficient because of selfinductive losses causing hysteris heating in the lines. BEP says they filter it but how do they filter the load pull?
Quote from: sparks on February 11, 2009, 10:22:41 AM
Maybe the power companies are getting smart and using the transmission lines to setup some harmonics on em. Longitudinal emwaves through the skin of the conductor instead of pushing amps. I think GE is ready to do this. Tesla was ready to do this but he found the Earth had alot more potential to create standing waves in than what I see up on the towers. Those conductors are hollow with some kinda dielectric material in em to minimize selfinductive losses. Big ole piece of inside out coax. :-\ Too bad they didn't spiral wind them. Resistance of the line would be negligible as the conductor itself would send the signal instead of using all that voltage to push it through.
I they do this we would not see it because of power transformers used to step voltage down. I bet there is already Free Energy coupled with HV lines, but all is then grounded nicely.
Btw: what is the difference between stationary waves and standing waves ?
OK - more hunch time.
What if that damn toroid was wound with litz wire?
I did a google search for "toroid with litz wire" and found only one hit.
http://part15.us/node/1631
It's a good read for coil and antenna builders (rather overunity.comish) , but not much specifics on the toroid with litz wire. Hmmmmm.
If the core had NO flux transfer ability at all, like a wooden core, then the two coils with litz windings would equal the windings in an air core antenna.
The EM Capacitors (two) could wind up being two crystals, one per toroid half then the signal is sent through the rings and outer coils to stabilize the output.
------------------------------------
In the OTPU there is evident a circuit board. This could simply be a small AM radio circuit catching the HV line hash and amplifying it. There is also a FTPU toroid in the OTPU if guys remember well enough.
-----------------------------------
OK I'll stop it now.
@Loner
If you could find anything on such Litz toroids, it would be good to see one or to know where to look.
@all
Found something interesting - A Self Drive Piezo Transducer with a resonant frequency of 6800+/-500hz.
http://www.islproducts.com/prod/piezos/P25080P3.htm
So far the only voltage rises I am seeing is in the 10mhz range with DC pulsing.
Question: At one point SM talked about one or two (can't remember) Forum Members that were getting close to the TPU function. Does anyone know who they were or where I can look for it in this huge Forum. Now that I have a very good mental image of the FTPU and OTPU, I think if I could review their posts, something may click.
Quote from: wattsup on February 13, 2009, 08:06:04 AM
@Loner
If you could find anything on such Litz toroids, it would be good to see one or to know where to look.
@all
Found something interesting - A Self Drive Piezo Transducer with a resonant frequency of 6800+/-500hz.
http://www.islproducts.com/prod/piezos/P25080P3.htm
So far the only voltage rises I am seeing is in the 10mhz range with DC pulsing.
Question: At one point SM talked about one or two (can't remember) Forum Members that were getting close to the TPU function. Does anyone know who they were or where I can look for it in this huge Forum. Now that I have a very good mental image of the FTPU and OTPU, I think if I could review their posts, something may click.
As i can remember it one was Freedomfuel an the other was BushWacker with some points of his HOPE-Generator. Unfortunately Freedomfuel deleted his posts.
Norbert
@Loner
Thanks. It's Tao. I have been doing some major reading all day long, I mean all day long. Back and forth from the Master of Magnetics thread - then looked up Tao's posts before April 13th, 2007 when Mannix posted on Lord of the Rings.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=1872.msg28253#msg28253
Then going back to SM statements on Tube testing and other factors of serial and parallel wire schemes when passed over with a magnet, then it hit me.
The FTPU ring or collector is many lengths of insulated magnet wire. Litz wire or if you take many lengths of a thin magnetic wire all in parallel and turn it into a three looped ring about 12awg in thickness. If you want to move a train, you first have to build the tracks. The more tracks you lay, the farther you will go. I don't know if I could find a Litz that is 12awg thick but if I did, It should have a good 1000 wires or more in it. lol
Pulsing the outer control coil wound over single conductor looped ring is not giving any results or results that anyone would expect as mundane.
My next trials will be with a multi-conductor ring. The multi-wires will give amperage and the three turns will give added voltage.
My ring is 7" in diameter so each loop of 22" circ., so three loops is 66" and add 7" on each side for leads and that makes each length to be 80". If I want two rings that's 160". So if I make a rectangular wooden form that is 66" by 14" and wind x turns, then cut in the center of the 14" ends, I'll have my two loop lengths. Easy as pie.
@otto
Found this for you.
SM Quote (yeh yeh I know)
I have made a great study of Vacuum tube power supplies as I have told you. It is all very interesting. Please remind me to tell you why Nicola Tesla used Vacuum tubes in his most powerful demonstrations of his power conversion technologies.
Anyway, I have taken a high voltage power supply as follows:
500 v-0-500 v 300 mV plate transformer run it through a full wave silicon circuit then run it through a 5U4 electron tube rectifier. Now you know that the 5U4 requires 5 volts AC at 3 amps for its heater to gather the electrons and complete the circuit. Well, I measured the output from the tube and the result is 500 volts DC at 250 mV. The loss is due to the high impedance of the tube and its limited ability to dissipate more than 250 mA.. The point I wish to make here is that also along with the 500 volt DC is, yes, you guessed it, the 5 volts three amp AC current! They are both completely independent of each other except for some very interesting things I will mention to you some other time.
SM Unquote
Funny thing. When you put your power supply onto a coil and turn up the juice, sometimes the voltage and amperage reading on the power supply will go way up, 32vdc 5 amps. But then on other coils, when you do the same thing, the voltage and amperage does not go as high. Why is this different on every coil type? When I put my outer ring coils in series from top level then through bottom level, I can go only up to 3 vdc and 4.8 amps. Hmmmmm, About the same wattage as the tube mentioned above. Would it be correct to say that in a way, the coil itself is self regulating the maximum applied input power like a resistor? This tells me the outer coil winding is close so I will do the same on the next ring.
Next ring coming up.
@wattsup
Do you understand why tubes are important ? I think you got it... Show me SS part able to pass low voltage at high current and high voltage AT THE SAME TIME. Tube can do this.
Seems that mystery is simple fact. if you have an inductor and wire or second inductor then current flowing inside generate a second current shifted in phase beside of original one. It's done due to fact that magnetic field does not collapse with infinite speed. Once you do that in circle (with tubes as signal source) kicks are created becouse some of that waves meet at correct time.Voltage and frequency of kicks are depended on wire length, they probably try to lock to odd number of waves along wire length to sustain flow.Stationary waves.
Seems that similar effect is used for antigravity and it's called Lorentz-O by Stan Deyo. However I cannot find the reference for such effect in literature.
Where can I find Mannix 'king's tale' and carl tale ? I saw that mentioned somewhere...
Hello all,
@wattsup
thanks a lot. This was a great help.
Otto
Hello All... I have read the paper put out by Otto and Robert and am wondering if any new headway has been made on the TPU device? Has it been verified that it really is an OU device or not... Just asking as this is my first day and my first message on this board....
James
nice coils wattsup, keep at it !!
I was reading the Lester Hendershot papers over the weekend, and it appears his device is not that much different then SM's tpu's, if one understands what it's realy doing.
the main thing is that these devices are tuned and they have high Q, which is key ! What has high Q?, well try vibrational types of devices, like reeds, piezo, SAW, magnetostriction, etc... etc...
Hendershot was using the solenoid and the vibrating magnetic assembly, SM I'm convinced is exploiting the magnetostriction properties of wires/rings (for the OTPU)
Hendershot was extracting energy from AM radio station, was one engineer's point of view based on the inductance and capacitance values etc..,
SM was operating in proximity of powerlines which have a number of frequences ready to be harvested, the problem is they are low frequency and it's hard to come up with a high Q device (by conventional wisdom) at those frequencies, but he did it.
@BEP, as you know, we are in the nearfield at 6 kHz and 150 feet away from the power lines, and are coupling inductively to the mag fields surrounding those lines. Also, to say that we are harvesting em waves we would have to be a number of wavelengths away from the "transmiter" or radiating sturcture, so that we can say we are in the far field. At 6 kHz 150 feet away we are definitley in the near field.
There is a way to amplify the energy received thousands of times with little or no power input, and the way to do it is by employing a high Q resonator. We can also use REGENERATION, which in effect induces a positive feedback to lower the apparent resistance of the tank circuit therby increasing the Q.
keep at it guys
EM
Hi EMdevices and all:
Would a piezo element, tuned to resonate at 6Khz, vibrate with exposure to the near field.
Perhaps some assistance: Having the piezo element mounted underneath the toroidal coil. Affix a magnet on the piezo element, maybe with a bead of hot melt for a spacer, dead center inside the toroidal coil. Piezo will most likely not produce much energy but lets say SM had access to some speaker coils. The speaker coil would be small enough to be mounted inside the toroidal coil as well with the magnet free to vibrate inside the speaker coil. The speaker coil would be secured inside the toroidal coil by using epoxy. Perhaps the toroidal coil is actually a speaker magnet with copper windings on it. The center magnet/piezo movement induces enough current to switch the speaker magnet off allowing the element to relax and sink/bow down starting the cycle over again at a rapid 6Khz rate. A battery may be able to be switched in at this rate by using the mechanical vibration of the element. Either way it could be touchy and an external magnet may have to be placed somewhere to influence this movement in a more productive way. Would not be able to turn it upside down though. This would change the mechanical characteristics and kill the process. Unless, however, one were to set it up where this assembly was put together for vertical assembly in mind as opposed to horizontal.
Maybe I should have placed this in one of the half baked threads.
Take care.
nap
@EM
So you are thinking the power transmission lines are the opera singer and the TPU is the wine glass?
It is not difficult to make a loop of metal have a high vibrational Q, but at a harmonic factor of 100?
Even with low frequency loop antennae, the coupling loop, as small as it is, and the driven element do not use conventional induction to perform the coupling. (Yes, many will disagree with this and some designs use other coupling methods)
Em,
Would you say that Henry Moray Tapped the power lines as well?
Nikola Tesla in 1890
probably Clemente Figueras in 1902
Roy Meyers in 1913
Alfred Hubbard in 1919
Lester Hendershot in 1928
Floyd Sweet around 1980
Steven Mark around ????
Paul Baumann around ????
and many others
All seems to have the same design or part of it !!!
A few inductors or transformers in CLOSED PATH, different ways to shift phase of currents and mix them together all around.
Quote from: Mannix on February 15, 2009, 11:39:39 PM
Em,
Would you say that Henry Moray Tapped the power lines as well?
I don't think so,
They took it to the desert far,far away from powerlines!
Marco.
Say we have an electromechanical compass. We pulse the needle at the proper time it will experience a torque towards alignment with the magfield of the earth. Like a wind vane. The other way to gain from the near earth mag field is to establish a magnetic current towards a common low pressure area. The currents will experience the coriolus force and bend towards the equator instead of impacting straight on. There must be a magnetic fluid. You can compress it spin it accelerate it there are equal lines of force just like a weather map. The wind seems to be blowing south to north. When you look at the magnitude of the electrical displacement currents running west to east it is no wonder the magnetosphere is so damn big. Venus is barely spinning it has no magnetosphere.
Sparks,
What if we could use just a tiny fraction of what you describe ....BUT 100 thousand times a second.
Steven said that it was that earths magnetic field in the video for want of a better explanation.
He also said that he/they never knew for sure from where the power came.
He said tubes ..over and over . I dont think he was being economic with the truth . Just sparse on specifics, as also stated.
I also knew that no diagram would be given ..just guidance for personal experiments to head in the right direction, a direction that I notice very few actually take because they are too smart to use tubes..after all, they have been outdated and superseeded havent they?
The only way is to contribute to this is by experimentation using the devices recommended...do join the fun and "sparks"
A geiger counter will be very useful and guess what's inside them?
Lindsay
@chef
My info on Hendershot comes from a pdf file titled: The Hendershot Motor Mystery, inside you find quite usefull info and some hand writen notes, those notes are excellent.
@slapper
I think that is a great idea slapper, I have even seen patents where they join a piezo and a magnet and coil setup for transduction type of circuits. I think you got the idea of what I'm shooting for.
@mannix
I haven't read what Moray did in a while, so I won't speculate about it. I hope the energy received is free and abundent, but if its entering my house I'LL USE IT, no matter where it comes from. Be it the powerlines one mile away or that AM radio tower 10 miles away, if I can tune into it and extract it's my free energy LOL :)
@ all,
Here's the beauty of working with magnetic loops instead of antennas:
assuming the magnetic field density permeating my house at a particular frequency is:
b = a * sin(2 pi f t)
where 'a' is some amplitude,
then the voltage induced in a loop of N turns and 1 m^2 of area is as follows:
v = N db/dt = 2 pi f a N cos(2 pi f t)
where it is evident the amplitude of this voltage is now:
|v| = 2 pi f a N
Now, just think about that for a while, notice it now depends on the FREQUENCY. So it is beneficial to receive as high in frequency a signal as possible (but there are always limitations)
If we are receiving a signal at 100 000 Hz, well that's a 100 thousand multiplication factor right there, don't need any amps to do that, it's the nature of magnetism that does it !!
I hope this gets some of you thinking if you weren't before, LOL
I've done these calculations before but I'm just amazed how well they work. Like I was telling you, it amplifyes the signals quite well. Now all I need is to construct a good high Q resonator which is becoming more of a problem than I thought. But I'll do it eventualy. SM spent 10 or 20 years perfecting his devices. I plan on a much shorter schedule.
EM
Hello all,
@EM
do your "job" with tubes. They are amazing!!!
Dont even think you know how tubes are working. Today I wrote to a good friend a message and I told him it looks like tubes are recievers for "cosmic rays", aether or call it what you want.
Still no tubers here??
Otto
I like it when Eric Dollard puts a vacuum bulb powered up by two nodes which have no voltage inbetween them but do represent conductors upon which dielectric fields can tereminate. He then shows that inside that altered vacuum state within the bulb there exists a potential over ground. He charges a capacitor one end hooked to a sink and the other end close to the bulb. Try doing that with a mosfet. In a wire the electrons may go one way but the space inbetween them gets altered alot faster than those little buggers which have MASS can move.
Energy inside a capacitor is stored in the form of altered vacuum. It has shit to do with electrons. When we charge a capacitor we condense the vacuum or create mass. The field between capacitor plates is relative to all other types of vacuum. A blackhole is condensed vacuum or full of energy. The core of the Sun holds the atmosphere together because energy is continually condensing in it's core. The sun doesn't run out of fuel it runs out of energy stored in the form of mass in it's near field to condense in it's massive neutron core. The more energy confined in a field the more gravity. This is a cooling process of our Universe to create mass from a totally energetic or radiant field. In one neutron of one atom there may have existed at one time a complete planet. The proton still has some spin to it's surface and hasn't cooled enough to become a neutron lacking the mass of the neutron. Meanwhile the neutron is able to hold protons together because of the weak atomic force which is actually ENERGY DENSITY relativity. Tempic field arises from this EDR. Cold electricity gravity etc.
Quote from: sparks on February 17, 2009, 10:39:31 AM
...When we charge a capacitor we ... create mass....
That should be obvious, charging a capacitor mean storing energy and energy=mass, so yes it should be a heavier capacitor ;D
@otto
Regarding the 5vdc to the tube cathode, I think if it was applied via a "vibrator" tube, there may be a way to return it back to source. I think it was EV Grey that used one with his tube.
I have tubes, even a tube tester but right now my plate is full with the study of coil and ring results that will eventually help also, since tubes will still need coils.
@EM
Push on. The math is above my head but I trust your explanation. Go for it. You will probably need some Litz wire for that antenna. Hendershot had collectors and control coils also.
@all
I had prepared a rather long post but will not post it. I just have one question regarding the ring. I made a new ring with Litz and two outer coils that is working fine. The ring has 1050 strands of 46awg and when looped in three, this gives 3150 wires to catch energy from the control coils. One CC is wound full length and the other about 25 degress over the ring and they are connected in series. The good thing about this particular wiring is that I am getting the best results from 1 volt up to 6 volts and at each volt increment, I am getting more output. I feel such an attribute of the coiling is essential if the device is to work with gain, it has to work just as well at low voltage as with higher voltage. Most coil schemes I test work either well at low or high but not accross the board.
The question is this. My Litz wire is straight.
When the outer coil imparts energy to the ring, Lenz's law will make it so the more energy the ring gets, the more it will repel more energy from the control coil. Even though the ring has three turns and this sort of equals a bifilar set-up, what if the ring was also like a twisted pair. Would this cancel the rings field and enable the control coil to impart more energy???????
We are fighting with Lenz's law all the way. Imagine any air coil with a twisted pair secondary connected bifilar then with a one strand primary of x turns. Would the secondary act like an energy funnel that creates no repelling action on the primary. That is going to be the key.
My next tests will be with one regular ring and one twisted pair ring for comparisons to see if I can push more energy into the ring.
The wires in the ring of the FTPU could be a multi-bundled twisted pair even though they look like a standard wire. "Wire is very important".
Hmmm I wonder if @otto's ECD used a tightly wound twisted pair type ring, maybe there would have been more results.
Added: Even if we are already on the next page I thought I should add a photo of my current coil just to give you guys the real idea.
try a neo near the coil to see if that increases transfer
What if we could manage coils in such way that the output of coil would be original current and a second ghost current shifted in phase for example 90 degrees.What if we put a lot of such currents into circle forceing them to flow in closed path many times per second. They would meet each other from time to time a create larger sinus, then larger ,the larger...Hmmm At the end we should get a lot of kicks. But where is the end of this process ????
Quote from: Chef on February 17, 2009, 02:11:49 PM
I have that paper, I think, I have everything about Hendershot. In one paper, he stated, he planned to use earth currents in his first idea, and those famous coils, and motors was the end products. He made different devices to achieve that goal during the progress. He state too, early motors worked only when aligned to North. How do you think alignment is important if he tapped to AM station?
I don't know.. maybe something like this .... : http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/3497-aromaz-radiant-energy-joint-research-group-18.html#post45765
Iron atoms could do that no matter of object orientation in magnetic field. They are acting like small compasses I think, though I'm not sure
Pulse Power Switching Devices - An Overview
By John Pasley
5/8/96
Copyright John Pasley 1996. This document may be freely distributed via. any
means in part or in whole, however the authors name must be included and
correctly attributed. The References Listed and The Disclaimer must also be
included.
Foreword by Carey Sublette:
An essential component of modern nuclear weapon technology is the ability
to rapidly switch high voltage/high current electrical circuits at very high
speeds.
The detonators that fire high explosive implosion systems (exploding wire or
exploding foil detonators) require voltages in the range of (roughly) 2-20
kilovolts, a complete detonating system may draw currents ranging from 10
to 100 kiloamps. Pulse neutron tubes, used to precisely control the
initiation of fission chain reactions, require voltages of 100 to 200
kilovolts, and currents in the ampere range. These currents must be turned
on rapidly and precisely, timing accuracies of tens to hundreds of
nanoseconds are required.
Switching devices that meet these stringent requirements often require
specialized technologies or skills to manufacture. They are also dual use -
in addition to weapons applications they have many civilian uses too.
Examples include controlling flash lamps used in high speed photography or
industrial photochemistry, generating high power radar pulses, in high
energy physics laboratory equipment, to name but a few. Consequently
commercial sale and international trade in these devices is permitted, but
it is also regulated. Attempts to circumvent these regulations have gained
considerable public attention in a number of technology smuggling cases in
the 1980s and 90s involving one particular type of device - the Krytron.
These devices have even appeared prominently in popular entertainment as
the "McGuffin" used to drive espionage thrillers - like Roman Polanski's
"Frantic".
This article summarizes the basic technologies and devices, and their
principle properties.
Section 1.0: Introduction.
Before entering into a consideration of the individual devices that concern
us, it would be as well to explain some of the associated technology/
terminology.
1.1 Switching basics and terminology.
The switch is possibly the most elementary device in the field of
electronics. A switch controls the flow of current in a circuit in a manner
such that either the current flows at a value determined by the other
components in series with it, or does not flow at all, as the case may be.
However this ideal behavior is actually never exactly what is seen in real
life. A switch has it's own parameters that determine how fast it can switch
from open to closed, or how rapidly it can interrupt the flow of current
once it is has been opened. Also of course there are more elementary
considerations such as the current handling capacity of the switch and the
peak voltage it can cope with before damage or other unwanted effects occur.
Mechanical switches such as are common in the home are in actuality far
from ideal in their behavior. The time taken to switch from off to on ( the
commutation time) is typically in the millisecond range. Also spurious
effects such as bouncing may occur as the switch fluctuates rapidly from
open to closed in the process of being physically manipulated by the operator.
Electromagnetic relays and reed switches experience similar problems to
those seen in the humble light switch. Long commutation and switch bounce
are standard features of virtually all mechanical switching devices.
With the advent of transistors and similar devices such as thyristors one
would have thought that these slow switching problems would be things of the
past. This is in fact largely true. But semiconductors are limited in other
ways, it is very hard to find semiconductors capable of switching many
kiloamperes especially at potentials in the kilovolt region, and those
devices that can manage high currents such as the larger thyristors are
troubled by overly high commutation times. Whilst there are now
semiconductors coming onto the market capable of performing at these
extremes of current and voltage there are some requirements which put even
these devices to shame. If you want to switch 50 kilo Amperes with a sub 20
nanosecond commutation time at 20kV you are going to be in trouble if you
are relying on semiconductor technology. However there is an alternative
class of devices that have been around long before the humble transistor
came on the scene. You might think that vacuum tubes and similar are a
thing of the past. But for problems of this magnitude they are the only
things on the market that will do the job.
1.2 Vacuum and Gas filled switching tubes, introduction and terminology.
There are a great many different types of vacuum tube in existence, however
it is possible to group tubes according to some fairly basic criteria. There
are two primary distinguishing features, the source of free electrons
within the device and the gaseous filling (or lack of it) within the tube
envelope. The later of these two concepts we have already introduced by
implication. A vacuum tube is a device with a vacuum (very low pressure gas)
filling. And a gas filled device is, as the name would suggest, filled with
gas that might be at a pressure somewhat above or below atmospheric. The
type of gas used is also an important feature, particularly in switching
tubes where a wide variety of fillings are encountered.
The source of the free conduction electrons in the device may be either
thermal such as a heated filament physically associated with the cathode of
the device - a hot cathode, or alternatively a simple consequence of a high
voltage gradient across the device, resulting in autoemission from the
cathode. A device employing this latter method is known as a cold cathode
device. In high voltage switching the presence of high voltages, and hence
the possibility of large voltage gradients within devices means that the
cold cathode system, quite a rarity in most other types of tubes, is the
norm rather than the exception.
Other important terms encountered in gaseous state switching tubes:
Delay time.
The delay time is the time taken between the application of a trigger pulse
and the commencement of conduction between the primary electrodes.
Jitter.
Jitter is the variation of time delay from shot to shot given similar
electrical stimulus.
Commutation time.
The commutation time is the time taken for the conduction to reach maximum
once it has commenced. (i.e. From the time from the end of the delay time to
the time at which the maximum level of conduction occurs.)
It should be pointed out that none of the switching tubes we are about to
consider look very much like the things in the back of an old radio set.
Many are large, some exceptionally so. Also glass has largely given way to
ceramic in the higher powered devices. Before you go down your local
electronics shop or radio shack it should also be pointed out that many of
these devices besides costing $100's (often $1000's) a piece, and are also
largely unavailable to the general public due to their application in
advanced missile and nuclear weapon technologies. Of these devices the most
'everyday' is the ignitron which finds much application in industrial
welding situations.
The following devices are considered herein:
2.0 Vacuum and Gaseous State Switching devices
2.1 Introduction to Cold Cathode Trigger Tubes
2.2 The Krytron.
2.3 The Sprytron.
2.4 The Thyratron.
2.5 The Over Voltage Spark Gap.
2.6 The Triggered Spark Gap.
2.7 The Ignitron
In addition I will include a short section on some of the solid state
devices that are finally beginning to fill the shoes of the above gaseous
state device (to a very marginal extent in most cases).
Section four will detail the ways in which these devices might be employed
in nuclear weapons.
2.0 Vacuum and gaseous state switching devices
Most of the devices in this section switch by inducing an arcing process in
a gaseous medium. I have included in the triggered spark gap section some
mention of devices that actually use a liquid or solid substitute for the
gaseous material that is the norm in triggered spark gaps.
The process of arc formation is actually quite complex physically, and it
will not be gone into in any depth. Anyone who wishes to look more deeply
into this aspect of device operation may contact the author for some
suggestions as to suitable text books for use in such study.
2.1 An Introduction to Cold Cathode Switching Tubes.
Cold cathode trigger tubes are physically small devices designed to switch
impulse currents and voltages of relatively small amplitude. Usually they
are intended, as their name suggests, to trigger other larger devices.
Typically cold cathode trigger tubes are designed to switch pulses of a few
hundred volts and a few hundred milliamperes. Most trigger tubes have three
or four electrodes, anode, cathode (+ve and -ve terminals respectively), a
trigger/control electrode and sometimes a priming electrode.
A trigger tube performs in a very simple manner akin to that of a triggered
spark gap, excepting that usually the conduction is not by an arcing but
glow discharge. The glow discharge is initiated when all of the following
factors are present:
i) A sufficiently high voltage is present across the device
(between anode and cathode)
ii) A trigger pulse of sufficient amplitude is present at the trigger
electrode.
iii) The gas in the tube is primed.
Cold cathode trigger tubes rely upon some external or internal source to
ionize the gas suitably for conduction to commence (This is called priming).
This means that in theory some of these tubes will only switch a minute or
so after the application of a suitable triggering voltage to the appropriate
terminal of the device when some natural source of ionizing radiation
ionizes the gas (forming a plasma) and hence causes conduction to commence.
The triggering is basically random- it is subject to huge statistical
variation even in apparently similar environments. Some devices incorporate
a suitably ionizing source to reduce the maximum possible time delay after
trigger application considerably. This source may be an electronic,
radioactive or photon source of some form or other. However even the
standard commercial devices often display a large variation (up to and above
an order of magnitude different) between devices fired in sunlight and
darkness, a standard commercial tube Z900T for instance displays a 20us
delay in day light and a 250us delay in darkness.
2.2 The Krytron:
Krytrons are completely different to the familiar Klystrons often encountered.
Krytrons are a highly specialized variety of cold cathode trigger tube. They
were one of the first products developed by the US based company EG&G. The
Krytron has 4 electrodes, and is filled with a gas at low pressure. A
Krytron is distinguished among cold cathode trigger tubes for a variety of
reasons.
The Krytron is designed to switch moderately high impulse currents (up to
around 3kA) and voltages (Up to around 5kV) in an arc discharge mode,
compare this with the usual glow discharge of the standard trigger tube.
Also, and perhaps more importantly, the Krytron is able to turn on this arc
discharge very rapidly, the reason being that it relies on an already
present plasma to support the conduction, rather than waiting for the plasma
to be formed as a result of priming etc. This plasma is created and
sustained by a keep-alive current between the keep-alive electrode and the
cathode of the device. When the trigger is applied under the conditions of a
high anode to cathode voltage, this plasma forms an easy path for the main
conduction between anode and cathode.
The fact that a conduction path is already established prior to triggering
makes a huge difference in the commutation time of these devices compared to
standard cold cathode trigger tubes. Commutation times below 1 nanosecond
are achievable with Krytrons and the time lag between application of trigger
and the commencement of switching may be less than 30 ns with an optimized
driver circuit. (Note this delay is largely due to the fact that the ionized
path will need to spread from the keep alive terminal to the anode of the
device).
Compare this delay time to that seen in the standard trigger tube
which is dependent upon many environmental factors and typically 3 or 4
orders of magnitude greater. Note that the variation in time delay exhibited
by the krytron is almost totally independent of environment, however the
time delay may be reduced up to a point with increasing trigger voltage.
Likewise the commutation time is generally decreased if the rise time of
the trigger pulse is also decreased. Given identical trigger pulses however
a krytron will have a very similar time delay from one shot to the next.
This variation is known as jitter and may be less than 5ns in optimal
circumstances.
This short commutation time and inherent environmental insensitivity of the
krytron is achieved by including a radioactive priming source, the weak beta
emitter Nickel-63. The source maintains weak the gas filling the tube in a weak
state of ionization, which aides the formation of the initial glow discharge
between the keep alive and the cathode. Ni-63 has a half-life of 92 years and
produces beta particles with an energy of only 65.9 KeV and no gamma radiation
at all. The quantity in each device is less than 5 microcuries and presents no
significant hazard. Usually the source is pulse welded to a piece of Nickel wire that
is in turn welded to one of the electrode supports.
Priming sources (which is also occasionally a radioactive source) are also be
employed in standard trigger tubes to reduce their environmental sensitivity.
Krytrons typically come in a small glass envelope somewhat similar to a neon
indicator bulb with more leads.
Krytrons require a high voltage pulse (500V to 2kV) to be applied to the
trigger electrode to fire successfully. This pulse is almost always
generated by a pulse transformer fired by a capacitor discharge in the
primary (rather like a simple strobe tube firing circuit).
The krytron often has only a short life expectancy if used regularly (often
as few as a couple of hundred shots) However when used within the
appropriate parameters and well within the expected life time they are
extremely reliable, requiring no warm up and being immune to many
environmental factors to a large extent (e.g. vibration, temperature,
acceleration).
These properties, combined with the small size make the krytron ideal for
use in the detonating circuitry of certain types of missiles and smart bombs.
The krytron may be used directly to fire a high precision exploding wire, or
alternatively as part of the triggering circuitry for a triggered spark gap
or similar ultra high current triggering device as used in exploding foil
slapper type detonators and larger EBW circuits.
Krytrons are used in firing circuits for certain lasers and flash tubes and
also in some pulse welding applications, often as triggering devices for
other larger devices such as Thyratrons and spark gaps.
The export/sale of krytrons is controlled under Dual Use Guidelines.
2.3 The Sprytron.
The Sprytron, otherwise known as the Vacuum Krytron, is a device of very
similar performance to the Krytron. Though it generally exhibits a somewhat
lower time delay after triggering. The Sprytron is designed for use in
environments were high levels of radiation are present. The sprytron is a
hard vacuum 'filled' device unlike the krytron which, as noted above
contains a low pressure gas.
The Sprytron has only three leads, (no keep alive), but is otherwise very
similar in outward construction to the Krytron. The reason for the use of a
vacuum filling is almost certainly that there is no medium present for
radiation from the external environment to ionize (such ionization could
promote spurious triggering effects.)
The Sprytron requires a more powerful trigger pulse than the Krytron, as the
device works by forming an arc directly between the trigger and the cathode,
which causes the tube to breakdown (go into conduction) by disrupting the
field between the anode and cathode.
Although it is usually stated that Krytrons were the devices sought in smuggling
involving Israel, Iraq and Pakistan, it may well be that Sprytrons were involved with
at least some of these cases, rather than the gas filled krytron, due to the very similar
size and performance coupled with very high radiation resistance.
The reason that radiation sensitivity is important in nuclear warheads is not actually
that the radiation levels inside a bomb are liable to be especially high. It is rather that a nearby nuclear explosion may in the case of a non radiation hard device, cause an
undesirable condition in the warhead. This defect may prevent the weapon
from being able to explode either at the correct target or at all. Also it
is conceivable that such a scenario could result in the detonation of the
second device. (nuclear dominos if you like). It is not considered
particularly helpful to have nuclear weapons explode at the wrong moment.
Even a few tenths of a second can be vital if the target is such that
it requires a very precisely timed detonation. (e.g. if an attempt is being
made to damage a hardened installation such as a missile silo or command
center)
A Sprytron is triggered in a similar fashion to Krytron, but as mentioned
requires a higher energy trigger pulse and therefore a more powerful trigger
transformer etc. EG&G makes trigger transformers optimized for use with
their various tubes, and also make devices named Krytron-Pacs which
incorporate a gas filled krytron and trigger transformer in a single housing.
One final point. It is interesting to note that in application circuits
(references 1 and 4) the sprytron is always shown directly switching a load
(an Exploding bridge Wire.) and a Krytron is always shown triggering a
secondary device such as a triggered spark gap. This may just be
coincidence, but as there is no apparent reason why a sprytron couldn't be
used in either role, it also occurs to me that possibly such a design might
be significant in the design of nuclear warheads, certainly this would
appear to be a useful combination (see section 4).
2.4 Thyratrons:
Thyratrons come in several varieties. All work similarly to the
semiconductor Thyristor, one difference being that in many designs (Hydrogen
Thyratrons are a common exception) the gate must be biased highly negative
in the off state and then biased positive to achieve switching. Like
Thyristors, Thyratrons operate like a latching switch, ie. once you have
turned them on you can only turn off by cutting the supply to the main
circuit. Mercury filled Thyratrons are the slowest, least useful type and
are much more restricted environmentally than other types due chiefly to
problems with the mercury condensing . They are rarely used as they have few
advantages of the thyristor. Hydrogen Thyratrons are *much* faster
switching than Thyristors. Some can achieve commutation in under 20ns. Inert
gas fillings tend to offer superior performance compared to mercury filled
devices, without matching the speed of the Hydrogen filled devices.
Note that Hydrogen Filled Devices employ a hot cathode.
The actual Physical construction/ operation of the thyratron is quite
complicated compared to the other devices we have looked at and no attempt
will be made to explain it's operation. The reader is advised to consult a
wide range of books as devices employing different fillings, or electrode
heating methods operate differently. It is not considered to be especially
important to consider all these variations here as this is merely an
overview of these devices and is not intended to be the final word on the
subject. However, in order to differentiate the thyratron form other similar
devices and to define it in at least some physical manner here follows
Frungel's (Ref.4) definition of the device:
'By the term 'thyratron' there is meant a discharge chamber in which are
arranged a cathode, one or several grids, and an anode, and which is filled
with an inert gas or metal vapor.'
Some Thyratrons can handle up to 50kV(double gap types) switch thousands
of Amperes and handle very high power outputs( e.g. CX 1154 can handle peak
powers of 40MW). Typical applications are Radar pulse modulators, Particle
accelerators, Lasers and high voltage medical equipment. Another variety of
thyratron is filled with Deuterium. These Deuterium filled devices are
similar to their Hydrogen filled counterparts but the sparking potential
for Deuterium is higher thus allowing even higher voltages to be handled.
E.g. E3213 can switch 70kV (double gap type). Specialist Thyratrons with
ceramic and metal bodies are encountered. These are designed to be used in
extreme environmental conditions. There is a wide variety of grid
configurations seen in Thyratrons, it would be impractical to consider them
all here. Manufacturers of Thyratrons Include EG&G, GEC, English Electric
Valve Co.Ltd, M-O Valve co.Ltd. Big Thyratrons often require you to get a
big box full of driver/control circuitry. Prices vary from a couple of
dollars to thousands. Hot and cold cathode type devices are encountered.
Note these ratings are the exception rather than the rule in Thyratron
devices, devices designed for sub kilovolt voltages and only capable of
handling a few tens of amps pulsed are common enough.
Thyratrons typically come in either small multi pin base type packages such
as are common in other vacuum tubes or in the case of the higher current
devices large tubular packages with hefty end connectors.
2.5 The Over Voltage Spark Gap
The Over voltage spark gap is essentially just two electrodes with a gap
between. When the voltage between the two electrodes exceeds the breakdown
voltage of the gas, the device arcs over and a current is very rapidly
established. The voltage at which arcing occurs in these devices is given by
the Dynamic Breakdown Voltage, which is the voltage at which the device will
breakdown for a fast rising impulse voltage. Note that this voltage may be
as much as 1.5 times greater than the static breakdown voltage (breakdown
voltage for a slowly rising voltage.) how much greater than the static
breakdown voltage the actual breakdown voltage is will be depends almost
entirely on how rapidly the voltage rise, a shorter rise time means a higher
breakdown voltage. Commutation times for these devices are exceptionally low
(sometimes less than 1nanosecond).
Overvoltage gaps are primarily used for protection. But in combination with
the other devices mentioned here they are commonly used to sharpen the
output pulses (decrease the rise times) of very high current pulses form
triggered switching devices e.g. Thyratrons.
The size of these devices is almost entirely dependent upon how much
current/voltage they are intended to switch, There is really no limit as to
the size of these devices they can be as small as krytrons, however they can
also be very big, and devices intended to switch MA will be just that.
2.6 Triggered spark gaps
The triggered spark gap is a simple device, a high voltage trigger pulse
applied to a trigger electrode initiates an arc between anode and cathode.
This trigger pulse may be utilized within the device in a variety of ways to
initiate the main discharge. Different spark gaps are so designed to employ
one particular method to create the main anode to cathode discharge. The
different methods areas follows-
Triggered spark gap electrode configurations:
i) Field distortion: three electrodes; employs the point discharge (actually
sharp edge) effect in the creation a conducting path
ii) Irradiated: three electrodes; spark source creates an illuminating
plasma that excites electrons between the anode and cathode.
iii) Swinging cascade: three electrodes; trigger electrode nearer to one of
the main electrodes than the other.
iv) Mid plane: three electrodes; basic triggered spark gap with trigger
electrode centrally positioned.
v) Trigatron: trigger to one electrode current forms plasma that spreads to
encompass a path between anode and cathode.
The triggered Spark gap may be filled with a wide variety of materials, the
most common are-
1) Air
2) SF6
3) Argon
4) Oxygen
Often a mixture of the above materials is employed. However a few spark gaps
actually employ liquid or even solid media fillings. Solid filled devices
are often designed for single shot use (they are only used once- then they
are destroyed) Some solid filled devices are designed to switch powers of
10TW (10 000 000 000 000 Watts) such as are encountered in extremely
powerful capacitor bank discharges. Except (obviously) in the case of solid
filled devices, the media is usually pumped through the spark gap. Some
smaller gaps do not use this system though.
Usually Gas filled spark gasp operate in the 20-100kV / 20 to 100kA range
though much higher power devices are available. I have one spec for a
Maxwell gas filled device that can handle 3 MA - that's 3 Million Amperes!
But then it is the size of a small car!! More commonly gas filled devices
have dimensions of a few inches. Packages are often shaped like large ice
pucks though biconical, tubular and box like structures are also seen.
Sparkgaps are often designed for use in a certain external environment(eg.
they might be immersed in oil). A system for transmitting the media to the
appropriate part of the device may sometimes be included. Common
environments used are:
a)Air
b)SF6
c)Oil
Typical spark gap device no.'s are: TG7, TG113, TG 114 etc. etc.
Spark gaps are damaged by repeated heavy discharge. This is an inevitable
consequence of such high discharge currents. Electrode pitting being the
most common form of damage. Between 1 and 10 thousand shots per device is
usually about what is permissible before damage begins to severely degrade
performance.
EG&G make miniature triggered spark gaps specially designed for defense
applications. these devices are physically much smaller than normal spark
gaps (few cm typical dimensions) and designed for use with exploding foil
slapper type detonators.
Laser switching of spark gaps. The fastest way to switch a triggered spark
gap is with an intense pulse of Laser light which creates a plasma between
the electrodes with extreme rapidity. There have been quite a few designs
employing this method, chiefly in the plasma research area.
Triggered spark gaps tend to have long delay times than Thyratrons (their
chief competitor, at least at lower energies) However once conduction has
started it reaches a peak value exceptionally rapidly (couple of nanoseconds
commutation.)
2.7 Ignitrons
The ignitron is mercury vapor rectifier in which an arc is switched between
a (usually graphite) anode and a mercury pool cathode. The discharge is
initiated by an ignitor electrode which dips into the mercury pool cathode.
On application of a suitable impulse current/voltage to this ignitor an
electron emitting source is formed at the point at which the ignitor
contacts the pool. This initiates the arcing between the anode and cathode.
It is important that the ignitor should be triggered correctly. The ignitor
requires a certain energy for successful ignition and also an 'ignitor
characteristic' application of this energy in terms of current and voltage
with respect to time. Misfiring or ignitor damage will otherwise occur. It
is also vital that no significant negative voltage should appear at the
ignitor with respect to the cathode else ignitor destruction will be the
inevitable result.
There are two main ways by which the trigger can be biased:
Anode excitation: common in resistance welding applications here the anode
bias is connected to the ignitor by means of a switch (thyristor, thyratron
etc.) and a resistor/fuse network. The ignitor current drops rapidly on
ignition as the anode-cathode voltage drops very low during conduction.
Separate excitation: as the name suggests, here the ignitor circuit is
largely independent of the main circuit.
Ignitrons are often used in parallel for AC power control applications.
Ignitrons must often be cooled when used continuously (ie. Not single shot
as in capacitor discharge) Water cooling is commonly employed. It is vital
that Ignitrons must be used in the correct temperature range to hot or to
cold can be very bad news for these devices- (cold leads to mercury vapor
condensing on the anode.)
Ignitrons are very limited with regards their physical orientation. This
reason being simple that they rely upon a pool of liquid at one end of the
device that must be correctly positioned for the ignitor to function
correctly. Positioning the device so that it leans over at an angle of more
than 2 or 3 degrees from the vertical is fatal.
Most ignitrons operate at most currents between 5 Amps and 100kA and may be
suitable for voltages from a couple of hundred to 20 000 Volts.
Thyratrons and Krytrons are sometimes used in ignitron triggering circuits
along with the familiar thyristor.
Ignitrons are suited to applications were power control of high voltages or
currents is required. Welding is probably the most common application.
3.0 Solid State Devices.
(Note this section may well be considerably
expanded following further research by the author.)
There are now a few commercially available transistors on the Market which
can switch many tens of kV. There are also a few transistors about that can
handle pulsed currents above 5kA. These devices may match for example
Krytrons and Sprytrons in terms of electrical performance, but not in terms
of size and (in the case of the Sprytron) radiation hardness.
Thyristors are widely available in designs that can handle upwards of 10kA
pulsed at several kV. They are however very slow switching devices and are
not capable of achieving even low microsecond switching speeds.
A new class of devices is at present showing great promise in the R&D
sector. These devices are optically (usually LASER) switched devices
employing GaAs or Diamond film technologies. The reader is advised to
consult the appropriate reference below for more information relating to
these devices.
Final note to the reader: Some of the devices I have mentioned are subject to strict control due to their military applications. Non of the above information is however in any way restricted or controlled. For clarity switching devices that are restricted by dual use guidelines are as follows: (courtesy Oak Ridge National Laboratory) (a) Cold-cathode tubes (including gas krytron tubes and vacuum sprytron tubes), whether gas filled or not, operating similarly to a spark gap, containing three or more electrodes, and having all of the following characteristics: 1.Anode peak voltage rating of 2500 V or more, 2.Anode peak current rating of 100 A or more, 3.Anode delay time of 10 microsecond or less, and (b) Triggered spark-gaps having an anode delay time of 15 microsecond or less rated for a peak current of 500 A or more; (c) Modules or assemblies with a fast switching function having all of the following characteristics: 1.Anode peak voltage rating greater than 2000 V; 2.anode peak current rating of 500 A or more; and 3.turn-on time of 1 microsecond or less. Acknowledgments: I would like to thank the following for their help in the compilation of this article: Carey Sublette for providing a great deal of assistance and encouragement. Roy Schmaus for providing the original www site for the vacuum/gas device info. JPG electronics for providing components used in the testing of certain ideas. References: (in alphabetical order by title) 1) EG&G Catalogues/ Material. (RE: Components) 2) Exploding Wires Vol. 4, Proc. of 4th Conf. on the Exploding Wire Phenomena. Ed. Chace and Moore -Plenum Press (RE: EBW's) 3) High Power Optically Activated Solid State Switches, ed. Rosen And Zutavern- Artech House (RE: Solid state devices) 4) High Speed Pulse Technology by Frank Frungel -Academic Press. (RE: EBW's, FCG's, components) 5) High Velocity Impact Phenomena by Ray Kinslow-Academic Press. (RE: Foil Slappers) 6) IEEE publications (please contact author for more details). 7) Maxwell Catalogues. (RE: spark gaps) 8) Mullard Valves and Tubes Book 2 Part 3 (RE: components) 9) Nuclear Weapons Frequently Asked Questions; Section 7 Nuclear Weapons Nations and Arsenals by Carey Sublette. (RE: smuggling info. relating to krytrons) 10)The Times (RE: smuggling info. relating to krytrons) FURTHER INFORMATION PERTAINING TO THE SUBJECT MATTER WILL BE MUCH WELCOMED BY THE AUTHOR. Information regarding the author: I am not an expert in any of the above technologies and I will welcome any corrections. However please could anyone providing information also provide references to either the material they present or as to themselves so that their contribution may be given due weight. Anyone who would like to contact me (the author) for whatever reason should mail: kc76@cityscape.co.uk Disclaimer: I the author assume no responsibility for anyone who injures/kills themselves trying to implement any of the above technologies. High voltages are generally exceptionally dangerous, and none of the above is intended or should be used to provide instruction in the correct procedures for building or constructing high voltage circuitry of any description. High voltage is used here to describe any voltage which may cause death i.e. anything above 50V.
Hello all,
@wattsup
nice picture, not a nice TPU without a core.
Finally I fond a device that allows me to use - switch kilovolts in my TPU.
T U B E S!!
And the best: I dont have to know how they work ( I know it) because not all connection points in my tubes are connected.
Ever tried to left open a base of a transistor and ply with it?
With tubes there is no problem if I dont connect the grid. They are working and showing me how good they are.
So, dont waste your time like I did with transistors, MOSFETs....use what you have at home, tubes.
I see a lot of people here building TPUs with tubes, sharing their results.....great.
Im a dreamer.
Otto
Come on Guys. With all due respect, let's get real here. I keep reading about Extremely High Voltage, Vacuum Energy, "High Voltage Kicks", Spark Gaps, Vacuum Tubes, H V Transformers, Atoms, Photons, Space Dust, etc.
Now let's take another LOOK at one of SM's 6" TPUs. I see ONE Tiny Little 9V Battery on top to run the circuit board & Coils. Let's get real here, he used VERY LOW POWER to accomplish his rotating field. WHY is everyone deviating away from his designs?
Regards.
.
Quote from: FatBird on February 18, 2009, 09:20:46 AM
Come on Guys. With all due respect, let's get real here. I keep reading about Extremely High Voltage, Vacuum Energy, "High Voltage Kicks", Sparks, Vacuum Tubes, H V Transformers, Atoms, Photons, Space Dust, etc, etc, etc.
Now let's take another LOOK at 1 of SM's 6" TPUs. I see ONE TINY 9V Battery on top to run the circuit board & Coils. Let's get real here, he just used VERY LOW POWER to accomplish his rotating field. WHY is everyone deviating away from his designs?
Regards.
.
What about the biggest TPU on video ? It is powered by more complex circuit and it's only 1kW output power. To heat moderate size house we need at least 20kW.
Switching high power impulses is restricted. >:( So bye bye Tesla magnifying transmitter....Our only hope lies in devices like TPU which is cummulating kicks around. It can be done actively powering with 3 frequencies using tubes or maybe there is another way ... ?
I think we should look deeper at iron atoms properties...Delay...
Quote from: FatBird on February 18, 2009, 09:20:46 AM
Come on Guys. With all due respect, let's get real here. I keep reading about Extremely High Voltage, Vacuum Energy, "High Voltage Kicks", Sparks, Vacuum Tubes, H V Transformers, Atoms, Photons, Space Dust, etc, etc, etc. LOL.
Now let's take another LOOK at 1 of SM's 6" TPUs. I see ONE TINY 9V Battery on top to run the circuit board & Coils. Let's get real here, he just used VERY LOW POWER to accomplish his rotating field. WHY is everyone deviating away from his designs?
Regards.
.
low power circuit i.e. subminiature tube.
http://www.fourwater.com/xmit/submini1.htm#1AD4
http://www.r-type.org/exhib/aaa0274.htm
http://www.r-type.org/exhib/aad0104.htm
http://www.r-type.org/exhib/aaa0112.htm
http://www.r-type.org/exhib/aaa0111.htm
http://www.r-type.org/addtext/add032.htm
http://www.peeblesoriginals.com/tubes-subminiature.html
Quote from: wings on February 18, 2009, 05:11:23 PM
low power circuit i.e. subminiature tube.
http://www.fourwater.com/xmit/submini1.htm#1AD4
http://www.r-type.org/exhib/aaa0274.htm
http://www.r-type.org/exhib/aad0104.htm
http://www.r-type.org/exhib/aaa0112.htm
http://www.r-type.org/exhib/aaa0111.htm
http://www.r-type.org/addtext/add032.htm
http://www.peeblesoriginals.com/tubes-subminiature.html
Yes ,
I have some of those little tubes as well... I would not waste them on experiments.
Perhaps they will come in handy when the understanding through experimentation is at a higher level
Perhaps then ss can be introduced ...that is after you have a running system..most asuredly NOT before.
What is it that makes peole think they know when they have not even tried the devices recommended by the inventor ?..Its no wonder that most of us are slaves to business interests.
I think other clues from SM are more important then just his comments about tubes.
For example has anybody tried to understand the Tesla Magnetometers, which he "tuned" to the magnetic fluctuations? (again all his comments were made in context, which was, he was trying to prove that yes you can extract energy from the MAGNETIC field of the earth)
EM
P.S. In case anybody is interested, I've appended another picture showing how easy it is to tune to low kHz frequencies. My setup is tuned to exactly 5 kHz. The big loop is solid copper and has about 5 turns and the ferrite toroid is in series with it, and adds the main bulk of the inductance (it has about 20 turns) The capacitor is a 10 uF, low ESR, and high amperage. The signal shown is from a quick pulse I gave it with a battery to see what is it's resonant frequency. Notice the quick decay of energy, which means it's low Q. That's why I'm convinced now that SM is not relaying on just the LC tank circuit for his tuning, but is in fact using the vibrational characteristics of wires or discs or other high Q resonators. In the FTPU this has to be the magnetistriction properties of his "bailing" wires that he used.
Hello all,
@FatBird
is seems you should again, or for the first time, read SMs words.
Otto
Where can I find a SIMPLE sinusoidal adjustable generator based purely on vacuum tubes ? Something like replacement for 555 circuit but for AC signal
Quote from: EMdevices on February 18, 2009, 07:28:41 PM
For example has anybody tried to understand the Tesla Magnetometers, which he "tuned" to the magnetic fluctuations? (again all his comments were made in context, which was, he was trying to prove that yes you can extract energy from the MAGNETIC field of the earth)
EM
Hi EM :)
I have found the part which Steven Mark means in Tesla's writings.
Here is the first part by Steven Mark, followed by the part from the writings of Tesla.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steven Mark Wrote:
Nicola Tesla said that one day in his laboratory he was noticing that there were some reactions on his magnetometer for no reason he could understand. The next day he had many magnetometers brought into his laboratory and he began additional research.
He noticed that most of the time the magnetometers stayed relatively sedate and around the same level. They would fluctuate just slightly. however one day he noticed that the meters jumped quite unpredictably. It attracted his attention and he began to find that the meters were reacting to a thunderstorm many hundreds of miles away. Interesting isn't it?
Then he continued his experiments and found that as a thunderstorm moved closer the magnetometers would register larger and larger fluctuations until they were off the scale and useless.
He was fascinated and consumed by this. He acquired better magnetometers and his research found that you could tune the magnetometers to certain specific frequencies and tap directly into large magnetic waves. When I say large, I am referring to huge. That was useable power.
However, you had to find a circuit potential in order for the electrons to flow. That was the difficulty which he overcame to produce his famous demonstrations of power from nowhere.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is the part from Tesla, it is in one of his books aswell as in the colorado spring notes.
Discovery of 'Stationary Waves' made July 3, 1899," and recorded in detail:
Observations made last night. They were such as not to be easily forgotten, for more than one reason. First of all a magnificent sight was afforded by the extraordinary display of lightening, no less than 10-12 thousand discharges being witnessed inside of two hours... An instrument (rotating "coherer") was connected to ground and a plate above ground, as in my plan of telegraphy, and a condenser was used to magnify the effects transmitted through the ground... As the storm receded the most interesting and valuable observation was made. It happened this way: the instrument was again adjusted so as to be more sensitive and to respond readily to any discharge which was seen or heard. It did so for a while, when it stopped. It was thought that the lightening was now too far and it may have been about 50 miles away. All of a sudden the instrument began to play, continuously increasing in strength, although the storm was moving away rapidly. After some time, the indications again ceased but half an hour later the instrument began to record again. When it once more ceased the adjustment was rendered more delicate, in fact very considerably so, still the instrument failed to respond, but half an hour or so it again began to play and now the spring was tightened on the relay very much and still it indicated the discharges. By this time the storm had moved away far out of sight. By readjusting the instrument and setting it again so as to be very sensitive, after some time it began to play periodically. The storm was now at a distance of greater than 200 miles at least. Later in the evening repeatedly the instrument played and ceased to play in intervals nearly of half an hour although most of the horizon was clear by that time.
Marco
A rotating bodies electrical charges can be viewed as alway accelerating as they continously enter and leave one plane to the next. This produces a magnetic field displacement that propogates at 90 degrees to the direction of rotation of the charge field. As the velocity of the rotating body is lower near the axis of rotation than that at the equator the magnetic field displacement at the axis is many orders smaller than that at the equator. The magnetic field arising from the rotating electrical field takes on a polar configuration. The lines of force concentrated near the surface of the rotating electric field at the axis and projecting outward to maximum displacement at the equator.
thanks for that marco, it seems SM is off a bit.
if Tesla used the "coherer" than this document explains more about what that device was:
http://www.teslasociety.com/teslarec.pdf
EM
I think the most important aspect here relates to teslas magnetometer, that is "what" it was measuring and not how it was measured.
Regards
AC
Perhaps Tesla was near some power lines and never realised to significance of them..LOL
I think the most important information, other than what he was measuring, are the distances. Multiples of about 50 miles? The equipment registered again and again at these points of distance to the storm.
Now, if Tesla was writing about things as (I perceive) he saw them, then figure that distance along with his idea of the speed of light and you have the frequency of nodes for his compression waves. Consider these waves as not going below zero, in amplitude. So, the lowest density points are ambient or zero.
Since electromagnetic compression waves do exist in waveguides (like the chamber between Earth and the Ionosphere) it is highly possible he was measuring the magnetic ripple caused by lightning strikes.
Resonance and high Q for a coil designed for this type of wave (travelling compression - not travelling wave) should not be hard to achieve. Is that a Tesla flavor non-inductive flat spiral coil in that photo?
A cloud to earth lightning strike acts just like a spark gap. An electrostatic potential causes ionization of a column of molecules or (leader) which grows between earth and cloud. The free electrons now form a coherent field of negative plasma between cloud and ground. The wire now being formed shorts the capacitor and a huge amount of current flows across the spark gap. The current between Earth and the clouds leaves the portion of the Earth where the strike hit positively charged relative to the rest of the Earth field. This positively charged unipole expands rapidly in the conductor field of the Earth. Causing atoms in the Earth to shift their electric dipole moments in response to the changing dielectric field about them. This electric dipole moment alignment is directly related to the magnetic dipole moments of the atoms depending on the atomic structure of the mass encountered. The magnetic field shift lags the electrical wave front depending on the neuclear magnetic response of the atoms in question. The Earth in the near field of the lightning strike is also acting as an anode and free electrons are being drawn towards the strike zone. This often results in electronic flow oscillating in the plasma field between cloud and earth at extemely high frequencys. This causes the Earth pole to oscillate in charge and associated electric wave fronts to be issued. The Earth acting as a broadband receiver and it's inductive response returning a magnetic wave.
Quote from: sparks on February 20, 2009, 09:31:08 AM
A cloud to earth lightning strike acts just like a spark gap. An electrostatic potential causes ionization of a column of molecules or (leader) which grows between earth and cloud. The free electrons now form a coherent field of negative plasma between cloud and ground. The wire now being formed shorts the capacitor and a huge amount of current flows across the spark gap. The current between Earth and the clouds leaves the portion of the Earth where the strike hit positively charged relative to the rest of the Earth field. This positively charged unipole expands rapidly in the conductor field of the Earth. Causing atoms in the Earth to shift their electric dipole moments in response to the changing dielectric field about them. This electric dipole moment alignment is directly related to the magnetic dipole moments of the atoms depending on the atomic structure of the mass encountered. The magnetic field shift lags the electrical wave front depending on the neuclear magnetic response of the atoms in question. The Earth in the near field of the lightning strike is also acting as an anode and free electrons are being drawn towards the strike zone. This often results in electronic flow oscillating in the plasma field between cloud and earth at extemely high frequencys. This causes the Earth pole to oscillate in charge and associated electric wave fronts to be issued. The Earth acting as a broadband receiver and it's inductive response returning a magnetic wave.
his sound ?
http://www-pw.physics.uiowa.edu/space-audio/sounds/EarthWhistlers/ewhist.html
@EM
I have done that same ring already and had the same waveform but one mounting on the other at high frequencies.
To tube or not to tube. Is that a question?????????
I found a wire called Twistie Mag Wire that can have up to 50 turns per inch and up to 10 conductors. The wires can be served with a polynylon coating so it will look like any regular single stanrd wire. I will see how much it costs and get some to make the rings. I don't think more then 20 turns per inch is required.
http://www.mwswire.com/twistite1.htm
The question I have is why would someone like SM spend so much time and money on so many coils and wires and then say use lamp wire. Someone is screwing with our heads. Lamps wire, no way.
Someone opened a thread once discussing about twisting short lengths of wire to make capacitors in the pF range. So maybe the ring was a capacitor, the conductors were anode, the insulation was the dielectric and the top control coil was the cathode.
The puzzle here is thinking of a tube, its function and how it could be replicated in a TPU. So I will continue on the coil end and if guys like @otto can continue on the tube end, maybe there will be a point where we could meet.
Like this question. How can a transistor be used like a tube. The tube works in one direction, so does the transistor with that internal diode. The tube works by heating a cathode that pushes electrons out towards the anode. So how can this be done with a transistor. What if you put a resistor accros the collector and emitter and then applied high power. You would have one part direct current and the other part as the pulsing of the transistor. Well I do not know enough about it.
SM indicated that the FTPU control circuit was patented. OK, what in such a punny circuit could warrant someone to patent it. What would be so extraordinary in such a punny circuit that would produce such an out of the ordinary function to warrant a patent. Honestly, I don't think the question is to USE tubes, but it is to UNDERSTAND what a tube does and then experiment with a transistor to do the same thing.
So if some guys are doing coils, some are doing tubes, then maybe some could work on trying to replicate a tube with a few simple SS components.
Quote from: BEP on February 19, 2009, 09:50:59 PM
I think the most important information, other than what he was measuring, are the distances. Multiples of about 50 miles? The equipment registered again and again at these points of distance to the storm.
Now, if Tesla was writing about things as (I perceive) he saw them, then figure that distance along with his idea of the speed of light and you have the frequency of nodes for his compression waves. Consider these waves as not going below zero, in amplitude. So, the lowest density points are ambient or zero.
Since electromagnetic compression waves do exist in waveguides (like the chamber between Earth and the Ionosphere) it is highly possible he was measuring the magnetic ripple caused by lightning strikes.
Resonance and high Q for a coil designed for this type of wave (travelling compression - not travelling wave) should not be hard to achieve. Is that a Tesla flavor non-inductive flat spiral coil in that photo?
Art of Transmitting Electrical Energy Throught the Natural Mediums
http://www.tesla.hu/tesla/patents/c-142352.006/c-142352.doc (http://www.tesla.hu/tesla/patents/c-142352.006/c-142352.doc)
Quote
The most essential requirement is, however, that irrespective of frequency the wave or wave-train should continue for a certain interval of time, which I have estimated to be not less than one-twelvth or probably 0.08484 of a second and which is taken in passing to and returning from the region diametrically opposite the pole over the earth's surface with a mean velocity of about four hundred and seventy-one thousand two hundred and forty kilometers per second 471,240 km/sec).
The pressence of the stationary waves may be detected in many ways. For instance, a circuit may be connected directly or inductively to the ground and to an elevated terminal and tuned to respond more effectively to the oscillations. Another way is to connect a tuned circuit to the ground at two points lying more or less in a meridian passing through the pole E or, generally stated, to any two points of a different potential.
f = c/λ
λ = c/f
50 miles = 80.4672km
1 λ = 4 * 80.4672km = 321.8688km
f @ 1 λ = 471240km/s / 321.8688km = 1.464KHz
f @ 1/2 λ = 2.9281KHz
f @ 1/4 λ = 5.8563KHz
When I read SM's remarks on tubes I got the feeling that he was using the tubes for an analogy. I think he was comparing the operation of a tube with the TPU, I thought he was trying to say that there are two things going on at once in a tube as well as in his TPU. From other posts I have made, Tesla's TPU has two things going on at once 'Transformer action and rotary action' the transformer action, like the filament voltage and current flowing through the tube, and normal tube action, like a signal being amplified and flowing through a tube. Everybody hears and see's something different. Where in SM's devices are the tubes located? Sorry but I can't believe SM used tubes to drive his devices.
Quote from: duff on February 20, 2009, 02:21:39 PM
f @ 1/4 λ = 5.8563KHz
Nice :)
And how do you collect the energy from a passing wave? You cancel it. I'm thinking effective aperture. I went down this road before and got nothing. It is still very interesting.
Hi,
There is a way to produce a rotating polarization ( helicons ) microwaves when a travelling acoustic pulse with a wavelenght equal to frequency of electron spin precession in a applied magnetic field are in 90 degree angle with each other, this is called as magnetoacoustic effect. This is what happens in a TPU and SEG like devices.
The created microwave radiation is produced in a direction of applied magnetic field, and can be amplified by reflecting the signal back ( interference ) like MASER.
The microwave frequency is the reason that the one turn collector coil can be used.
In a case of TPU the magnetic field is first created in a direction h in a toroid coil.
The toroid coil is made of elastic composite material like a urethane foam. This elastic composite material consists of magnetostrictive and paramagnetic powder like nickel and aluminium.
We can see this same phenomena with a SEG, the difference with a TPU is that the SEG uses deformation of material to produce an acoustic wave to travel around the stator, and uses permanent composite magnets for electron spin precession. Radial E-field must also be applied, with SEG this happens when the magnetic fields repel, in a case of TPU you must add a HV radial E-field.
Stefan, can you add xlsm to allowed attach file types?
I have a xlsm file, that you can play with to see the needed acoustic frequencies and applied magnetic field strenght for given TPU dimensions.
--Magnon
Hi Magnon:
Compress your file in a .zip file and you can submit.
Welcome to the forum. Take care.
nap
ok, here is the zip file.
--Magnon
Hello Magnon.
If you had used the search button you would have found we went over this two years ago.
Here:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=2169.msg32792#msg32792 (http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=2169.msg32792#msg32792)
And Here:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=3403.msg53303#msg53303 (http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=3403.msg53303#msg53303)
Even the phonon calculator was posted two years ago.
You seem to be pretty sure about your statements.
I on the other hand do not think your view has got anything to do with the TPU.
@All
Here is a fresh document i have just created about the true inventor of electronic television and also about more inventions of him, which suspiciously looks like the TPU.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=item246 (http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=item246)
Marco.
Marco,
A very good document. Thank you
No Thanks :)
Soon you will realize this is THE reason why tubes work where solid state does not.
It is simply because in solid state situations there is no secondary emission. :)
Marco.
Quote from: -[marco]- on February 21, 2009, 06:40:01 AM
Hello Magnon.
If you had used the search button you would have found we went over this two years ago.
Here:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=2169.msg32792#msg32792 (http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=2169.msg32792#msg32792)
And Here:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=3403.msg53303#msg53303 (http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=3403.msg53303#msg53303)
Even the phonon calculator was posted two years ago.
You seem to be pretty sure about your statements.
I on the other hand do not think your view has got anything to do with the TPU.
@All
Here is a fresh document i have just created about the true inventor of electronic television and also about more inventions of him, which suspiciously looks like the TPU.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=item246 (http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=item246)
Marco.
@Marco
Yes, we were discussing about the system two years ago. I am sorry that you did not found what this phenomena is all about.
The model is developed further and contains now the calculation for needed magnetic field strenght etc. The model explains also, why it is so very difficult to develop and tune TPU only with a quess method.
--Magnon
Quote from: Magnon on February 21, 2009, 08:50:47 AM
I am sorry that you did not found what this phenomena is all about.
I'm sorry you didn't either.
M.
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=get246 (http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=get246)
@marco
Thanks for the doc. Well done. I see the parallels but cannot comment because I do not know enough about it.
@Magnon
Very interesting especially about the toroids being a soft material. May explain why some of the wound wire looked rather embedded into the surface of the toroid. I'll have to think about this further. What frequencies are you talking about.
I tried to look up your profile and there is no permission to do so. Hmmmmm.
Last point is the xlsm file. What do you need to open this file. I'm using Office 97, goes way back, so I think I cannot view that file if it is done for later Excel versions. Can it be exported in other formats like PDF.
Added:
Just noticed you started a new thread on this. Good idea to not mix threads up.
Steven Mark, in his comunications with Lindsay, talked about the concepts of magnetic fields in the passage below.
I will make some comments at the botom after you read the text. Here's the text taken from the SM pdf file. (Note: just prior to this text he was talking about the Tesla magnetometers all in the context of energy in the magnetic fields of the earth.)
Please let me make another point.
Let us say that you have a magnetic field perhaps it is only a small permanent magnet.
Now, you have a single copper wire twelve inches long.
If you move the magnet across the surface of the wire from left to right at a certain speed you create an electron flow which is DC and it has a power potential based on how strong the field is and how fast the magnet is moved.
So, if you increase the size of the magnet or the speed it moves, you create a larger flow of electrons, larger as in higher voltage or more current.
Everyone tells us that the earth's magnetic field is measured as being too insignificant to generate any useable power, that is not so.
Let me give you something to think about...
If you had a short wire and you moved a magnet across it you would always have limited potential because the length of wire was so short.
OK now what if we increase the length of the wire to many miles in length even with a very weak magnetic field moving across the wire you still have a much greater potential flow of power
available.
If we put it into a perspective of power per inch it may be easier to
understand.
If you have a small magnetic field moving across a wire twelve inches long it can generate an electron flow equal to lets say one millivolt per inch.
If you move the magnet twelve inches at the same speed you get 12 millivolts as you transgress the twelve inches of wire.
Understand that I am trying to convey a principal that you can understand for use in the future.
So, you have a wire twelve inches long and you can make 12 millivolts moving a magnet across it.
If you have a wire 1000 feet long and you move the same small magnetic field across the length of it you can create much more voltage potential perhaps 12,000 millivolts lets say.
So, you have managed to generate a significant amount of electric power with a weak magnetic force.
OK, how does this help us? where am I going with this?
Suppose you have 1,000 pieces of wire twelve inches long and you run the same weak magnetic field over them all at the same time..... you get the same flow of electrons.
If the wires are run in series then you will get the 12,000 millivolts etc.
If you connect the wires in parallel you will get higher current but lower voltage.
However, the power potential is the same whether you run the wires in series or parallel.
If you know how to find the circuit potential, you tune into the frequency and you have enough short pieces of wire you can convert as much power as you wish in a given space.
Things are more complex then what I have told you but I am just trying to
give you an idea of how the technology works.
In a nut shell, we can say that Steven is talking about magnetic induction. Here's a few points.
He mentions a weak magnetic field of the earth and the need to TUNE into it's frequency. This is the most crucial point, he is not talking about the STATIC magnetic field of the earth but about a certain frequency or frequencies.
He mentions possibilities of series or parallel connections of the loops.
He mentions the possibility of faster speeds for this magnetic field that cuts across the wires, and as I showed before this correlates to faster frequencies since v = - N dphi/dt
He also mentions the need to find the circuit potential, so his device might be a bit unconventional such that it is not readily apparent where the voltage potential is occuring.
Over all, we can say his TPUs are primarily magnetic induction loops and together with the capacitors we see, they form tuned LC tank circuits that resonate and couple to the fluctuating magnetic fields, therby extracting energy from them. He could also be using unconventional methods of creating resonance like vibrations which have higher Q's, but the main principle is using magnetic fields to cause a flow of current in a wire, just like he said in one of the videos as well, the plain principle of magnetic INDUCTION.
EM
@WATTSUP
Download from www.openoffice.org install the suite, it replaces Microsoft office and successfully open that file. It is more advance than MS office.
@Marco
when you apply increasing voltage across a P-N junction, the leakage current increases slowly in a controlled fashion. At a certain voltage, you arrive at the same condition as in a nuclear reactor without neutron absorbers, namely an uncontrollable chain reaction.
When the avalanche voltage is reached, the voltage gradient is so high that for each electron ripped off an atom, it collides at such high velocity with another atom that it knocks off multiple electrons. When this happens, the chain reaction starts and with-in picoseconds there are so many electrons at such high velocities that the P-N junction becomes a short-circuit.
This can be an extremely useful process, since this happens much faster than any Tesla spark gap or any mechanical switch connecting a long transmission line to an Edison DC dynamo.
The avalanche effect occurs only in devices that use minority carriers, it does not happen with majority carrier devices such as Schottky diodes; they act as Zener diodes and do not avalanche in a chain reaction.
Regards, Earl
Quote from: EMdevices on February 21, 2009, 09:44:05 PM
Steven Mark, in his comunications with Lindsay, talked about the concepts of magnetic fields in the passage below.
I will make some comments at the botom after you read the text. Here's the text taken from the SM pdf file. (Note: just prior to this text he was talking about the Tesla magnetometers all in the context of energy in the magnetic fields of the earth.)
Please let me make another point.
Let us say that you have a magnetic field perhaps it is only a small permanent magnet.
Now, you have a single copper wire twelve inches long.
If you move the magnet across the surface of the wire from left to right at a certain speed you create an electron flow which is DC and it has a power potential based on how strong the field is and how fast the magnet is moved.
So, if you increase the size of the magnet or the speed it moves, you create a larger flow of electrons, larger as in higher voltage or more current.
Everyone tells us that the earth's magnetic field is measured as being too insignificant to generate any useable power, that is not so.
Let me give you something to think about...
If you had a short wire and you moved a magnet across it you would always have limited potential because the length of wire was so short.
OK now what if we increase the length of the wire to many miles in length even with a very weak magnetic field moving across the wire you still have a much greater potential flow of power
available.
If we put it into a perspective of power per inch it may be easier to
understand.
If you have a small magnetic field moving across a wire twelve inches long it can generate an electron flow equal to lets say one millivolt per inch.
If you move the magnet twelve inches at the same speed you get 12 millivolts as you transgress the twelve inches of wire.
Understand that I am trying to convey a principal that you can understand for use in the future.
So, you have a wire twelve inches long and you can make 12 millivolts moving a magnet across it.
If you have a wire 1000 feet long and you move the same small magnetic field across the length of it you can create much more voltage potential perhaps 12,000 millivolts lets say.
So, you have managed to generate a significant amount of electric power with a weak magnetic force.
OK, how does this help us? where am I going with this?
Suppose you have 1,000 pieces of wire twelve inches long and you run the same weak magnetic field over them all at the same time..... you get the same flow of electrons.
If the wires are run in series then you will get the 12,000 millivolts etc.
If you connect the wires in parallel you will get higher current but lower voltage.
However, the power potential is the same whether you run the wires in series or parallel.
If you know how to find the circuit potential, you tune into the frequency and you have enough short pieces of wire you can convert as much power as you wish in a given space.
Things are more complex then what I have told you but I am just trying to
give you an idea of how the technology works.
In a nut shell, we can say that Steven is talking about magnetic induction. Here's a few points.
He mentions a weak magnetic field of the earth and the need to TUNE into it's frequency. This is the most crucial point, he is not talking about the STATIC magnetic field of the earth but about a certain frequency or frequencies.
He mentions possibilities of series or parallel connections of the loops.
He mentions the possibility of faster speeds for this magnetic field that cuts across the wires, and as I showed before this correlates to faster frequencies since v = - N dphi/dt
He also mentions the need to find the circuit potential, so his device might be a bit unconventional such that it is not readily apparent where the voltage potential is occuring.
Over all, we can say his TPUs are primarily magnetic induction loops and together with the capacitors we see, they form tuned LC tank circuits that resonate and couple to the fluctuating magnetic fields, therby extracting energy from them. He could also be using unconventional methods of creating resonance like vibrations which have higher Q's, but the main principle is using magnetic fields to cause a flow of current in a wire, just like he said in one of the videos as well, the plain principle of magnetic INDUCTION.
EM
I disagree about frequency. I read it differently.
However, the power potential is the same whether you run the wires in series or parallel.
If you know how to find the circuit potential, you tune into the frequency and you have enough short pieces of wire you can convert as much power as you wish in a given space.
Things are more complex then what I have told you but I am just trying to
give you an idea of how the technology works.IF you know how to find circuit potential THEN you know how to compute REQUIRED circuit frequency input. Then you get EFFECT , which if put onto enough short pieces of wire WILL GENERATE POWER.
It seems very similar to Tesla radiant energy field - there is a power in it , but not usable for our present devices. To convert it into common DC you need COPPER wire as Tesla discovered, because radiant will generate normal DC current inside (?) copper.
This is very symmetrical in Tesla transformer patent .At the generator a coarse copper wire is passing normal oscillating currents, which are converted into radiant flowing on surface of pancake coil inside (secondary). At the step down transformer, the opposite action is taken - primary is pancake coil and secondary - coarse copper wire. Patent no 593138, and all other about wireless transmission of power also.
This is something interesting : http://www.rexresearch.com/nucell/nucell.htm
especially chapter about beta radiation adding energy to LC tank circuit at resonant frequency. It looks so close to secondary emission in vacuum tubes.
Hmm...could we consider surface flowing electrons as beta radiation ?
I have strange look at resonance ; I imagine a AC wave flowing around circuit and meeting itself at correct phase.The length of circuit matching frequency of current ? Or maybe opposite ? Exact number of waves on wire length ?
@tosky
Thanks for the in. I will keep it in mind but not for right now. Too many other things to do. I managed to open the Office 97 file @Magnon pu tup on his new thread but I'm getting errors when running the thing. I'll see about it but for me it is not a strict priority.
@EM
Your last post is why I'm saying multi-strand collectors.
The relationship between the control coils and the rings has to be one of gain. The design of the coils has to be bi-complimentary. If you pulse the ring, the control coil has to receive and if you pulse the control coil, the ring has to receive. I have tested this on both ways and there is coupling potential both ways. This is all a question of how you want to play them. Meaning........
In a regular transformer, you can pulse the primary or the secondary and either way, you will transfert energy to the other.
The energy built up in the TPU is omnipresent. It is not supplied by a capacitor accumulating more energy then it can discharge because capacitors will discharge everything in one shot. It is available in the whole device as part of its continuous function and this is why it can start with practically nothing and build up with gain. This cancels many theories of operation.
But I need to do more testing to find the right looping method.
Just as a side note, here is the exact DC pulse generator I have and am using for many of my tests. In case anyone is in the market for one I think this one will go dirt cheap.
http://cgi.ebay.ca/Agilent-HP-214B-Pulse-Generator-Tested-Working_W0QQitemZ250375724982QQcmdZViewItemQQptZBI_Signal_Sources?hash=item250375724982&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A1|39%3A1|240%3A1318
@forest
I really liked the read. I don't think there is any relation to the TPU but it does open ones eyes to other avenues towards OU. Really great. But I won't be playing with radioactive isotopes any time soon.
wattsup
I don't like radioactive material either. I talked about surface electrons maybe acting similarly to beta decay...Secondary emission. Is that electrons party from Mannix king tale ?
I was going to hold off until I have a more serious demo, but this isn't bad at all.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5t4ANPts8s
I'm telling you guys, Steven tunes into a particular frequency, but very few are listening. So be it. I'm working on better resonator topologies. I'm about 500 ft away from powerlines and my whole place is bathed in magnetic frequencies, but for some reason some couple more prominently to the AC wiring.
EM
Quote from: EMdevices on February 22, 2009, 11:40:26 PM
I was going to hold off until I have a more serious demo, but this isn't bad at all.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5t4ANPts8s
I'm telling you guys, Steven tunes into a particular frequency, but very few are listening. So be it. I'm working on better resonator topologies. I'm about 500 ft away from powerlines and my whole place is bathed in magnetic frequencies, but for some reason some couple more prominently to the AC wiring.
EM
Wow! Your persistence is paying off! Keep up the good work. I'm really impressed.
cheers
chrisC
WAY TO GO EM DEVICES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
COOL COOL.
Take it under the powerlines :)
M.
RE: Prominent frequencies.
Could it be the tank paramters you have there?
Small coil, cap, loop attenna. Since the loop is directional just tilt it towards the power lines and the led should glow brighter. Similar function of FCC directional tracking of renegade signals.
No wires running under the carpet this time? ;D
--giantkiller.
@EM
OK....... where did you hide the batteries this time. lol
And how come you changed the carpet from your regular white carpet background. lol
I will take my ring and modify it like yours and go under the HV lines since there is a road going right under it.
What is that small coil at around 2 o'clock on your last photo and what lamp type are you using. Is that a coil with a screw type central ferrite for tuning?
Actually when it will be springtime, I was thinking to go right under the lines and simply take a 500' roll of house electrical wire, connect a bulb and transformer on the lead exiting from the spool center core. connect the other ends together and roll out the wire, to see if the light will get brighter as the reel gets unwound more and more. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. (That's the noise you hear under the HV lines.)
I hope you realize that this approach will be of no help to anyone during a major grid power failure. lol
Great work. This just gave three points to the TPU Grid Theory.
Current Points Tally. (no pun intended)
TPU GRID THEORY 3
TPU HOPE THEORY 0
3 milliwatts today ...perhaps a kilowatt tomorrow! ;D
@wattsup
QuoteWhat is that small coil at around 2 o'clock on your last photo and what lamp type are you using. Is that a coil with a screw type central ferrite for tuning?
the little light is not a lamp, but an LED, so Mannix got the right idea, it's milliwatts of power !!!, but hey, we can only work up from here, right?
yes to your second question, just a little extra inductance for tunning
I'll go closer to powrlines if all else fails but first I want to improve the tank circuits and I'm going to stranded wire since it has lower resistance at higher frequencies than DC. Here come killowatts of power .... LOL
CAUTION: Don't climb any power line towers to test your tpu's !! LOL :)
EM
@EM
There is a lot you can do with your current setup. Altering the number of turns or modifying the diradious of the coil would be a good starting point.
Does your TPU only work around this socket/wall or is it the same around other sockets?
Can the frequency of the receiver be tuned to light perhaps more than 1 LED?
@ EM
Well done!
I think its becoming clearer how SM may have constructed his TPU. He talks about many short strands in parallel for high current, which I think is your resonator and many small short strands in series for high voltage, which I think is produced from a high efficiency DC / DC converter. Your resonator could probably be scaled up to produce higher current with a lot more parallel connected tuned loops. The power from these loops could then be used to power the converter. This would give the three seperate coil sets that SM talks about. There could be a clever interraction between the coils to enhance performance.
I feel a lot happier with this approach towards a solution than trying to magic up power from nothing which has been the theme of the various threads for far too long IMO! You have demonstrated that it is possible to induce power from your house wiring / overhead electricity lines and we know that power lines were in place where SM did the demonstrations, so things could to be falling into place.
Hoppy
@EM
On my way to the office, I stopped right under the HV lines with my ring, took it for a walk and nothing on the led.
Maybe my adjustable coil is not the right value. Do you know the mH of your small coil. I will take a photo tonight to show what I have made to compare. I put my LED on my power supply and it starts lighting at 1.5 volts. I guess the LED is to high a value and I may need to find leds that light with much less juice.
I don't have a meter to measure inductance wattsup, but it sure needs to be tuned just right, I think mine is tuned in the 20 kHz range or so, I tried other outlets in the house and it doesn't light so maybe this particular signal is only specific to my place. I know it's realy touchy on the tunning just like a radio, you have to get it just right or it won't work. Just using plain induction will not work it needs a capacitor for the tunning to build up the voltage, but if the magnetic fields are high enough I guess a simple coil can do the trick.
Quote from: EMdevices on February 24, 2009, 08:40:54 PM
I don't have a meter to measure inductance wattsup, but it sure needs to be tuned just right, I think mine is tuned in the 20 kHz range or so, I tried other outlets in the house and it doesn't light so maybe this particular signal is only specific to my place. I know it's realy touchy on the tunning just like a radio, you have to get it just right or it won't work. Just using plain induction will not work it needs a capacitor for the tunning to build up the voltage, but if the magnetic fields are high enough I guess a simple coil can do the trick.
Seems you have to retune each time you are close to other outlet. Hmm....how is it then related to original TPU ? I don't see SM adjusting TPU when going outside of house.
@EM
What do you see about polarities?
I doubt there is much power in the signal but if you have a remote read power meter there is a signal in the 10's of kHz used for those.
@EM
I would also like to know about polarity of your ring and simply if the diode LED will work if connected either way, or will it only light in one direction.
Just put another opposing diode/led in parallel there. :)
-giantkiller.
@GK
Thanks for the idea but this will only double the load which is something that would not be feasible at this point. The question of if the LED that is a diode only works in one way or both ways is to find out from @EM and his working device if there is in fact any current directionality or if the ring can work in both directions depending on the potential direction permitted by the LED.
@ everyone
it seems that there is similarity of the EM's device with this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1y_EotqAn1M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQeG4Qfi0YQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYYysBEwA6w
otits
LED works either way, I tried using a diode bridge to get DC and then had a series choke to make sure the resonant tank was not disturbed, but it didn't work quite as bright, I guess I need some good germanium diodes like in the video links posted above by Tito. I'll be absent for a while again.....but I'll be back
EM
EM did you switch off the mains power to see if it came from the house wiring??
If it then stil lights maybe it is tapping in some strange phenomena like earth waves or something :o :o :o :o
M.
Thanks @EM,
That's what I wanted to know. It says alot about about the loop being able to light that diode from both sides.
The lowest voltage LEDS I have found for my loop is 1.4volts but I measured my loop and it is fluctuating between .05-.25 volts so I have to find some smaller LEDS. I just got the components and will also try the smaller circuit from Titos referred vids.
But just to let you know, I am always pursuing the other end with the FTPU build and all so hopefully from both sides I can learn more about the TPU, what it can and can't do, etc.
Hi everyone
it is already proven that using 9volt batery can drive and produce a kilowatt.
and i think if we combine the use of the relaxation time of a capacitor as a source i think we can solve the TPU mystery 8)
God bless
otits
EM
perhaps this is related to your invention
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOwyn-xVXV4
Quote from: AhuraMazda on March 03, 2009, 08:58:01 PM
EM
perhaps this is related to your invention
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOwyn-xVXV4
i did not see sm making making some adjustment of where the strong signal is, and if sm invention is only working under the powerlines, i think it is not a good idea anymore because everyone of us should have their house under powerlines, am i right? its useless. :(
i believe there are other source that we can use 8)
otits
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUCtCYty-ns ::)
@ Poynt99
Similar to Forest's post,but a whole diff material
Posted By zerotensor ,A MUST SEE
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=6996.0;topicseen
real time vid
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_type=&search_query=Floating+Water+Bridge&aq=f
Chet
Magnetic field reacts with current flow perpendicular to current flow.Now the only problem is how to force it to react in current flow direction adding speed to flowing electrons ?
Request permission to answer question.
--giantkiller.
@GK
Go right ahead, we're all eyes.
Quote from: wattsup on March 11, 2009, 04:35:52 PM
@GK
Go right ahead, we're all eyes.
I'll second the all eyes :)
One of possible ways is pancake coil shape IMHO.With centrifugal force and decreased size of turns...
Second one is two forces acting against each other with wire inside of balance point. Moving such point of "squeeze action" along wire length in one direction.
Isn't that "like squeezing garden hose" ? Was that so hard to imagine ? Isn't that the reason why all those ancients devices have so peculiar shapes ? No more mysteries!
Put dc on the collector
Pulse the controls.
You, in effect, invade or enable the push against the bias. Heterodyning. Put this in multiple turn loop and you a dc toriod like Leedskalnin talks about. But with copper we cancel the flux because it is not retained like in iron. No latency.
I did these 2 years ago to show the ground(yellow) in the middle of the collector midline and below. The dc direction is shown in red. In the AC model we can see the red going both ways. That is where the highly excited energy comes from that creates high speed events against the iron and copper on the GK4.
DC with AC on top.
Anybody bringing the push pins to the balloon party?
--giantkiller.
GK
very very interesting
Thank you for sharing this
Chet
Can TPU be modified to produce AC current ? Why not ?
javascript:void(0); The videos show ac current ...a drill , and a vacuum cleaner via an inverter of course
Yes,I know about using DC-AC inverter,but why not just modulate TPU output to get pure sinewave instead of DC. If you look at Sweet VTA, there is kind of collector coils inside and additional system to modulate output at desired AC frequency.
I know that it may be common knowledge but look here : http://www.tpub.com/content/neets/14180/css/14180_143.htm
Do I properly compared that with vacuum triode ?
Bias = heater
Control coil = grid
It's interesting.
Quote from: Loner on March 16, 2009, 03:25:51 AM
Forest, the VTA frequency was pre-programmed at the time of the Barium magnet impulse charge. This was a severe part of the setup for that device and I don't think changing ti would be simple.
at least that is what the papers I read on it stated. (Yeah, I played, but never got it...)
Really ? Compare it to TPU :
http://www.hyiq.org/Library/Images/SQMsweet4.jpg
http://www.hyiq.org/Library/Images/SQMsweet5.jpg
1. Ferrous ring, with an air gap
2. 2 main driver coils at 90 degrees orientation to each other in series.
3. Audio frequencies
4. "what happens when fields rotate in two directions at once?"
The Lorentz O. That is what happens.
5. Exploding TV set.
What happens when heavy anti-grav is applied directionally and laterally? SM wasn't trying for free energy. SM may well be a figment. This suspiciously looks like a "noise remover" to me.
Paul Andrulis
I want everyone to know that it required approximately a six month hiatus from working on this to see what is now obvious. My minds eye conjured a multitude of probable effects, using various combinations/methods.
MOST were... interesting.... to say the least, politely. Extremely dangerous at best.
Yet, I could not reconcile my mental views with reality. What I was envisioning could not be strictly speaking magnetic field effects, though magnetism was involved.
Now I understand what the "other" is. Gravity.
This also led to many other questions and searches, and has led to the asking of some some very hard questions about basal stated truths, intents, and motives.
By the way, for those not conversant with the principle. When knowledge gets in the way of research, it is called "noise".
For example, something "cannot be done" because of x principle or y theory. This is an example of the principle of noise.
To remove noise, you demonstrate visually that something has already been done, which forces the viewer to examine how something HAS to be possible, disregarding previous "can and can't do's", forcing them to find a way to do what they previously thought impossible. You use their own senses against them, so to speak.
Paul Andrulis
Loner, I will blow your mind a little. I have been necessarily restructuring my understanding of effects as a hole. I no longer even like the term "field", as it is misleading.
I shall state to you that all things witnessed are but effects of three basic types.
1. charges in motion
2. charges at rest
3. lack of charge
Remember that charges tend to be polar in nature, and then the individual effect witnessed from any charge likewise has a corresponding diametric affect. For instance, a magnetic field has two seemingly inseparable poles, with COMPLETE OPPOSITION to the other pole, while seemingly exactly the same effect.
Just as like charges repel, and opposite charges attract, like effects repel and opposite effects attract. This makes all effects polar in nature, but bipolar in general practice.
There have to be at least four separate charge effects, but probably many more yet undiscovered, due entirely to the symmetry of the situation.
Just a thought.
Paul Andrulis
Quote from: pauldude000 on April 30, 2009, 06:33:10 PM
By the way, for those not conversant with the principle. When knowledge gets in the way of research, it is called "noise".
For example, something "cannot be done" because of x principle or y theory. This is an example of the principle of noise.
To remove noise, you demonstrate visually that something has already been done, which forces the viewer to examine how something HAS to be possible, disregarding previous "can and can't do's", forcing them to find a way to do what they previously thought impossible. You use their own senses against them, so to speak.
i understand what you mean by "noise", but that "noise" is what you make, your understanding, of what has been teached to you.
the "noise" is only yourself closing your mind to other possibilities. those other possibilities can also be already included in current knowledge.
often, when i read posts like this one, i am under the impression that the autor meant that physic's knowledge is bullsh**.
if it is, then any knowledge is.
physic's laws are not nature's laws, they are interpretation of nature's laws.
and, most of the time, those mathematical laws are incomplet.
once you really understand that, you can say you have an open mind.
Tesla had a diplomas in EE and physic.
did that stopped him from discovering things ?
even if it cost us, we own him our current living comfort.
Eddison had almost no scholarity and we know what he tryed to do to Tesla with his DC against AC fight.
how many things did Eddison invented that were not rumored stolen later ?
Quote from TheNOP:
"Tesla had a diplomas in EE and physic.
did that stopped him from discovering things ?
even if it cost us, we own him our current living comfort.
Eddison had almost no scholarity and we know what he tryed to do to Tesla with his DC against AC fight.
how many things did Eddison invented that were not rumored stolen later ?"
Actually NOP, this is a classic case of noise reduction. :)
Tesla was an EE (Electrical Engineer), and did indeed have a classical education.
Edison was indeed an undereducated a rip-off artist.
However, what you seemingly missed was that of the two, Edison followed the classical knowledge base of the time.
Nikola Tesla was NOTED for having his own understanding which went against the teachings and understandings of the time. If you examine any of the real thinkers, you will notice that they all demonstrated noise reduction, in that they spoke of new things, which went against the knowledge base of their times.
Knowledge is now, and has always been fluid in nature, changing and molding with new evidences of the nature of reality.
Now, as for solidity of knowledge, even the most basic things in physics have but a rudimentary explanation, when you examine them. Too many under defined explanations combined with over exaggerated claims of understanding. However, this is nothing new.
At one time, the scientific consensus was that the earth was flat, and that the earth was the center of the universe. These were the staunchly held beliefs of the vast majority of scientists of the day. We now know them to be undeniably false.
How many flat earth notions are still held today is the question: Man will never find out without noise reduction.
Paul Andrulis
Quote from: pauldude000 on May 01, 2009, 06:57:01 PM
Actually NOP, this is a classic case of noise reduction. :)
Tesla was an EE (Electrical Engineer), and did indeed have a classical education.
Edison was indeed an undereducated a rip-off artist.
However, what you seemingly missed was that of the two, Edison followed the classical knowledge base of the time.
Nikola Tesla was NOTED for having his own understanding which went against the teachings and understandings of the time. If you examine any of the real thinkers, you will notice that they all demonstrated noise reduction, in that they spoke of new things, which went against the knowledge base of their times.
Knowledge is now, and has always been fluid in nature, changing and molding with new evidences of the nature of reality.
Now, as for solidity of knowledge, even the most basic things in physics have but a rudimentary explanation, when you examine them. Too many under defined explanations combined with over exaggerated claims of understanding. However, this is nothing new.
At one time, the scientific consensus was that the earth was flat, and that the earth was the center of the universe. These were the staunchly held beliefs of the vast majority of scientists of the day. We now know them to be undeniably false.
How many flat earth notions are still held today is the question: Man will never find out without noise reduction.
Paul Andrulis
we are basicaly saying the same things.
the "noise" is a personnal thing.
where i do not agree is that knowledge base is an handicap, for me it is not.
"flat earth notions" is a bad example.
it was a beleive, it was not based on any prouvable fact.
physic laws
might be beleives too.
but at least they are base on observed phenomenas and you can't deny them.
Ex:
there are 2 ways you can achive something.
let say your goal is to make a simple RC circuit that oscillate at 100kHz.
-you can use trials and errors untill you get the result you want.
then, if you are clever enough, you will find the formulas all EEs already know.
-if you know how this work or search on how this work, you simply calculate your componants values and get there fast.
maybe you think you might find something new with the first way of doing things.
unfortunatly, if you don't know what you are doing, there are big chances you won't even notice it.
@TheNOP
I think you misunderstand. I rely upon my knowledge base in physics as well.
Knowledge per say is good to have. What is bad is when your knowledge LIMITS your ability to think outside the current understanding.
Let me give a simple explanation:
Consider the lowly electron, for instance. It is a charged particle which orbits an atom, which itself has spin. How do I know any of these things? The answer is my knowledge base. I have never personally examined an electron. My understanding of it and its properties and effects generally come at best second hand, through someone else's work.
The question is: are they right?
Considering that no human has ever seen an electron, weighed or measured an individual electron, how can I or anyone else for that matter make a bald claim without real proof that an electron is even a true particle? Or that it spins? Some things are very evident, and proveable, such as that it has charge.
What is charge? The term loses some meaning at this level, as in the macroscopic level charge denotes presence or lack of charged particles, but what is that very effect which we call charge???
Many basic terms actually LOSE meaning upon close examination, such as force, energy, particle, mass, etc., etc., etc... It seems the more basic the term, the less meaning it actually has.
It is amazing how many terms are actually self-referencing in some manner for their own definition.
These areas are scientific blind spots where a wealth of knowledge is to be gained, but upon which all of science rests.
However, the absolute accuracy does not negate higher observable effects. For instance, in the 1700's electricity was still though scientifically to be a fluid. This did not prevent scientists of the time from observing effects, and creating formula based upon the observable effects, which we still use today.
For analogy, science is comparable to Swiss cheese. Swiss cheese is still delicious and edible, and truly is good cheese, even if it is full of holes. However, if you desired an smooth unbroken slice, you must fill in the holes. Simply telling yourself there are no holes does no good.
Paul Andrulis
@Loner
I am tentatively starting to think that the "static" field is an inherent property of the packet which we call an electron. I think its motion through space creates magnetism, and its spin produces gravity.
Namely the static electric field is inherent with the displacement of space by the packet, with space pressing back. A local distortion of the material of space. (Call it space-time or aether, makes no difference to me.)
The greater the local distortion (due to more packets), the stronger the combined effect. In essence, space does not like distortion.
This may sound weird, but I think harmonics somehow plays a part in all this as well. Something smacks altogether too much of wave theory at work here. It could well account for everything from planetary orbits, to electron orbits.
Different effects could theoretically be accounted for by spin and orbit direction. Spin itself could well account for charge. Think about it!
Two packets with right hand spin HAVE to repel each other, while two packets, one right handed and one left handed with can exist touching, and might well link like two gears.
Paul Andrulis
No on ever looks beyond the electron or the magnetic field, or other particles/fields.
These are just secondary constructs.
What makes up these particles and fields?
Quote from: Grumpy on May 02, 2009, 10:22:00 AM
No on ever looks beyond the electron or the magnetic field, or other particles/fields.
These are just secondary constructs.
What makes up these particles and fields?
You hit the nail precisely on the head. That brings forth the fact that I think we have been ultimately asking the wrong questions. We have as you say always been asking about the electron..... as if it is the only charged particle, or demonstrates the only effect, or is in itself the only moving force used by a circuit. None of which we have absolute answer for. We guess, but there come more questions than actual answers with the assumptions made.
I am beginning to look at all particles as packets of energy. Nothing solid, but a state of energy which is self-sustaining giving the illusion of solidity. For instance, anti-matter may well be opposing spin.
Two packets of opposing spin can contact, and in actual contact, may happen disruption of the stability of the packet, releasing the contained energy back to the source. Merely a guess mind you, but I see how it could be true.
Paul Andrulis
Hello all,
I need a little help!
Maybe somebody could look into the 15" TPU video and say the world how the bulbs are connected. I mean the connection BETWEEN the bulbs. 1 or 2 wires???
Thanks for your help.
Otto
Hello all,
@Loner
thanks a lot but I supposed that. I only wanted to be sure.
@ All
now imagine a TPU working with a negative resistance!!
Otto
@Loner
No, I have not read that theory. I did not realize that this concept had already been postulated. If you could post a copy of both that would be interesting. I would love to read them. I should not be surprised that someone else envisioned a similar or the same thing though.
PAul Andrulis
Quote from: Loner on May 03, 2009, 10:21:58 AM
Grumpy, just a little side question, if you happen to read this. A little while back you posted a picture of a kick "Scope Shot?", possibly from a Digital scope or SIM. Could you tell me where it came from, or how it was generated? Certain basic concepts of the "Kick" are slowly showing themselves in other areas and I'm trying to pull it together. It seems that the "Original" idea of the kick being an interaction with the Earth's mag "Field" may not be very far off, as if you map the "Field" interactions that occur when "Inside" another field, well, I'm sure you get the idea. I'm Still learning.
Thanks all.
interaction with the earth's mag field was probably a hint that the kick interacts with magnetic fields in some way, possibly ina beneficial way since SM mentioned it at all
The recent "kick" scope was captured from a HV impulse circuit.
what if kick is th proof of something much more important , much more crazy ? what is it's current generated FROM Earth magnetic field ?
what if ANY current is the same ..... will the world be the same ?
I think the problem is that every one that makes the discovery of the kick power has its own personal explanation, some see it as taping in the gravitational field , some see it as a vacuum , others , some as godly acts.
That is one of the reason why we don't get to work and play with the words searching for the proper explanation , or a believable one.
First isn't pure energy solid matter , in theory , so any thing should work well there doesn't seem be two much power in matter around here, well in its solid state matter looks unpromising it is undisturbed so you need to kick to see what its made from , kick to make waves , these waves are the energy released from its pure form.
You induce a kick in a magnetic core the core reaction send to kick from coil to coil, kick a large enough copper coil the coil will kick you back.
For radio emitter they kick magnetic core you get radio reception.
so you can kick pretty much anything even air , some core work better then others.
I believe nature as the real answer , this is seen in many physics experiment also , even the beers blowing bottom with one tap. the beer is filled with water you hold the bottle tight and tap it down with the other hand (creating a kick ) so it creates air pockets at bottom of the bottle , this air pocket created by the kick generates a kick back breaking the beer bottle bottom .
That air pocket is so powerful because of is different pressure potential , the bottle breaks right off , DO NOT TRY THIS WITH BEER IS IT !! OK.lol
If its beer the energy from the kick is released in a less convenient way.
This is one way of seeing it , there are so many more .
Here is a video i found of the trick to get the picture.
http://www.break.com/usercontent/2007/4/The-Exploding-Beer-Bottle-Trick-Explained-273903.html
Quote from: forest on May 03, 2009, 03:49:59 PM
what if kick is th proof of something much more important , much more crazy ? what is it's current generated FROM Earth magnetic field ?
what if ANY current is the same ..... will the world be the same ?
The "kick" is proof that conversion of energy is possible without billions of dollars - nothing more. This is why no one who really knows will confirm that the scope shot that I posted was indeed a "kick", so I took their silence as confirmation.
It is not a magnetic field, but it interacts with magnetic fields in some way. Keep in mind, though, that all currents create a magnetic field.
It appears that to convert the kick to useful energy, we need to add a third dimension to it, which implies forming it into a ring.
It has absolutely nothing to do with "negative resistance" or the host of other incorrect assumptions and explanations.
Hello all,
@Grumpy
this means no Moebius in a TPU??
A Moebius gives us a negative resistance.
Otto
Quote from: otto on May 04, 2009, 12:04:51 AM
Hello all,
@Grumpy
this means no Moebius in a TPU??
A Moebius gives us a negative resistance.
Otto
No mobius.
No negative resistance.
Just conversion of energy into matter.
The interference fiield is what affects the molecular lattice binding. This is how Keely disassociated matter.
The TPU is a different configuration for a controlled path of power.
I have seen that without this distinction most get the two outputs mixed up.
Keely disassociated quartz into sand. Leedskalnin levatated coral, a crystaline structure. The pyramids are around alot of sand.
--giantkiller.
Hello all,
@Grumpy
if its OK for you then OK.
My results showes me something different but OK.
Otto
Quote from: Grumpy on May 04, 2009, 12:41:11 AM
No mobius.
No negative resistance.
Just conversion of energy into matter.
Not that it matters much what I think but I think that Grumpy was right that the kick is evidence of the conversion/harnessing of energy but I dont think that indicates that otto is necessarily incorrect that negative resistance occurs with TPU operation. Observations of a working model should answer that question.
Woops double post
While I'm here - what do you guys think about these photos I found:
P.S. Sorry about the quality - thats the best I could find :\
OOOOOO, I see 22 turns controls!
But who the f...k cares about this?
Otto
Quote from: otto on May 04, 2009, 03:21:10 AM
OOOOOO, I see 22 turns controls!
But who the f...k cares about this?
Otto
Well youre right
I just find the different setups he has interesting - I thought they were some different angles that might be interesting to some..
Hello all,
@Phantasm
yes very interesting the ANGLES between the CONTROLS and COLLECTORS!!
Otto
PS: i dont want to measure them
Mobius only works because you have signals going in opposite directions. SM used bifilar control windings, which are visible on the "open TPU", so mobius is not required.
Quote from: otto on May 04, 2009, 01:06:07 AM
Hello all,
@Grumpy
if its OK for you then OK.
My results showes me something different but OK.
Otto
If you shock the copper faster than it can conduct or at the moment of switch closure the energy of very high frequency(Tesla) flies off at 90 degree angles. When we put an impedance in the way it will absorb that high speed energy and slow it down due to resistance. The receiving matter will either heat(incandescant light bulb) or ionize(photon kinetics in Florescence light bulbs) then emit light at our visible acceptance level. But the energy is still wideband.
I guess there is always something new but never under the Sun.
--giantkiller.
@otto
I care. lol
Even though I am sort of on this Mylow magnet wheel and babysitting the thread, does not mean I am not working on my TPU studies. lol
I think there is at least 10% of my brain that works on this all the time. Through everything I read and work on, I always try to see some relationship.
Here is something for you. You know the output voltage of the LTPU. Here are the amps. This is very telling indeed. Looking at these amperage readings, can you see where the "kicks meet at the output". lol
In reality, these amperage readings are one of only a few living data we have about the LPTU. We have this, we have a voltage reading, we have the output bulbs and we have the flaming spark that show a direct indication of the energies in the LTPU.
So how was your vacations.
Hello all,
@Chef
if you show me my post where my claim about overunity results is posted I will show the world what I have.
I dont think overunity is possible. If we have a bigger output then input, then the system gets the extra energy from the surrounding.
I didnt find a good core! SM did it. Im only a little replicator, thanks God.
@wattsup
if my memory is OK, SM told us that the output voltage of this TPU was 800V??
800V x 1,2A = ??
This demonstration was only to show the people that a TPU has real power. But dont think its the top power such a TPU can give. The closer you are with the best frequency mix, the bigger is the output power.
Now imagine how many TPUs has SM blown until he got the total control of such a beast!!
Otto
You can make a coil trigger from a pulse on another coil, but if a pulse is missed it gets out of whack, so a more controllable means of timing is required, such as a counter.
I am not using low inductance coils, but I "think" that you would wind them in a bifilar arrangement - with a toroidal form as they must be in a loop. You then pulse both with a delay on the second control coil "or" you pulse them in opposite polarity. You have to control the timing either way, but I think you can get away from the delay with opposite polarity connections. If you connect the two controls together like a folded single coil, timing will be a pain in the ass and may never work.
This is based on an educated guess after reading the works of Rowland, Rontgen, and Wilson regarding moving charges and dielectrics. Hint, hint...
@loner
Hope this post will help in some way. Sorry for the length.
@all
Maybe I should elaborate on my last post of those pictures a little bit.
First of all @EM put this up but can't remember in which thread.
"All these frequencies "occasionally" "met" at the same time with a much larger kick at the output."
How occasional is "occasionally" if they have to meet anywhere from 100 to 100k times per second. I would say this means much more then occasional, more like almost always. The "met" means they meet, not cross or over-cross or overlap each other. Of course frequencies if they are to meet, depending on what they go through and into what they will meet, could produce many types of kicks.
Thinking about the above, I noticed there are four wires coming out of each center toroid in the LTPU. If the toroid was wound as a bucking coil, there would only be two wires required. So what are the two other wires going through the two toroids. Now if the wires from one of the yellow capacitors also goes through the center of one of the toroids and is connected in parallel with the two wires from the bucking coil, because the four wires are in fact connected in two parallel, could this be the basis for an audio crossover if there were some other resistors in the black box underneath. That would give you two crossovers to control two frequency outputs and all you would then require is one wider frequency as input or one input signal comprised of major hash signals. One input as major havoc enters the two crossovers and produces two outputs that compress the havoc and send it into the control coils. The controls coils received their two signals and then meet together at the collector to create the major havoc again that is re-fed again into the toroidal crossovers. If the center toroidal material is a core like the ones used in high voltage toroidal transformers, the unit will be able to withstand and maintain a very high flux level. Starting from the low voltage at start-up and going up to the high voltage output of the LTPU, this makes the center toroid the ideal device to "run with gain". OK this is just a preamble to the following.
First, I propose we should understand two new terms that I have developed to quickly position ones visualized locations in a TPU or any other device. They are "in-look" and "out-look". If you in-look the ltpu output, you are looking at the output from the center of the tpu looking towards the output on the inner core wall. Out-look the output means you are looking at the output from the opposite outward point looking towards the output outer wall. When you in-look/out-look something, you lock your perspective on one point and can then talk about the surrounding items, left, right, up, down, in front of, etc. Easy to understand and not get lost.
So if you in-look the output, CC1 is on the right of the output, whereas if you out-look the output, CC1 will be on the left. This way we can all talk about coils, looking from the inside or outside. You can use this to in-look a small toroid or anything else. Out-look the teeth on a shark or in-look the teeth of Moby Dick from inside his mouth. (Bad place to be. lol)
I would like to first address @ottos comment that the ltpu can produce much more energy then what is seen in the amps. Yes, you may well be very right but the inherent variance in the percentages of amperage seen above would still be the same. So, the amp values would be greater but the ratios between them would still be the same.
OK, the first picture shows the ammeter (AM) near the output, but not at the output. It is over one of the control coil CC3 and it reads .34 amps. That's about one third the real output amps shown on the last picture at 1.20 amps.
So this confirms to me that there are three control coils and the AM was over CC3 and I would take a major guess that CC3 is being driven under RV type resonance via the two big black series connected capacitors that are so conveniently just beside it if you in-look the output, they are on the left side.
OK, you take one full band audio signal or other signal and put it through two crossovers comprised of one center bucking coil toroid with one yellow cap makes one crossover and the other center toroid with the other yellow cap makes the second crossover. One signal from the collector goes to the two crossovers. One crossover then feeds CC1 and the other feeds CC2. The outputs of CC1 and CC2 are connected together (two frequencies meet and produce a kick) and are connected to one side of the collector. The other side of the collector goes to output with some going back as the one signal going back to the crossovers.
One havoc makes two frequencies that meet to create more havoc that makes two frequencies that meet to create more havoc, and so on.
If you look at picture No.4 shows the AM over the two toroids at .74 amps. How convenient that's about two thirds the output and confirms the above potential usage of the toroids to control two thirds of the CC's.
Look at picture No. 2 it is placed between one toroid and the outer core and reads 0.52 amps. How convenient again since this is about half way between the CC3 and toroid readings. It all falls into place. SM did not bother putting his AM over CC1 and CC2 because he knew that putting the AM over the two toroids would have covered that energy reading of those two coils. With his AM he went to CC3, between CC3 and toroids, over toroids, over output. For him, these four readings covered the entire energy dispersion of the LTPU. He did not have to see anything else to understand how the energy flowed in his LTPU.
The center toroid material will be important if any potential or gradual gain in the saturation of the toroid core can be used to increase the amplitude of the crossover action, hence more and more energy going through the control coils creating bigger kicks each time they meet at the collector.
CC3 is simply in parallel to the two black series capacitors and is connected across CC1 and CC2 and acts as a power pumping station something like the RV works on one phase of a three phase motor or like any other resonance tank. This ensures that the device will operate using the drive energy in its most efficient manner possible.
Inside the black box is nothing more then a strong battery driven AM radio or other miniature MONO signal producing device. One mono into two crossovers makes to signals out.
For me this is the first major topography of the LTPU.
SM is probably laughing because he is probably telling himself Hmmmm. This is a good idea but not exactly, he is right because there could be two other variations of this scheme.
One is that CC1 and CC2 are both going over 1/2 of the outer core. CC3 is the over coils that are to the left and right of the output (or zero point) where we can see there is an additional layer of winding in that area. CC3 still would use both black caps like an RV connected across CC1 and CC2.
The other is that CC1 and CC2 are wound in four quads, two for CC1 one facing the other, and two for CC2 again one facing the other. CC3 is again the over coils left and right of the zero point (or output).
I did do some comparisons of the above function logic to my original ltpu wiring diagram and I do see there could be a real relationship between them but would have to look closer at this.
My wiring diagram is located here;
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Steven%20Mark/wattsup-tpu/
click on any of the files starting with SM17-WD-1 for different sized files of the same.
One drawing I made a long time ago is also located there called discharge3.jpg.
It shows three CC's plus the exterior coil positions so it is not exact to the above but gives you an idea.
I would need some time (a rarity these days) to re-work the diagram but in general I think guys here will get a good idea on the above.
Hope this helps some of you working on the LPTU.
Yes there are some other issues like frequency ranges and LTPU outer core material but at this stage, I think this is secondary. SM's material choices, etc., were also heavily based on showing the device while keeping it secret so since we are working open source, we do not have to worry about such constraints and can make our builds accordingly in open fashion.
So @loner, does the above come close to the KISS criteria? Time will tell. I have learned enough with my FTPU build that I will start to build an LPTU and do some testing.
wattsup
@otto, do you know if insurance companies sell LTPU blow up insurance. lol
Quote from: otto on May 05, 2009, 12:22:41 AM
But dont think its the top power such a TPU can give.
They stopped at 10kW, they reached their goal.
A.
Quote from: Loner on May 05, 2009, 02:19:00 PM
Can I assume that the concept of a base loop current through the "Core" wires from "Feedback" winds removes the "Ferrous" metals requirement of the core? This seems to be assumed a lot, but I haven't heard anyone come out and state it in that way. (Or is that still unassumed?) If not, then how does one contain the looping "Magnetic" field. I am firmly into the "Self sustaining containment" method, but would like to hear if others know a better method. (Or comments on my insanity, if that be the case.)
All can agree that this is not a conventional inductive process.
All currents have an associated magnetic field, are all currents inductive?
When you form a two dimensional field into a loop - does it now have a 3rd dimension?
grab this and upload it to this site - post a link
(I can't seem to grab it.)
http://cpl.iphy.ac.cn/qikan/manage/wenzhang/0100652.pdf
here ya go Grumpy
@Grumpy
It's uploaded to the forum here;
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=downloads;sa=view;down=276
Hello all,
working on my 15" TPU I see more and more that I was right in my suggestion to the people that the Sweet drawing at the magnetism fateback site is somehow a TPU drawing. I said almost 2 years ago that this drawing only has to be "translated" into a TPU because of the turns numbers.
The site you can see if you google magnetism fateback.
Otto
Hello all,
@Loner
in this Sweet drawing we can see collectors, 2 cores, T1 and T2 as "transformers" to get a high voltage...
I never understood the FB1 and FB2 coils.
THAT ARE OUR CONTROL COILS!!
Otto
Quote from: Loner on May 06, 2009, 12:48:25 AM
...
You never looked up the Rowland Effect, Roentgen Current, Eichenwald, or the Wilson Effect.
Polarization currents (including displacement current) produce a magnetic field even though no electrons are traveling along a wire.
Did you know that photons have two polarization states, and that virtual photons have four states? Photons also have inertia - hint hint hint hint hint hint
@loner
I am in complete agreement with the Grumpster. The jokers whom state fields do not have inertia ignore all of the evidence to the contrary. They create terms such as "carriers" or "virtual" to explain away the self-evident but contradictory facts.
Like Grumpy said... photons hint, hint... :)
Paul Andrulis
(P.S. Loner, are you going to post the papers you were talking about, or at least a link? I still want to read them.)
@loner
One more thought. Have you ever wondered where the energy for fields comes from in the first place? Remember conservation of energy. Remember that there is no such critter as virtual energy. So, what energy how and where? (count the electrons....)
Paul Andrulis
A riddle for all:
Spin them fast
Spin them slow
When spin stops
Where do they go?
Spin them fast
Spin them slow
Change the spin
To and fro.
Paul Andrulis
@loner
ignore the P.S.... Just found the info.
Quote from: pauldude000 on May 06, 2009, 01:10:22 PM
@loner
I am in complete agreement with the Grumpster. The jokers whom state fields do not have inertia ignore all of the evidence to the contrary. They create terms such as "carriers" or "virtual" to explain away the self-evident but contradictory facts.
Like Grumpy said... photons hint, hint... :)
Paul Andrulis
(P.S. Loner, are you going to post the papers you were talking about, or at least a link? I still want to read them.)
Yes, photons!
http://van.physics.illinois.edu/qa/listing.php?id=414
QuoteMagnetic field is made of photons
Q: My question is--What is a magnetic field made of? I’ve read a lot of things about magnets and the fields they generate, and even that electrons themselves have magnetic fields around them, but I haven’t as of yet come across anything saying what the field itself is made of. It is matter so it has to be made of something. Is there a name for these "particles"? Or are they simply electrons themselves?
-Douglas (age 35)
Louisiana USA
A: Hi Douglas,
The electromagnetic interaction is mediated by the constant exchange of photons from one charged object to another. The magnetic field is really just a classical approximation to the photon-exchange picture. In a moving reference frame, a magnetic field appears instead as a combination of a magnetic field and an electric field, so electric and magnetic fields are made of the same "stuff" (photons).
Some electromagnetic interactions involve "real" photons with definite frequencies, energies, and momenta. Electrostatic and magnetic fields involve the exchange of "virtual" photons instead. Very close to an electron is a dense cloud of virtual photons which are constantly being emitted and re-absorbed by the electron. Some of these photons split into electron-positron pairs (or pairs of even heavier stuff), which recombine into photons which are re-absorbed by the original electron. These virtual particle loops screen the charge of the electron so that far away from an electron it appears as if it has less charge than close by.
Normally we wouldn’t call any of these fields "matter", but it is true that the electric and magnetic fields which surround a charged object like an electron do store energy, and therefore have a rest mass, via E=mc^2 (in a reference frame in which the electron has no momentum).
Tom
I'll water this down, but hopefully it will "click" in your head:
So, if a magnetic field is made of virtual photons and I make a rotating field of virtual photons - then I should be able to induce current into a toroidal coil if the virtual photon field is rotating within the coil.
Get it?
I should have used the term "momentum" rather than "inertia".
You'd be further along if you reviewed the Rowland, Roentgen, Eichenwald, and Wilson. Few non-physicists are familair with them at all.
@Loner
No insult taken! This kind of theorization can be a bit much for anyone to wrap their head around, including me. However, your credibility has actually increased in my book, not decreased.
I understand your basis, but what I put forth for your consideration is the fact that quantity cannot be removed from property, except in an equation. This is a cause and effect universe, with the effects tied inseparably to the root causes. The understanding of physics is geared towards gaining an understanding from a particular viewpoint.
I can state for a photon E=hf, and in such do not need to consider E=mc^2, for instance. Yet, does hf in any way negate mc^2 (ignoring the lorentzian transformation equations for simplicity)?
Ask yourself a simple question: why is mass coupled with c in ANY equation, considering that mass is by definition a property of matter only, and c is a constant for electromagnetic energy in a vacuum only. Einstein is still chuckling in his grave, as he understood full well the ramifications of this..... :)
(My guess is he left the concept unvoiced to allow the idea to become fully entrenched in physics before the revelation would HAVE to become both evident eventually, and irreversible logically, in order to stem off unnecessary traditionalist argument.)
Yet, a photons energy can indeed be found using hf, and the "virtual mass" can be figured with mc^2. I just state the mass is not virtual, that mass itself is another EFFECT of the existence of not "matter", but ENERGY. Therefore, all energy would and does indeed demonstrate the mass based "effects". (momentum, inertia etc.)
It should not be surprising to anyone reading this truthfully, though I myself overlooked the principle for quite a very long while myself, and was more than puzzled for years. However, QM, String theory, Etc, models all show that "matter" never was what we considered as "matter" anyway, but instead are a confined "packet" of energy. Relativity actually encompasses the concept, as well as QM. It is only the old definitions and understanding of "matter" that is violated.
I hate to state it this way, but particle research and QM have already shattered the old notion of "solidity" anyway.
Loner, I agree that when trying to consider this from the classical viewpoint, the complexity is staggering. I just wish to point out that I think our understanding is what is at fault, for the unnecessary complexity. I actually think reality is MUCH simpler than we make it according to it base principles, but more complex than we CAN understand within this limited framework.
To quote you "You can state that all currents create a magnetic field". First, I do not think ALL currents create a magnetic field, in fact this is limited in my understanding of only one type of "current", namely the one associated with the flow of electrons.
Yet I propose that any charged particle can "flow" from an area of excess charge to an area of depleted charge. In essence, that any charge imbalance can equalize, no matter the charged particle type. For instance, the only non-charged particle I am aware of (some of my knowledge may be out of date) is the neutron. What about the thousands of "other" charged particles?
Each type, when flowing or moving in any way may well have their own associated effects, in the same manner as the electron. Also, the flow of one may well affect the flow of another, due to field or charge interactions.
Now, you are absolutely right in that understanding these things do not necessarily affect on a large scale circuit designed for the lowly electron. However, understanding their interoperability, effects, and interactions may well be critical.
For OU purposes, OU may never be achieved except by accident unless these things are taken into consideration, as the electron is the best known of the bunch, and its rules of operation are the best defined and understood. Not all, mind you, but a good working model of operation.
@all
Sorry about this "DR GIGANTO" post... I couldn't say these things with any comprehension at all utilizing less wordage. I also think this is probably not adequately enough explained as it sits.
Paul Andrulis
So, how would we apply the ol' virtual photons to .99's work?
... or we could move it to the spherics thread and apply it to his tetrahedral device.
@all
I want everyone to know that at this point, my understanding is changing rapidly, sometimes daily on both minor and major points. I am at the logical interpretation and assimilation stage of my revisal of knowledge.
I am not putting forth ANY theory in any manner as concrete at this stage. All is tentative, so please take it as such. Do not assume the previous conceptions as polished theory.
I could well be completely full of the brown stuff. Time, experimentation, and observation will tell.
Paul Andrulis
Quote from: Grumpy on May 06, 2009, 10:05:46 PM
So, how would we apply the ol' virtual photons to .99's work?
... or we could move it to the spherics thread and apply it to his tetrahedral device.
Winding for special effects:
The shorted "jumping" jumper cable analogy just came to mind, with my new understanding. Amplification of the magnetic field by induced rotation!
Please bear with me on this. Not necessarily bifilar winding, but possibly bipolar?
You could get the same effect with lamp cord. Strip both ends, then twist one end pair together. Use one wire of the opposite end pair as positive, and the other as negative.
In a bifilar winding, the inductive system is self canceling, and becomes energy storative. This is due to the parallel currents flowing in the same direction. All spin is the same direction for both currents, and therefore fighting each other for field effect spin.
In a bipolar winding, such as the shorted jumper cable scenario, the fields are OPPOSITE in rotation, and therefore effect interaction amplification becomes possible. What makes them "jump", would be literally hundreds or thousands of whorls in the field between the wires.
These whorls may interact with other (particle) effects to affect a localized gravity effect change! WOW!
This effect, in conjunction with other like fields when wound around a toroid, may well induce an overall amplified spin.
However, this spin MAY NOT BE MAGNETIC IN NATURE, though it may interact with magnetism, or allow the production of magnetism, and therefore allow for the generation of electricity.
Now, in Spherics tetrahedron, that is possibly scary.
Four fields with localized effect on what is in essence a "virtual chamber" in the center may do interesting things. Four fields can cause balance, or imbalance. For a true effect of any kind, an imbalance of forces is needed. To produce imbalance, three field have to be of same polarity and spin, the fourth MUST NOT BE, but must be opposite, for any imbalance induced amplification of any effect.
What I am starting to wonder, is if the mysterious "wave" which "smacked so many here in the chest", was in effect an unstable dissolution of a localized gravity effect.
Spherics pattern though, reminds me more of a force chamber than an electrical production device.
Yes, I agree with you in that I am probably full of the brown stuff.
Paul Andrulis
Hello all,
@Paul
as we know we are pulsating our coils so please!!!! would you be so kind to make a 1 minute hand drawing so we can see what you mean?? The problem is that we have on 1 end of the coil pulses and on the other end a + or - connected.
Sorry, Im a little bit stupid, ha,ha.
And maybe other solutions?? Of course I also would love to know: are you talking about controls, collectors....
Otto
"However, this spin MAY NOT BE MAGNETIC IN NATURE, though it may interact with magnetism, or allow the production of magnetism, and therefore allow for the generation of electricity"
"current" with no electrons movement = masless current?
Physics professor Hong Guo:
"Charge current is the motion of charge; the movement of electrons creates a current. But electrons have other properties as well: mass, charge and spin. The motion of spin creates a spin current. But spin current is difficult to control, so charge current is used in all electronic devices, up to now."
"Our paper shows that a spin current can be generated using a rotating magnetic field, which flows out of the device without charge current. The spin current can then be controlled very quickly using a voltage -- this is the spin field effect transistor idea. Today, transistors use voltage to control charge current; we are saying it can do the same to control spin current. We also analyze whether this can be done with existing technology, and we conclude that it can be accomplished in a lab. I believe it will generate interest from experimental people, who will try to make it happen."
"For very tiny devices in the future, the problem of heat damage must be solved... would be helpful in terms of energy dissipation. A spin current does not couple to environment as strongly as charge current, and thus it does not give heat away as easily -- in other words, it does not create friction as easily."
??? ??? ???
Quote from: Grumpy on May 06, 2009, 10:05:46 PM
So, how would we apply the ol' virtual photons to .99's work?
... or we could move it to the spherics thread and apply it to his tetrahedral device.
Keep in mind that a magnetic field, per Eric Dollard and Leedskalnin, is composed of two flows of virtual photons in opposite directions. Per Wheatstones experiment with three spark gaps, we know that an electric current is also two flows of particles (everyone ignores the positron) in opposite directions. Two flows of different velocity may be the same as two in the opposite direction and I think this is what SM was doing - perhaps both depending on which unit you look at.
Next question is how do you make virtual photons flow, or appear to flow? If you just create a pulse, they move radially which is no good because we need to direct them. How do we make them go the right direction?
In a conventional circuit the ppower source determines the direction. Be it a battery, power supply, or capacitor, they are all dipole sources with positive coming out one way and negative out the other. So, it appears that we could "bias" our bifilar wires to give the photons a sense of direction.
I think this page has some interesting info regarding the TPU:
Scalar coil pulsing technique:
http://magnetism.otc.co.nz/Atoms.htm (http://magnetism.otc.co.nz/Atoms.htm)
/Tommy
@Grumpy
If you wish to directionalize a force, then you examine the direction of propagation, and design accordingly......
For instance, the whorls created in the "quantum foam" are at right angles to the direction of flow in the wire. These whorls, or vortices, tornadoes, etc.. (whatever term you like is fine) are by nature spin inducing currents, which would affect both spin and flow of all mass containers, or mass effect containers, whichever term you prefer.
Two devices would be needed to test for proper overall spin direction, which one would not even think of, as neither device normally associated with electronics....
A device to test for ratational torque on small scales (light turntable type device), and a good small postal type non-digital scale, or balance beam....... This should be in itself MORE than just a small hint at what I am getting at.
Look for inertial effects, scale of magnitude, and direction of force propogation. Rewind your coil if necessary to redirect the force to the desired angle.
E=mc^2, such a beautiful equation, and much handier now to me than I thought possible before.
Paul Andrulis
@all
We are starting to swim in new uncharted water, so tread carefully.........
DO NOT, please do NOT, try what I stated earlier with Spherics device!!!!!!!! It just hit me why it reminds me of a force chamber!!
Some of the effects which SHOULD become apparent are gravitic in nature. Spherics device may well, if my imagination is working at all, create a localized gravitic distortion, somewhat controlled in nature. Call it a "gravity bottle" for want of a better term or description. The force of gravity is exponential by nature. At the periphery, the effect may be quite small, while at the center quite strong. If too strong, then packet structures of individual particles may well be forced to contact DESPITE natural spin repulsion and therefore rupture, and possibly restructure into new stable combinants.
What I am talking about is, again for want of a better term.... possibly complete PARTICLE (not simply atomic) fission then re-fusion. If controlled, then not a problem, except for possibly powerful variant flows. If control is lost during the process???? (This scenario is not funny.)
Therein is probably the "overunity", of many electrical devices. The previous principle on an extremely small scale. Packet Energy Conversion, or PEC for short. A little goes a long way.
Paul Andrulis
Biasing is a good start.
Quote from: otto on May 07, 2009, 02:58:31 AM
Hello all,
@Paul
as we know we are pulsating our coils so please!!!! would you be so kind to make a 1 minute hand drawing so we can see what you mean?? The problem is that we have on 1 end of the coil pulses and on the other end a + or - connected.
Sorry, Im a little bit stupid, ha,ha.
And maybe other solutions?? Of course I also would love to know: are you talking about controls, collectors....
Otto
Otto, what I speak of is simple as breathing. Use ordinary plain lamp cord (or speaker wire... "zip-cord" of any style, which is heavy gauge, 2 conductor parallel with plastic insulation). Wrap your controls with this material.
Simple wire diagram below.
Twisted together at this end:
][
][
| | |
| | |
| | |
| | |
| | |
|| ||
|| ||
+ -
+ = pulse input
- = Circuit ground
Use this as your controls. Whether you will need one control all the way around, or two controls, I don't yet know.
This would focus the effect "vortexes" into the collectors in the center. Pulsing this would in effect be the same in concept as having jumper cables hooked to a battery, then slapping the clamps against each other, except with much less current involved.
At the right frequency, the pulse will be in lock step with each other on the two wires, and the effect would be at maximum for that voltage/amperage combination.
However, if you use a sintered iron core.... you may get more than you are looking for. (I know you like TV yokes, but please try it first without one.)
Personally, I want to try one with a single control all the way around, and the same type of wire hookup for the collector as well, but hook the control and the collector in series, on a TV yoke...... :) (not looking with this experiment for electricity generation.......)
It would be interesting to try the amplification setup BEP gave, as an answer to a question from me, in the "steven marks tube amp" thread.....
Interesting indeed.
EDIT:
DO NOT CLOSE WIND the lamp cord, as it may kill the effect! leave a space between each winding.
Paul Andrulis
The more I think about this, the more everything starts making sense, and the more of SM's clues start adding up.
For instance, look at a bar magnet under a sheet of paper, using iron power or filings sprinkled on the top of the paper. The classic "look at the mag field" experiment.
Notice something. No "lines of force" coming from the center of the bar magnet. The only concentration of perpendicular "lines" are from the pole areas. (Aaaaggh! I hate the term "lines of force". Fits like a salvation army shoe reject. They are only "lines" when viewed in flatland.)
Now, remember SM's toroid "jitter" when it moved? (He wasn't wearing a parka, so obviously wasn't even close to either magnetic pole of the earth.) Hint... The TPU wasn't "cutting" any "lines of force", which were PARALLEL to his TPU unit during the demonstration.
What, I ask therefore, was causing the TPU to have a case of the "jitters"?
:o
Paul Andrulis
Hello all,
I finished a very log post about cores, coils.....wanted to post it but I realized that it has no sence.
Why?
The people have a lot of their ideas, are maybe working on TPUs....I dint want to disturb them with my misleading posts. Its better Im quiet.
All I saw here is that nobody is listening!!
@Paul
try it.
Otto
@otto
There is no one saying your are wrong or right. If you have some idea please say it regardless.
Ideas are thrown around all the time and it is in these ideas that can give more ideas.
You are right about LTPU output voltage 800V x 1.2 amps = ???
So three coils, one in coil/cap resonance and two driven via the two center toroids via one frequency, makes two frequency and one resonance. If each of the three have only 0.40 amps, how many volts does each have to be to arrive at the above end result on the collector and do they have to be in parallel or series???????? Hey that's toooo easy.
You see, those amp ratings are very revealing. We now know all the wires, toroids, caps, etc., have to resist a minimum volts/amps rating. lol
Also think about the LTPU has two wires going to only one volume control or pot beside the two left on/off switches. I am thinking that if one of the two CC1/crossover lines was driven under resonance, the coil with cap would just follow it, but the third CC2/crossover would have to be trimmed to the first, so only one pot is required. lol
For me it will be easier to build one then to explain one. Build and test is the only way. lol There is a total of approximately 426 control coil turns of wire all around the LTPU. It could be 142 x 3. Or it is most likely 213x2 plus an additional 2 x 112 one to left and one to right of the output with the two black caps. Two half winds agrees better because when SM put his hands over the LTPU to show energy flow it was in a two way method with both hands starting away from him and coming together. Very symmetrically.
Anyways, maybe it is me that is the bother so I will just build one and show it when it is finished. Lucky I won't have to hide anything so this will take much less time.
I think maybe the problem many have with iron is to see where in the tpu there is some iron. But If what you are doing is getting results, then you are doing something right with your iron core technique.
There are many ways to do this and we don't have to make a true tpu replica. I am more oriented to deciphering physically the actual tpu's, slowly but surely, one step at a time, but anyways, the end result is what will really count.
Quote from: otto on May 08, 2009, 02:01:44 AM
All I saw here is that nobody is listening!!
This is correct.
@Otto
Please understand that my warning reference to iron cores has little to do with magnetism, but with OTHER potential effects. It would simply be better, and probably SAFER, to test without a ferrous core.
By all means Otto, please post your ideas! I may well be full of the brown stuff, and in ways actually HOPE I am.
Paul Andrulis
Hello all,
@wattsup, Paul
heeeey guys, I was all the time talking about COPPER cores!!!
NO IRON.
To use iron is out of any logic!!
We want highly accelerated particles and NOT the contra - slowed down particles. Iron is only slowing down the particles because they penetrate the iron core. As the penetrating is very deep, the particles are slowed down.
A totally different situation we have with Metglas cores. The particles are only striving over the surface over such a core and the end effect is zero.
So, COPPER CORES!!!
In this moment I cant give you ideas or what Im doing because .... because.....it doesnt matter.
Otto
Quote from: otto on May 11, 2009, 01:29:35 AM
Hello all,
@wattsup, Paul
heeeey guys, I was all the time talking about COPPER cores!!!
NO IRON.
To use iron is out of any logic!!
We want highly accelerated particles and NOT the contra - slowed down particles. Iron is only slowing down the particles because they penetrate the iron core. As the penetrating is very deep, the particles are slowed down.
A totally different situation we have with Metglas cores. The particles are only striving over the surface over such a core and the end effect is zero.
So, COPPER CORES!!!
In this moment I cant give you ideas or what I'm doing because .... because.....it doesnt matter.
Otto
otto
you are so right
i have looking that mylow motor and mister MrfixitRick stuff and there is that one little thing
i believe that right freq and right core material hmmm okey tpu is making two kind of energy
heat and electricity but the energy is coming from same place
maybe wrong maybe right
Hello all,
@zapnic
I know that Im right but dont even think I would read the other threads. The posts there would only confuse my little brain. Im not willing to read all over this big forum. Its a waste of time. A waste of time in the sence that nobody can help me and I even dont want help. I have more then enough ideas.
I would love my TPU is not so warm? hot? something between both. The heat is not good but....for now, I have to accept it.
Otto
@otto
Thanks for your clarification.
My main work has always been to better physically describe SM's TPU's in an effort that these descriptions may help others to better understand how it could work. I am seeing much more clearly the LTPU now after having worked closely on the FTPU physicals.
How the actual devices work will always be left to figure out exactly but the physical side will never change from what we have in hand.
There is only one question I have and it will never be to ask you to explain your device testing, etc., because I know it will only open up a whole new can of worms on the forum and this is not help to you at all. lol
So the question is when you are saying "copper core", the copper I understand and also why it could be used. The word "core" is more puzzling. Are you referring to the two center toroid cores because in my eyes that is the only place I can see a core. Or are you talking about the outer ring materials or wires in the outer ring in the FTPU and LTPU.
To me the word "core" announces a "coupling" process between two coils. Or as in my last LTPU description on this thread, yes the two center toroid cores could be copper even with bucking coil arrangements. I suppose this would offer less saturation potential but very quick reaction of what I would call "bounce back" or "reflection". One pulse to the copper coil wound rebound more pulses. I don't really know. SM did mention "shadow casting".
If I knew what you mean physically in the TPU by the word "core" then I could investigate the physicals of the TPUS to see a relationship and maybe even come back with some better identifications.
Anyways, keep well. Don't burn your fingers.
wattsup
PS: This is something that goes for all member when talking about the TPU's please try to physically clearly place the components you are talking about. Don't just say core, because there could be more then one. Don't just say coil, because there is more then one and all this only confused the issue further.
Hello all,
@wattsup
I have real 2 cores. They are 15" in diameter and made with copper pipes 1/2" in diameter. That are 2 rings.
@All
Maybe its time to discuss the kicks. I mean the positive - oridinary kicks and the negative kicks.
What are the differences, advantages, disadvantages?
We have here enough good educated people for a good discussion, I hope.
This is very important because a discussion about kicks can clear up a lot in the understanding of TPUs.
I would love to concentrate more on the negative kicks.
I used them in my ECD TPU if you dont know how they llook like.
Otto
Dear sirs.
This is my first contribution in OverUnity.com.
I have an integrative point of view recently.
I would like to share with you this view.
My English is poor English.
But I think the logic is easy to understand.
http://oriharu.net/eMylow_motor.htm (http://oriharu.net/eMylow_motor.htm)
Hello all,
@oriharu
welcome on board.
Im always "afraid" when I see newbies posting here because not once I had the feeling that SM was posting.
Guys remember "dfro", "spherics"? They posted only a few times but they did a great "job". At least for me.
Otto
PS: I see here a great discussion about kicks and coils and all the TPU stuff.
@otto dont wory and nothing to fraid from new people here
beacouse ...... i have say that here in forum has people ho his jobs
is for KEEP THE SECRET AWAY FROM AS
AND THAT PEOPLE WHILL NOT SAY HOW TO MAKE ONLY WHILL SAY COMPLEX EXPLANATIONS AND THEN WHILL BE LOST TIME AND ....
SOME DAY WHILL CAME WHEN THE SECRET WHILL BE DISCOVER
@ALL
BY THE WAY i like to say and i allways like to say but nobody listen me but i whill say
tpu or dc generator ....if we like to make mast be working in the principe
on CONVERSION THE ENERGY >
IF ENERGY IS NOT CONVERSION THEN WE WHILL NEVER HAVE MORE <COP THEN 1>
THE MEAN WHAT IS CONVERSION MAST BE ANDERSTEND FIRST
IF ENERGY IS CONVERTED TO ATHER TYPE OF ENERGY WE WHILL HAVE MORE <COP>
SIMPLE IF WE HAVE SIMPLE TRANSFORMER ADN MAKE PRYMARY AND SECUNDARY COIL THE ENRGY IS NOT CONVERTED BEACOUSE ......
IF SOME TRANSFORMER HAS... ABLE TO TRANSFORM ENRGY OF ELKTROMAGNETS FILD TO ATHERE TYPE OUT ENRGY DIFERENT OF .. THEN I SAY THEN YOU WHILL SEE AND YOU WHILL HAVE CONVERSION DEVICE <<LIKE <S.M>>
Hello all,
@MAC
I only wanted to say that they made fantastic posts and "forced" me to think about the TPU in another way.
Otto
hi @ otto
bio si u pravo ja mislim da si jedan covek zaboravio da kazes negovo ime <<tao>
taj je kazao nesto vrlo impresivno i mislim da je dodirnuo <s.m>
sa njegovim teoriom <zar ne sta mislis
NO PITAM SE KADA CE NAS FORUM DA NAPRAVI TAJ VEIKI DINAMO GENERATOR BEZ <MOVING PARTS >
;)
@all
Have any of you seen this patent before.
Method of gravity distortion and time displacement.
United States Patent Application 20060073976
I put it here - just click on the pdf;
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Inventors/Marlin%20Pohlam/
This goes way above my head on the technical side but the basic premise may have some bearing on the TPU.
wattsup
Quote from: wattsup on June 04, 2009, 07:49:53 AM
@all
Have any of you seen this patent before.
Method of gravity distortion and time displacement.
United States Patent Application 20060073976
I put it here - just click on the pdf;
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Inventors/Marlin%20Pohlam/
This goes way above my head on the technical side but the basic premise may have some bearing on the TPU.
wattsup
===============================================
That must be a SUPER GOOD patent because it is being BLOCKED from downloading! Can you post that patent someplace so we can download it?
Thank you.
.
@FatBird
How is this. Just added the 3Ws.
http://www.purco.qc.ca/ftp/Inventors/Marlin%20Pohlam/
wattsup
Hmmm.....
My head hurts now but it is a good read.
What he should have said is when you fire it up it looks pink from above and blue from below and anything you put in the middle looks like it is slowing down until you turn off the power.
I wonder if he was burned at the stake or declared insane :D
Interesting patent application! I wonder if there is anyone at the patent office able to verify the validity of this document? What is it in this document that you think is related to the TPU? It looks more like a "Time Looking Glass" to me.
Ah!
I guess I won't waste time checking his math. He's a fellow of Mensa ;D
What does this have to do with a TPU ???
Well yeh, it is a damn hard read and I am not ashamed to say that at least 80% is way above my head. This is not a patent, it is more like a treaties on the whole of electricity, gravity and magnetism.
At one time, there was some understanding with some OUmembers that the components of the tpu had to be located inside the ring because there would occur a time differential if the components were on the outside, hence it would be impossible to control the device in its real time frame.
Also, anytime someone says do some sinusoidal pulsing, my ears and eyes open up to see in there is anything TPu related. It's a force of habit. lol
When I started reading his patent it just blew me away realizing how the hell can someone actually patent such a thing (and get away with it).
I did some googling on this guy and found this to be very interesting and copied the first paragraph below the link.
http://proposals.igniteportland.com/proposals/48
"In 2003 Marlin Pohlman was diagnosed with Hodgkin’s Lymphoma and underwent a stem cell transplant. To combat the effects of the chemotherapy he was given high doses of Modafinil in a clinical trial. Modafinil, a nootropic gave him a short term increase his mathematical and cognitive ability. Making the best of a bad situation Marlin put his short-term ability and enhanced focus to work on the mathematics of time travel, a life long interest. This work lead to the publication of USPTO Application #: 20060073976, A Method of gravity distortion and time displacement. This invention is being offered royalty free to any and all groups desiring to pursue this field of study. (e.g. not a product pitch)"
Now you can know why your head hurts so much. This guy was on cerebral overdrive.
I grabbed two sections of the text that i think are important to me anyways,
Now, even in the detailed description of the invention where one would expect the normal run down of the components, one by one, number by number, explaining their inter relationships, but none in this patent. So actually the Fig. 1 that I am putting below is not really described in the true patent sense, yet there is a patent. Hmmmmm.
Anyways, there may be no relation at all to a TPU, but usually when I read something, even something that I do not really understand, there are facets of the text that just jump out at me and say, "Hey, could this be applied to a TPU?".
Sorry if there is nothing relevant.
wattsup
@wattsup
My last question was sarcasm.
There are many things in the patent that sound like solutions for a TPU.
-And-
You don't earn or keep a Mensa membership with drugs of any kind. There are none that increase your IQ. There are a few that increase your ability to focus.
I meant it when I said it was a good read. Much of the math was above me without doing some serious digging. I'll check into his formulae but i doubt I'll be able to see faults.
His description of electricity and magnetism offer validation for things I consider as 'fact'.
It's just a patent application. All the good stuff is at the bottom... Have you seen so many references? It's still just mathematical theory, painted like a picture.
Does this application merit it's own thread? What a puzzle to solve! Could make the longest thread yet and possibly the most popular! hmmmm....
Hello all,
maybe its better to think about TPUs and not about such patents.
The TPU is not soooo complicated.
SM said its only the knowledge about how coils are working, interacting...
Then you have Tesla with his coils...
Otto
Quote from: wattsup on June 04, 2009, 07:49:53 AM
@all
Have any of you seen this patent before.
Method of gravity distortion and time displacement.
United States Patent Application 20060073976
I put it here - just click on the pdf;
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Inventors/Marlin%20Pohlam/
This goes way above my head on the technical side but the basic premise may have some bearing on the TPU.
wattsup
Thanks for posting this wattsup!! Been studying some similar work, (and related to Wilbert Smith's ideas) just starting to read this. Possible topological transformations... and the TPU!
;D :o
The patent examiner's response: ;)
http://portal.uspto.gov/external/PA_1_0_15H/view/BrowsePdfServlet?objectId=EXC23L7VPPOPPY1&lang=DINO
And Marlin's response! :o 355 pages!!! :o
http://portal.uspto.gov/external/PA_1_0_15H/view/BrowsePdfServlet?objectId=F16ZHYVXPPOPPY5&lang=DINO
To access above: enter application # 10/954,767
http://portal.uspto.gov/external/portal/pair
and click the tab "Image File Wrapper"
also another view for the patent application:
http://www.google.com/patents/about?id=oH2bAAAAEBAJ
Check the amended Pohlman claim 04-23-2007 CLM :
Most of the 355 page response refers to the work of George Sparling for support:
One of the abstracts of his latest papers is a helpful summary:
Spacetime is spinorial; new dimensions are timelike
Author: George A.J. Sparling
http://arxiv.org/abs/gr-qc/0610068
Since Pythagoras of Samos and Euclid of Alexandria [1], we have
known how to express the squared distance between entities as
the sum of squares of displacements in perpendicular directions.
Since HermannMinkowski [2] and Albert Einstein [3], the squared
interval between events has acquired a new term which represents
the square of the time displacement and which comes in with a
negative sign. Most higher dimensional theories, whose aim is
to unify the physical interactions of nature, use space-like extra
dimensions (more squares with positive signs) rather than timelike
(more squares with negative signs)[4âˆ'8]. But there need be
no contradiction if timelike extra dimensions are used: for example,
in the seminal work of Lisa Randall and Raman Sundrum [8],
consistency can be achieved by replacing their parameters r,^2
and lambda by âˆ'r,^2 and âˆ'lambda, respectively. Here a new
spinorial theory of physics is developed, built on Einstein’s general
relativity [3] and using the unifying triality concept of Elie Cartan [9,10]:
the triality links space-time with two twistor spaces[9âˆ'14]. Unification
entails that space-time acquires two extra dimensions, each of which
must be time-like. The experimental device known as the Large
Hadron Collider, which is just now coming online, is expected to
put the higher-dimensional theories and this prediction in particular
to the test [15,16].
Citation for above article: Sparling, George A. J. “Germ of a synthesis: space-time is spinorial, extra dimensions are time-like.†Proc. R. Soc. A. doi:10.1098/rspa.2007.1839.
Story at: http://www.physorg.com/news96027669.html
Mathematician suggests extra dimensions are time-like
April 17th, 2007 By Lisa Zyga
[snip]
“My work can be seen as a strong antidote to the present air of pessimism surrounding modern fundamental physics,†Sparling said. “As is well-known, string theory has been roundly criticized for its lack of predictive power. String theorists have been reduced to an absurd reliance on the anthropic principle, for example. Here I have a clear-cut prediction, which goes against the common wisdom, which gives experimenters a target to go for: first find the extra dimensions, then decide their signature (a very tough homework assignment!). Of course I could be proved wrong, but the effort to decide is surely worthwhile.
“Actually, in the area of philosophy, I am in opposition to string theory,†he said. “It is a top down theory: dream up something that works in some high dimension and then try to finagle some way of reducing to fit in with the lower-dimensional theory. My approach is bottom up: take the existing four-dimensional theory seriously and try to build up from it. This is very tough to do. Hopefully my ideas work. Note that my work only constitutes a possible beginning at a more inclusive theory.â€
Quote from: otto on June 05, 2009, 05:06:57 AM
Hello all,
maybe its better to think about TPUs and not about such patents.
The TPU is not soooo complicated.
SM said its only the knowledge about how coils are working, interacting...
Then you have Tesla with his coils...
Otto
@Otto
In this puzzle one finds pieces that have the correct color pattern but do not fit. Then there are the pieces that fit but have the wrong colors.
I await your presentation of the working simplicity.
Many things attributed to SM have become true. I am at the point where strange effects can be generated. Some defy explanation by any current rules. Now, these are only good party tricks to confuse people.
This patent only demonstrates the thoughts of a typical, over-the-edge, genius. They have absolutely no creative ability except to translate, explain, validate and combine the work of many others into patterns very few can understand.
I suspect this patent examiner has an above average IQ but the theory described in the patent will never be understood by him.
Also, the theory cannot be completely correct. It suggest the possibility of time travel. In my mind time-viewing may be possible but time travel will never happen. How so? Because of my early mention of experiments using a watch and coils.
So who is correct? Was SM correct in his explanations?
Until I see some viable method of producing extra power I will continue trying pieces from other puzzles.
The attached pics are sooo unrelated to the TPU - NOT!
@wattsup
I read a good portion of the patent you posted the link for, and noticed a severe logical flaw in the thinking of the individual.
Namely he states (possibly correctly) that the individual energy of a quintessence is planks constant h, and is the smallest unit of energy in the system. He then states by formulaic conclusion that E=hn(sub)q representing the energy of the system. No problems yet.
He goes to state that conglomerations of these quintessences represent the representation of matter, which is logical. He states that lattices of these quintessences form space-time, somewhat speculation but yet acceptable logic.
He then ILLOGICALLY states that energy flows through this lattice, demonstrating that energy is not connected to space-time.
This is a serious flaw, as he has previously demonstrated all energy in the system as being accounted for, and in fact composes space-time, and all represented matter and light within the framework of his own theory. In essence, no energy to "flow through the quintessential lattice".
Am I the only one whom saw this?
Hi pauldude000,
I have yet to finish reading most of this, but so far it has some unfortunate typos and elementary mistakes in physical units and conversions. For instance, his n(sub)q is said to be a frequency, then later it is = m(sub)e/m(sub)q and m(sub)q = h/c^2 kg-s which is not just mass; h/c^2 has units of kg-m^3/s^3. He could clarify his terms more, in this respect it is not so much the problem you present, (he seems to using something more like a metaphor of a vortex in a medium) and when he speaks of energy he may only mean something related.
It is a puzzle why this was submitted as a patent application rather than a research paper, since he has no model details of a "working" unit. And despite the errors there is some interesting insight I've not seen elsewhere, a small example is for his approximation of electron-proton mass ratio, where again the units don't match up; but the numerical accuracy is remarkable and perhaps indicates something more than coincidence.
The conceptual basis is intriguing though the title word "distortion" could describe some of his physics. Since he has talked about this in his igniteportland proposal maybe he will further refine, correct, and write a research paper.
Hello all,
@BEP
I dont know but its only peoples fault if they cant find a solution for a TPU. They are NOT able to listen!!! This is the main problem.
It seems that a lot of people are only waiting instead of working.
I gave the builders more then they deserve and they are still ignoring me. Just remember, core - no core.
Yes, SM was correct with his explanations.
You mentioned "extra power".
Hmmmm.....
Here my statement: in a TPU you cant find extra power!!!
The only trick is to "hide" the load from the source!!! This is what everybody should understand.
@All
If some clever people wants a discussion about the "core - no core problem" Im here and please, no "PC heroes". And first think what youre wrighting because its not nice to spit on my words because I could be right!
Otto
Quote from: metatorian on June 07, 2009, 12:48:57 PM
Hi pauldude000,
I have yet to finish reading most of this, but so far it has some unfortunate typos and elementary mistakes in physical units and conversions. For instance, his n(sub)q is said to be a frequency, then later it is = m(sub)e/m(sub)q and m(sub)q = h/c^2 kg-s which is not just mass; h/c^2 has units of kg-m^3/s^3. He could clarify his terms more, in this respect it is not so much the problem you present, (he seems to using something more like a metaphor of a vortex in a medium) and when he speaks of energy he may only mean something related.
It is a puzzle why this was submitted as a patent application rather than a research paper, since he has no model details of a "working" unit. And despite the errors there is some interesting insight I've not seen elsewhere, a small example is for his approximation of electron-proton mass ratio, where again the units don't match up; but the numerical accuracy is remarkable and perhaps indicates something more than coincidence.
The conceptual basis is intriguing though the title word "distortion" could describe some of his physics. Since he has talked about this in his igniteportland proposal maybe he will further refine, correct, and write a research paper.
I have quoted your entire post to keep things clear in my mind as I write this. I seriously suspect he is coming from the aspect of a literal and not figurative mass energy relationship. In essence, that E really is equal to E.
n (sub) q would therefor HAVE to be a frequency, since E=hf. It would then have to be true mass/energy relationship as he is using it in reference to mass interchangeably, without constant reference to virtual mass, and would therefor also have an inherent mass frequency as if E=E then hf=mc(super)2. He is then tying all this into his mental framework.
Do not misunderstand, he is trying to do something I have understood for a long time to be true, yet he makes a separation between the energy of the system and total energy. All energy within the system is accounted for,unless the perception of the system itself is what is inadequate, which I personally think is the case here.
It is a terribly common mistake, which leads to fallacious thinking such as open or closed systems. There is no such critter as an open system, except in the minds of men. THE system is closed (there is only one). We merely tend to ponder utilizing entirely too small of scales of reference.
Paul Andrulis
heloo otto ... moram na engleski da kazem nesto za da me svi razume ;) razume
you have raid tpu is work whit and whitout core ;)
this is depend ho frekfency whiil be generated
BUT I HAVE MY OVN THINGIN BUT NOW IS NOT ONLY THING THAT
I LIKE TO SAY THAT AND I ALLTIME SAY THAT HO IS BE HARD TO EXPLANE AND IS LIKE NO POSIBLE <TPU IS MAKEING TRUE FASTING VORTEX SPEED BUT THIS YEARS IN FORUM DISCUSING HOW IS POSIBLE TO SPIN ELKTROMAGNET SO HARD TO EXPLANE AND REALY ANDERSTEND HOW
SOME OF MY ..... IF YOU LIKE TO SPIN ELKTROMAGNET OR PULSING OR ...
THE ELKTROMAGNET FILD IS ABLE TO SPIN OR MAKES ROTATION WHIT HIM ITSELF
THERE IS SOME ATHERE FORCE HOW GIVES TO SPIN
I SEE THE THE OPEND TPU
AND IF I TELL YOU SOME AMAIZING STRANGE SETUP
IF I TELL YOU THAT
THE RED BIFILAR 4 COILS IN THE OPEN TPU <IS NOT CONECTED ENYWHERE >
WHAT YOU WHILL THING NOW IM ASKING ALL HERE
IM JUST LIKE TO SEE PEOPLE WHAT IS THINGING FOR THAT
I KNOW SOME OF HERE WHILL SAY NO THAT IS STUPID THINGIN BEACOUSE WAY IS THEN NEED THAT WIRES ;)
NOW I SEE TPU IS LIKE <MAKES SPINING 5000 TIMES JUST IN ONE SECOND >WHIT VERY LITLE SMALL ELKTROMAGNET FILD
IMAGNET THE POWER SOME GENERATOR HO WHILL BE SPIN OF <300000 >SPINIG OF ONE MINUTES
Hello all,
OK, MAC says the TPU works with a core and without a core.
He is clever.
Who is the next??
Otto
Yes he must be a TUBE Professor....
Subquantum kinetics - the space between the spaces - 63x faster than the speed of light. Podkletnov.
How fast is that 'B' field spin or go around? You don't need a core.
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/magnetic/toroid.html
Quote
He then ILLOGICALLY states that energy flows through this lattice, demonstrating that energy is not connected to space-time.
This is a serious flaw, as he has previously demonstrated all energy in the system as being accounted for, and in fact composes space-time, and all represented matter and light within the framework of his own theory. In essence, no energy to "flow through the quintessential lattice".
I HAVE A FEW WORDS ...
RODIN COIL ... AND GET YOUR ROCK ON ;)
IST!
Hello all,
@Giantkiller says no core.
Who is the next???
Where are the TPU elite members??? HEEEEELLLLLOOOOO
Wake up!!
Otto
Quote from: innovation_station on June 08, 2009, 04:03:49 PM
RODIN COIL
If anyone needs help with a Rodin Coil, let me know and I'll do my best to be of use.
I do intend to make some more videos of the effects I have noted about the Rodin Coil soon as it is unique.
NOTE: Don't expect to get results by just shorting DC through it and hoping. Also don't be deceived by a moving magnet placed in the centre of the coil when you run AC through it. When researching this coil you should be careful to check if what you are observing actually IS unique, or if the same thing can happen with a normal coil with the same amount of wire and windings.
On a recent oscilloscope test I discovered that the Rodin Coil is an excellent inductor, especially for a coreless inductor. If I put in the right frequency in one coil, I found that the voltage output of the second coil ould increase, even triple, if I tuned to the right frequency, however, I have not yet measured the current output so don't get too uppity. I should point out though that the "primary" and "secondary" coils have the same number of windings so the voltage step-up is intriguing, I will double check my amplifiers, their voltage output is supposed to be 12 volts but you never know with Chinese products ::)
I think that one of the reasons the Rodin Coil makes such a great inductor is because the 2 seperate coils actually intertwine at the centre of the coil in a way, each coil is surrounded on either side by the other because of the geometry of the windings, I suppose I should draw an illustration to demonstrate this.
The Rodin Coil concentrates so much wire at the centre that the amount of inductance happening farther out doesn't matter so much because of the efficieny at the centre.
Geometry is essential stuff...
Quote from: Chef on June 09, 2009, 12:57:55 AM
Where is your proof?
Where is your proof to the contrary? ;)
Quote from: Chef on June 09, 2009, 12:57:55 AM
Wake up for what?
Where is your proof?
Why the discouragment?
Hi everyone
no core is very possible, conventional transformer has a core to amplify magnetic field, i think, using copper tube is more better so that mag-wire is easy to wind.
i think a feroite toroide core ..
ou can be acheived easly ..
with one without causeing massive disturbances to comm equ...
group the cascade colapesing magnetic feild ... pay for the first coil .. collect inputted power and kick in second cap and dump to following coil ... etc..... get through all 3 and dump to the load ... scoope a tiny bit of the final coil to replenish source to continue the operation ...
ist!
ps i can assure you there many ways .... ;)
@ otto
is this what you mean isolate from source ..... :D :D :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jiodkjo9hpk :)
my friend it is damm easy ....
ist!
once you can get a bit of the good stuff repete ... with it ..... idea start at 1.5 volts achieve a working voltage ... in a cap for the next coil ... then run it ... at say 12 vdc ... do it in steps ..
what are you looking for..
use a super cap allow buffer time to fill the cap and then draw off at the higher voltage ... ;)
sheesh tooo many ways bro
...
some of my designs are hi freq to lower freq devices .. high freq low volt supply ... ran fast ... lol then the output are ran at a much higher voltage but much lower freq...
i have built this many ways ... the shift coil is feroite and laminated iron as per hi freq and low freq ...
aswell aircore ...
i do have 1 more 1.5khz 5.5" feroite toroide ... laying around ... i can have any output voltage i desire in a cap ... i can darin off the out put cap to recharge the source ... and other batteries ... 8)
the princeable is the same 1000 x the current ...... ;)
Hello all,
@Chef
In this moment I dont want to prove anything. Im want only to hear the TPU elite members what they have to say.
The "wake up" was only for the TPU elite. I hope to get from them some response.
To hide the load from the TPU is an "old hat". When you connect a load to a pulsed TPU, the TPU doesnt "see" this load. The current from the power supply is the same as without a load.
There is no need for a circuit because the Moebius collector hides the load.
What do you think why in a 15" TPU are the bulbs connected in SERIES??
@Tito
no core. OK, thanks.
@IS
ferrite core.
OK, who is the next?
Otto
Hello all,
@Loner
1. Ferrite, iron......to have a good effect there is a sparc gap needed or at least a much higher frequency then we need in our TPUs. Look how Tesla did it. I would need a lot of words to explain how and why and i dont have so much time.
2. no core - a little bit complicated
3. Coper Wire Core - even more complicated then without a core because the particles are "splitted" to say so. In each single wire we have particles swirling around the toroid. If we have a multiturn "core" we have a lot of capacitance between each turn and this causes a total disaster. The hash is sooooo big...not to mention if we use 10 or 20 wires wound in a few turns...
The high voltage is not a problem for bulbs. I can light a bulb with 10kV, 20kV...
A time ago I wrote about negative resistance. A TPU has also a negative resistance. Just imagine:
Your TPU consumes from the power supply 5A. You connect a 2. bulb and the current dropps to 4,5A, you connect another bulb and you see 4A from the power supply.....isnt that good,ha,ha?
I have a 15" 3 stack TPU. 2 coils rotated in CW and the middle coil in CCW. And I dont see a better solution. And its the only possible solution. And this is the reason why a TPU has a height of....it doesnt matter. If we would have this rotating fields very near each other there would be sooooo a big "fight" of the particles...
Maybe you missed 1 of my posts: the controls have 22 turns!!!! This is veeeeery important. Did I mention lamp wire?
@All
I wait for other opinions.
Otto
Hello all,
@Loner
to light a bulb with 10kV or much more is not a problem. I made this with my ECD, now Im doing it with my 15" TPU....I have only to connect a 100W bulb. Nothing more. The point is that I dont have enough output power and this is the reason that I can connect a bulb directly to the TPU.
This works NOW! But not in future when I build a monster TPU. I mean, when I get a lot more output power. Then its really not good to connect a bulb directly to the TPU.
There are no stupid questions. We are discussing, sharing....
What do you mean with 1 loop??
Its clear that a loop works cleaner with a solid wire because in a solid wire is not soooo much capacitance. A stranded wire has a lot of wires and between each wire we have a capacitance and this you can see as a lot of hash on your scope. This hash is useless.
A long time I was working with controls wound around collectors. The controls wound 90° to the collectors.
Then I pulsed once only the collectors and saw that for the same light the TPU consumed less current. As I didnt know what to do I was a long time working only with pulsed collectors.
Then I saw the open TPU video, saw 22 turns controls (made with lamp wire), readed a comment that a TPU has 22 turns controls...
The point with 22 turns controls is that the angle between the control and collector is ...maybe 45°. This is very good. In this way are the particles from the controls in harmony with the collector particles. Everything is in harmony, to say so.
But if the controls are in a 90° relation to the collector then the particles have a fight. The controls wound in a vertical direction and the collectors in a horizontal direction...thats bad.
Every angle less then 90° is good. The diameter is not so important.
I can only hope that youre pulsing your TPU with a high voltage???? This is important!!
I have also a 15" test setup and had a 15" TPU. With this test setup Im learning, measuring....
I dont have anymore a 15" TPU because I want a new one. A better one.
Otto
@Otto
To answer your question I give you my opinion....
There is no core, not in the conventional sense. The part where a transformer core would be is a conductor.
When you wind around that conductor wind so the magnetic field of the control wire wraps this conductor in the same way you would wind a coil.
Remember the magnetic field around a conductor is perpendicular to the wire. More correct: the magnetic field is not like a tube surrounding the conductor it is helical. This field is radial with the axis of the magnetic facing the center of the conductor. Think drum type homopolar, generator shaft currents destroying bearings, etc.
I would say 45 deg. or less. This gives you a large space between winds of the control coil, so put more control windings on.
In a most basic TPU series connect the control and core. Any current drawn will reinforce the magnetic field from the control coil which increases speed and voltage from the core to the load.
The best core is a highly conductive tube with very thin wall thickness. Shove another control helix through this tube. Just make sure it aids the fields from the outside control coils.
I think of it like having a transformer core that can be wound around a wire.
The above opinion is probably not correct or maybe just not complete or I would not be paying utility bills right now ;)
otto
you want hv on the input side
so this is how i would do it ...
a mk2 hv ... jt ... to a cascade ... with diodes in between the caps ...
discharge to coil through sparkgap ...
i could explain this unit but its not my work ....
plus there hifreq issues really a poor way to do it ... as you will require high volt high freq diodes or tubes of low resistance
to have any use of it...
i try to contain the unit with in the core ...
this has worked well for me ..
and i dont need hv for ou ... lol
hears the proof ...... all goes both ways ...
ist
i reccomend a mk2 jt
@otto
No core = transfer is direct cc to mobius in series/parallel type mutual looping for mutual gain. The more the cc imparts to the ring, the more the ring imparts back to the cc. Means it is less possible to make full saturation if the frequency is well timed. Good thing.
Core = transfer must be between two or more coils via a core (that can act like a dioded capacitor for gain - good) but full saturation will start to kill it. Bad thing. You then get stuck to work only at resonance that has no punchy output.
FTPU is best example of no core and you get really great transfer between cc and ring. Funny as you said the cc winding is not perfect but very close to respect 45 degrees. Hmmmm.
But I am not a TPU-elite so maybe I should just follow along. lol
Quote from: Loner on June 09, 2009, 02:39:01 AM
SO, this says to me that the core is "Unimportant" to the basic operation,
No!
That is simply NOT correct.
I assume you have heard of a mechanism called "PI".
It stands for Pulse Induction and it is used in expensive metal detectors etc.
Any piece of metal as small as a dime has influence on the field and affects the operating frequency which is why these devices can detect metal at great distance.
Steven Mark gave the hint that metal near the unit changes it's operating characteristics and so it stops.
A core inside the TPU will do the same thing and even is it is tuned with the core inside the unit, it would make the unit even more sensetive for variables in frequency stability, due to external factors.
M.
Quote from: otto on June 09, 2009, 03:47:50 AM
@All
I wait for other opinions.
Otto
Depending on how you look at it, there is always a "core". In a coil with no material core, there is still air or a vacuum - both are dielectrics.
ferroite works awesome ...
fast release times ...
:)
aswell designed for the freq u desire... i choose low khz
it can run any way u design it to ..
my larger coils are generators ... ;)
i supply pulsed dc 1 2 or 3 freq ... i make use of both magnetic poles produced from the dc .. pulse coils ... north and south .... plus the colapse ... then i can add feedback .... lol :D
and the feed back is fed to the litz wire style mk2 pickup coils it acts as a resonant transformer .. to the other pickup coils twisted as 1 ... wire
ill digg up a picture of this unit ...
i no longer have it is was shipped to the US!!
ist!
Quote from: innovation_station on June 09, 2009, 11:39:13 AM
ferroite works awesome ...
fast release times ...
:)
HAHA about the slowest you can get.
try air ;)
The magnetic bias of my iron core retained a field to pulse against at very hi speed. It was always there including when it was hit with the previous pulse. Bam, Bam, Bam. No true control. That is the explanation of the spaztic energy output. The iron was impressed at many incident angles around the surface of the wire and the circumference.
It was only meant to be an example of an early conception.
Now imagine if air had been used to gain a higher speed of operation. Jdo300 showed the paper tube tests at that point.
--giantkiller. Not by sight but acknowledgement of the truths given.
Quote from: -[marco]- on June 09, 2009, 12:04:09 PM
HAHA about the slowest you can get.
try air ;)
yes indeed and with a parabolic alum dish ... ;D
i have air core coils ... but
i choose to contain this unit for now ;)
ist!
If you want some PI just shove a single insulated wire into a loop of small copper tubing. Exit the other end and wrap it back onto the outside of that same tubing. The return wrap should be a low pitch, say about 45 deg. With plenty of spacing between turns. Pulse the wire and measure volts from each end of the tubing. Best to use a fast scope. If the handedness of the outer wrap is wrong you will see almost nothing.
All I'm saying is simulate the mag fields going through a single piece of wire. The fields aren't just outside the wire.
Kudos
;)
So, the collector or converter can be toroidal or like a ring.
Quote from: BEP on June 09, 2009, 01:05:37 PM
If you want some PI just shove a single insulated wire into a loop of small copper tubing. Exit the other end and wrap it back onto the outside of that same tubing. The return wrap should be a low pitch, say about 45 deg. With plenty of spacing between turns. Pulse the wire and measure volts from each end of the tubing. Best to use a fast scope. If the handedness of the outer wrap is wrong you will see almost nothing.
All I'm saying is simulate the mag fields going through a single piece of wire. The fields aren't just outside the wire.
I don't have a working TPU. This was an experiment I did back when there was an argument about PI. This is also another way I found to make a loop resonate at very low frequencies.
You can get two pulses for the price of one. The tubing should only output during the rise and fall of the winding.
Don't make the loop too short. I had best results with a 15 ft piece of 1/4 inch tubing.
When you do this:
Quote from: BEP on June 09, 2009, 01:05:37 PM
All I'm saying is simulate the mag fields going through a single piece of wire. The fields aren't just outside the wire.
you can use a toroid or a ring or even two separated conductors to convert the energy into electricity.
Hazelton used a toroid.
SM used a ring (and maybe a toroid too)
Tesla used two separated conductors in his Radiant energy convertion devices (the solar ones) to charge capacitors.
here is 1 more pic of the otto test toroide jt config unit ...
it remains unfinished ...
i will change the config some time when i get to it ..
probally use .. 3 mk2's high self inductance high freq ... and dump the kick high freq to
3 shift coils ... wound on this ringggggg
ist
btw this is a self induceing coil .....
@BEP,
As we lower the angle of the control winding we lower winding count. We get that back by using stranded wire.
Quote
Joseph Henry's first discovery was that the power of a magnet could be immensely strengthened by winding it with insulated wire. He was the first person to make a magnet that could lift thirty-five hundred pounds of weight. Joseph Henry showed the difference between "quantity" magnets composed of short lengths of wire connected in parallel and excited by a few large cells; and "intensity" magnets wound with a single long wire and excited by a battery composed of cells in series.
--giantkiller.
Sorry GK.
I've had pretty bad luck with my TPU work but while using stranded wire my luck was about as big as a single piece of fly dung.
Like someone said a bit earlier.... good for capacitance and noise. I think I know all the reasons why it should be the way to go...just hasn't done me any good.
I think @Otto mentioned earlier... use high voltage to drive the controls. Well, the same is true for my tubing experiment. Take the number of turns around the outside of the tubing. Use that number to divide the control coil voltage. That should be your output voltage - if you hit resonance of the tubing.
Then there is that trick... figure your tube resonance by dividing the number of turns by 2 (usually works out around 1.65). Use that number to divide your 'normal' tubing resonance. There is where you should find highest output from the tubing.
The math is a little more complicated if the CC is bifilar series opposing.
Got a bug today - feel like excrement. Might as well share in case I head into that vortex :D
If it doesn't work for ya, sorry. Got some vacation time coming. Maybe I'll finally post something interesting.
@all
I saw someone mentioning hiding the load from the source , I pretty sure that is what Hendershot was doing and well he is using magnet and coil for powering the thing but you remove that you get the Sweet device , those 4 coil connected together in a dual closed loop .
I think Otto is also working on some variant of this ?
I my self make it on the joule thief.
Mark
Please pardon the interruption guys 8)
Hi Paul,
Reading further, Method of gravity distortion and time displacement
Marlin B. Pohlman
http://www.google.com/patents/about?id=oH2bAAAAEBAJ
Quote from: pauldude000 on June 08, 2009, 02:15:49 AM
I have quoted your entire post to keep things clear in my mind as I write this. I seriously suspect he is coming from the aspect of a literal and not figurative mass energy relationship.
In essence, that E really is equal to E. n (sub) q would therefor HAVE to be a frequency, since E=hf. It would then have to be true mass/energy relationship as he is using it in reference to mass interchangeably, without constant reference to virtual mass, and would therefor also have an inherent mass frequency as if E=E then hf=mc(super)2. He is then tying all this into his mental framework."
Right, I agree, and he goes into detail about this, then he turns around and in other parts I mentioned he moves into metaphorical mode with m(sub)q calling it mass instead of mass x frequency.
Quote from: pauldude000 on June 08, 2009, 02:15:49 AM
Do not misunderstand, he is trying to do something I have understood for a long time to be true, yet he makes a separation between the energy of the system and total energy. All energy within the system is accounted for,unless the perception of the system itself is what is inadequate, which I personally think is the case here.
It is a terribly common mistake, which leads to fallacious thinking such as open or closed systems. There is no such critter as an open system, except in the minds of men. THE system is closed (there is only one). We merely tend to ponder utilizing entirely too small of scales of reference.
Paul Andrulis
Could there be some misunderstanding here? THE "system" in this case is "Energy" - the whole and "only one", as you say
(I did not interpret this to mean he made the kind of separation you seem to indicate). It might have been confusing when he considers the system of the "space-time lattice" like a subset which he separates from the total Energy.
[0345] "Energy is not Bound by the Space-Time Lattice."
This is an important distinction and relevant to his concept of quintessence as a frequency. He seems to be saying space-time and matter is not a fundamental system, but Energy is.
[0346] "Thus as the EPR experiments suggest the existence of energy separate from matter and thus separate from the three dimensional space time lattice, it is interesting to find that experiments suggest the existence of free energy in a continuum separate from space time and matter to produce the effects of quantum teleportation."
So I would guess the total Energy includes "hyperdimensions" in a holistic scale of reference and possibilities such as those credited to Tesla in the alleged Philadelphia experiment with the rotating magnetic field, a SUPERTPU, if you will. :D
heloo to ALL
WOOOOWWWW WHAT HAPEND HERE
HEY OTTO THE VERY SMALL TPU OF S.M HAS CORE
THE OPEN TPU HAS CORE
I KNOW AND S.M SAY THE HIS TPU HAS MAKE SPIN WHIT VORTEX AND THAT IS REASON WAY TPU PRODUCED ONLY DC
I HAVE ASK YOU ALL HERE WHAT YOU THING IS THAT 4 RED FAT BIFILAR WIRES IN THE OPEN TPU
AND I SAY THIS 4 COILS RED WIRES IS NOT CONECTK ENYWHERE
WAY
AND WAY HE SAY DC WHIT AC
<5000HZ AND DC VOLATGE
;)
FOR ALL ..... TPU MAST BE PRODUCED MASIVE SPINING ELKTROMAGNET FILD
when he makes that tpu he get heating problem
and s.m say the true is get realy hot
all stuf he tell in the videos istrue some words from masege to mannix and s.m
is true<
move very small magnet whit speed of gun bulyth...........<THIS EXPLANE IS VERY GOOD ..........
ALL TIME IN THE SAME DIRECTION BANG BANG BANG WHIT THAT DIRECKTIONAL
I HOPE YOU WHILL FIND TO MAKE SPINING VORTEX
Quote from: MACEDONIA CD on June 11, 2009, 02:46:50 AM
heloo to ALL
WOOOOWWWW WHAT HAPEND HERE
I'm sure nothing has happened.
Quote
HEY OTTO THE VERY SMALL TPU OF S.M HAS CORE
THE OPEN TPU HAS CORE
Where? All TPUs are handled as if they weigh very little. Do you think a hand operated electric saw will cut through and iron core?
Quote
I KNOW AND S.M SAY THE HIS TPU HAS MAKE SPIN WHIT VORTEX AND THAT IS REASON WAY TPU PRODUCED ONLY DC
Agreed
Quote
I HAVE ASK YOU ALL HERE WHAT YOU THING IS THAT 4 RED FAT BIFILAR WIRES IN THE OPEN TPU
AND I SAY THIS 4 COILS RED WIRES IS NOT CONECTK ENYWHERE
WAY
"WHY?"
There should be no question. They are connected somewhere.
Quote
AND WAY HE SAY DC WHIT AC
<5000HZ AND DC VOLATGE
5000Hz can also mean 5000 RPM so it must be like a generator with a virtual rotor. Albeit, the 'fields' mentioned are not described as magnetic.
Quote
;)
FOR ALL ..... TPU MAST BE PRODUCED MASIVE SPINING ELKTROMAGNET FILD
when he makes that tpu he get heating problem
and s.m say the true is get realy hot
all stuf he tell in the videos istrue some words from masege to mannix and s.m
is true<
move very small magnet whit speed of gun bulyth...........<THIS EXPLANE IS VERY GOOD ..........
ALL TIME IN THE SAME DIRECTION BANG BANG BANG WHIT THAT DIRECKTIONAL
I HOPE YOU WHILL FIND TO MAKE SPINING VORTEX
I hope we do too. I don't think we will if we continue thinking about moving a simple magnet over a piece of wire. That is the weakest way to cause current flow with a magnet. The strongest way is to align that magnetic field radial to the wire. Then rotate it around the wire at very high speeds.
Therefore, the 'core' is a conductor or air AND this conductor is in the center of the TPU. This conductor is created with the operation of the TPU, NOT part of the assembly.
How do you think he could measure current with the clamp meter with no wire in the clamp? Try it. I have. The only way to have a reading is with a current carrying wire inside the clamp or a large change in the local magnetic field strength (also, assumed possible if you had current flowing through air).
I think the TPU is nothing more than a means to emulate the action of magnetic fields around a current carrying wire. When running it causes current to flow through the vertical axis of the TPU.
To tap this potential he adds a Rogowski coil all around the TPU (constant voltage output) and we have confused this coil to be a control coil. The only control coils are the ones on the outside placed in quadrature positions. The FTPU and OTPU use a slightly different method.
With that thought in-mind consider this:
You CAN stack Rogowski coils on a current carrying wire. AND you CAN connect them in any method you choose to increase voltage or current output. AND you can have as many as you want.
Our terminology is wrong. The 'collector' IS the complete TPU. The loop in the middle is just the return wire for the Rogowski coil.
While the above is only my opinion I am quite certain I am correct.
heloo @bep
you thing the red wire is conected enywhere <NO MAN> NOWHERE THE PORPOSE OF THIS IS SO IMPORTANT THIS SIMPLE NOWHERE WIRE CONECTION IS VERY IMPORTANT
FOR 5000HZ IS NOT 5000 RMP
IS LIKE THIS 5000 SPINING IN ONE SECOND IN ONE MINUTE.. 300000 SPINIG THIS IS LIKE YOU HAVE ONE SMALL ELKTROMAGNET HO IS SPINIG WHIT THAT SPEED
DO YOU HAS ASK WAY S.M SAY WHEN SAY <<WHEN I TURN OUT THIS SMALL MAGNET THE VOLTAGE IS DROPING SLOW IS LIKE JET ENGINE TURBINE .. THERE IS SPINIG
FOR THIS TPU WHEN IS UP DOWN IS GIVES LOW OUT
BEACOUSE THAT TPU HAS VERY LOW ELKTROMAGNET FROM SOME SOURCE THER AND THAT FILD IS WEAK AND THE EARTH IS ABLE TO GIVE ATHER ATHER MAGNET FILD TO TPU <LIKE HMM ..
TPU IS SPINIG LET SAY IN RAID SAID WHERE IS PLACED THAT MAGNET AND WHEN TPU IS UP DOWN THE MAGNETPERMANET IS IN ATHERE POSITION OF TPU NOW
AND EARTH IS ALLTIME HIS FORSEOF HIS FILD IS PLACED AND THAT ERTH FILD IS IN THE ATHER DIRECTION OF THE TPU ELKTROMAGNET ROTARY FILD AND THEN IS SLOW DOWN THE ROTATION FILD IN TO THE TPU
ALL THAT IS BEACOUSE THE TPU HAS VERY LOW ELKTROMAGNET FILD INSAID AND IS NO NEED VERY EXTRNAL FILD TO CHANGE THIS THE BIGER TPU IS MORE POWERFULL ELKTROMAGNET FILD AND THIS TPU HAS NO ENY REACTIONS FROM EARTH
S.M SAYS ,<IF I PUT MORE COURENT TO THIS DEVICE I WHILL HAVE MORE
S.M IS MEAN TO MAKE MORE STRONG ELKTROMAGNET FILD TO SPIN AND THEN TPU WHIT NOT HAVE ENY INTERACTION FROM EARTH
I LIKE TO SAY AGAIN BUT I DONT MEAN ENY MORE TO SAY THE SAME THING
THE KEY IS THE RED WIRES FIND AND THING IS NO CONECKTED WHIT NO EXIT NO INPUT WIRES
@marco
way you say <tube man >> i see now you came to end of your ideas IF YOU NEED HELP I WHILL NEVER HELP YOU AND YOU KNOW THAT I KNOW STUFF AND FOR YOU THAT IS VERY SAD BEACOUSE IM PURE MAN FRM PURE CONTRY HO KNOW MORE THEN YOU
YOU MONEY FOR YOU EXPERIMENTS IS LOST AND YOU HAVE NOTHING WHITOUT BRAIN NOTHING
NOW I TELL YOU PLEASE NOT FOR ME BUT FOR PEOPLE HERE BE NICE AND LEARN HOW TO SPEAK WHIT ATHER THEN YOU WHILL RICH IN YOU MIND
@MCD
I have only two disagreements with you last post.
1. If the red wires have no connection then please tell us how the have a purpose. I cannot see any possibilities without connection.
2. Your comments to Marco. If you are called a 'Tube Man' feel honored and thank him for it. I would ;D People who only know SS are like auto drivers who can't fix a flat tire. If things reach an unknown point they must sit and wait for someone to help.
Quote from: BEP on June 11, 2009, 08:31:39 AM
If the red wires have no connection then please tell us how the have a purpose. I cannot see any possibilities without connection.
How about an "Avramenko Plug"?
http://www.alternativkanalen.com/s-wire.htm
MAYBE I WILL MAKE A MOVE .... :D
IF I DO IT WILL HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH MAGNETICS AND ELECTRICS ...
FIRST I WILL EXPLAIN IT ..
TAKE A HAMMER HIT SOMETHING WITH IT ... MAYBE A PEICE OF STEEL IT WILL RINGGGGGGGGGGG
SO B4 IT STOPS RINGGGGINGGGGG DO IT AGIN IN THE CORRECT TIMEING ...
WHAT IS THE RESULT
HIT IT THEN TAP IT .... HUMMMMMM
IS THERE A RESONANT RIZE ..... ;)
IST!
Quote from: BEP on June 11, 2009, 07:22:30 AM
"WHY?"
There should be no question. They are connected somewhere.
5000Hz can also mean 5000 RPM so it must be like a generator with a virtual rotor. Albeit, the 'fields' mentioned are not described as magnetic.
I hope we do too. I don't think we will if we continue thinking about moving a simple magnet over a piece of wire. That is the weakest way to cause current flow with a magnet. The strongest way is to align that magnetic field radial to the wire. Then rotate it around the wire at very high speeds.
Therefore, the 'core' is a conductor or air AND this conductor is in the center of the TPU. This conductor is created with the operation of the TPU, NOT part of the assembly.
How do you think he could measure current with the clamp meter with no wire in the clamp? Try it. I have. The only way to have a reading is with a current carrying wire inside the clamp or a large change in the local magnetic field strength (also, assumed possible if you had current flowing through air).
I think the TPU is nothing more than a means to emulate the action of magnetic fields around a current carrying wire. When running it causes current to flow through the vertical axis of the TPU.
To tap this potential he adds a Rogowski coil all around the TPU (constant voltage output) and we have confused this coil to be a control coil. The only control coils are the ones on the outside placed in quadrature positions. The FTPU and OTPU use a slightly different method.
With that thought in-mind consider this:
You CAN stack Rogowski coils on a current carrying wire. AND you CAN connect them in any method you choose to increase voltage or current output. AND you can have as many as you want.
Our terminology is wrong. The 'collector' IS the complete TPU. The loop in the middle is just the return wire for the Rogowski coil.
While the above is only my opinion I am quite certain I am correct.
Great post, BEP.
Here is a good explanation:
http://www.imeko.org/publications/tc4-2008/IMEKO-TC4-2008-148.pdf
Please note as the earlier pdf link describes somewhat - this coil is inherently less coupled to the core conductor. Also be it understood such a coil is famous for very low output voltage. The solution is found if you understand voltage is not only induced by increasing field from the conductor being monitored but also by increasing rotation and frequency of the monitored current. Also understand the coil is only sensitive to the complete rise and only a small portion of the fall time of the monitored signal.
This alone would provide some conversion of sine to a more DC output.
Then there is the use or non-use of magnets.
Consider the orientation of the magnets on all with magnets except the OTPU along with the orientation of the magnet used to start the early TPUs. Unless he had unusual magnets the poles were pointed to the vertical central axis.
This tells me he was using radial magnetic fields.
Now the only way to cause a radial field with CCs wound as shown is to always have adjacent coils bucking. You then just rotate the bucking point around the circumference in a way that no coil is ever off. There is your virtual rotor. The OTPU uses the same bucking with the red wires except the bucking points include fields concentrated by applied magnets.
The circuitry then would be nothing more than a racetrack circuit.
@BEP
You may well have something here......
The drive circuitry would then be current, not voltage, dependent and could be low voltage high current pulses. 1 joule over 1 second = 1 watt.... the same joule over 1 microsecond = 1 megawatt (Energy/Time=Power). It does not matter whether these pulses have a "gap" in between them. This would explain the "AC or High Frequency characteristics of a DC arc".
If you were to space the pulses properly, you would have 1 megawatt pulses flowing through the field generation coil. If carefully balanced using amperage verses voltage pulses, then the output would drastically increase in the Rogowski coils......
The control coils would then not only be the generation coils, but could be used to monitor the field, and thus control current pulsing.... brilliant!
This may actually work!
Paul Andrulis
Quote from: metatorian on June 10, 2009, 04:40:57 PM
[0345] "Energy is not Bound by the Space-Time Lattice."
This is an important distinction and relevant to his concept of quintessence as a frequency. He seems to be saying space-time and matter is not a fundamental system, but Energy is.
[0346] "Thus as the EPR experiments suggest the existence of energy separate from matter and thus separate from the three dimensional space time lattice, it is interesting to find that experiments suggest the existence of free energy in a continuum separate from space time and matter to produce the effects of quantum teleportation."
So I would guess the total Energy includes "hyperdimensions" in a holistic scale of reference and possibilities such as those credited to Tesla in the alleged Philadelphia experiment with the rotating magnetic field, a SUPERTPU, if you will. :D
I will go out on a limb, and risk looking the nut.
What I am stating, in a nutshell, is that all energy IS the "system". His described space-time matrix is nothing more than a latticework of stored energy potential.
What people refer to with terms such as "zero-point energy" is free energy not coalesced into either the space-time matrix or into much larger "particles", and is somewhat unusable by any other source, as it is a background energy with no available difference to equalize, in other words no "ground".
Particles are made of the same energy, and so are the "quasi-particles" such as photons. This energy however is MORE BASIC in nature than photonic "light", as is currently thought by many.
This concept also explains the emergence directly from space-time of short-lived unstable "virtual" particles as well as spontaneous stable particle formation. It is merely energy release and conversion of already present potential.
All "Energy" is either locked up in and/or proceding from as well as eventually returning to, the "space-time matrix".
What we are describing is in effect the "Aether" of old. No surprise, as it requires little imagination to understand that the current space-time understanding did not ever replace the Aether concept, but merely restated it.
That is why "space-time" has physical properties to begin with. It truly no more explains action at a distance than did the old Aether concept, it merely gives finer detail.
Paul Andrulis
The 60hz system we have today is comprised of Conduction and kinetics. Too bad. The controlling forces of that time thought you have to push electrons. Tesla's solution enabled that for long distances. A real half-assed fix. But he had to pry dollars from the idiots somehow.
But!
If Telsa had his 100% way the we would be kinetically transfering atomic pressure upon a transformer at a distance with no current flow and through resonance. Each transformer would become a baby Wardenclyffe and then shock the aether in resonance with the return magnetic force and not conduction through a conductor.
Oops! You wouldn't need a grid. The wheelworks of nature would be our device.
--giantkiller. Silly humans...
Quote from: BEP on June 11, 2009, 01:14:15 PM
.... The solution is found if you understand voltage is not only induced by increasing field from the conductor being monitored but also by increasing rotation and frequency of the monitored current. Also understand the coil is only sensitive to the complete rise and only a small portion of the fall time of the monitored signal.
....
Then there is the use or non-use of magnets.
Consider the orientation of the magnets on all with magnets except the OTPU along with the orientation of the magnet used to start the early TPUs. Unless he had unusual magnets the poles were pointed to the vertical central axis.
This tells me he was using radial magnetic fields.
Now the only way to cause a radial field with CCs wound as shown is to always have adjacent coils bucking. You then just rotate the bucking point around the circumference in a way that no coil is ever off. There is your virtual rotor. ...
Hallelujah
Remember my posts?
Quote from: tsl on May 20, 2008, 05:15:46 PM
Ok.
Let us assume that the radial field pattern exists inside a conductor(collector)-that would be B1-.Now assume that somehow- see tao's posts- a current I appear in that conductor.That current will create the second B field ,let's say B2.So what now?Will the field pattern begin to rotate?that would be nice.Nope ,it will begin to swirl around .So the B2 will make B1 to swirl. Now what does that swirling create/induce ?That's right.A new current that will amplify the first current.And and and .....
The Rodin coil does not have any coating on the wire, the wire is bare copper. Yet it does not short out... I believe IBM or HP did the research on it. I wouldn't be suprised if this was half the puzzle.
Quote from: tsl on June 11, 2009, 05:32:30 PM
Hallelujah
Remember my posts?
;D
I did more than remember your posts. Unfortunately, just party tricks here so far. The hardest part for me, so far, was letting go with the digital garbage and just let the thing do what it wants at the rate it wants.
So far, I can make a compass wind up and down or make weak but strange sci-fi noises. Out is not greater than in and I certainly can't light a 60W bulb with it :(
hi
i see again nobody like to anderstend me ok NO PROBLEM
IS HARD TO ANDERSTEN BUT I KNOW EASY WAY TO PROVE THIS EXPLANATION ONLY IN SIMPLE WAY <,VIDEO >> OK
BTW there is only one control coil and that's the one on the outside, the ones on the collector are for inducing the effect.The freq on the controll is around 5kHz (square or not).remember: the first ,the second harmonic and the third
(example 20kHz,60kHz,5kHz).
AGAIN THIS FIRST SECOND AND THIRD FREK.... WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY
IS ONLY ONE PURE CLEAN FREK . TO HAVE GOOD SONTROL COIL NO THEN YOU WHILL HAVE GOOD ROTAION
Quote from: MACEDONIA CD on June 11, 2009, 07:40:27 PM
AGAIN THIS FIRST SECOND AND THIRD FREK.... WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY
IS ONLY ONE PURE CLEAN FREK . TO HAVE GOOD SONTROL COIL NO THEN YOU WHILL HAVE GOOD ROTAION
mmm...nope
Quote from: tsl on June 11, 2009, 07:26:24 PM
BTW there is only one control coil and that's the one on the outside, the ones on the collector are for inducing the effect.The freq on the controll is around 5kHz (square or not).remember: the first ,the second harmonic and the third
(example 20kHz,60kHz,5kHz).
by carefully selecting the first freq one can controll
how fast the radial field(bep's bucking point) is moving or rotating
IF YOU HAVE CLEAN ONE FREK. THEN YOU HAVE PROPERLY ELKTROMAGNET MOVING FILD IN ONE DIRECTIONI FYOU ASK HOW TO MUVE IN ONE DIRECTION THAT IS HARD IF YOU HAVE STRONG ELKTROMAGNET FILD THEN YOU HAVE VERY BIG BACK EMF THAT EFECKT WHILL PRODUCED ANTHER DIRECTION OF ELKTROMAGNET FILD MOVING AND THAT IS NO GODD
AND NOW CLEAN AND PURE IS ONLY PROPERLY ELKTROMAGNET FILD TO MOVE IN ONE DIRECTION AND WHIT NO BACK EMF <NO ATHER FREK.
I take it the mentioned harmonic examples are based upon classic radio tech's knowledge... meaning the fundamental is not the first harmonic (as I follow - sorry. been pounding brass for a few years).
BTW: My primary freek floats tightly around 4780 Hz. My construction is certainly a bit off.
----
Interesting thought...crazy or not...
This world looks a bit bass ackwards.
You create the proper moving field around a conductor to create current flow.
You provide the proper (would have been) harmonics to create the fundamental.
Kinda related to electronic transformer theory, isn't it?
@bep
damn, you're so close
;)
Thanks but I do know 'close' is not always a good thing. There is that fine line ...
Spinning compasses and magnets or making noises to irritate dogs is a bit fun but meltdowns are not.
I've got a way to go to get my harmony from the radial and circular correct and stable.
Quote from: tsl on June 11, 2009, 07:26:24 PM
BTW there is only one control coil and that's the one on the outside, the ones on the collector are for inducing the effect.The freq on the controll is around 5kHz (square or not).remember: the first ,the second harmonic and the third
(example 20kHz,60kHz,5kHz).
The outer coil is just for interaction. Unless it is rotating, nothing goes on. This is what the control coils are for.
If the controls are at 5khz, then bitchin' outer coil.
I think I can say I understand where my 4800Hz comes from...
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/Hbase/magnetic/larmor.html
This also means I finally created a magnetic field that truely rotates about its own polar axis.
GAWD I feel so stupid!
--------------
Bitchn' coil size for 5k? Hardly. Resonance isn't always just RC&L.
Quote from: giantkiller on June 11, 2009, 04:02:11 PM
The 60hz system we have today is comprised of Conduction and kinetics. Too bad. The controlling forces of that time thought you have to push electrons. Tesla's solution enabled that for long distances. A real half-assed fix. But he had to pry dollars from the idiots somehow.
But!
If Telsa had his 100% way the we would be kinetically transfering atomic pressure upon a transformer at a distance with no current flow and through resonance. Each transformer would become a baby Wardenclyffe and then shock the aether in resonance with the return magnetic force and not conduction through a conductor.
Oops! You wouldn't need a grid. The wheelworks of nature would be our device.
--giantkiller. Silly hu-mans...
WELL THE TIME HAS COME ....
i dont know how else to shout it .... 8) :D
ist!
BTW I CALLED UPON ALL LIGHT WORKERS AND BEINGS OF LIGHT TO TAKE ACTION ON EARTH ... FROM ALL 12 LOWER DEMENTIONS ... JUST TO REMOVE CONFUSION ... IM TALKING 12 DEMENTIONS ABOVE .. NOT BELOW ;)
OUT OF TIME FOLKS.... ;)
IT HAPPINS NOW~
PEACE AND GET YOUR ROCK ON !
AND I DONT GIVE A DAMM BOUT MY BAD REPUTATION .....
I LOVE ROCK N ROLL ;D
LIKE MY SPELL AT THE END OF THE VIDEO ... ;)
IST!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGcwHEgP_Vw
MAYBE I ENCODED A WAKE UP ALL IN THE VID.....
HUMMMMMM..... ;)
Quote from: pauldude000 on June 11, 2009, 03:31:41 PM
All "Energy" is either locked up in and/or proceding from as well as eventually returning to, the "space-time matrix".
What we are describing is in effect the "Aether" of old. No surprise, as it requires little imagination to understand that the current space-time understanding did not ever replace the Aether concept, but merely restated it.
That is why "space-time" has physical properties to begin with. It truly no more explains action at a distance than did the old Aether concept, it merely gives finer detail.
Paul Andrulis
Hi Paul, Followed what you said up to what we quote here, I suppose you mean three-dimensional space-time does not explain action-at-a-distance,
...Pohlman's hyperdimensional space-time would explain action-at-a-distance, and would also relate to Bohm's Super Quantum Potential. The frequency of quintessence being related to wavelength raises some interesting questions about the topology he describes. Thanks for going out on a limb. ;)
Well, after last night I should correct my statement about bucking turns being the only way I know how to create radial fields. A single layer flat, spiral or pancake will create an even one. One could also call it a voice coil. The big differences are the spiral evenly distributes but has counter direction from the center to the edge comparing top to bottom.
The bucking solenoid types create a field as if a magnet was between them with one pole facing the device center.
How this applies is not clear to me yet unless I sandwich one spiral with two others and use the one as output.
So many variations.....
Create a static charge with all this and pump it round n round?
Not a good idea to take the day off to play on the bench.
I think I'm convinced now this thing has more to do with ESR than ETR, aether or any other magical terms.
ok now i have here small spinig now is time to put red wires to get start my jet engine turbine ;)
Quote from: BEP on June 11, 2009, 08:00:31 PM
You create the proper moving field around a conductor to create current flow.
Is that a kick? ;D
Yes. Around the conductor but in two directions? One problem....
Almost half the time you are making things happen - you must keep it from happening, hence the second but lower major tone on the audio analysis of the 6" one powering a light bulb.
At least I've only had to rewind once, so far.
Quote from: BEP on June 26, 2009, 08:00:22 PM
Is that a kick? ;D
Yes. Around the conductor but in two directions? One problem....
Your experiment with the pepper in water can teach all one needs to know.
Quote from: Grumpy on June 26, 2009, 08:41:20 PM
Your experiment with the pepper in water can teach all one needs to know.
It certainly isn't mine.
I get so tired of claims of the magic of BEMF and quadrature (motor like) firing of separate coils to create rotation. IT IS TOO COMPLICATED and not required.
The thimble experiment is a simple homopolar motor. If you want rotation (real rotation - not jerking from one position to another) all you need are two forces perpendicular to each other. A third will be generated perpendicular to both of the two. Basic classic physics.
It is also how AA Battery+Wire+Magnet homopolar motor works.
The only thing I know to do is go back to work at the bench.
Quote from: BEP on June 26, 2009, 10:40:45 PM
It certainly isn't mine.
I get so tired of claims of the magic of BEMF and quadrature (motor like) firing of separate coils to create rotation. IT IS TOO COMPLICATED and not required.
The thimble experiment is a simple homopolar motor. If you want rotation (real rotation - not jerking from one position to another) all you need are two forces perpendicular to each other. A third will be generated perpendicular to both of the two. Basic classic physics.
It is also how AA Battery+Wire+Magnet homopolar motor works.
The only thing I know to do is go back to work at the bench.
I am tired too.
@BEP
Yes back to my bench after this stint with Mylow. I have a nice wheel but it aint turn'in. Should write a song about it. lol
Well I have been back at my TPU in the last few days.
Here is a challenge for the EE guys that I think if solved will lead to a TPU.
OK.
In my left hand I have a continuous supply of 1 volt. In my right hand I have a container with let's say 30 volts already accumulated. Now put the 1 volt into the 30 volt container to make 31 volts, then 32 volts, then 33 volts, etc. If you can work out a SIMPLE way of doing this a TPU will be possible.
It all has to do with working with gain and that means working with a proper and most likely novel storage method or maybe a novel circuit control or a novel way of using present components. So what can you add small energy into and have it grow with gain one volt (or a few volts) at a time???????
Well, in the FTPU the only thing I can think of is a core. The center toroid core has to be the center of gain. There is no other way I can think of. A capacitor will not work to increase voltage 1 volt at a time.
Is there another way?
While I was writing this I got to thinking about why we call a collection of capacitors, a "capacitor bank". This is a tremendous misnomer indeed. In a real bank, you can add any amount you want and it will add to the current balance. Add 100$ to a balance of 200$ and you have 300$. But in a capacitor, you cannot do this. If the balance was 200$, nothing less then 201$ will increase the balance but not to 401$ but only to 201$. That is a real bad bank. Well good for the bankers. lol
OK back to the FTPU which is still my target device to better understand the TPUs. I can tell you from my testing that the coupling action between the top and bottom outer coils and the top and bottom outer rings are very interesting.
The outer coils wound 180 degrees each at 22 turns (22 x 4 = 44 total) all in the same direction then connecting them in series, top half, then bottom half then top half then bottom half receive a pulse from my HP pulse generator. The outer rings are also wound the same direction (3 turns each of 12 awg copper wire) and are connected in series top to bottom. The two open leads are connected to a dioded capacitor to hold the highest voltage produced. Remember a capacitor is not a real bank.
The coupling action between these is incredibly almost 1 to 1 when you look at a scope with A at the feed pulse and B at the output seen before the capacitor bank. With this as I increase the pulsing voltage I can get a maximum of 60 volts in the capacitor and nothing more. So this is holding very well with the action of the FTPU demo. lol
The only thing left is to integrate the center toroid and see how to make this grow with gain on its own with 1 volt instead of me bringing up the voltage on my pulse generator. If this is done, then I have made an FTPU. lol
At this stage I am only looking at voltage since in the FTPU demo SM did not show any amperage ability. The amperage would then be worked into the design for the other models. Hmmmmmmmm.
I am putting a picture of the test TPU below. The outer rings are shown in two mobius but my present test was with the outer rings in series with two open ends. My next test will be with both rings in series/mobius since maybe this will help make it work with gain.
Hello all,
@wattsup
how about to reduce the red windings to 22 turns for each ring?
Otto
@otto
According to my observations of the FTPU, the number of turns is about 22 per 180 degrees over the 6 inch ring.
Maybe for the 4 inch TPU a total 22 turns would be a good test but in the 4 inch, I am almost certain that each of the two rings are composed of many rings in parallel in order to increase the amperage and light that bulb.
I think we all should have started with the FTPU coils and rings since a long time ago as we would have had more data and guys could have tried all the variations possible. I am still very amazed at the coupling ability between the coil and rings. I am also surprised to see this activity is happenning at the 5khz (good) range, the 200khz (good) range and also the 1.2mhz (best) or thereabouts. I would like one day to buy a new scope with the more modern and complete readouts instead of figuring out the uS, nS, mS settings on my current scope. lol
Last night I tried with rings in series mobius with outputs taken at two inverse points. The results were not good with more input then output. But there are many variations of coil connections to test yet.
Tonight I will try with a center toroid with each of the two toroid coils going to each of the rings in series. I think that if each ring was energized separately then go through half of the center toroid, both rings will have a possible increase in output because they can build up some mutual gain in the toroid core.
Each set-up takes time to test because you have to try with so many frequencies slowly, then changing the pulse width and starting over the range again, etc. I am lucky to have my HP pulser since this has saved me so much time.
So remember when SM put his ammeter on the LTPU, it was highest at the two center toroids and lowest at the output coils. I am sure now the output is going through the toroids but not as a regulating choke but simply as a point where you can have gain.
Also, remember the MTPU has only one center toroid. This is because the outer core only had two rings, just like the FTPU. The MTPU was producing 400 something volts. But I think in the LTPU having two center toroids, the outer core has 4 rings, 2 per toroid, all run in series. Like having two MTPU's to equal one LTPU.
SM just made different variations of the FTPU so if we can make an FTPU, we should be able to then make the bigger ones.
Well, I am happy to be back on the TPU's after spending the last few months in this magnetic wheel thingy. From now on, whatever I decide to build, I will not stop the TPU.
I know you are working on this in a different angle but hopefully, whatever I learn and post will help you also.
Something else just hit me about the mobius loop. Remember the ECD circuit diagram where the phase outputs where taken right off the mobius. Well I was thinking about this for the FTPU and was asking, how can I make a mobius loop turn and turn and then put two outputs off the ring. Well the answer is you do not touch the mobius. If you pass the mobius in series through one half of the center toroid, then the other half of the toroid is your output without touching the mobius loop at all. I will try this also tonight. lol
Keep well and keep up the good work.
Hello all,
@wattsup
Im using 22 turns in my 15" TPU. They are very good and make sence.
Each of the two rings ARE composed of many rings in paralel - lamp wire is to use - but DONT so much increase the amperage.
So, in short, use for the collectors AND controls a lamp wire.
Try various connections and tell us if you see something weird. Of course, the collector and control connected in series.
Maybe its better to build a 15" ring so you have not to worry about your fingers.
I hope youre pulsating this setup with a high voltage of at least 10kV!
Otto
Hi all,
I have been away for awhile and will answer emails in a few days
The FTPU...The most inspiring of all , and the most info of all
Here is how I believe this little unit might run
Perhaps we can forget 3 frequencies as the source drive because there is clearly 1 torriod/mag amp in the centre. In fact I would just forget lots of things except the video in this case.
So there must be 2 race tracks top and bottom
"there is a frequency pattern setup in here" I like that quote and he had not referenced in any correspondence.
The center oscillator would be wired to create rotation which probably happens by driving top and bottom opposites on the outer rim running in separate directions and wired to the center unit in such a way that with the small power of the oscillator running nothing much happens. A null balance would have to be achieved first.
When a magnet biases the blocking oscillator an imbalance occurs on the center unit which allows more effort in one direction than the other. Hopefully a directional spin would develop
some collector energy is fed back to the toroid so that acceleration can continue if the Imbalance is correct
Further enhanced by each outer rim control section containing within it the tuning cap for the next section .
This is what I see the aluminum foil/faraday shield quadrants may be about.
Think about 2 sets of 4 hendershot coils stacked in series around the rims.
The joule thief circuits are a good start reference but unless the speed of the flow can be increased by a larger diameter no rotational inertia will be allowed to develop
None of this could work unless the exciter torroid is mounted central so that the wire lengths will be the same for all "cylinders"
Think of the center toroid as the piston and the outer ring as the fly wheel but there are two flywheels running in different directions.
perhaps such a device would spin fast enough to interact with the static magnetic field of the earth.
Lots of questions , mainly how "wire is very important"
I hope that this is of assistance for experiments
Lindsay
Just to jump in here quickly while Mannix is around.
A question for Mannix. I'm rather curious as to why in all your communications with SM, he never gave any specifics about the actual construction of his TPU. Did you ever ask him for specific details?
It seems odd that he would communicate anything at all if he only intended to leave us with clues, unless the sole purpose of those clues were to mislead.
Please don't immediately assume me to be a nay-sayer as this would be a wrong assumption. My concern is simply that we may have been dealt a bum hand here, and given how little we really know about the TPU construction and how little progress has been made, I believe any scepticism to be fully justified. Would you not agree?
Why would SM only provide half the story? If he were going to fully disclose the details of the invention he would have done so. There simply would be no logic to only spilling half the beans, unless this was deliberate misinfo. Would you not agree?
As far as I am aware, the only reference to the construction of an SM TPU comes from your communications with SM. Could it be that all this time you and the forum have been led on a merry dance?
Quote from: Farrah Day on July 03, 2009, 06:14:09 AM
Just to jump in here quickly while Mannix is around.
A question for Mannix. I'm rather curious as to why in all your communications with SM, he never gave any specifics about the actual construction of his TPU. Did you ever ask him for specific details?
It seems odd that he would communicate anything at all if he only intended to leave us with clues, unless the sole purpose of those clues were to mislead.
Please don't immediately assume me to be a nay-sayer as this would be a wrong assumption. My concern is simply that we may have been dealt a bum hand here, and given how little we really know about the TPU construction and how little progress has been made, I believe any scepticism to be fully justified. Would you not agree?
Why would SM only provide half the story? If he were going to fully disclose the details of the invention he would have done so. There simply would be no logic to only spilling half the beans, unless this was deliberate misinfo. Would you not agree?
As far as I am aware, the only reference to the construction of an SM TPU comes from your communications with SM. Could it be that all this time you and the forum have been led on a merry dance?
What you suggest is possible. But as far as the first unit goes we must rely on the video only and that would not seem to not use 3 frequencies.
He also said that heat was a by product of operation yet in the video he says the more power , the more heat.
There surely are inconsistencies, but as to the motive I would not try and guess ..but have a go by all means if it is helpful for you.
Until more specifics are available i would suggest this first unit and the video has a lot of leads that may LATER put the other things in context.
I hope that will be the case, but either way we will know eventually as long as we keep trying and sharing our resullt if and when we can get this thing spinning at least.
meantime I may learn to dance better
Lindsay
@otto
I will look into it. Thanks. I have been pulsing only 3 - 10 volts dc trying to keep that pulsing in the realistic battery power that would be in an FTPU or OTPU or 6TPU. I don't know about the 10k volts. Where do you get such a power supply. From a neon ballast or what? I have a small device that puts out 100k volts but it only produced inter winding sparks inside some big toroidal transformers I used many many months ago. lol
@mannix
Thanks for your post. Yep I will consider what you have said. There is some good logic there. Please tell me what your thoughts are about the following.
@all
Here's my gyro rant entitled Gyro-Shmyro. I prepared this post during my work day yesterday to not get held up on the bench work when at home. I just finished polishing it up. (sparkle)
I really don't understand why guys are so heaped up on this gyro business. We have wasted months and months on that. So many many angles. They were all very educational in the general sense so there is no total loss since learning is always a plus.
Tell me....... if someone invents a TPU THAT WORKS, will it be less a TPU if there is no Gyro Effect? lol
The TPU was NOT built in a factory assembly line with precision machines doing the windings, placing the right anti stress spacers, no varnish, only a taped up bunch of wires that produced some good output and amperage. So yes, the whole device was under a stress level (like any transformer) but who cares. This has very little to do with the operation of the device and can supply no helpful clues as to how it is built besides saying and not proving this gyro motion.
Then some guys are thinking, well if I can make a device that can gyro via switched coils, then I have made a TPU. Nothing can be further from the truth. The TPU will be solved when we look elsewhere. lol
Sorry for being so abrupt but this gyro thing does not deserve any time and consideration and will definitely not help in making a TPU. But you need to think a few steps further then what is in front of you.
The other guy in the 6TPU video is your regular Mr. You or Me. SM put the 6TPU in his hands and the guy gave his quick description of what the hell was in his hands. Then SM took it back and said Gyro Shmyro.
Funny the guy never said "Wow it's hot, or, wow it's cold, or WOW IT'S GYRATING". If it was hot that would be the first thing anyone would say, but only if it was hot. SO IT WAS NOT HOT at the time the guy had it in his hands. Hey that's a good clue. But it was not cold either and it did not have any real gyrating effect otherwise the guy would have said "Wow, feels like it's wobbling or spinning", or something like that.
Now what did this Mr. You or Me say?
"Buzzing, Vibration, Slight Noise". END OF STORY.
We should repeat the above line 100 times. That should get our brains reprogrammed to search in the right direction.
SM surely did not want him to say this because he took the unit back and insisted as if to say "Hey you shmuck - it's vibration and slight gyroscopic effect - get it - nudge nudge". But what Mr. You and Me said means exactly what he said and the origin of such buzzing, vibration and slight noise can come from many of the stuff we have tried thus far. This sounds very close to what you expect from a magnet quenched reed contact. Also, under such use, based on my own experiments with reed switches and the Tesla Ozone Patent, such a reed contact would not last more then 20 minutes. Wow not last longer then 20 minutes. Now where did I hear that number before????????? This could infer that the heat issue needing further work is a decoy. What really needed some work was how to get rid of the reed contact or any other oscillating component that would be the one that takes the brunt of any such device. This is what needed fixing but obviously SM could never have said this to his potential investors. Solving a mysterious, unidentifiable heat problem would be the ideal thing to say needed fixing.
How much noise will an AC motor generator make to produce 1000 watts. So why can't the TPU make some noise also. Because SM was not showing a turning AC generator that one would expect noise from and no one would give such a noise a second thought. He was showing a still standing TPU and therefore any noise would give away tooooooooooo muuuuuch of the device functtttttttttttttttttion. Any sounds, clicking, tapping, wizzing, screeching and more, would all give away some of the TPU internal operation and SM would not tolerate this type of give away in order to protect his device from premature disclosure, that is to say, do all that is humanly possible to not divulge anything about the device before all the bucks are on the table.
That noise was no longer heard in the MTPU and LTPU because he has all that room below the black box (two layers of wood board) to embed, hence help to sound proof any noise making components below the center floor (where he could have also hidden his start-up batteries - lol). Hence most switching components will also create a "Buzzing, Vibration, Slight Noise". Take any toroidal transformer and pulse it
Now think about this. How in the LTPU can there be any vibrating in the outer core, to cause a drag effect on the base of the LTPU when guys were sliding the LTPU forwards and backwards? That core was made with a soft material that would have absorbed any such vibration or gyro effect. The only way you could expect the vibration to cause a movement resistance is if the vibration originated directly in the wooden base and by vibrating the wooden base, naturally a vibration would be felt in the outer core. What a great deception. Put your oscillator in the base, cause a vibration (which is perfectly normal) then pin it on a mysterious gyro effect of the coils. Then guys will be looking for gyro effects until cows can fly.
Put it this way..........
If you were SM and you made this TPU device that you are showing to a few Mr. BigGreens for some real serious cash, but you did not want them or their hired Mr. BigBrains to know how the thing was working, the last thing you would want is to have the device make noise. So there is a lot of cover up. In SMs thinking, if you made an apple, then you should disguise it as a walnut. As long as the taste is great, no one will know how to copy it and you are still in business. Guys will be working to make walnuts while your apple is safe and sound. What I am saying is SM gave us a load of bad info and some good info without him realizing it. SM was a master in OU device disguise so we have to be very vigilant and work the logic base.
So based on this, we should consider that all the videos shown with witnesses and investors should be considered as designed to be highly deceptive, overblown, over complicated and full of disinformation so as not to give away concrete direction. At the stage SM was at during that time, some good cash was coming in from investors, plus he had a requirement for more cash outlays to continue further development, HE HAD TO SHOW THESE GUYS SOME advancement, but everything was based on NOT LETTING ANYONE KNOW WHY AND HOW A TPU WORKED. So we have to consider his videos for the operational aspect and NOT even consider the visual of the device to be 100 true, but, to a high degree very deceptive.
Are the rings real? Are those disks in the OTPU real? Is the outer core of the LTPU real? This is the real work of peeling away the make-up to see the true device underneath.
Did anyone every make an audio spectrum analysis of the FTPU and OTPU videos? Are there any predominant frequencies that can be heard? Mostly background stuff that could not be humanly heard under his continuous talking. If there are any weird frequencies, maybe we can know the frequency and intervals to understand if such can be replicated with known components. That would be a good angle to attack this problem while others work out the actual tpu function end.
Anyways, that's the end of my gyro rant. Hope your heads are not spinning in a gryo motion otherwise I may consider patenting this post.
Quote from: wattsup on July 03, 2009, 08:58:53 AM
Did anyone every make an audio spectrum analysis of the FTPU and OTPU videos? Are there any predominant frequencies that can be heard? Mostly background stuff that could not be humanly heard under his continuous talking. If there are any weird frequencies, maybe we can know the frequency and intervals to understand if such can be replicated with known components.
Yes i did make some analysis :)
In fact they are on the cover of the TPU compilation Vol.3 , but that one never made it to the internet....
Marco.
Here i found some more :)
This is actually the start up sequence from the smalles one :)
Marco.
Hi
Has anyone ever tried making a Saturable Blocking Oscillator Monostable.
They are great ;D
1 transistor and can produce pulses over 1000 volts, although i still have a long way yet to get to this.
Peter
@marco
Thanks for these. They look similar to the ones made by @EM when discussing the high voltage lines. Can you explain how to read these. Is this just a full spectrum of one instance. I guess time is not factored in the graph since to do that you would have to choose only one frequency and look at it over the time of the video. Like let's say we took the 5340 frequency. Can we see this over time or see a full spectrum like just before he put the magnet to the FTPU or OTPU, then another after the magnet is on. Or before and after he pushes the on/off button on the OTPU. Maybe also before and after a load was put on the OTPU. Can you see this live or in real time.
@Peterae
Very interesting and looks very close to the TPU center toroid. Please let us know your results. I have found a patent on this and put the pdf file here:
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Inventors/P-G-Bartlett/
@ Farrah Day
A question for Mannix. I'm rather curious as to why in all your communications with SM, he never gave any specifics about the actual construction of his TPU. Did you ever ask him for specific details?
It seems odd that he would communicate anything at all if he only intended to leave us with clues, unless the sole purpose of those clues were to mislead.
============================================================
Attached is a FILE of a COLLECTION of POSTS that I found over time.
It is in MS WORD format, but maybe someone can CONVERT the file over to PDF?
:)
.
Quote from: FatBird on July 04, 2009, 10:20:23 PM
@ Farrah Day
A question for Mannix. I'm rather curious as to why in all your communications with SM, he never gave any specifics about the actual construction of his TPU. Did you ever ask him for specific details?
It seems odd that he would communicate anything at all if he only intended to leave us with clues, unless the sole purpose of those clues were to mislead.
============================================================
Attached is a FILE of a COLLECTION of POSTS that I found over time.
It is in MS WORD format, but maybe someone can CONVERT the file over to PDF?
:)
.
Steven always said that he was not able or willing to give specifics and would only speak in general terms. That was always clear from the get go
His info was designed to give a better understanding of the tpu and was never as a will to have replication. But perhaps rediscovery.He thought it might help people get on the right track and carry out experiments with tubes ...he was wrong for most part of that. As was I.
Perhaps some see this as misleading, it is certainly frustrating at times but I am grateful for the info even if I dont have the mental capacity and experience to put it all together yet.
Use what you can discard what you cant . I believe a spinning magnetic top /scorth field generator is the basis of this thing.
The early videos were never designed to fool investors and were never designed to be all over the net so use the videos as best you can. Particularly the first one.
There is a gyro effect!(fact) I dont know if there has to be but it seems likely.
Watts up, Great efforts ! some of the ftpu photos are still from the old video , it might be good to delete them and put up the high res versions..or a list of links and descriptions.
That blocker patent seems on the right track for this as well. the JT guys should like it also.
Perhaps just a little magnetic bias will induce rotation in the outer coils if the frequency and balance is just right?
I hope this becomes of use to you efforts
Lindsay
QuoteHis info was designed to give a better understanding of the tpu and was never as a will to have replication. But perhaps rediscovery.He thought it might help people get on the right track and carry out experiments with tubes ...he was wrong for most part of that. As was I.
Perhaps some see this as misleading, it is certainly frustrating at times but I am grateful for the info even if I dont have the mental capacity and experience to put it all together yet.
Mannix, we obviously see things in quite a different light - you seem to be looking at the world through rose-tinted spectacles. It makes no logical sense to believe he was ever trying to give us a better understanding of his TPU. Why would he try to give us a better understanding if he was so against it being truly replicated... or what..? Rediscovered??
You seem to be quite happy with the snippets of info - or misinfo, as the case may be - that he, (supposedly SM), has provided.
However, if I for one moment thought he was on-the-level, I would find it quite insulting that he would resort to this kind of immature teasing and time-wasting. Hence my belief that you have all been given a few parts of a puzzle that he knew would never actually piece together.
I just feel sorry for the people that have spent long months, if not years, attempting to replicate something from a few crumbs of info designed solely to deceive.
From all this, I'm led to believe that Jack Duban's attack on SM's character is fully justified.
Thanks for the file Fatbird.
Whatever works for you ...so how does a tpu work then?
Be sure you exclude anything from Steven
I was only trying to help, sorry you were not helped
I will keep silent for some time . Perhaps that will help.
May your dark glasses be usefull to you
addios..........
Mannix
It is nothing personal, so don't be quiet on my account, I'm outta here now anyway.
Just consider that you may well be the unwitting servant of a man whose sole purpose of communicating with you was to provide misinfo and deflect people from the real truth behind his TPU.
Farrah
Farrah Day,in the mannix files theres a mention by SM,I believe
of a video
that shows a compass spining.
People here refer to this because he says that the compass
starts spining faster and faster as proof
that a rotating magnetic field
is the source of the operation of the tpu.
The problem is no video has ever been show, it
exists only in SMs imagination.Since I have been here there have been
no postings of a SM video showing a spining compass.
Some of you are building TPUs with concentric (circular) wires. I do NOT see that in any of SM's TPUs.
PLUS, I do NOT see any Double Decker, NOR Triple Decker TPUs in SM's videos.
On the 8 Inch model, the Plastic Material he wound the coils on is from an OLD Speaker Enclosure. It looks like he just cut off a couple of the circles to wind the 4 Coils on.
Here is an EXTREMELY VALUABLE TIP on how to COPY ANYTHING on the screen:
1. Hit your Keyboard Print Screen Button.
2. Inside your favorite Graphics Package, Click on PASTE (sometimes under Edit).
3. Crop or Mask the image.
4. Size the image Larger or Smaller according to your needs.
5. Save the Image to your Hard Drive.
.
well the nice thing about teslas lil trick ...
is .. it is verry versitile ...
;D
can you explaine a bit more detail what your last pictures are ...
the things im building in the last week or so are cold electric rectified to dc pumps with a gate keeper ...
nothing more nothing less
ist..
@Mannix
I agree about the FTPU as being original and most likely non-decoyed simply because you can realize in his video that he took extreme care not to clearly show the circuit side of the device, always making sure it was in the back of the perspective.
Anyways, it is also clear now that you did your best to keep the information coming from SM while the original threads were progressing and for this we have to tip our hats to you. You played an important role with the right level of moderation to put whatever we have on the table.
@Fatbird
I put a pdf format of your doc here;
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Steven%20Mark/documents/
Also, I don't think SM used those grills for the OTPU simply because the OTPU grill or plate had four inward sections and the grill only has two or three. I had asked Jack Durban, (who is supposed to still have these grills in his garage that he took for money owed to him) to find his grills and take photos from the top to see how the grill is really made, but he never responded. By the way, he also has a beta copy of the videos but he never found it in all the boxes in his garage. I sent him another e-mail recently but no response. We will probably never hear from him again.
@marco
If you ever had some spare time to do some more audio spectrum analysis, it would be very interesting to see the differences in those frequencies before and after some key moments as I had described in my previous post.
Hi wattsup
yes you can have some more details of tests.
I just realized that picture wasnt my Saturable version but just a Blocking monstable, heres the first test results i had before i starting optimizing the pulse width.
1 transistor, 3 resistors and 2 caps are used in this simple design.
I used 100v for the supply.
As you can see i had pulses over a 1000v in amplitude.
Peter
Peterae:
Here is the exact example of a question I have been trying to find an answer for. In the photo just after the hv spike, there is an L/C ring down. Could you hazzard a guess as to the frequency of it? I know there is a way to figure this for any l/c but I have not found the formula yet and so far, no one can answer this.. Thanks much
thaelin
ill tell ya ... lol
but i think marco has done a great job of it !
those are the harmonics of the earth .....
tune in to resonance ... hummmmmm look at those waves as where the plannets ride ... in relation to the sun and if the sun is spinning 2 dirrections it will produce standing waves...
kinda like the earth and your charaks ... ;D
o yes this does get WILD ... the univirse sure is something ...... :)
william!
im on that HD FLAT... next level VISUAL!
and your still trying to figure out a SIMPLE TPU!! yikes!!
Quote from: Thaelin on July 05, 2009, 08:57:54 PM
Peterae:
Here is the exact example of a question I have been trying to find an answer for. In the photo just after the hv spike, there is an L/C ring down. Could you hazzard a guess as to the frequency of it? I know there is a way to figure this for any l/c but I have not found the formula yet and so far, no one can answer this.. Thanks much
thaelin
Hi Thaelin
Here's some data if that helps
Drive Voltage Pulse Voltage Ringing Period Ringing Freq Supply Current
110V 992V 2.8uS 357.1Khz 3mA
90V 912V 2.9uS 344.8Khz 3mA
70V 776V 3.0uS 333.0Khz 2mA
50V 584V 3.1uS 322.6Khz 2mA
30V 392V 3.4uS 294.1Khz 1mA
** not checked accuracy of supply current readings
All measurements taken at 5kHZ drive Pulse Freq.
Peter
Spinning Compass
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQ7Ax_b6S4k&feature=channel_page
if there was little transformer in it
and mmmhhh two magnified working together? like magnetic gear?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBVzHKMDCoA&feature=channel_page
Degaussing Coils
looks cool
bye
oops, I posted in the wrong thread. ;) Was supposed to go in the Ainslie thread.
Quote from: zapnic on July 07, 2009, 02:32:49 AM
Spinning Compass
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQ7Ax_b6S4k&feature=channel_page
if there was little transformer in it
and mmmhhh two magnified working together? like magnetic gear?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBVzHKMDCoA&feature=channel_page
Degaussing Coils
looks cool
bye
the first video was ok but ... i think some round here are getting much better results with much simplflied devices ... ;D
nice videos ...
but .. i like what im playing with as it uses wayyyyyyyyy less power to achieve results ...
and my results are only limited by how many times i kick it in the ass and speed it up ...
and i dont need a magic magnet ....
hummmmmm
ist!
Pete:
Thanks for the come back. Sadly, that isn't of much help. I will have to figure a test circuit and do a one shot to see the time. Then change the values and see the difference. My scope cant sample and hold or dump to the computer so I have to fudge it.
thay
Quote from: BEP on June 12, 2009, 07:52:14 AM
I think I can say I understand where my 4800Hz comes from...
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/Hbase/magnetic/larmor.html
This also means I finally created a magnetic field that truely rotates about its own polar axis.
GAWD I feel so stupid!
--------------
Bitchn' coil size for 5k? Hardly. Resonance isn't always just RC&L.
:)
Quote from: MACEDONIA CD on June 11, 2009, 08:00:15 PM
IF YOU HAVE CLEAN ONE FREK. THEN YOU HAVE PROPERLY ELKTROMAGNET MOVING FILD IN ONE DIRECTIONI FYOU ASK HOW TO MUVE IN ONE DIRECTION THAT IS HARD IF YOU HAVE STRONG ELKTROMAGNET FILD THEN YOU HAVE VERY BIG BACK EMF THAT EFECKT WHILL PRODUCED ANTHER DIRECTION OF ELKTROMAGNET FILD MOVING AND THAT IS NO GODD
AND NOW CLEAN AND PURE IS ONLY PROPERLY ELKTROMAGNET FILD TO MOVE IN ONE DIRECTION AND WHIT NO BACK EMF <NO ATHER FREK.
Mace......
Drop the fake accent, it drives me batty.
You have no consistency in your chosen misspellings. Your "bad English", is bad for the wrong reasons and in the wrong manner....
You can spell "properly, produced, direction, moving" etc...., but you seemingly cannot spell "will, with, effect, and move", which are easier to spell and pronounce in English.
Every post of yours has been this way, demonstrating that you are full of BS.
If you truly had a problem with English, you would easily spell the simple words, and horribly misspell the complex words. You would also spell properly the words you were supposedly most familiar with, namely those used specifically for your hobby, namely words such as "electromagnetic", "frequency", and "field", since all of your reading over these subjects would naturally re-enforce your spelling of these particular words.
As a potential ineffectual fraud, you take the cake, and have always been my first choice for SM masquerading as a moron. Foreign my butt.
hey paul ...
mac is mac ... lol i have spoke to mac .. and his english is his english ...
i have knowen mac some years ... i dont think mac is sm ... he is just another of us that can not spell well if you ever spoke to mac you would know ...
just another one that is no fool .... and DID LOTS OF WORK FOR HIMSELF AS PER HIS DESIRES ...
but mac choose to share ... so i wouldnt jump on mac ... BECAUSE YOUR PUTTING YOUR FOOT IN YOUR MOUTH ... ;)
william
Quote from: Grumpy on June 12, 2009, 12:32:23 AM
The outer coil is just for interaction. Unless it is rotating, nothing goes on. This is what the control coils are for.
If the controls are at 5khz, then bitchin' outer coil.
Quote from: BEP on June 12, 2009, 07:52:14 AM
I think I can say I understand where my 4800Hz comes from...
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/Hbase/magnetic/larmor.html
This also means I finally created a magnetic field that truely rotates about its own polar axis.
GAWD I feel so stupid!
--------------
Bitchn' coil size for 5k? Hardly. Resonance isn't always just RC&L.
I was not referring to the size of the coil or it's resonance freq.
Interaction of fields, remember?
Quote from: Grumpy on July 09, 2009, 09:27:30 AM
I was not referring to the size of the coil or it's resonance freq.
Interaction of fields, remember?
Sorry,
Most do when they speak of resonance. I should know you know better.
Interaction of the fields? Got it. Got more than I expected. Now, it must be made organized, orderly, and useful.
Sometimes it is in 'lock-step'. Most times it burps and blows something.
I'm in mandatory travel mode right now. Nothing but trying to make good sense of it all during free time. There won't be much bench work from me for a while :(
hi to all
i see here the people is mad and im traing to writing ok in english <<is not meaning thta if i writing bad that i dont know to speak
i like to ask some simple for tpu of s.m ho bealeavet that the s.m tpu makes vortex compresed rotaTion elktromagnet fild
that is MAIN AND TRUE WORKING PROCESS AND I THING THE SOME IMAGEN VIDEO CLIP OF S.M WHIT SOME COMPASS WHEN IS MAKES ROTATION IS <<TRUE >
AND I THING WHIT THIS VIDEO HE WHILL SHOW MORE DETALESS ,,,,BUT VIDEO IS NOT SHOW HERE BEACOUSE .....
I JUST LIKE TO ASK <,MANNIX WAY S.M IS NOT PUT THE SUPER LOW RESIST WIRES AND COILS TO NOT HAVE HOT AND BURN THE TPU
WHIT THAT S.M OR .. WHILL MAKE TO WORK WHITOUT PROBLEMS
AND I THING THAT S.M GENERATOR IS SIMPLE AND IS GREATED SOLUTION FOR ELKTRICYTY
You don't need a rotating magnetic field to make a compass turn. lol
All you need is alternating fields that hit the compass at the right timing.
Quote from: MACEDONIA CD on July 09, 2009, 05:38:42 PM
hi to all
i see here the people is mad and im traing to writing ok in english <<is not meaning thta if i writing bad that i dont know to speak
i like to ask some simple for tpu of s.m ho bealeavet that the s.m tpu makes vortex compresed rotaTion elktromagnet fild
that is MAIN AND TRUE WORKING PROCESS AND I THING THE SOME IMAGEN VIDEO CLIP OF S.M WHIT SOME COMPASS WHEN IS MAKES ROTATION IS <<TRUE >
AND I THING WHIT THIS VIDEO HE WHILL SHOW MORE DETALESS ,,,,BUT VIDEO IS NOT SHOW HERE BEACOUSE .....
I JUST LIKE TO ASK <,MANNIX WAY S.M IS NOT PUT THE SUPER LOW RESIST WIRES AND COILS TO NOT HAVE HOT AND BURN THE TPU
WHIT THAT S.M OR .. WHILL MAKE TO WORK WHITOUT PROBLEMS
AND I THING THAT S.M GENERATOR IS SIMPLE AND IS GREATED SOLUTION FOR ELKTRICYTY
@Macedonia CD
I agree with everything you say in this post.
Anger is only another obstacle to overcome :)
Your English is good enough. I don't think I will try to use your language :D Of course, you do know it is not common for people in the U.S. to speak more than one language.
The vortex? I am certain of this.
I have never seen the video of the rotating compass either. This is simple to do.
I don't know about the low resistance wires. Maybe @Mannix can answer that one.
I must agree on the simplicity of a TPU. It is surely simple in construction and design but I think all it may do is very complex.
@BEP
IS NOT COMPLEX YES IF YOU LIKE TO SEE COMPASS I WHILL TRAED TO BAY COMPASS AND MAKE VIDEO
FOR THE VORTEX IS THE POINT YOU LOK THE VIDEO AND SEE AND THING WHAT HE THING LIKE <<JET ENGINE TURBINE IS TAKE TIME TO SLOW DOWN
IS LIKE YOU HAVE ROTOR INVISIBLE THERE
IS HAS BEANG CREATED THE ROTOR OF THAT COMPRESS FILD <INVISIBLE FEILD
BUT FOR THE WIRES THIS IS ONE OF THE SOLUTION TO MAKE NO HETING AND MELTING COILS
Quote from: MACEDONIA CD on July 09, 2009, 07:13:23 PM
@BEP
IS NOT COMPLEX YES IF YOU LIKE TO SEE COMPASS I WHILL TRAED TO BAY COMPASS AND MAKE VIDEO
FOR THE VORTEX IS THE POINT YOU LOK THE VIDEO AND SEE AND THING WHAT HE THING LIKE <<JET ENGINE TURBINE IS TAKE TIME TO SLOW DOWN
IS LIKE YOU HAVE ROTOR INVISIBLE THERE
IS HAS BEANG CREATED THE ROTOR OF THAT COMPRESS FILD <INVISIBLE FEILD
BUT FOR THE WIRES THIS IS ONE OF THE SOLUTION TO MAKE NO HETING AND MELTING COILS
I should really apologize Mace, I am sorry. I am not mad at you, but am frustrated with the transparent games being played by SM.
Many here probably do not realize they have in all actuality been talking to him either directly or through proxy. (I am not talking about Mannix. SM has been playing him as well, which irritates me as I like Mannix.)
OU user XXX should have been a serious clue to all here, as it is Steven's boyfriend MM..
MM - 09/16/99 00:54:58
My Email:XXX
http://www.geocities.com/heartland/lake/8491/geobook.html (http://www.geocities.com/heartland/lake/8491/geobook.html) towards the very bottom.
I made the statement you were my first choice for SM to be pretending to be illiterate... that was wrong, and I spoke stupidly out of irritation. Not an excuse for what I said. Again I am sorry.
Paul Andrulis
Well Paul,
If you had done some research yourself you would have come to the same conclusion as me, after reading this message:
This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification. Delivery to the following recipients failed.
Quote from: -[marco]- on July 10, 2009, 02:58:19 PM
Well Paul,
If you had done some research yourself you would have come to the same conclusion as me, after reading this message:
This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification. Delivery to the following recipients failed.
If you would look at the date of entry at the site, you would find the reference to be late 90's. Are you surprised it is a dead link? Try xxxx, most recent I know from 2008.
Paul Andrulis
At least that one didn't bounce back :)
Thanks Paul.
deleted
This question has been bugging me for a long time now. The ftpu center toroid shows a shadow on its top edge that you can see going around. Why would there be a shadow there? If this toroid core is solid with sleek edges, how can there be this shadow where there is not even any wire? Hmmmm. The only way is for the horizontal edge to be very slightly receded from the top plane. But why? This is not
The other question I have asked many times is that given the total mass of the toroid core, which is pretty substantial when you consider such a core would be suitable for a rather sizable AC transformer having many many windings, how can one expect to cause any type of substantial coupling with so few winds of wire in the TPU toroids?
@wattsup
I can't tell if there is anything there , but that toroid seems to have 2 coil on it , it reminds me of Ed PMH , since it can store a kick in its coils and keep the amps circulating in the toroid , that would explain the thousand kick analogy , and maybe putting magnets on it releases the magnet power keeping the coils full ...
Really think about it before dismissing .
I can't tell if the toroid is encased in plastic .
Mark
Having space between the windings and the core may be important for some reason.
It would also seem that the magnet sticks to this core in that video which suggests a magnetic core.
When he turns it upside down he doesn't seem to be supporting the magnet.
@Mannix
The ftpu magnet is placed on the two metal terminals just in front of the toroid that are to the left and right of the red arrow, so we cannot base the toroid material on the magnets.
I would not be surprised to eventually learn that the real tpu is actually the center toroid and the rings and outer coils are decoys. lol
The center toroid could be a top and bottom disk with a horizontal or other vertical coil inside and the two control coils on the outside to pass off as normal bucking coils. That would fit with the bigger STPU and 6TPU designs that would basically follow the toroid design but in bigger format. Since the ftpu was an open design meaning it was shown out in the open, those outer rings would help distract from the central importance of the ftpu toroid, making it harder to figure out. Just what SM likes. Show.... but make sure they won't know.
Also, regarding that two terminal coil mounting bracket, this is usually used to connect to a simple coil that is mounted on it, but in this case you have two terminals and four wires from the two coils. This would infer that the toroid is not an off the shelf design, but using the mounting in this case again detracts from the custom nature of the toroid, trying again to banalize its importance.
Just some other angles among a sphere of possibilities.
Let me run some questions past the bright boys here.....
If a capacitor is pulsed with DC on the positive lead, the signal on the negative is 180 degrees out of sync if I remember correctly.
If this capacitor is wired across the end of a length of zip type lamp cord, then the signal on each wire will be directly in lockstep, and opposed to each other.
This should cause both the "shorted battery cable jumping" scenario, and field rotation in one vector.
If two of these coils were wound upon a toroid placed upon opposite sides, yet designed in such a manner as both fields opposing each other, and pulsed in sync with each other........
What would be the outcome? (The second needed rotation vector possibly?)
Just a thought.
Paul Andrulis
@Mannix
A quick question. Do you think that the "exploding tv set" story was maybe much more than a little hint?
The reason I ask is that, all things considered, it seems somewhat out of place, and Steve made cryptic remarks in that is may be important or not.
Consider this: Maybe, just maybe, the original TPU experiments were based upon the yoke of a 1960's GE TV, trying to reproduce the effects of the previously heard tale.
The main aspects of the tale point to:
1. A severe magnetic disturbance generated in a 1960's GE TV (extremely strong rotating field... nails pulled from walls, and then found corkscrewed.)
2. The main source for electromagnetism on any scale centered around the CRT is the Yoke containing two separate sets of windings, vertical and horizontal deflection. (exploded tube in tale)
3. Control circuits initially may have been same 1960's TV Hor and Vert circuits. (These had the "problem" referred to by SM. Faulty design.)
4. By using such a tale, he could in effect give the EXACT starting point for research, without any compromise of confidentiality claims.
5. Exploding TV tale one of the first "interesting" explanations given, pointing to 4.
6. Should be somewhat obvious, after careful consideration.
7. A 1960's TV would only be about 15 or so years old in 1979. (some still around in junk stores)
8. A 1960's TV would be tube type.
Is my brain starting to smoke, or is it starting to crack?
Paul Andrulis
Paul,
Welcome to TPU land!
There are so many things that need so much work to interpret but your thoughts are almost as I would interpret those clues.
Just to add another angle, what if one or both of those faulty valve oscillators was sweeping in frequency..at a rate of 5-6khz?
However the high voltage /horizontal section is the most likley area for trouble.
He was most surely suggesting tubes He always has
Lindsay
Here is a circa 1960's japanese made tv with an open flyback design. The black plate is 3/32 aluminum and the silver base is 2/32 steel. Say what?
--giantkiller.
some compass stuff
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYKp3IexzgQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBuOFB2ZNvA
Why is everyone so sure the beam deflection circuits, in a TV, have anything to do with a TPU?
As I recall, SM mentions shadow masking, Earth's magnetic field, old TV sets, and much more.
A shadow mask is used in most TV set CRTs.
Decades ago it was a big problem with Earth's magnetic field effecting a CRT almost every time is was moved. The CRT had to be degaussed once the CRT was moved. This still happens but degaussing is automatic.
There was a degaussing method built right into TV sets. This would execute on power-up. The design was radically changed and re-patented with only a mention of the original patent back in the 60's.
I can imagine there would be problems with such a system if sequencing the degaussing coils did not stop before the CRT electron beam was on.
I stopped looking at the beam deflection controls a long time ago. The degaussing circuits are simple and the coil arrangements can fit the description of a TPU.
The flyback was just a reference to the open design and not in particular to the TPU. Just covering some history.
--giantkiller.
Quote from: BEP on July 13, 2009, 07:35:25 AM
Why is everyone so sure the beam deflection circuits, in a TV, have anything to do with a TPU?
As I recall, SM mentions shadow masking, Earth's magnetic field, old TV sets, and much more.
A shadow mask is used in most TV set CRTs.
Decades ago it was a big problem with Earth's magnetic field effecting a CRT almost every time is was moved. The CRT had to be degaussed once the CRT was moved. This still happens but degaussing is automatic.
There was a degaussing method built right into TV sets. This would execute on power-up. The design was radically changed and re-patented with only a mention of the original patent back in the 60's.
I can imagine there would be problems with such a system if sequencing the degaussing coils did not stop before the CRT electron beam was on.
I stopped looking at the beam deflection controls a long time ago. The degaussing circuits are simple and the coil arrangements can fit the description of a TPU.
Like you said, the degaussing may well have been manual in the particular TV SM referenced, and even if not, it must have been off for the unit to operate. We must assume the child was killed while the unit was in operation.
That leave the initial malfunction within the deflection coils... the yoke. A degaussing coil present in the system may have contributed after the fact, but was probably not the start of the affect.
The yoke is driven by the two TV driver circuits, the vertical and horizontal circuits, which in themselves are fairly simple. (The timing circuits are complex, but the driver circuits are simple.)
Therefore, the malfunction would logically have to fall into one of two possibilities:
1. Malfunction or bad design of driver circuit(s)
2. Improper winding or initial bad design of the Yoke.
If Steven stumbled upon the TPU concept through trying to recreate the exploding TV scenario, then he would have started by using 1960's GE TV parts. He would have logically used the Yoke as a starting point, and progressed from there.
He probably would have desired a controllable uniform field shape, so started to rewind with the same general design as the yoke, but upon a symmetrically uniform toroidal form, instead of the nonlinear form used in a yoke. He then would have achieve the field effects, which I assume to be a two vector rotation based upon his words (field rotating in two directions at once). You will notice that such rotation is impossible with just a simple two or four coil single plane coil, such as could be achieved with either the horizontal OR the vertical deflection coils if properly fed, but would require BOTH for a two vector rotation.
Coils in the same plane will only further rotation within that plane, a problem I have been wrestling with for awhile.
Here is a thought that hit me after I started this line of investigation: The TPU may be a two part unit. The field generation unit (possibly the toroid in the center), and the electrical generation unit (the external toroid). It is but a thought, give it only that much weight.
I wish SM were reading this, to check whether the logic was even close.
Paul Andrulis
the open tpu reminds me of an induction style motor that acclerates to an insaine speed .. :D
hence the gyro effect .... :D
and maybe a few relay coils ... :D
ist!
;D
::)
IS OK @INNOVATION
IS GOOD TO START
Quote from: MACEDONIA CD on July 15, 2009, 11:04:23 AM
IS OK @INNOVATION
IS GOOD TO START
For some reason I can't reply to my personal messages on this computer, but I did read your post and I watched the video. It looks very interesting to me but I have no sound on this computer so I'm not really sure of everything that may be going on.
P.S. What is under that pad???
Quote from: stprue on July 15, 2009, 01:38:45 PM
For some reason I can't reply to my personal messages on this computer, but I did read your post and I watched the video. It looks very interesting to me but I have no sound on this computer so I'm not really sure of everything that may be going on.
P.S. What is under that pad???
its magic
lol
ist!
FOR ALL
IM VONDERING HOW TO MAKE RED SWITCH FOR MY TPU
DID ENY ONE KNOW HOW
Mac dont know wtf a red switch is but a reed switch you can get at any store that sells security equipment. BTW can't seem to be able to pm anybody must have some security setting on this new brain box setup wrong.
Quote from: sparks on July 17, 2009, 05:28:45 PM
Mac dont know wtf a red switch is but a reed switch you can get at any store that sells security equipment. BTW can't seem to be able to pm anybody must have some security setting on this new brain box setup wrong.
where ya been bro ?
a reed burns out fast ... unless u CAP IT ... or is that COP IT lol :D
i found a window sencer with fast off times .... might work better but fets used properly will do the job ..
agin this is still switching .. i dont think it is the best way to do it but it will work
when you do 3 freqs in the enviroment ... they will combine and cause rotation with out switching in the sence we are currently useing it ...
just as i see it ...
ist!
you could use spark gaps ... but thats kinda cave man style ...
so lets have a BETTER LOOK AT 4 COILS ABOUT 1 RING ...
matched by 180 deg .. power the first set .. like a jt... and the second set wich is also hooked up 180 deg is powered by the complementry engery ... thuss accelerateing what is circulating in the ring ...
so turn on the switch you get 4 magic feilds 2 n 2 s then shutt it off you get the fly back .. or inductive discharge or hemf depending how it is tuned ... then take that rectify it and dump to the comp coils ... bla bla ... basic ...
:)
@inno
been busy staying alive. god forsaken banking industry is really putting a hurting on the common man. Lost internet access last winter and just getting back online now.
@all
Reed switches are way too slow. SM is hetrodyning freqs. As the freqs combine there is the potential to create very fast current reversals that switching devices just cant do. Even if the base frequencies are down in the kilohertz range they can create ripple that is well into the light spectrum.
Funny things happen when electrons get kicked out of valence orbitals and can't find their way back home. Imagine if a force suddenly accelerated the entire solar system. The smaller lighter planets would ride the wave or accelerating force while the bodies with more mass would take more energy to overcome their centripedal inertia. The inertia and locked in energy of the less massive planets now effecting a much larger field than their normal orbital neighborhood.
Sparks
we missed you!!
AND ALL YOUR KNOWLEDGE
Chet
DAMM BRO ...
im glad your back ... ;D ;D ;D ;D
wanna help make a POWER POINT presentation for the AUTOMOBILE INDSTURY...
I GOT THE COIL ;) LOL
BUT I SUCK AT writeing it all up and all the jazz ...
but bros you got skills in that department!
its just a really simple coil but it im sure would make them happy .. ;D
if you want bro ... need to fund my TELEPORTOR SOME HOW .. :D
ist!
here is a pic of the coil im currently building ... the SKY 8<o>8 COIL
here is the driver board so far .. still building it .. the coil showen is a 2 freqency npn and pnp in sync 3 phase rotation 1 dirrection x 2 lol for the second phase .... i will flip power supplies as they are required ... like left and right hand ... but all the same dirrection pnp is wired in reverse of npn so the colapes both npn and pnp combine at the same time makeing a much larger electro magnet .. then i spun them just slowly cuz the first freq sets up the spikes ... it is tuned to the toroide bla bla i wrote most of it on line here and there ... lol
i want to keep the kick that is returned in this ring in a magnetic form so i can rotate it and and pull much more than just the fly back back off it ...
;)
yea it gets wilder yet btw this coil comes pre charged it only needs the first initinal charge ...
forever on... it runs on its own ....
:o ;D 8)
Good to see you back Sparks ;)
cat
thanks everyone for the greetings good to be back with some really motivated researchers. Bills been busy as ever. last pic looks like he's got a rodin coil up and at em. Nice thing about that configuration is the chance for coupling of emwaves and scalar waves in the same coil. Scalar waves are like when you drop a rock in a pool of water. The transverse waves spread out and we see the ripples in the pool. What we don't see is the shock wave the rock sends out to the bottom of the pool. Tesla called them non hertzian waves. Hard to detect but they could be the scource of all atomic bound energy continually being fed at us from another dimension or the big bang is still banging we just dont know how to listen yet. Enough theory for this evening. Again thanks for the greetings!
catch 'em if you can..
catch em? I have a hell of a time tuning in my favorite radio station never mind collecting superluminal shock waves emanating from unknown scources transmitted by an aetheric media. More politically sanctioned to attempt to enhance the cooling of the Universe in a device designed to capture energy released in the big bang. If we can get an energy sucking antennae to work in that cosmic background radiation band should be enough signal to last a few eons. Lately there is enough wattage dumping on either side of the band due to wireless communications developing an antennae would be a win win situation. If there wasn't enough CBR to collect my wifes cell phone usage alone could power an entire household for a year or two. I'd love to rip off the communications giants to run my hot water heater.
So true! a multiband receiver would pick up anything out there. Who cares about the mysteriousness of it!
One could use their cellphone to power their cellphone. The initial ramp up would be short.
I can't do PM's either. Ya think the fox is trying to smoke out the chickens?
Quote from: sparks on July 19, 2009, 09:03:30 AM
catch em? I have a hell of a time tuning in my favorite radio station never mind collecting superluminal shock waves emanating from unknown scources transmitted by an aetheric media. More politically sanctioned to attempt to enhance the cooling of the Universe in a device designed to capture energy released in the big bang. If we can get an energy sucking antennae to work in that cosmic background radiation band should be enough signal to last a few eons. Lately there is enough wattage dumping on either side of the band due to wireless communications developing an antennae would be a win win situation. If there wasn't enough CBR to collect my wifes cell phone usage alone could power an entire household for a year or two. I'd love to rip off the communications giants to run my hot water heater.
I met an inventor not too long ago, who has invented a "radio" receiver or "circuit" of sorts that can be "tuned" into a particular frequency and "amplify" the signal so much that he was able to power up a number of light bulbs,( of the 100 watt size). His voltages were amplified to 150 volts or so. He is quite old now, and his memory is failing, but he said he will try and brainstorm and remember what he did many many years ago in EUROPE. Sounds so much like Stevens device, at least the general concepts. What he did admit was that you needed a clear strong signal from a radio tower. He blew me away when he admitted that he used ELECTRO-MECHANICAL VIBRATION ELEMENTS FOR HIGH Q RECEPTION. I asked what happened to his invention and he said the military in his country "took" his invention and threaten him to forget about it. I gather this was in the 60's or so. Very interesting I thought, at least we know there's others out there that have traveled the same path as Steven has.
@em you have not be here where are you man did you find steven house where is born tpu ?
you say about Q .. hmmm i say good potencial energy is greated then eny kind
BUT to take this potencial is more dificolt then eny kind energy <i thing >>
now
im working of some and i like to catch clouse to maximum pick up reciver and i thing i whill have burning and fire here
FOR RED SWITCH IS IMPORTANT FOR ANTHER DEVICE IS POSIBLE TO FIND OF SOME PARTS OR tranis,, or to replac my switch
<switch whitout input courent >
Quote from: EMdevices on July 19, 2009, 03:00:22 PM
I met an inventor not too long ago, ....
All you need to do to harvest the energy in a signal is cancel it out. After all, this is the way an EM receiver works.
Quote
I gather this was in the 60's or so. Very interesting I thought, at least we know there's others out there that have traveled the same path as Steven has.
What really bites at me is SM has the gall to call it 'my invention'. You can't claim it unless you know how it works. You certainly shouldn't claim it when you know it has been done before.
I have enough reason to believe it was done in the 30's and I'm quite sure it was Olive Drab in the mid 70's.
Another good reason to not have a patent ;)